>> GOOD AFTERNOON, WE'RE
DELIGHTED THAT YOU ARE ALL
HERE AND WE'RE GOING TO
HAVE -- THIS SESSION IS REALLY
GOING TO RUN AS HOPEFULLY YOU
WILL BE THE MAJOR PARTICIPANTS
BECAUSE WE'VE GOTTEN TOGETHER
A GROUP OF THREE, POSSIBLY
FOUR PEOPLE WHO HAVE HAD
DIFFERENT EXPERIENCES AND AT
LEAST TWO OF WHOM ARE MAJOR
POSSESSIONS THAT PROFOUNDLY
INFLUENCE TRAINING, EDUCATION
AND HAVE A KEEN INSIGHT AS TO
WHAT THE OPPORTUNITIES ARE
TODAY.
SO IF YOU WILL BEAR WITH ME, I
WOULD LIKE TO BEGIN BY JUST
GOING A LITTLE BIT BACK IN
TIME.
WHAT DO THESE MEN HAVE IN
COMMON, ANYBODY?
COMMON, YOU KNOW THEM ALL.
THESE ARE THREE OF THE FINEST
BIOCHEMISTS WHOEVER LIVED AND
IN THE 20TH CENTURY, THEY PUT
BIOCHEMISTRY ON THE MAP AND
YOU KNOW THE PATHWAYS, THE
CYCLE, ALL OF THAT STUFF WHICH
I PRESUME YOU HAVE TO MEMORIZE
AS I KNOW WE HAD TO MEMORIZE
IT BUT I COULD BE WRONG WITH
THAT.
NOW WHY PUT THIS UP?
BECAUSE IT IS A VERY IMPORTANT
POINT.
THESE MEN, UNFORTUNATELY THERE
WERE NO WOMEN AT THAT STAGE IN
THE EXPLOSIVE GROWTH OF
BIOCHEMISTRY.
THESE MEN WERE ALL MD'S
BECAUSE AT THE TIME OF THEIR
WORK IN EUROPE, YOU COULD NOT
GET A PHD IN THE MEDICAL
SCHOOL.
DIDN'T EXIST.
NOR DID IT EXIST IN THE UNITED
STATES.
SO THEY WENT AS PHYSICIANS
INTO LEADING BASIC SCIENCE
DEPARTMENTS AND OUTSTANDING
UNIVERSITIES IN EUROPE,
PARTICULARLY IN GERMANY AND
ELSEWHERE AND MADE THESE MAJOR
DISCOVERIES WHICH FORMED THE
BASIS OF THE BIOCHEMICAL 
REVOLUTION THAT INFLUENCED
THAT WHOLE PERIOD OF TIME.
BUT THEY WERE PHYSICIANS AND 
THEY ENDED THEIR SCIENCE AT
MD.
NOW THINK ABOUT IT.
VERY OFTEN WE TRAIN PHDS ON
SOMETHING THAT INFLUENCES THE
HUMAN ADULT BUT YOU DON'T KNOW
ABOUT THE BASIS OF DISEASE AT
LEAST IN SOMETHING MORE THAN
THE GENERAL PUBLIC MAY KNOW.
MAYBE THAT IS AN EXAGGERATION
BUT PART OF THE PURPOSE OF
THIS COURSE HAS BEEN TO HELP
BRIDGE THIS GAP SO A QUICK
NOTE ABOUT THE GAP.
AND I POINT THIS OUT BECAUSE
THINGS ARE CYCLING IN ALMOST
EVERYTHING IN OUR LIVES,
POLITICS, AND FUNDING AND
SCIENCE.
AT FUNDING, WE'RE IN ONE CYCLE
BUT I DON'T THINK ONE SHOULD
THINK THIS IS A PERMANENT
STATE OF THE AFFAIRS.
ANY WAY TO GIVE YOU A LOOK AT
WHAT IT WAS LIKE, WHEN NIH WAS
CREATED AT THE END OF THE
SECOND WORLD WAR, AMERICAN
HOSPITALS AND EVEN MEDICAL
SCHOOLS WERE TRANSFORMED
OVERNIGHT INTO MAJOR RESEARCH
CENTERS.
AND WHERE DID THE SCIENCE COME
FROM?
TO CONDUCT THAT, MOST OF THEM
CAME FROM, IN THE EARLY DAYS,
THE NATIONAL INTOOT OF HEALTH.
NOW, MANY OF THEM WERE PHD.
I WOULD THINK A LARGE
PROPORTION OF THEM WERE AND
THEY WERE RESPONSIBLE FOR SOME
OF THE INCREDIBLE ADVANCES
THAT TOOK PLACE IN THAT ERA.
NOW, IN THE 50s AND THE
70s, IF YOU WERE A BRIGHT
YOUNG PERSON AND YOU FINISHED
YOUR COLLEGE OR MEDICAL SCHOOL
AND WANTED TO DO SOME
RESEARCH, ALL YOU HAD TO DO
WAS HAVE SOME GOOD IDEAS IF
YOU HAD A REASONABLY GOOD
RECORD AND BELIEVE IT OR NOT,
FUNDING WAS NOT THE LIMITING
FACTOR AND THAT IS WHAT
ACCOUNTED FOR HUGE NUMBERS OF
PEOPLE COMING HERE AND FROM
OTHER PLACES TO BE TRAINED.
ALSO THE GI BILL FOR THE FIRST
TIME PROVIDED FINANCIAL
SUPPORT FOR ANYBODY IN SERVICE
TO ACQUIRE ANY LEGITIMATE
EDUCATION.
COLLEGE, GRADUATE SCHOOL,
MEDICAL SCHOOL, SO A WHOLE
MIDDLE CLASS AND OTHERS WHO
NEVER WOULD HAVE HAD AN
OPPORTUNITY PERHAPS TO GO TO
EVEN THEN THE EXPENSIVE 
COLLEGES AND UNIVERITIES
FLOATED IN AT A TIME WHEN
SIGNS WAS GOING ON.
AND THEN IN THE 80s, IT WAS
APPOINTED OUT THAT PHYSICIANS
SCIENTISTS WERE BEGINNING TO
DECREASE FOR MANY REASONS.
MEDICINE HAD CHANGED, THE
HOSPITAL DEMANDS HAD CHANGED
AND THERE WAS A LOT WRITTEN
ABOUT THIS WHICH WE WON'T GO
INTO BUT THE POINT IS IT
CREATED A O HUGE GAP BETWEEN
THE BASIC SCIENCES WHO NOW
CHAIRED THE BASIC SCIENCE
DEPARTMENTS IN MEDICAL SCHOOLS
GIVING PHD'S AND THE NEEDS AND
INTERESTS OF UNL PATIENTS AND
THAT IS THE BEGINNING OF THE
GAP.
AND ONE OF THE OUTCOME OF THAT
PERIOD OF TIME WAS THAT THERE
WERE CAREER OPPORTUNITIES,
MANY, MANY, FOR PHD'S TO WORK 
WITH PHYSICIANS SCIENTISTS.
SO THERE ARE TWO THINGS THAT
KIND OF SUM UP MUCH OF WHAT I
WANT TO SAY.
THIS ONE FROM A GERMAN
SCIENTISTS AND THAT IS OUR
SITUATION TODAY.
MANY OF US SPEAK A VERY 
DIFFERENT SCIENTIFIC LANGUAGE
AND HAVE TROUBLE WHAT THE
OTHER PEOPLE, BE THEY 
ENGINEERS, PHYSICIANS,
MOLECULAR BIOLOGISTS, ET
CETERA.
AND THE OTHER QUOTE IS FROM
THE PRESIDENT OF THE HOWARD
HUGHES MEDICAL INSTITUTE, A
BIG SUPPORTER IN THIS DEFINE
SCIENCE ISSUE, WROTE THAT THEY
SHOULD KNOW SOMETHING ABOUT
THE DISEASE AND HOW IT AFFECTS
PEOPLE.
SO ONE OF THE WAYS OF TRYING
TO RENDER THIS COMMUNICATION
PROBLEM WERE A SET OF
PATHOBIOLOGY PROGRAMS WHERE
PHD SCIENTISTS IN PLACES WHERE
THEY SAW PATIENTS AND A LOT OF
PATHOLOGY AND IT WAS DIFFERENT
IN DIFFERENT INSTITUTIONS AND
THERE WERE VARIOUS GROUPS AND
FOUNDATION THAT SUPPORTED THIS
CULMINATING WITH THE HOWARD
HUGHES PROGRAM THAT GAVE
28 MILLION TO 23 PROGRAMS OVER
SIX YEARS.
UNFORTUNATELY, THIS TERMINATED
AT THE TIME WHEN THE PHARMS
WERE CREATED AND THEN IN 2002,
THE DEMYSTIFYING MEDICINE WAS
CREATED AND WITH A LARGE
FACILITY, CLINICAL CENTER WITH
AN EXTRAORDINARY STAFF OF
CLINICAL INVESTIGATORS, 
PHYSICIANS SCIENTISTS,
ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY AND SO
FORTH COUPLED WITH MORE OF THE
BASIC SCIENCE GOING ON IN EACH
OF THE DIFFERENT INSTITUTES.
SO PUTTING TOGETHER THE
PROGRAM THAT MOST OF YOU, I
HOPE, HAVE EITHER BEEN HERE OR
WATCHED A VIDEO OR SO FORTH,
WHAT WE HAVE TRIED TO DO IS
BRING TOGETHER SOME PEOPLE
KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THE
CLINICAL PROBLEMS AND WHAT
THEY ARE DOING HERE TO DO
RESEARCH ON THEM AND PEOPLE AT
THE FOREFRONT OF WHERE AN
UNDERSTANDING UNDER BASIC
PROCESSES ARE CONCERNED.
AND IT HAS REALLY BEEN QUITE
SUCCESSFUL.
WE'RE IN THE 17TH YEAR.
THERE ARE PEOPLE IN 18
DIFFERENT COUNTRIES AND 18
NORTH AMERICAN INSTITUTIONS
WHO REGULARLY USE THE MATERIAL
THAT IS PRESENTED HERE AS PART
OF THEIR GRADUATE TRAINING AND
SOME OF THEM EVEN,
UNDERGRADUATE TRAINING.
SO THE SUMMARY IS THE DATA
THAT HAS BEEN ACCUMULATED
WHICH I WON'T GO INTO SAYS
THAT TEACHING PATHO
PHYSIOLOGY, ANOTHER WORD FOR
DISEASE TO PHDS IS TIMELY.
THE SURVEY INDICATES PEOPLE
WANT TO KNOW SOMETHING ABOUT
THE DISEASE THEY ARE WORKING
WITH AND EVEN MAJOR HEALTH
CHALLENGES UNRELATED TO THEIR
RESEARCH.
IT IS CERTAINLY CHALLENGING.
THERE IS OUTCOME DATA THAT
INDICATES THAT POSITIONS
BECOME AVAILABLE FOR PEOPLE
WHO HAVE THIS BACKGROUND AND
FOR SOME, IT IS PREPARATORY
FOR ACADEMIC PHYSICIANS IN A
CLINICAL DEPARTMENT, NOT
WORKING FOR A PHYSICIAN
SCIENTIST BUT WORKING WITH AND
TENURE TRACK PHYSICIANS.
THAT BUILT UP SUBSTANTIALLY
UNTIL ABOUT ROUGHLY 15 OR MORE
YEARS AGO WHEN THINGS GOT VERY
TIGHT IN THE HOSPITAL AND
MEDICAL SCHOOL WORLD SO THAT
OPPORTUNITY HAS DIMINISHED BUT
THERE IS SOME DATA TO INDICATE
THAT THERE STILL IS 
SUBSTANTIAL -- WHOOPS, WHAT
HAVE I DONE?
OKAY, WELL, I DID GET SOME
DATA FROM THE AAMC WHICH
INDICATED APPROXIMATELY 40 
PERCENT OF PHD GRADUATES 45
YEARS HAD POSITIONS IN A
CLINICAL DEPARTMENT, PRIMARY,
SECONDARY, ET CETERA.
AND AS OF A YEAR AGO, THE AAMC
DATA INDICATES IT IS DOWN TO
AROUND 14 OR 15 PERCENT.
SO THIS IS A BIT OF A
BACKGROUND THAT LED US TO
WHERE WE ARE AT A TIME WHEN
SCIENCE HAS PROBABLY NEVER
BEEN MORE CHALLENGING, NEVER
BEEN MORE EXCITING AND I WOULD
POINT OUT THAT EVERY ONE OF
THE SCIENTIFIC RESOLUTIONS
THAT HAS HAPPENED SEEMS TO BE
HAPPENING AT A SHORTER TIME
LIMIT, A TIME LIMIT FROM BASIC
PHYSIOLOGY TO BIOCHEMISTRY AND
THEN IT WAS SHORTER TO
MOLECULAR BIOLOGY AND EVEN
SHORTER TO GENETICS AND EVEN
SHORTER NOW INTO THE EXPLODING
WORLD OF INFRAMATICS SO THIS
IS A EXPLODING THING AND
NOBODY KNOWS EXACTLY HOW TO
CONFRONT THE PROBLEM.
BUT WE DO KNOW THAT FOR YOUNG
PEOPLE WHO WANT TO DO SCIENCE
AND BE PART OF THIS EXPLOSIVE
BUSINESS, THERE IS PROBABLY
NEVER BEEN A BETTER TIME
DESPITE MANY OF THE PRACTICAL
PROBLEMS THAT ONE RECOGNIZES
EXISTS.
OKAY, SO TO DISCUSS MORE
DETAILS OF THIS AND
PARTICULARLY TO ENLIST YOUR
RESPONSES, WE'RE VERY
FORTUNATE THAT WE HAVE THREE 
SPEAKERS OR CONSULTANTS, OKAY.
SO THE FIRST IS JONATHAN
YEWDELL WHO IS THE HEAD OF THE
CELLULAR BIOLOGY SECTION OF
NIAID.
JOHN IS AN MD, PHD IN
IMMUNOLOGY FROM THE UNIVERSITY
OF PENNSYLVANIA.
HE DID ELEGANT WORK AND STILL
DOES ON THE USE OF MONOPHILO
ANTIBODIES TO UNDERSTAND
INFECTION AND SO FORTH BUT WE
HAVE POSTED ON THE WEBSITE A
BOOK THAT JONATHAN HAS WRITTEN
THAT HE WILL COMMENT ABOUT,
I'M SURE, OF WHAT I FIND IS
THE MOST EXCITING, THOUGHTFUL
APPROACH AT ANY AGE OF WHY ONE
MIGHT TO WANT DO SCIENCE AND
WHAT MIGHT YOU DO TO MAKE IT
MORE SUCCESSFUL.
AND THEN OUR SECOND PART,
SHARON WHO HAS BEEN THE
DIRECTOR OF THE INTRAMURAL 
TRAINING AND EDUCATION 
DIVISION, THE INTRAMURAL
PROGRAM.
SHE WAS UNTIL RECENTLY VERY
ACTIVE SCIENTIST STUDYING
SIGNAL TRANSDUCTION FOR CYSTIC
FIBROSIS FROM THE UNIVERSITY
OF NORTH CAROLINA AND CAME TO
HEAD UP THE PROGRAM WHICH HAS
BEEN VERY SUCCESSFUL AS I AM
SURE YOU ALL HAVE PARTICIPATED
IN.
AND THEN OUR NUMBER 4 HITTER
IS MICHAEL GOSTENMAN WHO
SHOULD BE KNOWN TO ALL OF YOU,
WHO IS THE DEPUTY DIRECTOR FOR
INTRAMURAL RESEARCH.
I WANT TO READ TO YOU
SOMETHING WHICH SOME OF YOU
MAY NOT BE AWARE OF, WHAT THE
DEPUTY DIRECTOR IS RESPONSIBLE
FOR.
COORDINATION OF ACTIVITIES AND
FACILITATING COOPERATION AMONG
THE 24 INSTITUTE AND
CENTER-BASED SCIENTIFIC
DIRECTORS TO, ACHIEVE THE
SCIENTIFIC TRAINING AND HUB
HEALTH MISSION OF THE NIH
INTRAMURAL PROGRAM.
HE PROVIDES GUIDANCE FOR THE
ENTIRE PROGRAM.
HE OVERSEES AND APPROVES THE
HIRING OF ALL NIH PRINCIPLE
INVESTIGATORS AND IS THE
INSTITUTIONAL OFFICER
RESPONSIBLE FOR HUMAN SUBJECT
RESEARCH PROTECTION, RESEARCH
INTEGRITY, TECHNOLOGY
TRANSFER, ANIMAL CAREY USE AT
THE NIH.
MICHAEL HAS BEEN HERE AT THE
NIH AS THE DIRECTOR FOR 24
YEARS NOW AND THOSE 24 YEARS
HAVE BEEN CHARACTERIZED BY THE
BEGINNING OF EXTRAORDINARY
PROGRAMS THAT HAVE INFLUENCED
ALL OF YOU SINCE THE
BACCALAUREATE PROGRAM AND A
GREAT VARIETY OF OTHER
ACTIVITIES.
HE IS AN OUTSTANDING CELL
BIOLOGIST AND IS CHIEF OF THE
NCI LABORATORY OF BIOLOGY, ONE
OF THE LEADING FIGURES IN THE
STUDIES OF DRUG RESISTANCE.
MICHAEL HAS BEEN WIDELY 
RECOGNIZED FOR ALL OF THE
SCIENCE WITH MANY AWARDS AND I
THINK WE ALL WANT TO JOIN IN
CONGRATULATING HIM BECAUSE
TODAY ON MAY DAY, 2018, HE
JUST LEARNED HE WAS ELECTED TO
NATIONAL ACADEMY OF SCIENCE
>> THANKS EVERYONE FOR
COMING.
I AM NOT SURE THIS IS A WIN TO
BE LAUDED BUT TOO LATE TO
CHANGE SO YOU WILL GET THE
PRAGMATIC ADVICE ON HOW TO
MAKE THE NEXT STEP.
I AM AN MD, PHD BUT HATED
MEDICINE, ACTUALLY, THE
OPPOSITE OF A ROLE MODEL FOR
YOUNG MDS AND BASICALLY
FUNCTIONED AS A PHD MY ENTIRE
CAREER SO THE NEXT STEP FOR
YOU, PRAGMATICALLY, HOW DO YOU
GET A JOB POST-DOC?
I TOOK A SABBATICAL TO WRITE
THIS BOOK, WAS AN ABSOLUTELY
LABOR OF LOVE.
I LOVED THE NIH PROGRAM,
BASICALLY FOCUSED ON RESEARCH
AND DONE LITTLE ANYTHING ELSE.
IT IS VERY OPINIONATED, I HOPE
YOU FIND IT FUNNY.
SOME OF IT WILL BE USEFUL.
SOME OF IT WON'T BE.
I HOPE YOU TAKE WHAT IS GOOD
AND THE BEST PART OF THE BOOK
IS THE CART TUNES, TAKEN FROM
THE WEEKLY CARTOONIST FOR THE
NHI NEWS LETTER.
THE COVER I AM INORDINATELY
PROUD OF.
THESE ARE FIGURES FROM MY
CAREER.
I JUST WENT THROUGH ALL MY
PAPERS AND PULLED OUT NOT
NECESSARILY THE MOST IMPORTANT
DIET TO BUT THE FIGURES THAT
EMOTIONALLY MEANT THE MOST TO
ME AND AT THE END OF YOUR
CAREER, THIS IS PRETTY MUCH
WHAT IT WILL LOOK LIKE.
YOU REMEMBER THE GREAT
EXPERIMENTS YOU DO AND
PARTICULARLY THE PEOPLE YOU
DID THEM WITH, STUDENTS,
COLLABORATORS.
IN THE END, THE BEST PART OF
SCIENCE AT THE END OF THE DAY
ARE THE PEOPLE YOU MEET.
OKAY, SO YOU ALL KNOW THIS
NOW.
IT IS NO LONGER ONE OF THE
DIRTY LITTLE  SECRETS OF
BIOMEDICAL RESEARCH, YOU WENT
IN TO TRAINING TO HOPE TO BE
AN INVESTIGATOR.
IN THE 80s, IF YOU WEREN'T
COMPLETELY PSYCHOTIC, CHANGES
ARE YOU GOT TO RUN YOUR OWN
LAB.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NUMBERS
WERE, PROBABLY 50 PERCENT BUT
TODAY THE NUMBER IS LESS AND
THIS WE CALL ALTERNATIVE
CAREERS, BEING A PI IS THE
ALTERNATIVE CAREER.
SO MOST OF YOU, YOU BEING THE
COLLECTIVE PHD'S IN THE
COUNTRY WILL BE DOING
SOMETHING OTHER THAN RUNNING A
RESEARCH LAB WITH YOUR PHD.
SO I DID SOME RESEARCH O ON
THE WEB, TRYING TO UPDATE MY
FIGURES AND THIS IS A NICE
FLOW DIAGRAM AS FAR AS I COULD
TELL READING THE INFORMATION
ON THE WEBSITE, IT IS FROM
2012.
BUT THIS IS INTERESTING ON
AVERAGE WHAT HAPPENS TO YOU.
SO 86,000 GRADUATES START PHD
PROGRAMS, 37 PERCENT DROP OUT.
THAT, I FOUND, SHOCKING
ACTUALLY THAT THERE WAS SUCH A
HIGH DROPOUT RATE.
MANY OF THEM GET MASTERS.
THE NUMBERS ARE A LITTLE
FUZZY.
WE DON'T KNOW HOW MANY
POST-DOCS WE HAVE THROUGHOUT
THE COUNTRY, MAYBE 40,000.
HERE IS AN IMPORTANT NUMBER.
LESS THAN 8 PERCENT OF
ENTERING PHD STUDENTS WILL
BECOME FAST-TRACKED FACULTY,
YET 50 PERCENT REACH THEIR
DESIRED CAREER.
THOSE NUMBERS ARE STILL PRETTY
CLOSE AND WHAT IS IMPORTANT
HERE IS WHAT THE REAL
UNEMPLOYMENT RATE IS.
THE NUMBER I HAVE ALWAYS
SPOUTED IS TWO OR THREE
PERCENT BECAUSE I THOUGHT THAT
WAS WHAT IT WAS.
AND THEN THIS IS SIX YEARS
AGO, PROBABLY WORSE NOW AND IF
YOU DO OTHER THINGS OTHER THAN
WHAT YOU TRAINED FOR SUCH AS
AN UBER DRIVER, IT IS ABOUT A
10 PERCENT UNEMPLOYMENT RATE,
OKAY?
AND THIS IS SOMETHING THAT
NEEDS TO BE FIXED.
I STARTED GETTING INVOLVED IN
POST-DOC ISSUES 20 YEARS AGO
BECAUSE I WAS APPALLED AT THE
LOW SALARIES THAT POST-DOCS
ARE BEING PAID.
I STILL AM BUT THINK WE CAN DO
A LOT BETTER AND I AM STILL
APPALLED AT LACK OF MODELING.
THERE HAVE BEEN A NUMBER OF
REPORTS FROM VERY GOOD PEOPLE,
A PAPER WITH HAROLD AND
SHIRLEY AND I READ THE PAPER
AND TEARS STARTED COMING TO MY
EYES AND I STATE OH, MY GOD,
POWERFUL INFLUENTIAL PEOPLE
HAVE TO GET THIS MESSAGE AND
FIX THIS MODEL AND SHOW HOW
MANY JOBS THERE ARE, WE REALLY
NEED TO START DOING THIS AND
AS FAR AS I CAN TELL IN THE
LAST FIVE YEARS, NOTHING WAS
WRONG. 
THERE WAS PARTICULARLY
NEGATIVE BLOWBACK.
SO THIS IS A PROBLEM, FACULTY
MEMBER PI'S ARE ENTIRELY
SYMPATHETIC TO THIS PROBLEM&
AND IT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED.
IT CAN'T ALWAYS BE SWEPT UNDER
THE RUG AND WE CAN TALK ABOUT
THAT LATER ON HOW TO START
ADDRESSING THIS.
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT HAS
JUST NOT GONE AWAY.
OKAY, SO I AM GOING TO PLOW
AHEAD.
IF YOU ARE GOING TO PLOW
AHEAD, I AM GOING TO GIVE YOU
ADVICE IF YOU ARE STILL INTENT
ON BEING A PI.
MANY OF YOU ARE NOT, GREAT BUT
IF YOU ARE AND I WANT TO MAKE
SURE YOU KNOW THIS, YOU HAVE
CHOSEN AN INCREDIBLY DIFFICULT
CAREER, RIGHT?
IT NEVER REALLY GETS EASIER.
THE HARDEST YOU WILL EVER WORK
UNDER THE MOST PRESSURE IS AS
AN ASSISTANT PROFESSOR IF YOU
GET ONE OF THESE PRIZED
POSITIONS AND YOU NOW ARE
FACED WITH A WHOLE LOT OF
THINGS YOU DON'T KNOW ABOUT
AND AREN'T VERY GOOD AT LIKE
ORGANIZING PEOPLE, GETTING A
LAB AND ON TOP OF THAT,
GETTING MONEY, GETTING MONEY.
SO AFTER THAT, IT GETS A
LITTLE EASIER BUT TALK TO
PEOPLE OUT THERE, RIGHT?
THEY ARE UNDER A LOT OF
PRESSURE AND EVEN AS A FULL
PROFESSOR, EVEN IF YOU ARE IN
THE NATIONAL ACADEMY -- I
REMEMBER LAST WEEK WHEN I WAS
AT HOPKINS, FANTASTIC LIKE,
FANTASTIC CAREER, GREAT
PUBLICATIONS AND CAN'T GET
FUNDED.
SO YOU ARE AS GOOD AS YOUR
LAST PAPER.
THAT IS THE WAY IT IS WITH
SCIENCE.
SOME OF THAT IS GOOD, SOME IS
NOT SO DONALD KID YOURSELF.
YOU ARE IN FOR THE LONG HAUL.
YOU CAN MAKE A LOT MORE MONEY
DOING A LOT LESS WORK AND
DOING MANY OTHER THINGS.
LIFE IN THE END IS ABOUT
HAPPINESS, NOT SOME ARBITRARY
STANDARD THAT DOESN'T INVOLVE
CLIMBING A CLIFF AND THAT
SHOULD BE THE MAIN GOAL.
THAT IS THE GOAL FOR MY FOUR
CHILDREN, THEY SHOULD FIND 
SOMETHING THEY LOVE DOING AND
THAT THEY CAN DO REASONABLY
WELL AND THEN MARRY SOMEONE
WHO IS WEALTHY.
[LAUGHTER]
>> SO THE ACADEMIC KIND,
COMPETING, STRUGGLING FOR
FUNDING OR MONEY FROM THE
COMPANY, WHAT YOU NEED TO MAKE
THIS WORTHWHILE, YOU HAVE TO
LOVE SCIENCE, JUST LOVE
SCIENCE.
BASICALLY YOU CAN'T DO WITHOUT
IT.
AND IT ISN'T JUST THE
DISCOVERY.
FOR MOST OF MY CAREER, I
THOUGHT WHAT I REALLY LOVED
ABOUT SCIENCE WAS EITHER
MAKING THE DISCOVERIES OR
BEING INVOLVED IN THEM, AND I
DO AND THAT IS, YOU KNOW, THE
HIGHEST POINT BUT THAT IS NOT
THE MAJOR REWARD.
THE MAJOR REWARD IS LOVING THE
PROCESS OF MAKING A DISCOVERY,
READING A FAVOR, GETTING AN
IDEA, DESIGNING AN EXPERIMENT,
SCREWING IT UP THE FIRST TIME,
EVERYTHING A DISASTER, SEEING
THE FIRST GLIMPSE OF THE TRUTH
PERHAPS IN YOUR DATA, REFINING
IT, DOING IT A HUNDRED TIMES
AND ENJOYING EVERY BIT OF
THAT.
ALL THE FRUSTRATION, ALL THE
STRIVING AND COMMUNICATING 
AND COLLABORATING, THAT IS THE
PART YOU REALLY SHOULD LOVE.
AND I THINK IT IS SAD WE HAVE
MADE SCIENCE INTO SOMETHING
LIKE MUSIC AND DANCE WHERE YOU
HAVE TO HAVE THIS PASSION TO
MAKE IT WORTHWHILE BUT I THINK
THAT IS REALISTIC.
IF THAT BURNING DESIRE IS
WITHIN YOU, OKAY, CHASE IT,
SATISFY IT.
SO WE ALREADY HAD ONE SLIDE OF
EINSTEIN, HERE IS ANOTHER 
TALKING TO FREUD.
[ READING SLIDE ]
THE STATE OF MIND WHICH
ENABLES A MAN TO DO WORK OF
THIS KIND AKIN TO THAT OF THE
RELIGIOUS WORSHIPER OR THE
LOVER, THE DAILY EFFORT COMES
FROM NO DELIBERATE INTENTION
OR PROGRAM, BUT STRAIGHT FROM
THE HEART.
YOU HAVE TO FEEL THAT WAY.
AND WHAT DOES IT PAY?
IT TAKES OBSESSION.
IT REALLY DOES.
IF YOU ARE GOING TO COMPETE IN
BASIC SCIENCE, IF NOTHING
ELSE, YOU ARE COMPETING WITH
PEOPLE WHO ARE OBSESSED WITH
THE SAME PROBLEM YOU ARE AND
IT REALLY TAKES THIS OBSESSION
AND NOT QUITE LIKE THE
MANIC-DEPRESSIVE AND IT ISN'T
ALWAYS PEACHES AND CREAM, THE
SCIENCE BECAUSE A LOT OF TIMES
YOU HAVE THIS ANGST FOR THAT
THING BOTHERING YOU THAT YOU
CAN'T FIGURE OUT AND THAT IS
WHAT DRIVES GREAT DISCOVERY
AND WHAT MAKES IT WORTHWHILE,
RIGHT?
TRYING TO SCRATCH THAT ITCH OF
NOT KNOWING THINGS.
RIGHT.
SO THIS IS YOU AS A SCIENTIST,
CHECKING OFF WHERE YOU ARE.
YOU NECESSARILY WON'T HAVE A
NORMAL FAMILY LIFE.
YOU CAN BUT MANY WHO DON'T AND
FOR SOMEONE WHO MUDDLED
THROUGH IT, FATHERHOOD AND
MARRIAGE, YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE
PERFECT BUT IT IS USEFUL TO
FIND PEOPLE AROUND YOU WHO
WILL CUT YOU A LOT OF SLACK,
THAT IS FOR SURE.
OKAY, SO YOU ARE GOING TO BE A
PI.
THERE IS NOT GOING TO BE SOME
POINT IN YOUR CAREER WHERE A
FAIRY FINDS YOU, SPRINKLES YOU
WITH DUST AND NOW YOU ARE A
PI, RIGHT?
FROM THE GET-AND GO AS A
STARTING GRADUATE STUDENT, YOU
HAVE TO HAVE THE IDEA THAT
WHAT YOU ARE STUDYING, YOU ARE
RESPONSIBLE FOR.
YOU OWN THE PROJECT.
IT IS NOT ON YOUR PI TO KNOW
IT, IT IS ON YOU TO KNOW IT
AND I THINK THAT IS TRUE AS A
GRADUATE STUDENT BUT
PARTICULARLY TRUE AS A PHD.
PEOPLE ARE GOING TO HIRE YOU
FOR THE NEXT JOB BECAUSE YOU
ARE THE WORLD EXPERT IN WHAT
YOU ARE DOING.
THAT IS ONE OF THE GREAT
THINGS ABOUT BIOLOGY.
WE DON'T NEED A
TRILLION-DOLLAR MACHINE IN
GENEVA TO STUDY THE NATURE
THAT WE'RE GOING TO STUDY.
WE CAN STUDY IT AT THE LEVEL
WITH OUR OWN TWO HANDS,
RELATIVELY INEXPENSIVE
EQUIPMENT AND WE BOTH STUDY
SOMETHING SO NARROW, BIOLOGY
IS SO BIG, NOT LIKE PHYSICS
WHERE EVERYONE HAS TO STUDY A
FEW PARTICLES.
WE HAVE ALL OF BIOLOGY, ALL OF
MEDICINE TO STUDY, THAT YOU
SHOULD BE THE WORLD'S EXPERT
ON WHAT YOU ARE DOING.
THAT IS THE EXPECTATION OF THE
DEPARTMENT THAT IS GOING TO
HIRE YOU, THAT YOU ARE THE
WORLD EXPERT.
YOU HAVE TO KNOW WHAT YOU ARE
DOING, KNOW THE LITERATURE.
IF THERE IS OLD LITERATURE,
KNOW THAT AS WELL.
THIS COMES ACROSS INCREDIBLY
WELL WHEN YOU INTERVIEW
SOMEONE FROM A JOB AND THEY
CITE A PAPER FROM 1940, YOU
ARE LIKE WHOA, THIS IS A
SERIOUS INDIVIDUAL, THEY HAVE
THOUGHT HARD ABOUT THEIR FIELD
AND KNOW EVERYTHING THEY NEED
TO KNOW.
YOU SHOULD TRY TO KNOW THE
MAJOR SCIENTISTS IN THE FIELD,
RIGHT?
YOU GO TO A MEETING TO MEET
PEOPLE, NOT TO SIT THROUGH A
úIF YOU WANT TO JUST WATCH
THEM, YOU CAN DO IT ON SKYPE.
SO AT THE MEETING, GET OUT OF
YOUR COMFORT ZONE, MEET THE
LEADING FIGURES IN YOUR FIELD,
SAY HEY, I WANT TO SHOW YOU
SOMETHING ON MY POSTER.
MOST PEOPLE ARE FLATTERED BY
THE ATTENTION.
MANY OF US ARE INTRAVERTED.
I WAS WHEN I STARTED AS WELL
AND THAT IS HARD TO BELIEVE
FOR PEOPLE WHO KNOW ME NOW BUT
YOU HAVE TO FORCE YOURSELF OUT
OF YOUR COMFORT ZONE.
AND DURING THE TALK, PUT YOUR
HAND UP THERE, ASK A QUESTION,
ASK FIVE QUESTIONS, THEY WILL
BE LIKE WHO IS SHE, BOY, SHE
IS REALLY ASKING INCITEFUL
QUESTIONS.
LOOKING FOR A JOB?
THIS IS HOW YOU GET JOBS, MAKE
YOURSELF KNOWN.
JUST PRACTICAL ADVICE.
GET YOUR NAME OUT IN A MEETING
TO ASK A QUESTION, YOU WILL BE
MUCH LESS NERVOUS WHEN YOU
GIVE YOUR OWN TALK.
INNATE PSYCHOLOGY, YOU ARE
LESS NERVOUS THE SECOND TIME.
FIRST TIME, YOUR HEART WILL BE
BEATING AND THAT IS TRUE OF
ANYBODY.
OKAY, IT IS BEST HAVE BIG
AMBITIONS.
THE IDEA IS TO CHANGE THE
COURSE OF YOUR FIELD OR START
A NEW ONE.
ALWAYS CHALLENGE YOURSELF.
NEW, NEW, NEW, RIGHT?
ONE OF THE REASONS I LOVED
SCIENCE AND NOT SO FOND OF
MEDICINE, BASICALLY MEDICINE
THEY DO WHAT THEY TELL YOU OR
YOU GO TO JAIL AND GET SUED
FOR MALPRACTICE.
SCIENCE, THE EXPECTATION IS
YOU GET TO THINK OF SOMETHING
NEW SO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THAT.
THINK, THINK, THINK.
SCIENCE IS MOSTLY ABOUT
CREATIVITY AT THE TOP LEVEL.
YOU ALL HAVE THE POTENTIAL TO
BE CREATIVE.
USE IT.
NEW THINGS.
AND IF YOU HAVE GREAT NEW
IDEAS, EXPECT CRITICISM.
THE BETTER THE IDEA, THE MORE
LIKELY IT IS TO BE TRUE, THE
MORE INTENSE THE CRITICISM.
YOU HAVE TO FIGHT THROUGH THAT
AND SELF-CONFIDENCE IS A BIG
PART OF BECOMING A SUCCESSFUL
SCIENTIST.
OKAY, WHAT DO WE DO AT NIH?
WE MAKE DISCOVERIES.
THEY ARE NOT REALLY
DISCOVERIES TILL WE PUBLISH
PAPERS.
YOU HAVE TO PUBLISH PAPERS AND
THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT.
EVERY STEP OF YOUR CAREER, YOU
ARE GOING TO HAVE TO PUBLISH
PAPERS AND I HAVE SEEN IT WITH
MY OWN POST- DOCS.
THE MORE PAPERS THEY HAVE, THE
MORE OPPORTUNITIES THEY HAVE.
NEVER PASS UP AN OPPORTUNITY
TO WRITE A REVIEW.
GET YOUR NAME OUT THERE.
MORE COMMUNICATIONS.
AND I AM NOT ENCOURAGING YOU
TO PUT OUT SHODDY PAPERS, NO.
IN ADDITION TO THE BIG THING,
THE NEW THING THAT WILL GET
YOU YOUR JOB, PUBLISH,
PUBLISH, PUBLISH.
SOME SEE IT AS A BAD THING BUT
IT IS NOT.
WE ARE PAID TO MAKE
DISCOVERIES AND WE PUBLISH
PAPERS SO THAT IS REALLY
IMPORTANT.
COLLABORATION IS ESSENTIAL.
THERE ARE SO MANY NEW
TECHNIQUES TODAY THAT ARE
EXPENSIVE, ARDUOUS, INCREDIBLY
INVOLVED.
YOU WILL NOT BE AN EXPERT IN
EVERYTHING.
SO COLLABORATION IS ESSENTIAL.
YOU WILL INCREASE YOUR
PRODUCTIVITY, YOU WILL
INCREASE YOUR PROFILE, MORE
PEOPLE WILL KNOW YOU, LABS YOU
COLLABORATE WITH, THEY CAN
WRITE YOU LETTERS, HELP YOU
LATER ON IN YOUR CAREER.
A GOOD COLLABORATION THAT WILL
DEEPEN YOUR KNOWLEDGE
ENORMOUSLY INTO THE SUCKED YOU
-- SUBJECT YOU ARE
COLLABORATING ON, YOUR 
INTERPERSONAL SKILLS COME
THROUGH BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO
COLLABORATE WITH SOMEONE AND
THEN BEST OF ALL, IT IS REALLY
FUN.
SCIENCE IS MOST FUN WHEN IT IS
DONE COLLECTIVELY.
IT IS GREAT TO HAVE A
DISCOVERY YOURSELF.
IT IS BETTER TO HAVE IT WITH
MORE PEOPLE.
THAT IS THE COLLECT IVE DRAW
WHICH IS AMAZING AND I PUT
THIS CARTOON IN FOR A PURPOSE
HERE.
YOU CAN'T COLLABORATE ALL THE
WAY THROUGH WITHOUT HAVING THE
BIG MAJOR PROJECT.
YOU HAVE TO HAVE THE PROJECT
TO GET THE JOB AND OPEN THE
DOOR.
THEN MORE SERIOUS
COLLABORATIONS, YOU GET TO
THINK MORE CAREFULLY ABOUT IT
BUT IN GENERAL, COLLABORATION
IS A GOOD THING.
OKAY, NOW YOU THINK YOU WANT
TO BE A PI BUT LISTEN, IT
DOESN'T ALWAYS WORK OUT.
AND IT IS OKAY TO SWITCH YOUR
CAREER GOALS MID-STREAM.
IT HAPPENS A LOT REALLY.
SO IF IT IS SOMETHING THAT
REALLY CAPTURES YOU, SAY YOU
ARE WORKING IN SCIENCE AND ARE
REALLY GOOD AT IT AND MAYBE
YOU COULD GET A JOB BUT YOU
THINK MAN, I DON'T WANT TO DO
THIS, OKAY, FINE.
IF YOU REALLY DON'T WANT TO DO
IT, YOU SHOULDN'T BE MISERABLE
FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.
AND IF YOU ARE NOT HAPPY, ALL
THE THEME AROUND YOU IN YOUR
LAB, YOUR FAMILY, THEY WILL BE
MISERABLE SO JUST DON'T DO
THAT.
DO THE OTHER THINGS YOU ARE
INTRIGUED WITH.
IF YOU GET AN INTERVIEW FOR A
TENURE TRACK JOB, PREPARE.
JUST PREPARE YOURSELF.
IN GENERAL, ANY INTERVIEW FOR
ANY JOB, THERE IS ALWAYS AN
EXCEPTION BUT MY ADVICE IS
NEVER TURN DOWN AN INTERVIEW.
ONE, YOU NEVER KNOW.
YOU GO TO A JOB, THINK MAN, I
DON'T THINK I WANT TO GO THERE
AND THEN AT THE END OF THE
DAY, MY GOD, THIS PLACE IS
INCREDIBLE, I HAD NO IDEA.
SO ALWAYS GO FOR INTERVIEWS
AND WHEN YOU GO, EVEN IF IT IS
NOT THE PLACE YOU WANT,
WHATEVER, DON'T EVER LEAVE THE
IMPRESSION WHEN YOU GO FOR AN
INTERVIEW THAT YOU DON'T THINK
THIS IS THE BEST JOB IN THE
ENTIRE WORLD AND YOU WOULDN'T
BE THE HAPPIEST PERSON ALIVE
TO GET THAT JOB, OKAY?
YOU ARE NOT LYING TO THEM AND
IF THEY OFFER YOU A JOB, THEN
WE CAN DECIDE WHETHER WE WANT
THIS JOB OR NOT.
YOU WANT TO LEAVE A GOOD
IMPRESSION.
JUST EVERY TIME YOU GO FOR A
JOB INTERVIEW, YOU WILL GET
BETTER AT THE INTERVIEW AS
WELL.
EVERY TIME.
SO NEVER TURN DOWN AN
INTERVIEW, RIGHT?
THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF
YOUR DAY, HONE YOUR SEMINAR.
IT WILL BE YOUR RESEARCH
SEMINAR AND BE SURE YOU SHOW
THE AUDIENCE OR FACULTY THAT
POTENTIALLY WILL BE YOUR
COLLEAGUES THAT YOU HAVE THE
BIG PICTURE.
THAT YOU KNOW WHY WHAT YOU ARE
DOING IS IMPORTANT, RIGHT?
NOT JUST THE LITTLE IMPORTANCE
OR MEDIATE CLINICAL IMPACT BUT
THE BROADER IMPORTANCE, THE
WHOLE FABRIC OF BIOLOGY.
YOU WILL HAVE TO SHOW YOUR
FUNDABILITY.
IN A PERFECT WORLD, YOU
WOULDN'T.
IN THIS WORLD, YOU WILL HAVE
TO.
SHOW THAT YOU ARE WORKING ON
SOMETHING AND NIH WILL GIVE
YOU MONEY TO STUDY.
YOU PROBABLY ALREADY KNOW
THIS, SOME PLACES WILL GIVE
YOU A K EYE WARD AND SOME
PLACES WON'T LOOK AT YOU
UNLESS YOU HAVE THAT K AWARD
TO START.
THERE'S PLENTY OF
OPPORTUNITIES, TAKE A
GRANT-WRITING COURSE AT NIH,
BUT THERE ARE PLENTY OF WAYS
TO SHOW YOU KNOW SOMETHING
ABOUT THE SYSTEM.
THERE IS A NEGATIVE KNOCK OF
PEOPLE WHO COME TO NIH, YOU
DON'T KNOW HOW TO GET FUNDING,
HAVEN'T WRITTEN GRANTS.
A IS NOT NECESSARILY TRUE AND
B IS GOOD.
I WANT YOU AS A POST-DOC TO DO
SCIENCE AND THEN IF YOU NEED
TO GET FUNDING, YOU WILL KNOW
HOW TO DO IT.
OKAY, SO YOU WILL NEED A LOT
OF READING OF RECENT PAPERS,
SHOW THEM THEY WILL BE THE
BEST -- YOU WILL BE THE BEST
COLLEAGUE THEY WILL EVER HAVE.
A LITTLE FLAT RECAN GET --
FLATTERY CAN GET YOU PLACES IN
LIFE.
NOW THEY HAVE TO SIT DOWN WITH
THEIR POST-DOCS AT LEAST ONCE
A YEAR WHICH I THINK IS A
FANTASTIC THING.
DISCUSS THE STRENGTH AND
KNOWLDGE AS A SCIENTIST, WHAT
ARE YOU DOING WELL, NOT WELL,
WHAT DO THEY THINK YOU COULD
BE, WHAT DO YOU THINK YOU
COULD BE AND HAVE A SERIOUS
DISCUSSION WITH THEM.
AND DON'T BE WORRIED THAT THEY
WILL BE DISAPPOINTED THAT YOU
DON'T WANT TO BE A PI.
THAT USED TO BE THE CASE MORE
OFTEN IN THE PAST BUT
WHATEVER.
IT IS NOT THEIR LIFE, IT IS
YOUR LIFE.
THE DAY HAS GONE BY WHERE WE
HAD THIS ATTENTION TO CAREERS,
WHAT WOULD OFTEN HAPPEN IS THE
PI WOULD THINK THIS PERSON IS
NOT REALLY SUITED TO BE A PI
AND THE POST-DOC WOULD SAY I
AM NOT SUITED TO BE A PI AND
THE TWO NEVER GOT TOGETHER.
SO YOU HAVE THIS MEETING, YOU
GO OH, YEAH, WE ARE ON THE
SAME PAGE HERE SO SIT DOWN
ONCE A YEAR WITH YOUR
POST-DOC.
DEVELOP SECONDARY MENTORS WHO
CAN PROVIDE ALTERNATIVE VIEWS
AND YOU CAN GET ADVICE FROM.
THERE'S OTHER PEOPLE AROUND
WHO WILL HELP YOU.
I AM ONE.
IF YOU EVER WANT SOME GENERAL
CAREER ADVICE, JUST E-MAIL ME,
WE CAN GET TOGETHER, I WILL
BUY YOU COFFEE AND WE CAN TALK
ABOUT IT.
THERE'S PLENTY OF OTHER PEOPLE
HERE WHO HAVE THE SAME
ATTITUDE.
FOR NONACADEMIC JOBS,
NETWORKING IS ABSOLUTELY
CRITICAL SO FOR PEOPLE TAKING
PICTURES, JUST E-MAIL ME AND I
WILL SEND YOU THE
PRESENTATION, THE SLIDES.
ONE OF THE GREAT THINGS ABOUT
BEING A POST-DOC AT NIH, THERE
ARE LOTS OF JOBS THAT YOU GUYS
HAVE THE INSIDE TRACK TO.
THERE IS EXTRA MURAL, MANY
PEOPLE FROM MY LAB, WE HAVE
MANY PEOPLE AT THE FDA.
WHO HAS EVER HEARD OF BARDA,
ANYONE IN THIS ROOM?
THEY HAVE A BILLION DOLLARS
EACH YEAR TO SPEND.
THEY HAVE HIRED SEVERAL
POST-DOCS, THERE ARE PLACES
LIKE THAT AROUND WASHINGTON
YOU HAVE NEVER HEARD OF THAT
HIRE PEOPLE THAT ARE REALLY
COOL AND FUN JOBS TO HAVE SO
NETWORKING IS REALLY CRITICAL.
THIS IS ONE OF THE BEST PLACES
TO GET A JOB IF YOU HAVE A
BIOMEDICAL PHD.
BY FAR, THE BEST PLACE TO GET
A JOB.
A WHOLE BUNCH OF POLICY JOBS
AS WELL.
THERE ARE JOBS IN AND OUT OF
THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WHERE
YOU CAN WORK ON SCIENTIFIC
POLICY.
IT CAN BE REALLY HARD
CONTACTING PEOPLE AT
COMPANIES.
EVEN WHEN YOU READ THEIR
PAPERS, THEY DON'T HAVE THEIR
E-MAIL ADDRESSES ON THIS, TEND
TO BE VERY PROTECTIVE SO EVEN
GETTING YOUR FOOT IN THE DOOR
CAN BE HARD SO MEETINGS ARE A
GREAT PLACE TO INTRODUCE
YOURSELF TO COMPANY JOBS AND
START NETWORKING AT THAT
LEVEL.
SO I WILL END WITH SOME
GRATUITOUS ADVICE FROM MY 64
YEARS ON THIS PLANET.
LIFE IS NOT FAIR.
NOBODY IS THE BIGGEST FISH
HERE, RIGHT?
EVERYBODY IS SOMEWHERE DOWN ON
THIS FISH EATS FISH SLIDE.
SO JUST DON'T EXPECT LIFE TO
, RIGHT?
AND YOU HAVE TO STRUGGLE AT
SOME LEVEL AND MAYBE THE OTHER
GUY HAS IT MUCH EASIER.
DON'T EVER THINK THAT.
YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT TROUBLES
SOMEBODY ELSE HAD, OKAY?
SO, YOU KNOW, JUST EVERYONE
HAS THIS DEAL.
LIFE ISN'T FAIR, YOU TAKE THE
LUMPS AS THEY COME AND IN
GENERAL, YOU WILL WANT TO BE
THE OPTIMIST.
I KNOW IT IS HARD.
THIS IS INTERESTING BECAUSE I
NOTICE THIS IS LIKE
NIH-SPECIFIC.
[LAUGHTER]
>> WELL, WHATEVER, BE THE
OPTIMIST.
AGAIN, LIFE ISN'T FAIR, NO
ONE'S LIFE IS FAIR, TRY TO BE
AS HAPPY AS YOU CAN.
WE ARE ALL BORN WITH A
DIFFERENT SET POINT FOR
HAPPINESS.
OPTIMISTS ARE HAPPIER PEOPLE,
OTHER PEOPLE LIKE THEM, YOU
WILL COLLABORATE BETTER AND
YOUR SCIENCE WILL BE BETTER.
A CRUCIAL PART OF THE SCIENCE
IS FUN, ENJOYING IT, LOVING
IT, SHARING THAT FUN.
IT IS A CRITICAL PART OF IT.
OKAY, LIFE IS TRULY A
MARATHON, RIGHT?
IT IS A LONG SLOG THROUGH
LIFE, IT IS A GREAT THING BUT
YOU WILL HAVE SETBACKS.
ENJOY THE JOURNEY.
FAMILY AND FRIENDS IS THE KEY
TO A HAPPY LIFE AND FAMILY,
YEAH, I THINK AS A YOUNG
SCIENTIST, YOU WILL HAVE TIME
FOR SCIENCE AND ONE OTHER
THING.
FOR SOME IT CAN BE A SERIOUS
HOBBY BUT FOR MOST OF US IT IS
FAMILY.
AND AGAIN, YOU DON'T HAVE TO
BE A PERFECT PARENT.
YOUR GENERATION TRIES TOO HARD
AT PARENTING.
MY GENERATION WAS MORE FREE
RANGE.
WE NEVER SAW OUR PARENTS AND
WE TURNED OUT OKAY.
AND OUR KIDS TURNED OUT OKAY.
MY WIFE WAS A PEDIATRICIAN, WE
DIDN'T HAVE A HUGE AMOUNT OF
TIME TO SHEPHERD THEM
EVERYWHERE.
AND THEY TURNED OUT FINE.
AND HUMOR, ONE OF THE BEST
PARTS OF LIFE IS SHARING A
JOKE WITH EACH OTHER SO THAT
SHOULD BE AN INTEGRAL PART OF
EVERYDAY LIFE.
THIS IS ONE OF THE WAYS WE GET
THROUGH LIFE.
AND NOT TRIVIAL, EVERY DAY TRY
TO GET SOME EXERCISE.
YOU WILL LIVE LONGER, IT WILL
IMPROVE YOUR AFFECT AND IT MAY
EVEN SAVE YOUR LIFE AT THE END
OF THE DAY.
SOONER OR LATER, SOMETHING
SERIOUS WILL HAPPEN TO YOU, A
SERIOUS HEALTH CONCERN.
IN MY CASE, I WENT FROM BEING
PERFECTLY HEALTHY TO NEEDING A
QUADRUPLE CARDIAC CORONARY BY
PASS AND YOU WILL BE ABLE TO
DEAL BETTER WITH IT IF YOU ARE
SUPER-HEALTHY GOING INTO IT.
COULD YOU HAVE CANCER, SOME
OTHER PROBLEM, BEING HEALTHY
IS SUPER-IMPORTANT AND I KNOW
WHAT IT IS LIKE TO WORK IN A
LAB, NOTHING WORKS MOST DAYS,
VERY FRUSTRATING.
GO TO THE GYM, WORK OUT, YOU
FEEL MUCH BETTER.
FIVE DAYS A WEEK, TRY TO GET
SOME EXERCISE.
MY FIRST RULE OF EXERCISE, TEN
MINUTES IS BETTER THAN
NOTHING, EVERY DAY, SOMETHING.
SO THAT'S ALL FOLKS AND I AM
HERE FOR YOU GUYS.
MY E-MAIL, I THINK IT IS ON
THE WEBSITE BUT IF YOU CAN'T,
CONTACT ME, THERE WILL BE A
GOOGLE FOLDER AND YOU JUST 
DOWNLOAD IT.
I WANT TO THANK
JON FOR COVERING SOME
REALLY IMPORTANT THINGS BUT I
AM ACTUALLY GOING TO DISAGREE
WITH A FEW OF THEM AND AT SOME
POINT -- I SORT OF HAVE TO RUN
SO IT IS NOT A DAY FOR AN
INDEPTH DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT.
I GUESS IT IS MY HOPE THAT THE
NEXT GENERATION OF SCIENTISTS,
WHETHER YOU BE SCIENTISTS IN 
ACADEMIA, IN INDUSTRY,
WHETHER YOU USE YOUR SCIENCE
FOR THE GOOD OF HUMAN BEINGS
OR IN THE CLASSROOM OR THE
OFFICE, I GUESS THAT ALL OF
US, THAT CONTRIBUTES AN
ABILITY WHERE WE CAN HAVE A
FAMILY AND A FAMILY WE WANT.
WHERE WOMEN FEEL SAFE IN
SCIENCE, WHERE PEOPLE OF COLOR
FEEL EMBRACED IN SCIENCE AND A
LITTLE BIT, I THINK, THE OLDER
VIEW OF SCIENCE WAS AN
ENTERPRISE DEVELOPED BY RICH
WHITE MEN WHO HAD A LOT OF
LUXURY AND SO A H LITTLE  --
LITTLE BIT OF THE LIFE IS HARD
AND IT WILL SUCK TO BE A
SCIENTISTS AND WILL BEAT THE
LIFE OUT OF YOU WHICH I DON'T
THINK JON MEDIUM  -- MEANS AT
ALL, I THINK YOU WILL LOVE
SCIENCE BUT THE PEOPLE SITTING
IN THE BACK, SOME OF THAT YOU
WON'T GET TO SEE YOUR KIDS OR
WILL ONLY GET TO BE ONE THING
WAS MAYBE HEARD AND I DON'T
THINK IT WAS MEANT THAT WAY
BUT I DO THINK SCIENCE HAS
CHANGED.
SOME OF YOU SAW THE E-MAIL
FROM AN NIH FELLOW, VERY
DISAPPOINTED ABOUT HER CAREER
AND FEELS NIH HAS TO DO A LOT
BETTER TO TAKE CARE OF ALL OF
YOU, YOU ARE OUR MOST
IMPORTANT HUMAN CAPITAL, MORE
THAN THE AGENTS AND THE TOOLS,
WE HAVE THESE PEOPLE THAT COME
HERE AND WANT TO CHANGE
SCIENCE FOR THE BETTER.
AND SO WHILE I THINK WE
HAVEN'T ADDRESSED ALL THE
CRISIS IN SCIENCE AND I AGREE
WITH JON WE HAVE KNOWN FOR A
LONG TIME THERE ARE ISSUES IN
SCIENCE AND DISAPPOINTED
PEOPLE ENTERING AND LEAVING
THE FIELD WITH THE LOVE OF
SCIENCE BEATEN O OUT  -- OUT
OF THEM, I ACTUALLY THINK WE
COULD TAKE A DIFFERENT VIEW
AND WORK AS A COMMUNITY TO
TAKE THE GOOD PARTS OF
SCIENCE, WHERE YOU LOVE A
PROBLEM AND TO WANT SOLVE IT,
HOWEVER YOU WANT TO SOLVE IT,
AND LEARN HOW TO DO THAT IN A
MORE HEALTHY AND HUMANE AND
COLLABORATIVE WAY AND SOME OF
THAT IS TAKING OVER BIT OF
JON'S ADVICE BECAUSE IT IS
GOOD.
WE ALL HAVE LEARN TO BE SUPER
HUMAN BEINGS AND MANAGEMENT
SKILLS AND INTERPERSONAL
SKILLS AND HAVE TO LEARN HO
TREAT EACH OTHER AS THE MOST
VALUABLE COMMODITY THAT WE 
HAVE AS OPPOSED TO
SOLICITATIONS OR THE TECH WEEK
WE HAVE.
I HAVE BEEN HERE A DECADE.
I ACTUALLY SHUT MY LAB.
I NEVER EVER THOUGHT I WOULD
BE SO CONSUMED OF HOW IS IT WE
CAN MAKE NIH A CLIMATE WHERE
PEOPLE COME AND TO WANT LEARN
AND LEAVE AS HAPPY AS THEY
COME IN.
BUT I ACTUALLY SHUT MY LAB TO
THINK ABOUT THE CAREER
DEVELOPMENT OF STUDENTS AND
STRIKES ME TO MAKE CHANGE FROM
THE BOTTOM, UP, MEANS EVERYONE
SITTING HERE TAKES THE
WORKPLACE DYNAMIC SERIOUS, ALL
FOUR PARTS.
EVEN THOUGH IT IS LABELED FOR
FIVE, IT IS ACTUALLY ONLY FOUR
PARTS NOW AND EACH OF YOU
TAKES IT BECAUSE IT IS HOW YOU
LEARN ABOUT YOURSELF AND HOW
TO INTERACT WITH OTHERS.
EACH OF YOU TAKES THE
MENTORING COURSE.
THE MANAGEMENT BOOT CAMP.
EACH OF YOU TAKE THE
UNIVERSITY DIVERSITY COURSE
AND REQUEST WHY IS THAT AS YOU
RIDE THE RED LINE, LIFE IN
MONTGOMERY COUNTY IS HIGHER
THAN IN WASHINGTON D.C.?
EVERY DAY WE RIDE THE REDLINE
OF INEQUALITY, MANY OF YOU
RIDE IT WITH ME AS I SEE A LOT
OF YOU HERE.
SO AS WE TALK ABOUT HOW TO
REACH THE TOP, WE CAN THINK
ABOUT HOW TO CARRY MANY, MANY
MORE PEOPLE ALONG WITH US AND
MAYBE WE CAN TAKE THE PASSION
FOR SCIENCE THAT I REALLY
ENJOYED IN JOHN'S TALK AND
MAYBE SUPER IMPOSE IT ON A
LITTLE BIT OF, I DON'T KNOW, 
WARMER, MORE SUPPORTIVE, I
DON'T KNOW, MORE INTEGRATED
LIFE AND WORK VIEW AND I HOPE
THAT YOU WILL JOIN THE OFFICE
OF INTRAMURAL TRAINING AND
EDUCATION IN DOING THAT.
SO OUR NEXT BIG EVENT AROUND
CAREERS IS AROUND MAY 18TH,
THE NIH CAREER SYMPOSIUM THAT
WILL HAVE ABOUT 1000 PEOPLE
COMING FROM ALL OVER THE
UNITED STATES BUT IS REALLY
FOR YOU HERE AT NIH.
OUR WORKSHOPS, IT IS
INTERESTING, SOME WORKSHOPS ON
RELATIONSHIP MANAGEMENT IS
ALMOST EMPTY BUT THEN WHEN I
TALK TO NEW TENURE TRACK PIS
IS THE HARDEST PART IS HOW TO
MAKE THIS A FUN PLACE TO DO
SCIENCE.
SO I WILL INVITE YOU ALL WITH
A LIST OF THINGS YOU NEED TO
DO TO FOCUS ON YOUR
INTERPERSONAL SKILLS AND I
WILL END WITH ONE LAST THING.
I LOVE THAT JON FLIPPED THE
WAY HE USED ALTERNATIVE CAREER
BUT I WILL ASK HIM TO REMOVE
IT FOREVER FROM THE SLIDE.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN
ALTERNATIVE CAREER.
NO SUCH THING AS ANY KIND OF
CAREER BUT ONE THAT MAKES YOU
VERY, VERY HAPPY.
IT WILL ALLOW TO YOU LOVE IN
THE WAY YOU WANT TO LOVE THEM
AND ALLOWS YOU TO CONTRIBUTE.
NO CAREERS ARE ALTERNATIVE, NO
LIVES ARE ALTERNATIVE BUT
ALTERNATIVE ENERGY IS COOL.
SO IF WE ARE TALKING ABOUT
ALTERNATIVE CAREERS LIKE THAT,
THAT WE ALL TO WANT DRIVE
REALLY SUPER-COOL ELECTRIC
CARS, THEN GO HAVE AN
ALTERNATIVE CAREER BUT BECAUSE
WE KNOW IT COMES IN A
NEGATIVE, PERJORATIVE WAY OF
YOU WEREN'T GOOD ENOUGH.
MANY OF US ARE.
I LOVE THE JOB THAT I DO
BECAUSE OF THE FELLOWS AND SO
I WOULD HOPE THAT WE CAN TAKE
THE POSITION IN JOHN'S TALK
AND SOFTEN IT A BIT TO BUILD A
SCIENTIFIC ENTERPRISE THAT
WELCOMES EVERYBODY.
SO THANK YOU FOR BEING MERE
AND WIN THANK YOU FOR THE
CHANCE.
MICHAEL GOTTESMAN HAS BEEN AN
AMAZING MENTOR SO I AM PLEASED
ACTUALLY TO INTRODUCE MICHAEL.
[APPLAUSE]
>> ALL RIGHT, WELL TWO, VERY
DIFFICULT ACTS TO FOLLOW.
SO I WAS SITTING AND LISTENING
TO JOHN AND THINKING -- JON
AND THINKING I REALLY AGREE
WITH EVERYTHING HE SAYS AND
LISTENING TO SHARON AND
THINKING SHARON IS ABSOLUTELY
RIGHT AND THE COMMON FEATURE
IN BOTH OF THEIR PRESENTATIONS
IS THE PASSION.
AND IN JON'S CASE, IT COMES
THROUGH VERY CLEARLY, A
PASSION FOR THE SCIENCE WE ALL
SHARE AND IN SHARON'S CASE WHO
I KNOW IS PASSIONATE ABOUT HER
SCIENCE, AN EQUAL PASSION FOR
THE PEOPLE WHO DO THE SCIENCE
AND YOU CAN'T HAVE ONE WITHOUT
THE OTHER SO THEY ARE
PERFECTLY COMPATIBLE
PRESENTATIONS AND BY THE WAY,
THAT IS MY JOB AT NIH TO MAKE
SURE THAT EVERYBODY GETS ALONG
WITH EVERYBODY ELSE.
[LAUGHTER]
>> SO I THOUGHT I WOULD GIVE
YOU AS WIN DID AT THE
BEGINNING, A LITTLE BIT OF
HISTORY.
HE MENTIONED ALL THE
RESPONSIBILITIES THAT I HAVE
AND I WAS SHOCKED TO HEAR THEM
ALL.
IT WAS LIKE WHAT AM I DOING
HERE, I HAVE SO MUCH WORK TO
DO?
[LAUGHTER]
>> BUT I THINK ONE IMPORTANT
POINT TO MAKE IS INITIALLY THE
NIH WAS A PLACE IN WHICH THE
GOVERNMENT CONDUCTED
SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH AND BEFORE
WORLD WAR II, IN FACT, IT WAS
THE ONLY PLACE IN A SENSE
WHERE BIOLOGICAL RESEARCH WAS
DONE BY THE GOVERNMENT.
IT WAS ONLY AFTER THE WAR THAT
THE GRANT SYSTEM DEVELOPED AND
UNIVERSITIES TO SUPPORT IT.
SO THE MISSION FOR MANY YEARS
WAS TO CONDUCT HIGH QUALITY
BIOLOGICAL RESEARCH.
IT WASN'T TILL ABOUT 30 YEARS
AGO IN THE LATE 1980S WHICH
MAY SEEM LIKE A LONG TIME FOR
YOU BUT NOT SO MUCH TO ME,
THAT NIH WAS GIVEN THE
AUTHORITY BY THE FEDERAL
GOVERNMENT TO SUPPORT
INTRAMURAL TRAINING.
SO THIS WAS CALLED THE IRTA
AUTHORITY, AND THEN THERE WAS
AN EQUAL PART OF CANCER
RESEARCH AUTHORITY.
BEFORE THEN, WHEN I FIRST CAME
TO THE NIH, THERE WERE NO
TRAINING POSITIONS.
EVERYBODY WHO WORKED HERE WAS
THE EQUIVALENT OF A STAFF
SCIENTIST OR RESEARCH FELLOW.
THEY WERE EMPLOYED BY THE NIH
TO DO OR HELP SUPPORT A JOB
AND WHEN WE WANTED TO HAVE A  
POST-DOCTORAL POSITION, IT
CENTERED AROUND THE MOST
IMPORTANT RESEARCH AT THE
TIME.
SO MEDICAL EDUCATION AND 
EDUCATION OF POST-DOCTORAL
FELLOWS, THEN WE DIVIDED THAT
UP AND THE MEDICAL PART MOVED
INTO THE MEDICAL CENTER AND
THE PART THAT SHARON NOW RUNS
WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE
TRAINING OF OUR STUDENTS,
POST-DOCS, GRADUATE STUDENTS,
FELLOWS AND TOOK THE JOB
REALLY SERIOUSLY.
AND I HAVE TO SAY SHARON IS
PROBABLY THE LEADER IN
THINKING ABOUT WAYS IN WHICH
YOU CAN INSTITUTIONALIZE ALL
THE SUPPORT THAT YOU NEED IN
ORDER TO MAKE THESE DIFFICULT
DECISIONS THAT JON WAS TALKING
ABOUT.
SO LET ME JUST RUN THROUGH
SYSTEM OF THE THINGS THAT YOU
MAY TAKE FOR GRANTED OR MAY
NOT EVEN BE THINKING ABOUT.
SO I MEET EVERY TWO WEEKS WITH
THE SCIENTIFIC DIRECTORS AND
ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, WE REVIEW
SALARIES, THE STIPENDS YOU GET
AS POST-DOCTORAL FELLOWS.
AND THE GOAL IS TO KEEP PACE
WITH THE LOCAL STANDARDS FOR
PAYMENTS BUT ALSO UNIVERSITY
STANDARDS.
NIH OVER THE LAST YEARS HAS
MET THE FAIR LABOR STANDARDS
ACT WHICH IS PRETTY HIGH FOR
POST-DOCTORAL FELLOWS SO WE
BELIEVE THAT OUR STIPENDS ARE
COMPETITIVE.
THERE MAY BE AN OPPORTUNITY
FOR SOME PEOPLE 'S STIPENDS TO
BE MATCHED WITH GRANTS WHICH
WE DO NOT HAVE BUT AT LEAST
THE SALARIES ARE COMPETITIVE
AND THAT IS SOMETHING WE THINK
ABOUT AND WORK ON EVERY YEAR
SO THAT IS WHY THERE IS AN
INCREASE IN SALARIES AS WELL.
HEALTH INSURANCE WHICH IS
REALLY A GOLD STANDARD FOR OUR
FELLOWS IS SUPPORTED THROUGH
THE FOUNDATION OF THE ADVANCED
ORGANIZATION OF THE SCIENCE
WHICH SUPPORTS NIH TRAINING
SPECIFICALLY AND THEY TRY VERY
HARD TO PROVIDE INSURANCE THAT
IS AS GOOD OR BETTER THAN THE
FEDERAL INSURANCE AVAILABLE
AND ASSURES THAT EVERYONE WHO
IS HERE HAS THE SUPPORT THEY
NEED TO TAKE CARE OF THEIR
HEALTH ISSUES.
FOR SOME PEOPLE, THAT COULD BE
CONSIDERABLE IF YOU HAVE A
CHILD THAT NEEDS CARE IN THE
NEO-NATAL INTENSIVE CARE UNIT,
THAT CAN RUN INTO TENS OF
THOUSANDS AND HUNDREDS OF
MILLIONS OF DOLLARS SOMETIMES
AND THAT RUNS THROUGH OUR
INSURANCE.
IT IS NOT PERFECT BUT
SOMETHING WE THINK ABOUT ALL
THE TIME AND MAKE SURE
EVERYBODY WHO IS HERE HAS 
APPROPRIATE HEALTH INSURANCE.
INSTITUTIONAL PROGRAMS YOU MAY
NOT KNOW ABOUT AND I WANTED TO
MENTION THEM BECAUSE YOU MAY
NOT KNOW ABOUT THEM.
WE HAVE THE KEY THREAD PROGRAM
WHICH ACKNOWLEDGES THAT
POST-DOCS EARLY IN THEIR
CAREERS HAVE OCCASIONS WHY
THEY CAN'T WORK FULL-TIME IN
THE LABORATORY AND WE DON'T
WANT YOU TO LOSE YOUR
OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT.
SO YOU CAN WORK PART-TIME AND
YOU MAY NOT BE AWARE THERE IS
A WHO WILL PROGRAM IN MACE
THAT ALLOWS YOU TO WORK AT
LEAST 50 PERCENT OF THE TIME
OR LESS.
TO GET HEALTH INSURANCE, YOU
HAVE TO WORK 50 PERCENT OF THE
TIME BUT WE CAN ARRANGE BY
VARIOUS MEANS TO MAKE THAT
LESS AND THAT MEANS COMING TO
THE LAB, INTERACTING WITH
PEOPLE IN THE LAB WHILE YOU
MAY NOT BE ABLE TO WORK
FULL-TIME AND THAT TIME THAT
YOU TAKE OFF IS ADDED TO YOUR
MAXIMUM POST-DOCTORAL
EXPERIENCE AT NIH.
SO IT IS A LITTLE LIKE STOP
THE CLOCK PROGRAMS FOR PEOPLE
ON THE TENURED TRACK AND IT
ACKNOWLEDGES THE FLEXIBILITY
THAT SOME PEOPLE NEED IN THEIR
LIVES IN ORDER TO PURSUE
CAREER SCIENCE.
THIS IS NOT IN ANY WAY
SUGGESTING THAT THE
INSTITUTION CAN SOLVE ALL OF
YOUR PROBLEMS BUT THAT YOU
EACH NEED THE FLEXIBILITY TO
CONTINUE IN YOUR CAREERS.
YOU HEARD ABOUT THIS ALREADY
FROM JON.
WE REQUIRE INDIVIDUAL
DEVELOPMENT PLANS.
YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO MEET AT
LEAST ANNUALLY WITH YOUR PIS
AND OTHER MENTORS YOU MAY MEET
ALONG THE WAY TO TALK ABOUT
YOUR CAREER GOALS AND HAVE TO
ACHIEVE THEM.
I HAVE TO ADMIT OUR PIS ARE
PRETTY MUCH FOCUSED ON THE
LABORATORY PART OF THEIR LIVES
AND IF YOU BEGIN TO THINK
ABOUT SCIENCE POLICY, SCIENCE
WRITING, TECH TRANSFER OR
ALTERNATIVE OPTIONS TO BEING
IN A LABORATORY, YOU MAY NOT
GET THE BEST ADVICE.
AND SO THE NIH OFFICE OF
INTRAMURAL TRAINING AND
EDUCATION HAS FIVE CAREER
COUNSELORS.
THIS IS SHARON'S BRAINCHILD.
WE HAVE PROFESSIONALS WHO WILL
AND SHOULD IMMEDIATE ON A
REGULAR BASIS TO HELP YOU
THINK WHAT CAREER OPTIONS YOU
HAVE AND HOW BEST TO ACHIEVE
THOSE.
AND THEN WE ALL WORK TOGETHER
THROUGH SCIENTIFIC DIRECTORS
AND SO ON TO DEVELOP A PLAN SO
YOU CAN REACH THOSE GOALS.
COULD BE A DETAIL IN AN OFFICE
AT NIH, COULD BE SOME OTHER
EXPERIENCE YOU WILL HAVE ON
THE WEEKEND THAT WILL HELP YOU
GET WHERE YOU WANT TO BE. 
YOU KNOW ABOUT THE FAR AWARDS,
THAT IS NOT JUST AN
OPPORTUNITY TO WORK ON YOUR
SCIENCE BUT AN OPPORTUNTY TO
GET PROPOSALS, SPECIFIC
POSTERS AND GIVES YOU THE
EXPERIENCE THAT OTHER
SCIENTISTS HAVE WHEN THEY GET 
TO BE PI'S TO LOOK AT OTHER
PEOPLE'S WORK AND WHETHER TO
AWARD THEM OR NOT.
YOU HEARD ABOUT GRANT WRITING
CLASSES, MANY OF YOU SO HAVE
OPPORTUNITY TO SUCH CLASSES.
THE ABILITY TO BE MENTORED, TO
HAVE ADVOCATES.
TO BE INVOLVED IN CULTURAL OR
ADAPTATION PROGRAMS AND ALL 
THE OTHER ACTIVITIES THAT
SHARON MENTIONED.
ANOTHER PART OF WHAT WE DO
WHICH MAY NOT SEEM LIKE A
POSITIVE TO ALL F YOU IS LIMIT
THE POST-DOCTORAL EXPERIENCE.
IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE FIVE
YEARS AT NIH AND THE REASON
FOR THAT IS WE WANT PEOPLE
EARLY ON TO START THINKING
ABOUT WHAT THEY WANT TO DO.
IN FACT, TEN YEARS AGO, THE
AVERAGE WAS THREE, THREE AND A
HALF YEARS AND NOW IT IS MORE
FOUR AND A HALF TO FIVE YEARS
AND THAT IS EXTENDING FURTHER
THIS PERIOD OF SORT OF
INDECISION.
SO WE WOULD LIKE YOU TO START
THINKING EARLIER.
AND ONE OF THE CONSEQUENCES OF
COURSE IS PEOPLE ARE NOT
BEGINNING TO PLAN THEIR
CAREERS AHEAD OF TIME, IS THAT
THE 5TH YEAR COMES AND THEN
THE PEOPLE WHO LOVE THE NIH,
WANT TO STAY HERE IN SOME
CAPACITY AND CAN'T APPLY FOR
POSITIONS HERE.
I WILL GIVE YOU STATISTICS IN
A MOMENT AS THESE ARE NOT EASY
JOBS TO GET BUT YOU IT ON THE
WANT TO BE IN A SITUATION
WHERE YOU ARE BASICALLY IN A
STOP GAP MEASURE, SITTING IN A
POSITION WAITING FOR SOMETHING
TO HAPPEN.
YOU NEED TO TAKE ACTIVE
CONTROL OF YOUR LIFE, TAKE
ADVANTAGE OF THE OPPORTUNITIES
THE CAREER COUNSELORS OFFER
AND REALLY START THINKING
AFTER THREE YEARS WHAT YOU
WANT TO DO.
YOU CAN APPLY FOR K AWARDS.
BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF OPTIONS
AND LET ME SAY SOMETHING ABOUT
EMPLOYMENT OF THE H FELLOWS.
JON GAVE YOU STATISTICS FOR
THE WHOLE BIOMEDICAL RESEARCH
ENTERPRISE BUT A THE DATA WE
HAVE IS A  BIT ROWSIER FOR
FELLOWS.
BACK WHEN I WAS LOOKING FOR A 
JOB, 55 PERCENT GOT A JOB.
CURRENTLY THAT NUMBER IS ONE
IN TEN, ONE IN EIGHT,
SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
WE HAVE DON'T KNOW EXACTLY
WHAT IT IS AT THE MOMENT SO
THAT IS VERY DIFFERENT.
SO THE LIKELIHOOD OF ANY ONE
PERSON GETTING AN ACADEMIC JOB
IS PRETTY LOW BUT IT APPEARS
TO BE BETTER FOR NIH POST-DOCS
AND THE DATA IS NOT REALLY
HARD BUT LET ME BE CLEAR.
THE GOVERNMENT DOES NOT ALLOW
US TO COLLECT THE DATA FOR
POSITIONS.
IT IS CONSIDERED A SYSTEM OF
RECORDS AND THE PRIVACY ACT
DOESN'T LET US KEEP RECORDS
ABOUT YOU AFTER YOU HAVE LEFT
THE NIH.
SO WHAT I HAVE IS TWO STUDIES,
ONE DONE BY NIES WHICH WAS
DONE BY FELLOWS WHO WENT INTO
THE PROGRAM AND TRACKED THEM
USING INTERNET SEARCHES TO
FIND OUT WHAT THEY WERE DOING
AND WHERE.
THE EVIDENCE REVEALED ABOUT A
THIRD ARE IN FACULTY
POSITIONS.
A THIRD IN SOME KIND OF
GOVERNMENT POSITION AND A
THIRD ARE IN INDUSTRY, THE
REST DOING A WHOLE VARIETY OF
DIFFERENT THINGS.
WE HAVE A SIMILAR STUDY DONE
BY NHLBI AFTER THE FACT WITH
ABOUT THE SAME KIND OF
NUMBERS.
NOW ,THE OTHER INSTITUTES I
CAN'T SAY FOR SURE BUT WE ARE
TRYING VERY HARD TO COLLECT
THE DATA AND I THINK IT VERY
IMPORTANT WE HAVE THOSE DATA
AND THE FAES, THE FOUND DAYS
THAT  -- FOUNDATION THAT IS
TRYING TO COLLECT YOUR HEALTH
INSURANCE, YOU HAVE TO SIGN
OFF WHEN YOU LEAVE HERE THAT
YOU ARE NOT GETTING HEALTH
INSURANCE ANYMORE AND IF YOU
GO OVER TO THE FAES OFFICE,
THEY WILL GIVE YOU A FIVE
DOLLARS GIFT CERTIFICATE FOR
STARBUCKS IF YOU FILL OUT A
QUESTIONNAIRE THAT INCLUDES
LIKES WHERE ARE YOU GENERAL
COUNSEL, WHY ARE YOU GOING
THROUGH SO ON AND SO FORTH SO
WE CAN FIGURE OUT WHY PEOPLE
ARE GOING.
WE CAN FIND PEOPLE ONLINE BUT
EVEN THOUGH IT IS NOT A LOT,
IT IS SUFFICIENT TO HAVE
PEOPLE FILL OUT A RELATIVELY
SHORT SURVEY SO I ENCOURAGE
YOU, IF ANY OF YOU ARE CLOSE
TO LEAVING THE NIH, LET US
KNOW WHERE YOU ARE GOING
BECAUSE WE REALLY NEED TO KNOW
WHAT IS HAPPENING TO PEOPLE
WHO HAVE BEEN HERE.
IN TERMS OF THE ACTUAL JOBS AT
NIH, THERE IS HARDLY ANYONE
WHO WOULDN'T WANT TO STAY IN
THEIR POSITION AT NIH, JON AND
I CAN TELL YOU HOW WONDERFUL
IT IS TO BE A SCIENTIST HERE,
REALLY A PRIVILEGE.
WE HAVE TWO KINDS OF SEARCHES.
ONE A GENERAL SEARCH FOR
TENURE TRACK PEOPLE, ONE NAMED
AFTER THE STATUTEMANS WHO WERE
GENERAL CHEMISTS AT THE NIH,
THAT IS A TENURE TRACK FOR ALL
KINDS OF POSITIONS.
THERE ARE 20 DIFFERENT SEARCH
COMMITTEES THAT MAKE UP THAT
SEARCH AND THE IDEA IS TO FIND
PEOPLE AND MATCH THEM WITH INS
TOOT LOOKING FOR PEOPLE WITH
THOSE KINDS OF SKILLS.
WE HIRE ABOUT 10-12 PEOPLE A
YEAR INTO THOSE POSITIONS AND
IN ADDITIN, WE HAVE A SEARCH
FOR CLINICAL INVESTIGATORS
NAMED AFTER MARY LASKER AND WE
HIRE TWO TO THREE PEOPLE PER 
YEAR INTO THOSE POSITIONS.
AND THEN THERE ARE ADDITIONAL
POSITIONS THAT ARE LAB AND
INSTITUTE-BASED AND TOTAL,
MAYBE 20-30 POSITIONS A YEAR
AT NIH.
WE HAVE 3000 POST-DOCTORAL
FELLOWS SO THE REALITY IS
THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH POSITIONS
TO SATISFY ALL OF THE TALENTED
PEOPLE WHO ARE HERE.
HOWEVER, SOME OF YOU MAY
BELIEVE IT IS HARDER TO GET A
JOB IF YOU ARE NOT ALREADY A
POST-DOC, THAT IS NOT TRUE.
50PERCENT OF THE POSITIONS GO
TO PEOPLE ALREADY AT NIH AND
TWO-THIRDS OF THE PEOPLE IN
CLINICAL POSITIONS.
SO YOU HAVE THE REAL ADVANTAGE
IN REALITY OF GETTING A JOB
HERE BUT STILL THE STATISTICS
ARE NOT MA MUCH  -- THAT MUCH
IN YOUR FAVOR.
SO THE PICTURE ABOUT THE
FUTURE, WE ARE REALLY
INTERESTED IN EVERYONE BEING
SUCCESSFUL WHO HAS BEEN HERE
AND I HAVE A FEW SUGGESTIONS,
SORT OF LONG THE LINES THAT
JON HAD, ABOUT THINGS YOU CAN
DO.
THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IS TO
START PLANNING EARLY.
DON'T WAIT TILL YOUR
APPOINTMENT HAS ENDED BEFORE
YOU START THINKING ABOUT WHAT
YOU REALLY WOULD LIKE TO DO
NEXT.
SO I WOULD SAY AFTER THE
SECOND OR THIRD YEAR OF YOUR
POST-DOC, YOU SHOULD START
THINKING ABOUT WHAT COMES
NEXT.
IF YOU CAN APPLY FOR K AWARDS
AS JON SAID, THAT IS PROBABLY
THE SIMPLEST PATHWAY TO A PI 
POSITION INSIDE OR OUTSIDE THE
NIH.
GETTING THOSE AWARDS IS
HELPFUL, DEMONSTRATING YOU
HAVE THE DISCIPLINE TO WRITE A
GOOD PROPOSAL AND YOUR
INSTITUTION IS WILLING TO
SUPPORT  THE WORK YOU WANT TO
DO.
THE SECOND POINT, THERE ARE
JOBS ALL OVER THE COUNTRY,
TERRIFIC JOBS FOR SCIENTISTS.
THERE ARE GREAT UNIVERSITIES
IN AMAZES OTHER THAN NIH, IN
BOSTON, SAN FRANCISCO, NEW
YORK, AND A COUPLE OF OTHER
PLACES AND YOU SHOULD BE SURE
TO THINK OF THOSE OTHER
PLACES.
I KNOW IN SOME CASES THAT
CREATES FAMILY ISSUES BUT, YOU
KNOW, LIFE IS NOT FAIR AND I 
THINK HARD DECISIONS HAVE TO
BE MADE.
AND FINALLY BE CREATIVE IN THE
WAY YOU THINK ABOUT YOUR
SCIENTIFIC CAREERS.
SOME MAY WANT TO WORK IF A
LAB, SOME IN THE CLINICS BUT
THERE ARE JOBS IN SCIENCE
WRITING, SCIENCE POLICY, TECH
TRANSFER, LOT OF JOBS AT NIH
IN GRANT REVIEW.
THE FDA IS HIRING A HUGE
NUMBER OF PEOPLE NOW,
LITERALLY A THOUSAND PEOPLE
OVER THE NEXT FEW YEARS AND
THEY LOVE NIH POST-DOC AND I
PERSONALLY KNOW OF MANY PEOPLE
GETTING JOBS THERE.
YOU MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN
STARTING A COMPANY SO BEING
ENTREPRENEURIAL IS NOT A BAD
APPROACH.
PEOPLE TALK ABOUT CONSULTING
AND MANY PEOPLE GET JOBS WITH
BIG CONSULTING AGENCIES LIKE
DELOITTE AND SO ON WHERE THEY
GET PAID PRETTY WELL TO GIVE
ADVICE ABOUT SCIENTIFIC ISSUES
BECAUSE LOTS OF PEOPLE IN THE
COUNTRY AND OUT OF THE COUNTRY
WANT SCIENTISTS TO WEIGH IN ON
HOW THEY SHOULD PROCEED IN
THEIR BUSINESSES AND SO ON.
AND ONE OF THE GROWTH AREAS AT
NIH HAS TO DEAL WITH
REGULATION WHERE WE NEED
PEOPLE ALL THE TIME, PEOPLE
WHO HAVE INTEREST IN
REGULATORY AFFAIRS RELATED TO
HUMAN SUBJECTS AND OTHER
ASPECTS OF ANIMAL CARE AND SO
ON AND SO FORTH AND THERE WILL
BE JOBS AS PROTOCOL
NAVIGATORS, PEOPLE WHO ARE
COMPLIANCE OFFICERS, SO ON AND
SO FORTH, ET CETERA, ET
CETERA, A LOT OF OTHER
OPPORTUNITIES INCLUDING
OPPORTUNITIES YOU CREATE FOR
YOURSELF.
SO ON THAT NOTE, I WILL END
AND I THINK THE PLAN IS TO
HOPEFULLY HAVE A PANEL THAT
WILL ENGAGE YOU IN A REAL
DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT COMES 
NEXT.
>>  LET ME ASK MICHAEL
HERE, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WHEN
THERE HAVE BEEN PROGRAMS AND
SYMPOSIA, DISCUSSIONS AND SO
FORTH ABOUT ALTERNATIVE
CAREERS --
>> WE DON'T USE THAT TERM
ANYMORE --
>> OKAY, LIKE ALTERNATIVE
FACT.
OTHER CAREERS, TO BE A PI, IT
SEEMS TO ME THAT ONE THING
THAT IS RARELY MENTIONED IS
THIS FACT OF LINKAGE WITH A
CLINICAL DEPARTMENT.
NOW, A LONG TIME AGO, CLINICAL
DEPARTMENTS EXPANDED LIKE
CRAZY BY HIRING MANY, MANY PHD
SCIENTISTS ON THINGS CALLED
RESEARCH TRACKS AND SO FORTH.
BUT THEY WERE ALL SOFT MONEY
AND IF THE INVESTIGATOR LOST
HIS OR HER GRANT, THE
INDIVIDUAL WAS OUT, THAT WAS
IT.
BUT THEN THINGS DRAMATICALLY
CHANGED WHEN PHYSICIANS
SCIENTISTS BEGAN TO DECLINE
AND INSTITUTIONS HAD
BUILDINGS, LABORATORIES FOR
BIG CLINICAL DEPARTMENTS AND
MANY INSTITUTIONS CHANGED THE
RULES.
SO AT ONE POINT, THERE WERE AT
LEAST A DOZEN FULL PROFESSORS
OF MEDICINE IN THIS COUNTRY
WHO DID NOT HAVE AN MD.
MOST OF THEM WERE IN CANCER
CENTERS OR OTHERS AND A LOT OF
THAT PERSISTS.
NOW, WITH THE EXPLOSION IN THE
NEW SCIENCE COMING ALONG, IT
SEEMS TO ME THAT SAME KIND OF
SCENARIO IS NOT TOTALLY OUT OF
THE QUESTION, THAT THERE WILL
BE OPPORTUNITIES FOR PRIMARY
APPOINTMENTS IN CLINICAL
DEPARTMENTS WITH SECONDARY AND
BASIC SCIENCE DEPARTMENTS.
WE HAVE A FOLLOW UP ON A
PROGRAM I RAN QUITE A FEW
YEARS AGO NOW BUT THE VAST
MAJORITY OF PEOPLE WHO WENT
THROUGH THE PROGRAM WE HAD
THERE IT WHO WERE PHD'S, MANY
OF THEM WOUND UP IN CLINICAL
DEPARTMENTS AND REALLY THRIVED
BECAUSE THE CLINICAL YOUNG
SCIENTISTS WERE DELIGHTED TO
WORK WITH PEOPLE WHO WERE
TRAINED AT A MORE REDUCTIONIST
LEVEL AND WILL IN TURN, THEY
LEARNED WHAT REALLY ARE THE
IMPORTANT QUESTIONS THAT ARE
BEING ASKED IN TERMS OF
DISEASES.
SO I DIDN'T MEAN TO GIVE A
SPEECH BUT WHAT ARE YOUR
COMMENTS?
NO ONE SEEMS TO DISCUSS THIS.
>> YEAH, SO THERE ARE A COUPLE
OF THINGS I DIDN'T MENTION IN
TERMS OF CAREER DIRECTIONS
WHICH I THINK ARE IMPORTANT.
WHEN I THINK ABOUT YOUR
STATISTICS, THAT 50 PERCENT OF
THE PHDS A FEW YEARS AGO WERE
ENDING UP IN FACULTY POSITIONS
IN CLINICAL DEPARTMENTS AND I
SUSPECT THAT IS STILL TRUE
BECAUSE THE INVESTMENT MONEY
IS GOING INTO CLINICAL
DEPARTMENTS.
BUT THERE WAS A REPORT
ACTUALLY RELEASED THREE WEEKS
AGO BY THE NATIONAL ACADEMY OF
SCIENCES ABOUT THE FUTURE OF
CAREERS AND SCIENCE FOR
POST-DOCTORAL FELLOWS.
YOU CAN GO TO THE NATIONAL
ACADEMY WEBSITE AND DOWN LOAD
THE REPORT FOR FREE.
IT IS CALLED THE NEXT
GENERATION OF BIOMEDICAL AND
BEHAVIORAL SCIENCE RESEARCHERS
BREAKING THROUGH.
THE MAIN RECOMMENDATION IS
THAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
PUT MORE MONEY INTO RESEARCH
BUT THE OTHER POINT IS THAT
THEY ADD MORE STAFF SCIENTIST
POSITIONS.
THESE ARE POSITIONS AT NIH
WHERE THEY ARE NOT PIS,
INDEPENDENTLY CREATING THE
SCIENCE BUT ON TEAMS OF
SCIENCE GOING ON AT NIH AND
MANY OF THEM WERE PHYSICIANS.
THE REPORT SUGGESTS THAT THE
NIH OUGHT TO BE SUPPORTING
MORE OF THOSE PHYSICIANS.
I KNOW NIH HAS A PROJECT GOING
WITH GRANTS TO UNIVERSITIES TO
INSTITUTIONALLY SUPPORT THOSE
KINDS OF PHYSICIANS.
IN SOME WAYS, THEY ARE THE
BOTH OF BEST WORDS, OPT
OPPORTUNITY TO BE A SCIENTIST,
WORKING WITH OTHER PEOPLE,
HAVING ALL THE EXCITEMENT OF
BEING IN A GROUP BUT NOT
HAVING TO WORRY ON A REGULAR
BASIS ABOUT APPLYING FOR
GRANTS, EVEN OUTSIDE THE NIH.
JON, YOU MAY HAVE THOUGHTS ON
THIS?
>> YES, A STAFF SCIENTIST IS
THE BEST JOB.
YOU DON'T HAVE THE PRESSURE,
BET OF BOTH WORLDS AND NOT THE
TIME LIABILITIES YOU WOULD AS
A PI.
YOU KNOW, I THINK IN THE END,
WE REALLY NEED TO BALANCE THE
NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO WERE
PRODUCING AND THE NUMBER OF
PHYSICIANS AND IT IS NOT AN
EASY PROBLEM.
THAT IS THE PROBLEM.
IT IS NOT CENTRAL.
THE ECONOMY HERE, UNIVERSITIES
HAVE A RIGHT TO DO WHAT THEY
WANT AND EVEN WITH THE BEST OF
PLANNING, IT IS WORSE THAN
HERDING CATS.
SO IT IS NOT AN EASY PROBLEM
BUT YOU GUYS, UNLESS YOU WANT
TO GO INTO POLICY, YOU CAN'T
WORRY ABOUT ANY OF THIS, YOU
JUST HAVE TO TRY TO FIND --
THAT IS THE BEAUTY OF IT AND
ALSO A LIABILITY, IT IS
COMPLETELY QUANTAL.
YOU NEED ONE JOB, NOT TWO, NOT
A HUNDRED BUT UNTIL YOU GET
THAT JOB, THERE'S NO JOB.
SO I THINK THE BEST ADVICE I
HAVE HEARD TODAY IS AT THE END
OF YOUR SECOND OR THIRD YEAR,
START THINKING ABOUT WHAT THE
LANDING PAD IS GOING TO BE,
WHAT THE GOAL IS AND TRY TO
GET THERE.
A STAFF SCIENCE POSITION,
CERTAINLY A POSSIBILITY,
CERTAINLY CONSIDER IT.
IT COULD BE REALLY GOOD.
DEPENDS ON THE PI YOU WORK
WITH.
FACULTY RELATIONSHIP IS
CRITICAL WITH THAT JOB AND IF
YOU GET ALONG WELL WITH THAT
PERSON, IT CAN BE FANTASTIC.
SO PEOPLE MUST HAVE QUESTIONS
OR COMMENTS OR CRITICISMS.
GO AHEAD, WE CAN TAKE IT.
>> IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION, YOU
WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK, COME TO
THIS MICROPHONE.
>> HOPE YOU GUYS CAN HEAR ME.
I JUST CAME BACK FROM A
CONFERENCE ON THURSDAY, THE
WEEKS PASS BY SO QUICKLY, AND
ONE OF MY OLD MENTORS
MENTIONED TO ME VERY STRAIGHT
FORWARDLY THAT THE RESEARCH
SHE IS INTERESTED IN AND MY
INTERESTS DON'T MATCH.
I ALSO WORK HERE BUT AM A
STUDENT PART-TIME IN PUBLIC
HEALTH, WHICH WAS KIND OF HARD
TO HEAR BECAUSE I THOUGHT OF
HER AS MY MENTOR BUT THE WAY
SHE LAID IT OUT, HER WORK IS
IN EPILEPSY, MY WORK IS IN
MIGRAINE AND THEY DON'T LAP
100 PERCENT SO SHE MENTIONED I
NEED TO FIND A REALLY GOOD
MENTOR IN MY INTEREST
100 PERCENT TO GO TO BAT FOR
ME IN CERTAIN SITUATIONS TO
MAKE SURE I SUCCEED.
SO I AM NOT A POST-DOC YET,
STILL IN MY GRADUATE DEGREE.
SO WHAT ARE SOME TIPS FOR YOU
GUYS FOR STUDENTS LOOKING FOR
GOOD MENTORS BUT CAN'T
NECESSARILY FIND SOMEBODY WHO
IS, YOU KNOW, THAT IDEAL
PERSON THAT IS GOING TO OPEN
OPPORTUNITIES FOR THEM OR AT
LEAST TO MEET WITH THEM TO
EXPLAIN WHAT THE STRENGTHS AND
WEAKNESSES ARE?
IS SOUNDS GREAT BUT IT IS
REALLY HARD TO FIND THOSE
PEOPLE IN MY EXPERIENCE SO ANY
TIPS YOU CAN GIVE, LIKE ERDAS
OR FOR STUDENTS IN GRADUATE
SCHOOL RIGHT NOW WOULD BE
GREAT.
>> THAT IS A HARD ONE.
>> I WOULD SAY CAST A WIDE
NET, PUT IT OUT THERE THAT YOU
ARE LOOKING FOR A MENTOR AND
JUST APPROACH PEOPLE WHO YOU
THINK MIGHT BE OKAY AND DON'T
BE PUT OFF BY WHEN PEOPLE
DON'T GET BACK TO YOU, RIGHT?
YOU GET AN E-MAIL, YOU ARE NOT
INTERESTED IN, THE WORST THAT
CAN HAPPEN IS YOU JUST DON'T
RESPOND TO IT.
USUALLY THEY FEEL GUILTY THAT
THEY HAVE NOT GOTTEN BACK TO
YOU SO DON'T BE A I  --
AFRAID.
CHECK WHY YOUR FRIENDS,
COLLEAGUES, PEOPLE WHO THEY
MIGHT THINK --  WHERE YOU ARE,
AS A POST-DOC MAYBE YOU NEED
SOMEONE IN YOUR FIELD TO BE A
CHAMPION BUT AS A STUDENT,
THAT KIND OF ADVICE I DON'T
THINK YOU REALLY NEED TO. TALK
ABOUT WHAT LAB YOU WOULD WANT
TO DO A POST-DOC IN, THAT IS A
WHOLE DIFFERENT THING
ALTOGETHER BUT THAT IS NOT
YOUR QUESTION?
[ OFF MICROPHONE ]
>> -- A GOOD MATCH BETWEEN --
YEAH, SO A GOOD MATCHING THE
DOCTORAL STUDENT AND A MENTOR
IS BROUGHT UP A LOT.
>> WHEN APPLYING FOR A PHD?
>> YES, GOOD MATCH FOR A
MENTOR --
>> THAT IS NOT THE FIELD THE
THREE OF US ARE IN.
WHAT WE DO, YOUR MENTOR IS
USUALLY IN YOUR DEPARTMENT AND
THEN YOU FIND PEOPLE DOWN THE
ROAD.
YOU GET TO SAMPLE THE FACULTY
AND LAB YOU ARE INTERESTED IN,
YOU GET TO WORK WITH FOR A
COUPLE OF MONTHS AND FEEL THE
FIT.
THAT IS MORE STANDARD IN A
BENCH-BASED LAB.
>> UNFORTUNATELY THE CLINICAL
TRANSLATION --
>> MAYBE WIN CAN SPEAK TO
THAT.
I AM NOT SURE.
IT IS MORE CLINICAL.
AND IT MAY BE MORE FIELD
SPECIFIC BUT I GUARANTEE YOU,
WHATEVER IT IS YOU ARE
INTERESTED IN, THIS IS THE ONE
PLACE ON EARTH YOU PROBABLY
COULD FIND A PERSON HERE WHO
CAN HELP YOU BECAUSE WE HAVE
SO MANY PEOPLE IN SO MANY
DIFFERENT FIELDS.
SO GO ON THE INTERNET, LOOK
AROUND, E-MAIL PEOPLE AND I
WILL BET YOU WILL GET 10 OUT
OF 10.
AND JUST SAY ARE YOU
INTERESTED, I WOULD LIKE TO
COME TO YOUR OFFICE TO TALK
WITH YOU.
>> SO FINDING SOMEONE WHO HAS
A BROAD VIEW THAT WORKS HERE
SO ARE YOU A NEUROLOGIST?
>> KIND OF COMPLICATED, I WORK
AS A NIAC --
[INDISCERNIBLE]
>> SO I WOULD GO TO THE
CLINICAL DIRECTOR AND SAY IS
THERE ANYONE HERE WHO COULD
ADVICE ME ABOUT THE WORK I
WANT TO DO.
ARE YOU INTERESTED IN CHANGING
YOUR  THESIS?
>> NO, I AM ALMOST FINISHED
BUT THE PROGRAMS I AM LOOKING
AT, I WANT TO MAKE SURE THERE
IS A GOOD MATCH BETWEEN
MENTORS AND FACULTY IN MY
RESEARCH INTERESTS AND NOT BE
FLOATING AROUND FOR A LITTLE
WHILE BECAUSE I KNOW THAT IS
NOT PRO UCTIVE FOR STUDENTS.
>> I THINK JUST TALKING TO
PEOPLE IS THE BEST WAY TO GET
INFORMATION.
AND DON'T BE SHY.
IF SOMEONE SAYS THEY WANT TO
TALK TO ME, I AM HAPPY TO TALK
TO THEM.
SOMETIMES IT TAKES A WHILE BUT
THERE IS NO MORE IMPORTANT
THING THAN FOR PEOPLE WHO WORK
HERE.
>> THANK YOU, THAT IS REALLY
HELPFUL.
>> SO I AM A POST-DOCTORAL
FELLOW HERE AND ONE OF THE
PIECES OF ADVICE I GOT WHEN I
WAS IN GRADUATE SCHOOL WAS
BASICALLY THAT IF I DON'T WANT
TO BE A PI, I SHOULDN'T DO A
POST-DOC BECAUSE IT DELAYS
YOUR CLOCK.
IF YOU CAN FIND JOBS FOR
POST-DOC AND DON'T WANT TO GO
BE A PI, THEN YOU SHOULD JUST
DO IT.
AND I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE
END UP IN POST- DOC, I AM ONE
OF THEM, AND I FOUND IT
AVAILABLE BECAUSE IT IS
ADDITIONAL TRAINING BUT I
THINK MANY YEARS AGO, YOU
DIDN'T NEED THIS ADDITIONAL
TRAINING.
SO I HAVE SEEN A SHIFT OF --
AND Dr. GOTTESMAN SAID THIS,
WE ARE EARLY CAREER SCIENTISTS
BUT HERE I AM ALMOST 30 AND
STILL BEING TRAINED.
SO I WAS WONDERING IF YOU
COULD COMMENT ON SHORT OF THE
SHIFT TO WHEN IS IT THAT WE
BECOME SORT OF INDEPENDENT AND
WHAT IS THE RIGHT TIME LINE TO
SORT OF MAKE THE JUMP FROM A
TRAINING PHYSICIANS TO AN
ACTUALLY, YOU KNOW, STAFF
POSITION OR SOMETHING LIKE
THAT.
>> SO I THINK IT IS TRUE THAT
SOME PEOPLE WHO HAVE PHD'S
DON'T NEED TO DO POST-DOCS BUT
THEY USUALLY PRECISELY KNOW
WHAT THEY WANT TO DO AND KNOW
THAT IT IS NOT A REQUISITE
PART OF THE JOB.
I MENTIONED THE FDA FOR
EXAMPLE AND KNOW FOR A FACT
THAT THEY ARE TRYING TO HIRE
PEOPLE WHO CAN OVERSEE DRUG
DEVELOPMENT AND SO ON AND THEY
WILL NOT EVEN LOOK AT ANYONE
WHO HAS NOT DONE A POST-DOC
BECAUSE THEY HAVE A LARGE POOL
OF HIGHLY TALENTED AND TRAINED
PEOPLE THEY CAN CHOOSE FROM.
SO IF YOU ARE INTERESTED IN A
JOB AND HAVEN'T DONE A
POST-DOC, YOU SIMPLY WOULDN'T
GET IT.
ANY EDUCATION THAT YOU GET,
THAT EXPANDS YOUR UNIVERSE,
GIVES YOU INFORMATION AND
TELLS YOU HOW TO GET THINGS
DONE, IS VALUABLE.
NOW, YOU MENTIONED YOUR AGE
AND SO ON AND SO FORTH WHICH
MOST OF US SITTING AT THIS
PANEL THINK IS AWFULLY YOUNG
TO BE WORRYING ABOUT THAT.
SO MY WIFE AND I, MY WIFE IS A
SCIENTIST AT NIH, SAID WE WANT
TO HAVE REAL JOBS BY THE TIME
WE ARE 30, NOT JUST A POST-DOC
OR WHATEVER.
AND THAT AGE HAS CHANGED OVER
THE YEARS AND GOTTEN A LITTLE
OLDER.
THE STATISTICS ARE PRETTY
AMAZING.
NIH AT THE TIME OF THE FIRST
GRANT IS NOW 44 YEARS OLD
WHICH IS AMAZING.
IT USED TO BE TEN YEARS
YOUNGER AND IT SHOULD BE TEN
YEARS YOUNGER SO THAT IS A
REAL PROBLEM.
BUT EACH PERSON HAS THEIR OWN
CLOCK AND I THINK JOHN WANTS
TO SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THIS
ISSUE.
>> IT IS REALLY LAMENTABLE
BECAUSE I THINK THOSE ARE TEN
OF YOUR BEST YEARS AS A
SCIENTIST THAT YOU ARE NOT A
PI AND THAT IS ONE OF THE
WORST TRENDS.
WITH SOME IT IS WORSE, AT 45,
46 AND IN MANY CAREERS, YOU
ARE WINDING DOWN AT THAT
POINT.
YOU GO TO WALL STREET, YOU ARE
COUNTING YOUR MONEY AT THAT
POINT, RIGHT?
SO THIS IS SOMETHING WE REALLY
NEED TO FIX.
THE ADVICE GOUT WAS GOOD
ADVICE.
FOR MOST THINGS, YOU DON'T
NEED TO DO A POST-DOC, THEN
DON'T DO IT BUT IF YOU HAVE
HAD A GOOD EXPERIENCETHEN THAT
OPENS OTHER DOORS AND NOBODY
CAN TELL YOU ADVICE THAT WILL
BE GOOD FOR ALL THINGS AT ALL
TIMES.
THAT IS WHY YOU HAVE DIFFERENT
MENTORS AND ARE TRAINED TO BE
SKEPTICS OF THAT IS PROBABLY
NOT HARD, RIGHT?
YEAH, PLOTTING A COURSE IS
HARD AND THERE'S A RANDOM
ELEMENT TO IT THAT I THINK IS
THE MOST TROUBLING PART.
IT USED TO BE IF YOU WERE KEEN
AND GOOD AT IT, IT WOULD
GUARANTEE YOU YOU HAVE A
CHANCE OF BEING A PI. 
NOW WE HAVE ADDED A MAJOR
ELEMENT OF LUCK THAT IS JUST
NOT FAIR TO YOU GUYS AND THAT
IS THE MAIN ELEMENT WE NEED TO
ADDRESS.
>> OKAY, THIS PROBABLY SHOULD
REALLY BE DIRECTED TOWARDS
SHARON BUT SINCE SHE IS NOT
HERE, I WILL DIRECT IT TOWARDS
YOU, MICHAEL.
SO I AM ACTUALLY A PHD WHO DID
NOT DECIDE TO PURSUE RESEARCH
AFTER I GRADUATED AND I AM
ACTUALLY NOW A STAFF PERSON AT
ONE OF THE CENTERS FOR NLDI.
SO I AM A PART OF THE
LEADERSHIP DISCOVERY AND I WAS
WONDERING IF THERE IS SOME
SORT OF SIMILAR COURSE THAT IS
OFFERED TO LIKE SCIENTISTS AT 
NIH OR PARTICULARLY NHLBI
EQUIVALENT?
SINCE YOU BOTH MENTIONED BEING
A PI OR RESEARCHER MIGHT NOT
BE THE PRIMARY FOCUS OF
EVERYONE HERE AND I FEEL LIKE
A LOT OF THE CAREER
OPPORTUNITIES OR WORKSHOPS ARE
REALLY FOCUSED TOWARDS
GRANT-WRITING OR STAYING IN
SCIENCE AND I WAS WONDERING
WHAT ELSE IS OFFERED TO TRY TO
FOSTER INDIVIDUALS TO BE LIKE
THE BEST SET AND BEST PREPARED
WHEN THEY GO JOB SEARCHING?
>> SO I THINK SHARON WOULD BE
THE BEST PERSON TO ANSWER THAT
QUESTION BUT IN THEORY, AIM
SUPERVISOR SO I SHOULD KNOW
THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION.
SO AS I SAID, THERE ARE FIVE
CAREER COUNSELORS AND THEY
WILL CERTAINLY MEET WITH YOU
AND HELP YOU DEVELOP IDEAS FOR
HOW YOU CAN SUCCEED, EITHER AT
NIH -- YOU ALREADY HAVE A JOB
AT NIH, IS SOUNDS LIKE?
SO THE QUESTION IS HOW CAN YOU
DEVELOP YOUR CAREER OUTSIDE
THE NORMAL ROUTE WHICH IS
GRADUATE SCHOOL, POST-DOC AND
THEN SOMETHING ELSE.
AND I THINK SHARON HAS
TALENTED PROFESSIONAL PEOPLE
WHO CAN HELP YOU WORK THROUGH
THAT.
WITHIN YOUR INSTITUTE, I THINK
YOU NEED TO FIND MENTORS AND
ADVISORS WHO CAN SEE A TRACK
FOR YOU TO ADVANCE THROUGH THE
VARIOUS STEPS OF CAREER
LADDERS EITHER WITHIN NHLBI OR
OTHER INSTITUTES.
THERE ARE A HUGE NUMBER OF
JOBS FOR PEOPLE LIKE YOU WITH
YOUR DEGREE INTERESTED IN
PROVIDING SUPPORT FOR SOME
FUNCTION OR OTHER THAT EXISTS
WITHIN THE INSTITUTES AND ALL
OF THEM HAVE SUCH POSITIONS.
I MENTIONED PROTOCOL
NAVIGATORS, FOR INSTANCE.
THEY ARE PEOPLE WHO ACTUALLY
WRITE WITH THE HELP OF A PI, A
PROTOCOL FOR CLINICAL STUDIES.
SO IT IS ENORMOUSLY REWARDING
TO BE INVOLVED IN THE
BEGINNING AT DESIGNING A STUDY
AND KNOWING EXACTLY HOW TO
WRITE THAT STUDY SO IT GETS
THROUGH THE VARIOUS REGULATORY
PROCESSES AND SO ON.
WE'RE HOPING THAT PEOPLE LIKE
YOU WITH SIGNED  BACKGROUND
AND WRITING SKILLS CAN GET
INTERESTED IN PROTOCOL
NAVIGATION AS AN EXAMPLE.
THERE ARE OTHER OPPORTUNITY.
THERE ARE PROBABLY A DOZEN
DIFFERENT JOB DESCRIPTIONS YOU
WOULD ENJOY LEARNING ABOUT AND
YOU ARE ASKING A GOOD QUESTION
THAT I THINK OUR CAREER
COUNSELORS WOULD MOST LIKELY
BE ABLE TO ANSWER THAT.
>>  ACTUALLY THE NCI RUNS A
COURSE WHICH IS ORGANIZED AND
RUN FOR STAFF SCIENTISTS AND
CLINICIANS BUT WE ACCEPT
POST-DOCTORAL FELLOWS TO
ATTEND SO THAT IS ONE EXAMPLE
FOR PREPARATION FOR
ALTERNATIVE CAREERS IN
SCIENCE, IF YOU WANT TO CHECK
THAT OUT.
>> ARE THERE ANY OTHER
QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS?
HERE IS YOUR OPPORTUNITY.
OKAY, IF NOT, I WOULD JUST
LIKE TO MAKE A BRIEF
ANNOUNCEMENT TO CALL TO YOUR
ATTENTION THAT NEXT WEEK IS
THE FINAL SESSION OF THE 2018
DEMYSTIFYING AND WE'RE REALLY
VERY DELIGHTED THAT FRANCIS
COLLINS AS THE DIRECTOR OF THE
NIH IS GOING TO SPEAK TO
EVERYBODY ABOUT THE -- HIS
TITLE IS THE NATIONAL
INSTITUTES OF HOPE.
AND I AM SURE IT WILL BE VERY
REWARDING AND REVEALIG AND
EXCITING FOR ALL OF US AND WE
HOPE THAT YOU WILL TUNE IN.
SO THANK YOU VERY MUCH, 
MICHAEL, JONATHAN.
[APPLAUSE] 
