JUDY WOODRUFF: But, with that, we turn to
the analysis of Shields and Brooks. That's
syndicated columnist Mark Shields and New
York Times columnist David Brooks.
And I want to ask both of you about what we
are hearing from folks like the ones we just
heard from, Mark.
But I do want to ask you first about Joe Biden
picking Kamala Harris as his running mate.
Mark, what is your take?
MARK SHIELDS: Well, Judy, you know, the successful
model in American politics historically, whether
it is Ronald Reagan, two terms, Bill Clinton,
two terms, both leaving 60 percent approval,
or, obviously, Franklin Roosevelt, has been
sort of an irrepressible, contagious optimism.
And Donald Trump has been the exception to
that. Donald Trump has portrayed a world in
which we are surrounded by those who are not
in our interests, our allies that we can't
trust, refugees who want to subvert our nation,
or even enemies within.
And I just thought what came through in Kamala
Harris and her appearance with Joe Biden was
sort of a return to optimism. I know it is
inappropriate to say it, but she has an absolutely
million-dollar smile. And smiles have been
missing from American politics. And I really
think it was welcome to an awful lot of people.
JUDY WOODRUFF: We will let you say that, Mark.
David, what do you take away?
DAVID BROOKS: I am showing my 5-cent smile
right here.
(LAUGHTER)
DAVID BROOKS: I thought it was a triumph.
The first 48 hours of any vice presidential
pick are really important. Are people -- are
the -- is the party fired up? Or is there
some sort of scandal? Is the press going into
some sort of frenzy?
And you would have to say, Democrats are very
fired up. They have already raised 50 extra
million dollars in this window. And Republicans
are really finding nothing to really attack
at. And so they are struggling to find a way
to criticize Kamala Harris.
I also thought, you know, a bit of a return
to professionalism. The way they handled the
search left all of the people who did not
get picked enhanced. And so they leaked nice
things about Tammy Duckworth. Susan Rice feels
more enhanced by this. And so that is a -- that
is just a professional and generous way to
do this.
And then they have controlled, which was -- for
many, including me, was the concern of Kamala
Harris, which was her own campaign for president
was very poorly managed and run. And so what
does that say about her management skills?
And that would be a legitimate concern.
And so the Biden team, according to my newspaper's
reporting, has said, you know, we are going
to have one team. There is not going to be
a Harris and a Biden team. We're going to
have one team. And the Biden team is going
to control the team. And so she just can't
take the whole California crew and implant
them, some of them, yes, not all of them.
And so, all the way along, from how they managed
the campaign, to how they rolled it out, I
thought quite an impressive display.
JUDY WOODRUFF: So, we always like to ask early
on, Mark, about pitfalls.
What -- I mean, what are the pitfalls ahead?
And what do you make of the Republican response
so far, which, as David said, is kind of all
over the map?
MARK SHIELDS: Well, that's right.
One prominent Republican, national Republican,
said to me today, you can't have it both ways.
She's either the most liberal senator in all
of Christendom, or she is a terrible opponent
of Democratic liberals.
I mean, they have not settled on a line. And,
in fact, it is contradictory.
But I would say this, Judy. The very liabilities
that Kamala Harris had in the primary, that
-- among liberal Democratic voters, that -- was
a tough-on-crime district attorney and attorney
general, if anything, become a plus in a general
election, in making her, if not bulletproof,
then at least a lot tougher to attack on soft
on crime, for example, than the typical Republican
approach to Democrats.
And, as far as the attacks on her, you know,
Dame Margot Asquith of David Lloyd George,
he could never see a belt without hitting
below it. And that really is President Trump.
I mean, he had every opportunity, appeals
not to that which is highest or most noble
or most elevated in any of us, but almost
to that which is most base.
And he did it again questioning her -- raising
questions about her citizenship and eligibility,
horrible person, worst person in the Senate.
You know, I don't know. I just think it -- I
think it is a song that has been sung and
maybe people are tired of hearing it.
JUDY WOODRUFF: And, David, just quickly on
that.
I mean, they -- the president himself called
her right off -- right as soon as they heard
who it was, he called her nasty and horrible.
Is that -- is that a line of attack that is
likely to stick?
DAVID BROOKS: No.
She is tough. And that is something that is
to her benefit. Most politicians I have interviewed
are afraid of personal conflict. They will
attack somebody from across the room, but
-- or across from on TV. But room to room,
face to face, right in person, they are loath
to be critical, they are loath to have a conflict,
because they want everybody to like them.
Kamala Harris is not like that. Whether as
prosecutor, as attorney general or a senator,
she is very quick to call somebody out. And
that could be an advantage in a Biden administration,
because one of the (AUDIO GAP) administration
is, the president makes a decision, and then
nobody -- everybody just ignores it. There
is nobody to enforce the decision the president
made.
And if she can be a person who, like, keeps
people in line, that would be a gift to the
administration. So, the flip side of Trump
calling her nasty is that (AUDIO GAP) actually
a true feature of her career, which is marked,
which is that she has a certain toughness
that is really rare in politics.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Maybe she will be the enforcer.
So, Mark, I want to go back to what we heard
just before I introduced you and David. And
that is the ordinary Americans who are out
there waiting for help.
Congress has gone home. They haven't come
to an agreement. The Democrats say they have
dropped their bid from three $3 trillion to
$2 trillion, and the administration is saying,
we are at $1 trillion.
Who should the American people hold responsible
for this?
MARK SHIELDS: Well, I think they hold responsible
the government.
David said last week, 60-40 Republican responsibility.
I won't argue with that.
I would say, the administration has not covered
itself with glory. But I think the Democrats,
I would be holding hearings at this moment
on just exactly what is happening. The voices
we heard, I mean, statistics don't bleed.
Statistics don't cry tears, but human beings
do.
And anybody who could listen to those poignant
portraits and self-statements just made on
our show and not respond and say, oh, we can
wait until September, or I have to get to
the county fair, and campaign at the 4-H show
or wherever else, or go to Nantucket, I think
has to -- an awful lot to answer for.
JUDY WOODRUFF: David?
DAVID BROOKS: Yes, this is yet another down
side of COVID, actually.
When you are only in Washington, or you are
only in the media world, or in the political
world, I should say, you -- life is abstract.
It is scoring political points. It's how to
win this game.
The advantage of campaigning at any level
is that you are right face-to-face with human
beings and it's not an abstraction anymore.
It is their lives and your lives together.
And so you see the vast gulf between Washington
and the real lives of Americans. And Washington
isn't able to say, OK, we have these fights,
but these people are really suffering, let's
figure this out. And they are lost in the
political point-scoring. And this is why people
have such intense contempt for Washington.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, going back to politics,
Mark, the story that we heard from William
Brangham a few minutes about what is going
on with the Postal Service, they are letting
states know, most of the states know they
are not going to -- they may not have ballots
returned in time for them to be counted.
The president is continually, almost daily
now denigrating mail-in voting, is opposed
to funding so much of what the Postal Service
says it needs. What are we headed for this
November?
MARK SHIELDS: Well, Judy, I am not one to
often question former President Barack Obama's
selection of words or his eloquence, which
is demonstrated, but I think he was absolutely
wrong when he said that they are trying to
kneecap, Republicans are trying to kneecap.
I mean, it is a mafia term. And it is very
harsh.
I think what we are talking about here is
nothing less than Bull Connor in the streets
of Birmingham with dogs and fire hoses. I
mean, this is repression and suppression of
Americans who want to vote. It is nothing
less. That is what it is. And let's call it
for exactly what it is.
Donald Trump is afraid of losing. So, most
candidates, the voters pick the candidate.
Donald Trump, in this case, wants to pick
the voters. He wants to limit who can vote.
And I just think that they are making an incredible
mistake. There are 22 million Americans every
month who are kept out of poverty, kept out
of poverty by a Social Security check. There
are 67 million Americans who live on them;
1,278,000 in Florida get a Social Security
check.
You go into the United States mail, you start
playing games there, then you are really -- talk
about misery, and you want to talk outrage,
and you want to talk about political unrest,
I think it's -- I think he's -- the whirlwind
is about to be set.
And -- but it is indefensible. And I have
had five Republicans, I think, up to now,
Susan Collins, Lisa Murkowski, Tom Cole, Kevin
McCarthy, and Roy Blunt, who have even said
-- dissented publicly that this dismantlement
of the post office is not -- unacceptable.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Well, just quickly, David,
we have seen the president's attempts to talk
down mail-in voting have worked.
We have a quick poll result to share. In May,
I think it was 50 percent of the American
people said they believed that they would
be comfortable mailing in their ballot. That
percentage is down to 43 percent, a big drop,
especially among Republicans.
So, the president continues to talk it down
and to say he doesn't want to fund the Postal
Service because it would -- could mean universal
voting.
DAVID BROOKS: Well, with the Trump administration,
you never know if it is incompetence or malevolence.
In this case, the Postal Service is hemorrhaging
money. And it is doing so because the number
of pieces of mail has gone down 33 percent
in the last several years. And so they -- it
makes sense to sort of try to make the thing
a viable operation.
Whether you want to cut some of these services
right before a heavy election, where people
are going to be mailing in ballots, strikes
me as extremely foolish, but not necessarily
malevolence.
I do think we are going to end up funding
this thing. Kevin McCarthy has said it is
going to be funded.
I would say to people, send in your ballots
early or deliver it straight to the authorities.
The problem is not going to get ballots to
people. It is going to be the crush of millions
of ballots in the final days in November.
And so that's -- that could be a crisis, even
without Donald Trump, just because of the
unusual nature. His tendency to talk down
the voting and to delegitimize the system
is its own shade of horror.
JUDY WOODRUFF: Shade of horror.
Well, we -- it is good advice to tell people
to remember to vote under any circumstances,
but especially this year. And if you can vote
early, you should vote early.
David Brooks, Mark Shields, we thank you.
