[MUSIC PLAYING]
[APPLAUSE]
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Thank you, Megan.
Thank you, Megan.
What's up, Google?
I have a box.
I put something in
this box earlier.
Just take note of the box.
We see the box?
AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE]
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
What's in the box?
What's your name, dude in hat?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Josh.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Do
we know each other?
AUDIENCE: We don't
know each other.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, good.
Point to someone
you also don't know.
Networking.
[LAUGHTER]
Who do we got?
What's your name?
AUDIENCE: My name is also Josh.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Thank
you, good night.
Good night.
Come on, what are
the odds of that?
Two Joshes?
Josh, can you point
to another Josh?
AUDIENCE: Uh--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No,
point to someone
who definitely is not a Josh.
AUDIENCE: There.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Who?
AUDIENCE: The guy
with the beard.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: The
guy with the beard.
You have to be more specific
[LAUGHTER]
AUDIENCE: With the
gray sweatshirt.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
What's your name?
AUDIENCE: Bob.
[LAUGHTER]
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Really?
AUDIENCE: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, great.
I mean, you couldn't
have written that.
I mean, Bob is so not a Josh.
Bob, do we know each other?
AUDIENCE: No
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, good.
That was fair and random.
Bob, do you remember
your first kiss?
AUDIENCE: Yep.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Who was it?
AUDIENCE: Emily [? Kurbstat. ?]
[LAUGHTER]
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You
gave me her last name?
With a K?
Kurbstat with a K or a C?
AUDIENCE: A K.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Emily K. We'll just
call her Emily K. to
protect her privacy,
even though you just said it.
Privacy, I mean, come
on, who am I talking to?
Listen, Bob, when was the
last time you saw Emily K.?
How long has it been?
Since the kiss?
AUDIENCE: Since the kiss, yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, so
how long has that been?
AUDIENCE: 15, 16 years?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Ah, adorable.
I like to open a
magic show, you've
got to blow people's minds.
You've got to let them
know that you're legit.
They're about to see some
wizard, witchcraft stuff.
So you haven't seen
this-- you haven't talked
to Emily for 15, 16 years.
Yet today, in New York
City, on stage at Google,
I brought her here.
Please welcome Emily Kurbstadt.
Now, that would've been good.
That would have been good.
That would have been
awkward for Bob.
I could have done it.
Come on, I could have done it.
You could have
helped me find her.
But I didn't want
to make it weird.
That's why I brought the box.
What's in the box?
The box, what's in the box?
Emily's head.
That's what's in the box.
No, there's a--
I put a prediction in
the box before our chat
today, a sheet of paper.
On that sheet of paper,
I wrote one name.
And that name happens
to be Emily K.
AUDIENCE: Oh, my god!
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
[APPLAUSE]
Let me give that to
Bob as a souvenir.
Wow, six seconds.
I just counted in my head.
So I pulled the sheet
of paper out, and we
just-- it was six seconds
from that point of what
I call Google wonder, OK?
And that's when you're in a
room at Google, and everyone's
kind of like, wait, what?
Right?
But it was very brief, you know?
Because we're in a smart
room, and 6 and 1/2 seconds,
people started snapping
out of it like, all right,
let's figure this crap out.
People try to figure out magic.
And I know you know this, right?
Because when they try to figure
out magic, they go to you.
And they're like, how does he
pull the name out of the box?
Where does Emily Kerbstadt live?
I miss her.
You know?
So--
[LAUGHTER]
But people act like they
don't try to figure out magic.
But I know after shows,
this conversation is,
how do you think he did that?
No one invites me to be
in these conversations.
I could be very helpful.
But let's just have the
conversation right now.
Bob, people must think that
you're part of the show, right?
That it's an elaborate scheme
between the Joshes and the Bobs
to land on you?
But I don't know you.
AUDIENCE: I don't know you.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: People
think, oh, he's got, like,
a folder of every
first name and initial,
Emily K. You know, everyone's
kissed an Emily K. likely,
right?
Some people think,
oh, it's high-tech.
He's got a wireless
Bluetooth printer
in the box or something.
He's got some person hidden
some-- is that what you think?
What's your name?
AUDIENCE: Ryan.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Ryan?
OK, well, Ryan, I
hate to show you this,
but that's exactly how it works.
There's a wireless
printer in the box.
Damn it.
Yeah, yeah, congratulations.
You just ruined Christmas.
Thanks, Ryan.
Magic is easy.
Listen, I don't-- it's 2020.
I don't care anymore.
You get me drunk.
Get me drunk and be like,
what's the secret to magic?
Amazon Prime, I'll
tell you the truth.
I'm not here to--
149 bucks, you can make anything
Bob says come out of a box.
That's because we live
in an amazing era, right?
20 years ago, you
couldn't do that.
There were no tiny printers.
You had to use a bigger box,
put a small child in the box.
The kid would write it by hand.
It was illegal.
It was not-- does it feel good
to know that you were right?
AUDIENCE: Kind of.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah, OK,
well, you're a sick person.
You're a sick person.
Most people think they want to
know, but then, when they know,
they realize that they
didn't want to know.
But not you.
That's OK.
But that's the thing.
You can't-- once you know,
you can't unknow, right?
Because you don't know you don't
want to know until you know,
you know?
So that's why I thought,
I mean, even though we're
at Google, the epicenter of
curiosity, and knowledge,
and quenching people's
thirst for how--
which sucks for me-- but
even though we're here,
I thought we could give it
just one, like, a little apple
Z, a chance to undo it.
We can make it magic again.
We can live the rest of
the hour in Google wonder.
Truly, would you like that?
AUDIENCE: That'd be great.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Give me an amen.
AUDIENCE: Amen.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: All right,
let's make it magic again.
[CROWD MURMERS IN ANTICIPATION]
[LAUGHTER, APPLAUSE]
Welcome to the talk.
Megan?
Hi, Megan.
MEGAN GREEN: Hi, Johnson.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Megan is here.
Get rid of this.
Here, souvenir?
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You can take it.
MEGAN GREEN: I'm going
to start with a softball.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I just gave
away one of your tables.
I hope that's OK.
He works here.
He looks like he works here.
MEGAN GREEN: All
right, all right.
So let's just clear this up.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: What,
how did I do that?
All right, listen.
MEGAN GREEN: Are you a wizard?
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
I'm not a wizard.
MEGAN GREEN: Not a wizard, OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
That's not a softball.
That's pretty big.
MEGAN GREEN: That's
not a softball?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: If I said
yes, it all crumbled down.
MEGAN GREEN: [INAUDIBLE]
talk would be about.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Uh-huh.
MEGAN GREEN: OK, so I love
the name "Magic for Humans."
You say that you're
using magic to master
the art of being human.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Uh-huh.
MEGAN GREEN: What have you
learned about being human?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, god, I
think I've confused myself more
than I've learned anything.
I mean, the show, if
you haven't seen it,
we explore a different
human theme every episode.
And I feel like, I guess,
to answer your question,
what I've-- not to be a joke,
but what I've learned is that
we are much more alike than
we are different, humans.
And I feel like we
often forget that.
Because a lot of comedy
comes from us and them,
and laughing at another
thing's expense,
or making fun of the
way people do things.
And I think what I've learned,
especially since Magic
is kind of a universal form,
in that it doesn't matter where
you're from, what language you
speak, even what age you are,
you can appreciate an
interpretive thing.
You might react
differently, but you can--
it impacts you.
And so it's a nice
common denominator
that I can intersperse myself
in different demographics
of humans and find that
we're all just the same.
We're all clueless in the end.
MEGAN GREEN: So you are human?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I am human.
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Were you
wondering if it was the title
was me suggesting
that I am performing
magic for those humans?
Magic for those humans?
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah,
it was a thought.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Uh-huh.
MEGAN GREEN: OK, cool.
Tell us a little bit
about your origin story.
Your show, on the show, you
do show clips of yourself
as a young kid doing magic.
And I think it's one thing
to realize you love magic.
When did you realize you really
had a talent for it, though?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: That's
a good question.
First off, thankful
that my dad was
one of those early
adopters of the VHS camera.
In '88, he's the
dude with the thing.
And when it was
a shoulder strap,
you had to have a whole satchel.
Remember, in '88?
And--
[LAUGHTER]
I didn't start doing
magic till I was 12,
because I had broke my
arms while riding my bike.
Ran-- it's a long story.
I was wearing roller blades.
I was riding my bike while
wearing roller blades.
Long story.
Don't do it.
And my doctor recommended
I learn card tricks
as physical therapy.
And that's how I got into it.
And I think it
wasn't until maybe
a year of doing magic lessons--
because I took classes
with a junior high school
buddy of mine.
It was me and John-o.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah
JUSTIN WILLMAN: My buddy John-o.
And it was like after a year, I
realized, wow, John-o's really
not getting it, you know?
And it wasn't that.
It's just like magic, it's you
either have the attention span
to work at making your hands
do a thing that kind of feels
weird long enough.
That doesn't sound right.
You have the
attention span to work
at learning a trick that
feels awkward, because magic,
it's hard.
And he just didn't
really care as much.
And he moved on to other things,
and he's amazing artist now.
But I realized, oh,
wow, I like this,
and people seem to like it.
I think it's the first time you
do a trick for your parents,
and they don't know
how you did it.
And you're like-- because it's
a weird paradigm shift when
you can do something
that your parent, who's
taught you everything,
doesn't know how to do.
MEGAN GREEN: Was it a good
trick you did for them?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No,
it wasn't even good.
I think my dad's an idiot.
[LAUGHTER]
It was like a vanishing
salt shaker trick
where you drop it into your lap.
Now he knows how it works.
MEGAN GREEN: You just blew it.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Now--
I know, yeah, sorry.
Spoiler.
MEGAN GREEN: Don't
[INAUDIBLE],, Dad.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah,.
MEGAN GREEN: So I think
one thing you probably
asked a lot is, it's a different
format doing this on TV
than it is doing it
for a live audience.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
MEGAN GREEN: A lot of
people question camera
tracks, what is going on here.
And you do try to debunk
that a little bit.
But what have you found
are the biggest differences
between doing this TV show and
performing for a live audience?
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Doing magic on TV,
I think, is much
harder than doing magic
for a live audience, just
because, I think, you have--
when you're here
in person, you're
holding a printer made of
paper, you kind of get--
you don't, for a second,
get distracted by,
is this really happening?
You know it's happening
unless someone's on acid,
and they don't know if what's
happening is happening.
But for the most part,
you can trust your eyes,
so you really get to be present.
But magic on TV, you have to--
attention spans are diminished.
There's that
skepticism, so you have
to try to use uncut shots
as much as possible.
But you have to balance
it because, if you
use a lot of uncut shots, it's
like, this show's an hour long,
and it's boring.
Tim and Eric are my co-EPs.
So Tim and Eric's editing
style is insane and frenetic.
So I had to find a way
to meet in the middle
where we can make
it funny, and use
the editing as a
comedic tool, but also
not make people think we're
using editing as a magic tool,
to the best that we can.
MEGAN GREEN: Right.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: And you have
[INAUDIBLE] for certain people
who you ask to do real reactions
versus a fake reaction?
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We do a little thing, yeah.
Because there's a lot
of people who I think,
in our digital age, if you're
here live and a trick fools
you, you're just
like, wow, that's--
I-- [INAUDIBLE] I'm fun.
Mind blown.
But when you're watching
on TV, if a trick fools
you, a lot of people
just immediately go to,
well, it must all be fake.
As opposed, to
it's a good trick.
So we tried to just at least
be a little tongue in cheek.
I had a bunch of people pretend
to be amazed at non-magic
that was happening.
That all had-- I had a
dude in green spandex,
and I was trying to
make him float me.
It was comical.
And then real magic happens,
and you can A/B the reactions.
MEGAN GREEN: Real magic?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Real magic.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Well, when I
say real magic, real fake magic.
Real illusion magic.
There needs to be a
better word for, yeah,
when magic is
actually happening.
What do you got?
That's the look.
MEGAN GREEN: I'm going to--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: How
about that look?
It's that look.
MEGAN GREEN: It's that look.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: One of the things I
love about the show is that you
do go to these subcultures.
So for instance, you
go to Santa School.
You go to something
called LARPers.
I didn't know what that was.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: What?
She doesn't know
what LARPing is?
Where my LARPers at?
MEGAN GREEN: These people
probably know what LARPers are.
WILLMAN: Any LARPers?
No LARPers here?
You kind of went--
come on.
MEGAN GREEN: My favorite
thing was actually
when you did the
magic for the animals.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, yeah.
That was fun.
They were not that into it.
MEGAN GREEN: That one
bird seemed kind of like--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Kind of into it.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah,
having a good time.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: LARPing
is Live Action Role
Playing, by the way.
Yeah.
Just didn't want to leave
people wondering, well,
what is LARPing?
MEGAN GREEN: They
were all Googling.
How do you find
these subcultures?
And what do you think
that adds to the show?
When you go, and
you're actually sort
of getting into their world
a little bit, doing presents
for the Santa people or--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Well,
I have an amazing team
of really great comedy
writers and great magicians.
So we kind of all collab.
And I try to find people who
I think are really funny,
but know nothing about magic.
So they're not--
their brainstorming
isn't restrained by what they
think they can do or not.
So people, they'll
pitch ridiculous things.
How about you
levitate over a Santa
sack and you change his
beard color a bunch of times?
It's like, OK, tone it in.
But a magician would never
pitch random stuff like that,
because they're kind of
thinking, how would I do this.
So you get this
interesting group
of people who you have to kind
of do a lot of explaining.
You have to explain to
magicians what's funny
and explain to
comedians what's magic.
And that's fun.
And I think a lot of good stuff
comes out of that friction.
And I think we all kind
of get together and just,
what's something that you just
heard of that's weird that you
want to know more about?
What's an interesting
thing that humans
do either for fun or for work or
for play that is just unusual?
What's not low-hanging fruit?
LARPing is not a new thing,
but we did puppy play season 1.
People who dress up
as puppies and play.
[LAUGHTER]
Which was unusual, and the
parents did not like that.
The parents of young viewers
who thought it was a kids
show up until that episode.
Who knew?
I didn't know.
But stuff that I think
that showcases something
about humanity.
And then I like to
infiltrate that.
And I tend to get
enthusiastic about what
they get enthusiastic
about and try
to write a trick that tells
a story that caters to them.
MEGAN GREEN: It's
fun for me, because I
get to learn about
all of these things--
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Like infotainment.
So Santas have to
learn somewhere.
They have to get
certified somewhere.
MEGAN GREEN: Obviously.
Not at the mall.
It doesn't have--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Not at the mall.
There's a real Santa school.
They do it in the summer,
so that doesn't interfere
with their peak months.
Many of them are Uber drivers
off season, which is probably
exactly what you thought.
MEGAN GREEN: I actually
have a follow-up question
to what you said.
You talked about the
fact that have a team.
And I think that's
really interesting.
How big a team does it
take to do these things?
So you don't act in isolation.
I like to think it's all you.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I know.
That's the illusion.
He's just, no preparation.
He just leaves the
house, and stuff happens.
We do a writing--
writer's room kind
of, just like you
would get together to write a
comedy show or write anything.
Where we're just in a room
for two or three months just
putting the cards on the board.
Good ideas, bad ideas, pitches
of just people, places, things.
And then there's a second
layer where we go through,
and it's just like,
OK, what would you do?
What's funny?
What hasn't been done?
And that's that whole process.
And then a different
team comes in.
Obviously, the producers who
figure out the locations,
and how do we find
a Santa instructor,
all these kind of little--
the odds and ends.
But the magic team--
once we've written
the tricks we want to do,
we haven't figured out
how we're going to do them.
So it's a matter of about two
months of just me and a bunch
of fellow magic nerds in
kind of a grungy garage space
just arts and crafts galore.
And it's a lot of
trial and error,
but it's a blast when it works.
MEGAN GREEN: And are
a lot of those tricks
sort of based on
fundamentals of magic?
Do you find that they're
sort of iterations?
Or that you're really
starting sort of from scratch?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I
mean, sometimes you'll
come up with a method
or a technique that's
like, wow, this is diabolical.
And often those are total
accidents where just--
but for the most part,
they're all based on really,
really old, sometimes
centuries-old techniques,
just the old stuff that you
dress up into a new context
and you kind of make it--
take what looks like
a magic prop table
with dragons painted on it
maybe a hundred years ago
and just try to
make it look normal.
And it then feels new and
organic, and it's fun.
I love when a trick that
is based on something
super old blows people's mind.
Season one--
MEGAN GREEN: Can you
give us some examples?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah,
season 1 I did a trick
where it was about minimalism,
about having everything
you need in your backpack.
And it's almost like,
oh, I could never
live without my wife.
He was trying to suck up to
his wife who was probably
viewing eventually.
He was smart.
And I opened my backpack
and pulled out my wife.
And then people on Reddit
are like, it's CGI.
No way.
But it's literally one of
the oldest tricks in magic.
So I was simultaneously
irritated when people think
that I'm taking the easy way,
but it's kind of gratifying
when you can pull out an old
dusty however-I-did-it trick
that maybe Houdini would have
even used onstage and use it
in 2019.
It's nice.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah,
and make it fresh.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Make it fresh.
MEGAN GREEN: I love that.
Talking about fresh,
I think something
that you do that's
recurring through the show
is you have a
couple of segments.
So one is Trick Questions
and one is Magic for Susans.
Even Susan Sarandon did the
show, which was really cool.
And I know-- you
might not know this--
but Lena Dunham
actually has a hashtag
called YesAllSusans,
which I think she did
for her mother who is a Susan.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Wow.
Why?
MEGAN GREEN: So I
didn't know what
is your relationship to Susan?
Who is Susan?
Why Susan?
I mean, I love it.
And it's great that you
can always find a Susan.
Do we have Susans here?
Is there a Susan here?
No.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Google
does not hire Susans.
MEGAN GREEN: Only Joshes.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Susans are
very unique characters.
Susans pay with a check.
They ask to speak
to the manager.
Susans are unique.
Magic for Susans--
we wanted to do
these little
interstitial things just
to have short palate cleansers
between longer segments.
And I think it was one of the
early cards on the board where
my head writer just pitched
Magic for Susans, because it
kind of rhymes with humans.
And we were like,
yeah, put it up.
We'll get something
better eventually.
And we just never
got something better.
And then we just
were like, well,
let's start finding Susans.
And on Craigslist, Susans
will come wherever you need
them to come for a free lunch.
A lot of Susans have
time on their hands.
And we've found that there's
some common thread about how
Susans are.
Susans kind of-- I don't know.
You don't meet a
lot of young Susans.
There's very rarely
an under-30 Susan.
Almost-- in fact, never.
MEGAN GREEN: Do you look
for under-30 Susans?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No, I think--
I mean, we did look.
We just looked for Susans,
but we found none under 30.
But there's something about
these older, wiser Susans.
And they kind of don't
blow smoke up your ass.
If they're not impressed,
they'll tell you.
They kind of don't care.
If it's good, they'll react.
Which means, to me, if
you can impress a Susan,
you've done something
with your life.
And Susan Sarandon was
like the golden goose.
I put her on my--
I made her my desktop wallpaper
on my laptop at the beginning
of season 2 as a vision board.
I was like, we will get
Susan Sarandon somehow.
And it turns out her
son's a fan of the show.
And he was like, I'm going to
have my mom come do the show.
She had no clue what
she was doing there.
Still doesn't have
any clue, I think.
MEGAN GREEN: You don't want
somebody who has a clue.
I mean--
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
I just don't know
if she even knew I was a
magician before she came.
She just came because
she loves her son.
And that's nice.
MEGAN GREEN: That is nice.
So you had something
happen last season.
You had a meme go viral where
you kind of did this sort of,
well--
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
When I was a kid,
I said, I really want to
have a meme go viral one day.
I was eight.
I remember thinking back--
MEGAN GREEN: Did
you expect that?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: There were
no memes when I was a kid.
MEGAN GREEN: Should we tell
everyone what the meme is?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, yeah.
Well, I convinced two dudes
that they were invisible,
using a little flash mob thing,
where they're not actually
invisible.
I do the vanishing person
trick but framed like I'm
making this guy invisible.
And then I put the cloth over
this guy who is not in on it,
but everyone who's
gathered in this park
has already been prepped to
act like this dude just turned
visible, whip it away,
and they're freaking out.
That combined with
the fact that he just
saw dude vanish, all
the evidence lines up.
He thinks he's invisible.
He roams around, and it was
the greatest day of my life.
OK?
And what that became was a bunch
of parents and older siblings
punking their little brothers
and sisters or children
and making them think
they're invisible.
Because it was hard to convince
an adult they were invisible.
It's much easier to convince
a child they're invisible,
when the person they
trust most in the world
acts like they can't see
them, and that turned out
to be internet gold.
MEGAN GREEN: It's really
fun to do with your boss,
if you get your team in
on it, just a little--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Did you do that?
MEGAN GREEN: I'm going to.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Is your
boss here right now?
MEGAN GREEN: Might be.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I am.
MEGAN GREEN: Ah, see?
Perfect.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I can see him.
MEGAN GREEN: Sh, OK.
So you use a lot of
technology in your tricks
which is awesome.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: We like
technology here.
In fact--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Really?
MEGAN GREEN: Sometimes.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
MEGAN GREEN: In one
segment, you actually
are at home with
your baby, Jackson,
and you have a robot go do your
tricks for you, which is great.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: A human robot.
MEGAN GREEN: A human robot.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: But it's
still great outsourcing.
I loved that.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Thank you.
MEGAN GREEN: And so is that
like the next frontier?
You can maybe just have
these robots going around.
You can do magic
in multiple places.
Like, how is technology--
you use it a lot in the show.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
It's so funny, because I use
it a lot like as the plot,
the premise, the story,
but using technology
to actually pull
off a trick I try
to avoid as much as possible.
Because you guys know
technology fails a lot,
and it seems like these old
fashioned secret methods--
strings, magnets, wax--
I've already said too much.
That's how magic works.
Those are more reliable.
But in researching
segments for the show,
we came across these human
Ubers they were called.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: People who
will, if you can't go attend
a meeting, they will wear
an iPad on their face,
and you will FaceTime or live
feed your face to their face.
So they're a human
avatar for you.
OK?
And a lot of these
clips we found
were in Japan, because
they're ahead of the curve
here with this.
So it was like a lot
of human Ubering,
and I thought,
wouldn't it be fun to--
listen, I'm a new dad.
I've got this little
kid, and you're pulled
in these different directions.
You can't be two places
at once, or can you?
So I sent this guy out to do a
night of street magic for me,
while I babysat my guy.
And people were as amazed,
if not more amazed,
than they would be when
I was actually there.
Which made me wonder, I don't
know, I was like half offended.
I was like, wow, they're
really loving this,
and I'm not even there.
What am I doing wrong?
But it was interesting.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
It's really cool.
I loved that.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Thank you.
MEGAN GREEN: And I
thought about maybe
I could come to
work that way too.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You should.
MEGAN GREEN: Videoing.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: None of us
should leave the house, ever.
MEGAN GREEN: I agree.
I agree.
So you're a new dad.
We just talked about that.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
MEGAN GREEN: You have an
episode with your baby.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
MEGAN GREEN: And I'm
sure he likes magic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Uh-uh.
MEGAN GREEN: He
does not like magic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: He
doesn't know what it is.
MEGAN GREEN: Do you,
like when he cries,
do you make him disappear?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Megan,
that is illegal.
You should know that.
That's frowned upon.
MEGAN GREEN: I don't know the--
[INTERPOSING VOICES]
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Magic has no--
like it doesn't-- he's 2.
He's 13 months, so I can
take a ball, it disappears,
and he's just like, well, I
need to find another ball.
Like he just looks elsewhere.
MEGAN GREEN: That's
kind like the animals.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Exactly
like the animals.
Exactly.
Wow, see?
MEGAN GREEN: See?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Baby
humans are animals.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Baby
humans are adult animals.
MEGAN GREEN: They are.
Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Or should I be offended that
you called my child an animal?
I don't know.
MEGAN GREEN: He'll
grow out of it.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
He'll grow out of it,
but I don't know if he'll be
glad his dad's a magician,
or if he will get bullied
because his dad's a magician.
So I'm trying to make
magic something he can--
you can see a trick,
but I'm not going
to force anything upon you.
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah, and
I want to be that guy.
MEGAN GREEN: Well,
it's very cute.
You do a great job with him, and
I'm sure he's going to love it.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Thank you.
MEGAN GREEN: So don't worry.
So I think a big
part of the show--
and you mentioned
this before-- is
you have a really good
sense of humor, obviously.
A lot of what you do
is comical and comedy.
How hard is it to do both magic
and you have to do comedy?
It seems like you
to do two things.
Like, comedians
only have to do one,
and some magicians only have
to do one, and you to do two.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Right?
It's not fair.
MEGAN GREEN: You
should get paid double.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
This is not fair.
Like when I was starting out,
I would do very serious magic.
I'm like Lance
Burton was my hero.
So I would wear a tuxedo
and make birds appear.
14 years old, and
I owned 12 doves
that I would like travel
around to magic competitions.
I was good at it, but
I just felt like I--
I don't know.
Like when something goes wrong,
and you're being serious,
and you have this bravado, like
you just look like an idiot.
Like when something
goes wrong, you
can tell something went wrong,
because the veneer cracks.
Like Harry Anderson
was my hero as a kid.
He used to be a magician.
He was the star
of "Night Court,"
everyone's favorite show,
early '90s, "Night Court."
Yeah.
He was Harry T.
Stone, but he was just
a great comedy magician who
styled like Mac King, Penn
and Teller, all these guys.
I just was like, I like that,
because you don't-- and Amazing
Johnathan-- especially
because you don't know--
if a trick works, and
it's funny, great.
But if a trick is funny,
and it doesn't work,
it's funny for
different reasons.
Like they don't know where
something is going to go.
You don't know, like with
the printer thing, it's like,
should we know this?
Should be not?
Is this the truth?
Like I don't know, it's a
little more exciting to me,
and I don't want to be all goth.
That wasn't for me, you know,
the serious goth magicians.
You know who I'm talking about.
Just wasn't my style.
Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: Fair enough.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: But it is hard,
because you have to obviously
pull off the magic part.
Like when I'm working
out a new trick,
I'll have to make sure
I get that part down.
But then the jokes, like for
me that's just as important,
like that what you're doing
is funny or about something.
I don't want to just do
a trick for magic's sake,
because then it's like you're
just missing an opportunity
to have a little weight
to what you're doing.
MEGAN GREEN: Speaking of
funny and non-funny magicians,
have you heard
from any magicians?
This is one of the first magic
forays on Netflix and maybe
even in terms of a series on TV.
Have you gotten feedback
from other magicians?
I know you hang out
at The Magic Castle.
Like what's that been like?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Magicians have been
really, really supportive.
I've got a great team of
magicians who work on the show.
But then, I think like
the magic community--
and the comedy community,
magic community,
like kind of the hacky go-to
is that like everyone hates
one another, and everyone's
like resenting other people's
success, but I find
that's not true.
I feel like magicians
like when someone
is doing their own thing but
also hopefully showcasing magic
in a good light, because they
feel like it helps everybody.
A lot of magicians
got jealous when
David Blaine's special first
came out, because they're like,
he's just doing small tricks.
I could do that.
I'm jealous.
But really, he kind of changed
the perception of magic
and did everybody I think a
favor in making magic cool
again, whatever that means.
So I think magicians have
been really incredible.
Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: And
in comics as well.
I like straddling the line
between those two communities.
MEGAN GREEN: That's awesome.
It was fun that you got
picked up for a second season.
I'm sure that felt good.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
When does this air, by the way?
MEGAN GREEN: We've already
done the second season.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No
no, this right now,
what we're doing right now.
MEGAN GREEN: Maybe
in a couple weeks.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, good,
because season three--
we even got the go for season
three-- comes out in May.
MEGAN GREEN: Yay!
That's helpful for
my next question.
Good contact.
So you obviously had to evolve
season two from season one.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: And
now, you're going
to have to evolve it again.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
MEGAN GREEN: Can you
talk a little bit about
like you obviously keep
certain things consistent,
but how hard this is to keep
doing, keep churning out,
keep making new tricks,
and that's really quick.
You had season two in
December, and now you're
going to have season three--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: In May.
MEGAN GREEN: May.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Right.
Well, what we did is we
shot them both back-to-back.
MEGAN GREEN: Oh.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Sneaky.
MEGAN GREEN: Obviously, magic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: So like
it was a very long year
of doing all that.
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: So while we
were like in editing season two,
I was out shooting season three.
So it was kind of
multitasking, but yeah,
because you want to deliver--
people come back because
they want that flavor.
Give me what I am here for, but
also don't just give me that.
You've got to surprise me still.
So it's like you have to
serve two different goals.
So we still found more
Susans, of course,
and season two, I
think, got really,
really autobiographical
and emotional at times.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: And
I think, compared
to season one and
season three, it's
like right in the
middle, where it's
like, we're going to take
you back a little bit here.
You're not going to
cry every episode,
unless you get triggered
by something that I
couldn't have predicted.
I don't know.
MEGAN GREEN: Like LARPers.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Like LARPers,
maybe LARPers, maybe.
Yeah.
Maybe your first kiss was, I
don't know, maybe at a LARP.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: And you
never saw them again,
and it's really triggering
for you, but yeah.
Like I'd always wanted to go
do magic at a nudist colony,
because like as a magician--
and I've had these nightmares.
Because we do a fear
episode in season three,
and you always have these
nightmares of being introduced.
Like when you're like, ladies
and gentlemen, Justin Willman,
and not just like
not having my props
but also just not
having any clothes on.
So like as a magician,
your pockets,
you need to know
where everything is,
and it's a nightmare
to have nothing.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: So in the
episode, I faced all my fears,
and that was one of them.
So we went to a nudist
colony, and I did magic naked
for naked people.
Because you can't just go do
magic naked on the streets.
They have to be naked as well.
MEGAN GREEN: Is
there a naked Susan?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: There's no--
MEGAN GREEN: No, no.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Susans are never nude.
MEGAN GREEN: Never nude.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Never nude.
MEGAN GREEN: Speaking
of fear, do you ever--
you probably, at this point,
everything is so well executed,
you probably don't have
too many screw-ups.
But have you ever
had a screw-up,
and do you ever have fear like
still that that could happen?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
I have screw-ups a lot.
Like well, when I'm on stage, I
try to minimize the screw-ups,
because there's no way
to finagle out of them.
Obviously, if you're
out filming something
in the world and
just a whole bit,
the way you thought
I was going to go,
it just tanks, you're just like,
OK, well, I guess we will--
MEGAN GREEN: Never see
those people again.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No one
will ever see that.
Because you have to take
chances and do stuff
that may or may not
work, and also you
have limited time
to shoot a bit, when
you're out in the world.
And sometimes, you'll do
something for somebody,
and the trick will go
great, looks amazing,
but their reaction sucks.
So they were looking
away, and you're like,
you have to lose
the whole thing.
Sometimes, their
reaction is amazing,
but when you watch a trick
back, you're like, ah,
you kind of can see
how it worked there.
They didn't, but you
can as the viewer,
so you scrap that whole thing.
So there's a lot of variables,
but for the most part,
if something
doesn't work, that's
when the improv
comes in, and you
try to just make it look like
it was all part of the show.
MEGAN GREEN: The show.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: That's amazing.
I'm going to invite people
up for questions now too.
So if you want to start lining
up, that would be awesome,
but I'm going to ask you a
question before we do that.
So you've performed for
a lot of famous people.
We mentioned, you
performed for the Obamas.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I
love that you're
like, you performed at the White
House, Obama administration.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
Obama administration.
We wanted you to have
a good time here.
So you've obviously
performed for Susan Sarandon
and a lot of celebrities.
Like does that make
you more nervous?
Is that more fun?
Like can you tell us about
a time that sort of like--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Well,
performing at the White House
was the most nervous
I'd ever been.
MEGAN GREEN: Really?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: The most.
MEGAN GREEN: I thought
this was the most nervous
you'd ever been.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: This is pretty--
I feel like I'm in friendly--
like there's love in the room
here.
Not that there wasn't
love there, but like
there's so much like
rigid security, obviously.
MEGAN GREEN: Malia.
No.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: She's so rigid.
It was for a Halloween
party at the house.
So it was like a military
family, White House staff.
So everyone's in a costume
which helps put you at ease.
Obama was not a--
he was in a fleece.
He was in a fleece.
AUDIENCE: Aw.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
He was dressed as the
president in a fleece.
MEGAN GREEN: Wow.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: But just like,
you're doing your thing here.
I'm doing my thing,
and he's like--
he's where you are-- and he was
heckling, like nice heckling,
like how did he do that?
You know?
Like trying to like help.
So I couldn't forget
that he was there.
Like normally, I'd just be
like, just a normal show,
but it's like he's
razzing me the whole time.
MEGAN GREEN: And if
it's the president,
do you feel obliged to
answer when he's like,
how did he do that?
Wait, I've got to tell him.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
I did not answer.
I did not.
MEGAN GREEN: You didn't answer.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
I didn't get shaken
down at the end.
It's all good.
Yeah.
He was very sweet.
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I
often find, like if I'm
nervous to meet somebody, it's
more awkward to like, hey,
how's it going,
have a conversation
here than it is to have
them be in the audience.
And then on stage, you are in
more control and you zone out.
The fact that I'm a huge
fan and just do what you do,
that makes it easier to
meet very impressive people.
MEGAN GREEN: Very cool.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You are
well lit over there.
Wow.
AUDIENCE: Congrats
on the third season.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Thanks, man.
AUDIENCE: Misdirection, I know
I like a lot of, obviously--
I'm a magician myself--
but I imagine a lot of it is
about controlling the audience
and controlling
where people look
and where their
attention is focused.
I wonder whether that's
much easier to do in person
than to do through a camera.
Because I guess you
have to kind of imagine
whether you're
controlling the viewer's
attention in the
right kind of way
and how you get any sense
whether you're doing that?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, wow,
that's a good question.
It is easier to misdirect live.
I think because if
you just think about
if you're watching "Magic
for Humans" like on a--
what do they call
the huge screen
that comes all the way around?
MEGAN GREEN: IMAX.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
IMAX, on an IMAX,
you can look over here, see
one thing, and over there,
but that's similar to
how it would be live,
versus when you're
watching on your laptop,
you can see the whole frame.
So live, if you're
watching my eyes--
you have to pick
one place to watch.
But when you're watching
on a screen, or even
home on your TV,
you have the whole--
you can take in
the whole picture,
and also you can pause and
go frame-by-frame backwards.
So it's much harder
to misdirect on TV.
So you have to use
different magic techniques
to accomplish the same tricks.
Like as we're coming up
with routines for the show
and [? trying ?] to come up with
methods, like a lot of times
it's like, OK, that
method to be great,
but that would only work live.
Or that method would
be great for TV
but would not be good live.
There's a lot of--
that's all I can say about that,
but that's a good question.
It is a weird conundrum.
Yeah.
AUDIENCE: Thanks so
much for coming, Justin.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Yeah, my pleasure.
AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE]
the show, you're
my family's like
favorite celebrity.
We watch it.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, wow.
AUDIENCE: We watch it every
holiday, and so thanks.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Thank you.
AUDIENCE: My question
is, how'd you
get hooked up with Tim
and Eric, and what's
it like working with them?
And Tim, is he
ever not sarcastic,
or is he a normal person?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
So I've always been like
a huge Tim and Eric fan.
Are you familiar
with Tim and Eric?
MEGAN GREEN: I am.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Like there were
times we're watching
"Awesome Show" and Steve Brule.
Like I couldn't remember ever
laughing harder at anything.
So their producing
partner's name
is Dave Kneebone, their company,
Abso Lutely Productions,
who happens to be an
amateur magician, who
I met through The Magic
Castle, and we just
started talking about maybe
doing a show together.
And we did a pilot for
Comedy Central that
didn't get picked up, but
we were like, that was fun.
I think we're onto something.
So it was like I kind of like
backdoored into the production
company, in that this show
is maybe like the least
Tim and Eric of
all the Abso shows.
But like the same
editors and producers,
so it still has that flair.
Seeing those guys
around the office
is so surreal, because
they are alarmingly normal,
Tim especially.
It's just like, I always
think he's like making a joke.
It's like, hey,
man, how you doing?
And I'm like excited,
like, oh, he's
going to drop some
Heidecker on me right now,
and then it's like, oh,
no, he's just being nice.
So he's alarmingly normal
and enjoys a good Keurig
in the morning and a Danish,
and then he's off on his way.
Yeah.
I'm still nervous and a
little star struck by them,
even though I see them
around the office,
going to the bathroom.
They're peeing.
I'm like, nah, I'll
go use the sink.
I'm like, I don't know.
I'm awkward around them.
Yeah, but they're lovely.
They're fans of the show.
AUDIENCE: Thanks.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Thank you.
MEGAN GREEN: Well,
they should be fans.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: They
should be fans of the show.
They make money.
AUDIENCE: Hey, Justin.
My name's Jenna.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Hi, Jenna.
AUDIENCE: I have a comment
and a question for you.
First, I'm not sure if you're
an "Arrested Development" fan,
but Gob Bluth is a magician.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yes.
AUDIENCE: And he talks a
lot about the difference
between a trick and an
illusion, and so I just thought
that was something that
was interesting that you
guys commented on today.
Not sure if you want to
start talking about it more
as an illusion than a trick.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Illusions, Megan.
AUDIENCE: But my real question
is, clearly, you use comedy,
and you have this surprise
and wow factor in your magic.
Do you prefer getting
a laugh or a wow?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: That's
a great question.
I think because growing up, I
was so like all my admiration
was for people like Steve
Martin, Johnny Carson, and then
Jay Leno.
Like I studied Jay Leno.
I was like, I want to be
the host of "The Tonight
Show" and Mitch Hedberg.
Like all these guys,
I so badly just wanted
to be funny, while I was also--
it's like, yeah, I'm a magician.
I'm working hard on that,
but like, man, solving--
how do you-- the science of
crafting a joke that just makes
a whole room of people laugh.
Like I was so
obsessed with that.
So I think I still get a lot
of gratification from a laugh,
and I get greedy.
I want to have the laugh
and the wow, obviously.
If I'm a magician, I have
to deliver on the wow,
but if I can get a dozen
laughs on the way to the wow,
like it feels
really, really good.
MEGAN GREEN: You're
an overachiever.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I try.
Yeah.
Yeah, but just being
able to like be accepted
into the comedy world is--
I don't know-- very gratifying
and surreal and feels nice.
The difference between
illusions and magic is--
I don't know-- like I
would never call myself
an illusionist, even though
I guess by definition,
am I someone who does illusions?
Yes.
This is not really happening,
but it looks like it is.
But anyone who calls
themselves an illusionist,
I feel like just should
be punched in the face.
Like it just seems so pompous.
Like you can call me a
magician or an illusionist.
I don't care, but I will
call myself a magician.
Something about illusionist
just has a connotation like--
I don't know-- maybe it's
just the word, illusion.
It's just begging for that.
MEGAN GREEN: Is that
those goth magicians
we were talking about before?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I don't
know what you mean.
Yeah.
Copperfield, someone who's doing
like big, old, crazy stuff.
Yeah.
If you own an island, you can
call yourself an illusionist.
Copperfield owns an island.
Imagine the taxes
he must have to pay.
MEGAN GREEN: Has Netflix
gotten you an island yet?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No.
MEGAN GREEN: No.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No, nothing.
MEGAN GREEN: Nothing.
How about an elephant?
No.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Nothing.
MEGAN GREEN: Nothing.
OK, we'll work on
that for season four.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Please.
AUDIENCE: Hey, thanks
for being here today.
So as a comedy writer, I find
like this mixed writers room
that you have
really interesting.
So I'm curious if
a comedian has ever
pitched an idea that
wasn't physically feasible,
or if conversely, a
magician has pitched
an idea that wasn't funny.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh,
man, that's like what
happens most of the time.
Most the time,
it's both of those.
It's unfeasible things.
Let me think of an example.
Oh, gosh.
So many unfeasible
things, but there's
always like a kernel of,
if you distill it down,
like, oh, there's this--
where you're coming from though
is that an interesting thing.
So for example,
as a new dad, I'm
fascinated with my wife's
ability to breastfeed.
I want to breastfeed.
So it's like, I'm going to
go into a coffee shop and--
this is weird and
out of context.
But we did a hidden
camera thing,
it's like, oh, you just got
to-- oh, they're out of milk.
What do you want, almond milk?
Here, I'm going to
pop some almonds,
chew them up, unzip
my sweatshirt,
and I'm squirting almond
milk out of my chest.
You know?
MEGAN GREEN: I saw it.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You saw it.
Like the way that idea was
pitched by one of our--
it was actually a female
comedy writer, so it's OK.
Right?
I'm sure you like, women
have a problem with this.
Right?
[LAUGHTER] The way she pitched
it was like much more--
milk was coming
out of everywhere.
But I loved the idea
of it, because there
is a magic in like what
a mother is able to do
to sustain a life of a child.
It's incredible.
Did you know that a baby's
mouth and a mother's nipple
actually have a
symbiotic-- like there's
an exchange of bacteria
that lets the mother know
what nutrients the baby needs.
This is true.
MEGAN GREEN: Gross.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Google
it, and there's this--
so to me, I found
that to be magic.
So I liked that.
That was like the kernel of
like, oh, this is really great.
Let's make it not gross,
and we've got a winner,
and I hope it wasn't gross.
Was it?
MEGAN GREEN: No,
no, it was adorable.
AUDIENCE: It was
a little adorable?
MEGAN GREEN: It was adorable.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Well, I
wasn't going for adorable.
It's supposed to be
a little off-putting,
but it's over quick.
MEGAN GREEN: OK.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
That's the good thing.
Yeah.
AUDIENCE: Thanks.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Thanks, man.
MEGAN GREEN: It was a mix.
It was adorable, and off.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: It
was half and half.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
It was-- [LAUGHTER]
JUSTIN WILLMAN: See?
That was like a dad joke.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Because I'm a dad.
MEGAN GREEN: Or a dad trick.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Dad
tricks, dad tricks, yes.
AUDIENCE: I'm Amanda.
Nice to meet you.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Hi.
AUDIENCE: As a magician,
do people expect
you to have a party trick
when you show up at a party,
and if so, do you always
have to have one prepared?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I used
to never leave the house
without a deck of cards
on me and business cards,
like when I was just hustling.
Especially in
college, like I used
to do kids' birthday parties.
That was my thing.
So I didn't go by
Justin Willman then.
I was Justin Kredible.
That was my stage name,
[LAUGHTER] Justin Kredible,
and you're trying to drum
up gigs all the time.
So like I could end up
booking a couple of gigs,
if I did a trick at that party.
And then once I wasn't doing
those kinds of things anymore,
I liked to have my,
here's when I'm on.
I'm here performing, and
then out in the real world,
I can be off.
Because if I have to switch from
just out being social, relaxed,
chill, real life
Justin into like, OK,
I've got to do a trick now.
I've got to put
on a performance.
It takes you out of
your chill, your vibe.
So I don't always.
Now, I tend to not
show up, unless I
have an inkling that I'm
going to be put on the spot.
Because there's nothing
like being put on the spot
and then being like,
I have nothing.
I don't have my things with me.
MEGAN GREEN: Do you get
invited to less parties?
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Well, as a new dad,
you just go to less parties.
MEGAN GREEN: Fair enough.
Fair enough.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Thanks, [? Imagine. ?]
AUDIENCE: So we watch your show.
We don't know how
you do your tricks.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You
look so familiar.
AUDIENCE: I know.
I'm sorry for double dipping,
but it's a different question.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
I'm glad you did.
AUDIENCE: Different concept.
So we watch your show.
We don't know how
you do your tricks,
but my question is, do you watch
other magicians and try and--
are there any tricks
that you don't
know how to do that you
watch other people do?
And as someone at the top
of the magician field,
do you share tricks
with other magicians,
or how collaborative is that?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
It's luckily not as cutthroat
as "The Prestige" makes it out
to be, where there's murder
and espionage involved.
I love watching other
magicians and being fooled.
I love being fooled,
because as a kid,
seeing magic and
being fooled is what
made me want to be a magician.
And then unfortunately, you
then learn all the tricks
of the trade, and then
therefore, you less frequently
get to experience
what made you want
to do that thing in the
first place which is sad.
So Penn and Teller
fool me all the time.
Shin Lim is really amazing.
Mac King is a great
Vegas magician.
There's so many great people
who I can turn off my magician
brain and just watch
it like a real person,
and to me that's
really exciting.
And then maybe later that
night, I then think like, OK,
how the hell did they do that?
You often will
come up with a way
how you think they did
it, which isn't how
they did it, but could work.
You know?
Like it's a different
method, and that's a fun part
of the creative process.
Magicians are very
willing to share.
I think in certain
circles, in terms
of secrets and
tricks of the trade,
there are certain
things though that they
know like, all right,
this is a trick that
is fooling everybody.
And if they know
how this works, this
makes this trick less
special, because they're
going to start doing it.
So some people guard the
secrets a little bit better.
I find, like with
the show, magicians
who like didn't work
on it, who just saw it,
and things that fool them, they
kind of don't even want to ask.
I think that's the
side of, hopefully,
a well-evolved magician is
that you want to preserve
the things that fool you.
Watching Penn and Teller fool
us, I think you can get that,
that Penn and Teller kind
of love when they get--
they love being angrily fooled,
because they know too much.
That Teller is a very smart man.
MEGAN GREEN: So sometimes,
you do believe in magic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Some--
MEGAN GREEN: No?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: What
was the [? face ?]
we said was fake-real magic.
Yeah.
No, sometimes, I like
to feel the feeling
of believing the magic.
I've never seen
somebody and been
like, oh, there's no magic.
This is witchcraft.
MEGAN GREEN: That's how
I feel when I watch you.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Well, that's good.
That's good.
You're a muggle.
You're supposed
to feel that way.
AUDIENCE: I'm Ali.
I was at your show in December.
I'm not [? stalking you. ?]
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Hi, Ali.
AUDIENCE: I actually have
a non-magic question.
I really enjoy the videos
you do with your wife,
the "Drunk History" one.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
AUDIENCE: I just wanted to ask
about how those came to be.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, fun.
AUDIENCE: [INAUDIBLE]
and I liked the follow-up
about your baby's birth.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
Thank you.
We, my wife Jill and
I, when we got married
4 and 1/2 years ago, we
knew from going to weddings,
being the guest,
you see the couple
get bombarded with
all these questions
from in-laws they
haven't seen in a while.
Always like, so how
did you guys meet?
And it's like, I don't want
to tell the story all night.
So we thought, let's
shoot a "Drunk History"
spoof, where we get hammered,
tell the story of how we met.
Show it at the rehearsal
dinner, and then we
don't have to do
small talk about it.
We don't have to talk
to our relatives at all.
And we had my buddy
Adam Franklin,
who directed "Magic
for Humans," he
slummed it and directed this.
And we had a bunch of my
actor buddies re-enact it,
and it ended up being a little
viral thing on our honeymoon
which was super fun.
Shout out, thank you, YouTube.
They're not here.
Are they here, the YouTube?
Is there commingling?
MEGAN GREEN: Oh, yeah.
I work at YouTube.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: It's
all under the same roof?
MEGAN GREEN: Mm-hm.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, OK, good.
Here we are.
MEGAN GREEN: Here we are.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: We're here.
We're doing it.
It's like magic and
comedy intertwining.
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
And we didn't even
know we were going
to put it online,
because it was something
fun to show for our guests.
But that then got my wife and I
jazzed, once our son was born,
which was a very
tumultuous birth story.
He came a month early.
I was in Hartford.
She was in LA.
When she's going
into labor, I have
to try to get back
there in time.
I did, barely,
spoiler, long story.
MEGAN GREEN: You did a trick.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You don't
want to be in Hartford most
of the time anyway, but
let alone, the morning
that your wife goes into labor.
And so we shot another
one to follow up
that is on the Instagram
and the Twitter.
I'm going to put
a censored one up
on YouTube, after
I meet somebody,
and they expose the algorithm
for the recommended page.
MEGAN GREEN: I'll
see what we can do.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, good.
AUDIENCE: Hey,
Justin, John Michael.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: What's up, man?
AUDIENCE: Thanks
for coming today.
I really appreciate it.
I really enjoy the show a lot.
I also happen to notice
you're a guest on "Nailed It,"
and I was curious just to hear
about your experience on that
and if you could try
to go back on again,
because that was really cool.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: You
watch "Nailed It?"
You know what it is?
Do you?
OK.
So "Nailed It" is a Netflix
baking dessert show.
MEGAN GREEN: That's
what I thought.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: But you don't
have like pro level chefs.
They're just like
they're ordinary people,
like us, who suck.
MEGAN GREEN: Like if
I was doing magic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Like
if you-- exactly.
Exactly.
They often suck, and it's
funny, and Nicole Byer,
who's hilarious, is the host.
So that was a
blast, but also was
it was a cathartic experience,
because for nine seasons,
I hosted "Cupcake Wars"
on the Food Network.
OK, big fans here.
This is great.
[LAUGHTER]
I think to me, when
I watch "Nailed It,"
I think this is all the things
I wish I could have said
on "Cupcake Wars" but couldn't.
Like it's a spoof of that.
So it was nice to finally
like make the jokes
and experience the
tongue-in-cheek version
of the show that I was a
prisoner to for a long time,
but it was very good to me.
Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: What's your
favorite kind of cupcake?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Peanut
butter, chocolate,
I don't know, like I'm a savory.
If I can get some savory
in there, I'm good.
Peanut butter, what's
your favorite kind?
MEGAN GREEN: I just like
a regular like birthday
cake, chocolate.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Funfetti?
MEGAN GREEN: Yeah,
I love Funfetti.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Oh, wow.
MEGAN GREEN: I like
sweet, very sweet.
Sorry, we got distracted.
Next question.
AUDIENCE: Hey, how are you?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Good.
AUDIENCE: So sidebar
to my question,
you know the CEO of
YouTube is a Susan?
MEGAN GREEN: Oh.
AUDIENCE: Oh.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: I
take back everything
I said, but am I right
about my generalization?
Does she pay you
guys with checks?
AUDIENCE: No comment.
So I was just wondering,
like you mentioned earlier,
but did you go through like
a starving magician phase?
Like did you have a
talk with your parents
where you're like,
hey, I'm going
to be a professional magician.
And were they like, have you
thought about law school,
or were you the whole way
through just following
the dream?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Well, when
I was like in high school,
I was like one of those
like young entrepreneurs.
I'm like 15, don't
even have a car yet,
but I've got a briefcase and
the business cards and stuff.
So my parents were very
supportive of that.
And then once it was like
near the end of high school,
and they're like, wow, he's
still really into this.
There was a talk
of like, Justin,
you know that we think you
should get a college degree,
even though this magic thing
seems to be going well.
So that was always the urging.
So I went to Emerson
College in Boston
and got a degree in broadcast
journalism, because I was like,
maybe I'll be--
if magic fails--
I'll be like a funny
weather man or something.
And luckily, it worked
out, but that ended up
being good training for reading
a teleprompter on "Cupcake
Wars," in slavery for
nine years, just yes.
You know how many times I had
to count backwards from 10
on "Cupcake Wars?"
MEGAN GREEN: Wow.
Does that help at all
with "Magic for Humans?"
JUSTIN WILLMAN: No.
MEGAN GREEN: You ever
have to count backwards?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Never.
MEGAN GREEN: Never.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
No, only forwards.
MEGAN GREEN: Only forwards?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: 1, 2, 3,
but baking, it's 10, 9, 8.
The starving part, like
when I went to college,
I think it was like,
once I graduate college,
I moved to LA.
And Justin Kredible
was out in LA,
and there's not like
the college structure.
There's a lot of things in LA
to distract you from success,
and just like I'm sure,
New York, you just, ah, I'm
in New York, party, and you
really veer off the path
that you came there
for in the first place.
So I think keeping my drive
and ambition on track,
faltered for a few years.
And there were times where I did
think about maybe moving back
to San Louis and maybe
like getting a real job
or whatever-- maybe
I'll be a weather man--
and managed to stick that out.
My pants were always
very, very supportive,
but my dad was always supportive
yet fiscally skeptical about
whether or not I was
making the right moves.
AUDIENCE: But now?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Now, he's--
now, he's good.
Now that season
three's happening,
he thinks this magic
thing's going to be OK.
Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: Last question.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: My
dad still asks me
what channel Netflix is
on, if that tells you
about my parents at all.
AUDIENCE: Hey, Justin.
I'm Alex.
I saw you in Times Square
like a year and a half ago,
and someone heckled
you, and you did well
with it and everything.
I guess my question is--
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Was I
performing in a venue,
or was I just
roaming the streets?
Was I in Times Square like on
the sidewalk, at Carolines?
AUDIENCE: Yeah, at Carolines.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK.
AUDIENCE: And my question
is, are the hecklers in magic
different than the
hecklers in comedy,
and was there a difference in
getting used to the second one?
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Do you
remember what they heckled
or what they said?
AUDIENCE: I think
it was something
about like getting with you,
or they were very graphic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: See, that
sounds like an Obama heckle.
Like it's like an
encouraging heckle.
AUDIENCE: Yeah.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: There's
not as many hecklers
as with a comedian, I
think, just because I
think comedy is naturally a
little more feather-ruffling,
a little more antagonistic.
It's meant to present itself
as a conversation between you
and the audience, but
it's an unspoken rule
that you're not
supposed to respond.
But often people are drunk,
and they forget that,
so there's a lot of heckling.
With magic, I feel like I
get less heckles or at least
more frowned upon.
You'd think magic hecklers would
be like, it's up your sleeve,
but I find people are a
little more respectful.
Sometimes, I like
a little bit of--
just a little--
I don't want the audience
to be quiet and polite.
Like I like-- if it's not
laughs I'm going for--
I like a little
bit of a rowdiness,
a little combativeness.
So sometimes, I try to
actually encourage friendly
heckling the best I can.
Like about the first kiss stuff,
if you were like reluctant,
like you gave it up too easy.
You gave me her
first and last name,
but I would love it if
he was like, I'm not
going to give it to you.
Yeah, you are.
Come on.
And then we would
insult one another,
and it would have
been a weird start,
but you would have
remembered it.
You know?
So for the most part, people
are polite, yet too polite,
occasionally.
Yeah.
AUDIENCE: Awesome.
Thanks.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Nice
sweater, by the way.
I was about to wear
that exact same sweater.
I'm glad I didn't.
MEGAN GREEN: Well, I want to
leave everyone on this note.
I think one of the
things you said
in the show that
really resonated
with me is that it doesn't
matter if what you see
is fake, as long as the way
it makes you feel is real.
And I wanted to know
if that's what you
think the secret to magic is.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
I like that quote.
Out of complete
context, it's like there
are more serious
implications when something
is fake or information is--
but I think, in
terms of like magic--
MEGAN GREEN: I was
talking in the magic.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: OK, good.
MEGAN GREEN: Just to clarify.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
The headline, the click bait,
is like Google [? rep ?] says,
it doesn't matter if it's
fake, as long as the news makes
you feel good.
[LAUGHTER] I think magic is
about suspending the disbelief
willingly.
I think that people who
enjoy magic the most
are people who are intelligent.
It's not about trying to
like trick you or make
you feel dumb, fool you.
I think the willing
suspension of disbelief
that happens with magic
or professional wrestling
or at a play or at
a movie, I think
it is like a pure,
wonderful thing.
And I think magic
especially, especially when
you're seeing it
in person, like it
is a rare chance where
the rules of the universe
get changed for a moment.
You feel like a kid again, like
the what, how, is something
that we don't feel every day,
because we live in an age
where we can have all of
our answers in front of us.
So I think it is a
beautiful little feeling
that you can give people,
and I love doing that.
And I love getting
that, but for me, it's
my favorite pastime
that I've been
able to make a career out of.
MEGAN GREEN: Well, it has been
truly magical having you here.
Season two of "Magic for
Humans" is available on Netflix.
Go and check it out.
JUSTIN WILLMAN: Yeah.
MEGAN GREEN: I'd like to give
Justin a big round of applause.
JUSTIN WILLMAN:
Thank you so much.
Thank you, guys.
Thank you for coming.
