JONATHAN KOLA: All right,
good afternoon, everybody.
Welcome to Talks at Google.
In this talk, we'll be
talking about the technology
ecosystem and the
entrepreneurship ecosystem
in general in Africa.
We have the pleasure
today to be joined
by four entrepreneurs who have
built businesses in Africa,
ranging from financial services,
from media education and market
research.
The goal of this talk is to
help us to better understand
the technology ecosystem in
Africa, and the role a company
like Google could be playing
through the diverse eyes
of our guests.
So first on stage, let
me introduce Greg Cohen.
Greg is a co-founder and CEO of
Asoko Insight, Africa's leading
private company data platform.
As COO, Greg drives Asoko's
product development,
data acquisition, and data
management operations.
Prior to Asoko, Greg
spent several years
as a market research
manager and analyst,
operating across Africa
and the Middle East,
including Nigeria, Ghana, Kenya,
Algeria, Oman, and Bahrain.
So welcome, Greg.
GREG COHEN: Thank you.
JONATHAN KOLA:
Next on stage, I'd
like to introduce Eyitemi Popo.
Over the past few years, Eyitemi
has launched three ventures
aimed at changing the
Africa narrative globally,
and amplifying the
voices of Africans.
She is the founder of
"Ayiba Magazine," which
is an award-winning African
publication that tells stories
of the African
diaspora, and GitGirl,
which is Africa's first data
science academy for women,
designed to teach
African women skills
in data science, data
engineering, and data
analytics.
Welcome, Eyitemi.
Next on stage, I'll
introduce Abbey Wemimo.
Abbey is co-founder of Esusu
which is a financial technology
company that helps people
save, bills, credit,
and provides a bridge to
financial access and inclusion.
The company's name is derived
from the Ghanian Twi language
word susu, which means to plan.
Now Esusu is a form
of rotational savings
among family and friends that
has been around the world
for centuries.
It allows people to advance
financially and overcome
the constraints of poverty.
Welcome, Abbey.
And finally, I'd like to
introduce Michael Rain
onto the stage.
Michael is a co-founder of ZNews
Africa, a media and technology
startup that publishes stories
about the global pan-African
community.
ZNews Africa was
a selected member
of Google's Launchpad, Facebook
FbStart, and Microsoft's
BizSpark accelerator programs.
Michael is also the
creator of ENODI,
which highlights the lives
of first-generation people
and immigrants of African,
Caribbean, and Latin descent.
He's also a TED fellow, and
his writing photography,
and film work have been featured
in the "Wall Street Journal,"
NBC News, and
"Upscale Magazine."
So welcome, Michael, and
welcome to all of our panelists.
[APPLAUSE]
So it's good to
have you all here.
Thank you for coming once again.
I think we'll dive straight in.
And I'll first start
by asking each of you
a couple of questions.
You can take that opportunity to
share with us a bit about what
you're doing and
address the question.
And then we'll do some general
questions before opening it up.
So let's start
with you, Eyitemi.
With GitGirl, you
focused on young women.
So if you could
share with us what
the state of women in
technology is in the countries
you work in, and why you
focus on data science,
as you tell us more
about what GitGirl does.
EYITEMI POPO: OK.
Hello, everyone,
my name is Eyitemi.
I am the founder of GitGirl,
which is Africa's first data
science academy for women.
Right now, we're operating
in Lagos, Nigeria,
and we've enrolled
about 100 students.
We plan on expanding
to Ghana in the summer.
And our goals are
pan-African, so hopefully, we
can get to that point.
We decided to focus
on data science
because we felt like data is
the next transformational trend
in technology.
It's already a huge
trend here in the US.
And it's picking up speed in
different countries in Africa.
And when you look
at engineering,
for example, or
software engineering,
women are not represented
in tech on the continent.
Even around the world,
the stats aren't great.
And so we felt like if we could
go to something that hasn't yet
hit and we can prepare African
women to have that first mover
advantage, when it really
comes in, then we could win.
Because the idea
is to economically
empower African women.
And if you go into a tech
hub in Lagos or Nairobi,
you will find women
there, but they're
likely digital
marketing, or web design.
They're doing the
non-tech tech things.
And we wanted to give them
high value technology skills,
because that's what pays.
And if we really want to
give African women skills
that actually pay
the bills, then we
have to prepare them for
careers of the future.
So that's what we do at GitGirl.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK, great.
And so far, I
believe you've done
about two or three mentorship
sessions in South Africa.
I know you're planning
on going to Kenya.
Can you give us some
insight about what
happened in those programs,
how was the interaction like,
and what was the experience
for the young women you
were working with?
EYITEMI POPO: Yeah, so
that's a separate business.
That's my magazine.
So I actually found out about
GitGirl through my magazine.
It's called "Ayiba," and
we highlight change makers
across the African continent.
And that's how I met my founder.
But through that, I also
have a female focus.
So that's kind of the
thread in my career.
Everything I do is focused
on female empowerment.
So with that, I bring
my magazine to life.
Because the magazine is focused
on Africans in the diaspora.
And I want them to be able
to experience the continent.
And so we do curated trips,
where you can go to Ghana,
or South Africa, or Kenya.
And while we're there,
we're mentoring young girls.
And so what I do
is I bring girls
that are interested in tech.
And the women on the trip
are high-ambition women
with great careers.
And we give them role models.
We show them what's possible.
Because sometimes, you
live in this tiny bubble.
You're in a township in Soweto.
You've never seen a
professional woman
that's living independently and
is able to provide for herself.
So just giving them that
example is really powerful.
And that's actually
why I joined GitGirl.
Because as I've gone around
to different countries
and I've worked
with young girls,
I see how early it starts.
I see how early they
lose their confidence.
And so if we can start
training them younger,
I feel they will
be more successful.
So right now, GitGirl does
focus on a slightly older
demographic, because that's
who can afford our fees,
even though they're
highly subsidized.
But in the future, we do plan
on expanding younger so that we
can get them when it matters.
JONATHAN KOLA: Fantastic.
Picking up on the thread of
media and to switch over here
to Michael--
now Michael, you've
built a career
around storytelling and media.
So could you tell us a bit about
the mission of ZNews Africa,
some of the work you do with
other initiatives, like ENODI,
and some of the
personal work you do?
What's the why behind it?
Why is it important,
and what are you trying
to convey with the work you do?
MICHAEL RAIN: Sure, yeah.
So I'm a storyteller,
and have been
since I was a child, from
illustrating little comic stuff
to being a writer, and
telling stories for companies.
And that's just my strength.
And at some point
about six years ago,
I decided to focus that
storytelling on my people
and my community, right?
So it started with ZNews,
which was a media tech
company that I co-founded with
a friend of mine from college.
And our goal was to expand
the stories about Africa
beyond the war, poverty,
and disease stories which
dominate all of media to give
a platform for us to tell
our own stories, and
to make it easier
to find all of those
stories instead of searching
around, or depending on
all of these email lists
that I'm sure a lot of
you are subscribed to,
and to just make it easier.
So we have a mobile app that
is basically a flipboard
for African news, that
aggregates from over 170
publications in
English and French,
and organizes it by
country and topic.
That's only on Android.
And since we're in Google,
I guess that's cool.
[LAUGHTER]
We also used to
have a weekly email
newsletter of curated content
and producing original content.
ENODI, which I launched a few
years ago to focus specifically
on first-generation
and immigrant people
of African, Caribbean,
Latin descent,
was about the Africans outside
of the continent, the people
in the diaspora who are
connected to the continent
and want to be connected,
but live outside of it.
So that's starting
mostly on highlighting
stories of individual people.
But we'll also be highlighting
stories of entrepreneurship
with immigrants.
So here in the US, most people
don't know that almost half
of Fortune 500
companies were founded
by an immigrant or the
child of an immigrant.
And we also focus on cultural
innovations of immigrants.
So salsa was actually
invented here in New York
by Latino-American immigrants.
And even hip hop--
the roots of that
stems from Caribbean
immigrants in the Bronx.
So that's our stuff.
So on the tech end
of that, I'm actually
starting a fellowship
at Stanford
this fall where I'll be
focusing on improving
local news for immigrant
communities using
SMS technology.
So I'm sure any of you who
have parents who in the US
might have a smartphone,
but they're probably
not on Google and Twitter
and all those things.
They're in WhatsApp and some
other messaging platforms.
So the goal is to provide
them and serve them
with quality news.
JONATHAN KOLA:
And the readership
for your different
publications--
it sounds like there's a
diversity of publications
you've been working on.
Are these mostly people
in the African diaspora,
people in Africa,
people that want
to learn more about Africa?
Can you give us a sense of--
MICHAEL RAIN: Yeah,
so the app is probably
80% people on the continent.
Even though it was originally
built with folks like us
in mind, those were the users
that gravitated towards it.
The newsletter was like flipped.
80% of people are here all over
the US, but also in the UK,
in Canada, and in France.
Yeah, so that's kind
of how that split.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK.
MICHAEL RAIN: Yeah.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK, yeah.
So as we-- oh, oops.
Sorry about that.
As we talk more about the
metrics of the different things
you're working on,
Greg, let me turn
this over to you as the
market research expert here.
So you have been in the market
research space for some time
now.
Could you tell us
a bit about Asoko?
Give us some insight into
the world of corporate data,
market data in
general in Africa,
and how you came about
doing what you do?
GREG COHEN: Sure.
It's a very challenging world.
We founded Asoko Insight
about five years ago.
I've been working across the
continent and the Middle East
for a while, doing
market research.
And Africa is the
last continent where
it's extremely difficult to
get information on companies.
And from an investor's point
of view, a corporate that's
looking to enter the
continent, a government that's
looking to do programs
on the continent,
it was very
difficult to identify
who are the companies in
this particular value chain,
in this particular sector,
who were their owners, who
were their managers, et cetera.
So we decided to build
Africa's most comprehensive
private company data
repository, similar
to the way that a Thomson
Reuters, or Bloomberg user
experience would work here and
in other developed markets.
So we got VC backed,
set up offices across--
I think at this stage, we're
in about 10 African markets
across East and West
Africa, headquarters
in Nairobi and London.
And we have teams
that partner us
with key data repositories
in each of these markets.
Most the data is not online.
So we have to funnel that data
from credit reference bureaus,
tax authorities, corporate
registrar's offices,
a whole bunch of private
sector associations.
We pull whatever is
online, if there is any.
And then companies also submit
their information to us,
because we connect
them with investors.
So all of that data
is quite messy.
We normalize it,
put it on our API,
and then offer that to
investors, banks, governments,
et cetera.
I think the catalyst
of why we wanted
to do this is there is a lot of
really amazing technology going
on across the
continent when it comes
to the retail side of things.
Fintech, as you all
know, is probably
the booming story when it comes
to innovation on the continent.
I just got back from
Kenya yesterday.
And you're seeing
these new tools
that will provide automated
loans to people, based
on their spending habits.
So they don't even need to
communicate with the bank,
they just get money based
on their spending habits,
pretty impressive.
But as soon as you get
a step up from there--
we call them the missing middle
market, kind of below the IPO
multi-national companies, and
above the mom and pop shops
and SMEs, you have these missing
middle market companies that
are making a few million dollars
in revenue, need to grow,
but are unable to
access any capital.
World Bank puts that number at
about $330 billion of finance
that's missing for these
types of companies.
And this is a big reason why
the continent isn't developing
as fast, is the access to
credit, the access to finance
is very difficult, not
only on a personal level,
but at a business level.
So our goal is to profile
all these companies,
enable them to be
marketed to anybody that's
looking to do business, whether
it's intra-African or global.
And yeah, happy to get
into other questions
when we get into it, yeah.
JONATHAN KOLA: Great.
So in my mind, getting
data from Africa
seems like a pretty
challenging effort
for a variety of reasons.
Could you [INAUDIBLE]
and maybe validate that?
Is that the case?
And if so, what makes it
particularly challenging?
GREG COHEN: Yeah,
I think that, first
of all, the regulations when it
comes to data is very nascent.
And that's also a
big opportunity,
because there's not as much
legacy legal frameworks.
And you have some very
innovative technocrats
that are now--
telcos are becoming banks, and
then banks are becoming telcos.
And there's a lot of interesting
regulation coming out now
that's adhering to a lot
of the new technology.
But at the same time,
it's new and people
don't know how to handle it.
And the way that it's
captured and structured
is still being figured out.
So a lot of the repositories
that we need to get information
from are still hard copy.
They're in archives.
They need to be digitized.
That's a huge effort that
costs a lot of money,
so we've had to negotiate
ways to get that at wholesale.
And it's been a challenge.
Each country has its own
unique nuances, as we all know.
Kenya has been at the forefront.
Nigeria has been very difficult.
[CHUCKLING]
Yeah.
But we're making progress.
And I think that
overall, the environment
is becoming more conducive
to knowing that there
needs to be solutions.
Here, if companies
want investments,
the governments need to
provide enabling environments.
Registrars are
starting to digitize.
I think in Kenya now, you
can register your business
through a phone.
So you're seeing
the right track.
Rwanda is ahead of probably
a lot of Western countries.
So country to country,
it has different stories.
But the challenge is to
standardize and normalize that.
Because our clients want to
look at Ethiopia, Nigeria,
and Tanzania, and compare
the same data points together
for their analyses, which is
very difficult to do, yeah.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK.
Now somebody who
perhaps has a lot
of this data in a
digitized form that
could be ready to be consumed
by Greg is Abbey, right?
So you work on Esusu, which is
a digital platform for savings.
Could you tell us a bit about
the model and how it works,
and why it works
the way it works?
It seems like it's a
very innovative model
in terms of the savings model.
It leverages communities.
Could you shed some light
on how it comes together?
ABBEY WEMIMO: Yeah, absolutely.
And I think I'd be
remiss without first
off, now talking about the
inspiration behind the idea,
and how far we've come, and
then the aggressive expansion
into the African continent.
So yeah, I grew up in the
slums of Lagos, Nigeria.
And one thing I was afforded
was one of the best educations.
And throughout
that experience, it
was a good one
being able to really
be thought-provoking
about what's
going on in the landscape.
And I had the opportunity to
come to the United States,
and had the experience to work
in different banks on Wall
Street and in corporate America.
And one thing that was
striking during my transition--
my mother and I,
when we immigrated
from Nigeria to
the United States
in shivering negative 22
degrees weather in Minnesota,
it wasn't fun at all.
And one of the
biggest things was
we didn't have a credit profile.
So we didn't even have access to
capital, which was a struggle.
So the alternative was
to go through payday loan
lenders, which is very
synonymous to what's
going on the continent.
I like to call them call
them neo-payday loan lenders.
And we'll get to that during
the course of this conversation.
So the main factor there was
we got high interest rates,
which was insane.
And we tried as much as
possible to make ends meet.
So after my stint in
corporate America,
my co-founder and
I founded Esusu,
which is really based on
the premise of capturing
relevant data, and unlocking the
financial potential of folks.
So right now, they're over--
for this-- 45 million people
[INAUDIBLE] in the United
States specifically.
There are over $500 billions
of loans accessible to them.
I mean, when you look
globally, especially
some African countries, and
compound the market opportunity
there, there are over
$10.3 trillion of capital
waiting to be unlocked.
That's a lot of capital.
So the inspiration
behind what we did
was leveraging a century-old
idea on the African continent,
and bring innovation to a
place like the United States,
getting a lot of pedigree
and doing it right,
and now looking to and expanding
across the African continent,
specifically in Ghana,
Nigeria, and Sierra Leone.
And what we're
doing there is we--
like Greg talked about--
gathering people's
payment activity,
looking at their
debt to equity ratio
when we look at
their bank accounts,
and giving them access
to capital that way.
So it's data-driven.
It's not a derivative
of who your father is
or who your uncle is.
It's actually how you're
keeping your personal finance,
and having that lens of
being data-driven to allocate
capital.
So when we think about
the data we capture,
it's a lot of
powerful information.
So personal
identifiable information
is one, accounts, to how people
think about their balance
sheets on a monthly
basis, and then
their payment history, which
is quintessential to making
lending decisions.
So we have a wealth of data.
And right now, the biggest,
most exciting thing--
and we should talk, Greg-- is
walking alongside the minister
of finance in Ghana
to actually see
how we can create a credit
rating system there.
So the access to
capital won't be
the derivative of
who your father knows
or your uncle knows.
It's actually a
derivative of what's
going on in your balance
sheet and everyday life.
So that's what we're trying
to address aggressively.
JONATHAN KOLA: Yeah, amazing.
And Abbey, you talked about
taking a centuries-old idea,
something that has
worked in Africa in terms
of communal savings, and
using that to influence
the service that you offer.
ABBEY WEMIMO: Right.
JONATHAN KOLA: And perhaps I
just open this up to all of you
on the panel today.
When you think of
building products
for a consumer base that
is primarily in Africa
or interested in
Africa, what are
some of the differences, if
any, in how you structure
the problem, how you think
about the problem, how
you design your solution?
EYITEMI POPO: So
for me, since I work
in the educational
technology space,
I find that education should
be very context-specific.
And this may be because I'm a
bit salty about my high school
education in Nigeria, where
we focused on the queen,
and had this colonial
education 60 years after we
fought for independence.
And so I bring that into
how we design our curriculum
at GitGirl, making sure
that we're not just
taking a curriculum that
already exists in the US
and transplanting it there.
Because it doesn't make
sense for our students.
And if we were to
do that, then they
could just sign up for an online
education program in the US.
So what makes us different
is that we're designing
for a very specific audience.
We're designing
for African women.
And the first thing
is we have to realize,
since it's an online
program, internet in Nigeria
is very expensive.
The speed isn't always there.
Electricity isn't always there.
And so because we
understand this,
that dictates how we
set up the timing,
and how we make sure
that our students are
able to get their all.
Because it is a very
self-directed learning program.
And as Greg can tell you
from living in Lagos,
it's not an easy place to live.
It's very stressful.
You have a lot of traffic.
So understanding the
time constraints-- you
build that into how you design.
Also, understanding
the finances, right?
So our program costs
$300 for three months,
so that's $100 a month.
That doesn't sound like a lot.
It's probably the
cheapest you'll find.
But it has to be at
that price, because we
know that our average student
earns about $300 a month.
So even though that's
quite well-off for Nigeria,
they're allocating a third
of their salary to us.
And so we have to
have financing options
so that they can afford it.
We have to have scholarships
and grants available.
So those are the type of things
that we fit into our design.
When it comes to the fact that
we're serving women, especially
women in tech, we do know that
there might be a confidence
issue, right?
So if they were to sign
up for a course here,
they're in classrooms with,
probably, majority men.
In America or in India,
if it's an online course,
they might not ask the questions
that they really want to.
And so part of our
curriculum is also
creating a community
that is able to motivate
them to just keep at it.
We get Instagram posts
with people saying,
this looks really cool.
I want to try it out, but I
don't believe I can do it.
Like, give me some information.
Tell me that that you
believe I can do it.
And we have one of our
lead instructors, who
is actually based in the US,
and she does an amazing job.
She's a computer
science graduate.
And she knows what
it's like to be
the only woman in the room, the
only black woman in the room.
And so having someone
that has that empathy
and can constantly encourage
the students to do their best,
because she knows what
it's like to be overlooked
and underestimated,
really matters.
And so we could
have just created
this data science academy
that's just like the rest.
But we had this opportunity
to develop something
that was exactly for our
audience, the African woman,
and that's what we've done.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK.
GREG COHEN: I'll go next.
I think I'll frame the question
in the context of a B2B
scenario for Asoko, because
we don't focus on consumers.
When you look at a lot of
the global corporate research
and data providers,
particularly in Europe,
they're based on the
availability of structured data
sets coming out of a regulator
or listed equities markets.
When you look at Africa--
the markets that we're
operating in-- the data sets
are very unstructured.
So the way that we've
architected our system
is based on how
do you accumulate
unstructured data sets
and normalize them?
So it's a bit of the inverse
compared to the companies
that we've compared
ourselves to in Europe.
And what that means is we have
to focus a lot more on quality
assurance, and use a lot more
of a human in the loop style
system, where data comes in from
a variety of random sources.
That goes through an
increasingly semi-automated
quality assurance process, where
we can pick out the bits that
need polishing, the
bits we want to reject,
the bits we want to accept,
to generate a clean data set.
And when you look
at other firms that
do these types of
things in Europe,
their systems aren't
built in that way.
Because they haven't worked in
those types of environments.
So I think that's kind of what
emerging market-- and it's not
just Africa.
I mean, these are any markets
that just have nascent data
repositories.
So that's kind of the genesis
of how we did it, yeah.
ABBEY WEMIMO: Yeah, I can
just chime in real quick.
I think when we think
about data structures,
the key factor we
need to think about
is really open and
machine-readable, right?
The question is how
do we get there?
The data we're having right
now is very unstructured.
And the transition to
machine-readable and open--
we need to have a data
clearinghouse that
essentially--
if you want to make kind of--
before you get to the Asoko
Insights of the world, there's
an interim market play there
where you can have
a lot of folks
essentially just
cleansing data, and making
sure it gets to that point
of open and machine-readable.
One thing that's
important to underscore we
need to work with institutions,
because they really, really
matter.
They might not have the kind
of data we have right now,
or it's not particularly useful.
But the more investments
we have working
alongside those governments,
and set the frameworks
to make the data more
palatable to our customers.
We also operate on the B2B
end, selling some of our data
to financial institutions.
So we really, really
need to bridge that gap
from open machine-readable,
have a very, very good data
clearinghouse that can
interact with the government
to make sure there's a
sense of verification.
And one thing that's also
crucial to have this policy.
Because one thing
that's troubling for me,
especially on the continent,
is going to Kenya and Nigeria--
yes, a loan is accessible, but
people are not paying back,
and there are credit rating
agencies everywhere now.
And what that's doing to
people's credit scores
is setting us back
60 years again.
MICHAEL RAIN: I'll
just say for us--
so we think about
the users a lot,
particularly with
our app, which has
a robust cache so you can read
news even if you're offline.
Because data is expensive,
or you might get
cut out of electricity.
We also think about building
mobile first, truly mobile
first.
Because a lot of us take for
granted all the other computers
outside of our laptops and
our phones that we're using.
Even if you use
ATM, or if you're
in a store using a
scanner or something,
this is not available
to a lot of people.
So it truly has to be a holistic
experience on your phone.
And we also go off feedback.
A lot of American companies
here are constantly
trying to get feedback,
engage people in studies.
Lucky for us, Africans will tell
you exactly what they think.
You don't have to ask them.
If you go to the
Google Play Store,
we have over 1,000
reviews of people
we didn't solicit,
telling us what
they thought about our app.
Mostly, it's good
things, it's great.
But there's always things
for you to improve.
So thinking about the user
is almost revolutionary
when you think about
emerging markets or Africa.
Because everyone is
thinking about kind
of taking what works here
and just planting it there.
But having a conversation
and a feedback
with people who actually
use it is revolutionary.
JONATHAN KOLA: So in that vein
of thinking about your users,
do you have a sense in
the different domains
you're working about what
technologies dominate in terms
of things that, whether it's
business or student or just
the general consumer, what
technologies kind of dominates
in the different markets
you're working with?
ABBEY WEMIMO: Yeah, I can start.
Finance, obviously, is one big
one on the continent right now.
[INAUDIBLE] alluded
to now is access
to loans can easily be
captured within five minutes.
As long as you have the right
things plugged into a phone,
you can easily get
access to a loan.
There's a huge play
going on in Nigeria
specifically on credit
scoring, and Ghana.
A lot of the big
credit-rating agencies
around the world,
especially the Experians,
the TransUnions of
the world, are also
looking at those markets.
So access to capital, very,
very big, and then decision
making with the data they're
being able to capture
and that little
markets they've created
from the loans being
provided has also
been very, very big for us.
It's more or less,
like, how do you
continue to help the end
customer of saving capital
and having more cash flow?
So we have access to a lot
of interesting data sets,
I would say.
And the inference we can
make from those data sets
is at a 95% confident level.
So it's very reliable
information now.
We can predict people's
behavior with that.
So our focus is how do we
leverage those data points
for good and continue to move
the frontiers of people's
personal finance forward?
MICHAEL RAIN: I'll say not
because I'm here but Android
is a very important technology.
I forget the source,
but apparently
over 80% of people on
the African continent
access their internet
through an Android device.
That includes laptops and
all of those other things.
So that's pretty dominant.
Social media is also a very
important technology because
of how people use it.
So a lot of people
use Twitter to replace
text messaging to save on data
and rates on the continent.
So social and
Android definitely.
EYITEMI POPO: So I
would say since I'm
focused on a
data-science academy,
there are a lot
of trends in data.
So Greg knows with big
data, machine learning, AI,
those are things that
we're trying to prepare
our students to thrive in.
I'm head of partnerships, and
we're just getting to the point
where our students have
learned enough that they
want real-world experience.
And so there are so many
startups on the continent--
I mean, Esusu's one.
Asoko's another that work with
data that can really leverage
our students to do more.
There is a company in Congo.
It's called Stats
Congo, and they
use data to better predict
health outcomes for women
and children.
We're working with another
one in Nigeria called Ubenwa,
and they're using
machine learning
to detect babies' cries to
prevent SIDS, Sudden Infant
Death Syndrome.
So there's so many
tech startups already
moving in that
direction, and that's
why we're trying
to prepare students
to be able to work
in those fields
so they're not always
outsourcing talent
from the content.
GREG COHEN: Just
on that point, I
think what's so
interesting about Africa
because of all the
challenges is the innovation.
I just met somebody
on my last trip
who used the same
technology behind Shazam
to detect tuberculosis,
which is very interesting.
ABBEY WEMIMO: Kenya
and [INAUDIBLE]..
GREG COHEN: Yeah, which you
hear these stories all the time,
right?
I would say, yes,
trendwise, I'm always
envious when I hear
people in the fintech--
Abbey talking about
the machine learning
and the AI on the retail side
because there's so much data
available and you're seeing so
much consumer spending habits.
It's very hard to do
that on the business side
because you don't have a
single point of payment
that you're able to analyze.
So what's interesting for us
is our next phase of growth
is can we cross-reference
all sorts of signals
to create a credit
score for a company
without access to their
financial information?
And this is something that
we're continuously looking at
based on what sector they're in,
what region, the age of their--
the quality of their
shareholders, et cetera.
So that's something
that we're looking at.
More specifically, now we
use Neo4j and the ability
to connect different
entities on a database,
particularly for
private companies
and owners in Africa--
we've probably built the
most comprehensive ecosystem
of related entities across
East and West Africa.
So if you were to look at
Aliko Dangote, for example,
in our database,
we've organically
learned about all of
the different corporate
affiliations that he has
based on the different local
companies and entities that
we profiled independently.
So this technology has
become very useful for us.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK, so looking
within these walls of Google,
now that we're
sitting in Google--
many global tech
companies, Google included,
like to aim to
build for everybody.
It's something which we
talk about a lot, something
which we strive for.
Just based on your experience
through your perspective,
do you see a gap between
that goal and the way
products are actually
being received
in the African market from
these global tech companies?
ABBEY WEMIMO: It's a
very good question.
I think to start off, I would
really underscore Michael said.
Android has probably
contributed significantly
to the ecosystem from a finance
perspective and data capture.
What it has been able to do,
especially in low-data phones,
has been, in my
opinion, revolutionary.
And the data we have access
to is thanks in big part
to what the Android technology
has been able to do.
When we think about gaps, we
need to take it a step further.
GREG COHEN: Two steps.
[LAUGHTER]
ABBEY WEMIMO: I think we can
really build technologies,
especially when we think
about what Google does
with businesses, we can
really build technologies
that capture insights on
SMEs and then really helping
them get access to capital.
So just imagine a tool where
you can capture financial data.
So you can leverage
[INAUDIBLE] Nigeria,
for example, across
the continent
to capture pertinent
data on a business
and look at their cash flow,
look at their balance sheets,
look at their
weekly performance.
Let's get to that granular level
and understand the propensity
to get access to capital.
And if we're able
to do that, we're
able to unlock a lot of capital
that's not there right now,
and that business can thrive.
And when that
business thrives, they
can hire a bunch of
people on the continent
and we stop blaming
the government,
although the government
does have a role
to curate the environment.
But that's how we need
to think strategically.
There's a phase in going to
create some consumer products.
Albeit fantastic, but we need to
still understand the ecosystem
of our capital flow.
We need creators, so businesses
that are taking the first step
to take that leap of faith.
How do we support them?
And I think Google can play a
quintessential role creating
technologies that gets pertinent
data from the small businesses
on the tipping point, get
them access to capital,
and then explore that
businesses and give them
more opportunities to hire more
people, which in turn turns
tax dollars for the government.
There's a step further in terms
of what the government does
with that capital.
That's a discussion
for another day.
But that's what we
need to focus on.
And if Google can play
a role in curating
that kind of technology--
it's a lot of initial capital
investments for small
venture-backed startups
like us, but I think Google
can play a big role in that.
MICHAEL RAIN: I think
you can definitely
build for everyone
if you include
everyone in the building.
So one of the reasons
Android is so dominant
is because it's open
and people could just
build what they needed to
build on that platform.
That's how we got started.
My co-founder built that
app himself and could put it
in the Google Play
Store without friction,
and people could
just use it, right,
and that approach can
work across the world.
So as long as you include
everyone in the building
process, you can
build for everyone.
If you don't, there
will always be a gap.
GREG COHEN: So I would
say that there just
needs to be some
strategic vision when
it comes to the continent
to see the opportunity.
I mean, Google's invested
already on the continent,
but if you look at what some
of the top Chinese companies
are doing, if you
look at Huawei and how
come it's become so
pervasive, I mean,
the phones are designed for
the local context in Africa.
You can put in
multiple SIM cards
because sometimes one
of the telcos goes out
and you need to
use the other one.
They understand this.
It understands
darker complexions,
which American manufacturers
don't It's Swahili.
So from looking at this,
there's a reason why--
and it's obviously very cheap.
In 20 or so years--
I think you see these
statistics all the time--
Africa is going to be a quarter
of the global population.
This is the next story of
consumerism in the world.
So it's something
that I believe--
I've been talking with the
State Department for a while
now on the initiatives
under Trump about what he'll
be doing in Africa, and it's
still just not a top priority.
Then it's government, talking
about a few different things
now.
But overall, in
corporate America
it's not a strategic priority
to focus on this market.
And it's getting
there, but very slowly.
So it's a question of when this
becomes a strategic priority.
EYITEMI POPO: And to
go to Michael's point,
you said in order to
build for everyone,
everyone needs to be building.
And so for everyone
to be building,
they have to have those skills.
They have to have
those digital skills.
They have to know
different languages.
And again, that comes with
education and the skills
building and making sure that
Africa, which has the youngest
population in the world,
has people who are
able to build what they need.
JONATHAN KOLA:
Well, fortunately we
have a room full of
builders at Google
who can open up the floor now
for anybody with questions
for our panelists.
And we can also go
to the Dory if there
are any questions on the Dory.
AUDIENCE: And so the topic
of China just came up.
Lots of questions there.
So I think China increasingly
is finding a market in Africa
both for consumer products--
phones, clothing, et cetera--
but also for large-scale
infrastructure projects.
I'm recently using a
Chinese company to partner
up with the
government in Zimbabwe
to help with facial recognition
for use of government purposes.
Is there a conversation
happening currently
around consumer protection,
citizen production of data?
Like for example, in
the US, San Francisco
just banned facial-recognition
technology for use
by city agencies-- so for the
police department, et cetera.
Is that a concern
currently, and as people who
are kind of innovating in
the space, is that a topic
being had or a conversation
being had currently?
GREG COHEN: I mean, if I
go first, to be honest,
I have not heard that
in the conversation.
I think that's
probably a concern that
comes up after certain
infrastructure is really
put into place.
So I'm sure it will
be a concern soon,
but right now Chinese
money is very welcome.
[LAUGHTER]
I think the question
is just what
are the terms on that
money is the debate.
So that's my short
answer to that question.
ABBEY WEMIMO: Yeah.
I've done lots of research
on China-Africa [INAUDIBLE]..
It's interesting now.
It's brought the limelight.
China-Africa engagement actually
started the full boom in 2000
under the [? FOCACI ?]
agreement, the Forum
on China-Africa Cooperation.
And then they have this biannual
conversations every year,
and that's when they talk
about the investments going on
in the continent.
When we think
about data, I think
Uganda has done a
very good job in terms
of creating the equivalent
of what you call the Consumer
Financial Protection Bureau.
And they're really thinking
about being even a step further
thinking about blockchain.
I know that will play a
big role in the landscape.
But when I think
about data protection,
that's why it's very,
very important for us
as entrepreneurs,
as innovators not
to just go into the landscape
and think about consumer
products or business products.
We need to work concomitantly
with the government
to help them think through
privacy, consumer protection,
and then what big data is going
to do it because it's scary.
Eventually we're going to
have data computers talking
to each other, and that's
how they do transactions.
We've already seen
stuff like that
and currently do
that today, but we
need to walk alongside
the institutions
to help them curate
the right laws.
It shouldn't be a
copy-and-paste approach.
It should really be ideographic
rules and regulation
that can really help propel
those economies forward
without other forces
having a different agenda.
MICHAEL RAIN: Putting
my journalist cap on,
I've had a lot of
conversations with people
concerned about this issue and
know it very well in emerging
markets, particularly on
the African continent.
And it's not a
welcome conversation
with a lot of people
in government.
There are governments who
turn off the internet in parts
of the country, sometimes as
a precaution around elections,
sometimes as punishment.
It's definitely a
conversation that
needs to be had sometimes
with government but definitely
with people.
I don't think people
understand what's going on
and the effects of
it and the danger.
So we should all be
having this conversation.
AUDIENCE: I guess
my follow on is
who is concerned about privacy?
Where do the concerns come from?
Where do you see the
gaps, and who do you
think should be considered?
MICHAEL RAIN: Well, journalists
are definitely concerned.
It's a big issue,
particularly how governments
are leveraging it on people.
In emerging markets,
there's another layer
of how independent
businesses are using this
and whether people really
understand their privacy.
I think the best-reported stuff
is probably around WhatsApp
and what's going on in
India, those elections.
But in journalist circles, we're
definitely talking about it.
A lot of people don't want to
talk to us about it though.
ABBEY WEMIMO: I think
I can say something
on financial technology,
and it's tough.
We had an investor, which
obviously I won't name,
that offered an interesting
proposition that
said, oh, just
capture fingerprints
and a whole bunch
of data and we're
going to give you capital to
do that, and just give freebies
for people to supply you
that data without what
we call the caveat emptor,
buyers beware of what's
actually going on.
We decide to say no to that
kind of draconian capital,
in my opinion.
But the concerns of what's
going on right now, especially
in places like
Kenya where you have
what I like to call a
neo-payday-loan lenders whereby
you tap a button and five
minutes you get a loan,
and then you don't have
education on exactly
the ramifications of that loan.
Is he going to report that to
TransUnion, Experian, Equifax,
and what does that do
to your credit ratings,
and how long does that
stay on your record?
That conversation
is not being had,
which is utterly frustrating.
Everyone is thinking about
the short term, which
is access to capital, but
not the financial health
of the individuals.
It's quite sad.
The governments also are just
very excited about growth.
But there's a
fundamental difference
if we build these institutions
on the sinking sand
or we should build on
a solid foundation,
and that's the conversation
we need to have.
And if he want to
build a doghouse,
let's build it very well before
we graduate to the White House.
But right now we're building in
a very, very fancy institution
on the sinking
sand, in my opinion,
from a data-privacy perspective.
EYITEMI POPO: And just
for me, from conversations
I've had with startup founders,
since there isn't really
government regulation
around it yet, it
is incumbent on
the startup founder
to use their moral
code to figure out
how much is too much because
the consumer-- especially
the consumer is maybe in a
rural area, isn't educated,
they don't care either way
or they don't know to care.
And so a lot of the onus does
fall on the startup founders
and how to model it.
GREG COHEN: I would just add
that a lot of African countries
have the real opportunity
to draft legislation
that's a lot more in line with--
a lot of discussion right now
is importing the GDPR standards
from Europe, and they're
such misguided policies
within that framework,
and it should not
be imported to a variety
of other countries.
So I just agree that
the conversation needs
to be a higher priority and that
entrepreneurs need to keep--
that's one of the fun
things about being
an entrepreneur on the continent
is you're also a lobbyist.
So you need to push the
government as hard as you
are building your business.
AUDIENCE: Why do you
think that people
across the continent of Africa
are engaging with local news is
sort of what I'm wondering.
Because I think-- well, at least
in the more developed countries
there's more of a pullback
in terms of only looking
at the global context rather
than the local context,
and I'm sort of wondering what
that means, like the phrase
you used, I guess,
in particular,
what that means in
terms of how you
view engagement or monetization
or sort of the business
of the app itself?
MICHAEL RAIN: Can you
repeat the first question?
What about local news?
AUDIENCE: Why do
you think people
are engaging more
with local news
rather than here,
for example, where
the only companies of repute
are like the "New York
Times" or "Washington Post"?
MICHAEL RAIN: So I would
argue all people care
about local news.
We just take for granted
how much local news
we have access to.
So media in this
country is ubiquitous.
It's just everywhere
for us, whether it's
on television or our phones or
on a paper or people talking
about it.
It's just there.
But in other parts
of the world, it's
just not that easy to
know what's going on
or to get that context.
The reason local
news in particular
is salient on the continent
is because a lot of mainstream
news is still dominated by--
the, quote, unquote, most
trusted news source in Africa
is CNN, right?
So it's people who
are not you telling
you what's going
on in the world,
telling you what's going
on in your country.
So people are more interested
in what their own people are
saying about the news.
It's really that simple.
AUDIENCE: This question might
be most relevant to Greg,
but I know that when you
spoke earlier about how
Ghana and I believe
you mentioned
Uganda were doing
better in terms
of trying to aggregate data--
better than Nigeria,
for instance.
And I know that the
Nigerian government
started this ideal of doing
an action plan for ease
of doing business.
And I'm curious
about whether or not
the problem stems in the
legislation or execution?
And then in alignment
with what you do,
do you work directly
with businesses,
or are you partnering
with the national--
I know that there is
a national ministry
to collect data, for instance.
Where is your data coming from,
and what are the roadblocks?
Because I think we've talked
about this so many times
when it comes to
Africa that data
is so sparse and expensive,
but where exactly do we
go in to address the problem?
Is it with the
businesses directly?
Is it with the legislation?
Where is the problem?
GREG COHEN: Sure.
So I guess a few parts.
One is depending on how
much central control
the government has is how
efficient the solutions can be.
I think that's we're
at the stage right now.
So in a place like
Nigeria, there
is a will from
certain stakeholders
to do certain types of solutions
to centralize the repository
and then to make it transparent
for the global business
environment.
But certain stakeholders
have vested interests,
and it becomes a very
difficult process
to just build a solution.
So we've been talking with
folks for a long time,
and things have just
stalled, for example.
So that's in a particular
country like Nigeria,
but there are certain areas
where there is momentum.
In a place like Rwanda, it's a
different type of a government.
You have Kagame who has
significant authority
over everything that happens,
and he makes a decision,
and the decision gets executed.
So these are the
types of dynamics
that make it pretty simplistic.
With regards to how
we collect the data,
so we have to unlock any
type of silo that there is.
So certain government
agencies will have data.
And if they're willing to share
it, then we would collect it.
We'll also buy data
from private entities,
commercial entities where
we'll have arrangements with
third-party researchers
who have that information--
and then certain civil-society
organizations as well.
So the idea is that anywhere
where there is information,
we want to be able
to get access to it.
So I think the answer is,
without saying a cop-out,
it's both there needs to be the
regulatory governmental push,
and I think that is fundamental.
But you do need to
have innovation coming
from the private sector that
understands how to navigate
these types of environments
to get to a solution
because the government
won't solve it on its own.
And you can see from just
the crops of entrepreneurs
that are coming up who are
looking at these problems,
the governments
understand that they
need to work with
them if they want
to do anything efficiently.
AUDIENCE: What do you see the
impact of the African Union
in terms of there's a new
African Union passport?
There's a new EU-like
economic arrangement
to have transnational
business and things like that.
What is the impact of
that in terms of identity,
regulation, and how
it affects tech,
and Africa's perspective to
orchestrate the tech market
and compete globally?
That's one.
To Greg, there's also
a cultural context
in most parts of Africa, maybe
specifically for Nigeria,
whereby we don't
like to share data.
So we all know that
in Nigeria it's
assumed that the world's richest
black man is Aliko Dangote,
but we all know that there
are people that are richer
than Aliko Dangote in Nigeria.
Because why?
People keep their
money [INAUDIBLE]..
So how do you not
get that whereby
it's a taboo to share
especially financial [INAUDIBLE]
information or data or stacked
even within enterprises?
GREG COHEN: I can
take the second part,
and then I think
Michael, probably best
if you take the first part.
And this, I think, is
incumbent on the government
because it's true.
Until there is an incentive
in place to be transparent,
there is no reason
that a company should
want to provide its data.
You become a taxation target,
and this is the implications
on the continent right now.
Why would you, if
you're making money--
the government is not supporting
you in any way, right?
Here, despite all
of our opinions
perhaps about government,
there is an innate trust.
When you pay your taxes,
social services come to you.
There's a whole
variety of benefits
that you have with that
contract with government.
And that's not the case in a
number of African countries
yet.
And until there is a route to
financing that becomes clear,
companies will not feel the
need to provide their data.
And we learned
this the hard way.
We tried to just get
companies to submit data,
and the answer was no.
So then we said, all right,
why don't we provide--
then we have a new product
now called the Dealbook
where we say, look, if you
provide us with your data,
we will put you in front
of global financiers
that are looking to
invest in Africa.
And all of a sudden we
have thousands of companies
providing us with data, right?
So I think there's simple
solutions that governments
can put into place to show that
if you formalize-- and this is
a whole other question
with development is
the reason the informal
sector is the way it is
is because there's more
benefits to being informal.
So the government has a
big role to play there.
MICHAEL RAIN: The first
part was about the African
Union or the passport.
I'm optimistic about it.
To me, probably
the biggest thing
that can happen in my lifetime
on the African continent
is African countries actually
trading with each other.
So hopefully that can come
with travel and there actually
being direct travel
routes and not
having to fly to Europe to fly
back to go to another country.
It's insane, but that can
be built through travel.
We take it for granted here
in the US with 50 states,
but a lot of that cohesion comes
from having a highway system.
So it's a step forward.
We'll see 50 years from now
what that's going to look like.
ABBEY WEMIMO: Yeah,
I can answer that.
I think for African
Union we also
need to see digital identity.
So now imagine you have your
credit score in Nigeria.
You go to Uganda, and then you
can borrow money against that.
So that ability to be a
convenient environment--
for data privacy,
I think it will
be interesting to have a
open-data initiative curated
by the African Union.
And what that
looks like, there's
a lot of conversations
that can be had.
And that can had sequel
to this conversation.
GREG COHEN: I think there's
a free-trade agreement that
was just negotiated,
and it's going
to take a long time before
it has its full effect.
But once it does, and
hopefully it does,
Africa becomes dangerous.
When you unify the continent and
have a full integrated trading
system with the largest
consumer base and everybody
can trade freely, then
finally it becomes a story
that it should be.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK, now
we'll take those two
as the last questions.
AUDIENCE: So I actually work
on the Africa marketing team,
so I'm coming to find you.
But I'm just curious, so in
terms of growing your user
or customer base, whether
it's a business or a consumer,
I'm just wondering
what you consider
to be your single biggest
challenge in reaching them,
educating them, converting them.
EYITEMI POPO: I can take that.
So for me, our B2C
model right now-- we've
actually explored
the B2B model, and we
did go into investment banks
in Lagos, tech companies,
and we gave them the
patch and we said,
we want to train the women in
your companies to level up.
And then let's meet
your data team.
There are no women
on the data team.
Let's meet your IT team.
No women.
So it goes from a
problem of just thinking
that you can have this
educational product to actually
then building an
entire talent pipeline
and then teaching people or
do diversity and inclusion
training, explaining why you
should have women on data teams
and women in IT
But as much as that is
a challenge in order
for us to scale, it's
also an opportunity
because you get to not just
create this product that
sits on its own or offer
this singular service,
but you're not
creating a system,
and that's what's so
great about innovating
on the African continent.
So now if we design a talent
pipeline, once our students
graduate and we're
placing them in companies,
we're able to help them
negotiate better salaries.
We're able to
inform what it means
to be a woman in the workforce
in tech, and that's amazing.
And so as much as it's difficult
right now when we're still
trying to figure out how
to scale up, especially
because of the financial
constraints of our consumers,
there's so many different ways
that we can go and so much more
that we can do.
ABBEY WEMIMO: Yeah,
I think two things.
We do a lot of growth
hacking and then
trying as much as possible to
offer incentives for people
to sign up for stuff.
The B2C angle is still expensive
because customer-acquisition
costs, regardless, B2C
is just cost prohibitive.
So one of the things
we look at is actually
working with B2B partners.
A classic example
from a fintech player
would be majority of people
have some sort of bank account
or mobile money partner with
the telecommunication networks
on their bank.
Provide some sort of value
proposition for them,
and then you have a
huge market penetration.
Those conversations
do take a lot of time,
but it's better to
allocate your capital
in building those
right relationships
so you can have a
good foundation.
So that's number one.
Number two, I continue
to drill down on this.
Working with
institutions matter.
I've been involved in
my previous company
where I worked for over a
decade in the water space, which
our company was eventually
acquired by a government,
and they are running
good operations when
it comes to infrastructure now.
And really working
alongside these institutions
and showing them ultimately
it is in your best interest
and there won't be
political instability
if you do invest in
working with innovators.
So there's one piece telling
them what is a need for them
and helping them create
the right structure.
So if you're interested in
doing business on the continent,
you need to be a curator or,
like Greg said, be a lobbyist
that help people write
certain bills in some cases.
But your main
agenda is how do we
move the frontiers of the
country forward, number one,
and then your business will
thrive in that regard also.
MICHAEL RAIN: Yeah,
I'll just piggyback off
of what both of them
said, that people
have to be a part of whatever
campaign that you're using.
It cannot be completely
digital in Africa.
ABBEY WEMIMO: True.
AUDIENCE: How
developed would you
say the field of user
experience is in Africa?
What processes are in place?
What processes do
take to make sure
that your products
that you're building
are usable both
locally and globally,
and how easy is it to access
user-experience professionals--
so user researchers, designers,
and things like that?
What does that look
like currently?
ABBEY WEMIMO: We build products
so people can have access
to-- it's a fantastic question.
The reason why we are in
expansion aggressively
into the three countries
where we're going into now
and continue to work with
our institutions because
of a lot of demand from people.
Folks are saying, how
do I leverage this app
or how to access it?
What's the value proposition?
And what we quickly
did from a user
sort of feedback
standpoint and user design,
we gave them our
technology and said,
are you willing to
be a tester and then
really capture user stories.
Our product designers
worked alongside them.
But when we think
about the ecosystem,
there are tech companies
that do curate that space,
but they have the Andelas of
the world do supply technology.
A good friend of mine
runs a company called
Think-it based out of Tunisia.
They do a lot of good work
when it comes to user test
and also [INAUDIBLE]
hubs, but you
have to know folks
to essentially
have access to them.
But it's still hard, and there's
a huge market opportunity,
especially for big
companies going--
talk to Asoko Insights.
They tell you you're
doing market entry,
and then connect with them
to have user experience.
Capture users' stories to
create ideal graphic products
for folks there actually
in the particular country.
I think it's a good market
opportunity you've identified.
Go do it.
JONATHAN KOLA: OK, thank you
Greg, Eyitemi, Abbey, Michael.
We applaud you for
all of your efforts.
Thank you for sharing
your insights with us,
for taking your time to come
and share with us today.
I thank everybody for engaging
with us in this session.
I hope it was useful,
and it's a wrap.
[APPLAUSE]
