Hey thank you for joining us
today at prophecy of the
news I'm your host Dr
Kevin Clarkson with
special guest
today Dr Thomas Ice
Tommy as I may call you
yes researcher author been
a pastor been in ministry
for a number of decades
and really is the
executive director and
co-founder of the pre
tribulation research
center in the Dallas Texas
metro area a defender of
our pre tribulation
rapture postion that's
really come under fire in
recent days yeah years
well it does because we've
seen a shift from Among
younger Christians away
from the Bible to social
issues yes and of course
the rapture is a big
social issue because
when we got going to
remove the church they see
it as escapism if I
get it right they want to
volunteer and they don't
want to the world you can
do both as a Christian you
can't but I don't think
we're going to have
institutional changes
until the Lord returns
we're not going to be post
millenielists are in the
know we're not going to
but God uses us for
restraining Yes the
purpose of government some
of government you know as
he talked about after the
flood when he that most
will go
and so the point is that
this isn't a time in which
we're calling out people
who are going to reign in
the Christ in a
but resurrected people
to bring in the kind of
millennium the scribe of
the Bible right if you go
for anything else and you
have to dumb it down.
And I'm sorry take the
Bible literally Well even
if you don't like the
Bible literally go.
It is going to bring in a.
and you know one of those
social issues that you
alluded to that video
people are passionate
about today is the
and 
the 
Palestinians as
the oppressed and they
have really bought that
whole lot of propaganda
and that's what we speak
today your newest book The
Case for Zionism why
Christians should support
Israel yeah I went last
year to something called
crush at the checkpoint
it was their fourth
conference having
every other year
And they 
were very
basically blaming
Dispensationalism air
belief system for the
quote unquote occupation
the word occupation and
there is no occupants no
Israel there is actually
no nation or people of
hope out and well that's
right and they didn't deal
with the issues that are a
real issue
and by the 
way you know
he had an area a Ph D.
From Westminster similar
you know another guy had a
Ph D.
From Trinity Naser
evangelical schools.
Well one of our foremost
scholars today for
conservatives are
both Dr Ian T.
Write for.
Britain he is the
replacement theologian
Yeah and I don't think
just because he wrote a
book defending the
resurrection I think most
of his other books
have not been
conservative right and
especially his stuff on
Israel you know and right
you know he might spot on
the air views and since
it's American craziness
right and of course
actually the modern
version of it began
I mean one it did
but that's a whole you
were in our line and
that's a whole nother
discussion but getting
back to the point is this
guy concluded at the end
of the conference that
our greatest challenge or
enemy was dispensational
And so that means that the
people many of the people
watching this program are
very enemies and why
because they see.
That most of the world
supports the Palestinians
but Americans do not
support the Palestinians
because of why
because of our history
and 
more recently our
dispensational and like
our planet Earth left
behind all of these things
and I mix snide remarks
about it by what Hank had
a graph hangman's you know
what he's an anti israel
guy he's a total predator
of yes not a total But
he's a partial credit
yeah but he is a lot of
historically fulfilled
prophecy Yeah it's already
backward
and so therefore because
this has had a ascendancy
evangelicalism and it has
in the past it was a given
that you will pro Israel
as an evangelical in the
past because of your
belief in the Bible not
just prophecy but the
Abrahamic Covenant Yes
just as God will bless
those who bless you and
curse as a curse you
even if we didn't.
Have prophets that's
enough for Christians who
support Israel
and therefore that makes
America different and
America is the
enabler of an Israel
Well I know I wrote an
article for a bank is a
just as the year in that
as we came up to Christmas
you're aware of the
famous you had resolution
Security Council
resolution against in
condemning Israel and
that's been brought
forward so many
times the U.
S. Would always Mito it
but Obama instructed his
minions to just abstain
and so we did and it will
forward
and Trump tweeted wait
until January twentieth
they want it for and they
are different and we're
they are they are
officially but we're still
almost at a tipping point
but really beneath that
it's that they are against
Israel yes you could
substitute whoever they
are whoever would be
We call the new
anti-Semitism and I talk
about there and what do
you mean by the new arts
kind of.
Go ahead right the new
anti semitism is that
before Israel
accommodation people hated
the Jews as individuals
and you know you see that
war Nazis and all of this
even the church often Yes
the church throughout the
Middle Ages.
Killed millions of Jews
through the church you
know Catholic Church
and Protestants as well
unfortunately all up.
Every result when Israel
became a nation people
would use a sign times
of arguments against the
nation of Israel that
they would use against
individual Jews and so
hating Israel as a nation
is called the new anti
Semitic and so they said
well heck can't we
criticize a nation for
their policies yes
but all criticism of
Israel is not necessarily
anti semitic but all
criticism but all.
But.
They are involved in
criticizing Israel often
and out of anti semitic
motive they are right and
so that's called the new
anything some of his mates
it's a form of anti
Zionism that's a term
we'll doesn't have they'll
be right at the end we
know we said last time
that God getting this land
Israel if it was to the
patriarchs Yes that was
unconditional regardless
of what their descendants
do you know that was made
to Abraham Isaac and Jacob
That's right and my
organization about five
years ago had a guy.
I'm shocked not the air
from Canada who's an
heiress lawyer and he
wrote a piece that was for
technician university
didn't even Switzerland.
In the area of
international law and
demonstrating that Israel
has all the legal rights
to the land
and that's what I would
ask you because you have a
couple of chapters about
Israel's right and it is a
real legal right yes
follow that the state was
that and of course when we
believe to be right that
makes true as the Bible
you know that I have not
but it just so happens
that you have all the
legal rights and this goes
back to the League of
Nations in the now or
never origin of the
Balfour deck.
Ration was simply a
statement and this is one
hundred university of it
of British foreign policy
but the Lord.
Lloyd George who would
be a prime minister of
England at the time and
Balfour was basically his
foreign minister
and 
they had during war
won a war camp and so in
parliamentary governments
where you can call
parliament up and have a
big debate like that you
see on C.
-Span or something
right I'm having to.
They wouldn't get a
government made up of mind
to twelve representatives
and to call it a war
cabinet and you couldn't
if you could of picked a
better war cabinet that
was pro Israel than the
one they happen to have
And he was the son of a
Baptist minister from
Wales and he was very pro
Israel the Balfour was
Scottish and he grew up
learning the Bible and all
this me you have
all these guys only
and the world view which I
talk about in the book and
so they issued the Balfour
Declaration and he and
Lord George secretly
sins and Bess is General
General Allen the from the
Western Front in Europe to
the Palestine campaign
as it was call because
Britain was losing and he
secretly transferred fifty
thousand troops to make
sure that night to roost
and they did
and they did that in one
thousand nine hundred
Balfour declaration was
issued in one hundred
seventeen and
the captured.
Missile midnight tonight
and order George became
prime minister until
nineteen twenty two and so
after the war was over
you had the Paris.
Peace Agreement whereby
divided the lands.
Of the former Ottoman
Empire which was the
Muslim empire and they
created what they call
mandates
and for example Syria
and Lebanon was given to
France and they were
to oversee those two
countries becoming
Countries like a father
overseas a son
but they needed guidance
after the war to become
country because that
report of the broader
autumn and in part and
Britain had Mesopotamia
which pin years later
became Iraq and they had.
They had some other
mandates as well and so
they.
Were able to settle all of
this in relation to the
Middle East at the Paris
Peace Conference so they
had another conference
call the cops that met
saying Remain in one
thousand nine hundred
twenty
and there you had the
seventy two nations of the
League of Nations the
United States was not part
of it because we even
though it was thought up
by our President Wilson
but we didn't protest
because we didn't want to
be part of that global
thing and as a result
seventy two nations voted
to give a mandate to
Britain to make Palestine
a Jewish state so that
incorporated the Balfour
declaration into a legal
document.
Initially it was agreed to
by the Arabs Feisal at the
Paris accord at the San
Remo I'm sorry OK yes.
You know and Turkey mom
took over in Turkey and
all this and they
undermined it
but what really undermined
the implementation of this
call the mandate which was
started in one thousand
nine hundred two was.
Yasser Arafat's own
called the Grand Mufti of
Jerusalem who says who
invented terrorism
and you had him using
massacres of Jews to do
that starting in one
hundred twenty have the
famous massacre and he
Bronwyn it ran the Jews
out for the first time
in three thousand years
killed over one hundred
A lot of people don't
realize there was a civil
war from not being thirty
five to about nine hundred
thirty eight over one
hundred seven thousand
people were killed during
that time mainly Arabs but
British a couple thousand
British use seven
thousand use.
Nine thousand maybe I
can't remember and so we
explain all of that and
that's what is real for
becoming a
nation early here
and so the legal right of
Israel to the land was
granted through treaty
you don't make true
international law based on
UN resolution you have to
come in and agree to this
and this is why Israel is
not occupying the land
because in four after the
war not in forty eight you
simply have a cease fire
agreement and even that
cease fire agreement with
the U.
N.
Says that Israel is not
the occupier right it says
that but you get all
these people on T.
V.
These leftists and the
Arabs and Occupy Occupy
people who occupy in the
Land of No they're not.
And they won't negotiate
with him and I said
they're supposed to
negotiate you know a
settlement on on this kind
of stuff and so this is
the point is it is real
but based on air national
laws demonstrated by this
got here in his Ph D.
Dissertation that Geneva
University Geneva
demonstrates and others
have written whole books
on this
and even met the Netanyahu
government about five or
six years ago had former
Supreme Court people in
Israel do a study and
they agreed unanimously.
It's called the Cohen
reporter something like
that are on the level
where every report every
report that Israel has the
Land of Israel put on it
and so it's a matter of
them exerting their
political will to do that
and I don't know how
that's going to come out
but the point is we point
out that Israel has a
legal right but they're
still everybody's going
against them than ours if
I don't have the right to
the land it looks for the
time being immediately
foreseeable the United
States will be standing
you know we're
Israel with Israel
and that's very good to
know but we're talking to
Dr Thomas I think his
newest book The Case for
Zionism
You know we are offering
this and you could as
always go to our website
prophecy the News dot com
or call the eight hundred
number on your screen and
this book is just out
and it's available for
fourteen twenty five and
shipping it had link you
will enjoy it it's a
little inform you and Dr I
think we just have may be.
Time enough to talk about
some of the theology
through the ages of the
church how the church kind
of deviated from.
The diet is a bit of
his somewhat returned
were pro Israel but the
idea that the Bible should
be interpreted literally
that was a plague began to
be resorted now
and the Middle Ages had
very few if anybody who
believe that Israel had a
future now some believe
that the Jews would
but that's different than
the land of Israel you
know them returning to
their land and so you have
a guy named Francis cat
who's from Norwich England
be a two degrees
from Cambridge
and he written a book
about Christianity and
OK and he was burned at
the stake because of that.
You know and it's amazing
it shows you you know even
if there probably were
other people out there
with similar views but you
know it's kind of a tough
environment and then in
sixteen twenty seven you
have.
To not talk about
Himalayas program Mr
Chance Yes we did sort of
what I think we didn't
explore very deeply though
the really the Puritan
influence that came into a
barrack a right that would
be important to
trail the Puritans.
Became almost totally
pre-millennial in the six
hundred people
or Cromwell.
The founders of America
the maverick Richard Knabb
or the emigrated.
and increase Mather who
was the second president
of Haagen
and he married John Cotton
who was the most famous
Puritan minister in Boston
and made his son a cot
matter you see because
he was married to John
Cotton's daughter and
Scott matter you know
when you're here Jonathan
Edwards was the most
brilliant person in
American history run hot
made around four hundred
twenty five books that
were published he finished
second to Jonathan Edwards
and nine hundred seventy
six to Paul who's the most
brilliant person in the
history of America I'm
happy to call it a draw
Yeah but they were big
time promoting this and
they wrote a lot of books
on prophecy and it's
freshly increase Mather
believe the Jews are going
to be restored he wrote a
book his first book on
this it was revised seven
or eight times expanded
and Cotton Mather had
talked about how he had
hoped to lead a Jewish
person to Christ all of
this kind of stuff so this
is the foundation we have
in America it's pretty
basic it's different from
Europe that's all that
medieval anti semitism
that had added some of his
among many of the
Protestants we have a
different background
and that's why we ended
up with six seven million
Jews in the United States
and it's also why God shed
his grace so they exactly
because it was the
Abrahamic of it again I
will bless those who bless
you the preaching of
the gospel even today
and eighty percent of the
money to support World
Missions comes from the
United States right
and this could be why
they could be giving us a
reprieve here yes.
With more Christian
friendly president in
ministration And so and
definitely more friendly
toward Israel
although I don't lie.
What he said about the
settlements Right right
All right so we we have a
very difficult and what's
concerning us is the shift
what by young people you
have people like Lynn Hi
because you don't hire was
wife
and through the
social issues.
And then I think only it
is a graduate you know
Bill is yes so I you know
somewhere probably she
probably is so we're sort
of straight off that well
we we can put
pre-millennial ism out of
the darkness
five years ago
but that's a whole nother
that's another story for
Dorothy Yes I doubt if
there's hardly anybody
left that we met even
point of let me let alone
prove Israel Yeah you know
but you have this shift
going on especially Eppie
academic level
and among younger people
never still probably there
are still a majority of
younger people that are
pro liberal but this is
the first time in our
lifetimes we've seen a
shift right and that So
older people middle aged
people are still very pro
Israel and even a majority
of younger people but you
know it's very different
one of my sons my youngest
son after going to
seminary did a year and a
half internship at the
evangelists to Berkeley
California and you
wouldn't believe some of
the stuff he saw on the
campus we all saw the
rioting that was going
on the other night and
everything but he was he
actually was on the campus
one and so he saw an Arab
hit a Jewish girl the Jews
had set up and were having
some a vent in the mall
area at Berkeley and this
guy hit this Jewish girl
he pulls out his camera.
when I was there last
April they had sprite
banging on the sidewalk
free Palestine and all the
scum stuff so this is
what's taken over on
college campuses they're
a bit over a dozen riots
over Israel.
You know on the college
campus and unfortunately
it's now impacting
Christians
it's Or this question
there is today you know
even a position by some
that the butter Jewish
people are not truly the
but that is something
involving the night the
Kennedys are as they call
him and that was a real
country in that
it existed.
and they in the seven
white seven hundreds they
were confronted with
either becoming salami or
Christian
and lost their national
identity in Christendom
the Byzantine Empire the
Islamic empire and so they
converted to Judaism.
For about one hundred
fifty years as a matter of
convenience and so there's
this whole view out there
that the Eskenazi Jews
which are eighty five
percent of the Jews in the
world today are not really
just are gentiles who were
converted to Judaism from
Gentile stock and so they
really don't have the
blood of Abraham Isaac
and Jacob flowing through
their writings and I'll
show rebuttal you can
refute that historically
with the events.
You know that happened
subsequently And secondly
with the rise.
D.
N.
A.
Analysis that's what I
want or has there been
some there they did yes
there's been all kinds of
D.
N.
A.
Analysis and these people
do hand of Middle Eastern
B.
N.
A.
You know the type B.
and I and people that are
from that area have and so
this is ridiculous and you
know I just wish it off it
was aware of it the Jews
who were putting to death
weren't really Jews but
there's a lot of people
like Tex Maurice and
people out there about are
advocating these kinds of
forms and so we have a
chapter dealing with that
and most people don't
build with those kinds of
things in their books and
we try to deal with it
well fascinating Our guest
has been Dr Thomas I
think he's the executive
director of the preacher
relation research center
in the Dallas Fort Worth
metro area certainly a
staunch defender of
biblical prophecy
and the nation of Israel
His newest book The Case
for Zionism again go to
our website or call the
eight hundred number and
get your copy you want to
be a supporter of Israel
the Bible commands us to
pray for the peace
of droughts right
and I believe in clued
in that prayers that the
whole idea that the prince
of peace will return and
we should share the gospel
with your history and as
well we all people Muslims
and everyone that they may
have peace with God
and has not found peace
with God You see the
Nation of Israel was
created by God to bring
forth the Messiah Jesus
Jesus gave His life on the
cross he's God it's bad he
would in your place he was
innocent so he would in
your place be God He is
infinite
and he went to the place
of all who will be saved
forgiven if you call on
His name He will hear you
would forgive your said
the Bible makes that
promise we heard you to do
that today and a lot of
change your life at it
till he comes back we are
going to keep
looking up thank you.
