Devon: Hello, I'm Devon Wieters and
welcome to real talk the podcast
where we talk all things inclusion
and have a little bit of fun , too.
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Hello.
Hello.
Welcome to another episode of real talk.
My name is Devon Wieters.
On this episode, we have Noel MacNeal.
He was bear on being the big blue house.
And he also works on so many other shows.
We talk about all those, the importance
of representation, and yeah, this is a
long podcast for us, but if you watch
Bear in the Big Blue  House as kids,
this is going to be a great treat.
So strap in and enjoy the show.
So, first of all, tell us about
yourself and then we'll go from there.
Noel: Okay.
Well, first of all, I'm
really glad to be here.
So it was my cat.
He just jumped into my lap.
So she wanted to be here too.
Her name is Lola.
I'm hugging her now.
Um, I am a mung, other things, a.
Puppeteer.
And I started, well, pretty much when
I was a kid, I would love it puppets
because there were so many shows at
that time that had puppets on it, like
captain kangaroo and Sherry Lewis.
And I'm Paul winter was a ventriloquist.
Cold winter and Mahoney time.
And Paul Winchell also went on to,
um, be the original voice of Tigger.
And he also invented the artificial heart.
So puppetry can save lives.
Uh, there was also a female puppeteer
ventriloquist named Sherry Lewis, and
she had several shows, uh, um, that
I watched, um, through the seventies.
And she even had shows
even into the eighties.
Um, but then I saw this show, um, called
Sesame street and that's what kind of
hooked me and just like, cause I've
never seen puppets like this before that
were just a soft cause all the other
puppets were carved or like socks, like
Sherry Lewis has lamb shop, but these
puppets were different, especially.
Big bird.
Cause big bird was a puppet that you
could like walk up to and he could
walk to you and walk away from you.
And it was amazing.
I've never seen a puppet like that before.
And so then I decided I
wanted to be a puppeteer.
I did research the old fashioned
way cause it was the seventies.
So I went to the library.
Which is like Barnes and
noble, but it's free.
And I looked up, I looked at what
colleges I could attend and there were
two and it was one here in Brooklyn.
Yeah.
Called Pratt Institute.
And at that time there was a, the theater
department and the theater department.
I had a puppetry class that was taught
by the designer and builder of big
bird whose name was Kermit Love.
I know the frog was not named after him.
It's just a weird coincidence.
And.
I attended Pratt and was a theater major.
And then he offered me a job to
be as assistant on Sesame street
to help take care of the puppets.
What's called the Wrangler.
And so I became the Wrangler
for big bird and his puppeteer,
Carol Spinney, who is my mentor.
Because he taught me all about
body puppetry, cause Big Bird
is what's called a body puppet.
And then I got to meet and know and work
with Jim Henson and Frank Oz and the
other Sesame street, puppeteers, Jerry
Nelson and Richard Hunt, Fran Brill.
And it was, it was an amazing time.
And so then transitioned from being the
Wrangler to being a background puppeteer.
So, you know, second grouch  from
the left third chicken from
the right and right handing.
So assistant characters like, um,
The count and a cookie monster.
So I've been doing puppetry.
That's what, that's, how I started was on
that little street called Sesame street.
Devon: So that's amazing.
Tell us about bear and the big
blue house and how that came about.
Noel: Oh, well, Well, after Sesame
street, I started to, um, go to
other TV shows like Eureka's castle.
That was my first show where
I was a principal puppeteer
of a character named Magellan.
And then I did other shows like, uh,
Oobi uh, Nickelodeon and, um, I did
the third Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle
movie where they go back in time.
Um, and then I also, um, did the
puppetry for, um, Lionel for between
the lions and Leon for the puzzle place.
And then in 1997, I got a call
to come and audition at the Jim
Henson company for this character.
And they, uh, faxed me the
description and the sides.
Cause yes, that's how
far back it was kids.
They faxed it to me.
And I went and I auditioned for it.
And when I went in the executive
there, Peter van Roden immediately
said, use your own voice.
And I was like, what?
But we're the Muppets.
We don't do that.
And they, he explained they wanted
bear to have this sort of very
gentle, but normal voice and not
too cartoony, like a certain.
Purple dinosaur.
And so I got into the prototype of bear.
There wasn't any fur, it was just like
the under structure, like what's called
the helix and this foam head and I
got inside and it immediately felt so.
Comfortable and so much fun and how
great this character would be,   and
then I thought, wait a minute.
Noel, it's quarter to five Friday.
They're just, you know, you know,
just checking off the boxes, they've
already picked out who they wanted.
And so I decided screw it.
I'm just going to have fun.
And that's when, um, you know,
I was like running around in him
and getting close to the camera.
And at one point in the script, it said
he sniffs the viewer and that's when I
just jammed the nose all the way into
the lens and pulled it back again.
And then that was it.
It took about, about 20 minutes.
And then I left and.
It was a Saturday and Sunday.
And then the following Monday, just
before six o'clock I got a call
from the gym has a company and they
said, Noel, we want you to be bear.
And I was gobsmacked that I actually
got the part and, um, that's
how it, that's how it started.
That's that's why I got Bear
okay.
Devon: Tell us about the, I need to
watch this episode, but tell us about
the disability episode of Bear in the Big
Noel: Blue
oh, it was, um, it was the one where
they, um, welcome a friend of theirs.
Who's um, a bat.
I believe it was bad.
Yes.
It was a bad.
And so it was, um, the episode where,
um, they were learning about, um,
uh, the differences and pretty much
learning about, uh, I wouldn't say
disability, but just like limitations.
Like some people have.
Just limitations.
And they were learning that their
back friend isn't used to being up
this late in the day time and his
particular site wasn't all that
good, but he could hear really well.
So it was really about learning about
limitations and how people with certain
limitations can still do things.
That the rest of us can do.
And so it was sort of exposing the
audience to the fact that there are people
out there who are different from you,
not just in a height or in hair color,
but also physically they have certain
limitations, but it doesn't stop them
from having just as much fun as you do.
You know, I'm so passionate about
disability representation on TV because.
I believe that the quality of
representation we see on TV affects
how we act towards certain people.
And I did not know until I started
dating Bob, that all of these kids'
shows were ahead of their time,
as far as I'm like, where is that?
Like, it's starting to come back now.
But I was like, where was that?
When I was like, well, I guess.
I did have that when I was a
kid, but you know what I mean?
I was like, why didn't I see this?
, yeah, it was, it's one of those things
where it's just certain kids shows.
They just do it and it's, if it's
done well, it's kind of seamless
so that you really don't realize
it unless, um, you do feel that
character is, um, representing you.
Um, when we did the puzzle place.
It was a show back in the nineties
and the characters represented, uh,
specific, uh, ethnic backgrounds.
Like my character was African-American.
There was a Mexican American,
there was a native American.
There was, um, Uh, Asian-American
uh, one was Jewish.
And, uh, so then we tried to
introduce another character
who was handicap, uh, Kyle.
And so, um, then, you know, that was okay.
Our attempt at it for handicap.Sesame
Street tried to do it back in the
late eighties with a character
named Oh, um, Ari, which stood for
Aristotle and, um, he was blind.
And so the Muppet was, was blind.
He was performed by Richard Hunt and it
was a difficult thing to do because, um,
Ari had pupils, you know, had eyes, but
Richard Hunt had to make sure that he and.
The thing about puppeteers is that, you
know, we, we are so, um, focused on focus.
Like there, make sure the eyes, like,
look at the camera so that they're looking
at the kid at home and originally Hunter
had to fight instinct to not look at
the camera and have Ari kind of look
like off as he was talking to somebody.
And so they've done that.
They've also had.
Uh, kids who have had, uh, disabilities
like on Sesame Street to show
like, you know, real kids so that
they could see them themselves.
This is one actually great little insert.
It's so sweet and so quiet.
It's with this little girl.
And it Exon Perlman and this little girl,
um, steps off onto this little platform
and sits down and Exxon Perlman has to
use his, uh, crutches, his braces to
like lift himself onto the platform.
And sit down and then she
pulls out her violin and plays.
It's very simple, you know, uh, like
twinkle, twinkle, twinkle, and then it's
a probe and pulls out his violin, but then
he does this amazing, like Bach, Mozart
riff on it, twinkle, twinkle little star.
So, and that was it.
And it was, but it was just showing how
someone has one limitation, but it doesn't
stop them from achieving something else.
So it was very.
It was very sweet and there've been other
shows that have, have, uh, done it too.
And, um, the last show I worked
on was it's on Netflix when I
was called Julie's greenroom.
And there were kids puppet kids
on the show, and one of the kids
performed by, uh, my friend, John
Tartaglia, uh, was in a wheelchair.
And so.
Again, that was like that representation
trying to get the representation,
because I think now more than
ever, people are more conscious to
certain issues and aspects of life.
And one of them is representation
Devon: In all those lthings you mentioned.
Did you have any kind of like consultant
or expert on the matter to guide you?
Noel: Um, I think I'm not sure.
Sure.
Because with the shows I
mentioned I was on the performing
end, so I really didn't Mmm.
Do that.
Although there was one episode of
puzzle place I'm suddenly remembered
that I wrote and it was about, um, how.
To the kids, um, originally, um, Ben,
then it changed it to sky who's native
American and sky comes to the puzzle
place, which is like their clubhouse.
And he explains it.
He ran across this really rude kid at
the rec center and he's it happened.
And his flashback, you see that.
This kid is playing this, um, like
pinball machine or upright arcade
machine, because that was before like,
you know, even SEGA and Atari, um, upright
I'm like pinball machine arcade game.
And Kyle comes up behind her and,
uh, comments that, you know, she's
doing really well, but she just
keeps playing and he says, uh, um,
you're gonna be done any time soon.
And she just.
Keeps playing.
She doesn't respond.
And Kyle starts to get a little annoyed.
Like it's like, you know, I'd like to
play too, and then she doesn't respond.
So then he walks away.
And so then, um, he comes back and so
then it comes to the puzzle place again.
And so Kiki.
Who was the Mexican American
character played by Carmen Osbar.
She goes back with Kyle to the
rec center and the girl is still
playing and they're standing
behind her and Kiki's like, hello?
Hello.
And the girl doesn't respond.
And Kyle's like, see, this
is what I was telling you.
And Kyle walks away and Kiki,
who's standing up for her friend.
Taps the girl on the shoulders, like,
Hey, like this is very rude of you.
And that's when the girl starts to sign.
And that's when Kiki suddenly
realizes that the girl is deaf.
And so it was a total misunderstanding.
And so from there, that's when, um,
they, um, talk to an expert because they
had this machine, it was like, it was
like pre, like zoom meeting and sky.
Uh, Skyping.
It was like this big machine that
you could call anybody and you could
actually see them and talk to them.
And the person told them about what
it was like to be deaf and showed
them a couple of simple sign language.
Um, things they could do in fact told them
that we all sign language all the time.
We just don't realize it like waving.
Hello?
Yeah.
Waving a buy.
Um, and so they go back.
And then, um, after introducing
themselves, that's when they become
I'm friends with the girl, but I
really didn't, um, consult with
anybody other than, um, just realize
that the miscommunication of somebody
who's deaf, I originally had it as.
The character to Ben,
they changed it to sky.
He was native American because rec centers
are, big in the native American community.
That's where people get and
they wanted well representation.
And so they wanted to represent
the native American puppet.
And then, um, um, Kiki being Mexican
American too, but I really didn't, um,
consult with anybody about that one.
You
Devon: also mentioned that you did
Between the Lions and stuff like that.
So tell us about Between
the Lions and all that
Noel: Between the Lions
was this great show.
It was kind of like if you combined
Sesame Street with the curriculum
of the electric company, Um, both
versions electric company pretty much
was also created by the original one.
And then the reboot were
created by Sesame workshop.
And the electric company was
designed to come after Sesame street.
Once you learn the alphabet and  certain
words, then the, then the electric
company was all about phonics and reading.
And so Between the Lions kind of
picked up the Slack from that.
And it takes place in this library
and it's a family of lions, the mom
and dad run the library and they
have adventures in the library.
And I got to work on the last
two seasons of it, which were
shot in Jackson, Mississippi,
because, um, it was created by a.
It was co-created by, uh, uh, WGBH
Boston, but then Mississippi public
television decided to be a cosponsor
because of , the fact that the literacy
or illiteracy rate among adults in
Mississippi at that time was the highest
in the country and shows like, but they.
They noticed that people grown people
who watched between the lions, their
literacy, they actually improved.
And so they wanted to support afforded
the caveat being, you have to shoot it
in Jackson, Mississippi, which was fine.
Cause Jackson, Mississippi
is a lovely town and we had
a great time down there and.
Ate way too much food.
Um, we still kiddingly call it the Jackson
five because it's the five pounds we
gained from eating so much barbecue.
But yeah, between the lines was,
was really a really good show.
And I'm so sorry, it's
not on the air anymore.
Um, I think you could still find it
online at pbs.org and you could still
see some of the videos also on YouTube.
YouTube is like the, I call it
the video dresser drawer of the
world, where you could just.
Type in almost anything
it'll pop up on YouTube.
So you can still watch segments
and a couple of complete episodes
in between the lions on, on
there as well.
Devon: Have you gotten any letters
from kids for either of the shows
about how any of the representation
on it or having access to that kind of
education like in Jackson, Mississippi,
um, where a lot of the schools are.
Struggling for money to put it politely.
Um, have you gotten any letters from
kids about how that's impacted them?
And what's one that stands out to you?
Um, with, um, with letters I've gotten
the most letters I've gotten was, uh,
from playing bear at the big blue house.
And, uh, people just thanking me for
their childhood and also parents.
Thank you.
Thanking Bear and his friends for helping.
Potty train their children,
because that was a, a huge thing.
Um, but then, uh, lately I've been
doing appearances at Comicons and
my character Leon was on the Puzzle
Place and he was African American.
He, he looked like, uh, an African
American kid with dreadlocks.
And depending upon where you grew up.
Dependent upon if you remember the
Puzzle Place because unlike certain
shows like Bear or Eureka's castle
that were on at specific times, PBS
stations create their own schedule.
So they create, when you see these shows.
So puzzle Place could have been on at.
Seven-Thirty in the morning, just before
you went to school or four o'clock in the
afternoon after you came home from school.
But if it was on like 11 or one o'clock
in the afternoon, You probably missed it.
So certain people do remember Leon
and they've been of people of color
and black people who really liked
to see, even though it was a puppet
seeing representation on, on the show.
And so that's been very gratifying.
Um, hearing these grown people say how
much they appreciate it, see a character,
um, Like Leon, um, and, uh, represented
tell us
about puzzle place and
what that was about.
Noel: Oh, puzzle place.
The puzzle place was on PBS.
It, uh, we started shooting at
1994 and it premiered in 1995.
A puzzle place was actually the
result of the Rodney King riots.
And it was because it was a show
about this whole show was with these,
um, interracial kids representing
these specific ethnic groups.
The show was all about, um, respect.
And tolerance and they had pitched it
and nobody was, um, um, accepting it
then the Rodney King riots and occurred.
And that's when KTLA Los Angeles
went back to the producers, uh,
Lancet media, who are the ones who
created Reading Rainbow by the way,
and said, okay, we want to do this.
We need.
To do this show.
The caveat is you got to do it here in
Los Angeles, which was fine because I
got to spend six months in Los Angeles.
And so we did it and it
was, it was a great show.
It was myself, Peter Linz, Carmen Osbaldo
Jim Martin, uh, Allison Mark, who is
the character, Jody and season one.
And then Stephanie Brousseau.
Season two and Alice Dineen,
we all worked on the show.
I knew it was great.
And the tackled subjects like,
um, um, bullying and, um,
discrimination, uh, and also.
Chauvinism like, um, how we
treat girls or perceive girls.
Um, and then also just different points of
view and, um, touching on, um, cultures.
And it was, it was great.
After the first season, I got to be a
writer for the show and Jim Martin who
played Ben on the show, he also got to
be a director of the show, which was.
Which was great.
And it was, it was one of the best,
well produced and best, uh, shot puppet
shows, um, that that was ever created.
And, um, because there's this thing
where happens on Sesame street
where you'll have like all the like
talking heads, all the puppets are.
Like along the horizon of your TV set,
and then you've got this huge airspace
up above, and you really don't want that.
You don't want talking heads.
And so we made a conscious effort
with these characters, especially
cause supposed to be humanoid
characters to make sure you saw them
like from the waist up and not just.
The talking heads and, um, it was great.
It was, it was, it was, um, a fun show.
And it's the kind of show that if you
brought it back now, it would totally work
because of the whole thing about tolerance
and acceptance and respecting each other.
I wrote a show, um, that's on
YouTube, several of the episodes
of puzzle place on YouTube.
My episode was called, um,
Dressing up is hard to do.
And it was about the kids wanting
to do a grownup party and they
decided to dress up like grownups.
But Jody finds this sweater
that has a bunny on it.
And Julie takes offense to it
saying that's not what a grown
up or where you look like a baby.
And apparently you say that too,
you know, like a tween, kid.
You're like a baby.
That's like the highest insult.
But then when um Leon.
Inadvertently laughs at Julie's outfit.
And Julie says, I, I
like what I'm wearing.
She suddenly realizes
that's how Jody feels.
And so it's this great song that's on
YouTube that I co-wrote, um, called itchy.
And so it's basically the lesson was.
I may not, I may not like
it, but I respect that.
It's your choice.
And so, which is a lesson more than ever.
Now
Devon: tell us about, uh, Julie Andrews
and what it was like working with her.
I know it's a little bit out of
order, but Julia Andrews is the bomb.
And so like you like pinching
yourself, like I would have been doing.
Noel: Oh, yeah.
It's, it's, it's one of those things
where, you know, I've, I've met all kinds
of celebrities and stars cause uh, uh,
having worked on Sesame street, we've
had guest stars and having been gone to
Hollywood squares, I've met all kinds of.
Guest stars and celebrities,
but then there's a whole other
level, whole echelon above that.
And that's what Julie Andrews is.
Julie Andrews is just an icon.
I mean, you just, you just say the
name, Julie Andrews, and you just
think of these, like, you know, the
iconic things that she has done,
Mary Poppins and the sound of music
and the specials that she's, that
she's done that are now available.
On YouTube, but I think also on
like things like Amazon prime and,
and Hulu and the woman is just, and
I caught the thing is if you even
go there, she will SWAT it down.
She does.
She's well aware of it and does not
wrap herself around it as she is not
a diva, uh, in any sense of the word.
Okay.
And she will SWAT it down.
She has a very wry sense of humor and
she's very sharp and she was great.
And the thing was, it was so funny to
watch the celebrity guest stars for
her show Julie's Greenroom, which is
on Netflix, come on the show and they
would start to like gush and like,
like, uh, uh, Alec Baldwin came up.
And the premise of the show by the
way, was, um, she ran this like
theater camp for kids and she had
this young, uh, assistant, uh, Juliet.
And on the first day of the camp, the
basement floods with all of the scenery,
all of the costumes, all of the scripts,
all of the music, it's all like destroyed.
And so the arc of the series.
22 minutes each episode is the
kids learning how a show is
created and each week, okay.
The guest star comes in to show
them an aspect of acting or singing
or movement or mime or writing.
And then.
At the last episode is the show
that the kids have created.
And all the guest stars are in the
audience watching and feeling very proud
that they helped to create that, that,
that show with the kids, Alec Baldwin
came in and he was about to sing the song.
He said, I can't believe I'm standing on
this stage about to sing a song with you.
And he said did Julie Andrews.
And she said, Oh dear, I just
call this another moment in life.
And she just looked at me
just like shrugs it off.
And that eloquent way that she can
just like, Oh my God, it's true.
Um, Ellie Kemper, who's the star of,
um, um, Kimmy Schmidt who was great.
Um, she came into, um, the area that
has, uh, craft services, the, you
know, the free food that we all love.
And she came around to the area
and mean a couple of the other
puppeteers were there and she saw
us and she looked over her shoulder
to make sure she couldn't be heard.
And she leaned into us and said,
Oh my God, I'm with Julie Andrews.
I wanted to be a nun
because of this woman.
She was just so flabbergasted and thrilled
that you got to be with Julie Andrews.
And it was, and it was great
that she was on the show, Alec
Baldwin, um, Um, um, Oh God.
It's like, so they was like, Oh, I know
the, um, the combination, the last episode
is the benefactor who supplies Julie with
the money for her show is this woman.
And whose name is, I think this is
plenty pockets or something like that.
But the guest star who played
that character was Carol Burnett.
And so that was like, again, another
level it's like, cause you've got,
you know, you've, you've have so
many funny people and comedians,
but there's Carol Burnett and yeah.
To have to be there that day
to work with Julie Andrews and
Carol Burnett was unbelievable.
Like the end to end,
they are genuine friends.
Carol Burnett is the godmother
of Julie Andrews daughter, who
was a producer on the show.
And so it was just.
Amazing to have these two women,
um, on the side and they've
done, um, comedy specials.
There's a great comedy.
There's a great special that they did.
I think it was at the Sydney opera house.
And you could see it called Carol
and Julie or Julia and Carol.
And it's very funny.
And, uh, yeah, it was just amazing.
Couldn't have been nicer.
Um, she was, she always
had time to take a picture.
And then she would check the
picture to make sure, you know,
it was acceptable and  if not, Oh
no, no, no, let's do that again.
She would do it again.
The last day she made herself available
on the set and to take pictures and
the crew, which is like lined up.
It was like, it was kind of like.
And I was kind of like seeing a character
at Disney world and you're lined up to
take your picture for the meet and greet.
And she was so patient, she
was patient with everybody.
Again, checked to make sure that photo
was I'd take one more and she would do it.
And she was just the
loveliest human being.
She now has a podcast, by the
way, if you want to listen,
um, Julie's library and she.
Um, I read stories, um, to kids or to
families or anyone who wants to listen
to the beautiful voice of Juliana.
Devon: So I have to say, I don't
like a lot of comedies because I
can't stand the sound of live tracks.
It's like a sensory thing for me,
but  Carol Burnett must have been.
I need to go watch more of her
skits because she must have
been hilarious on that set yet.
Anything that you can share on
a podcast that, that she did,
like any kind of pranks or.
Noel: Um, not pranks.
She was just like really into it.
And there was, um, what we would do is
the guest star would be for that episode.
And then before the guests are
left, they would set up a section
of the audience so that it would be
edited together so that it looked
like the guest star had come back.
To watch the show.
So they set up the audience section
so that cabinet could watch the show.
And one of the puppeteers, my friend,
Paul McGuinness sit next, sits next
to her and they just start to kind of
like this it's really quick, but this
little improv, the kind of like flirting
with each other, which was really fun.
Um, so she didn't do like big
pranks, but she just like.
That's pretty much, you know,
here are the lines, you know,
do what ever you want with them.
And it shows, it was just great.
Devon: So how much she  improv
in the actual show versus
like, what was actually there?
Noel: Um, it's like, I'm not sure I
would have to go back and like watch the
episode again, because it was just, I
mean, she was just great just to, to watch
how easily she just did everything and
how, and the chemistry, but between the
two of them and just adding like little.
Little touches, little, little, uh,
glances or like, um, um, like when
she comes in, she just like comes
in, like opens the door and kind
of leans in and she just did that
and it was just like, it was great.
So she didn't have to, it wasn't so
much, like she felt the need to improv.
She was just having fun with the
material that was given to her.
Devon: Any fun memories
from the set of Bear.
Noel: Oh yeah.
Bear had a lot of great memories.
Uh, first of all, just working
with my costars, Peter Lance ,Tyler
Bunch, Vicky Abner, and Jim Krupa.
And that was, uh, one of the,
the assets I ever worked on.
In fact, Brian Henson, Jim Henson's
son came by to visit and he said,
you guys are having way too much fun.
Laughed because that was the whole point
of it because it was a, uh, uh, it was
a puppet show and we wanted to, and this
was our opportunity because all of us
had always been like, uh, background
characters besides sideline characters.
This was our chance to actually
be principal performance.
And so we made the most of it and had
the most fun, um, the best memories was
whenever kids would come by and visit.
And it got so popular by the fourth
season that we would do it like every
two weeks where we would have kids.
You could just couldn't
show up at that point.
You had to actually call it advance.
And we would set aside
like that Wednesday.
From like 10:00 AM until 11 o'clock.
And we would start at nine,
get as much as we could done.
And then 10 o'clock we would stop
and we would set it up so that the
kids know families could come through
the big blue house and see all the
characters and the last character they
saw in the living room that they could
get their picture taken with was bad.
And as a camp, as the
families did this, the camera.
Would follow them and record it.
Uh, Dean Gordon, who was the
assistant director, nicknamed
at the bar mitzvah tape.
And so once they left, they would
give, given a video cassette copy of
their visits so they could treasure it.
Always.
And so it was always great to see kids
come and, and visit because it's also a
really nice reminder of why we're doing
this because it's still a TV show and
there's a schedule in this production.
And, um, you know, there's the
pressure of getting in my aisle,
going on for over time and whatnot.
And then, you know, it is a job, but
then you see why you're doing the
job and you see these kids who had.
Just beaming and smiling.
And that was also whenever I went as
bear and did personal appearances.
Um, that was always the best part.
And my favorite memory of that was
whenever I visited anywhere, whether it
was going to LA Hollywood squares or the
Jerry Lewis telethon, or going to England
to promote Playhouse Disney, I always ask,
can I please visit a children's hospital?
And that was, has some of the.
Best memories for me was
visiting children's hospitals.
I went to the st Ormond
street hospital in London.
I went to this hospital in Mexico,
which was pretty much for the poor
and entertain the children there.
Uh, I went to this place and, um,
cause to me or Kissimmee, Florida,
it's called give kids the world.
And this, this facility,
it's an entire resort.
That this man set up for, uh, children
who are critically terminally ill
and they work with Make-A-Wish.
They work with all the other resorts.
They work with all the theme, parks,
all the rental car agencies, all
the airlines, all the restaurants
to make sure that this kid and their
family have like the best experience.
And they have even what's
called critical wishes where
they will organize everything.
And federal express plane tickets
within 24 hours to get the kid and their
family down there to enjoy their time.
Um, they haven't been able to do it
because of, well, the world's having
shut down, but they are planning
on getting back to it very soon.
And they're even doing a
very special fundraiser, Cod.
Next March at the contemporary resort.
And they asked if I would
come and meet and greet people
and also do a panel on beer.
And I said, yes, but I also
said, please invite my CoStar.
So yeah.
Right now, um, the schedules don't change
like Vicky Eisner, who was, Oh, Joe.
Yeah.
Peter Lynch who was Tutter and
pep and Tyler bunch who was
pop and Trello are coming too.
So it will be a reunion of
all of us together for people.
And I'm really looking, uh,
looking forward to that.
So.
Those are the best.
And, and, and the fact that so many
people remember bear now, because I have
a puppet of bear, a puppet of a puppet,
and I've been using him on a tic doc
to do little videos and people have.
Responded.
So amazingly, because adulting is hard
enough, but considering everything that's
happened within the past, like five
months has put like us on the brink.
And so to see this character
from your childhood back, pretty
much to say, you're doing fine.
It's going to be okay.
You're still smelling.
Good.
Has.
Been so gratifying and has helped
just so many people, even just
for a moment to just smile.
I remember a time when things were
simpler and just actually give them
a hope that things will get better.
So those are the.
Best parts of being a
bear who owned a home.
Devon: I have seen a few of
those tech talks and yes, they,
the few I saw made me smile.
So I have to go and watch them.
Noel: Well, you don't have to, but yeah,
Devon: well, no, I need
something to make me smile
these days.
Um, tell, tell us about the
show you're developing the show.
Me show.
Noel: Yes.
So going back to what you were asking me
before, like do I get letters, I've gotten
fan emails from the kids who grew up on
bear, who thanked me for their childhood.
Uh, some of them now are actually
having kids of their own and introducing
their babies to Bear on through
YouTube and the DVDs they still own
.
A lot of their parents, I've also written
thanking me  for Bear, even though
I didn't, like, it wasn't just me.
There was a whole team of people.
Um, but I've gotten a lot of emails
from parents and kids, um, autism
and special needs, who always saw a
bear as this Haven, this very special
place that they could go to that
wasn't jarring that wasn't too loud.
Wasn't to frenetic, like other kids'
shows and how some of the parents said
that some of their kids who are now
in their like twenties, it's still
a GoTo, uh, for them on like the
videotapes of the DVDs that they have.
And it made me realize that the
networks aren't going to do.
a show like this anytime soon.
And so that's why I decided I
was going to try and develop it.
And so that's when I started,
um, this is a YouTube channel.
I started doing these little
videos to get people aware of it
and it's called the Show Me Show.
And it's the Show Me
Show channel on YouTube.
And, uh, if you want to become a patron.
If you want to be part of the show,
you could support us on Patreon.
There's even a Zazzle shop where you can
get some just Show Me Show merch, but
basically to make people aware of the
show that I want to create for kids with
autism, with autism and special needs.
Yeah.
It's it's, it's very interesting how
I think it's going to happen because
when I started it, um, people weren't
really aware of autism as they are now.
I mean, Within the past five years,
it has just gotten more and more
of a mainstream stream topic.
And the fact that the rate of autism
has risen just in the past five years.
And so this kind of show is
needed now more than ever.
And it's such a niche show.
I think it will happen because
of the fact that it doesn't.
Any kid could watch it, but it
would really benefit autistic
and special needs kids.
And that's what the parents and the
caregivers of these kids got to help
them, um, cope with the world because.
Again, the world is challenging
enough as it is, but it's extra.
So for autistic and special needs kids,
um, for instance, right now, um, that, you
know, you should wear a mask in order to
protect yourself and also protect others.
Well, one of the, the challenges
is like sensory and having that.
On your face.
And so there are tactics.
I haven't done it yet, but I saw that
there are, um, tactics and tips that
you can do to help a kid, a person
kind of get used to it, having this
on their face because it is necessary.
So there are many challenges and
I think it's going to happen.
Devon: And I can speak to that.
Being an adult is hard enough, but being
in a woman with a disability, it doesn't
happen very often, but there was this
one time where we went up to this woman
at one of the little mall stands and
Cindy, it was like low carb chocolate
and my aide wanted to try some samples.
So I was like, okay.
Cause we, cause we, you
know, when we don't have.
Well, we go out and do things and
we were walking away in the end.
The lady at the Sam was kind of like
talking down to me and whatever, and
we were walking away and the lady goes,
our Cindy goes, I can't believe she
asked you if you knew your name or not.
I'm like, Oh, okay.
Noel: Yeah.
Yeah.
It's a, it's a kind of thing
where, um, for instance, Sesame
street now has the character.
Julia and Julia is
purpose is to, uh, expose.
People to the fact that there are autistic
and special needs people in the world,
and this is how they perceive things.
This is how you can still
communicate and have fun with them.
It's just helping you.
There are people like this, and this is
why, but it doesn't change them from.
Being a person.
And so, um, I remember pitching
the show to my show the Show
Me, Show, to Sesame Workshop.
And they, they, um, the person asked me,
how is this show different from Julia?
and just as I said to you, Julia
is great because she's such a
great exposure for people who are
unaware or not sure of what it.
Is to be autistic and
to know autistic person.
My show is the show.
Julia would watch to help her cope with
the world and being an autistic person.
Um, just to wrap that up,
Sesame workshop turned it down.
They couldn't do it at the time,
but I still think that, um,
my show will, um, will happen.
But it's the kind of thing where
I've done Comicons and more than once
people have come to me, thanking me
for Bear and say how much it was.
It was great for them when they were kids.
And they had recently been
diagnosed as having autism.
And they were so worried because
it finally explained why they.
Were who they were, why they
responded the way they did.
And it wasn't something wrong with them.
It's like, it's just because they
had autism or on the spectrum.
It's such a wide and varied range
that I'm still, um, learning from.
And so, and that's one of the
reasons why I have to show me
show, and it goes back to what
you're saying about representation.
There's going to be
representation on the show.
There's going to be.
Autistic special needs people as many
empowerment position as possible.
Well, especially in the writing and, um,
yeah, and obviously for consulting, but
especially in the writing, I want to have
autistic, especially needs, uh, writers
as involved in order to address like.
What would the issues be?
It was great going on Facebook, whenever
I've done, like little things asking
people, like, what do you think of this?
Or what issues would you like?
And people have been, my Facebook
friends have been very open and
responding to saying who have autistic.
Special needs kids or who are autistic
special needs themselves, or who are
teachers, caregivers, or know people.
And know kids, and they've also
shared by things with them too.
And so that's the other thing
that Comicons people have come
up to me and said, we've seen
the show me show on YouTube.
And I was like, Oh, actually in
my own neighborhood, I went to the
hardware store a few months ago.
In the before times, And I was wearing
my, I had this hat made to show me, show,
which you can get on Zazzle at our shop.
And she said, Oh, the show me show.
And she said on YouTube, I said, yes.
He said, Oh yeah, my
daughter watches that.
I was like, really?
Yeah.
She loves it.
And it's like, well, thank you.
It was great.
The fact that people are, um,
aware of it and doing things like
tick tock, helping helps with
people being aware of it as well.
Though
Devon: it's currently on YouTube
and you're developing it for
like Netflix or something.
Noel: I'm, I'm developing it as
a series for whoever wants it.
Devon: Networks get on that.
Gotta get on that.
Is there anything else
you would want to add?
Noel: Um, yes.
The, uh, the great thing about bear is.
That pretty much.
It's my voice.
It's back then.
Um, before it was apparent, I called
him my uncle Knoll mode, where I would
go to visit friends and I would kind of
just give into whatever the little kid
wants, like, okay, we do want to do.
And like, that's it.
And so.
That's my voice.
People say, okay, you do the voice.
I was like, sure.
Okay.
This is the voice of bear.
Do you want to hear it again?
This is the voice of bear.
It's my voice.
And so a couple of months ago on tick
tock, a bear read a couple of lines from
Shakespeare is Midsummer night's dream.
Celebrate.
Shakespeare is 465th birthday.
Also the day he died, by the way,
the day he was born, it's also the
day he died, we had piece of trivia.
And so I read this and so many people were
like, Oh my gosh, I miss bear's voice.
Bear could read the phone book to me.
Oh, I would love bear to read
like a story to me every night.
And that gave me the idea of doing this
podcast called NOLs book nook, which is
on Apple and Spotify and anchor and Google
podcasts, wherever you find podcasts.
And I just did my first season
where I'm reading stories to you.
Yeah.
I guess if you close your eyes, it
could sound like bear if you really
picture him, because it is my voice.
Um, and I'm also doing it because I
always would have loved reading to my son.
Who's 15 going on 42.
I always loved reading to him.
Stories at night and then about, I
guess it was like three years ago.
He came to our bedroom.
I told my wife and I, okay,
I'm going to sleep goodnight.
And I was like, Oh, so what
do you want to read tonight?
He was like, no, I'm good, good night.
And that was it.
Like I looked at my wife and we
looked at each other and realized.
Like it's over like no preamble,
no, like getting ready for it?
No.
Okay.
Here's the last one.
Like, no, that was it.
He just ended it on his own terms, but
it was that little piece of childhood
just, or just part of our life.
That was just now gone.
And I kind of missed that.
I missed reading to
somebody reading out loud.
And so it's filling that nice little void.
So I've, I've, I've read stories and
chapters from books for this first season,
and I'm going to do season two soon.
I'm actually going to interview
a couple of friends of mine, who
have actually written books as so.
Reading the books and then interviewing
them about how it came to be.
So, um, yeah.
Devon: Where can people
follow you on social media?
Noel: Oh, let's see.
I am on, uh, Instagram
at, uh, and actually.
I'm just going to look at my phone because
there's so many, this is way too many now.
Um, so let's see on Instagram.
There's the show me show on
Instagram as well as myself
who is  @nmcnealon Instagram.
I am on the Twitter as at Noah
McNeil and we also have on Twitter,
uh, know your host, which is.
The show me show account.
And this is the show me
show page on Facebook.
I also am the author of two books,
a 10 minute puppets and box,
which are available on amazon.com
and your independent bookseller.
And I'm on cameo.
And I'm on.
Took talk.
This just
Devon: came to me like, as you were
talking, how has your race, if anything,
if any way shape your affected your career
Noel: and your opinion?
Oh, being African American.
Oh, um, well it's definitely helped me
get parts like Leon for the puzzle place.
Um, I've twice I've been a
Muppet version of our Roker.
Which is all that
Devon: is awesome.
Noel: Yeah.
A great guy too.
So it comes in handy like that because
they want to have a, you know, a
black person doing a black puppet.
Um, so it, it has
shaped, I guess, in that.
Um, but then you also just
need more representation.
There's this great group on.
Uh, Facebook now and they have their own
YouTube channel, puppeteers of color.
It was created by David bizarro,
this horror and it's address, uh,
issues of being nonwhite in this,
uh, career that we've chosen.
Puppetry because puppeteering is still
prominently white, male dominated.
And so that, just these the change.
And I've said before, you can have
this wonderful cast crew photo that
has a smattering of diversity, but.
Unless you have people of color as part
of your core cast, unless they're in
the writer room, unless they're the head
writer, unless they're a director who gets
just as many episodes as a white director,
unless there's the music director
in editing and post and the camera.
Then that great cast crew photo that you
have, isn't diversity, it's tokenism, and
you just need to, to, uh, to change that.
So I just auditioned for this part
for, um, it was just a voiceover
for a character and the character.
In contrast to the high energy high
pitched voices of the other characters,
this character was supposed to be more
laid back, more mellow, older, wiser.
And I was like, Oh, okay.
But then they made a point to write, but
please, and this was just a general one.
It wasn't specifically for me, but it
was still, it said don't fall into the
usual stereotypical ethnic choices.
And I thought, well, why
do you need to say that?
And what would it be wrong with having a
ethnic sounding voice for this character?
And it, for this show that you pride
yourself on being so diverse about.
So I just like I did and I didn't get it.
But it just made me think again, it's
like, it's those little things that
you just have to start picking at.
And so, um, my friend, Jim Martin
said, when you get your own
show, this is what you can do.
So, yes.
So when I get to show me show, it's
gotta be a whole lot different and
it's going to be so represented.
It's going to be ridiculous.
Devon: I love that.
And if you ever need
any help consulting I.
And have no shame in Loki, inviting
myself to consult as you would have me.
Noel: Thank you.
Devon: Do you mind if we in like
really in this time with, with,
uh, with a little rapid fire?
Noel: Sure.
Devon: Okay.
You can't leave home without what?
Noel: My phone,
Devon: your favorite food,
Noel: potato chips.
Devon: Last show you binge and loved.
Noel: Oh, the, um, Oh,
um, Schitt's  Creek,
Devon: uh, a snapshot of an
ordinary moment in your life.
That brings great joy.
Noel: Um, my son
Devon: that will conclude this episode.
Thank you so much for coming on
and we will see you guys next time.
Bye guys.
Noel: Ciao.
Devon: Thank You for listening to
real talk, all things inclusion.
Remember to follow us on Instagram
at  @realtalkpodofficial on
Twitter at @devonrealtalk and on
Facebook @realtalk podcastofficial.
And if you want to support the show, you
can do that by using  the link in the show
notes, we will see you guys next episode.
Thank you guys.
