[MUSIC PLAYING]
SPEAKER 1: Well, thank
you for being here.
Thank you, DC Comics.
So I wanted to start by asking a
general question to all of you.
What does Superman stand for?
And why has he been a fan
favorite for 80 years?
Who's brave?
PAUL DINI: Well, when
you're that strong,
you don't stand for much.
SPEAKER 1: [LAUGHS]
PAUL DINI: Sorry, bad joke.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Well, hope is
what he stands for in
the most general sense.
And that's why the character
has lasted long because you
can't argue with that.
It's inarguable.
Hope is good.
So, yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Agreed.
DAN JURGENS: Moral integrity.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah, which
extends to everything.
MARV WOLFMAN: Truth without
looking for a reward.
PAUL DINI: Yeah, he
stands for the future.
He puts himself up there
as a suggestion of what
mankind could look toward.
And he doesn't force
anybody to do that.
But he's out there and
seeks to inspire people.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Yeah, and also truth,
justice, and the American way.
This is a phrase synonymous
with Superman for decades.
And it's just one of those
almost cliche things.
But now in this day and
age, truth and justice
and the American way--
they mean different things
to different people.
SPEAKER 1: Right.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: And
some of it is under siege.
And so writing a character
who believes in them so much--
it's actually a great
way to spend your day.
MARV WOLFMAN: Well, it's
completely ingrained in him.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Yeah, oh yeah.
MARV WOLFMAN: He doesn't
have to think about doing it.
He just does it.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yep.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, and we
need that always, especially
right now.
PAUL DINI: Exactly.
SPEAKER 1: So do
you guys see him
more as the Boy Scout
figure he has kind of been
for a long time or
more as the prominently
alien counter-cultural
figure he's been recently
and perhaps was originally?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Well, I
don't see him as a Boy Scout.
That was the question
as the new Spider--
Spider-Man-- Superman, rather.
DAN JURGENS: Wait, wait, wait.
What was that?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: I'm
still writing Spider-Man--
PAUL DINI: Oh, yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
It's going to be a while.
I'm still writing
Spider-Man on my checks.
But with Superman comes a great
deal of empathy and pathos.
And sometimes people
can relate to that
as vanilla or Boy Scout.
And nothing could be
further from the truth.
And I remember, like, when I was
writing, like, Captain America
or Cyclops, they would
say the same thing and go,
isn't that a vanilla character?
I'd go, oh, no, no, no, no.
Those characters are the most
interesting to peel back on.
As someone who can stand
there and has the guts
to be a Boy Scout, there's
a lot going on in there.
And to peel it back and show
you how relatable it is,
is quite something.
MARV WOLFMAN: Well, to call
someone a Boy Scout in the way
they mean it means
they're bland.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
MARV WOLFMAN: And
that's ridiculous.
A character who is just
trying to do good, who's
trying to do the right thing--
if you say that's bland,
if you say that's bad,
you're saying doing
the right thing is bad.
But doing the wrong
thing is cool.
And that's totally the wrong
message for the character.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Totally.
PAUL DINI: I've always
thought of him as--
there was a line, I think,
in one of the early Fleischer
Superman cartoons.
There was a race of Supermen
from the planet Krypton.
And I've always felt that
there was something about him,
maybe either
spiritually or even just
in the way the
Kryptonians evolved,
that they look ahead, that
they look out for each other.
They look toward
the better things.
Whereas humans might see crime
as an option or something
to consider, that's
not the Kryptonian way.
It would be abhorrent
to think that way.
And I think that he personifies
the best of that nature
and is trying to put it out
there as a way of saying,
this is where I come from.
And this is what I do.
And I think he was lucky enough
to find adopted parents who
fostered that belief in him.
SPEAKER 1: Mm-hm.
Anything to add, Dan?
DAN JURGENS: No,
only that to me,
the Boy Scout thing-- he only
ever had a couple of villains
refer to him as a
Boy Scout, if any.
That was always something that
came up on the part of fans.
And they meant it in
a derogatory sense.
And I always thought was
remarkably unfortunate
because, yeah, it's true.
If we're to say it's bad to try
and embrace the best qualities,
there's something
totally wrong with that.
PAUL DINI: Mm-hm.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah,
but the struggle to do it
is not a vanilla struggle.
DAN JURGENS: No, not at all.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
It's insanely hard
to do what he's doing.
So I always, like, bat
that away as not even
worth discussing because it's so
obvious what a struggle it is.
DAN JURGENS: Right.
PAUL DINI: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, so see,
being good is cool, guys.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: So it's probably safe
to assume that most Superman
fans obviously cannot fly
or bench press the Earth.
So what do you think
makes Superman relatable?
DAN JURGENS: I think it's the
fact that he is one of us.
And if you go back to his
creation and this idea that
here is this kind of like farm
kid in the middle of the United
States in Kansas that I
thought at that time, in 1938,
that becomes representative
of what we were thinking
America was at that point.
It was much more typical
then than it is now.
But at the same time, I think
that is very much who he is--
this farm kid who grew up
with a respect for life
because if you live on a farm,
you have animals around you
all the time.
They come, and they go.
They die.
There's all sorts of things
with the planting season
that comes and goes.
And everything lives and
dies and is born again stuff.
And I think because
of that, that
is something that has always
been imbued in the character.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Marv agrees.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Thanks, Brian.
You're his assistant.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Yeah, I'm his hype man.
SPEAKER 1: So how
do you understand
Superman's relationship
with Batman,
Wonder Woman, and the rest
of the Justice League?
MARV WOLFMAN: I think it's a
matter of seeing people trying
to accomplish the same goals,
but watching them do it
in a different way,
and the realization
that you can't have people do
everything you want them to.
Everybody has the right
to go their own way.
But their mission is the same.
SPEAKER 1: Right.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: So
often when you're kids,
you're reading these comics.
And one of the superheroes will
always say, Superman's here.
What are we going to do?
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: And
so the amount of respect--
like, physical, and emotional,
and spiritual respect
they have for
Superman-- is enormous.
He is the standard of which they
are all trying to live up to,
to the point where it's
annoying that he's there,
because he's constant.
He's always living up to it.
So living up to
that can be immense.
But at the same time, he
seems to respect the others
in a way they
can't even process.
Like, he goes to Superman--
I mean, he goes to Batman
and Wonder Woman, and goes,
I need help with this, or
you know how to do this.
And I always like that
you've all written scenes
where they've always seemed,
oh, Superman needs my help.
Oh.
And I like that.
They genuinely
seem like friends.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
And--
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
They genuinely
seem to really like each other.
DAN JURGENS: Right.
And Superman never shows
up and says, I'm the guy.
I think the whole
point is he always
has this sense of
presence about him.
And they respond
to him as the guy.
But he'd be the last guy
to ever say, I'm the guy,
if that makes sense.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Which makes him the guy.
DAN JURGENS: Right, exactly.
PAUL DINI: Which makes him
the guy, exactly, yeah.
MARV WOLFMAN: He's the one
who just his presence inspires
others.
And whether it's the normal
people in Metropolis,
or the world, or
other superheroes,
you want to do well for him.
You wanted to be the
best because of him.
If he's going to
take you someplace,
you know it's going to be good.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Yeah, I think
you wrote a scene where the
superheroes are like, ugh,
I don't want to do this thing.
And they're like, all right.
I mean, you can't
not be your best self
when he's standing there.
You just have to suck it up.
PAUL DINI: He's the best leader
because he doesn't necessarily
lead.
He allows the others
to come to the fore.
DAN JURGENS: Yep.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: He lets
Batman think he's leading.
PAUL DINI: Yeah.
[CHUCKLING]
SPEAKER 1: So is Clark Kent
or Superman the disguise?
What separates
Clark Kent's persona
from the Superman persona?
MARV WOLFMAN: I think
they're the same.
DAN JURGENS: I do, too.
MARV WOLFMAN: Superman,
or rather Kal-El,
came to Earth as an infant.
All of his morality, all of his
viewpoint comes from the Kents.
Therefore, he's
the right person.
He's the real person.
Superman doesn't talk about it.
But he goes out and implements
what the Kents taught him--
to be right, to be
good, to try your best.
So I don't see much
of a difference.
Clark is just the
character who isn't flashy.
But they're both always
trying to do the best.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: I think
about that "Kill Bill" bit
often.
I mean, it gets brought
up to us quite a lot.
Then people think that that's
a statement on Superman.
And you have to
make a statement.
But my feelings about
it are so different.
Like even using
the word disguise--
it's like I wouldn't
even use it.
What I'm a little obsessed
with right now writing them
is that Superman was
kind of thrust on him.
Like, his father said,
you are going to do this.
And we're going to
send you to do this.
The choice that Clark made in
his life was to be a reporter.
Like, everything else
was thrust upon him.
Or he was sent to a place.
But he chose to be a reporter.
He said, there's
truth out there.
And there's justice to be
had that Superman can't
get to just punching it, right?
There's another way through it.
And being a writer
to reveal that truth
is something I'm going to do.
So he chooses to spend
his time doing that.
And I find that
enormously admirable.
It makes me love
him all the more.
MARV WOLFMAN: And it's something
that all his powers cannot
alter in any way.
He is a writer.
He loves being a writer.
He loves telling the story
that he's going to tell.
And all of his powers
means nothing to him.
It's all about getting
those words down and getting
the thoughts down.
And that's pure Clark.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
DAN JURGENS: Mm-hm.
Right.
And I think there's a difference
to be drawn between a character
that puts on a mask and
goes and does what he does--
or she does--
because they're making
a conscious decision
at that point to have
this other identity.
I think with Superman,
I've always looked at it
as being like someone
who's a police officer,
or a firefighter, or whatever--
someone who's in
the military-- where
this is what they put
on when they wear to go
do what they do.
But they come home, and
they're still that person.
And they're not making an effort
to disguise themselves so much.
So I've always
separated Superman out
from many other
characters that way.
PAUL DINI: Mm-hm.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: And
for people who don't know--
and I'm going to embarrass Dan.
So I had been doing an
insane amount of research.
And then all of a sudden--
and I got to know
Dan over the course
of this whole new
chapter in my life.
And then you start
going back and, like,
well, the death of Superman
was how many years ago?
And that wasn't--
DAN JURGENS: Three.
[CHUCKLING]
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: And
that wasn't his first Superman
story.
He's been with
Superman for as long
as anyone's been
with any character
in the history of comics.
Like, people talking about
Chris Claremont and X-Men.
But what Dan's
accomplished on Superman
is equal, if not
greater, because
of the size of the stories
and what he's accomplished.
So it's quite amazing
what he's done.
And he did it so quietly.
Like he got to people.
He kind of just slid in
there and got it done.
But here we are, decades
later, with one of the greatest
achievements with a character.
So.
DAN JURGENS: Thank you.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
[APPLAUSE]
SPEAKER 1: You embarrassed?
DAN JURGENS: Yes.
[LAUGHS]
PAUL DINI: Little bit.
DAN JURGENS: It doesn't seem
like it's been that long.
It really doesn't.
So, yeah.
SPEAKER 1: So since
you brought it up, Dan,
how did it feel
to kill Superman?
DAN JURGENS: When we started,
it was just a story to tell.
And we had talked
about it a couple
of times before as let's
do the death of Superman
because it was a story
we had read in our youth.
And it had been done
a couple of times.
And we never had the rest
of the story to go with it.
And it became a story
that was all about trying
to make a statement
about Superman
by removing him from the book.
So we had "Death of Superman."
After that, it was essentially
"Funeral for a Friend," which
was the world without Superman.
That was the story
we wanted to get to.
Before that, the
death of Superman
was just this big, fun exercise.
But what we wanted
to write about later
was a world with no Superman.
So at first it was just
this cool story idea.
But then, as the hype
started to build,
it really-- as I was writing
and drawing the story,
you become very
aware that this isn't
going to be the normal thing.
An awful lot of people are going
to be looking at this book.
And they're going
to be reading it.
And everybody was
talking about it.
And it became a story
element in terms of news,
even before the book
came out, that it
felt like there was always
something hanging over me,
especially as I was
drawing the book,
because it was all splash
pages and everything like that.
But it was a fun and
magical experience.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Well,
and I'm from Cleveland.
So when the death of
Superman happened,
I was actually working at a
comic book store in Cleveland,
going to art school.
And the line out the door that
day that Superman died was--
DAN JURGENS: Oh, it was crazy.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
--the craziest thing
I'd ever experienced.
We were in a mall in
downtown Cleveland.
And it was the length
of the mall of people
just buying Superman comics.
And the whole point of
working at the comic store
was not have to work this hard.
So I was very annoyed by you.
I wanted to sit and draw
my pages at the counter.
DAN JURGENS: I apologize now.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
And then I remember being
completely flustered by this.
And the phone rang.
And it was my mother.
And she goes, is
Superman really dead?
And I just hung up.
Uh, I've got to go.
And it was a crazy day.
SPEAKER 1: It was the first time
that had ever happened, right?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
No, yeah, yeah.
I have a very definitive
memory of everyone
really believing this
was going to happen.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, now
they come back to life.
But--
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Yeah, but--
SPEAKER 1: --not
back in the day.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
They fell for it.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, exactly.
DAN JURGENS: Well,
although-- and I've always
said, at the time, we did
not know when and how we
were going to bring him back.
We knew inevitably it
would happen at some point.
But then we also
suspended publication
for a couple of
months and everything.
And we did not know.
When we did that
entire story, we
had no idea how it
was going to happen.
We didn't know when exactly
it was going to happen,
just that eventually
it obviously had to.
But we didn't know.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: No, but
you did the perfect thing.
It was never about the death.
It was what do
you get out of it?
DAN JURGENS: Right, exactly.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
And that's the mistake
when you see other people
doing their death-cycle story,
they're so obsessed
with selling the death
that it's really what
do you get out of it?
Like, what kind of new stories
are you going to get like--
any superhero, it's
like, Batman dies.
And then you get all the other
players rise to the occasion.
And you get a new story.
And that's what you
guys had for years.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah, yeah, we did.
SPEAKER 1: So, Brian,
how did you end up at DC?
And why did you want to write
Action Comics and Superman?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
I ended up at DC--
over the years, they
had been very kind
and made it clear
that I was invited.
And a few years ago, a
serious offer was made.
But it just wasn't time yet.
I knew it would
happen eventually.
I just, I knew me well enough
to know, boy, it was just--
but it wasn't time.
I didn't feel like I'd finished
what I was doing over there
with "Jessica Jones" and
Miles and some other stuff.
But this time around,
they came at me
with a really decent offer that
was worth turning to my friends
at Marvel, who I
was friends with--
I'm still friends with.
And to turn to them
and go, hey, I've
got to go, it's got to be
enough for them to go, yeah,
you've got to go.
It had to be enough
for them to agree.
And it was.
And, yeah, I think
Dan and Jim just--
I guess everyone walks
in there and says
they want to do Batman.
I guess that's
what everyone does.
And so they were
braced for that and how
they were going to tell
me I'm not doing Batman.
But I said, if it comes
along that Superman
becomes available, that would
be, I think, where I would go.
But I don't know
where you're at.
And, again, it's someone's gig.
I don't want to
take someone's gig.
And then a day later,
he got over the shock
of me saying Superman and
said, actually, Action #1000
is coming down--
like, I don't want
to rush things.
But, boy, there's a
real opportunity here.
And I go, all right,
let me think about it.
And then I went
back to Cleveland
for my brother's wedding.
It just so happened my
brother was getting married.
And sorry you have to
hear this again, Dan.
And--
DAN JURGENS: No problem.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
And at the library
I used to hang out in all
the time, one of my friends
helps run it now.
And he had put together
a Superman exhibit
at the Cleveland Museum that
connected Cleveland and Judaism
and Superman and me and all this
other-- and I walk in there.
And it was like this maze
I had to walk through.
And by the end of it,
I just texted my wife
and go, close the deal.
I have to do this.
It really felt like someone
had put a show on for me.
It's like, see, you
love all this stuff.
You're connected to it.
It's part of your DNA.
And I just flashed.
I remembered I was the
artist for the Superman
parade in the '80s
when I was in college,
and how connected
it was to my youth.
And, boom, here we are.
SPEAKER 1: Great.
So you brought up Action Comics
#1000 which is why we're here.
So, Marv, you have a story
coming up in Action Comics
#1000 using artwork from
the legendary Curt Swan.
MARV WOLFMAN: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: And what was
it like to script a story
drawn by such an
acclaimed artist that's
no longer with us?
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: And where was
this art for all these years?
MARV WOLFMAN: I don't know.
There were four pages that
they found of something.
Superman's not in it.
They're a fragment.
It's not the first page.
There is no last page.
It was dialogued.
I have a hunch it was a writing
test of just four pages given
out to writers of something.
But I don't know.
Of course, nobody up there
is aware of what it is.
My assignment was to strip
out the copy, look at it,
and turn it into a complete
story with a beginning,
middle, and end, even though
there's no beginning, middle,
and end, and to make
it a Superman story,
even though there's
no Superman in it,
and to create an entire thing.
And I used to do this all the
time as an assistant editor
to Joe Kubert.
We would take old stories--
I don't know why Joe
wanted it done this way.
But we'd take old war stories.
And I would rewrite them
as current unknown soldier
stories.
At Marvel, we did it once.
And I don't remember the
order, but we lost the license
to either "John Carter"
or "Planet of the Apes."
We had the artwork for
one of those books,
and it had to be
converted to the other.
How you take a
"John Carter" story
and turn it into a "Planet of
the Apes," I don't remember.
But anyway, it's a
great, fun thing.
Now, I had worked
a lot with Kurt.
I did Superman for
years with Kurt.
Kurt is wonderful.
I mean, he's a brilliant artist.
I just loved his stuff.
So the idea of being able to
take these four isolated pages
and turn it into a
complete Superman story--
and I threw in a
Superman villain,
who you also don't see, because
the pages were already drawn--
was just wonderful.
It was like working
with Kurt again.
He was a dear, sweet man.
When I was at
Disney, I would hire
him to do short stories for us.
He was one of those
people I grew up with.
And I always wondered why
the covers of "Jimmy Olsen"
and a couple of the
books were so much better
than the insides.
And then I discovered all
the covers were done by Kurt.
Great artist, and it was
so much fun to do it.
SPEAKER 1: That's awesome.
So, Paul, I wanted to
ask about "Superman"
the animated series, because it
seems like for a lot of fans,
he's the definitive
version of Superman.
So what do you think makes him
distinct from other versions
of the Man of Steel?
PAUL DINI: Well, with
the animated series,
we were lucky in that we had
such an incredible wealth
and history of material to
draw from, from Superman's
various incarnations, from
comic books, from radio shows,
from comic strips.
Everything that he is in the
public mind we distilled down
into what we felt was a
universal telling of his story.
And we were able to concentrate
on him as Superman and Clark
Kent and also expand his cast
so it included the Kents back
at the farm, and
Lois, and Jimmy,
and do a take on all of them.
So it really grew beyond
Superman to being a show
that you really enjoyed
all his characters and all
the extended cast.
And it was fun to--
I know there have been
other animated versions.
And those characters were
certainly a part of it.
But in this case, we were really
able to draw from the work that
had gone before and make
Lois and Darkseid and Lana,
fun versions that, I think, were
unique to the animated series
but also rang true to
the fans in general.
And also, Superman
himself was just--
he was a joy to write.
At first, I was
wondering, how am I
going to write this character?
Because he doesn't
have the moodiness
and the dark side of Batman.
But he is an incredibly
likable character,
both as Clark and as Superman.
And it's fun, perhaps,
making him maybe
a little lower on the power
scale than he was in the comics
so that he was able to wrestle
with things a little bit more.
So it was more of a
matter of mind over matter
than just brawn, even though
you can show everything
in a cartoon.
He was a challenge to write,
and it was a lot of fun.
And I think people
picked up on that fun.
SPEAKER 1: So now
I want to move on
to my favorite part of the
talk, which is villains.
What do you think are or what
do you think are the most
interesting Superman villains?
And we have the
obvious, obviously.
But-- Lex.
[CHUCKLES] That's my favorite.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah,
I like Lex a lot.
I mean, I could do a three-year
Lex Luthor series easily.
I think there is that.
I was also always intrigued by
Toyman, for whatever reason,
just because it was so counter
to who Superman is, right?
I mean, here's this guy--
and that was always a
problem Superman had,
which was villains.
I mean, if you look throughout
the history of Superman,
there was always a problem
with some of the villains.
But I found Toyman to
be strangely intriguing,
just because he was so different
than Superman, which was here's
a guy who makes toys.
How can he possibly be
a threat to Superman?
How does that story not
end on page one, right?
Superman shows up.
Boom, you're gone.
The story is over.
So I was always intrigued
by that level of villain
and how you could possibly
make it work with Superman.
SPEAKER 1: I didn't
expect that answer.
Thank you.
That's great.
DAN JURGENS: Sure.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Yeah, Toyman
shows up in my second issue.
I couldn't believe it.
DAN JURGENS: See, you get it.
You get it, yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: But I
couldn't believe it, either.
I couldn't believe it.
I go, my subconscious put it in.
And as I'm consciously
writing it, I go--
DAN JURGENS: OK.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
--it must happen.
We agree.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Anyone else?
PAUL DINI: I always liked the--
with Lex Luthor,
there was something
I always found rather poignant
with their relationship
in thinking about the character,
in that Lex is someone who has
basically had to buy affection.
Like, he put himself on
the scale in Metropolis,
where he is beneficence.
And he has created all these
great scientific advances.
And I'm sure his name is on
a lot of public buildings.
And I'm sure he is
lauded wherever he goes.
But that wouldn't happen unless
he was paying for it, unless he
was going out there and
buying affection, as it was,
with his inventions and
with the things he does.
And there is Superman, who
just does it out of his heart.
And people flock to him.
And I think that galls Luthor
on a deeply soulful level.
And it's like, I have
to do all this just
to get a friendly hello.
And he rescues a cat out of
a tree, and I'm forgotten.
And I think that, in a lot
of ways, spurs on his hatred.
MARV WOLFMAN: I
like the characters
who can out-think Superman.
I'm not really into
the big punchy guys
because you're not going
to be able to defeat him.
The beauty of what you did was
that he was finally meeting
a character who could do that.
But in the past, if Luthor
put on a super suit,
or somebody else
attacked him, he
could physically
take care of you.
So that's not interesting.
What I like is the characters
who out-think because that's
not Superman's superpower.
He's smart, but he's not Luthor.
He's not Brainiac.
And those characters, to
me, are far more interesting
because they match
Superman in ways
that Superman doesn't
deal with the best.
He has to go out of his
way and find some way
to deal with them that's
not in his comfort zone.
So to me, Brainiac and Luthor
are the strongest characters.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: And we have
some new villains coming up.
Starting in Action
#1000, it's the debut
of a big new villain
for Superman,
because I agree with Dan.
As good as the good villains
are, there are good villains.
And then there are some others.
But it's not enough.
Compared to, like,
Spider-Man or Batman,
he doesn't have nearly the
rogues gallery that he should
have, compared to his legacy.
So we're going to be as
additive as possible.
And starting right
away with Action
#1000 is this new villain who
knows something about Superman
and the history of Superman
that Superman does not know.
And that's going to really
challenge him, both spiritually
and physically.
And then in the pages
of Action Comics,
we're debuting some criminal
activity in Metropolis
that has been going on
right under Superman's nose.
There is a criminal
who has no ego.
Like, Lex has a lot of ego.
I need Superman to acknowledge
that I did this, you know?
And imagine a criminal that
is inspired by Lex Luthor
and excited by, yeah, Lex, you
go get Superman's attention
as much as you want.
Go get Daddy's attention.
And we're going to run
our business like adults.
And I don't need
Superman's attention.
And I don't need any of it.
And what kind of criminal
empire can you build right
under Superman's nose?
How smart do you have
to be to do this,
and it's been going on for
years, and he didn't even know?
So that's what we're going to
be doing coming in the future.
SPEAKER 1: Wow.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: So you've
got to pick that up.
So no names?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: That was
my point, if I wasn't clear.
[CHUCKLING]
PAUL DINI: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Trying to
sell comics here, guys.
So no names?
You can't spoil the name yet?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Well, the name
of the big villain in Action
#1000 is named Rogol Zar.
And this is an alien that's
coming to Earth with an agenda.
The first part of the name
is named after my doctor,
who saved my life.
I had a big thing last December.
I had a MRSA infection.
And every day, I would hear her.
This German woman would
come in and work on my face.
But I couldn't see her.
I was blind.
And I'd hear this
name, Rogol, every day.
And then I'd go,
she's definitely
going to be the villain.
And I couldn't wait to
tell her as soon as I--
and then I told her when
I was finally awake.
And I go, I think I'm going to
use your name as the villain
in the new Superman books.
And she went, uh-huh.
And then I realized I never told
her what I did for a living.
Like, and so it just sounded
like an insane person.
And then she Googled me
and then the next day
came in very excited
that she may actually
be in the Superman books.
DAN JURGENS: And
can I just say how
cool it is you work
in a Google plug?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: I did.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah, you did.
PAUL DINI: Yeah, you
definitely did that.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Do
I get free Google now?
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
[CHUCKLING]
SPEAKER 1: I didn't know that.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Cool.
OK, so do you guys prefer
to think about Superman
as the last survivor
of Krypton or as part
of an extended
family of survivors
that includes Zod, Supergirl,
his dog Krypto, et cetera?
DAN JURGENS:
Somewhere in between.
SPEAKER 1: OK.
DAN JURGENS: I think that
one of the nicest titles that
can be ascribed to Superman
is last son of Krypton.
I just love that because it
is so heavy with implication.
MARV WOLFMAN: Yeah,
the responsibility.
DAN JURGENS: Right, exactly.
It describes him and his
background so well, just
last son of Krypton.
And so I really like that.
And it's like, OK,
Supergirl, fine.
But there comes a
point where it gets
kind of too much because
then that invalidates
the last son of Krypton idea.
So I say it's like in the
middle somewhere, little more
towards just a handful.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: What would
you label the horse, Streaky--
Streaky the Super Horse?
DAN JURGENS: As the
idea that probably
shouldn't be in the book.
MARV WOLFMAN: Comic.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
The Super Horse, yeah.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah, comic.
Streaky's the cat.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Streaky's the cat.
I apologize.
Again, I'm new.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
PAUL DINI: Beppo's the monkey.
DAN JURGENS: Yes.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah, OK.
They're Googling it right now.
Yeah, that's all real stuff.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Everything
we just said is real stuff.
SPEAKER 1: There's a couple
of people here, they're like--
true nerds are
like, you got to--
OK, so, Paul, in "Superman--
Peace on Earth," Superman
confronts the limits of his
powers, not in the form of
an all-powerful super villain
but against a very
real problem--
world hunger.
Why did you choose to
test Superman this way?
PAUL DINI: Well, when
Alex Ross and I came up
with a story for that,
we wanted to tell
a story that was very
close to Superman's heart
and also to his origins.
We didn't really want to do
the ultimate punch-up with Lex
or Brainiac or
anything like that.
We wanted to go back to Superman
at his most human level,
and also do a story that speaks
to his origin as a farmer
because he goes back
to that at the end,
at least as a touchstone
at the end of that story.
But it was also kind
of we put ourselves
in the position of what
if we were Superman?
I think everybody
has fantasized,
I want to put on the cape.
And I want to solve all
of humanity's problems.
And once we looked at it
from that point of view,
it was like, OK, then we're
dealing in a real world,
with real people, with
other countries that
have other agendas.
And the ideals of Superman don't
always work in the real world.
I mean, it gets to be
too human, too selfish.
And what does he do in
a situation like that?
If he goes out to
eliminate that,
then he becomes a god, a
monster, or a dictator.
And he's got to
take a step back.
And even though what he's trying
to do is set a good example
and be altruistic, all
he can do is suggest.
And all he can do is
lead in small ways.
He can't solve the big problems.
When a dam is busting or when
aliens invade, that's great.
But on a real human level, when
it comes to give and receive,
he's just as human as all of us.
And that was something
that was really important
for us to touch on that.
SPEAKER 1: That's great.
Marv, I heard you got
lucky as a young man
while touring the DC
office and received
an unpublished Superman story.
Can you talk about that?
And is it true that
it's about to be
published for the first
time in "Action Comics--
80 Years of Superman"?
MARV WOLFMAN:
Yeah, the DC Comics
used to have a tour every
week of the DC offices.
And I went to high
school about four
or five blocks away-- high
school of art and design
because my intent was
to become an artist.
So I would run over
there and go on the tours
when I was able to.
One of the times
that I was going
there, Sol Harrison, who was the
production chief at the time--
later became publisher-- was
wheeling out a post-office
cart--
one of these things
that's about--
oops-- six, seven feet
wide, six, seven feet long,
four feet wide, four feet
high, filled with artwork
from the 1940s, all of
which was being written off.
It was never published.
And they were finally
trying to clear space.
And he was taking it
to the incinerators.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Ugh.
SPEAKER 1: Ugh.
MARV WOLFMAN: Now, you've got
to remember, it's horrifying,
even the concept of that
and some of the other stuff
that was done.
But back then, not even the
artist wanted their art back.
To most of those people,
most of the artists--
because I've spoken to them--
they wanted to
clear their offices.
It was giant stacks of paper
that had no value, as far
as they were concerned.
It took the fans-- it
took those of us here
and the fans from my generation
to say this work had value.
This work was special.
Anyway, he's wheeling
this stuff out.
And there's three or
four people on the tour.
And he says, if you
kids want anything,
grab it before I take
it to the incinerator.
Like Uncle Scrooge, we dove
into the money vault, swam
through the pages, grabbed
everything we could.
Did not take the
rest of the tour
because we were weighed
down with artwork.
And this is the 1940s artwork.
So it's a lot larger than
the artwork that most of you
may be familiar with that
you see at conventions.
We rushed downstairs
and started trading.
And I noticed that
I had 8 or 9 pages
of a 12-page story that was all
written off a Superman story.
And I started trading multiple
pages to get the last three.
So I walked out of there.
I took a cab at,
like, 13 years old.
I had to get a cab--
because it was so heavy--
with a complete Superman
story, as well as
a whole bunch of other stuff.
And it never saw print.
It never had.
When they were putting
together the "Action Comics--
80 Years of Superman"
Deluxe Edition, Paul Levitz,
who used to be publisher-- he's
now working with them in other
ways--
asked if he could print it.
And I said, absolutely.
This is the perfect place.
It's the only place that
I would have said yes to.
And you'll be able to see it.
They left it in black and white
because it was never published.
It was never colored.
And they didn't want
to color it now.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Why wasn't it published?
Do you know why?
MARV WOLFMAN: They had thousands
of pages of unpublished stuff.
Now, the artwork was done in
1946, written by Jerry Siegel,
drawn by the Joe
Shuster Studios.
That we know because Paul Levitz
was able to find the bills.
DC has everything.
But they found that.
Why it wasn't published
back then, I don't know.
But it never was.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Was it,
like, filthy or something?
MARV WOLFMAN: No.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: It was
like a completely inappropriate
Superman.
MARV WOLFMAN: It was as weird
as all the stories from 1940s
were.
But two years later,
in 1947 or '48,
we found a new version of
that story, drawn by Wayne
Boring, now a 10-page story.
So for some reason, they
decided not to publish it
but then reused the script,
only cleaning it up or fixing it
up a little bit better.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Fascinating.
MARV WOLFMAN: So for
the first time ever,
the story is going to see print.
And it couldn't be in a
better book than that one.
So I'm really pleased about it.
PAUL DINI: Right.
SPEAKER 1: That's great.
I'm jealous.
So we're, unfortunately,
almost running out of time,
and we want to get some
audience questions going.
So as a last quick
general question,
what are your favorite
Superman stories?
It can be one you wrote.
DAN JURGENS: I am really bad
at issue numbers and everything
else.
But there is a story that--
we had earlier mentioned Wayne
Boring--
where Superman goes
back to Krypton.
And it must've been
a late-'50s story.
Help me out here, Marv.
MARV WOLFMAN: Yes, it is.
DAN JURGENS: You know
what the story is.
Yeah, "Superman's
Return to Krypton"
was the title of the story.
MARV WOLFMAN: Go to the old guy.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
MARV WOLFMAN: He'd remember.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
It was called "Superman's
Return to Krypton."
And I remember
reading it as a kid.
And it just struck me because
it was a very sad story.
Superman gets to
go back to Krypton.
He sees what a
beautiful place it was.
And it was also this
story about discovery.
It was stuff that he didn't
know about where he came from.
And I think,
ultimately, we're all
curious about where we
came from and stories
we never would have heard as a
kid, like your crazy old aunt
never told you until
you were 35 or whatever.
So there was something
about that that I still
find very poignant to this day,
and a story that was really,
I think, kind of ahead of its
time for when it appeared.
MARV WOLFMAN: For me, I'd also
go back to about that time
period because I would not
talk about anything I did.
Someone else could, I hope.
SPEAKER 1: No pressure.
MARV WOLFMAN: The original
"Death of Superman,"
which was an amazing story
written by Jerry Siegel,
the creator of
Superman in the '60s--
late '50s, early
'60s, something--
where Superman dies.
And the story was
amazingly effective
because he actually dies in it.
It's a great, great story.
And I remember it as a kid.
And even now, if I read
it, it still is emotional.
There were a lot of
stories back then.
More modern times,
"All Star Superman"
by Grant Morrison I thought was
a really good Superman story.
Again, from left field--
those are the type
of stories I like.
And also "Superman for All
Seasons," by Jeph Loeb.
I thought that was a
really solid story that
took you in a different
place for Superman.
There's been so many Superman
stories done over 80 years.
It's nice when someone finds
a new tack to writing him.
SPEAKER 1: Right.
PAUL DINI: And I'll
go with "Whatever
Happened to the Man
of Tomorrow?" by Alan.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Oh, yeah.
PAUL DINI: All right,
you get that one.
I'll take the first
Mxyzptlk story.
I mean, I love the little jerk.
And looking at that
very first one, where
he's this little weird
Elmer Fudd flying man,
I just thought, this is
the fun side of Superman.
And I loved that story--
not every story with him.
But I always liked the
idea that in some way,
he is to Superman what
Superman is to us.
Superman's an advanced creature.
Then one step beyond--
a few dimensions beyond
is this strange
godlike creature that
can either be fun or amusing or
else be absolutely terrifying.
And then I'm sort of intrigued.
What's beyond him?
What's in the dimensions--
what scares him?
And I always liked
that relationship.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Mine was "Whatever
Happened to the
Man of Tomorrow?"
which was Alan Moore's, like,
last testament of Superman
but before crisis and you
tearing everything up.
MARV WOLFMAN: I killed them all.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
And that one was--
I think, the first time, like,
there was genuine emotion.
Like, you felt like
there's loss happening.
And "Superman #400" is
this anniversary issue.
And it's one of these great
moments in comics where they
literally found, like, who would
be the most insane, coolest
people to write
and draw Superman
that you could ever imagine?
People not even from the world
of traditional superheroes.
They have Steve Ditko do
Superman, and Moebius,
and Brian Bolland.
And it's just this celebration
of stories and artwork.
And it rattled me.
And when I was offered,
like, "Action #1000," which
is in the same vein of
that, I was, oh yeah,
I have to be part of that.
But if you ever get a
chance, it's "Superman #400."
It also comes with a
Superman portfolio.
So you get, like,
a large version
of all these beautiful
images of Superman.
And it just-- everything you'd
ever want out of the Superman
experience right there.
And the first Superman
movie, Richard Donner.
Just showed my
5-year-old son the movie,
thinking he wouldn't make
about 10 minutes into it.
Like, I thought he'd bail.
Riveted.
Couldn't take his
eyes off of the movie.
So it's a great experience.
SPEAKER 1: Great.
So who wants to go first?
Oh.
I'm going to throw
this to you awkwardly.
AUDIENCE: OK.
I'll [INAUDIBLE].
SPEAKER 1: So here it goes.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: What is that?
AUDIENCE: That is awkward.
SPEAKER 1: That is the way we
ask Google questions awkwardly
because we like to
embarrass people.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: All right.
AUDIENCE: We like to
really embarrass people
who can't throw, specifically.
SPEAKER 1: Yes.
[CHUCKLES]
AUDIENCE: So my
question for you guys
is, how do you deal
with considering
how long the Superman
comic has been around,
how do you deal with
keeping it consistent
and not conflicting
inside of itself?
Like, did you have to consider
that when you're writing?
Or is there somebody who
reads it later and says,
you totally can't say
that because it really
conflicts with this
other thing that
was said like 30 years ago?
Or does it just
kind of work out?
DAN JURGENS: Well, I was lucky
because when I first started,
Superman had had a new starting
point, where they just said,
OK, we're starting clean.
And that was John Byrne
and Marv and Jerry Ordway
who relaunched the franchise.
So I was fortunate enough
to be able to come on
and say we had a
fairly clean slate.
And I think that's
important to do.
It's only fair because
to strictly adhere
to 80 years of
publishing history
is really, really hard to
do and totally impractical,
I might add, I think.
MARV WOLFMAN: I
think if you worry
about making sure
every story fits
into some place in continuity,
you're not able to expand out.
The box that you're in keeps
getting smaller and smaller.
I think you have to take
the spirit of the character,
the idea of the character, and
the approach of what you're
trying to do to
tell more stories,
and not worry about every
little detail of the past.
It's fiction.
No one's going to come and
say, that's not what happened.
I was there.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Yes, they will.
That's what Twitter [INAUDIBLE].
AUDIENCE: Are you sure?
MARV WOLFMAN: Yeah.
AUDIENCE: I'm pretty sure--
SPEAKER 1: That's the internet.
AUDIENCE: --people at
Comic-Con probably would.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Yeah, what I
do is I ignore everyone else's
work and just barrel ahead
straight.
And it works out great for me.
MARV WOLFMAN: That's
already on Twitter.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
Honestly--
MARV WOLFMAN: Brian says--
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: No.
You know what the key is?
You live like how you're living.
You live in the moment.
You live in the now.
Like you, yourself,
you live in the moment.
You're not sitting there
living your continuity that
brought you to this--
I'm not sitting here with a big
thought balloon over my head,
thinking about what happened
to me in the eighth grade that
led me here.
It's in the moment.
And when things happen
that relate to your past,
then you bring them up
when they're appropriate.
But it's a trap that comic book
writers can get sucked into,
where you think you
have to acknowledge
everything that ever happened to
this character at every moment.
Or if, like I said,
like, if I tell my wife
I loved her today--
wait a second.
35 years ago, you told a girl
in high school you loved her.
Like, that's how comic book
fans sometimes act at you.
Like, wait a minute.
Like, well, yeah, that was
true then, and it's true here.
So anyway.
SPEAKER 1: Is that how you
reply to Twitter followers?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
No, I ignore it.
No, it's part of the game.
I actually like the
part of the game where
they go, hey, wait a minute.
I'm the resident
expert of Superman.
And I'm about to tell you
what you've done wrong.
I like being there for them.
[LAUGHING]
No, I do.
Like, I was writing "X-Men."
And someone who's
read every "X-Men"
wants to come give
me the business--
what a great time
they're having.
They've read all their
comics, and now they're
giving me the business.
Anyway.
AUDIENCE: My question was,
one of my favorite iterations
of Superman is when he shows up
in a "Justice League America"
episode where it's
Bizarro World.
And essentially, all of the
Justice League characters
are evil versions of themselves,
or at least morally defunct
versions of themselves.
And in that episode, Superman
lobotomizes Darkseid.
And I guess my
question is, that was
one of my favorite
iterations of Superman
because it showed
how hope fails.
Like, hope does diminish
after a period of time.
And that was kind of what that
Bizarro Justice League was
the amalgamation
of, was their world
had gone to such a dark point
that they just said, screw it.
We're just going to start
lobotomizing the enemy, right?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Well, it
depends what you're hoping for.
Like, if you're
hoping for a lobotomy,
it was a very hopeful story.
AUDIENCE: Yeah.
I guess my question is, is like,
that really resonated with me
because as real human
beings dealing with the day
to day, we do lose hope,
even in the small things
and sometimes very
easily in the big things.
And so that really
resonated with me
that, like, somebody as,
like you guys were saying,
a symbol of hope like Superman,
that in that iteration
of his story, he just quickly--
and, like, I think it's the
Batman from the regular world
sees that happening.
And he's like, holy sh-- like,
he's lobotomizing people.
We really have something
to worry about here.
Like, this is a serious threat.
Do you guys ever see
Superman going back
in a direction like
that, where his hope is
so on the hairline,
where he's dealing
with something that the world
itself or, like, the city
or even other superheroes
look to him and worry,
because if he loses hope, not
only is it a symbol of hope
crashing, but he might
really be something
to worry about himself?
PAUL DINI: Well, I think--
AUDIENCE: And that was
really kind of cool to me.
PAUL DINI: I think stories like
that are important because it
gives the heroes from the
real world-- our world--
a mirror to what could happen
if they do cross that line.
And it's like "It's a
Wonderful Life," where
you see what his life
could be like if he did,
in fact, lose hope.
I think with Superman, the
challenge is there to make sure
that he never loses
that because that's
what makes him different
from everybody else.
That's the ultimate test.
It's to keep that hope alive for
everybody else and for himself.
MARV WOLFMAN: Yeah.
That's, Paul, one
of a two-part story.
AUDIENCE: I mean, I've
seen [INAUDIBLE] episode.
But it still was brilliant.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Good answer, by the way.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
[CHUCKLING]
AUDIENCE: So I
really love Superman.
He was my first favorite
superhero as a kid.
So this is a really
cool talk for me.
So my question is, one of
the things that I think
makes Superman more
challenging in some ways
is that he doesn't have some
of that internal conflict
that you see in a Batman or
a Spider-Man or something,
where he's really,
really struggling
with his own insecurities
in a lot of places.
And I think there have been a
lot of really interesting takes
on that over the years,
from, Paul, when you brought
up earlier Superman
confronting, like,
a real-world situation
where his powers don't apply
or things like that.
And so I was curious,
without that level
of internal conflict, what
is your favorite way that you
or somebody else has approached
that kind of thing, of finding
a conflict, finding a challenge
for Superman that's not related
to that internal struggle?
MARV WOLFMAN: Well,
for me, I think
what you do with Superman
is his internal conflict is
about what is the best way
of solving this problem?
How do I do it with the
least collateral damage?
How do I create a
situation that makes
this work, rather than, oh, Lois
didn't want to date me tonight.
That's a very different
type of thing.
His problems deal
with how to do his job
and how to do it the
best way possible,
because he is only a person.
He may have a lot of powers.
But he's only a person.
And he's going to have questions
on is he doing the right thing.
How do I do it?
How do I make it work?
And he's going to keep trying
to find the best way that nobody
gets hurt in the process.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Yeah, I found myself
looking for my
relatability with Superman.
And the one internal struggle
I found for myself is I'm
a father.
I have four kids.
I have little kids.
I have big kids.
And one of the hardest
things for me for parenting
is you have to be on
your game all day.
You can't-- today, I'm going
to just be the worst version
of myself.
No, you have to be the
best version of yourself
like every day, or
at least try, right?
So you're, like, every day.
And it could be exhausting.
Like--
AUDIENCE: I have a 9-month-old.
So I'm starting to
figure that out.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Oh, yeah, well,
when they can walk and talk, and
they're actually watching you,
like, looking for hypocrisy--
like there's an age at, like, 7
or 8, where they walk around
the house going, well,
I didn't get any candy.
I'm going to watch and
see if you get any candy.
And so there's,
like, just general--
and I see Superman
has to do that.
He has to be Superman every day.
You can't just-- today, I'm
going to walk around in my robe
and-- no, I have to, like,
live up to this every day.
And that's the connection
I feel like as adults,
we have to live up to a
certain responsibility.
DAN JURGENS: Oh, yeah.
PAUL DINI: Yeah, absolutely.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: And if
we blow it once, we blew it.
That's it.
DAN JURGENS: I've
always had this thing
for a different
Superman story, where,
like, if there had
never been a Superman,
how would you do
it kind of thing.
And it was we pick up on
Superman when he's, like,
42 years old.
And even at then,
he's barely a myth
because he was someone
throughout that first 25 years
of him being Superman, never
revealed himself to the public.
He only ever would have come
out like once every three years
when the world
demanded it somehow.
And then ultimately,
the conflict
would have been exactly when
do you choose to get involved?
Because that, to
me, is something
we all face every day.
How often have we
walked down the street
and seen something
happening across the street
where we wondered, should
we get involved or not?
That woman-- she's really kind
of being hard on her child.
Should I go say something?
That's the conflict
for Superman, which
is when do you get involved?
And exactly how far do you go?
And you mentioned
this earlier, which
is Superman doesn't
tell people what to do.
He hopes to inspire.
And so you start to
build around that.
And there are so many stories
that you can pull out of that.
So, yeah.
AUDIENCE: Cool.
I obviously have a question.
But before that, I want
to say, thank you all.
Like, you all have
amazing contributions.
And nobody says thank
you enough to you.
So, like, thank every one
of you, like, so much.
My question kind of
pulls from, like,
Dan's recent storyline in
action around "The Oz Effect."
Do you think we
deserve Superman?
DAN JURGENS: I sort of wrestle
with that all the time,
because I think that one of
the things about politics
right now, without
getting into either party,
is more and more
I ask myself, why
would any good person do this?
Because we punish them.
And I think we see that
across-- whoever signs up
to run for office
basically knows
they're going to get nuked
by the other side, right?
And so I ask myself
that all the time.
When do we find out
that we do or do not
deserve someone who is trying
to act on behalf of us?
And I think that's a
fascinating theme to play with.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Well, I'd say yes.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah,
I would hope so.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Yeah.
We do deserve it.
We don't deserve the
opposition research.
DAN JURGENS: Right.
Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
But, yeah, we do deserve--
DAN JURGENS: Yeah, but the
question is, who would step up?
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
No, absolutely.
Who would step up,
like finding out
what you found out this week?
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Like with the analyticals?
I'm sure you guys are
dealing with that.
Like, who would want to
put yourself under that?
Like, that that's
even more intense.
Like, the first
thing was intense.
This is even more intense.
So, yeah, I don't know.
But I'd remove that
from the equation.
And just someone shows
up and goes, screw it.
This is the right thing to do.
I'm going to do it.
Yeah--
DAN JURGENS: Right.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
--we do deserve that.
DAN JURGENS: Yes.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Paul doesn't think so.
PAUL DINI: [INAUDIBLE]
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Paul
thinks we deserve to burn.
He likes to write the Joker.
PAUL DINI: A little bit, yeah.
[CHUCKLING]
AUDIENCE: Thanks.
SPEAKER 1: Anyone else?
One more?
We've got time for one more.
AUDIENCE: I wanted
to say, I love
hearing how much you
guys have thought
about the story and
about character,
and just how deeply
you're invested in that.
I just really loved
watching that.
Kind of a little
bit related to that,
one of my personal favorite
Superman stories is "Superman--
Red Son," which for anybody
who doesn't know about that
is Superman, instead of his
rocket ship crashing in Kansas,
it crashes in the Soviet Union.
And he grows up there
instead, and kind of
like how that transforms
the character.
I just wanted to know if
you guys have any, like,
thoughts about that-- about
how that would change Superman
and what would stay constant
about the character?
Because what's of
intrinsic to him
and what he picked up from the
Kents by being raised by them?
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Well, I think
that's why the
"Elseworlds" in general
are such a big thing at DC,
because all the characters can
be shown through these awesome,
like, cracked mirrors and--
DAN JURGENS: Right.
BRIAN MICHAEL
BENDIS: Yeah, right?
You're all done them.
Yeah.
PAUL DINI: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Right.
PAUL DINI: Well, I did
one in the animated series
where he leads an
invasion on Earth
because he believes that he
was raised on Apocalypse.
And it was almost like
"The Manchurian Candidate."
He was attacked in space.
His memory was
basically blotted out.
And these other
memories were put
in that he was the
son of Darkseid,
that he was found and
brought to Apocalypse.
And he has a whole history
with Darkseid, which only
goes back, like, about a week.
And he leads an
invasion on Earth.
And that is a very natural
thing for him to do.
And when he returns,
he is himself again.
But he's really mad.
And he goes after Darkseid.
And Bruce Timm and
I said, this is
the only time Darkseid will
ever get physical in the show.
This is the only time
that Superman is so mad
that he confronts him.
And he goes.
And he fights him.
And Darkseid is forced
to fight physically.
And Superman beats
him, and he loses.
And he loses his--
we wanted it to be a
spiritual defeat for him,
because he takes Darkseid,
throws him into the street,
and says to the people of
Apocalypse, you're free.
And they look at Superman.
They look at Darkseid.
And they pick him up, and they
put him back on the throne
because that's what they know.
And Superman had to lose it.
And he had to confront him.
And he actually starts
to go after him again.
And Supergirl, who's a part
of the story, says, stop.
If you go after him,
someone's going to die.
And it won't be Darkseid.
And he realizes,
I can't do this.
I cannot be the liberator.
I cannot be the guy
who takes down tyrants
because that's what
I'm going to become.
And it's a very hollow
victory for him.
And he has to live with that.
And he has to go back.
And we imagined
that was going to be
the last episode of the
series, where if we did more,
he would have to rebuild
that trust on Earth.
And the only person who really
believes in him is Lois.
And we thought, that's a great
place because he sort of lost
the trust of Earth.
But he's gained
the love of Lois.
And we thought, if
we don't do anymore,
this is a good
place to leave it.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Yeah, but I will say,
you just brought up,
though, some elements we
didn't get to talk about today.
We were talking
about how obsessed
we are with the characters.
It's Lois and Jimmy and Perry.
PAUL DINI: Yep.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
Like, it's the cast
that we haven't talked about.
It's absolutely the best cast.
PAUL DINI: It is.
It really is.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS:
It's a tremendous cast.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: I'm sorry.
SPEAKER 1: So we're
going to have-- actually,
our guest speakers are awesome
and are going to sign some
great posters--
beautiful posters--
for us if you guys
want to start lining
up back there.
But before you do
that, I want to make
a couple of announcements
from DC Comics.
"Action Comics #1000" is
coming out on April 18.
And that is 80 pages for $7.99.
And then "Action Comics--
80 Years of Superman"
is 365 pages.
And that's a
hardcover for $29.99.
So please visit DC Comics.
Pick those up.
I'm pretty excited about it.
And thank you so
much for being here.
Thank you, DC.
And thank you, guys.
DAN JURGENS: Yeah,
thanks for coming.
BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS: Thank you.
It's been a pleasure.
[APPLAUSE]
