US NEXT.
>>> UNDER THIS ADMINISTRATION,
AUTHORITARIANISM HAS TAKEN ROOT
IN OUR COUNTRY.
I AND MY FAMILY AND MANY OF
YOURS KNOW THE INSIDIOUS WAY
AUTHORITARIANISM DESTROYS
DEMOCRACY, DECENCY AND HUMANITY.
>> JOINING US NOW, REPUBLICAN
POLITICAL STRATEGIST AND
CO-FOUNDER OF THE LINCOLN
PROJECT, RICK WILSON.
HIS BOOK "RUNNING AGAINST THE
DEVIL:A PLOT TO SAVE AMERICA
FROM TRUMP AND DEMOCRATS FROM
THEMSELVES" IS OUT TODAY IN
PAPERBACK.
ALSO WITH US, MSNBC NATIONAL
AFFAIRS ANALYST, CO-HOST OF SHOW
SHOWTIME’S "THE CIRCUS," JOHN
HEILEMANN.
>> YOU KNOW, TWITTER, TRY TO
STAY AWAY FROM IT AS MUCH AS
POSSIBLE.
RICK WILSON, LAST NIGHT, I
LAUGHED OUT LOUD --
>> THAT WAS A GOOD ONE.
>> WE GO LOW, SO YOU DON’T HAVE
TO.
THE SCRUBBING BUBBLES OF 2020.
WE WORK SO YOU DON’T HAVE TO.
BUT, YOU KNOW, IT REMINDED ME
HOW REPUBLICANS CAMPAIGNING AND
DEMOCRATS CAMPAIGN DO THINK
DIFFERENTLY.
THEY JUST DO.
YOU AND I MAY HAVE LEFT THE
PARTY, BUT THE CAMPAIGNING DNA
IS STILL IN THERE.
I SAW THESE PEOPLE WHINING LAST
NIGHT ABOUT THIS MYLES TAYLOR
GUY ENDORSING BIDEN.
OH, WE DON’T WANT HIM.
NO, NO, NO, NO, NO.
I WAS REMINDED OF WHAT W.D.
CHILDERS SAID, I DIDN’T AGREE
WITH A LOT OF THINGS HE SAID,
BUT ONE IS THIS, I WANT ALL THE
MONEY AND I WANT ALL THE VOTES,
AND THAT’S THE IDEA.
WHEN YOU’RE THE CAMPAIGN, YOU
WANT ALL THE MONEY AND ALL THE
VOTES AND YOU WANT AS BIG A TENT
AS
>> AND YOU DON’T WANT TO END UP
LIKE W.D.’S FRIENDS UNDER A
HOUSE.
BUT LONG STORY SHORT, THIS IS
ALWAYS THE CASE -- THIS IS
ALWAYS THE CASE WITH ADDITION.
THE BASE OF EITHER PARTY IS
INSUFFICIENT TO WIN THE
ELECTORAL COLLEGE SO YOU HAVE TO
ADD PEOPLE, BRING FOLKS IN.
THEY WERE TRYING REALLY HARD AT
THE CONVENTION TO SHOW THAT
EVEN -- EVEN THOUGH THEY ARE NO
LONGER IN OFFICE, REPUBLICANS
WHO ARE BREAKING AWAY FROM
TRUMP, IT DOESN’T HAVE TO BE A
LOT.
WE CALL IT THE BANNON LINE.
STEVE BANNON SAID 3% OR 4% OF
REPUBLICANS WALK AWAY FROM
TRUMP, THE GAME IS OVER.
HE’S NOT WRONG.
WE’RE IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU
SAW THAT LAST NIGHT HIGHLIGHTED
A LITTLE BIT.
AND THAT’S A LOT OF WHAT WE’RE
DOING AT THE LINCOLN PROJECT AS
WELL.
>> YEAH, JOHN HEILEMANN, DONALD
TRUMP’S CAMPAIGN CALLED JOHN
KASICH A USEFUL IDIOT OR
WHATEVER.
FAR LEFT WING RADICALS.
SO AGAIN, IT’S SO BIZARRE.
THIS IS A GUY, AND I WAS THERE
WHEN HE WAS DOING IT, WHO FOUGHT
LIKE HELL AGAINST THE REPUBLICAN
AND DEMOCRATIC ESTABLISHMENT, TO
BALANCE THE BUDGET FOR THE FIRST
TIME IN A GENERATION AND HIS
BUDGET CHAIRMAN, HE DID IT FOUR
YEARS IN A ROW.
YOU KNOW WHAT OTHER CONSERVATIVE
HAS DONE THAT IN THE PAST
CENTURY?
OH, WAIT, NOBODY.
AND KASICH HAD TO BE
CONSERVATIVE AND STARE DOWN NOT
ONLY LIBERAL DEMOCRATS BUT
POWERFUL APPROPRIATORS IN HIS
OWN PARTY.
THE GUY IS A CONSERVATIVE.
ONLY IN THIS BIZARRE POLITICAL
WORLD WOULD ANYBODY EVER
CONSIDER KASICH ANYTHING BUT A
CONSERVATIVE.
BUT IT’S A PERSONALITY CALL.
>> WELL, YEAH.
THINK ABOUT THIS, JOE.
IN THAT SAME PRESS RELEASE THEY
SENT OUT LAST NIGHT ATTACKING
JOHN KASICH, THEY ATTACKED SUSAN
MOLINARI FOR BEING -- WAIT FOR
NICE THEY ATTACKED SUSAN
MOLINARI FOR BEING A VLADIMIR
PUTIN PUPPET.
A PAL OF VLADIMIR PUTIN.
SO TALK ABOUT POTS AND KETTLES
AND THE COLOR BLACK.
I WAS JUST STUNNED BY THAT.
SO, YOU KNOW, WHAT ARE YOU GOING
TO SAY?
IT’S THE MOST RIDICULOUS THING
ON EARTH.
I DON’T THINK PRESIDENT TRUMP
WOULD KNOW A REPUBLICAN IF ONE
CAME UP AND BIT HIM ON THE HIND
QUARTERS.
WE ARE WHERE WE ARE.
>> SO, RICK, WE’RE GOING TO LET
JOHN HEILEMANN CLOSE HIS BLINDS
TO THE RIGHT THERE.
>> SERIOUSLY.
>> RICK, LET’S TALK ABOUT THIS
CAMPAIGN BECAUSE YOU HAVE SAID
THAT, OF COURSE, DONALD TRUMP --
THERE HE GOES.
YEAH, TURN IT THERE, JOHN.
>> YOU SAID, OF COURSE DONALD
TRUMP COULD WIN.
OF COURSE HE CAN WIN, BUT JOE
BIDEN COULD LOSE IT.
AND YOU EXPLAIN THAT BY SAYING,
IF HE RUNS THE CAMPAIGN THAT
DONALD TRUMP AND THE TRUMP
CAMPAIGN WANTS HIM TO RUN.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?
>> DONALD TRUMP KNOWS THIS
CAMPAIGN RIGHT NOW IS A
REFERENDUM ON HIM.
IT IS A REFERENDUM ON A MAN WHO
HAS MISMANAGED A PANDEMIC SO
BADLY THAT 170,000 OF OUR FELLOW
AMERICANS HAVE DIED.
HE’S WRECKED THE ECONOMY BY
BEING AN IDIOT ON THE FRONT END
OF THE PANDEMIC AND SAYING,
NOTHING IS HAPPENING.
IT’S NOT WRONG.
NOTHING IS HAPPENING.
THIS IS A YES OR NO DECISION.
DECENT MAN OR INDECENT MAN.
COMPETENT OR INCOMPETENT MAN.
AND THEY’LL KNOW DONALD TRUMP IS
THE INCOMPETENT, INDECENT,
CORRUPT PERSON IN THIS RACE.
IF THIS IS A RACE ABOUT
SOCIALISM OR POLICY, DONALD
TRUMP HAS A SHOT TO RECAPTURE
SOME OF THOSE REPUBLICANS WHO
ARE WALKING AWAY FROM THE PARTY
RIGHT NOW BECAUSE THEY FEAR
THINGS LIKE SOCIALISM AND THEY
FEAR THINGS, YOU KNOW, THAT A
RADICAL FLIP SIDE VERSION OF
DONALD TRUMP.
I DON’T THINK IT’S EASY FOR THEM
TO GET THERE RIGHT NOW BECAUSE
TRUMP HAS FALLEN SO FAR AND SO
FAST, BUT THIS IS A MATTER OF
STICKING WITH THIS BEING A
REFERENDUM ABOUT DONALD TRUMP’S
LEADERSHIP AND THE FAILURES THAT
HE HAS CAUSED AND THE PAIN HE
HAS CAUSED THIS COUNTRY.
>> JOHN HEILEMANN, DEMOCRATS DID
THAT LAST NIGHT.
THAT WAS THE FIRST NIGHT TO
REMIND PEOPLE ABOUT DONALD
TRUMP’S RECORD, EVEN JUST OVER
THE LAST FEW MONTHS.
YOU HAD BERNIE SANDERS OUT FRONT
BRINGING PROGRESSIVES BACK INTO
THE FOLD AND SAYING WE HAVE TO.
IT’S CRITICAL.
IT’S EXISTENTIAL THAT WE GET
BEHIND JOE BIDEN AND KAMALA
HARRIS.
WE HAVE DISAGREEMENTS WITH THEM
ON ISSUES BUT WE HAVE TO GET
TOGETHER WITH THEM.
AND CLOSING THE NIGHT WITH
MICHELLE OBAMA.
FROM DEMOCRATS YOU’VE TALKED TO,
HOW DO THEY THINK LAST NIGHT
WENT AS A KICKOFF TO THIS WEEK?
>> I THINK PEOPLE ARE, WILLIE,
VERY FOCUSED ON THE TWO THINGS
YOU MENTIONED AT THE END WHICH
ON THE BROADCAST NETWORKS WHICH
STILL HAVE, YOU KNOW, A MUCH
BIGGER REACH THAN THIS NETWORK
AND OTHER CABLE NETWORKS, THEY
ONLY TOOK AN HOUR OF THE
CONVENTION LAST NIGHT.
THEY TOOK THAT 10:00 TO
11:00 HOUR.
THE FIRST HOUR WHICH SOME PEOPLE
THOUGHT WAS NOT MAYBE AS WHOLLY
COMPELLING.
IT WAS AN ATTEMPT TO DO
SOMETHING NO ONE HAS EVER DONE
BEFORE.
THE FIRST ATTEMPT TO DO IT THAT
FIRST HOUR.
THEY’RE STILL FIGURING OUT HOW
TO MAKE THIS SEAMLESS.
THE SECOND HOUR WAS MORE LIKE A
TRADITIONAL CONVENTION.
YOU HAD THE TWO BIG SPEECHES.
THOSE ARE THE ONES THE BROADCAST
NETWORKS TOOK AND THOSE WERE
EFFECTIVE PIECES OF
COMMUNICATION FOR THE WORK THAT
NEEDS TO GET DONE HERE.
FOR A LOT OF DEMOCRATS I TALK TO
AND WHAT PEOPLE INSIDE THE
CAMPAIGN ARE FOCUSED ON, HAVING
GOTTEN THAT WORK DONE LAST
NIGHT, IT’S EXPECTED SANDERS AND
MICHELLE OBAMA TO BE VERY GOOD.
THEY’RE NOW FOCUSED ON REALLY
THE MOST IMPORTANT WORK OF THIS
CONVENTION.
AS WE’VE STARTED TO SEE SOME
POLLS THAT HAVE SUGGESTED A
LITTLE BIT OF TIGHTENING OVER
THE LAST FEW DAYS AND
PARTICULARLY, THE FACT THAT
DONALD TRUMP CONTINUES TO
MAINTAIN THIS ADVANTAGE ON THE
ECONOMY THAT THEY HAVE IMPORTANT
WORK TO DO THESE NEXT THREE
NIGHTS ON TELLING PEOPLE THE
STORIES OF JOE BIDEN.
EVERYONE IN AMERICA KNOWS HE WAS
BARACK OBAMA’S VICE PRESIDENT
BUT THERE’S A LOT OF DATA OUT
THERE THAT SUGGESTS THERE’S
STILL A LOT OF HIS BACKGROUND
THAT NEEDS TO BE FILLED IN.
THE STORY OF WHO JOE BIDEN IS
AND TRYING TO LAY OUT THAT
ECONOMIC VISION AND TRYING TO
MAKE UP A LITTLE BIT OF THAT
GROUND TO GET CLOSER IF NOT
OVERTAKE DONALD TRUMP.
GET INTO A MORE COMPETITIVE
POSITION WITH HIM ON THE
ECONOMY.
IT’S ACCORDING TO THE NBC/"WALL
STREET JOURNAL" POLL, THE MOST
IMPORTANT ISSUE TO VOTERS.
WHO IS BEST SUITED TO REBUILD
THE ECONOMY.
TRUMP HAS A TEN-POINT LEAD IN
THAT AREA.
THAT’S THE THING THE BIDEN
CAMPAIGN IS SUPERFOCUSED ON.
YOU’LL HEAR DISCUSSION ABOUT JOE
BIDEN’S BIOGRAPHY AND ECONOMICS
OVER THE NEXT THREE NIGHTS.
>> YOU KNOW, RICK WILSON, WE
CAN’T SAY IT’S EARLY ANYMORE
WHEN WE LOOK AT POLICYLS.
WE’RE STARTING TO GET INTO THE
EARLY STRETCH.
EARLY VOTING WILL START IN THE
NEXT FEW WEEKS IN QUITE A FEW
STATES.
I THINK NORTH CAROLINA IS ONE OF
THE FIRST.
WE HAVE A POLL OUT OF WISCONSIN
THIS MORNING THAT WE’VE SHOWN
THAT SHOWS JOE BIDEN UP BY SIX
POINTS.
THAT’S FAIRLY CONSISTENT.
YOU GO TO THE CROSS TABS, FAIRLY
CONSISTENT YOU HAVE SUBURBAN
VOTERS MOVING AWAY FROM DONALD
TRUMP, SENIORS MOVING AWAY FROM
DONALD TRUMP, EDUCATED VOTERS
MOVING AWAY FROM DONALD TRUMP.
I’M JUST CURIOUS, THOUGH.
SIX POINTS.
IS THAT STILL A LITTLE TOO CLOSE
FOR COMFORT?
NOT ONLY IN THIS POLL BUT ALSO
IN POLLS THAT YOU SEE IN
MICHIGAN, ARIZONA, NORTH
CAROLINA AND OTHER SWING STATES?
WHERE ARE WE?
WHERE IS THIS STATE OF THE RACE
AS FAR AS YOU’RE CONCERNED BY
ALL THE NUMBERS YOU’RE LOOKING
AT?
>> JOE, ON THE ELECTORAL COLLEGE
LIKELY VOTER POLLS, BIDEN HAS A
MEANINGFUL BUT NOT SUFFICIENT
ADVANTAGE.
AND I THINK IT’S IMPORTANT IN
THE COMING WEEKS THAT PEOPLE
FOCUS IN THOSE STATES, THEY
FOCUS RESOURCES, COMMUNICATIONS
EFFORTS, STRATEGIC EFFORTS IN
THOSE STATES TO REV UP THE EARLY
VOTING BECAUSE THIS IS GOING TO
START AS EARLY VOTING STARTS IN
A VERY SHORT WINDOW FROM NOW IN
MOST STATES, DONALD TRUMP IS
GOING TO TRY TO ROLL OUT AN
AUGUST, SEPTEMBER AND OCTOBER
SURPRISE TO DRIVE DOWN
DEMOCRATIC TURNOUT.
WE’RE GOING TO HAVE TO BE READY
FOR THOSE THINGS.
THE EARLIER PEOPLE VOTE AND
REQUEST THEIR ABSENTEE BALLOT
AND GET BACK IN, THE BETTER WE
ARE.
ESPECIALLY IF HE’S PLAYING
SHENANIGANS WITH THE POSTAL
SERVICE AND OTHER THINGS.
IT’S IMPORTANT TO KEEP THAT UP
IN THESE STATES AND TO NOT TAKE
ANYTHING FOR GRANTED.
YOU CANNOT REST WITH DONALD
TRUMP.
HE IS A FERAL ANIMAL TRAPPED IN
A CAGE RIGHT NOW.
HE’LL DO ANYTHING.
LIE, CHEAT, STEAL, SUPPRESS THE
VOTE.
HE’LL DO ALL KINDS OF THINGS TO
KEEP REVVING UP HIS BASE,
DEPRESSING DEMOCRATIC TURNOUT
AND FEED THE MONSTER THAT KEEPS
THE FUNDRAISING GOING FOR HIM.
YOU CAN EXPECT A LOT OF
WHITE-HOT CRAZY COMING AT YOU
REALLY SOON NOW FROM DONALD
TRUMP.
>> JOHN HEILEMANN, WHAT ARE WE
LOOKING AT TONIGHT?
WHAT ARE WE EXPECTING AT THE DNC
TONIGHT?
>> WELL, I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE
HIGHLIGHT FOR TONIGHT I THINK IS
GOING TO BE THE WOMAN THAT
YOU’RE GOING TO HAVE ON THE NEXT
MORNING WHICH IS TO SAY THURSDAY
MORNING -- WEDNESDAY MORNING, I
GUESS.
WHICH IS DR. JILL BIDEN WHO, TO
MY POINT A SECOND AGO.
THINK ABOUT THE TWO BIG PIECES
OF BUSINESS THIS CONVENTION HAS
TO DO.
TELLING JOE BIDEN’S STORY,
MAKING HIM THE ACCEPTABLE
ALTERNATIVE.
THEY’VE MADE THE CASE AGAINST
DONALD TRUMP FOR MONTHS NOW.
STILL MAKING IT, BUT CAN JOE
BIDEN BE THE ACCEPTABLE
ALTERNATIVE?
A LOT OF THAT IS BIOGRAPHICAL
WORK AND NO ONE KNOWS HIM BETTER
THAN DR. JILL BIDEN.
SHE’S GOING TO GET A BUNCH OF
TIME TO TELL THE STORY OF THEIR
RELATIONSHIP AND TELL THE STORY,
THE HUMAN STORY OF JOE BIDEN.
A LOT OF THE STUFF THAT’S HAND
TO HIM THAT MAKES HIM THE
CHARACTER OF EMPATHY THAT IS
SUCH A STARK AND APPEALING
CONTRAFTS TO DONALD TRUMP.
WE’LL HEAR THE FIRST PART OF
THAT STORY TOLD TONIGHT BY HER
AND THAT’S, I SAY, A POLITICALLY
VERY, VERY IMPORTANT PIECE OF
BUSINESS THEY NEED TO GET DONE.
>> REALLY LOOKING FORWARD TO IT.
JOHN HEILEMANN, WE’LL SEE YOU
TOMORROW AT 6:00 P.M. AND RICK
WILSON, THANK YOU.
HIS BOOK "RUNNING AGAINST THE
DEVIL: A PLOT TO SAVE AMERICA
