Hi everyone
Hope you all are safe and motivated enough
So today we are back again
with same exciting webinar
For all of you guys
but before moving forward i would request
I would request you all
to just
go through a little housekeeping rules
which I will just go ahead with
We all are working very hard to present
these kind of webinars in front of you
we feel it is also helping a lot
of student communities to understand
what this animation industry is all about
and how you can get into this industry
So request you all to ask your questions
as it is a live webinar
I would request to put in your comments
Ask how much you want
and we would be answering and addressing
all the relevant questions
Throughout the webinar you can ask
questions whenever you feel like
we will be having particular slots
when we will highlight your question
And you will be answered
Lets just move forward
I'll be introducing today's guest
our today's guest is a
a very well known and
an eminent personality from
Indian Animation Industry
I feel you all are aware who
Mr. Ranjit Singh is
still
I will take a moment to introduce him
Mr Ranjit Singh
you may also know him by the name
Tony Singh
is a mentor
creative producer
animation director
He was a process consultant
on a lot of national
and international projects
Just to share his knowledge & experience
he wrote an amazing and informative book
The Art of Animation Production Management
Ranjit Sir, is now affiliated with
a lot of well renowned organisations in
education, to guide all our students
as a contribution to the
Indian animation industry
And to create a talent pool
for this ecosystem
So without further ado
let's welcome our guest
Mr. Ranjit Singh
Hello Sir!
Hi!, Good evening everyone
A late afternoon I guess
Thank you for
having me on for this webinar
First of all I must thank FRAMEBOXX for
giving me this opportunity to address
the audience, such a large number
of people that I see are coming on board
& hopefully we'll have a fun session today
more in terms of a freewheeling chat
Please feel free as Vishal said,
to ask questions that you may have
We're trying to kind of ensure that
we, within the stipulated time
try and cover as many queries
that you may have
whether it is related to any kind of
specific trouble shooting or
related to your careers
related to questions you may have
regarding
what to do
during down time
or even how to further your education
even if you may be
already working somewhere
So, I think this is an exciting subject
that we've managed to hone in on
and the reason we didn't want
to keep it technical in nature
or specific to a particular vertical
is that
the first in the series,
we're hoping that
this will become a series
is more trying to get to know
what is the general sentiment
so once we get clarity on
the type of topics
that people want to address
or want to see discussed
then I guess we can you know come up with
dedicated sessions regarding those topics
But, today it is going to be
pretty much an
an informal session so
if you want to startup
with any specific question or maybe
I can give you a little bit of a backdrop
in terms of that, I've been involved
with the animation industry
for those of you who don't know
for well over 30 years now
and
along with the animation industry
I also been fortunate to be associated
with the manufacturing sector
I've done stints there
I've been associated with the NGO,
Non-profit sector which again has been
in the education vertical
I'm now also, as Vishal said
in the introduction
been associated with
several acclaimed institutes
purely from a standpoint that there is a
I feel that there's a lot of stuff
that professionals can contribute
from their experiences
in these various streams that they
have spent their lives in
and what better way than to get involved
with schools, educational schools
and colleges and to give back
to the students and the new generation
any sort of knowledge
that can be of help to them
So
Having said that, let me
at the outset I'd like to start off
by saying that this is
THIS IS A FUN FIELD
Alright!
This is an industry and a craft
that is a lot of fun
and the best part is that
you have people paying you
to have fun!
So
So long as you are sincere
you are disciplined and you are focussed
without losing sight of the fact that you
are having a good time and
you should be having a good time
doing whatever career work that you
are doing
I don't think that there is
any other parallel that you can find
in any other industry
where you can have so much of fun and
make a livelihood out of it
and make a serious career out of it
so
having said that
One of the things, that I think
Vishal mentioned to me during
our discussions is that
where exactly is the industry headed
and we'd like to talk about what all
is happening in the industry
so that those of you who are planning
to get in, or who have enrolled
in courses, or are about to complete
their courses
what lies in the future for them
So, Hi everyone
if you have any questions
before starting the webinar
any primary questions what you want
to address, you can just drop your
questions right below
Okay! so I hope the sound has improved
a little.
OK! Sorry about that, I mean somethings
that we really can't, we have to
figure out as we go along
challenging times so we
have to find solutions
as we go along the way.
So as I was saying that in terms of
the current state what Vishal
you were asking me
I think that this is an amazing time
for animation per se
because
as I see
what is happening on the
broadcast front, or what is happening
on the streaming front, what's happening
on the publication front, what's happening
on gaming
there's a whole lot of stuff that's going
on a lot of development work is going on
lot of creative stuff is happening
People very often come up to me
students ask me, that you know
should we follow or
take up 2d animation, because 2d animation
seems to be dead
I don't know where this impression
comes in from, I think 2d animation
is alive and kicking,
In fact if you look at the majority
of shows that you find on air
the maximum percentage is towards 2d
animated shows,
so in fact one of the things
that we do joke about in the industry is
that if you want to find a 2d animator
it's very difficult, it's very easy to get
a 3d animator today. So it's
an interesting development to see
that 2d is finding favor again.
There's a lot of interesting stuff
happening even internationally in fact
in stop motion areas. In 3d movies area
you're seeing a lot of films that are
being you know launched
purely on the 3d animation platform
and now most of them are headed towards
hyper-realism or you know super realistic
movies
So, along with that
look at the game development area, I don't
know how many of you are aware but
recently Unreal5 was launched,
and you know there was a demo
that we could all see,
and that's like really mindblowing work
that's happening you know in the
gaming sector
so
which I think is also
changing a lot of the rules of the game
because
we've been always talking about 3d
animation and as being slightly different
from gaming. Also from the standpoint
of asset build, from the standpoint of
actual execution, from the standpoint of
how exactly we handle you know textures
and images we create
the backgrounds that we create,
all the associated art that goes with it
But the, I mean this new development has
just blown the socks out of everyone,
I mean in terms of you know
if you look at the demo,
it talks about heavy assets,
it talks about assets which that have no
concern to optimisation and special care
in modeling, rigging, texturing and
lighting and so called so forth
In fact you've got like billion count
scenes and interactive lighting
in real time!
Now, how how would anybody even in
their wildest of dreams would imagine that
something like this would happen
I believe that this is an interesting time
a lot of fun stuff is happening
Open source tools are really kicking in
in a very big way. Those of you who are
familiar with open source will know what
I'm talking about, those of who are not
for your benefit, Open Source is basically
FREE software that you get, no license
required, you download it, install it and
you're up and running
and it's FREE for life!
and so there's a lot of stuff
that is happening in the 3d arena as well
as in the 2d arena as far as
Open Source software is concerned
A few years ago,
I wouldn't be saying this
because
Software was not, or the tools were not
yet as well evolved in the Open Source
arena.
But all that is changing
so the last couple of years has seen
huge shift in terms of how people are
even approaching development, how people
are approaching this craft, how people
are approaching
the art behind it, so thus I think this is
this is a fantastic time to be involved
in this craft and industry
I personally feel like asking you
one question. if you allow....
Sir, out of all of these topics like you
see a lot of people coming on social media
and talking about you know why to start
working with Blender, start working with
Maya, start working with Photoshop
Why is that you chose this specific topic?
What is that 'beyond the techniques'?
What do you really mean by that?
Ok. Well, firstly I think that like you
rightly said that you know
everybody is focussing on the
technical aspect
so
I think there is no point in also being
a 'Me too' there you know where
Where everybody is talking about
Some are talking about
tips and tricks in Vfx, some are talking
about Blender, some are talking about
Maya, some are doing session on Nuke
a Gaming session, the technicalities
left, right and center
I have always been a very strong proponent
of..I myself am a software agnostic person
Which basically means that I do not have
any affiliations with any software
because I don't think
software is important
I, in fact don't believe
that Software is important
what is important is your understanding
of the craft and what is
your understanding of the basics
or the fundamentals of the craft
Software is just a tool
So
Yes! It will be that what you can do
in maybe Photoshop in one way
probably you know Substance Painter will
allow you to do that in another way, maybe
Krita will allow you to do it another
third way, it's not that you will not
be able to do things.
The only time when you come to a dead end
when you say that I can't do this in this
software is probably when either
the software itself is not that evolved or
you really don't know your basics
that well.
Because there is always a workaround
there is no one right way to approach
a problem and to solve it.
This is a fact, OK.
So
Similarly even with 3D, whether you are
working with Max, or you're working with
Maya or you're working with Softimage, or
you're working with Modo or you want to
work with Blender
If your fundamentals are not clear
if your basics on what is it that you're
trying to do are not clear
You're not going to be any better off than
the next guy. So I think this insistence
on software should stop. Given a choice
I would like to see a lot more focus
coming in on holistic learning
which means that there are things which
we are not talking about but
are extremely important.
Yes! Software training
or training is important, you need to know
the tools, you need to know how to use the
tools, which is where you know
courses come into play and specific
courses come in to teach a specific thing
about you know various tools,
But there are also things
like the management side of art
there are things like the business side
of art, there are things which are about
how do you develop yourself as an artist
beyond the software, so what is it that
and I didn't find anybody addressing
those topics. It was like a very similar
thing that happened when the lockdown
started happening in our country and
world over in fact.
I saw a lot of articles being written on
work from home, and a lot of people
talking about what work from home means
but frankly I didn't find even one article
which was addressing specific areas or
specific points, in terms of Ok
Work from home
so here 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10... these are
things that you should be looking at
in order to kind of adjust your working
style, in order to adjust the way that
you're approaching your work.
These could be starting points for you to
be looking at so that they can help you
transit this difficult phase.
So that prompted me to write an article
myself, and I kind of took what all was
at least it was an attempt to see what
all was missing from what people should
have been saying and should have been
addressing.
And trying to put those down
in front of people
Now, I'm not saying that is a solution
I'm not saying that is the only solution
but atleast it gives you some points
to start looking at, examining yourself
seeing whether you are actually
doing these things, if you're
not doing these things
can you do these things, and
if you go to my website there is a
link on my website which is to
the article, I posted the article on
LinkedIn as well, and if you like at the
end of the session, I can post a link
to that article again. Which basically
is just a collection of thoughts
If you're working from home, this is a
changed environment, it's a changed
situation, lot of things
are not in your control
a lot of things are in your control
so let's start worrying about what
we have in control and let's start
addressing issues from that standpoint
So, instead of saying
Oh well! we have a problem
My approach is always trying to
look at it, OK, what is the solution
Let's try to become a part of the solution
as opposed to really
reinforcing what the problem is
Everybody knows what the problem is
Right?!
So this session again in the same vein
was more about
We all know there are software tools
we all know that there is ample
material available
Even
when it comes to
technical aspects, there is a lot of stuff
apart from
these webinars, the interactive sessions
there is enough stuff available
online which you can look at and
you can you know kind of follow along
do your demos and learn a new craft
To give you an example
4..3 years ago I started after you know
27-28 years in the industry working with
various different verticals.
I started working on Open Source Blender
3 years ago....
And people say, Oh well you know now
we've become old, we've spent too much
time in the industry and
how will we learn. It's again
just a matter of what is your interest
what is your inclination.
How important is that
learning for you. And trust me, I mean
it's not really difficult if
if you have your fundamentals clear
It's just a matter of
applying those fundamentals using a
different set of tools. And that is what
allowed me to pick up Blender
very very quickly, in a matter of like
I would say 6 weeks! I was doing
some fairly interesting stuff on it.
Although following tutorials and
following teachers online. But still
it's a question of just getting in there
and giving it a go.....So
Topics we wanted to talk about here
were non-technical because there is a
lot of technical stuff available. And....
we felt like things like, what is
design management, why is design
management important, what is
what are the things that are needed
beyond the skills that you are learning in
your schools and your courses
Are there things that are there that can
be learnt? You know which are beyond
these kind of skill sets. So that's
the reason why we said let's talk about
something that is beyond the technique.
Ok Sir.
Trying to now fix audio issue
We apologise for the audio quality
Please jump to 26:46 on the timeline.
Sir, nowadays we have so many students
who are learning so many different
tools, like Maya is there, Max is there
Blender is there, there are so many
different softwares which are
being released. And all the institutions
are teaching technical tools, like how to
use a move tool, or how to use a extrude
tool. So what is that one thing that you
can say is lacking in students today.
I wouldn't say there is anything lacking
in students today because that's like
saying that you know what all these
institutes are doing is of no use. I
I wouldn't be presumptuous to say that
I think there a lot, See...you have to
understand one thing. What does a course
do for you? I mean, when you go to school
tell me that you studied from Kintergarten
all the way to class 12, have you learnt
everything that there is to learn?
No!
It's practically impossible for any school
any course to teach you everything there
is to learn about a subject. And trust me
that's not the intent either.
There are fixed curricula that schools
follow, and these curricula are designed
based on general tendencies of what the
market is looking for, it's practically
a lot of it is dependent on what the
professional market wants.
One of the reasons why in our country,
3d animation developed the way that it
developed, was because there was a huge
need for specialist artists at a given
point in time when this industry
was just about taking off.
So it's incorrect to blame courses
it's incorrect to blame institutes that
oh well! they're not teaching animation
they're not doing this, they're not doing
that, the fact of the matter is that there
is a curriculum that is being taught, the
curriculum is being taught by hopefully
people who know what they're talking
about. I think what students need to
understand is that learning does not
finish in the institute. In fact what the
institute or any institute is giving you
is a sense of direction, it's giving you a
sense of, OK this is the path that you
want to walk on. Here are some basic
things we will equip you with
We'll teach you these in the hope that
you will excel in them and the curiosity
will be awakened enough for you to learn
a lot more beyond what we are teaching you
because it's practically impossible
even if you take a 3-Years course,
it's practically impossible for animation
visual effects, gaming whatever industry
you want to talk about
forget even animation
any industry you want to
talk about, you think
a 4-yrs course in engineering
teaches you everything there is
to learn about engineering, or
4-Yrs course in architecture
It doesn't
So there are a lot of things you have to
learn yourself. So, I'll mention a few
things which I find very interesting that
You learn well when you're interested
to learn, you've to always remember this.
This is a fact. Only when you
are interested in learning something
are you really going to learn it well.
Because, if learning is not enjoyable,
it's a wasted effort, trust me. It's like
just going though the motions. Alright?
So if you're not enjoying the process of
learning. It's like if a teacher is not
enjoying the process of teaching, he will
never be a good teacher, he will never be
able to reach a status of a Mentor or
a Guru. He will always be (just) a teacher
How is it that you remember
Only a few choicest teachers from your
school days. It's how they impacted you
How they taught you.
What they taught you is very
very minimal in that experience.
You always remember how. So whether it's
a Maths teacher, it's an English teacher,
a Hindi teacher or any even
Sanskrit teacher for that matter
How they teach the subject comes through
from the passion that they bring to it.
Now the same thing applies to a learner
as well. If you're going to be interested
in what you are learning or attempting
to learn, if there is a genuine interest,
you will learn that a lot better. You
will imbibe that a lot better,
you will assimilate it a lot better.
Secondly, learning is always
a process of dialogue I mean
I fail to understand why
people think that learning is
a one way street..
that teacher will talk
student will learn
and everybody will be happy.
It doesn't work like that Ok?
Learning always has to be
a process of dialogue.
And dialogue means...
I talk
I seed your imagination,
I seed a thought in your mind,
and you as a student then
push me.... As a teacher you
push me to say, OK, I understood
what you're saying, but here is what
I feel about it and we have a
dialogue.
The minute we get into a dialogue
that's when actually the learning starts
That's when the understanding starts
It is said that you have learnt well
when you actually learn to formulate
your own questions
That's when you have learnt well
Just by saying that I know everything
there is to know about a particular
piece of software is not learning
You've become a technician, So
nothing wrong with being a technician
absolutely, we need technicians, but
are you a thinker
are you a troubleshooter,
are you a problem solver.
Are you a person whose approaching
a problem from a standpoint of
not which tool is going to help me do this
but, what is the core of the problem
how do I address the core of the problem
and OK once I understand that
here is where this problem lies,
then I'll go and figure out which tool,
which set of tools whether I have to catch
my (hand) ear like that, or like that
or I've to catch it like that, I don't
know, I mean I'll figure it out
And that can only come you know
not from a course,
no course in the world can teach
you that, no teacher in the world
can teach you that, they can
only guide you to it...... so....
If you ask me why are we talking
about these topics beyond
specific tools.... this is the reason
that we want to encourage,
I personally want to encourage this
kind of thinking coming into students.
where your learning
starts after the institute.
Your learning starts after the course
the course is just..... it is your mind
Look at your mind not as
it's not like a vessel or a glass that
has to be filled up with something
Your mind has to be like wood
it has to be ignited...alright?!
you have to ignite your own desire
to learn, you have to ignite your own
passion to learn more than what is being
taught, and you have to push the system
only then will you reach
towards excellence
[Vishal] Definitely Sir.
[Vishal] Sir, there is one more thought
what can you tell or guide us from the
students from 3d, 2d, design, Vfx and
gaming industry to focus more onto?
See again like I said, if you look at the
steps of any development
any personal development
I have always believed that
your personal development
in this field specifically
along with a lot of other fields,
but in this field specifically
begins with observation
Observation is going to be
your biggest teacher and you have to
have to open your mind up to
observation as a past time
you almost have to make it into a hobby
Now, I have a personal habit which is
that as far as possible whenever I am
walking, I'm walking to the market or I'm
coming back from the market, this is
just something very personal, it's
a quirk that I learnt from my mentor
and who happens to be not
related to this industry at all, he said
I walk back to my house using a different
route everyday if I can and I found that
very interesting, I said why would you
do that. He said, Well, there is so much
to see, there's so much to observe
and thats the day I started looking at
things like Okay, how many of you know
the name of the street on which you live?
Have you read the nameboard on the street
that you live? Do you know
which are the connecting roads
in your locality? What are their names?
Every road has got a name here right? So
in the place where you're living
How observant have you been in terms of
what is the kind of architecture of
the houses that are there,
even if they are buildings
Are all the buildings, do they all
look the same, do they look different,
how are they looking different?
What kind of color combinations are
being used in the various buildings?
Ok? What are the types of trees
that I have around in the locality.....?
So it's again like I said, it's
a question of what is your interest in?
If you're walking on the road and
you don't even observe what is around you
then you're not observing,
you're basically just going through
the motion of walking from point A
to point B and coming back
to point A
I think you should make that into an
opportunity to learn something
which is observe things around you,
because the next time you are trying
to build a city
somewhere down the line
those observations
will be sitting in your head.
And they will help you to start
designing stuff which will not look weird
it will look believable
because you have seen it
you observed it,
you know that a structure
looks in a certain way
somewhere it's getting imprinted
in your memory
So, OBSERVATION
ABSORBPTION
SATURATION
These are the 3 things
that you must focus on
You have to saturate your mind,
from all walks of life.
Whether it is looking at
things that are from your industry
So if you're in 3d animation or in Vfx
natural tendency of a lot of artists
is that if they are VFx artists they like
to look at a lot of Vfx art, Ok?!
3d animators will try to look at
lot of 3d animation performances,
YES!, that is good.
I'm trying to suggest to you
look beyond that. Okay!
So just because you are a vfx artist
and have an interest in vfx,
doesn't mean that you should
not have an interest in painting
doesn't mean that you should not
develop an interest in music, interest
in dance, interest in theatre, interest
in physical activity
because
all these things are
growing on you they are
increasing your knowledge base
increasing the database that you have
of all information.
Where you are going to use
that information how you are going
to apply what you have learnt
you don't know, Nobody knows,
it's a subconscious thing that happens
Why do you find that a lot of artists
will make something that looks
very realistic believable
while some artists will make stuff
and you'll say well this looks fake,
doesn't look real, I think
it looks like somethings wrong with it.
The difference is observation.
The difference is how keenly has
one artist observed the finer nuances
and those observations then have come back
to play a role in the work that he
or she has done
And this is the key thing that
you have to understand
For an animator
go watch a dance recital
or a dance performance
99.9% chances if you are really paying
attention to the performance
really enjoying the performance
it will make a difference to the way you
setup your animation performance
Because these are subtle things you will
ABSORB without even realising them
But
Give a dance setup performance to
an animator who has never created a
dance sequence and never seen
a dance sequence and you will see
the results, you will see the results
and say well, doesn't look convincing
A lot of stuff which is ancillary
Music, Design, Architecture,
Science and technology
Handicraft
I see a lot of technical stuff, there are
fantastic programs like heavy engineering
programs and How It's Made a nice
program that comes
on Discovery, How Things Work
another interesting aspect...so
Woodworking exercises......not that these
are going to help me in animation or they
are going to help me in digital effects
It's just that you saturate your mind
You saturate and absorb lot of
the information that you see in terms
of Shape, Form, Color, Style, Design
Patterns, and they get imprinted in your
memory
It's an interesting aspect
to pay attention to
[Vishal] Ok Sir.
We have a few questions from the audience
So first question...
The only software that is best for
Animation is here.....this is the software
that is best for animation.
How you're going to develop this software
and how you're going to develop
this toolset, that's going to determine
how your animation turns out
Everything apart from that is secondary
It's like, let me give you an example
Somebody comes up to an artist and says
Well!, you've painted a beautiful picture
what brush do you use?
Alright?
So....the writer turns around and says
that's like me saying to you,
you've written a beautiful letter,
which typewriter do you use?
So, it's not the tool!
It's not the tool that is going to make a
difference in terms of your animation
whether Blender, Max or Maya
Please get this thing out of your head
The only tool that is going to really
help you is up here, USE THIS!
Sir, we have a next question
Well the first basic thing like I said
which I covered
OBSERVATION!, very important...
Understand that
Animation is NOT about movement
this is a common mistake that
a lot of students make.
Animation is NOT movement
Animation is PERFORMANCE
And if you can understand the difference
between movement and performance
you will understand
what is the basic change you need
to bring about in your approach to
creating animation
so....
For performance what is important
basic thing, again... Go and watch movies
see how actors perform, how they get
into character
again.... Watch
good characters, watch bad characters
as well.
Watch good films which you enjoy
don't shut down a bad film just because
you don't enjoy it. Watch it, because
you'll probably learn what not to do
What's not working
Why don't you like the film
and that should be a learning experience
for you, that okay, I didn't like the way
the pace of the movie worked
It was too slow for me
I didn't like the way the camera was setup
because it was not
defining the action clearly
I did not like the
performances of the actors
because they were not convincing
so it means that
the actors were not in character
You could see the actor
and you could not see the character
You're going to relate to the character
So......
Basic things in animation are
nothing to do with the tool,
again....it's about
Are you watching a lot of drama & theatre
If not! Go and do it
Are you watching
musical performances, if not, go and do it
Observe people.....see how people behave
how they act, how they perform.
Watch good actors, see bad actors
see good theatre artists, see good dancers
see good musicians
even when a musician is playing
Let me give you an example....
If you haven't, take a look at when
Ustad Zakir Hussain plays the Tabla
Observe him...take a look at him
when he's playing the Tabla
He is so expressive
He is lost in the music
He is completely in sync
with what he is playing
and he's not an individual
at that point of time, he's is one
with his music. And you can see
his face changing
you can see expressions coming, you can
see his head falling back coming forward
He's making all these kind of
head movements, shoulder movements
This is a performance that he's giving you
And he's so in tune with that performance
Now I tell you that you please create
a character animation and you animate
a tabla player. Ok. The difference will be
In your animation will be
those who observe live players
will know the subtle nuances
that they have to put
into their performance.
Where will the shoulder move
How will the head move
How much will it move, when it will move
How will the hands move
What will be the facial expressions
these are the subtleties you will observe
from a live performance.
And then you can use animation
to push it a little more, ........to......
play with the tenets that we have, things
like staging, things like exaggeration
things like styling, action, the
follow through action, the anticipation
action. You can....
push the limit there because of the medium
to create a more interesting experience
But, it still is going to be a performance
so do not look at animation as motion
It's not taking one thing from point A and
moving it to point B and then to point C
on a timeline. That's the technical way of
looking at it. The human way of
looking at it is that you are
creating a performance
and your performance
has to be believable. Your character
has to live that performance,
which means.............you as an animator
have to live that performance only then
will you be able to translate it
into animation.
[Vishal] Sure Sir,
Sir we have one more
question from Vinit
I mean this is again a repeat
of what we said earlier that the courses
that you are doing or if you've done your
courses or if you've done some training
of any sort or you're doing online
learning, whichever way you are picking up
these skills, or these various tools,
the idea is to get to a point where you
start asking questions.
Now about the tool itself
You start asking questions about ok
what next. I've got a specific tool called
lets say we're talking about
a very specific tool like a
a boolean operator. Alright in 3d.
Now you've mastered the boolean tool
and you know exactly how you need to
do to use that tool
various different ways to create
different kinds of modeling
solutions for yourself. What next...?
Can you push it to a level where you come
to a dead-end and say well now maybe this
is something that can't be done here.
So what is the solution? You RESEARCH
You go and read about it, find out on the
internet, you talk to people who have been
around, specialising in those areas
which is why NETWORKING becomes very
important for you in the community
This is another thing, that I feel
students need to pay attention to, you've
a lot of attention on technicalities,
courses, institutes, subjects and so on
so forth.
I think a very good teaching
experience a very good resource for
teaching and for learning is the community
itself.
And trust me, it's a very very
helpful community.
I have yet to come across
any artist senior to me, junior to me
who if you ask them, look I'm stuck here,
I don't know how to do this and they
turnaround and say, O well
I'm not gonna tell you.
Nobody does that, OK
They're happy to help.
The point is
are you asking. Do you have the network
Have you made an effort to step out and be
visible in the community.
Are you joining community organisations &
being part of community organisations
which give you the opportunity to network
amongst the fraternity. Because there is a
whole lot of solutions that you can get to
when you talk to people, and people
are generally helpful. Artists I've found
are generally very helpful to each other,
so long as they find that there is
a genuineness to learn.
So you need to also be prepared
with the questions that you want to ask
Don't ask questions which are readily
easily available, the answers to which you
can do a little research and you can find
those answers. That's then ...
showing that you're not serious enough
to spend time formulating what you want to
ask, you've got a simple question.
10 answers are available,
instead of looking at those answers
what you're doing
is asking somebody
because it's easier to ask.
Alright...Ya! People will
give you the answer, but do your research
So instead of just being on social media
to socialise,
I think social media also has given us the
advantage of a lot of resource pool and a
lot of knowledge pool. There is tons
of information out there, trust me,
Why do I have this kind of little
disappointment, because when we started
out learning in our career, 30 Years ago,
There was no internet.
I'm going to let that sink in
for a little while. Ok?!
There was no internet. Internet was
designed in front of us,
it came into being, infact born in front
of us. Alright. So how do you think we
learnt before the internet?
Books, talking
to people, attending seminars, going to
workshops, that's what we did.
We got a chance to have a word with
anybody on an international call, we would
grab it. Just that 5 seconds in a seminar.
I remember talking to a very senior artist
way down in Australia. There was a film
called 'Ferngully, The Last Rainforest'
which came out many years ago, even before
a lot of people in the audience would
have been born.
And they did some technical stuff in that
film which I was working for a company at
that point of time which was at the
forefront of technical development. And we
had a suspicion that a lot of what they've
done is exactly what we've been doing over
here. So I was lucky to be sitting in that
seminar, I still remember it was at the
YB Chavan Center in town, Bombay,
Those days it was called Bombay not Mumbai
And
there was this opportunity that this
artist was on the line from Australia.
And I jumped at it, I just went up to the
phone, talked to him, asked him that how
exactly are you doing it because this is
what we are doing here, and he agreed,
that Yes this is exactly what we are doing
So... unless and until you talk to people
who are doing path breaking stuff, who are
doing interesting stuff, you'll be limited
by whatever knowledge you're getting in a
particular place, and we all know
how limiting that can be.
[Vishal] Sir, we have a next question
Well! The only difference in I find is
One major difference in fact not the
only difference, one major difference
is that I think digital makes you a little
lazy. Because digital has the
as my friend Vivek Ram says, digital has
the ability for a CTRL Z. Ok.... UNDO!
Whereas physical...
physical there is no CTRL Z, there is
no undo. If a stroke is drawn incorrectly
It's there. Unless you paint over it
There's no way that you're going to
get rid of it easily. So... I think
Physical is very very important
Handwork.. It's practical handwork is
very important. In fact I......
suggest to a lot of my students that
even when they are talking about things
like digital modeling, they must approach
digital modeling like
I'll give you an example....
Some of our students were building
furniture, 3d furniture....
and one tip that I gave them
not that it's an earth shattering tip,
a mind-blowing tip,
it's a very simple tip
Look at the piece of furniture that
you're trying to design, and get into the
mindset of the carpenter who actually
built it. Look at where all the joints are
See how these joints have been
put together. And you'll start
slowly getting into a mindset of
how exactly things have been put
together, which you can then
translate into your digital model.
I do a lot of DIY stuff, I do a lot of
practical work myself, from carpentry to
electricals to plumbing, I like to do all
that stuff myself, what that gives me is a
tactile feel.
So...
I know
what a GI Pipe..
a galvanised iron pipe, I know
what it looks like because I've handled it
myself. Alright.
I'm not relying on images, I'm not relying
on theoretical knowledge,
I'm not relying on physical
things that I've seen
I'm not relying on digital things
that I've seen. These are things I've held
in my hand. I know what woodgrain is
I know when I sandpaper something what is
the kind of finish, that comes in. So,
I'm not saying everybody should be
doing that. But.........
Physical craft brings you....
brings a very important aspect to play
which is TACTILE feel.
You get to feel a lot of stuff.
It's like... ask your mother
when she goes to buy vegetables, why does
she pick up the tomato and feel it?
Why doesn't she just take it and put it
into the basket, like maybe a lot of you
guys are doing now that you're going.
And then you get a little talking to when
you come back home, that what kind of
rotten tomatoes have you brought?
It's tactile, you feel it,
You hold it in your hand, you get to see
this is it's firm here, it's soft here,
it turns this way, there are dents here
there are crevices here, so
physical interaction
I feel is very very important
and if you have the ability for physical
interaction never let go of that.
Even if you're working the digital space
make time to constantly up the ante for
your physical work. So.. even if you paint
textures as a professional
in an environment you're working as a
texture artist you're painting textures
Make sure you get home take a canvas,
take a piece of paper, draw, paint,
whatever medium. But you must do that.
[Vishal] Sir, we have one more question...
Again, there's tons of resources available
online, If you just take the effort to
hunt online for books on animation
trust me, we can spend 6 months talking
about this. Alright,
there is so much of information out there
So, me telling you can I give you 1 book
there is no 1 bible Okay!
sorry to bust your bubble.
Even though books may be called the bible
for animator, it's not a bible,
so you can look at The Illusion of Life
and think that this is the end-all be-all
of all existence for 2d animation.
It's not!
Richard Williams has come out
with another book. Okay!
The Animator's Survival Kit, so
There is so much of stuff out there
that it's a waste of time to even discuss
this topic over here, that which books
should I suggest for animation, gaming vfx
There's enough resources available just
please spend time looking for it
going through it, reading it
Knowledge is never wasted
that's another thing, people think
maybe I'll pickup this book,
I won't learn anything
Well like I said,
If you're interested in learning
you will learn.
So don't hunt for a book
that'll give you......the holy grail,
there is no holy grail, there is no Granth
Which you can pickup and say
Now that I've read this, I've reached
We're still learning! At our age we're
still learning everyday.
[Vishal]: Sir, there's one more question
Can you put a little light over
2d animation industry, because since now
we're all speaking about 3d, there are
few people talking about 2d, so
any career approach as to how anyone
could move into that industry?
Well Vikrant, to you too, I mean I see
your little icon over here, 2d is always
been a major area of interest for me
I have as far as possible whenever I talk
about animation, I always talk about 2D
because I think,
Somewhere, this is a personal preference
people may agree with it, people may not
agree with it, but I've always believed it
2D has some thing in it
which 3D can't match! Okay. No matter how
hyper-real you start making things, infact
when you start going towards hyper realism
that's the point I start shutting down
from 3D animation as well, so
But that's just me, I'm probably one of
the few people who has not watched
The Jungle Book in it's new avataar, cause
I absolutely do not subscribe to this
whole hyper realistic stuff on the screen
That's just me, I enjoy, I can still watch
the original Jungle Book
hands-down anytime.
The amount of artistry, the amount of
fluidity, the kind of beauty
that 2D brings to the screen, I still have
to find that in a lot of the 3d work.
So, and to answer your question why no
one is talking about 2D, again, it's an
ill-informed question.
Look at the majority of shows that you
have on air today, you'd be hardpressed
to find an equivalent number of 3d shows
It's the 2D shows that are ruling the
roost. So don't for an instant think about
Ya! nobody's talking about 2D in terms of
Why are we not talking about 2D training?
Why are we not talking about 2D courses?
Why are not putting insistence on 2D as a
medium to teach?
That's a valid question,
Even I would like to know why
they're not doing it because
I think we've had some fantastic
brilliant 2D animators in this country
and I would love to see them come to the
forefront and start teaching the craft
that they've so beautifully taken forward
over their careers. Here's your first
student, I would enrol happily in any
course that starts teaching 2D animation
It's at a different level of enjoyment, so
I hear you, I totally hear you, but
trust me, 2D is up there, very much
up there, in fact if you look at
the latest release of blender,
I can talk about that because I'm fairly
aware of what they're doing
Grease Pencil is a toolset that they have
for 2D animation. And, it's a game changer
It's open source, but again
unless you know how to create 2d animation
Grease Pencil, Toonboom. Harmony etc, is
not going to help you, cause they're
not going to draw for you,
you have to draw, right!
[Vishal]: Sir, next question is from
my side. From all this career perspective
for all the students doing courses
When is that right time that
they should start planning for their
careers.
Usually we see students creating their
demo-reels after the courses get over
then the'll hunt and make specific demo
reels, when is that time they should
actually start thinking about it.
Okay! lemme address this in a couple
Let me split this into 2 parts.
One is, it depends on the duration of the
course that you're doing, cause not every
student takes a 3 yrs course. I know a lot
of students who take up short 6-month
courses or 3-month course, or 9-months
course, or 1-year course.
I'm not commenting on what course is good
what is bad, because like I said, if you
are interested in learning,
even a 6-weeks course is good enough
Because you will push people to teach you
what you really want to know. So, let's
keep that out of the discussion.
The second aspect of when should they
start planning their career, I think you
should be planning your career even before
you take the course. Because the course
should be or the....
the learning process should be because
you want to get into a particular area.
Now what will happen and happens to a
lot of us, is that our interests change.
It happened to me personally
When I started working, my interest was
I got a lot of excitement in the area of
modeling. So, I did for many years
I use to just model. I would not
be interested in anything else.
I just wanted to model stuff
It was a nightmare because
we didn't have the kind of tools
that you guys have today
and we didn't have the hardware also
to support it.
But over a period of time, my interest
in modeling started waning away, Ok,
Been doing it for enough number of years
What next? I want to get into
something else. So the next thing that I
started looking at was lighting.
Now I want to understand lighting and I
want to get into it in a full fledged way.
Interest change happened. That means that
There is no full-stop to when you can stop
and start on a particular thing.
You have to find what interests you
You have to find what excites you
It is something that you must want
to get up in the morning everyday and do
You wake up in bed and say okay! I want to
finish that model, today I want to light
1 corner of that room, make it look good
or paint a few textures which i'm going
to use.
What is it that excites you,
and
don't be alarmed if you lose interest in
certain things over a period of time
and a new interest develops.
It's perfectly natural for that to happen
You just have to PERSEVERE,
you have to be focussed,
you have to be clear that this is
something that is there for the
long haul.
This is not a field or a craft that you
should be getting in for timepass.
So when you talk about when to start
your career? It should have started before
you decide that I want to do a course.
That's when your direction has to start
that I want to make a career.
I personally was very clear that I don't
want to get into any of the regular fields
My background is in commerce and I come
from a family of engineers.
All of them are engineers
I'm the only guy who did commerce,
so natural progression was that I would
become a Chartered Accountant.
But I was very clear, that I don't want to
get into that field. I wanted to get into
a field which was something different,
what it was? again see, 'something'
different. Very scary, because
Imagine 30 years ago when nobody's
even heard about animation,
digital animation
classical animation and the industry is
just taking off, at that point of time
I'm saying I want to hedge my bets and
I want to make a career in this area,
which nobody knows what's going on in
But it forced me to research,
if forced me to look, it forced me
to travel all the way from another city
come into this city, find ways
and means to get a foothold,
work for 6 months without pay
with a very clear mindset
' THIS IS MY CAREER '
this is where I'm going to spend my life
If you're going to have that kind of
passion towards building a career
commitment towards building a career
then I don't think that's going to come
and your way. I've done 3yrs of my course
now I should start building my showreel
Whatever work you are doing as part of
your exercises during the duration of your
course, you must also start looking
at those exercises that do I want to put
this in my demo reel? Do I think that this
could go into my showreel, my portfolio?
There is no such thing as this is very bad
work in a student portfolio, anybody who's
looking at a student portfolio
is also looking at it from a standpoint
He's not expecting that it's going to have
Pixar quality work in it.
So
Let's be clear, people who are evaluating
your portfolios are looking for potential.
They're looking for your observation power
They're looking for attention to detail
They're looking for have you painstakingly
paid attention to and spent time on areas
that are fundamental.
Give you a very simple example.
I've seen showreels of animators
wanting to apply
for jobs as animators and the character
is skating on the ground when he's walking
Now this is something very fundamental
Right? You can't say well do I make
a career in animation? Ok I want to make a
career in animation let me start putting
animation in my portfolio.
Pay attention to the basics,
Get comfortable with the idea that
whatever work you're doing
you have to give it your all, and
this is not just for animation industry
this is a mantra you should be making
for life.
During this time of lockdown, I would love
to meet a lot of the parents
not the students.
And I want to ask the parents
if they're helping you in the kitchen
are they cleaning up after they finish
their work.
Are they cutting the vegetables in
a manner that you like or are they doing
it just as an exercise.
Are they cleaning the house
as if they really want to
clean the house
or are they cleaning it just because the
maid hasn't come
Point is
are you invested in that activity.
If you're invested in an activity it will
show in your work. So if you're making
your portfolio, a modeling portfolio, or
animation portfolio, a lighting portfolio
whatever it is
Your commitment will show in your work.
Those who are professionals sitting out
there evaluating your reels, they have not
reached their positions just like that.
They have something behind them,
they know what to look for.
It's important that
you pay attention to detail
and invest yourself fully in your career
You will find many artists will change
They start out in the art department and
after that they want to try their hand at
something else, they get into some other
department but, that again you have to be
aware, you can't say I spent 10 years in
the art department I've become very senior
now I should get a lot of respect and I
should now be given a chance
to do animation.........NO!
You are now a fresher
for the animation department
and if you have the interest
If you have the wherewith all, If you
have the passion, and if you're willing
to invest yourself as a fresher,
work your way up
in the animation department.
The point is don't fall off the bed and
want to become a director.
It doesn't happen. It takes a lifetime
to reach there.
[Vishal] Sir we have one more question
It is one of my questions also
Is formal art education and drawing
knowledge important and if I can't
draw is that a disadvantage?
This is a very interesting question
that we face, it keeps coming back and
it keeps doing the rounds again and again
Let's get something very clear
When you say that you're not
good at drawing.... good for what?
Are you entering your drawing in a
drawing competition?
Ask yourself this question
Are you entering a drawing to be hung
in a museum? Ask yourself this question.
The point it you're making a drawing to
convey an idea
Does the drawing convey the idea? You can
make a stick figure and convey the pose.
You can make a stick figure
and convey the action. You can make
a stick figure and convey the emotion.
So
please do not mistake or get confused that
I cannot draw like Vincent Van Gogh,
I cannot draw like Rembrant, I can't draw
like the best artist that ever lived,
therefore I can't animate.
Therefore I can't visualise, therefore I
can't make a storyboard. I don't have any
formal training in animation drawing
But, Every time I sit with a client, or
have sat with a client, there's always
been paper and pencil. When the client
talks to you, you draw a little frame on
the paper and ask 'Is this what you're
looking at?' You draw a rough sketch
it looks nothing like a character,
but is it conveying the idea?
Is the message getting across? So
Please differentiate and learn to
differentiate the purpose of your drawing
if it is to get your idea across,
if it is to communicate,
Is it communicating? Then you don't need
shading in it, you don't need
light direction in it,
you don't need proper
anatomy in it,
all that is secondary. But Yes!
If you're drawing to show off your drawing
skills, definitely. Then obviously
in a drawing competition, you don't expect
to win the first prize by
drawing a stick figure, right?
So does formal education in drawing help?
YES!. Let's lay this to rest.
Does it help? And how does it help?
Well it helps because you struggle
that much less to create an illustration
that can convey an idea.
The struggle is that much less.
Can you learn how to draw? ....Definitely.
It's a skill that you can pick up, in fact
I was very fortunate that recently our
dear friend and very senior person from
the industry -Vivek Ram- He conducted
sessions on fundamentals of drawing for
artists who can't draw. And....it was a
fantastic opportunity, I attended all the
sessions that he did, and so much to learn
in terms of figure drawing. So again the
question is are you drawing to showcase
your drawing skills or are you drawing to
communicate an idea or to get the message
across. If you can get the message across,
The drawing is good enough for you.
I see one question over here....
How do students develop a portfolio for
storyboarding?
Are there any exercises one can do?
Yes, definitely there is, developing a
portfolio for storyboarding.
1. Lot of boards your can find if you
research online and you should definitely
study, that
How have these storyboards been done
How has the storyboard artist approached
the subject, what is the story that he's
trying to convey, and has that story been
conveyed clearly enough for you
Alongwith that take a look at a lot of
scripts, resources you can get online on
scripts, try to
visualise those scripts yourself
You can get screenplays which are
even better, because they have a lot
of descriptions in terms of time of day
action and performances.
That can be a very good start for you to
get an idea on how a board can be put
into play.
It's very important that you find
again like I said a good mentor
Network,
walk though your network
find out people from the
industry who can critique your work
Tell them that this is the board or the
story you've been developing
or this is the ideation, visualisation
you've been developing, not necessary
that you tell them what the story is.
Just show them the board and ask them
can you make out what I'm trying to say?
Can you figure this out?
I always say this to a lot of students
do not show this to family members
Don't show it to your girlfriends &
boyfriends, & brothers & sisters,
mothers & fathers.
Because you're always going to get
a very emotionally strung-up
review
or a response
What you need to do is to show it to
people who understand the craft
You need to discuss it with people who
are good at the craft, get critiqued from
them.
I see a lot of students putting stuff on
Facebook and social media and then 1
guy will upload something and 10 others
will say 'brilliant stuff' when you know
looking at it, it's not even worth
discussing. Please moderate this mutual
admiration society, If you want to get
critiqued, want advice, want feedback?
Take it from those who know the craft.
Get critiqued
from good animation directors
or show it to good modelors.
Most artists are more than happy to
give you some advice and some
feedback on the work you are showing
Storyboarding you can practice a lot, you
can show stuff, make your own stories and
send out the boards for critique to see
whether what you have done is that
understandable for someone
who doesn't even know your story.
[Vishal] Sir we have one more question
This is on management
Whenever we see these big projects happen
A question also from one of our viewers
How do you manage the art?
It might be a storyboard or maybe a small
animation clip?
I'm not very sure I understand what the
question here is.
Obviously the starting point is your
script your story that you have.
And one thing that I can tell you
which helps is descriptive writing.
Which is that when you are
building your story, your script,
I like to do a lot of visual writing
or descriptive text
If I have to talk about time of day, like
it's a cloudy night,
I would, in my writing try to encourage
myself to say, it's a cloudy night,
what is the color of the sky?
what type of clouds are there? I
would like to describe that in my writing
So that I get a flavor of the scene that
I'm trying to setup.
What's the cast of light that I see in the
frame that I imagine in the frame. So
when you start doing a lot of descriptive
writing, actually describing what you are
seeing, and you write that down on paper
it becomes that much easy then to
translate that into a drawing, into an
illustration, because you are actually
practically writing down the scene on
paper. One exercise that I suggest you can
do is.......
[Vishal] Sir as we have depleted the whole
webinar time,
we understand that you are
busy and we would not take a lot of time
from you, we have finished off the time
which we have allotted,
there are so many other questions in the
audience's mind, I would request all you
guys, we have shared a feedback form,
which you can give your details and if we
have a great response we, would possibly
want 1 more webinar with Tony Sir. Sir can
you give us 1 more time of yours where we
can get into few specific questions
targeting 1 specific genre, it would be
really great!
Yes sure, I saw a question from our friend
Sachin, who was talking about
story writing in animation and....
One of the things I really enjoy teaching
is visual story telling.
Sat Sri Akal to you too Sachin,
fantastic to have you here.
Visual story telling is something that I
also enjoy teaching, it covers a lot of
ground from an idea to conceptualisation
to visualising the story
I look at storytelling as connecting with
an audience. When you can draw the
audience in to the story that you're
talking that you are telling them,
is when I
personally feel that the storyteller has
succeeded with me
So, when I watch a film,
if I am able to get into the film
if the storyteller is
able to draw me in to such an extent that
I'm actually part of what is happening,
then I've really got an immersive
experience with the story, and I feel
connected to the story, I can relate to
A lot of students come up and say, we've
got an idea, but we don't know how to
convert it to a story. or..... I get
these question about
there is this concept,
but we really don't know how
to develop this concept in
to a full fledged story.
We can definitely conduct sessions on
storytelling, we can do a general webinar
also for more questions they want to ask
I'm more than happy to give time for that.
For those interested in some very basic
fundamentals of computer graphics, we can
talk about nuts and bolts, what goes on
behind the scene, can do questions on that
We can do sessions even on the basics of
basics of design management.
Which will cover a lot of things like
personal time management,
workflow management, how do you manage
your projects,
how do you ensure you get
things done on time,
so.... variety of things, things like
communication, things people
are not talking about,
like negotiation.
Who's teaching the art of negotiations in
school and students are going to go out
there, whether is negotiating your salary
package or with your vendor to do the job
for you. There is an art behind it.
Talking to clients.
Front-ending jobs with clients, make them
understand what you can do, what they want
whether the 2 of you are on the same page
Lot of these are subjects are like I said
in the beginning, this is not a technical
session precisely for this reason. Nobody
is talking about these aspects.
Everybody is concentrating on .....
our friend said we will talk about 3d,
we see a lot of people talking about
only technicalities.
I want to slowly drive attention towards
these areas, let's talk about storytelling
let's talk about story development,
let's talk about visual descriptions
How do we take an idea and convert it into
a story. How do we take it to storyboard
How do we board that idea down
Whole lot of things
can be talked about and then
where-ever specific technical requirements
come into play we can get, I'm sure you
guys will be able to source the right
technical strength for that.
Those people can then come in and
show the craft of exactly how it's done
But before the craft,
we must address the theoretical aspects
that are important to understand
we can definitely address though issues
Decision making is one very big area,
that nobody talks about.
And I would love to see students pay
attention to what exactly
is decision making because that's what
you're doing daily when you're working
in a professional environment, so there is
a method to decision making, a lot of
thought goes behind how exactly you make
a decision which has far reaching
consequences and which is why
Your schools, colleges, institutes are
the best place to make mistakes
because real life
is very unforgiving when it comes to
decisions. So, if there is a CTRL+Z
if there is an UNDO button, it exists
while you are in your institute
so make the most of it.
There's this lovely person who talks about
teaching and learning and student behavior
by the name of Sir Ken Robinson,
he says a very beautiful thing
if you're not prepared to be wrong, you're
never going to come up with anything
original, this is a mantra you must take
on as a life mantra.
Unless and until you are prepared to fail,
Unless and until you are prepared
to fall into the ditch,
Unless and until you're prepared to say,
let's move ahead and see what happens,
at the most what's going to happen?
You're going to fail - right?
Our intent is not to fail.
Nobody intends to do any project
with a viewpoint of saying,
I want to make sure it fails,
nobody does that, right
Everybody wants the project
to be the best one
But the point is, you will come
across things in life where you will fail
How do you handle those failures,
How do you turn them into opportunities
to learn.
What have you learnt from them?
That's your learning
So
There are so many things we can talk about
I see institutes, yours included...
When we do, we are called industry seniors
I don't know why we're called that because
we're also just students like you, but
we are asked to come as jury
judge our films
Our students have made films and frankly
I'm going to be no holds barred here
I find that a lot of the films lack
basic connect
A lot of the films lack basic storytelling
technique, they lack
basic conceptualisation and ideation
of what exactly a story should be.
It's not about the execution. You may have
seen some years ago there was this
stick figure animation that somebody had
done in Flash, where this character keeps
playing with the interface of the
Flash software.
It's just a stick figure that keeps
running up and down the screen
and it's interacting in a very fantastic
way with the entire interface of
the Flash software tool. So
it can be as simple as that. It's engaging
It's something that hooks you, you keep
looking at it, that what next is it going
to do. You become part and parcel of the
experience.
It is not rocket science,
storytelling has been made into
such a huge bogey that there
are only a few people who can tell stories
Each one of you today, look back
when you were a little child.
I have a memory of the fact that
I used to have a T-shirt which used to
say.... I was doing very well in life till
education ruined me.
That's a fact. Somewhere down the line we
somehow tend to over complicate ourselves.
We are all storytellers. Each one of us!
There is no such thing as geniuses in life
Everybody is a genius, ok!
Everybody has got something unique that
they are going to bring to the table
That they can bring to the table.
You have to believe in that fact that you
will bring that uniqueness to the table.
What is that uniqueness? You have to find
And that means going that extra mile,
that means taking that extra interest,
that means investing yourself
that much more.
Did you not tell stories when you
were children? When you went to school,
we used to also call it 'tall tales'.
This one is telling a tale, right?
This one is just fibbing...
What is this fibbing?
it's your imagination isn't it.
With your imagination you create a
situation, and make it so believable that
everybody is looking at you with
rapt attention.
Why is it that you lose this craft
as you finish your 12th or come
out of school, you've lost your craft of
telling a basic story.
If you really want to test
your storytelling abilities, sit with a
little child and keep that child engaged
with a story, for 1/2 hour. You will come
to know how great a storyteller you are.
And give a little child a story to tell &
tell them to weave a story, and you will
see how imagination flows.
Anything is possible in their life,
Anything is possible in their world.
So why are we constraining ourselves?
It's not rocket science,
it's not something difficult, it can
be learnt, there is a structure to it,
there is a methodology to it. You just
need to put the pieces in the right place
and approach it in a structured way
and it can become a very simple
and a very enjoyable exercise.
So Sachin's question, should we not have
people presenting these kind of sessions?
Definitely they should.
I'm quite disappointed that we don't have
sessions on this.
This is the other thing
A lot of us are also
disappointed in that there is so much
insistence on tools, that we are not
paying attention on the basics.
We're not paying attention to
what is actually required.
[Vishal] Software companies have brand
marketed themselves so brilliantly over
internet and online educators that they
are insisting more on tools, learn Maya
learn Max with the professionals. They've
never insisted on
learn modeling as a skill or learn how to
make hyper-realistic or particular genre
of textures, maybe that could be one of
the reasons.
I will say a very simple thing
People are running a business
Unless somebody is doing something free
People are running a business
you can't fault them for running a
business, that this is a wrong business.
No one has forced you into the course
You have joined it willingly, with your
eyes open, ears open, at least you should
open your eyes, your ears, talk to people
the point is it's not about
right or wrong teaching in the course.
What's in a curriculum?
3d animation curricula is a standard
curriculum world over.
The point is how much effort are you
putting in beyond that? What is your part?
Which is what I said in the beginning,
how invested are you in this?
How much are you pushing the system?
How much are you saying that it's ok that
I've been shown certain tools, that's
another matter, I'm going to not get
limited by this, I'm going to go beyond
Are you doing that? So don't fault
a software company that has
to sell software. You can't blame them for
it, you can't fault them for it. That they
push software so our animation is ruined
Sorry!, I don't trust that, I don't buy
that ...at all.
That's like saying the government is
pushing for primary education which has
ruined the outcome of our education.
People are pushing education. People are
pushing tools, people are pushing what
they can bring as solutions, it's up to
you
How you take that solution and use it, to
multiply your own knowledge, and whether
you get limited by that tool or you get
liberated by that tool
is entirely upto you...It IS A FACT that
you cannot become an artist due to a tool.
Please understand this, you cannot become
an artist due to a tool, you can learn the
tools to enhance your artistry.
You can't run away from the basics.
[Vishal]: Sir, I think we're done with
all the questions and this session was
really very exciting and it was really
motivating. All are students and viewers
I feel we are really motivated to learn
more things due to this session.
There's one question Vishal over here
which I find quite interesting.
I'm not really sure what Pavan is trying
to say here, but I always tell my students
that whenever you watch an animation
film or you watch a VFx heavy movie
Watch it twice, I'm giving you a Guru
mantra. Maybe it will work for you.
Watch a film twice. First time when you
watch it, watch it purely from an
entertainment point of view.
Does the story excite you?
Do you get involved in the story?
Do you enjoy what you're seeing on screen
Don't get into the technicalities of it.
How did they do it, where, on green screen
with models, live, mixed? Let it be.
Leave that aside, If you really want to
enjoy a Govinda (Bollywood commercial)
movie, leave your logic outside the hall.
If you want to enjoy his movies, don't go
to the hall to intellectualise.
Because they are fantastic movies when it
comes to performance, and the enjoyment
factor, it's mindless stuff that is going
on. It is illogical stuff that is going on
But you enjoy it. Some people will swear
by it. I think his comic timing
is brilliant, if you really want to
understand comic timing, you must watch
him as an actor, as a performer.
But you don't watch his films to start
theoretically breaking them down into
logically this did not happen, he was on
this side, suddenly where has he gone
He was at home just now, and now the
scene has shifted to a dance sequence in
Singapore! What is going on?
If you're going to start intellectualising
a movie like that, you'll never enjoy it.
If you are watching a movie for purely the
fact that you want to understand the
technicalities of it, that's a different
aspect. Then Yes! you're anyways not
sitting for that movie to enjoy it.
My personal feeling there is, you're
sitting in the movie to try and understand
how did they do this, how well has it been
done, how bad, you're basically going
there with a magnifying glass which is a
horrible way to see a movie, if you ask me
But, Ya, people like to do that.
There are enough books on 'making of'
There are enough online tutorials that you
get now which most studios put up
which are behind the scenes
of how movies are made
how sequences are shot, you can take a
look at that and understand how it was
done, how they managed to pull off a very
complicated shot like this.
Very often a time you will find in
today's date and time you think that this
is all live, when all of it is CG
it's done that well and you can't figure
out that this was CG
and it's a shock to you.
My advice to my students always is, watch
the film twice, first time try to watch it
by keeping your technical hat outside
Don't be the director, don't be the actor,
just be an audience member. Go in
watch it purely for entertainment value
Enjoyed it or not? Did it grab you, did
you get an immersive experience? Did you
really live each and every episode in the
film, was the film able to draw you in as
a performer in the story, watch the film
purely to go for getting entertained.
Then, if you still have the interest
and you want to see how it was done
Do your research, find out online how they
did it, after you've studied it online
that this is how behind they've done stuff
Watch the movie again
Now you're doing it from a standpoint of
trying to learn. How did they pull this
Yes, I agree with you that sometimes when
you come to know, if you see it beforehand
that this is CGI, you may not enjoy it.
I think you're over complicating things
for yourself.
It's like people commenting...now this is
public forum don't know whether I should
be saying it or not, but lot of people
commented on some films recently that
came out. Let me name 1 film called -Kabir
People talked about how it is glorifying,
or negating or talking about bad behaviour
It's a film, for heaven's sake
It's a story.
These are characters in the story, it's a
make believe world and in that
make believe world,
if you have come away
being affected so heavily by it
by the performances, I think you should be
giving a gold medal to the actors. That
they have performed so well, that you have
actually believed that this character
exists. Now watch the film
for that performance, instead of that, you
are seeking negativity, and you are
criticising it, that they are showing
something wrong,
They've made a film, why are you creating
a mash of it. It's a film! Watch it from
an entertainment point of view.
Yes! If
on a social platform,
somewhere if there is a talk
on behaviour which is unacceptable
& somebody were to come & say that this
kind of behaviour is unacceptable
and here is an example
I would still be ok with it.
That you're taking an example of a
character which is behaving in a way which
is not acceptable, not done, and you're
showcasing that as something that should
not be done. Let's understand. Let's not
mix the issue, the performance, the story
and the world of make believe.
And if you tell me
honestly, anybody honestly with a
straight face can they say that whatever
has been shown in the film, do these not
happen in real life?
It's like saying, let's not make a film
on rape because then we are encouraging
rape. People will watch a film on rape and
rapes will start happening. C'mon!! it's
something that happens in society and you
address it.
How do you address it, if you watch a
sequence,
look at all the films in the earlier times
We saw Ranjeet (famous Bollywood villain)
one of my favourite actors, the guy who's
probably committed the most physical
assaults on women in the history of Indian
cinema, the Bad Man of Bollywood - Gulshan
Grover, so has society degenerated by
watching their films. This is taking it a
bit too far.
They say films are a reflection of society
Storytelling is a reflection of society.
So whatever is happening around you that
is enough ammunition and fodder for you to
create stories
Now it's your choice, do you pickup the
negative aspects, that you see around you
and you make a film on those aspects or
do you pick up the positive aspects and
you make a film on the positive aspects.
Just because somebody picks up a negative
aspect doesn't make him a lesser or a
bigger film maker that somebody who picks
up a positive. I think that is something
we should be very sensitive to,
and we should respect the choices
that people are making
And if in any character
you see so much
negativity
on the screen that seeing it
you are repulsed
I think you should then be
lauding the performance.
You should then be applauding the
performance
that this character's been so beautifully
portrayed, the way its been done
that I am not seeing Shahid Kapoor anymore
I'm seeing Kabir on screen. Now does that
mean that Shahid Kapoor is that kind of a
character? Far from it. So
Let's try and see what is it for
and which realm are we in.
Yes! there will always be good v/s evil
This has been going on since
time immemorial
What is in the Ramayan? Mahabharat?
Good v/s evil, so does this mean that we
should not talk about these texts because
they have reference to evil.
That seems a little foolish.
So I hope I've been able to answer Pawan's
question, I know we got a little
sidetracked with movies
Yes! watch a movie from technical interest
if you really want to get under the skin
Watch a movie from entertainment point of
view if you want to get under the skin
whether the storytelling is good, whether
you enjoyed from a story perspective, from
a point that did the film maker, are the
characters have they been able to touch
you in a way, that you
have gotten involved with the story
to such an extent that you have
forgotten that you are in the theatre.
That's the best example.
Whether the characters are well thought
out, whether they are well fleshed out
My favorite example that I always give
is a movie which you may have seen
I'm surprised when young students say we
haven't seen it. They should get a whack!
Please go an see it. It's a film called
Sholay.
I think it's an iconic film where from
story, to art direction, cinematography
costume design, to performances,
characterisation,
till date you
remember Thakur,
not Sanjiv Kumar
you remember Gabbar, not Amjad Khan,
you remember Samba, not Macmohan.
This is strength of character development.
So when you develop these kinds of
characters, this type of characterisation,
when you will write such characters
and (such performances), that we forget
the actor, we forget that this animation
has been created by Vishal, but they see
the character that has been animated,
called Samir or Rohit or whatever,
that gets embedded in your head,
that's when you know you've actually
connected to the audience
That you've been able to reach
out to them, so which is why they say that
an artist you have to live the role of
and animation allows you to do this,
this industry this field that you're in,
you have to wear the hat of an animator,
a director, a performer, a choreographer,
a dancer, a light director, DOP,
cinematographer, art director,
costume designer .....everything.
Sound designer, music director,
even a musician, so this is the one field,
one area that allows you the flexibility
to play all these various roles.
So I'll come back again to that whole
point of being invested.
Investment means this only.
If you're trying to make a film,
trying to make an animation short
are you invested in this...
across the various multiple verticals?
or are you only concentrating that No,
I know how to do modeling, I will do only
that and I'll have nothing to do with
the rest of the film.
You can't do that. You have to be invested
100% in it... in all fields.
And take an interest... an active interest
in all this
I remember
Just as an aside I'll tell you,
I was once working with a music director
and this was a small TVC we were doing
and he was making the music for it,
and he looked at me and he said,
something that has always
stayed with me, I'm talking some 20-25 yrs
ago when he said this...
He said, you know I always find it fun to
work with you, when you bring TVCs because
I don't have to struggle to put things in
meter with you. Your films are already
edited to meter, your performances are
edited to meter, how do you do it?
And my response to him was that...
it's 1, it has been an always an interest
in music, different types of music
so I don't limit myself that I will
only listen to Classical,
I enjoy Classical as much as I enjoy
Heavy Metal, as much as I enjoy
Electronica, as much as I enjoy
Fusion, to Sufi, to Hindustani, to
Western Classical, to Indian Classical
everything, across the board
Music has to be something that
if it sounds good to you
forget about what genre it is.
Now what that does is
when you take a subject, a short film and
you're looking at the story, automatically
somewhere down the line, instrumentation
starts coming to your mind. How would I
structure the music for this. What kind of
background sound would I use in this scene
What would be the voice character of my
performer, voice characterisation is a
very important tool for us animators.
What will be the voice of the character?
Heavy, thin, high pitched, low pitched,
gruttal, cracked, makes a huge difference
to the performance, so when you start
thinking sound, when you start thinking
aurally, with your aural capacity
and you have a mind that is constantly
being saturated from various aspects, you
are hearing Sufi music, hearing Indian
classical, hearing Western Classical, you
are hearing different types of instruments
and you are enjoying the beat, the rhythm,
the harmony, the vocals....
when you get into that space,
it starts showing in your work, so
when we made a film, or made a
TVC, made a storyboard
already thinking from a
sound perspective. Which instruments will
we use, how will we treat it musically.
And those things are visible when you go
into a sound studio & the director telling
you that it's a pleasure to make
sound for you because we're not struggling
that much, the sound design is almost
ready for us in terms of the direction we
want to take. So, this is again where
holistic learning comes. This is again
where interest in various different fields
comes in to help you in your work.
And to push your work to the next level.
Any good animation director today...take
Vaibhav Kumaresh, very dear friend, I love
the kind of work that he does,
to sit with Vaibhavji is a pleasure,
because he'll keep humming, some song or
the other he'll hum. We have gone out
to picnics where we've had singing & music
sessions. Now he's an animator you may ask
he's an animation film maker, why is he
singing? Why does he have an interest in
songs. What difference does singing make?
It shows in the work. Somewhere in your
work it will spill out. These are your
sensibilities that will always help you.
[Vishal]: Sir, any more questions you'd
like to address, viewers do you have any
final questions? We can take finally
last 2 questions as what we can address
so any relevant questions you have
please put it in the comment box
Sir, I think so it was a great and
a very informative webinar today and we
would like to have you once more
but on a very particular and precise genre
or precise topic which you could elaborate
on. So guys there is a small request, if
you want Tony Sir back and if you want any
specific topic then we have shared
a small form which is in the description
you can click on it, just a 4 question
form, fill it and hopefully we'll be
conduct a similar kind of webinar you are
expecting, that would be more relevant to
what you want to ask. So I feel...
I feel it's time for goodbye Sir
OK
[Vishal] Thank you for being with us and
sharing your experiences with us.
Pleasure is all mine. I enjoyed I hope
this session is
been useful for people
I know at the outset we said
it's not going to be a techincal session
because
I like to call myself as technologically
challenged, even though I like to
tinker with technology. But
There are a lot of things which go beyond
technology which I think students should
seriously start looking at, if they are
not already, and they should invest a lot
of their time given the fact that there
are so many avenues for knowledge
available today to you.
Please utilise those, please make the best
use of the technology that is available to
you today in terms of information,
in terms of the tool sets
that are available, the tutorials that
are available. And don't ever think
for even an instant that what can
a tutorial teach us? Lot of stuff I am
learning from tutorials, if you think that
I have learnt everything there is to learn
Not at all. I haven't even touched the
tip of the iceberg. So, many areas, I see
people are asking questions on matchmoving
Sorry! the only matchmoving that I have
done has been matchmoving without tools
where frame by frame we have sat and
literally we used to call it donkey work.
Frame by frame we used to track things
using any sort of 2d software,
so in matchmoving if you want something
very nice, you want to excel in
something like that?
here's a quick tip as I go away
take any shot, 25 frame clip
and go into any vector program
that you can get
and trace it frame by frame, don't use a
matchmoving tool because that's easing
your life out for you.
When you trace it, frame by frame and you
play it back you see whether there is any
kind of slide, any jittering, any mismatch
then you will know how much you have to
pay attention to detail.
What is the importance of attention to
detail then. That is the way that
we used to make mattes.
In those days when there was no
matchmoving tool, our test of a new
trainee used to always be that new
trainees have arrived now let them sit to
make mattes & we used to give them footage
of 10 seconds - that is 250 frames.
250 frames!, Now make mattes!
And then you superimpose the mattes on
the live footage and you play the footage
back together and you see
where your matter has spill over
and where has your matte gone under
where it's changing it's shape
Unless you do this detailing physically
by your own hands again see....
if you insist on tools then tools
in a lot of things in life
will make you lazy
you won't understand the basics
where are the corner points, where to pin,
which are the important points which
you have to keep in mind from where
we can understand relative motion
You will get this only when you do
it physically with a brute force technique
Now, it's not to say that brute force is
the way to do it. People may misinterpret
this that instead of matchmoving we should
use brute force, that is better.
There is no better or worse,
I'm just telling you that there is a way
by which you can hone your skills.
One good exercise I give to students
which if you want to learn tracing,
then what is the way to learn it?
Cursive text, you know what it is?
Or text with serifs,
Times Roman is a font
Using Times Roman write any text
type 1 character on screen in large size
72 point or 160 point, type a very big
character......... that letter
Any letter 'R', 'D', 'T'.
First those with single straight lines
start with them, like 'A' and then go
to the ones that have curves them.
And trace them and see.
Using the minimum number of points
If you really want to do good modeling,
then start from here
Take one letter, let's say 'D' for donkey.
Now trace this letter D using vectors
and place your traced image 1 on 1
your traced image on the original image,
there should not be a single pixel shift.
Can you do it?
Are you willing to invest
that kind of time?
This is tracking.
This is hard brute force tracking
Now Imagine this 'D' character
is moving on the screen, dancing like this
1 second footage.
Can you physically place keyframes
and track it?
That you don't see any deviation by even
a single pixel? Then you will understand
the expertise needed in real matchmoving
Otherwise in the software
you press a button you corner pin
how do you know what's happening at the
backend? The you will tweak it and claim
to have become a matchmover.
There is no solution for that.
Therefore today
maybe I may not be able to
explain the software technology
of matchmoving to you because I've never
used it,
but I can definitely explain to you that
at the fundamental level
what you need to do to learn
matchmoving and for that
I've just shared a tip with you.
Try it yourself and see.
I challenge all your attendees today,
not one of you will be able to get it 100%
right in the first shot.
Do it physically without the tool.
And keep doing it till you are not able
to crack it and get a 100% match, then
you will know how painstaking the work is
Then you will know what
attention to detail is. Then you will know
the difference between good work
and exceptional work.
That is where the difference is
attention to detail. So if you want to...
then learn it simply.
[Vishal] Sir, there are a lot of requests
from all our viewers that we need 1 more
new webinar with Tony Sir, and that
usually happens in all of your lectures
Me, personally when I've attended your
sessions, I also used to tell you
Sir, 1 more session, so on that case
hats off Sir for being such a good mentor
and this is something which we as all the
students we need today.
Yes, let's try now to get a little more
specific, if you are interested. Find out
what is the general, whether people want
a session on maybe Idea Concept Story,
if that is the content we want to do
a session on
but I would not want this to be
a session which is very loose.
We want to keep it slightly focussed
If students are really interested,
I'm always happy to make time for anybody
who can even....
I don't know so much, let me clear out
some things for you.
I know very little, I have very little
knowledge, I have very little expertise
I don't know why people feel that I know
a lot. I don't. But whatever little I know
if I can share it with you, if it can help
somebody, I'm always happy to make time
for it. Provided you are serious.
So if you have interest in learning, I can
guarantee one thing that I will not
hesitate to share.
Whatever I can. I can't guarantee that
someone asks a VFx heavy
technical question, then I'll have to
excuse myself. Probably if I don't know
how to do it.
There's a point which comes where you
can't learn everything about everything
You can learn a lot about somethings. So
it depends on where your interest is.
It's not that I haven't done VFx work.
I've done compositing, Vfx, animation,
lighting, modeling, texturing, you name it
I've done it. Even done physical handwork.
You tend to take on certain interest areas
and focus on those interest areas.
So if I can talk about the topic then
Definitely, I'll share whatever I know.
Maybe it will help you, maybe it won't!!
No guarantees.
[Vishal] Ok Sir,
Sir, Thanks for having you
Thank you so much, once again, be safe
all of you, stay at home, don't risk
stepping out. I know this is a difficult
time, make the most of it.
This is a fantastic time to practice a lot
Fantastic time to get online and
get hold of tutorials and follow tutorials
Fantastic time to see chats like this
hopefully we'll get to do more of these
So make the most of it. It's not easy to
get this kind of time. Don't cry about
that we're sitting at home, be happy
that you are at home with
time for personal improvement.
[Vishal] Thank you Sir.
So it's an opportunity make the most of it
[Vishal] Bye Sir.
All right, bye bye......(Wave)
