Alright, let's go to Ann in Mississippi.
Ann, welcome to Stand to Reason.
Thank you, I appreciate it.
You're welcome.
My question would be, and I'm not
terribly familiar with your show, and
maybe this is common knowledge, but I'm
curious as to how many foster children
you personally are raising in your home
and how many the author of this book is
raising in his home. I understand
your need to value human life, but do you
feel any obligation to these children
once they're here?
Well, I'll answer the
question in a straightforward fashion
and to what we are doing, both Scott
and I, and I know Scott personally,
so I can I can answer specifically for
him, but then I also want to discuss
after I answer it, I want to discuss with
you maybe the point behind the question,
and I'm sure you'll be willing to chat
about that a little bit. In my case, I
have two children that I've adopted out
of crisis pregnancies, all right?
And Scott has about four of his own so
he hasn't maybe—yeah, four of his own, so
he hasn't adopted any. He's got his hands
full. However, what both of us do is we
travel around the country, he more than I,
and we assist crisis pregnancy training—
crisis pregnancy centers, excuse me—in
raising funds so that they can offer
services free of charge to women who are
in crisis pregnancies who choose to keep
their children. So we are actually doing
quite a bit to to meet that particular
need. Does the answer satisfy you, Ann?
I understand your point, and I see that you
are directing energy toward your goal—
Wait, I wasn't making a point,
Ann, I wasn't making a point, I was
answering the question which was a kind
of a challenge, and so I want to know, are
you satisfied now that I'm doing enough
for those babies that are born since I'm
a pro-lifer?
My personal conviction would be no.
Oh so I would have, I should what—how many should I adopt before I can be
justified in campaigning against
abortion?
Well, I think you can campaign all you
want I obviously nobody thinks it's a
great idea for babies to not be here. I'm
not arguing w— I don't think anybody in
their right mind thinks abortion is a
great idea, but I'm, I guess I'm pondering,
you all have such focus, and talent, and
energy, and obvious resources, and yet the
gentleman who was just on the show with
you from Atlanta, funny enough, I teach in
Atlanta and I have, for instance, a little
girl in my classroom this year who's
being sexually molested who has been
covered in lice since the first day of
school, who shows up hungry, and yet
she can't be taken from her home because
there's not a foster placement for her,
and they do not consider her to be in
imminent danger.
Okay, I'm not sure what
that particular point has to do
with our prior discussion, first of all.
And secondly, I'm still mystified as to
why the challenge that you offered me
about what am I doing for
those children that are born, why my
answer, that I regularly raise money
for organizations to give a help to
women in crisis pregnancies and I've
adopted two children out of crisis
pregnancy myself, I'm wondering why that
isn't in the least bit apparently
satisfying to you.
Obviously you've done
something, but what about those children once—
Something?
I understand you need to—I'm not trying to
offend you, I'm really not. This is a
question, though, that always is in the
back of my mind when I hear people being—
No, I understand—
—militant about these babies need
to be brought here so my question—
Well, there's nothing militant that we've done here.
Where is the obligation if this mother didn't go
through one of your trainings and chose
to have this baby—
Let me answer the question—
—where are these children being helped?
Okay, let me answer the question.
First of all, it wasn't a militant
presentation. It was a
discussion about the moral obligations
that we have not to take the life of
innocent human beings. Now, what was
raised in the process, though, in your
question, you know, I understand the point,
generally, though you didn't say this,
though, my suspicion is that you meant to
infer it, and you can correct me if I'm
wrong, that if we are not willing to care
for those children that come in the
world, then we really don't have any
right to be campaigning against women
who wants to have abortion. And I don't
accept that moral equation. But even if I
did, I have done, I would say, quite a
bit to meet the challenge, and that
is, to raise funds for people and to
adopt children. And it sounds to me like
you wouldn't be satisfied unless I raise
funds for every woman in crisis
pregnancies or adopted every child which,
obviously, would be ludicrous.
Obviously, that's not an option.
Okay, yes,
but then I don't understand why you're
not at least marginally satisfied, in my
case, with my response.
I will give you that I'm marginally, marginally satisfied
with your response—
Okay, fair—
By the way, Ann, I'm not taking umbrage at the point. My
feelings aren't hurt. I am
concerned, though, so I'm not taking this
personally, but I am concerned about the
logic and reasoning that seems to be
sitting behind this, and that is, unless
we're willing to care for those children,
then we have no right to tell other
women not to kill them. This is not a
morally sound equation. Just because I'm
not willing to hire a slave doesn't mean
I can't object to somebody enslaving
another human being. Just because I'm not
willing to marry the woman that a man is
beating, his wife, doesn't mean that I
can't object to him beating her. And by
the same token, if the unborn is a human
being, we shouldn't be taking their lives
for the reasons that people have
abortion, and even if I don't adopt all
of those kids, I'm still within my rights
to say don't abuse that child. That's
basically—
Obviously, that's a well-researched
argument on on your part, and I
give you credit for that. It is logical.
It is logical, and yes, just earlier you
said these children, and I believe the
distinction was the children are made in
the image of God, and that is what makes
it necessary, obviously, to save all of
them.
No, that's why we should value their lives, right.
Yes, that's why we should—
thank you because I missed your phrasing
and that was better than what I was
going to say. Yes, we should value their
lives. Does that
obligation to value them end—and not you,
personally—I guess my question then
becomes—it's now evolving through
conversation—is there something in
this book and is there something in your
movement that suggests once people have
adopted this philosophy and are going
forth to further it, are they doing
anything for these children that are
already here—
That's a fair question.
Is that part of the process?
Yeah, It is. And I've actually partially
answered
that question. You may be
surprised to hear this, but there are
actually more crisis pregnancy centers
in the country than there are abortion
clinics.
Wait wait, Ann, I wasn't
quite making the point I finished
because I want to make sure that you—that the answer registers before you
jump on to another another statement and
that is, is there anything in your
movement, you asked me, that goes further,
essentially, than just says, "You can't
have an abortion," what about taking care
of these kids? And then I said actually,
there are more crisis pregnancy centers
that are funded by private individuals,
not by money they get from their
services like abortion clinics, that are
doing that very thing. And by contrast,
there is virtually none of those things
that are happening like that in the
pro-choice crowd. Therefor, the
pro-choice crowd is not really
pro-choice. It turns out to be
functionally pro-abortion.
So that statistic alone meets your
challenge, it seems to me.
The fact that there are all these crisis
pregnancy centers that are operating
with the funds from people who give
money so that women could be cared for
for free. So yes, we are doing something.
It's organized. We've been doing it for a
long time.
Okay, so once the pregnancy is
over and the child is here,
how much further contact or how much
obligation is there for the rest of this
child's life?
How much follow-up is there? What about
children that didn't go through one of
the centers?
Okay. Yes, I'll give one
more answer to this, and I'm
going to have to move on, but also, and
the reason that I'm only going to give
you one more answer is because I'm
getting the feeling that no matter what
I said to you, no matter how much is done,
no matter how many children are cared
for, you can still find someone left
behind that you can complain about
instead of tipping your hat to a massive
number of pro-life people who are doing
way beyond, above and beyond the call of
duty to help these children that they're
saying that we should be
rescuing and not killing. So
here is the one more thing. My wife, for
20 years—this is personal, it's my family—
has been running a support group for
single moms. She calls it the single mom
care group. They meet twice a month. They
have a potluck, they have encouragement,
they have a craft, they have a speaker,
they have child care, so they get away. So
these are all women who went through
crisis pregnancies who are now raising
their children and we are still trying
to do what we can for them. Let me ask
you a question just to finish up, and
it's just a simple yes or no would be fine.
Are you satisfied yet?
No.
Okay. Fair enough, Ann. I'll give you the last
word. Thank you so much for the call. It
was a very—it was a good, and
interesting, and challenging one.
