Mm-hm
We're continuing the conversation. I just
wanted to mention again that part of what
we're doing with all of this is that we're
documenting WHO were documenting at all. As
you know with the camera crews that we've
got here and also where we have our ongoing
website that emerged from the exhibit site
last year. And we're actually coming out with
a new improved site and we're going to be
posting these segments edited segments onto
that site. But we're also hoping to add more
material to it. And part of what I'm hearing
and part of what our intention had been is
that we're all coming from very particularist
and kind of academic scholarship backgrounds
but also different kinds of practices and
different kinds of. We're bringing different
kinds of analogous to this situation from
our families what we're dealing with in high
school and I really hope you guys who come
back. Welcome back. By the way. You guys are
also going to consider contributing to the
website also because I'd love to have you
guys have your perspectives in in that as
well this will be a continuing conversation
in that way which brings people from very
different places who normally are not in conversation.
La Times are in these silos and that's who
we're talking with and only. But this is not
about that. Alright so this is really about
trying to link and trying to kind of speak
to larger and larger audiences. At one time
I heard that one out of five people had lived
in Brooklyn who live in this country have
lived in Brooklyn. Their families have lived
in Brookline or been from Brooklyn at one
time or another. I'm hoping that in some ways
we can start. We piecing together Humpty Dumpty
the eugenics Humpty Dumpty. That kind of smashed
everybody into pieces in some ways and the
fragments of somebody who's dealing with disability
rights and somebody to dealing with the the
horrible consequences of high-stakes testing.
And somebody else who's dealing with immigration
laws et cetera et cetera et cetera can be
coming back together again to understand that
there are some shared common struggles and
roots historically of what we're dealing with.
So that's what this site is meant to do. We're
trying to help make that happen. So so looking
forward to the conversation today I think
it's just going to get richer and better.
And I want to welcome timing pico to the stand
And here having this came home last year marking
Noel had become into the hunter files which
was the the eugenics is work in response to
it. And the thing is at the time I was also
writing my second book which is a book long
poem called nature poem. It's kind of about
being from in any reservation and why I care
poetry because it's like stereotypical when
feeds into a bunch of ********. By then I
start folding where they made for them into
this book. So I'm just going to read you a
short excerpt from it that I think illustrates
my experience of the exhibit and then also
back to the book that I was working on in
the first place you guys thrown into your
home. The stars are like always in far away.
What you see look into is a jet from light
years but also close like the sea stars. Because
There's no arms lesion and Na and pull away
the insides spill into the ocean. Massive
deaths. When I try to sleep by just thinking
about orange cliffs bear more stars nine glut
ways nuclear Lebanese and she sang fleas.
There are c goes overhead. I swear to myself
I will never read a nature poem. The sand
is fine. They say it's Nakashima. You will
find that undo illustrates the errors in a
DVD work out on YouTube and Hebrew are fit
and strong. She says raise like you're being
pulled apart. I think sometimes it sometimes
what you see is when glare there sometimes
in science they are Indian is a thing people
feel comfortable saying to me on days. What
rhymes with fog up and God is hard to look
at something. Most people. Remember that goes
but I understand the allure of one's knowledge
or it's. And this is a kind of equilibrium
when you feel at a flea in whiskey I just
read a lot of holes. Yeah guard is by AR is
the old mysteries of avail themselves of technique.
It's disheartening to hear someone say there's
no magic laughed because I love YouTube of
anyone now see LAS a losing game and the mercury
are worth it. Yesterday I overheard at Brooklyn
means broken lands. There aren't many earthquakes
in the city but there's the fault line and
paid is alienating but blue breath break you
out of voices the kind of magic that makes
people going wild. I learned to ask any person
who look like exactly Stars are characters
in the tome of the night sky which were more
decided green button. Now I'll just sit here
and think about what you a Beautiful Mind.
I just invented. When you start getting into
myself to acquire line it is a high school
math tests on violence situation. Tracing
shapes in stars is the closest I get to calling
a language mine. The ripening mega threes
that it is the information. Amy WiMAX namespace
it and our dishes. Blame my ideal power. Couple
name is Tom. But I'm pretty sure that aij
yj plus renewability casket. And I'd love
to miss myself through doors. I sit in the
pool and embed myself laughs and an attempt
to maneuver from a stinky kind of incestuous
sadness. Beauty immerses in occupied on there.
And an analogy works until I being. Why is
this so dn Barbaresco maneuver why does it
always with wrong right great. Grandparents
had almost no cause that will lead to share
a poem is the only place we're at illusion
myself some authority. Everyone remembers
the weather when discovering Irvine. I think
it's perfectly natural to look skyward. Lead
your home because the English this is complicit
in my slides erase your wife. Think about
poetry. It's a container for words like wireless
and hid her hair conduct something permanent
and universal interests. Pause like an apple
and turn it into this skin disease and the
core. They talk about gravity about Snow White
and still knowledge. The ABL driving new dresses
like Mill made. By share I won't give away
to a state remains a monad and **** on the
grass. Harker poetic form. Moons looking out
of a straw into the Chinese shop of grammar
and establish trust is dumped then gingerly
slip out unrelated ones. I bought a cab to
take me to the drive through a Cadillac in
the dining room close. I saw at logos that
Roy is leading me to begin diner on the formerly
Italian side branch tree. This is our media.
He says my great grandmother dreamed of Tin
Pan Alley and wrote a song ones with the chorus
yard. He says draw line j and loser. What's
already landscapes of the Interior in the
midst of worth to plu the mayor the radiant
energy onstage the tremor as well as the phase
difference between the faces of attention
and danger they gifted Clery repeat a known
quantities. Today is Wednesday. Wednesday
is a turkey burger. My throat is full of survivors
This trauma can be passed down molecular scar
tissue DNA cavorting with war and escape routes
and your dad. Dad I didn't hear disappear.
In the mid 18 hundreds California would pay
$5 for the head of an Indian and $0.25 per
scalp man woman or child. The state was reimbursed
by the Feds descended from clever stuff and
yet elevating an occupying force when contact
another swaps it snaps and other stolen sister
in the Rx and Ry the blah blah blah blah you
flush major bone because that conversation
happens in the hollows out there to people
at the American Museum of Natural History
which is flaky. So traditional GAR ones. Because
it really matters that were national natural
history. Hey also history although people
hey Friday is showing some redness or made
to save our history is lower. I'm sure you
really do to flower areas. There are certain
concept is easier than adding both your personal
and your class. Designation past formulas
like say more generally actually cheaper after
they die. We must reference alcohols like
I started drinking again my parameterization
Plan Charles about. So why don't you try in
my HER today that you might be in your size
tries California where drought years that
somehow consequences. The consequences or
whoever is using some are. Some people will
always remain remain calm. Buddhist go in
his face. I buggy Chaplin. I'm aware that
in frame B that is my profits Washington Kahoo's
stream wise. Mom part realize despite history
your own routes from Vera King by whomever
that goes and Anthony for at least 100 years
of history were foreign Sharp warned ma silent
grace upon specific Northwest is this and
each of you here versus in today's world and
rather than each evolves as through I thought
I would never read ancient form last year.
I need nature. As a new something small sigma.
We eat Asian. Places have thoughts hills have
that's the stroke by our eyes. The river goggles
there are tracks for that also valid say no
love for. The tear up a little bit more stellar
sugars. She flies and beans. I agree. Flatbed
aggregate as that I felt let's say I live
in NYC let's say versus invite graduate college
let's say. And I watch you grow on Google.
This is the difference. So CHS or where I
see lungs side other also for laser holes.
When a star dies it behooves any number of
things like a black hole or a documentary
the early years of our state was remarkably.
So now I stand in a rapid cuisine and angularity
diverse are supported Iraqi. Wanes as our
sky is really the same as it was for them
which isn't very cellular inheritance. I don't
know how. So that's how we survive long enough
to make the story more generally. But that
absence of idioms. So yes suggestion of me
is ultimately enacted home. So I started reading
stars that is fast foods are digested. So
that suddenly friends with benefits pose semesters
or if my god EBITDA especially diverse subjects
DR and heating them up in FASTQ files are
wired. To view. Well if announces rounding
down. Before I close my eyes at high warnings
in our hall for a voice Twitter right there
and interacting with asset versus Shack around
stillness openness for actually having to
go to moles. Breath I sound. Pretty freely
gave this stupidity friendly nation home that
is thoughtful base for myself. In it This
is the poem wanted all along. It's hard to
be a hazardous. When you feel Ryan whales
so many images in key areas the cigarettes
are our. Fortunately he's the silence over
the hill and my friend going those places
for AR. For basically this shows that emerged
around that we're in all things We've got
everybody Great. So here's here's what we're
doing. So we have four Framers who are going
to have eight minutes each. So some people
none of you. But some people think eight minutes
is 20 but this is not the true. The truth
is that eight minutes eight minutes. One more
than seven. Thank you got. Six plus two. Yeah.
So and Jack and I are going to be much more
aggressive than we were yesterday. We were
just kindly passing pieces of paper but today
we're just going to stand up and have you
sit down. So and why is that that is because
what we're trying to launch here's this conversation
and everybody has something to say. So we
want you to frame the conversation and launch
it but not. You know that's it. That's all
you need to do. And we're going to have five
people join us for the round table. So they
will each have five minutes and we're asking
to the students to join us but sort of as
a team. So you guys should work out how you're
doing how you're doing your five minutes.
That's cool awesome. So this is very exciting.
So let's go in alphabetical order because
that seems to work really well. So Katherine
bliss. Okay You still microphones but it doesn't
matter. I'm probably gonna hold it. But I'm
only going to take five minutes so I'm going
to be crazy here. So the thing that I brought
in for my my item or my artifact is my passport.
And what you'll see here is that it's an American
passport. And the significance to me is that
it's only an American passport. I only have
an American passport. Even though my parents
are from different countries My mom is from
Indonesia and my dad is from the US. I like
Indonesian VSA just fell out. Anyways a lot
of pieces are falling out so and so and I
have to pay for that everytime. So that's
kinda funny since I go there very frequently.
But my parents divorced when I was born and
so I grew up in an Indonesian household. It
was culturally ethnically Indonesian only
Indonesian. Yet we only spoke in are mostly
spoke English at home and didn't speak much
Indonesian because my mom was fearful that
I was going to develop an accent And so she
was grasping at my absentee At the time dad's
status. And so actually she couldn't hold
dual citizenship in Indonesia. That was the
policy at the time. I think they just changed
it last year but or maybe this year. But so
she decided that we were both going to be
American and only American. So that's why
I have only an American passport and that's
what I share with you today. The thing is
that as I got older it I was actually curious
about why I was categorized as such. So why
why was I categorized as American not Indonesian
Why was I categorize as you know the race
that I was categorized as. And so I turn that
into a scholarly pursuit which I'm going to
share with you today. And I really develop
this research program based on this curiosity
in this interests. And all of my research
looks at the ways that social categories of
race and gender and sexuality have become
biologists. And now I really study this in
terms of the present genome era. So how DNA
Science is doing this so you could slide.
So I bring this because I didn't bring a copy
of my book so that's what the book looks like.
But my first book Race decoded delved into
the lives and the abuse of genome mappers.
So the people who are leading these major
genome projects like the Human Genome Project.
You've heard of some of these projects. And
also the political arena and all the policies
that have been coming out in the last 25 years.
So I wanted to understand why DNA science
has really embraced social categories of race.
But why they've done so wise scientists have
done so in a way that has translated them
into something That's not really social anymore
but is rather biological and actually something
that's genetic or innately based in our genes.
So I was looking into the last again last
25 years. And what I found was that in the
early nineties when biomedicine and public
health came under the US government's policy
to use racial categories federal race categories
in research and in healthcare and healthcare
delivery. Scientists genome scientists of
the time we're actually immersed in this tradition
of calling themselves colorblind or race blind
scientists. So they said that race is something
that's going away where all mixing especially
here in the US. Us scientists were were really
vocal about how we were. We were going to
get rid of race. Race was something of the
past. And they they also said that race was
a bankrupt concept scientifically so there
wasn't a real scientific basis. The genome
is proving that there's no scientific foundation
for our social notion of race. So that was
the nineties. But by the mapping of the human
genome at the end of the decade. Scientists
of the genome really changed their tune. And
they did. So what I found what I write about
in the book is that they did so because there
are a lot of policy changes. So the NIH and
the FDA or the Food and Drug Administration
and the National Institutes of Health and
other parts of our public health system Began
to require that researchers actually report
the biology of drug dosage and drug response
based on these race categories based on the
government's race categories. And they also
flooded all of their Institutes. All of these
public health agencies with billions of dollars
to study racial health disparities and at
the same time to to understand genomics better
and to integrate genomics into whatever they
were studying. So if it was the National Eye
Institute studying glaucoma they said here's
a bunch of money. Now you can study the genomics
of glaucoma in African-American specifically.
So that's where you get this racialization
in a sense. So by the mid two thousands all
of the major international genome projects
like the Human Genome Project sampled by race.
And many leaders of these projects were planning
projects to look at genomic specifically or
look at DNA science specifically in specific
racial groups. So to have racial genome projects
different ones for different races. So what
I found was that these changes really happen
because there were a lot of efforts from activists
and academics who were Sorry I'm trying to
say that being colorblind array spine didn't
work. So they said you know this racial inequality
is important and we want you to to take note
of this. And scientists became Strategic of
their use of racial categories to create inclusion
to include minorities in their research. But
the big irony is that in getting these different
these different genome projects that are race-based
or racial. They have produce something that's
more akin to separate but equal medicine.
So what you see are a lot of race racial pills
pills that are just for a specific racer.
Also diagnostics and you see all those racial
genealogy hands-on TV. And you don't see organizing
against toxic neighborhoods and all of the
issues that really contribute to racial health
disparities. So you can change to the next
slide. So I'm still in process with my current
book socio genomics which looks at the new
science of the new genomic science of behavior
including the science of social genomics which
are like sciences like you might have heard
of Gino economics of geopolitics. So people
looking for the genes responsible for someone
going to college or someone going to prison
or getting married or single or being a Republican
or being a Democrat. So a couple of things
to report or that lake. You can see we actually
go to the next slide. So so social genomicists
look for genes for a range of behavioural
traits and and more and they do so using standard
genomic techniques that focus again on specific
racial groups. And while many of their findings
have not been explicit explicitly put in racial
terms. Some have and what you see in the literature
are studies that say things like Maoris are
genetically predisposed to aggression. Latinos
are predisposed to being gang bankers. Europeans
are predisposed to entrepreneurial ism Or
to high cognitive functioning. And the other
thing is I'm just really fast. There are range
of tests now out on the market. There are
tests for things like IQ EQ which is emotional
intelligence sports potential music potential
et cetera and test makers basically warn parents
that they're not going to that parents won't
raise their kids properly if they don't take
these tests. And they also say that tailoring
parenting and training and education to genomics
to the genomics of their children will produce
better citizens. So we're seeing some of this
language of racial eugenics that we've seen
in the past. So thanks a lot and we'll continue
on I'm just going to set my timer. Nice press
start and I didn't start yeah. Good morning
everyone. So yesterday I began by asking us
to think how the past can allow us to ask
questions about are present in particularly
around surveillance technologies. And I talked
about Lantern laws in New York City that would
regulate that black mixed-race and indigenous
people enslaved people would walk after dark
and unless they were accompanied by some white
person with a candle lit candor lightened
a lit candle and that was the law. And you
can see that as a precursor for say stop and
first practices. So 300 years later they had
these kind of same kind of regulatory technologies
happening. Any white person can then take
up that person without a candlelight a lantern
and arrest them and take them to the gals.
So I'm going to talk about particularly how
are bio-metric past can allow us to ask questions
about our bio-metric present. I'm gonna focus
on the presence right now. And so this was
in 2009 in Texas. These two workers were testing
out HP technologies facial automation. So
and what they found was they posted a video
to YouTube they call themselves black Desi
and white Wanda. When black Desi when white
wanda would use the camera it was able to
pan tilt zoom and follow her. But when as
he says when black Desi enters the frame the
facial recognition technology didn't work
and this is facial recognition technology
that is about automation. You can see. So
they took it to YouTube and end and really
offered a critique of this technology. If
we look at the next one this is something
that came up. I saw an old world star like
two weeks ago. And this was what they call
the race the sink. This is again if you think
of a biometrics is simply bio the body and
measurement. This was a measurement of asking
the question Is anybody there for automation
and what it found was they posted again onto
YouTube and other spaces and that when they
use this technology the White Hand the soap
would be able to come out and then the black
hands the soap wasn't working and it's and
it's the use of lights that disallowed this
person to engage in this technology not couldn't
wash their hands on stuff we move to the next
one. You see facial recognition sometimes
have using two like tag your friends on Facebook.
Sometimes it's a knee or sp2 for something.
We go to the next one here. You can tagging
again This is like a convenience. We we'd
sometimes we just think it's a it's a convenience
as we use these social media and other sites.
And I'm going to move to the next one. This
is Joshua Wong in our 2009. This is the Blink
Detection would used in cameras and she found
that asked the question Did somebody blink
and so we can think about this as some of
these technologies operating around the question
around a kind of prototypical whiteness. And
so the body that is imagined as the the body
that will use these technologies the ideal
body that they're designed for is the white
body or at least the light body. So you can
see that with black Desi and also with the
on the the sink. Now with this technology
here as well. And so then you have she posted
this onto her social media site and it got
a lot of take-up people questioning. What
is that stakes with these technologies that
don't necessarily recognize or where bodies
fail to enroll removed from that point. And
then you see the kind of mummification of
this critique that takes place. Um if we move
to one more again the meme of when blackness
enters the frame with computer vision. Well
what bodies are not seen by these computers
and sets I'm going to talk us. So this is
all around the category of bio-metric technology.
And we can think of biometric technology operating
in a few ways. One of them I spoke to you
about about automation is anybody there. It
also operates in the sense of verification
answering the question Are you who you say
you are it's also identification Hou Ru within
this massive enrolled people in a database.
A face in the crowd. Are you even enrolled
in this database and this might make use of
say iris scanning and retina scanning fingerprint
technology facial recognition perhaps gate
to how you walk is that could be one measure
that one's a bit tricky because you could
have on. You can walk you can sprain your
ankle new shoes different terrain. But so
all of these things operate as a kind of behavioral
or or guest physical or physiological way
of linking the body to identity. And if we
think about these operating under a prototypical
whiteness and prototypical able bodied ness
and maleness. They're often bodies that some
of these technologies they call them failure
to enroll. And that could be someone who's
fingerprints. Might not have fingerprints
right someone who comes into contact with
heavy caustic chemicals. Someone who might
work in a nail salon a mechanic or a massage
therapists that have their fingerprints have
been on unreadable. Someone who is working
with as I mentioned that caustic chemicals
or heavy hand washing. And unlike a hospital
or those types of things so certain bodies
fail to enroll. And so one of the things that
I to question this idea that the body is neutral
or these technologies are neutral. If I can
just move to the next one. This is a research
and development article around a biometric
technology and what they were trying to look
at is the idea of facial recognition used
for say in a casino or a large sporting event
They can match Gender and also race in terms
of classification. And so this particular
one found that when they were attempting to
match for gender and race the black women
would be read as men and the Asian men would
be read as women. So these kinds of long histories
of masculine Ising black women and feminized
in Asian men still kind of played into the
research and development of these technologies.
You'll notice that the prototypical black
man is Will Smith and the protocol Bogle.
White man is Tom. That's going to say Tom
Tom Cruise right and so both of these people
often appear in shows like TV shows like Mission
Impossible movies that make use of bio-metric
technology. So these are some of the ways
that we come to learn about these technologies
is useful as in the future and we come to
develop a popular bio-metric consciousness
through the watching of these films watching
them use these technologies as something that
is. For ease automation in part of the future.
So what I want to ask is that if I can get
the next slide is to have a critical bio-metric
consciousness. One that has informed public
debate about what happens when we give up
our fingerprints at a border or at a store
or for our work. So are they selling that
data if they say they don't sell that data.
Do they traded rent it share it with other
companies. And you can think about when you
use when you upload your pictures to Snapchat
Instagram and Facebook as falling under this
kinds of categories that we should question
I'm on the idea that we have to have accountability
by the state and by the publics that about
the private sector and to see bio-metric bio-metric
technology or at least the ownership of the
data when our bodies information about our
bodies is turned into digitized code we should
know the code or at least have access to it
or at least have the same amount of access
that the state might have private entity might
have on the third one is to kind of acknowledge
the connections between the past and our present
and how they kind of make how they link today.
And particularly when we think about say for
example my phone here which is telling me
I'm almost out of time after 14 seconds to
think about the idea of the kind of pull ten
or conflict minerals that that design and
that we need for these phones who go there
sorry about that. So I'm gonna stop there.
Maybe we can have a larger conversation I
later on. Thank you very much Alright well
good morning everyone. At first I want to
thank Jack and Mark and indeed for inviting
us all to be here together. The last couple
of days it's been really great. I'm especially
really just so happy to see the students here
yesterday and today. As I mentioned it myself
about my myself and my own work that it's
so important to have a mentor and I hear that
you have this amazing teacher named Miss grace
O'Keefe who This brought you know it's not.
So fine wonderful mentors like this. Ask questions.
This is how you develop what the sociologist
C Wright Mills called the sociological imagination.
The ability to connect your personal history
with larger social processes to understand
the interconnectedness. It gives you great
power. The ability to ask questions and to
and to challenge them and and change things.
So I'm so glad you're here and I look forward
to more conversations with you guys. So like
I said this this my book I didn't even realize
it until pretty much towards the end. How
much of it was actually influenced by my own
personal history so the book is about the
history of family reunification law in American
immigration policy from the mid 18 hundreds
to today. And sort of Chronicles the way in
which American policymakers have thought about
the family as being important or not for making
policy changes over time. And you know a family
is is you move up to the next one is an important
part of the conversation about immigration
reform. I think many of you are familiar with
this photo from just the other day. Little
Sophie came through the barricades and the
Pope lifted her up and she delivered a letter
asking that the pope remind Americans and
especially American lawmakers about the importance
of family unity. So this is often presented
as an important not only challenge in dealing
with how to address the estimate of 11.5 million
unauthorized immigrants in the US but also
concerns the refugee crisis also in Europe
and elsewhere family. Unity is an important
theme. Around human rights around pressing
policy matters such as immigration reform.
So I'm directly affected by this. Oops I'm
sorry. Yeah okay so I touched on the test.
Okay so the next picture I want you to look
at is this one and I'm on the bottom right.
This is a picture of two of my siblings. My
one of my older sisters in the back my brothers
to my immediate left and that's my cousin
then on the far left. But so that's me in
the right and I'm about age I think eight.
This was the summer I turned eight. And I
had been in the US by then bout a year and
a half. And by then we had been separated
from our mother for about for about a year
and a half and so and prior to that we had
been separate from my father for almost two
years. So the history of our migration and
settlement to the US was that my father first
came and then the four kids joined him two
years later and that our mother unfortunately
didn't join us till almost four years later.
So for and I mean there is a nice sort of
denom into my own history was which is that
eventually we were all settled and this was
the next generation born. That's my little
son 5-years ago when he was a baby. And that's
for one more. So we were part of this important
wave of immigration settlement in the US using
family unification. Family unification is
a very important feature of American immigration
about two-thirds of all and we're great authorize
immigration to the US is by family. Family
reunification about 70% of visas are reserved
for family unity And you can imagine in the
history of American immigration that if you
were to think about family unification as
a recent feature it suggests that we've had
a sort of liberalization of American immigration
policy. So some of these earlier laws were
touched upon yesterday. The exclusionary acts
against the Chinese against southern eastern
European immigrants. So if you think about
what happened in 1965 that may family reunification
a centerpiece of American immigration policy.
It looks as though we have a very progressive
expansive inclusive inclusionary policy no
doubt as I showed in the previous slide and
my own history it's been an important feature
of indeed helping immigrants to come to the
US and settle. But what I want to argue is
that their family education has always been
a feature. But And then one more sorry we're
going to go through this a little bit faster
that family unification I'm I argue in the
book can be part of exclusionary policies.
And so quickly to that next picture. This
is a cute little picture my my parents and
my son. But if you look in the next picture
oops sorry. So I had cropped it look at look
at what what's above my father's head. It
says do not enter. I don't even realize. That
was the original picture that do not enter.
And I thought was quite fitting the idea that
we don't want families to come and settle.
And what I want to sort of help frame in our
discussion is that increasingly we are using
bio-metric test DNA testing to test for families
and to question familial ties and the suitability
of families. So I just want to quickly mention
an example in 2006 the New York Times reported
on the story of this man. Forget now his last
name first name uhhh Sue who was Isaac OSU.
He had left behind for sons and Ghana. And
after he came to the US he apply for family
unification to bring over his four sons. Once
his wife had passed away the idea of going
back we're going back and forth had had died
with the death of his uh his wife. So he apply
for family unification first four sons and
did DNA testing to prove that his four sons
were indeed his when the results came back
six months later. And he learned that only
three of his four sons were biologically.
His one turned out to be not his biological
son. So he learned in that test result that
not only was his wife unfaithful but the bond
that he had new known to be that of his family
for two decades was completely broken. And
the only recourse he had for reuniting with
that fourth son was to apply for him as his
stepson. And this is not a trivial matter
as we move forward into the current period
as we make family unification such a vital
part of thinking about how we can sort of
have a policy of bringing people in but but
still maintaining what we call Secure borders
we're relying increasingly on these biometric
measurements to test for suitability of applicants
and for settlement. So one important feature
has been the use of these DNA technologies
and just want to finish with this slide about
how DHS is thinking of the use of DNA testing
as a way to make sure that we maintain border
security and make sure that the illegitimate
son of not not even sun not biological son
of a man like Mr. Isaac OSU is not allowed
to enter. So let's talk more about that further
Our next speaker is not actually officially
in the program but we're so glad he's here
John polo now but tell me how to say your
last name hierarchy. So here's a sociologist
an ethnographer here at NYU and he's interested
in questions of politics and culture Critical
Social Theory and cities. Thank you for joining
us. Well thank you for letting me crash your
event Jack and Mark and Mindy. And let me
congratulate I I heard from a lot of people
yesterday What a nice event it was and what
a nice way to fulfill the EPA's public mission
to have students from the public school district
here. I think that's just absolutely Wonderful.
This was not planned but I actually have an
object too which was going to get to the question
that I wanted to leave as my framing question.
And so this is a trusted traveler card global
entry card which I got by submitting to voluntary
background FBI background check about six
months ago. Because for years before I entered
I fell into a rabbit hole of being a person
of interest to Homeland Security. I was traveling
I don't know because it's a secret secret
sauce how they determine these things. But
I had driven to Canada on the day of the G8
protests and I posted something on Facebook
and then I flew out to Latin America the next
day. And trying to board the plane I began
to live a small nightmare of missing that
flight. That kind of weird interrogations
you have to go through having to plan to go
to the airport basically every time after
that that I flew every other time these four
S's came when my boarding pass which you're
special and you go to these interviews in
a separate room and you say things like I'd
like to call a lawyer and they all say things
like this is not law and order. You don't
get a lawyer here. You say things I ask why
am I on this list wire you bugging me and
they say well it could be random. It could
be your name is like someone's name that we're
interested in. Or maybe you want to tell us
why you're here today. So this was a nightmare
for quite awhile. And then and this is the
sort of provocation I would like to. And then
a lot of folks suggested as the sort of liberal
solution to this which sometimes the New York
Times likes to do Sometimes people at our
University talk about which is a solution
to some of the problems of this algorithmic
governance which is like decision-making by
machine. So we've talked about surveillance.
We've talked about biometrics are eugenics
but algorithmic governance. This idea that
the computer algorithm is going to make decisions
for us. The solutions for its failures is
more of a you just got to put more data into
the system so that you get a better result.
Obviously this is a mistake go to the FBI
and do the voluntary background check. I felt
very uneasy about this until the corporate
overlord that I work for bought a 100 of these
are trusted traveler cards from homeland security.
And we got this email saying Hey we got a
100 of these for free just do the voluntary
background check. So I did it. It was an uninteresting
process and then I got the car and I've been
able to fly ever since. And but I do worry
and this is why I love the way Simon put it
as how do we have a critical what is the critical
discussion about these things look like. We
live in a world of biometrics surveillance
and algorithm right there's one narrative
which says look we just need more information
and better surveillance so that there's no
hiccups. But I'm fair skin Latin American
immigrant. I have resources I work for a corporate
overlord. I'm not Muslim. In many ways. My
life was never going to be that difficult
to begin with. I know many more horrible stories
of people who've also applied for this and
just simply haven't denied for no reason.
And now they can never ever fly. Right so
what is that critical discussion look like
for example I think the case of body cams
and police officers. An interesting case for
us to think about sometimes write exposing
the police in this arbitrary behaviors to
surveillance and tracking seems interesting
right it seems like something that we want
in Brazil where I come from to this day the
military police when they go on on patrol
in the countries largely policed by these
military type officers. They take off their
name tags on Velcro. They take it off and
they leave it at the station and every morning
they wrote take their weapons. So your weapon
is randomly assigned to you. So there's no
ballistics evidence. Should you decide to
shoot a black person or ten or 20 right one
of the things that human rights activists
want is surveillance is tracking is a kind
of it's in. So there's situations like that.
Another example here from New York City that
I've heard about recently is a group of hackers
has been putting together an app that lets
you see a building's rental history right
away. So when you're talking to a landlord
and they say this has never been regulated.
You can quickly look. So there's lots of cases
like that. That's obviously very very different
than some of these other cases. But how do
we critically deal with these technologies
and how and in what does that space of conversation
look like there's some of it that we can't
understand I mean some of the algorithms are
very complex and when the technology is very
very difficult. So maybe is there a role for
universities and scholars incentive like the
APA to play a crucial mediating role for us
a big inform critical human citizens around
these questions. So that was the the the question
that I wanted to leave us with a discussion.
Thank you
really provocative. This is sort of hair of
the dog kind of medicine I wanted to say something
really important which is that Tommy p goes
book just went to his agent. It's hopefully
it will be published next year but He promises
to post it on the website so that we can all
buy it. And I know we're all going to want
to buy it. And now we have actually five people
joining us for the round table. But two of
them are going to speak together. So we'll
want to come up and then you'll have five
minutes to comment on what you heard come
on up. So that's you already read The two
people were adding or dealing Garcia and Huisman
DBA and you guys in alphabetical order go
first. So you want to come up and get us started.
I guess with a party's right so before I start
I just want to say again like like yesterday
I I I wanted to point out great points that
were made in this in yesterday's conference
and today was not disappointed Also great
points lay. I'm talking like what was your
name again some on some on like I'd never
heard of that in my life light shadow. And
when I heard that it was really surprising
and it give it gives a lot of thought because
for one thing it's funny when you say like
for example the title of the video HP computers
of races right but when you think about it
it's a good really theory to touch on so I
just want to shout them out for that. And
another was also yeah what was your name Catherine
yes Abu Catherine. That was really good too.
I really enjoy how men are anyway. So yeah
just review again on that. So all my packet
over there I was reading on how it acts to
one question. And it was talking about what
we were speaking about but one thing that
stood out to me was at the end how can we
fight back due to everything that's going
on between groups that think that they are
better than others or anyone they think they're
better than others because when when you're
Caucasian let's say or y right I really don't
like to users but people don't understand
how powerful they are when they're shade later
than someone else. And they have the Caucasian
looks they'd really don't they don't understand
how powerful they are compared to others.
And when it's when it asks the question how
can we fight back this is a. If we all they
if you realize that everyone here has come
to talk about brilliant ideas brilliant suggestions
that our Everyone that poem you know everything
that just came across. That is a powerful
weapon we could use to fight back. And I truly
believe that better than anyone else anyone
that has ever told me that we could fight
back by using violence or even verbal yeah
it's not going to work for the simple fact
that my father was one of the people that
taught me that if someone does something we're
like this is going on or almost like a race
war is because that's how I feel like what's
going on especially at this time era we we
use almost any. We say that well we could
fight back you know you fight against it but
look at Martin Luther King. Gandhi like they
became the most inspirational because people
all time and people do not realize how powerful
they behave become especially now. So to answer
that question or how we can fight back is
all of us. I know it sounds cheesy but if
we all like it's the most powerful to get
people's attention because we all as a country
can overrule what's going on between racism.
But I don't want to go too much into it but
also I'd like to touch on. Basically I have
somewhere so I wanted to talk about it. I
just want to stick to. But I'm just going
to give an example on the police force task
force or I don't want to touch upon. Now I
was saying that how powerful you can be if
you're Caucasian. When the other day I saw
a video on on young Turks or I don't know
if anyone's ever heard of it but they were
basically discussing about how a teenage boy
on California black right was walking to the
bus to go to school. He was apparently staffer
jaywalking from a police officer and he told
them you know stop. And basically the kid
revolted started resulting into escalated
because he was cursing atom. And it resulted
him getting hit with a baton. There's a video
on it but he had got hit in the baton shrug
off the button twice in the face. And my I
remember my father showing it to me and he
was in fury and I've never seen my dad like
this in a long time. He was literally tearing
and time you just watch this. And I was trying
to figure out why why why Woody react like
this so intense but he told me that all he
could think about was me. And that alone.
I started thinking like imagine. Imagine your
SON walking like and they train getting stopped
for jaywalking. Obviously there's office has
never been to New York but G jaywalking and
getting shocked with with tau1 twice for that.
And it's simply racism. Most of the problems
today is racism after my dad also told me
you know when you when you as a kid you would
think you know growing up or what was going
to be like oh I can't wait for things to change
and I can't wait For we are going to get pass
this but then I told them at the same time
thousands hundreds of years. And we're still
at this point. And that makes me lose hope
for what's going on. At the same time I know
for a fact and I know for a fact that we're
going to pass this in going to these conferences
is burning. What is really people have to
say I just want to say thank you and I just
want to like to appreciate everything has
gone on. And again please take on as together
as people we can overrule is. Thank you very
much. Hello guys good morning. Thank you again.
Reiterating the limb words but I wanted to
touch on San Pablo were ways stated in the
beginning where in the airport how they they
put you in a system where you are already
target before you even get there. And related
to that story my mother goes through the same
thing being that she's Muslim and she's way
the traditional governments every time we
go to the airport she stopped and asked the
same thing. But she's a she's an American
citizen. Nevada record for anything but consistently
consistently she's put in this system of racism
and prejudice and that we can't stop almost
stop. So I'm wondering how can we start this
perpetuating idea that being Muslim and being
an American. How can we break that because
if you're a Muslim doesn't make you an automatic
terrorist. That idea baffles me because we
we came to this country for the same ideas
that this country was built on the fundamental
ideas of this country that you come here and
you create a new life in UK. There is hope
and there's all these opportunities. But then
because of your religion you are stereotyped.
And people like Ben Carson. They create been
an inspirational beyond TV consistently. And
then they put these ideas in young people's
minds. And people who are ready already ignorant
it perpetuates that saying that where we can
have a Muslim in office because it doesn't
they they're believes as an aligned with the
concepts constitution. But isn't the purpose
of this country's separate church and state
or someone's belief shouldn't stop them from
becoming president because is separation of
church and state. So I just want to thank
you so much for allowing me to Hi everybody.
This is great because my comments are speaking
to so many presenters today. Thank you for
inviting me to this powerful conversation.
I come to it as an outsider as so many of
us do. But because I'm not American I am a
Pakistani and my my object harris My passport
as well. This has meant a few things for me
as people have spoken before about airport
checks. So extra security screenings my mother's
also because you as a hijab always been targeted
my white professors appointed me as at one
brown woman in the classroom asking why Muslims
hate Americans as though it was a scientific
fact of Islamic nature. And so it was that
preemptive question that retorted that you
know that the followup question couldn't be
retorted to for example Why does America hate
Muslims but to also then experience sorting
as a US foreign policy to belong to a country
that became ground 0 of the US war on terror
meant that I grew up and kids like so many
of you grew up I grew up knowing a post 911
kind of violence that predominantly took the
form of suicide bomb blast by terrorist groups.
And also now drone strikes this form of violence
produces enmeshed dismembered decimated bodies
usually in public spaces in schools markets
mosques. In the streets. This violence is
sorted through various mediations through
the rescue workers who literally sort through
body parts and stitch them together so that
families can hold them in their hand during
funerals. And I think this speaks to the idea
of family unity that Catherine Lee was talking
about. But also to through the complex mediatic
storytelling of these blast in the news and
on social media to the complex ways in which
so many of us process loss repurpose resistance
laboured through the ordinary life. As we
move on about our city spaces that are marked
by these brutalized post 911 moments. The
question that I'm asking here're you know
what does it mean to grow up with these processes
of sorting there are not indigenous. That
these visuals and memories that are not vernacular
to us but are some form of foreign Other.
What does it mean to have this kind of social
and collective memory what does it mean to
grow up as a Pakistani under this kind of
america. These questions have particularly
flared up in the context of drone strikes.
And I'm quoting here numbers from the Bureau
of investigative journalism from two thousand
and forty two thousand and fifteen. The US
has conducted over 421 strikes killing about
two thousand and two thousand four hundred
seventy six people up to 3,989 people. So
the range is actually really massive. And
that's because there's not enough data On
the particulars of people killed and estimates
say that anywhere from 423 to 965 civilians
have been killed out of them 200 children.
Approximately drones in the sky there observe
and target imminent threats as permanent routine
practice I heard on the ground as signs of
imminent death. What does it mean to matter
beyond the death count but within a space
where one lives spaces of social innocent
civilian life that will not target conventionally
during armed conflicts. Edges are now the
targets of drone strikes are mosques have
been targeted people's homes weddings. Schools
civilians restrict their movement and seek
refuge in their homes but since homes to our
targets you know there's a displacement even
at home. So essentially questions of efficacy
come to matter in the context of signature
strikes. Aware categories of people are targeted.
So people have been talking about categories
her identities that are not known. Don't matter.
So basically what happens is that men of a
certain age in their military age which can
be anywhere from 18 to 65 I subject to random
selected targeting. And this kind of speaks
to a certain scientific method at algorithmic
method of determining precise signature strikes.
So what does this kind of killing collateral
damage displacement in Prism and mean in the
context of eugenics. Can we say that Joan
strikes specifically signature strikes are
also forming eugenics. Given that eugenics
history so warped up in systemic genocides
Good morning this gives me fired up softmax.
I'm ready to go come on. Let's go as March.
I'm the executive director of Roger Lord project
where our lesbian gay bi to spirit Chan's
gender-nonconforming people of color organizing
center in New York City. And we started based
solely on racial justice and against policing.
In particular with the AMA do Diablo was murdered
by the police that became the inception of
the Audrey Lord Project. And what I want to
talk about is racism in relationship to to
gender. I brought my birth certificate and
my birth certificate it's complicated because
I'm of mixed race so lantern long night. So
but this idea a concept of race I first was
going to show this because I wanted to talk
about that in 1970 when I was born. And the
Salvation Army Hospital in Philadelphia was
separated from my white mother for three days
because the nuns decided that I wasn't viable
birth and that she shouldn't raise a black
child. So she was immediately told to have
me on go up for adoption and we were separated
for those three days. She changed her plan
and decided to keep me and my father and mom
and I we figured out how to move forward This
idea this concept that when you're born how
you are sorted based on sociological or a
nice case to religious belief in that moment
that they were doing their own sorting. So
I'm just sort of looking at consumerist eugenics
inside of state eugenics as well. But also
that on my birth certificate says that I'm
female and the assumption of gender and being
sorted by gender immediately when we're born
and that preconception sets up a lot of predetermine
ideas of what gender identity and gender expression
looks like. So most of our work at the Audrey
Lord project is actually around state control
and anti policing questioning the particular
policing of gender and race. And that we're
looking at an increase of trans women of color
mostly black and Latino descent being murdered
and policed being preconceived as either be
as sex workers. So then immediately being
incarcerated. And this assumption again being
sorted by gender and race and in particular
younger so we've got age two. So there's multiplicity
of how state sorts us out. I want to speak
too much to what you were talking about earlier.
Transformative interventions and how this
looks on the ground and organizing how we're
organizing against biome metro technologies.
How we're organizing against this idea of
family unification. And just sort of decoding
the codification of our communities. I want
to speak to several projects that are happening
on the ground that I think push back to some
of these ideas of technology. First and foremost
I definitely want to speak to pre genetic
do selection and the relationship that much
of us also talked about yesterday on how people
with disabilities automatically are sorted
out and this idea of this notion of what is
healthy and what as well and how that's defined
by state. And that we have actual advocacy
to change these notions one by nine even choosing
to use that breed selection gene genetic selection
over the counter if you will. And in our clinic
tools also how are we thinking about the distribution
of Depo-Provera and gardens so again those
are inside of genetic technologies. This presumed
notion it's connected to population control
it's connected to eugenics and who gets to
reproduce and who needs to be controlled on
their birth control. So how are we questioning
our clinics to stop putting out massive free
access to depo. When we know what causes increased
depression lowering the libido and was originally
used for people who did sex crimes in the
early 19 hundreds excuse me early 19 twenties
and thirties. So do your history on birth
control because many many of it started in
the military industrial complex as antimalarial
and other kinds of tools but I digress I want
to speak to how there are communities organizing
against up Rivera and organizing against genetic
do selection as politically understanding
of the ramifications of using these technologies.
I want to talk about the healing that is necessary
for the cumulative impact of our communities
and being under this constant surveillance
and these constant technologies. On a psychic
level it is removing our belief that we can
advocate and have self-determination for ourselves
and each other So I'm working with several
projects one of them being a huge national
movement of Muslim women who are losing their
sons and daughters who are being preemptively
strike as terrorists. And as the slow isolation
of removal by the state to say that we know
your son or daughter will be a terrorist solely
based on your religious beliefs and practices
I'm almost done. How do we actually worked
together to look at not only the political
ramifications but the trauma and what kind
of healing needs to happen to transform this
slow psychic. Removal of self-determination
that we feel is happening through these preemptive
strikes. And last but not least I just want
to say it's critical to do testimony witness
and honor. We have to map sites of eugenic
practice. But we also have to map sites of
eugenic resistance yesterday. I named katrina.
I want to name the Atlanta child murders in
Atlanta How many of us have honored and remembered
just by remembering the death and complete
dismissal and removal of our communities by
honoring and remembering is going to change
this history. So the narrative does not become
displaced Okay so my name is Josh and I first
wanted to thank everybody. For putting this
together this has been an amazing event for
inviting me. So I do work on the nypd and
on their predictive policing system and a
predictive policing software. And also on
this sort of idea of responsive cities in
general and I wanted to just start out with
kinda the punchline which is that the question
of fighting back or critically resisting that
there is no liberal response to algorithmic
or predictive policing it doesn't exist. You
cannot cannot mathematized your way out of
a eugenic project and that's what this is.
So. And I didn't come up with this line because
I'm not that clever but in general it's always
good to remember that liberalism is not a
halfway point on the road to liberation. So
whenever we're trying to consider these sorts
of politics we should keep that in mind. So
what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna take five minutes
and I'm going to try to square a couple of
circles in terms of what we've been talking
about with housing policies red lining policing
and bringing that all together into this idea
this predictive policing biometrics which
we can talk about. And I'm happy to talk more
about. The thing about algorithmic stuff is
that it doesn't really work. So let's but
alright so I'm going to talk about broken
windows for those of you who don't know broken
windows policing theory that we all live under
which is basically that you should prosecute
2D with as much power as you possibly can
the most minor offenses that you possibly
can. So you get up misdemeanors for things
that are basically like small citation or
offenses. The idea being that then people
will clean out their ads. Of course the question
of cleaning up your act sounds a lot like
hygiene and since we've been talking a lot
about racial hygiene We should then be wondering
what cleaning up Dirac means gleaned street.
Alright so we live under a pleasing regime
called broken windows that may only be implicitly
eugenicist but explicitly leverages or adventitious
reversion of respectability politics in order
to partake of a logic and genealogy of racial
uplift and good governance And like it's historic
corollaries this discourse this theory of
the human poses as a liberal form of pastoral
care that in fact mobilizes the racially organized
expropriation of land and resources. While
historically this may have been achieved through
dominion over govern territories. In our case
we can call it gentrification. Lest we think
that these processes of revenge his quality
of life policing masquerading as liberal respectability
politics in the name of improving local communities
governance of themselves which is the putative
broken window in broken windows. Rudy Giuliani
did us the favor of saying plainly what broken
windows is all about and I'm going to quote
from the late great Neil Smith here in the
spring of 1995 faced by a $3.1 billion budget
deficit which we talked about why that happened
in red lining yesterday Mayor Rudy Giuliani
voiced explicitly along implicit intent of
service and budget cuts by cutting services
the mayor told a small group of newspaper
editors. He hope to encourage the poorest
of the city's population. Those most dependent
on public services to move out of the city
shrinkage of the poor population would be
a good thing for the city he suggested and
this is the quote. That's not an unspoken
part of our strategy. That is our strategy.
This should remind us of the current rhetoric
surrounding smart responsive cities that promise
that by transforming the urban into a laboratory
it will enable the municipality to do more
with less. That all of these initiatives had
been driven first by police agencies with
nypd COM stat program as their fountain head
is worth noting. But beyond that what such
a logic of governance flags is that the decision
about what this city exists to do has already
been formalized. It is the deliver of services
to demanding consumers. Advocates explicitly
invoke Google Amazon and Uber as models for
the urban. This is rather than a fine tuning
of the city's capabilities an endpoint in
a long struggle over who and what the city
is for it is not a place where communal resources
can be put towards achieving social justice.
It is a place where services rendered is convenience
can be delivered most effectively to those
populations that most effectively demand them
that these are exactly the wealthy weight
gentrifying populations that the city has
quoted at the expense of the poor working
class et cetera closes a loop on how the logic
of broken windows works in tandem with racially
and sexually mobilized strategies of expropriation
and settlement. And this is not a negative
logic. We talked a lot about this yesterday.
Eugenics is not a negative logic. It is a
positive program and an aesthetic program
that articulate itself against and threw the
bodies of undesirable populations. It is for
example no surprise that the bodies that have
felt the boot heel of the state most consistently
are black brown we're poor et cetera. The
policing of these bodies is not indicative
of suspicion as is so often articulated because
especially can ultimately be reduced to problems
of individual officers training or prejudice.
Rather it is the outcome of a programmatic
determination of who the city is for white
heterosexual moneyed et cetera. And I'm just
going to end with this. It's worth noting
that the contemporary tactics that the contemporary
attack it's a poetic policing have not changed
much in the last 300 years We may not call
that Lantern laws anymore but a crucial part
of nypd is omnipresent strategy is to position
extremely powerful flood lights in and around
high high crime neighborhoods and to blast
them at the community at all hours so that
the police can see can know when and where
people of color are moving about the city
or we might think here again at predictive
policing which mobilizes digital capacities
to achieve a similar purpose to render a population
towards criminality in order to ensure that
they are ensnared in a Carswell state whose
existence and metastasis is not a failure
of the state but a deliberate an inevitable
consequence of making scientific and industrial
the historical process of racial capitalism
I really want to thank you all for being interesting
and on time. And so we'd like to open it up
who's got a sum to throw into the pot or a
reaction or something you sit. Not. Technology
is basically they are They have created is
DNA photo fitting technology which takes any
sample. So you can cancel this apparent in
the ground and constructs that person's face
this is actually a vision technology because
they offer they say so specifically both it's
there for turning Afro Afro came off as African
hopefully. Backgrounds and the law enforcement
agencies ask them to help them so specific
populations. So that technology is out there
in the sciences. They actually dragged into
Israeli national governmental regulation of
this to say direct-to-consumer myth Threats
whose intervene law enforcement so that what
is the name of that technology OK. Scott do.
Uva Is there somebody in the back that wants
to speak and then you speak first and then
we'll bring the mighty. But there's a person
in the back and we'll continue next time.
Yeah takeaway on. So as we'll talk about real
quick like the future of your own the future
of these technologies because clearly there's
potential for us to be use as product instead
of as actually indeed in in my eyes this is
just the continuation of slavery slavery ended.
They needed a new way. So the new way instead
was Only certain races ON everyone would just
be SHE Carol et cetera. But you won't just
be another tool to use. So polluted as we
are now rho working just the RBI needy or
maybe a little bit better. But still you still
working to support yourselves for your family.
That's what they want you to be as all they
want you to be. Smarter or better or go anywhere
in life. If you do reservations emitted by
you can open it. Now you just up there with
them say no no. That's awesome Technology
Chicago I'm really interested in predictive
policing frame ID that you came up with here.
Let me offer an alternative. There's been
a good 25 years of work in the name of community
policing. That nasa but longitudinal studies
show when there's a good division of labor
between communities and police early warnings
can come from community knowledge. The police
action thing say for the interventions that
are actually necessary. When that when you
don't do that when the police pretend Andy
community by the central router that doesn't
work and community tries. And technology themselves
would be phones feeds vigilante action. And
when you do it together you get something
that can be measured collected advocates say.
And he actually worked better than anything.
I click Clear alternative to what you're talking
about there. So yes it'll be all of these
technologies that you mentioned are clearly
the aquatic discriminatory sort of ways and
feeding exclusion but yet it is this now also
because of the alternatives that actually
work better. Push don't get the attention.
Don't sound sexy Biometric screening or maybe
tweak your framing. Push am a question. Why
were so you could go consensus Seems to me
to be interested in anywhere. I just want
to say that the tests are cheap. They're really
cheap. So you can do basic ancestry testing
for. I mean it probably cost the the scientists
who do it are the companies who do it. Maybe
like ten bucks or something like that. So
it's not you know it's it's a no brainer for
law enforcement agencies. What are you going
to spend money on and I'm building out some
kind of community-based program. Are you going
to spend with the yet charges maybe $99 or
something like that Now that's true. Yeah
no edges. They have to use this for police
work or military work. Am I correct no doubt.
If yeah yeah just specifically toilet that
in like you like you said did I'm just curious
is there any events in particular were that
a core occurred but I guess specifically on
different races or like when it comes to the
edges wondering now because this is like the
first time I've heard of it Law enforcing
agencies basically say look we're worried
about this population and it's usually black
people. And so it's like we want to surveil
these people. We want you to give us something
that's effective for targeting that population
and then science. It's it's easy for scientists
just turn that over and actually the Department
of Justice and Department of Defense they
are the governmental bodies that fun this
the actual bench science of this research.
So it started being made in 1997 from a Department
of Justice Grant given to one of the scientists
and you know so it develops from there but
currently the Department of Defenses is funding
a lot of the research that I'm talking about
my my current book. So I just want to say
because I'm a psychiatrist How many people
feel depressed I feel depressed. Okay So these
technologies y'all have scared scared. I don't
know what you scared out of me but it's all
gone. This is scary right but the title of
this is pushing back. And I think that although
I really appreciate the science about how
terrible it is we didn't urine of science
about how we're going to push back. And I'm
going to tell you something about groups.
There is a downward spiral groups actually
will naturally know how despair feeds the
news we'd love to know that the baby fell
down the well. And so that's what we're doing
because because the more we talk about it
there's another technology we haven't listed
yet. Is there not somebody know another technology.
Somebody in this room knows another technology
or knows another terrible thing about another
technology. So I want to say that part of
today and the point of a line create Connect
is that we do need to get in alignment. We
need to get together. We need to get on the
same page and I appreciate the part about
this. There's like Yo we all need to know
this so that we can figure out we're going
to do about it but we stay there and our despair
we're going to go to lunch and never come
back because it's too depressing. So we have
to we have to you have groups actually have
to work. And how do you find the solution
that pushing back is the hard work make it
ourselves. Depressed is easy. So I am wondering
if anybody in the audience is thinking about
pushing back any story of pushing back. Yes.
There's a microphone right behind you. But
can he just say about pushing Would you mind
how can we get to her next inlet let this
guy because he races have very enthusiastically
and then we'll get to you order. I love your
statement about how Technology is feeding
the depression but luckily we're in an era
were also humor is feeding the critique. And
thank God the first voices on the Internet
that are using art in systems of humor. Kirchhoff
push that I'm reminded of a colleague Rich
how who've run something called the Institute
for Applied autonomy. And one of the great
projects was to have a Google map like where
say about ten years ago where you could trip
from 1 in New York City to another quantity
or ICSI We've mapped the route of surveillance
but 8 thousand cameras that are New York SIV.
If you like that project were Celsus and new
You see in Pittsburgh call center post Natural
History which is looking at eugenics as well
as subjects of study. So I think that it's
really important to realize that to this gentleman's
pointing to companies like this is really
important but also kinds of activism which
are pointing out and ready queue in some ways
the absurdity of these multi $1 million military
industrial complex and really important way
to go For this course and that takes us back
to the videos that people were posting about
kinda I can never get those six to give me
water. So I really appreciate it knowing there
was a reason for that or du over u you were
reading you ready. Jack Jack is right. You
do your great take it away. So really fantastic
it's been so great to sit here and here all
this. And you know one of the ways they think
that we can resist actually isn't something
that just sort of thinking of Catherine and
I was listening to your Great presentation
around family reunification which you know
we are in this place for the United States
which purports you'll gonna have family first
policies right family family family. Which
of course fails by its own definition by its
own logic right and the stuff that you're
talking about because there's this presumption
that families safe from the global south of
0s still care about each other. Don't care
about their children as much as white American
families right but as somebody who is queer
and who's done a lot of immigration related
worker and queers talking around you know
folks who do not conform to their gender at
birth and things like that. I think there
is a site of pushing back as well where you
have the more expansive definition of family
where we in our term do not tie our rights
to biology right that we have a different
kind of internationalism that different kind
of kinship and that we understand that we
get these rights and we push for these rights
And this inbuilt our campaigns around this
idea that we have rights not just because
of who were attached to write but because
we're human beings and we have we have human
rights that would be to assert and do this
very successfully in fighting for the HIV
immigration ban and resisted ideas to tile
that work into who people were partners or
to tie it into a larger gay marriage paradigm
right so yes with a challenge to the system
that says we're profoundly. But if you come
from these parts of the world you probably
don't care about your children that much anyway
To make them be responsive within their own
paradigm right to make the powers that be
be responsive to the owner I mean their own
logic that they're putting out but also the
challenge that in a more expansive way. And
I think we've seen some success not just around
the HIV bent but a lot of other folks were
trying to smash those categories. And I just
want to add to her too in terms of perspective
on how organizing organizing movements are
looking at these technologies. I mean Black
Lives Matter knows a lot about surveillance
technology the organizers. I was in a meeting
a couple of months ago on how we are looking
at predictive policing how we're moving our
even the campaigns United for police reform
here in New York City. A lot of our work is
looking at surveillance technology you know
so understanding how our strategies can transform
this. But I do want to go back to a certain
level of testimony and witness that even if
we are aware and how are my mapping sites
of eugenics For instance the sterilization
in California prisons. He wrote a statement
several deaths. It's organizing it's ten years
ago. I read a statement again sterilization
abusing eugenics and presents it took ten
years to get the case to make it visible to
actually change this course of action so that
I do think there's a certain level witness
testimony that is a technology within itself.
You'll inevitably too but I think I think
that's very very important that I wanted to
just add to that part of the witnesses and
testimony that we need to do as part of a
movement is our successes in our experiments
and things that do work. And you know when
the environmental justice movement maps environmental
harms enforces the EPA to do something that's
also very important part of our legacy that
we can't forget Yeah I just wanted to add.
So something that I was thinking you know
the question of depression or the reason that
I think that doing something like that is
somewhat depressing. And this kind of overarching
sense is that it gives a paints a clear picture
of something like a political economy at work
that you have as you school-like asked in
a sort of like abstract ways MIT to not to
be snide to know how the best route to get
from point a to point B with the fewest number
of cameras looking at you number one the cameras
are almost infinitesimal part of what the
nypd use this to do policing to do surveillance
Number one technology is a eugenic. Technology
would seize to say what your skin color is
what your gender that you present is when
you're walking where you're walking. So you
know this idea that there is like this that
the idea that there is this sort of extra
valence technological apparatus that you can
resist on its own terms fails. So when we're
thinking about how to resist something like
this having something like these technologies
in the context of what the city is for is
really important there's been a move since
the 19 sixties 19 seventies right with the
financial collapse of New York City with the
reorganization with neoliberal gentrification
with the increasing of the police state right
with broken windows policing with turning
New York City into something that doesn't
exist as a space for the people that live
here to live here but instead as a space for
capital to move through and certain types
of bodies that had been rendered by the state
of being right the most hygienic the best
for that will make the neighborhood better
on. If you guys saw the video the two white
bargaining in downtown Brooklyn yesterday
over the stroller rather than one guy say
to get a guy like the only reason you can
be here is because I settled this neighborhood
40 right so there's a colonial logic here.
So I think that in order to do something like
an effective push back against these technologies.
These apparatuses of surveillance. You have
to see them within this larger context of
how they're operating within this racial political
economy and making making it something that
you can point to right so what are the things
one of the best things that these technologies
do is they do a dot right so now that you
can say like well look it's not that our officers
are races. We train them in sensitivity training
is that this computer says that this neighborhood
has the most crime and that we know that when
it is going to have is going to be these at
times in this place. And these are the sort
of the bodies that we have to look for and
we know this because the computers aren't
races. Like of course computers are racist
right but as we saw. All right so the point
is that there is this project of policing
that free figures the technological apparatuses
that are deployed to make it a reasonable
thing to spend a billion dollars a year on
which is what the nypd you spending on amino
groups. So that's cloud save dot. So as far
as pushing back Yeah I mean absolutely there
are ways of resisting. And it's like if you
want to know the best way to resist or really
good ways to resist you should daughter-in-law
project you should follow what they're doing
on very closely and linguistics it because
like that's where it's at. But you know that
oppression is helpful for painting the larger
picture I'd say even knows. I'm a psychiatrist
depression is never helpful Reality is helpful.
I I totally appreciate. I totally appreciate
that we have to look at. We have to look at
what's going on. Reality is important and
everybody has painted the reality. But then
you have to flip it pretty quickly because
the reality is pretty big and pretty hard.
When we talk about the totality of the project
of making New York City not a city for working
people but a city for the rich weight. That
means all of us are gone as pretty upsetting.
So so the pushback like getting really fast
it. What concretely are we gonna do that where
we have to go and I really appreciate Kara.
Consumers really saying some explicit things
that we have to do. And I think that's where
we have to push ourselves To get real and
so all these things that are getting thrown
out like telling jokes and laughing. People
oppress people have told jokes for. Since
the beginning of time since the beginning
of oppression. But you look like you're trying
to jump in. I really appreciate the point
that the surveillance predates the technology.
And I think these technological advances are
just tweaks along along y of the kind of oppressive
practices that we revolve in documenting.
And so I think it's important to be asking
the questions and asking questions not in
your area. So and to think that the alliances
are in ways that you might not be thinking.
So for example around immigration reform.
Who's not for that little girl sophie being
allowed to stay with her parents. You want
to support family unity. But it's also important
to think about the ways in which other individuals
get excluded because you focus so much on
these heteronormative ideals about family.
So how do we turn around immigration reform
to be then about let's say the right of all
humans to live with dignity and opportunity
to make a living for themselves and the people
that they want to care about and surround
themselves with a U Turn the right to move
across borders not as something that the state
sanctions certain appropriate bodies to have
but for all humans to be allowed to do. And
to think about immigration reform in the US
is tied to larger global processes of war
and economic deprivation so that we rethink
ideas about refugee identifying people as
refugees versus migrants in other contexts
and thinking about how that relates to to
what's going on in New York as a as a city
of sanctuary. And what that means and how
we can make cross alliances. So again I I
think that's why it's important to think about
intersectionality and thinking about how your
positionality as particular gendered racialized
class person can make linkages in ways that
you might not have been thinking about but
I think this cross dial or across a number
of different political economic sites suggest
that there are important moments to to collaborate.
And I think to be hopeful of that. On the
one hand I feel so sad as a mother hearing
you guys despair but also so excited to think
about how young people could can imagine possibly
a different kind of future and you have to
you. Otherwise I don't see what the point
is. So don't despair too much Amy needs to
happen just yet. So I'm thinking about for
pushback on first deletion or is around. I
think we've started kind of with my thought
process which is looking at positionality
but what does it say it isn't as if I'm either
thinking about how to translate this information
as an artist or as an educator and I'm not
cyclically I do teach at a university in atoms
but I'm not inside of a academic institution.
And one thing I'm really struck by is seeing
young people in the audience. Having the ways
that we're kind of navigating different language.
And even for myself as soon And I start talking
to other people sort of have like describing
what this is about. And so I think on one
hand we might feel depressed inside the room
and yet with the information and yet some
people for example I teach I worked with two-year
college students and a lot of them are people
from immigrant backgrounds and undocumented
young people and older people and as well
as in places you don't know outside of Oakland
30 minutes away in place the Livermore where
most of them are very much whitewash culture
and people are all trying to become police
officers and joined the military. Forget their
name right outside open So I teach those I'm
always kind of navigating audience. I think
around are ways that we think about these
issues is taking and synthesising information
and thinking why I'm gonna be teaching both
in a social justice based program to young
people who just read The New Jim Crow and
I'm also going to be teaching James Baldwin
and works a bunch of students who believe
that racism was in the past and literally
say back then when they have racism and some
of them are also mixed-race themselves. So
there's a lot of there's a lot of different
dynamics. And so how can I translate and so
a lot of it is literally just any one fact
that I bring back Even just one the ones that
deliver more they're going to go. No I don't
believe you like shock complete shot and the
world start to change a little bit. They might
like hate me at the time because they don't
like all of this stuff. There's a lot of cognitive
dissonance. But some of them go home and later
on tell me something change. So I guess on
the positive and maybe to think about if those
of us who are educators or work with with
those communities. You know some of the pushback
is literally just finding ways to translate
any pieces of this information is there making
those costs turn and having people. And when
I think of the ones who are going to the police
who are going to become police officers. When
Class I hope something take a few minutes.
But I'd love to hear from some of the some
of the transfer RNA positive thanks. But that's
gotta barely. Barely in Jack and I were included
in the leaders of China. But the only thing
I remembered the actions willing to read into
the Chinatown is like nineteenth-century city.
What this disappearing I came to New York
City 62 in Chinatown one other thing I want
to use as an illustration that pushing back
is the small mom and pop restaurant or eatery.
One particularly one is main Anwar. Before
it was sort of renovate it because of the
Bloomberg administration discovered and went
down to the basement and Clearwater rats.
And well the Filipino workers status lined
up to get the tacit bar. This is the row spoke
but there's a history of that but it comes
up Philippine the upper vocal tract Chinese
Hadn't been the salt bread from the Spanish
not the hot migrating to Mexico and then went
down to South America. So that businesses
face those January by his own time and Poisson.
Well what happened was that they cared about
they all kind of tied and the renovate it
to like a typical modern Asian D20. But the
taste is gone. No more rats normal location.
In fact they don't even like the new f2 so
pay back. So there was a almost more memorial
rest in peace me like wow what was proposed
was a kind of sadness and loss that time so
many of us all. So I think disappearing very
fast. So I didn't move as a way to reconfigure
Chinatown that report we have to update that
report. Yet no thank you for asking me to
contribute where I'm sitting here trying to
intake everything and it's been quite fascinating.
For me I think as I mentioned the idea of
having a critical consciousness about these
technologies and how they are developed within
colonial logics. So when we talk about algorithms
Those are just patterns and codes and that
people create these things. It's not like
cyber diner some computer that just happened.
So Conditions that say biometrics are created
under or not outside of the conditions and
logics that we live in and that they're used
for. And so we can critically question when
when we use something for free like Facebook
where the product where the data question
though where we're putting our images online
if our friends our family of questions of
consent those are things that I think that
are kind of pushback or at least a politics
of refusal so that we might not be able to
map the least surveillance space when we have
walking cctv cameras in the form of police
but that we can question the logics that make
this kind of visual surveillance something
that is understood as optimum for security
for safety and rather than see it as something
that's a long history of racial profiling
et al and coding logistics you mention. And
so I think just having the knowledge that
these things aren't it's not the end. There's
not a given that we could push back In some
ways. Yeah this isn't really fast thing. Yes
but also I think that communicating with the
scientists to who invent these technologies
who come up with these technologies and strategies
is really important. And this is actually
the 25th anniversary of backdoor to eugenics
by Troy Duster who is a sociologist emeritus
here. And when you he was also my exists or
to one of my dissertation advisors and and
he is the person who did that with his career
you know he he spent decades talked in the
last 25 years definitely talking to all of
the scientists in having critical engagement.
And every time that there's a Genome Project
any kind of thing that moves us so-called
forward. On that front. There's always a public
forum where they say you know public needs
come in and tell us what what we what how
we should think about race how we should think
about these things. Even with vital the African-American
heart failure drugs there was a lot you know
Congress is like come in the public come in
here. So anyways just getting in and talking
to people We'll make a huge difference because
there was a depressing human provenance project
in the UK where you know the UK was saying
we're going to use the actually launched this
project to use genomics to determine whether
people could come in as asylum seekers or
not. And so a bunch of scientists said from
all around the world grow and said this is
we do not stand behind. The technology doesn't
work that way. It's not accurate enough and
then they roll that back. So they decided
not to do that. And so that was like a year
or two ago. I think it's important to engage
with those people through a quick question
types. So width Positioning young people at
a place where they are able to create conversations
and create action towards creating the type
of change. How can how can we create a conversation
archaea we create change position young people
to use a Facebook say Twitter the answer like
the social media how can we position young
people face where we create social change
in a consistent basis. So how can we create
a conversation around where we can Lee I can
Navier and take something with me so I can
use to create that change. I know everybody
has something to say right this has been a
great panel. Thank you guys so much. But we
did have to break for lunch and right after
lunch we come back and we take up where we
do question So at least in my work and going
around cities what I learned from people is
that is that there's kind of three large tasks
that people engage in. The first is is this
aligning tasks like sharing ideas and finding
what we have in common and finding out what
we're for where we want to go. So starting
that conversation and getting on the same
page that the second part is then to create
to create what it is we want to see which
is what happens in the classroom what should
you be taking back to your class what should
your teacher be doing on Monday to help move
this forward and then the next part is to
take that forward. What Amy was saying how
do we take the ideas and the creations and
take it forward so this afternoon we're going
to create lists of ten things we'd like to
see. And then that will be what we will take
forward as we go back but I really I don't
know if you have two last words to say Tom
if pico because I think that really how how
much did what he told us this morning is what
we have all been talking about which is how
do you be the person who to write a nature
poem is to be enacting the stereotype. And
then you take that and you transform it and
you push back. I mean it was such a brilliant
exposition of how we do push back. I don't
know how I just like Just wrote a book that
I am going to create a community right now
with a bunch of artists and writers like Smith.
And so my Sharif and Morgan Parker an angel
not this URL people who write in English now
and it wasn't like necessarily. We didn't
ever felt that with the claim that if our
language because it had been told of dominion
or whatever but that we tried to use it in
subvert kind of at least at least creative
power structure. And hopefully like using
use that as a way that I could do that. What
it did for me was it allowed me to you And
in a very big way the ally. Thank you
