 
#

### Aptavani 12

### Volume II

Gnani Purush Dadashri

Shuddha Anami

Copyright 2010 by Shuddha Anami

Smashwords Edition

# Word from the Translator:

Please note that Gnani Purush Dadashri never wrote a word for any book. This book is a compilation of his spoken words in satsang, and Shuddha Anami is a translator within a collective, of the words spoken in Gujarati. Shuddha has been sharing the English translations of the words of Gnani Purush Dadashri on the Internet since 1994.

Gnani or Jnani is the One who has known, is in the experience of, the eternal Self. Purush means the Self. Akram Vignan means that which is attained without doing anything, and the science behind this. A gentleman by the name of Ambalal M. Patel became a Gnani Purush in June 1958. This happened spontaneously within him. The absolute light of the Self prevailed in him from that time. In that state of the absolute Self, he became the instrument for the salvation of the world. The words that came out through his medium have become words that are now liberating hundreds of thousands of human beings who were seeking meaningful solutions for their pains. These satsang sessions of the Gnani Purush happened in Gujarati and were carefully preserved and are presented as they are, in many different languages. They are all in the form of questions and answers from Gnani Purush Dadashri.

Aptavani 12 is available in two volumes. 'This Aptavani 12 is the collection in a book of that which equips those who have attained the Self through Akram Vignan, to rise towards absolute Self. These Souls are called Mahatmas.' These are the words of Atmagnani Dr.Niruben Amin. Aptavani 12 was made available to the world in Gujarati, in 1999.

The Gnan Vidhi of the Gnani Purush separates the Self from the self. The reader is requested to allow for the use of capital letters in the book, which have been used frequently for ease of understanding the message of the Gnani Purush. The small 's' is the self or the worldly interacting self, where the reader has to introduce one's own worldly name. The 'S' is used to denote the awakened Self after the Gnan Vidhi or the absolute Self. Similarly, the small 'y' is used for the worldly self, and the 'Y' for 'You' is for the awakened One. The small 'v' is for the vision through the worldly eyes or the physical eyes whereas the 'V' is for the Vision of the awakened One as the Self.

Table of Contents

Word from the Translator:

Samarpan

Volume II

Aptavani destroys all demerit karma effects

Editorial

Preface

[1] The Importance of Agna

[2] The Line of Demarcation between the Real and the Relative

[3] Settling of Files with Equanimity

[4.1] Inner stock of karma

[4.2] Charge-Discharge

[4.3]Cause-Effect

[5] "Not Mine"

[6] Anger

[7] Sainyam – Absence of Kashaya

[8] The Penance for Liberation

[9.1] To Suffer (bhogavavoo); To Feel (vedavoo); To Know (jaanvoo).

[9.2] Pleasure from non-Self complex – Bliss from the Self

[10] Understanding the Goal of the absolute Self

[11] The Majesty of Satsang

[12] Freedom from fear in the state of Knowledge

[13] Soul or Self Oriented Resolve (nischaya) and Worldly interactions (vyavahar)

[1] Importance of Agna

The One who follows the five Agna, attains the state of Lord Mahavir

Awareness and moksha through the Agna only

Agna verily is religion and penance

Value is of the Agna only

Is Dada important or the Agna?

It is necessary to remain Agna

Ocean emptied into Your pitcher

That which gives satisfactory solution is Gnan

Guarantee of attaining the Self

Moksha guaranteed for the one who lives in the Agna

I take the responsibility for the one living in the Agna

The Agna is verily My presence

Attain the energy from the Gnani

How brilliant Dada is!

The liability lies with the one giving the Agna

Swachhand ceases with Agna of Gnani Purush

Awareness as the Self remains naturally

Plus the Agna is fresh

Awareness to remain in the Agna is needed

Only the nischaya is required for the Agna

Five Agna keep You constantly as the Self

Only the One with great merit karma receives special Agna

Agna removes koosang, detrimental influence

Agna are not to be recited

Gnani's closeness is verily moksha

Akram's flywheel

Only awareness is needed

Agna protects the Self

Numeral 'one' on a blank slate is always clear and clean!

When one does not remain in the Agna after attaining Gnan

Protection by the ticketless Dada

He who understands Agna, has understood everything

Contracts of karma of past life create obstacles

Ticket for the ultimate destination

Agna without Gnan

Gnan without Agna

Where there is Agans, there is Liberation from all misery

The essence of all religions in the five Agna!

Keep understanding the Agna

The Self and the non-Self are enveloped in the five Agna

Based on the Agna, there is one more life

Faster progress through Agna

Following the Agna pleases the Gnani

Follow Your goal, not the mind

Discharge moha goes away through Agna

He who does not have the slightest intellect is a Gnani

Dada's Agna verily is one's everything

This Agna is of Dada Bhagwan

Who follows the Agna?

Thermometer of the Agna

Prakruti takes over upon failure to remain in the Agna

Where there is Agna, there is saiyam and samadhi

Get the work done, how?

[2] Demarcation between Real and relative

After attaining Gnan...

Mahatmas have attained Bhedagnan, the knowledge of separation

Shuddhatma is not in the form of word

You have to turn the handle in the beginning

The Effect of Seeing the Soul benefits the Self

This is the samayik of Pooniya Shravak 'Pooniya' to avoid confusion with Punyai

Divine vision blossoms through practice

Not 'thou are that' but 'I am that'

The Pure Soul in Others remains in Awareness

'I am Shuddhatma' - should this be in words or in awareness?

One can Say That Only After being Awakened

It is not mechanical for the mahatmas

Is it not the subtle ego?

Remember that

You do not have to repeat 'I am Shuddhatma' again and again

You cannot do Japa or Penance in Gnan

His main nature is this

Moksha through worshipping the hidden Self

How much Agna should one follow?

Unawareness of Agnas due to diet

That reduces the suffering

Shuddhatam forever pure

Atma becomes what it envisions

Wrong or right is of prakruti only

How should one remain in the Self?

The inner burning has stopped

Safety in a strong room

Akram Vignan, a scientific way

Support for the kashaya is destroyed

The real is permanent, the relative is temporary

Both are inseparable

What separates the two is pragna, the energy of the awakened Self

Line of Demarcation between Real and relative

Every Atma is Shuddhatma

[3] Settle files with equanimity

With equanimity, the world goes out of memory

Settling the file of eating with equanimity

What is considered a file?

Only the nischaya does the work

Can weapons be picked up in equanimity?

So much power and energy in the word 'file'!

The understanding of settling with equanimity

The inner intent of equanimity should not be broken

Don't look at the resolution; remain in the Agna

Cling to the decision tenaciously

Neither attachment nor abhorrence; that is equanimity

See with equanimity, the wrestling of the non-Self complexes

The secret of equanimity and settlement

Want a just solution or want to settle with equanimity?

Should you tolerate it or swallow it?

Blessed is the day of the special prize!

Then it will be solved, will it not?

Is singing of pados, spiritual songs, a charge or an effect?

Nikal does not mean to dispose

Keys for doing nikal

The worldy life survives on the pillar of enmity

Whether you like it or dislike it, it is a file only

The visa for moksha is in hand but the files have to be settled

The worldly life wandering is perpetuated by enmity

Settle the account of karma sooner than later

By what method do I settle?

Do not hurt, that is critical

Satisfaction for the other person will free you

If it is not settled then is there bondage?

No need for indifference in the Akram path

The home department and the foreign department

The Gnani Purush settles with equanimity

Circumstances by nature dissociate for sure

Akram Gnan is working on autopilot

Settle the likes-dislikes with equanimity

Your own account of karma only

Difficulties from others awaken the energies of the Self

Remain dramatic (superficial) and then settle

Reprimand but after separating the Self

Special ways of settling files with equanimity

Maintain the pure intent of equanimity

Cutting off the rotten part is settling with equanimity

Settle in the language of the water bufallo

The other person is irrelevant in your settling with equanimity

The responsibility is not yours, thereafter

You should not see the result, just settle with equanimity

Equanimity against sticky file

Maintain equanimity and leave the stress of a file

The file will leave but attachment will remain

Spend this life in settling with equanimity

Layers of sticky file are shed just with the nischaya

Sticky files push You towards moksha

The sticky tape has to removed gently

What is sticky? Is it the file or the glue?

How can stickiness come to an end?

Layers of files removed just by 'seeing' them

Settling with family files with equanimity

Right for one but wrong for the other

Become free, even if you have to act crazy

Quick settlement with commonsense

You cannot look at profit or loss in settling a file

When lawsuits arise, maintain Your equanimity

You may fight in court but do so with equanimity

'Doing' ruins; 'seeing' improves

File two problem settled with equanimity

Freedom from conflicts with file two made easy

The way to settle with children with equanimity

Should children be scolded or not?

Equanimity and teaching pratikraman when he steals

It is a file that brings pleasure or pain, not your relative

Which is more important, the office worker or the file?

Collective settlement of the files

There are no more new files after Gnan

Quickly or at the right time?

The exact application of upayoga in settling a file

As the files decrease, shuddha upayoga increases!

Entanglements in files dissipate awareness

Clear experience of the Self is obstructed due to files

When is the file completely settled?

Emotional outbursts amongst mahatmas

Mahatmas are Dada's files ?

You cannot become like Dada

What now remains is the settlement of parishaha

Even if you are to be hanged, settle with equanimity

The two tasks of antaratma, the awakened Self

Have conversations with file number one

Understanding the ego and pragnya

The body complex is gneya and I am gnayak

Settling file one by seeing it

The details of settling file number one with equanimity

Whose file is it?

F-I-L-E distinguishes the awakened One of Akram Vignan

My-ness, mamata vanishes with the word 'file'

The energy of the word nikal

This is Dada's Vignan!

Aho Aho This wonderous Akram Vignan

This Vignan has manifest after a million years!

The Lord was without files

[4.1] Filled stock of karma

Become free by saying 'not mine'

This is siddhant, the ultimate principle

Are the karma to be discharged or is the discharge taking place?

Filled stock must come out

Profit is not seen because of heavy debt

The stock of karma is cleansed through pratikraman

Now, only the water in the pipe line remains

Good or Bad – both are to be discharged

Liberation even in Dada's subtle presence

The filled stock will even show you faults of Dada

When there is no interference; the filled stock will fall away

Thoughts too are filled stock!

Become suspicion-free but not arrogant

[4.2] Charge-discharge

After attaining Gnan...

The understanding of charge and discharge bhaav

Discharge has to be seen with Gnan

Become free through pratikraman

That is precisely why we became worry free

Despite activity there is complete inactivity

Oh karma! Come, you are welcome!

The fact is very subtle

Acquisitiveness-nonacquisitiveness both are discharge

After Gnan, even the ego is ego-less!

Following the Agna is charge

Discharge of discharge

Misuse of discharge

In Akram the discharge happens without charging

Pratikraman erases the 'design'

If the karma are docile, then the suffering is light

[4.3] Cause and effect

It is an effect even when you sign it

Raag-dwesh verily is the cause

The first change is in the cause

What that too is an effect?

Understanding suffocation after Gnan

[4.3] Cause and effect

It is an effect even when you sign it

Raag-dwesh verily is the cause

The first change is in the cause

What that too is an effect?

Understanding suffocation after Gnan

[5] 'Not mine'

Then You will have to go to moksha!

There is no attachment-abhorrence in 'not mine'

The puzzle due to kashays

The instant you say 'not mine,' it vanishes

When You say 'not mine', You are the Self

The Gnan of the line of demarcation maintains separation

Karma are separate and the Self is separate

Pragnya separates it

Engrossment in phases of mind will have to be broken

Even in difficult times there is endless bliss

That is where the experience of the Self becomes steady

All circumstances are of the pudgal, the non-Self complex

The scientific effect of the words 'not mine'

That which creates any effect is 'not mine'

The one that hurts is your step-relative

The method of becoming free from addictions

Where the awareness is dim, there effects will continue

House catches fire after it is sold

The one who says 'not mine' is the winner in the end

Ownership but without mamata

Beyond pleasure and pain

The Self and the non-Self

Whose intent of ownership is in this?

Myness is inversely proportional to Gnan

Now there is purification for the pudgal

[6] Anger and

Stored anger becomes empty!

After Gnan, the kashaya are of the non-Self

Freedom from kashaya in the Akram Path

Anger is charge and gusso is discharge

Taap

Taanto: the link of continuity of kashaya

The part that does anger is separate and the Self is separate

The definition of exact awareness

[7] Saiyam

Saiyam with asaiyami is true saiyam

Even the offender is seen faultless

The karma settles only with saiyam

Opinion that becomes separate from prakruti is saiyam

There is no saiyam where there is dehadhyas, the belief of 'I am Chandulal'

Real saiyam is the saiyam of kashaya

Saiyam is when there is no artadhyan or raudradhyan

Five Agnas – that verily is saiyam

Complete saiyam is natural with Self-realization

[8] Penance for moksha

Penance in Kaliyug while sitting at home

Difference between inner penance and external penance

Gnan-darshan-charitra-tapa

Equanimity lost in the opportunity for penance at hand

Understanding penance at the time it is happening

Penance needed where it is contrary to your goal

Dada too has invisible penance

Penance for moksha

If pleasure then the tapa will be broken

Wrong or right is verily a relative view

Taking consolation from others weakens the penance

Penance at the time of obstructions for satsang

Is there a difference between tapa and artadhyan?

Dada did such penance

Tapa is not in the vyavasthit

What stops it from manifesting into one's conduct?

Penance in the Akram Path is within

Should you ask for penance or bliss?

Tapa happens while settling with equanimity

Questioner: Is it because it has come into charitra conduct?

The son; is he yours or is he the source for penance?

The brave will seize the tapa

Energy of the Self manifests through penance

[9.1] BHOGAVAVOO – VEDAVOO – JAANAVOO

The state of the Gnani during physical pain

Unaffected state even during pain and discomfort

The neighbor suffers the pain; I do not.

Dadashri's upayoga while dining

The one who tastes the pleasure has to suffer the pain

Separate during eating is to be separate during suffering

The way of the Tirthankaras during pain

Pain suffering : from the experience to the knowing state

Penance is to remain separate from pain sensations

The sufferer and the knower are absolutely separate

[ 9.2 ] Pudgal Pleasure versus Bliss of the Self

Where does true pleasure lie?

The one who offends you is greatly beneficial to you

The conviction that the body is pain generator

The comforts makes one a pleasure seeker

Watch out! You will have to repay them!

Thus are the pains of mind and speech

The understanding nurtures the power of the 'bearing'

To sleep is to lock the Self in a sack

Absolute enlightenment is obstructed by the taste of pudgal

Initially absolute conviction is needed

Lack of reaction to pain happens after Gnan Vidhi

The first stage of moksha

Experience the bliss of the Self

[10] Understanding of the Goal

Subtle difference between aim and goal

To attain the Self is verily the goal

Absolute Self verily is the goal after, 'I am pure Soul'

When terrible adversity arises, then enter the Self

Dhyeya, Nischaya and Niyanu

[11] Importance of Satsang

What if the water is not sprinkled after sowing the seeds?

If the nischaya is strong then obstacles will break

You will never sustain a loss in business while in satsang

The amazing wonder of the company of Dada and His Satsang

Even insults in satsang are beneficial

You cannot trust a venomous snake

Punyai pulls one away from koosang into satsang

Live in the group of mahatmas

[12] Fearlessness, in the state of Gnan

All kinds of fear leave in the company of the Gnani

There is always protection along with fear

Eternal freedom from fear in the abode of the Self

A Gnani is absolutely fearless

No one can shake the one who is strong

Become such that no living being will experience fear from you

A reaction of being startled due to reflex is not fear

Fear leaves once the ignorance leaves

When sorrow does not move, one will move away himself

When bombs fall, one becomes like the absolute Self

Fear or fearlessness, at the time of death?

That is when the Science becomes Complete

[13] Uchit vyavahar – Shuddha vyavahar

Discharging karmic stock is not vyavahar

The internal intent is verily vyavahar

Only the Gnani helps one attain shuddha vyavahar

The Self Knows and the worldly interaction continues

No shuddha vyavahar without Self-realization

Sadavyavahar is ego dependant: Shuddha vyavahar is egoless

Deeper understanding of sadavyavahar

Shuddha vyavahar is without ego

The difference between shubha and shuddha vyavahar

Shubha, ashubha and ashuddha interaction

All interaction except the shuddha interaction is with ego

Shuddha vyavahar happens after kashayas end

Examples of various types of vyavahar

Shuddha nischaya rests on the foundation of shuddha vyavahar

Complete vyavahar dharma in the five Agnas

Shuddha vyavahar is like a drama

The wagon to moksha can no longer get stuck

Akram Vignan sails through the worldly life

Seeing the Self in the person cursing you

Shuddha-vyavahar only after attaining the Self

No insistence in vyavahar

Vyavahar remain right till the end

There is no relationship between vyvahar and nischaya

Vyavahar cannot be negated or ignored

Pudgal is vyavahar and Chetan is nischaya

Swabhavik is nischaya and vibhavik is vyavahar

The doer of the vyavahar is with the vyavahar

Vyavahar cannot be renounced prematurely

Vyavahar is settling

Centering is vyavahar and the slab is nischaya

Where vyavahar is ideal there is completion

Ideal vyavahar is like this

Vyavahar of devotees

The worldly life interaction decorated through ego

Guidance for the vyavahar of mahatmas

The vitarag are more beneficial to the world

The vyavahar of mahatmas is being settled

In Akram, the vyavahar is like ice

Conduct needs to be settled only in Akram Vignan

Respect to even those that insult – that is pure vyavahar

Even the Gnani accepts the realm of vyavahar

Vyavahar of the Gnani is rasadavo

Keval Gnan is when the vyavahar does not touch You at all

I really appreciate you reading this book! Here are my social media coordinates:

# Samarpan

The Complete Offering

Sthoodamaathi sookshma taraf, peysaadey barmi na Aptavachan

From the overt to the subtle, moves, the energizing sentences of this twelveth one of the Gnani,

Nathi maatra pathan kaajey, maange oondoo param arthaghatan!

Is not just for reading only, it demands deep effort to derive the absolute meaning, the Self.

AgnaO nu mahatva, swachhand nirmulan;

The acceptance of the critical importance of the Agnas, dissolves all self-willed efforts

Shirey Dada layee ley mosha soodhinoo saurakshan!

Then 'Dada' takes over all the responsibilities of protection until _moksha_

Gnata-Drashta sahejey sampraapya, shuddha upayoga nu nivaaran;

The state of the Knower-Seer is naturally and easily attained, pure awakened awareness unfolds

Barma gunasthan dhariO ! Paamo anant bhedi aa samajan!

O attainers of the twelveth level of spiritual quality stage! Attain this vision beyond all secrets

Pragatina sopaan chadhaavey, shikharey laksha dradhikaran

Makes one climb the steps of progress, and establishe the firm awareness of the Peak

Ek ja shabda pachye mandaavey, mokshana gabharey pagaran

The digestion of just one word, moves one in the depths of _moksha_

Aho aho Dada!Tamaroo vachanbada, shabdey shabda bhedey avaran

I am filled with wonder Dada! The energy of Your words pierces veils of ignorance by each word

Vamani laagey prachand shakti, ajamaavi jey 'pokharan'!

Against which the colossal energy of the atomic test at Pokharan is insignificant!

Gnani ni jagrutini jhalako, jhookavey seesha Gnani charan;

The glimpses of the awareness of the Gnani, makes the head bow to the feet of the Gnani

Aho ahoni ashrudhara, vanchata naa sookaava dey nayan!

The flow of tears from the absolute wonder, does not let the eyes dry while reading!

Baarmoo gunthanu vyavaharthi pamava, karo nitya aradhan;

To attain the twelveth stage in worldly interaction, be continuously devoted

Baarmi Aptavani kaajey, mahatmaO ney vinavan!

To the 'work' of Aptavani Twelve, that is the request to _mahatmas_!

Jagruti yagna ni akalpya samagrio nu collection;

This uniamginable collection of the auspicious sacrificial fire of awareness

Samarpan samarpan, Akram mahatmaO ney samarpan!

Is surrendered with absolute humilty to _mahatmas_ of Akram Vignan!

~Pujya Niruben Amin 1999

Aptavani 12

# Volume II

#

## Aptavani destroys all demerit karma effects

**Questioner:** The world became invisible for two hours while readingAptavani!

**Dadashri:** Yes, such two hours never arrive. It is a very big thing when the presence in the world, is broken. While reading Aptavani, when the world is forgotten, a whole bunch of demerit (sinful) karma are washed off. In this all demerit karma are burnt to ashes. This is because, in this, while reading, one is not in the world or in _moksha_ ; he is in the middle. There is no worldly life in this at all. Therefore, Aptavani is such that it will accomplish the work of liberation.

This Aptavani will help people a lot, if it comes in the hands of the people in future! This is because the understanding and vision from all corners is placed in it. There is not a single corner where the understanding remains to be placed. And upto fourteen Aptavanis are yet to come, and they will be something else altogether! Gnani Purush Dadashri and Dada Bhagwan the manifest Absolute Self within Him... _Dada Bhagwan Na Aseem Jai Jaikar Ho_

The One who manifest within Gnani Purush 'A.M. Patel'

DADA BHAGWAN NA ASEEM JAI JAIKAR HO

# Editorial

The _mahatmas_ of Dadashri, the revered scientist of Akram Vignan (the stepless path to Self-realization), have attained the Self. Now, they are to start the journey to attain absolute Knowledge ( _Keval Gnan_ ). They have to attain absolute Knowledge while fulfilling their remaining worldly responsibilities ( _sansaar_ ) and while staying as the Self ( _nischaya_ ). Dadashri has frequently explained about _mahatmas'_ puzzles about their worldly interaction, their difficulties in following the Agnas (the five cardinal spiritual instructions given after Self-realization) and about ways in which they can remain in awareness ( _jagruti_ – awareness of the Self). His spoken words, in different places, addressing different questioners in various situations, have been recorded in audio format. After transcription of Dadashri's satsang from all the various audio-cassettes; a 'necklace' is made from the scattered beads of the Gnani's wisdom! It will prove to be very effective for _mahatmas_ to progress on the path of ultimate liberation ( _moksha_ ). While reading, many things are clarified within. We feel as if Dadashri is talking to us directly. The reader should insert his own name in place of Dadashri's conversation with "Chandu". 'Chandu or Chandulal or Chandubhai' means the owner of the name, your relative self. In every sentence, one should move from the belief of 'I am Chandu', to that of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ (pure Soul- pure Self) only'; 'I am not the doer'; 'I am only the Knower-Seer ( _gnata-drashta_ )'. 'Besides the Atma - the Soul - all else is 'not mine'. Everything is simply a discharge, of all that was previously charged. Only the stored baggage ( _bharelo maal –_ previously charged karma) is coming out. Under no circumstances are new causes being created in that. What You are 'seeing' is only the effect of past life causes. This has been emphatically reiterated. In reading this, a tremendous affirmation takes place within.

After Self-realization (Gnan), _mahatmas_ do not have to do anything except to stay in the five Agnas all the time. What have the Tirthankaras said? 'Agna is religion ( _dharma_ ) and Agna is penance ( _tapa_ ).' No other penance is required thereafter. These five Agnas are only for _mahatmas_ , those who have taken Gnan through the Gnan Vidhi. They are not helpful for other people. The person, who can stay in the five Agnas in their exactness, shall attain a state that is similar to Lord Mahavir's! He will become _ekavatari_ – one more lifetime before final liberation! Yes, the Five Agnas are to be followed with _pragnya_ (liberating energy of the Self) and not with the intellect ( _buddhi_ ). Agnas followed with intellect will not set one free from karma!

_Mahatmas_ are to study the first and the second half of this Aptvani very minutely. They are not to leave it alone until there is crystal clarity through deep-thinking and inner visualization or through asking questions during live _satsang_. Deep study is to be done. While reading these words one is profoundly awed and gets a high level understanding about the true nature of the Gnani Purush. While comparing Dadashri's words with the words of the self-proclaimed enlightened people, or the 'dry' (those without the experience of Self-realization) scholars; one realizes the difference between an authentic diamond and a piece of glass! Great praise to this unique Gnani Purush! Reading His experiences gives the meaning to the phrase 'Never before and never again'!

In various places are described Dadashri's experiences about the ways in which he stays in the awareness ( _jagruti_ ) of the Self, in pure applied awareness of the Self ( _shuddha_ _upyoga_ ), in separation state of the Self and in a state of absolute detachment ( _vitaragata_ ). This will prove to be the beacon for us all in the understanding of the goal and the mistakes in attaining the goal! Then the heart becomes filled with emotions of tremendous gratitude, "Dada, praise be to you! You have given this wonderful _Aptavani_ (speech of the One who libeartes) to people of this era who are unfortunate in every aspect (from the perspective of liberation) and made it extremely easy for them to achieve liberation ( _moksha_ )!" Upon reading the words of the perfect experience of the One who has attained the highest level of spiritual knowledge in this era, one gets the freedom from the burden of reading all other confusing literature on spirituality. As soon as 'Dadashri's book is in the hands, the arms, legs and the heart start to dance!

I cannot help but mention a specific red flag for _mahatmas_. Dadashri's speech is on worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ ) as well on the Soul-the Self. The limitations of speech are such that two viewpoints cannot be cleared at the same time! Multiple balls can be pocketed with one stroke in a billiards game; this is not the case with speech; only one aspect, one view, can be talked about at one time. Therefore, when there is talk about the Soul, "Only for the purpose of remaining steady in the Soul', it has been said that no matter what interaction Chandubhai has done, You the Self are pure, you are the pure Soul. And besides that all the rest are _paramanus_ (sub-atomic particles) which are 'not mine', it is only discharge and for _mahatmas_ , there can be no new charge (karma)." etc. has been said. And in fact, that is correct. But when there is talk about _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction); 'What type of awareness should Chandubhai stay in' has also been mentioned. What is ideal worldly interaction ( _adarsha_ _vyavahar_ )? When it is not hurtful to anyone at home or outside, it is ideal worldly interaction! If someone gets hurt, Chandubhai has to do _pratikraman_. The truth of the matter here is, this hurtful interaction is Chandubhai's discharge; however, in order to breakdown Chandubhai's wrong opinions about the other person and to purify his response, Chandubhai has to be made to do _pratikraman_ , with the awareness of "I am the Pure Soul, I am not to do _pratikraman_ but Chandu must do it." Otherwise, it will be misused and it will spoil the _vyavahar_ and the person whose _vyavahar_ is spoilt, will have problem with the awareness of the Self ( _nischaya_ ).

Now, if _mahatmas_ take Dadashri's words about the Self only neglecting His words about worldly interactions, then it will create a lot of confusion and then one will not know where his train will end up!

What is the conclusion of Akram science in short? "I am pure Soul only"; I am only the Knower-Seer and whatever is happening in the self's life is the result of previously filledkarma and One is to 'see' that. Now, where does one make the mistake here? [1] If one did not know that this is a filled stock from past life ( _bharelo maal_ ), it is a total loss. [2] If one knew that this is filled stock from past life but didn't 'see' it as a separate entity; it is a partial loss. Here, he allows the mistake to continue and does not oppose it. Therefore, he will not be able to know when He slips from the Knower-Seer state in future. [3] 'I am pure Soul' and anything other than which happens that is discharging of the filled stock. It is to be 'Known' and 'Seen' as separate; not only that but there should be a strong opposition from _pragyna_ at all times that, 'This is wrong, it shouldn't be so'; then, we will win and the filledpervious karma will vacate the house and leave.

Many times, one will know and see that 'This is the filledprevious karma' but then, the perverse intellect will deceive him within a short time and he will not be aware of this. And the intellect will take over and instead of allowing the vision to remain as a vision; the intellect will become dominant. As a result, it will place one in a position of suffering from the subtle ( _sookshma_ ) to the gross ( _sthool_ ) levels! Nevertheless, it causes no new charge of karma but the previously charged will not get thoroughly discharged and one does not experience bliss of the Self during this time. To be in the exactness of Gnan during all this, if one uses this simple, straightforward and easy key; one will attain the state of one more life before _moksha_ in the Akram lift. This is guaranteed! What key is that? Once the filled stock that is expressing is opposed, the possibility of getting engrossed with it is gone. Thereafter, whatever Chandu, the relative self, file no. 1 does, good or bad; if he sees a beautiful woman and he is attracted to her, even then it is a discharge of karma; it is just _parmanus_ getting exhausted. He is to go on opposing it and maintain that 'This is not I-the Self'. While remaining in this much awareness all the time, the filledkarma shall decidedly get exhausted. The person who fits this much understanding of the Akram science all the time, will be able, even in this era, to live in a state of freedom from all disturbances and a state of freedom from the worldly life, just as the Gnanis do, and attain _moksha_ in only one more life time. This is a fact.

Pujya Dadashri has said on one occasion that, whether Chandubhai does a bad deed or a good deed; 'see' them both. This is because the Seer is not at fault, there is no good or bad. The Seer is the light of Knowledge ( _Gnan_ _prakash_ ). Just as flowers do not give fragrance to any source of light and mud doesn't make it dirty; in the same way the Self is _nirleyp,_ non-taintable by good deeds or bad deeds. Therefore, the Self, is pure, but if Chandubhai does something bad, You, the Self, should remain separate and make him do _pratikraman_ and rebuke him. It would be a mistake if Chandubhai remains _nirleyp_ – unaffected. The Self is already pure. Thus, there is a wonderful balance between the speech that is directed towards the Self and the speech that is directed towards worldly life. And none of the talks are about one side only. Liberation will be possible only if both the sides; _vyavahar_ , worldly interaction and _nischaya_ , the Self, are balanced. Here, if there is misuse, no benefit will be attained and there will be loss. Moreover, all the karma in the worldly interactions are declared as discharge karma. Illicit sex ( _unhaq no vishaya_ ), meat eating and alcohol; these three are prohibited. As long as these three are present, there cannot be any talk of liberation ( _moksha_ ) or religion ( _dharma_ ). Therefore, only if this is understood from all aspects, can one start the progress but otherwise it will not happen with one-sided understanding.

Often times, _mahatmas_ understand that worldly interactions take preference over the Self and believe that they are told to dispose the file with equanimity ( _sambhavey nikaal_ ) and thus conveniently protect their illusory attachment ( _moha_ ) towards that fie. They avoid coming to _satsang_ with this excuse. In this context, Dadashri has defined a 'file' as that which is likened to being forced by a policeman to eat meat (for one who is a vegetarian) or get beat up. But if one 'likes it' and 'does it' and claims that he is settling his'file'; then it is considered as misuse of Gnan.

Dadashri's unique speech has naturally come forth dependent upon the matter, place, time and intents, ( _dravya, kshetra, kaad and bhaav,_ respectively) and depends on the evidentiary instrument ( _nimit_ ). The reader may find a fault or controversy at someplace in the book, but in fact, not a single sentence of the Gnani is controversial. The path of liberation is a path of cultivation of the knowledge of each individual. In order to dissipate an individual's _prakruti_ (non-Self complex), Dadashri would screen his _prakruti_ as it is, and then make the understanding of science, fit him. He had that surprising _shakti_ energy! Different remedies for different _prakruti_ are shown in the current volume and it is possible that may seem contradictory. If a hundred patients have 104º fever but an experienced doctor will give different medicine to each of them. Some will get medicine for malaria, some for typhoid, some for virus, and some for a kidney infection! Will a layman not see contradictions here?

To a person of strong mind who may have committed a serious fault, Dadashri tells him to rebuke himself (file one) forcefully. Whereas, to someone else He would say, "There is no need to rebuke yourself; just do _pratikraman_." This He would say to a person of sensitive or depressive nature otherwise he would go into depression! Moreover, while talking about the higher levels of Knowledge, he has said that the one who remains in the Knower-Seer ( _gnata_ - _drashta_ ) state does not need to do _pratikraman_. Now, if someone who is unable to remain in the Knower-Seer state takes up this sentence one-sidedly and with his own interpretation that, 'I don't need to do _pratikraman_ '; where will he end up then?

Attempts are made to capture the Gnani's speech that has become available over twenty years at various places and with thousands of _mahatmas_ , and to compile that speech in a smooth flow. If a mistake is found by a well-informed reader, it is because of defective compilation and not because the Gnani's speech is defective. Every single sentence of a Gnani is such that no part of it can be crossed off at any time!

Pujya Dadashri's words are spoken but naturally in the colloquial _Charotari_ dialect. It has been maintained as it is, so that the exactness and accuracy of the speech has arisen can be preserved without deforming it. And it's sweetness and it's 'heart touching' effects are a different matter altogether. And only those who enjoy it; know it!

Dr. Niruben Amin

# Preface

Dr. Niruben Amin

## [1] The Importance of Agna

After imparting the knowledge of the Self, absolutely revered Gnani Purush Dadashri gives the five Agnas (instructions which when followed attain liberation) in order to purify the worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) and bring it to an end. One is to use the Agnas at every moment of life and be free from all the bondages of the worldly life. The five Agnas' importance is so much that Dadashri says, "If one follows the five Agnas, he will be in a state similar to Lord Mahavir's, I can attest to that. Even if you follow one instead of five, I take the responsibility for you." The science of the whole world is contained in these five sentences.

The five Agnas are cardinal for remaining in constant awareness of the Self. The five Agnas are the protective fence for the Knowledge!

Akram Vignan, the scientific realization of the Self, that Dadashri has given to this world; is quite short and free of any labor. One remains effortlessly in awareness and the karma get exhausted!

Because of the tremendous energy and strength in the Gnani's words, these five Agnas present themselves on their own and give total resolution for each and every situation! This is a science and science means it is self-functioning ( _svayam_ _kriyakari_ )! It makes one aware of one's own mistakes at all times!

With the support of the five Agnas, the Akram Vignan opens up the path for final liberation for even those who are married, people with wife and children and people with a job or business. Only for the married, there is a cautionary red flag with reference to sexuality that, 'Only with what is rightfully yours and only if there is a 'fever' may you take the medicine!' And they are to follow the five Agnas.

Dadashri gives the guarantee that after going through the process of the Gnan Vidhi, if one follows the five Agnas, he is guaranteed final liberation, _moksha_! There too, Dadashri does not say that one should follow them one hundred percent but even if one follows them by seventy percent; that's enough as well. One is to ask for forgiveness for the remainder that was not followed.

Dadashri also says that 'the person who follows My five Agnas has My protection. 'I' have to be present there'. A doctor gives instructions about the do's and don'ts after giving medicine and the patient does follow them, right? Similarly, these five Agnas are instructions for liberation. Dadashri even goes farther and says that if the person following the five Agnas has a single worry, he can bring a legal claim for two hundred thousand against him!

What if the Agnas cannot be followed? Dadashri takes the responsibility for the person who sincerely wants to follow them but is unable to do so, but not for those who misuse it. There is no objection if one cannot follow the Agnas despite being sincere in this. If one does not follow the Agnas, then the Gnani does not take responsibility for him.Is there any risk for the giver of Agna (Gnani Purush)? No. It is only for the benefit of others and therefore, it does not touch Him. To get guarantee for the final liberation without doing chanting ( _japa_ ), penance ( _tapa_ ), renunciation ( _tyaga_ ); such is the Akram Vignan that is available to us and we must accomplish the goal in it! To live the worldly life and yet not miss out the bliss even for one moment is a wonderful accomplishment!He who remains in the Agna of the Gnani Purush has totally uprooted _swachhand_ (to act according to the dictates of the intellect). In spirituality, when one conducts himself according to one's own intellect, it is called _swachhand_! One can never uproot _swachhand_ without remaining in the Agna of the Gnani Purush. One is only to make the firm decision to remain in the Agna and the Gnan in order to be in the awareness of the Gnan, the Self! How can awareness not remain? Where is the requirement for studies or ritualistic activities there?Just as the rules of traffic and the road are in the awareness ( _laksha_ ) of the driver of a vehicle; the five Agnas should be in the awareness of _mahatmas_ all the time. It is not objectionable that the Agna was not followed, but it should not be one's inclination that one doesn't want to follow them. The resolve to follow the Agnas must be there one hundred percent.

When one is not with or near the Gnani Purush, His Agnas are equal to His presence! When horrible uprising of karma are there and one remains in Agnas, everything will resolve completely! Nothing else is to be done by the person who follows the Agnas. No rituals or scriptural studies are necessary.Once the Gnani's blessings and _shakti_ (energy, power) are obtained, it is not difficult to follow the Agnas. Why can't _purushartha_ (following the Agnas) be done after attaining the Self? Unflinching determination ( _nischaya_ ) is the main thing. "Make a resolution everyday and say five times, "I want to follow the Agnas come what may!" and then if you can't follow them, 'we' give the bonus", says Gnani Purush Dadashri. There is nothing higher than the high level understanding of the Agnas. Then, the Agnas shall present themselves! If one follows the Agnas completely, he doesn't need to meet with Dadashri. But he should meet with Dadashri for speedy resolution of all issues! Therefore, stay in touch with the Gnani. It is extremely necessary to be in His proximity! That verily is _moksha_!

Why should one even go to _Satsang_ (company of Self-realized beings)? To be able to remain in the Agnas, that is why. In this _Kaliyug_ (fourth era of the time cycle characterized by lack of unity in mind-speech and bodily actions), Agna is the fence that protects one becoming lost in worldly life ( _kusang_ ).

While doing Dadashri's _nididhyasan_ (visualization), Dadashri will present Himself at any time. There is some effort and exertion in starting to turn the 'flywheel of Agnas', but once it reaches 181 degrees, it will speedily complete the 360 degrees on its' own and by it's own momentum! One is not going to get such a Gnan and such a Gnani in any future life and therefore, it is worth attaining the goal by remaining in His Agnas!

What does attaining success mean? It means to pass the examination in such a way that you don't have to plead or beg in front of anyone. Therefore, work hard and learn well.Why is one not able to follow the Agnas? It is because of previous karma. This knowledge has been obtained in the Akram, direct way without getting the karma exhausted.

Agnas is for the protection of the Self. The unfolding karma can't shake the person who remains in the Agnas! If he follows the Agnas one hundred percent, he becomes a God! If one misses the Agnas but does _pratikraman_ (awareness, repentance and firm decision never to repeat the mistake), then he will pass!

When he follows the Agnas, his worldly tasks will be resolved naturally. Then the devotees will say, "Dadashri, it happened because of Your grace!" Oh, it happened not because of grace but because he followed the Agnas! Grace happens on a rare day when there is a grave hindrance! When one is in Agna, it is called as being in applied awareness of the Self ( _shuddha_ _upyoga_ ) and therefore, one can remain in pure worldly interactions ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ).

Dadashri shows a red flag of caution to those who miss the Agna that, "If he doesn't stay in My Agna, his _prakruti_ will gradually override him." He will be at peace because of Dadashri's grace but it will last for two to five years. Then the _prakruti_ will devour his peace. Then he will become the _prakruti._

What is the measure of missing the Agna? Inner suffocation will begin right away. The inner unaffected state ( _samadhi_ ) will break down. For the one who remains in Agna, the _samadhi_ will be preserved even during the body, mind or externally induced problems ( _aadhi, vyadhi_ and _upadhi_ , respectively)!

What if one stays in the Gnani's Agna but the results are not apparent? Then it is considered as the Gnani's defect! And if he doesn't stay in Agna, it is then his mistake! The past knowledge confuses him and does not let him stay in the Agna. After attaining Gnan, _laksha_ (awareness) of the pure Self is established, but if one does not follow the Agnas, this 'awareness' will be lost. Not only that, but his awareness will go to wrong places. Women are not at risk of going to the wrong place because they stay in Dadashri's devotion _bhakti_. They do not understand the Agnas or the Gnan in depth. Agna is the main thing. Because of being in Agnas, one is in _dharma_ - _dhyan_ (free from adverse internal meditation) in worldly interaction and on the inside there prevails _shukla_ _dhyan_ awareness as the Self. Everyone will reach the ultimate resolution ( _moksha_ ). Those who follow the Agnas will definitely get liberation within two to five more life times and those who do not follow them, may take more . The value of the Agnas is higher than all else, even higher than Gnan.

Top most awareness for _mahatmas_ is one where they follow the five Agnas. Otherwise it is good if they remember Dadashri all the time. Following the Agnas is the _purushartha_. What _purushartha_ is there in remembering Dadashri all the time? Therefore the Agnas are paramount!

Can the five Agnas be followed without attaining Gnan? Dadashri says, "No, that is not possible without Gnan."

If one does not follow the Agnas, it is not considered as a fault but he will abandon the resultant liberation. One following the Agnas shall be free from all kinds of pain!

The essence of the whole world is contained in Dadashri's five Agnas. All the religions; all the scriptures are included in them! Nothing at all is left out. Out of the five Agnas, the first two are about the Self ( _nischaya_ ) and the remaining three are for the worldly life interaction ( _vyavahar_ ). What is to become of the followers after the departure of Dadashri's mortal body? Dadashri answers this by saying, "You are to find the eternal 'Dada'. This Dadashri's body may be gone but what is it to us if the five Agnas have been received? The Agnas are 'Dada' Himself, no!" Because of the five Agnas, one's progresses speedily and the energies of the Self, manifesting in worldly life ( _aishwarya_ ) become apparent. Obstructions will be broken and all various kinds energy ( _shakti_ ) will manifest!

One can follow the Agnas if grace ( _krupa_ ) of the Gnani is there and when the Agnas are followed, one gets more grace! Here, to please Gnani is the first priority! Following Agna is the only way to please. There is no higher religion in the world than pleasing the Gnani Purush. Gnani's _rajipo_ (Gnani being pleased with _mahatma_ ) may be different with different people. He has no difference with anyone and yet why is this difference there? It is based on _param vinaya_ absolute humility of the follower. The person showing constant absolute humility gets special grace ( _vishesh_ _krupa_ )! What does special grace mean? Complete and total success ( _moksha_ ) can be attained. And this grace is from "Dada Bhagwan" and not from the Gnani Purush.

Pray heartily to Dadashri, "Dada, the responsibility for our worldly life is on your head and your Agna is on our head!"

One is to attain the total experience ( _poorna_ _anubhav_ ) of the Self, which has just come into conviction ( _pratiti_ ) by following the Agnas.

Who follows the Agnas? Is it the one with wrong belief ( _pratishthit_ _atma_ )? No. It is the _pragnya_ , the liberating energy of the Self that has been awakened. Intellect ( _agnya_ here) will not allow one to follow the Agnas.

Who makes the decision to follow the Agnas? That too, is the function of _pragnya_ _shakti_ , the liberating energy of the Self.

The five Agnas are non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ), but they are relative-real. All the steps leading to the absolute Self are known as the relative-real and the absolute Self is the real!Nothing compares to taking Dada's shelter (there is nothing better than surrendering to 'Dada'). "Whatever happens to Dada may happen to me." Live according to what Dadashri says.

No activity is necessary for those who want to attain final liberation _moksha_. They only require the knowledge of the Self and the Agnas of the Gnani Purush. The Agnas keep the mind pure and Gnan gives solutions in all circumstances.

These five Agnas do not originate from A. M. Patel or the Gnani Purush; they are of Dada Bhagwan Himself and He is the supreme One of the fourteen regions of the universe ( _lokas_ ). These five Agnas have been going on since the times of the _Vitarag_ Lords. Dadashri is just instrumental here. Akram Vignan is a great _siddhant_ (that which accomplishes the ultimate goal). There is no scriptural quotation here. When can one remain as the Self continuously? When the five Agnas are followed, that's when. The value of the Agnas is not completely understood and that is why they are not high levelly followed.

If a special Agna ( _vishesh_ _agna_ ) from Gnani is received, one feels over come with gratitude beyond words! To serve Dadashri means to serve the Agna. And to serve Agna and to serve Dadashri is also one and the same. As compared to giving tangible service of the physical body, to obey the Gnani's Agna is far superior!

## [2] The Line of Demarcation between the Real and the Relative

After attaining knowledge of the Self, the real and the relative have become separate. Real is the _Purush_ (Atma, the Self) and relative is the _prakruti_ (self, the non-Self complex). After becoming the Self, one is to follow the five Agnas and do this _purushartha_ (follow the five Agnas) to become the absolute Self!

'I am pure Soul' should be in one's awareness and goal. This is called as being in the meditation as the Self ( _shukla_ _dhyan_ ). Pure Soul is not in the form of a word and it is not in the form of something that one chants about either.

To 'see' pure Soul-Self in every living being and to maintain this continuously for forty-eight minutes is known as the _samayik_ of Puniya Shravak. It is called as being in total applied awareness ( _shuddha upyog_ ). This is also called as the divine vision ( _divya_ _chakshu_ ).

Say not, "You verily ( _tu_ _hee_ ), You verily"; but say, "I am, I am ( _hoon hee_ ) " in all. In every living being, 'see', "I verily am, I verily am'; the difference of 'I' and 'You' does not exist there. Once you put a diamond in a small box and close the box and place the box in a cupboard, does it not stay in your awareness ( _khyaal_ ) that there is a diamond in that box? Do you have to open the box and see it again and again? Similarly once you attain Gnan, it sets in Your awareness that there is pure Soul in everyone.

Why is it necessary to speak that 'I am pure Soul'? As much walking you have done in the wrong direction by saying, 'I am Chandubhai, I am Chandubhai'; you will have to reverse that by saying, 'I am pure Soul, I am pure Soul'. Thereafter, it will remain in Your awareness naturally. 'I am pure Soul' will be your state once the _chit_ has become purified. 'I am pure Soul' may be spoken only after the Soul is awakened (in the Gnan Vidhi), not while asleep! This is to be done with the high level applied awareness of the Self, not mechanically.

'I am pure Soul' is not for doing _japa_ (repeating like a mantra). It is to be done with the knowledge of the relationship between the Knower ( _Gnata_ , the absolute Self) and the thing to be known ( _gneya_ , the non-Self, relative). By doing _japa,_ the mind may cool off but the _Gnata-gneya_ (Knower-known) relationship awareness will not be there!

Soon after birth, if a lion's cub get mixed up and raised in a herd of sheep, it will become like a sheep but, if it sees and hears a lion's roar someday, it will also make a similar roar and its' innate nature ( _swabhaav_ ) will be awakened. Similarly, the one who believes 'I am Chandubhai' all his life, gets the awareness and the knowledge that 'I am pure Soul' by shouting only once in the Gnan Vidhi of the Gnani Purush and stays awakened aware forever!

The person who says, even for one moment, 'I am pure Soul' after he has become the Soul, shall be free! If he remains as, 'I am Chandulal', the drops of venom of the self will trickle day and night and if 'I am pure Soul' is in his awareness ( _laksha_ ), drops of nectar of immortality of the Self will trickle day and night! Thereafter, his speech, action and thoughts will, by nature, become like nectar! To have no activity ( _kriya_ ) other than just to 'See' and 'Know' is known as the real. Real-relative have a constant connection ( _avinabhavi_ _sambandha_ ). If one is there, the other must be there!The one that 'sees' the real-relative is the liberating energy of the Self _pragnya_ _shakti_! It functions beyond the senses and the relative can be seen with the senses! _Pragnya_ separates the real from the relative. What do you want to be? Some say, 'I want to be like Dadashri', whereas others say many different things! Actually, why don't we keep the goal of being the pure ( _shuddha_ ) only! Nothing but liberation _moksha_ will do. There is no other state that is higher than that in this world. It is not worth getting entangled anywhere else.If one envisions ( _chintavey_ ), 'I am sick'; he will become sick. If he speaks, 'I am with infinite energy'; he will become that!When _nikachit_ _karma_ (karma effects that will leave only after suffering them) unfolds, at that time, if one remains in the awareness ( _laksha_ ), 'I am pure Soul' or at last keeps on saying, 'I am pure Soul'; that karma's effect will be lighter! And it will not touch him. Everyone likes it when things run smoothly but when things are rough and they make themselves 'like it'; then nothing will touch them, right?As soon as one sits in the seat of the real, the Self an undisturbed _nirakoodta_ (bliss of the Self) is experienced and if one is on the relative seat, 'shock' is experienced! Since there is a line of demarcation between these two after Self-realization; one should stay in the seat of the real only.The Self is pure; it is pure all the time. After attaining that state, no matter how bad work is done, that is done by Chandubhai and not by 'Me'- the Self; this must not be missed. However, if he believes, 'I have no concern or problem with the bad thing that has happened,' then he will be doomed. Therefore, be careful, but do not be fearful. The karma that has come before you will pass and the Self will be same as it was before, pure only! It is the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ , the self) and not the pure Soul that does the rights and the wrongs of life. Yet, if someone is hurt because of Chandubhai, _pratikraman_ including _pratyakhyan_ should be done for that hurt.If one steps on an insect and it dies, one should keep the two separate. The killer and the victim; and 'I am pure Self' and the other one is also 'pure Self'; that is how it should be. Dadashri has separated the two elements, like iron and gold. Then, if iron gets rusted, what concern is that for You? And yet, Chandubhai has no right to do whatever he feels like. Whatever wrong gets done by him, must be one hundred percent against Your 'wish'; Chandubhai must not miss doing _pratikraman_ for it! This is a very profound matter. If viewed superficially i.e. only with the worldly interacting ( _vyavahar_ ) viewpoint, it may appear to be quite contradictory but from the elemental ( _tattva_ _drashti_ ) viewpoint, it is one hundred percent absolute truth!

How should one remain in the Self? How did you used to stay as Chandubhai before? All the effects of Chandubhai were there, no? Now, when no effects are there (felt), You have remained as the Self! Respect-insult, profit-loss; none of these will touch You."I am pure Soul" is absolute decision - _nischaya_. _Nischaya_ (absolute firm decision) is that which does not ever change.After attaining the Self state, no inner burning ( _antardaah_ ) will exist. Yet, there is still that lifeless ego and if it takes over the problems of the neighbor (Chandubhai), then it will give effect. This commotion is in the outer circle (non-Self). That has to be 'seen'. As a matter of fact, the inner burning can be there only in the ignorant state. It burns one on the inside like an electrical current. One suffers inwardly and feels the burning and can't bear to tolerate it. When one comes into the state of Self-effort to achieve the absolute Knowledge; then this inner burning will go away.No matter how bad a storm may come, _mahatmas_ will escape to the strong room of the pure Soul! Therefore, nothing will touch them.Can it be known as to when liberation will be attained? Yes, it can. The Soul, the Self, is like a thermometer. Just as one knows about the urge to go to toilet or urinal; the time to go to the liberation can also be known. The reason for not knowing is, one has fallen towards the side of worldly life and become lost in the worldly life and therefore, is unable to see anything on the side of the Self. After the Gnani Purush gives Gnan in the Gnan Vidhi the body and the Self are experienced as separate. Then, they cannot become one again at any time! After churning yogurt and separating the butter and whey, they never become one no matter what you do; this science is similar to that. And Dadashri gave this science to the world. Originally, it is the Tirthankaras' science but he gave it in his Akram, direct path method! In the past, the soul was wandering around on the basis of the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ). Now, after attaining the Knowledge of the Self, one has the Self as the support. One has attained the state with the Lord! Once, one has the support of the Self, _kashaya_ (anger, pride, deceit and greed) become without any support! The projection ( _pratishtha_ – instillation of 'life') of 'I am Chandubhai' is gone and 'I am pure Soul' is firmly established. Now, only the past faults are to be suffered and thus settled. Once the awareness of 'I am pure Soul' happens, the vision opens up that every living being is in fact pure Soul in fact. Hence, 'I am in all that lives' (' _Atmavat_ _sarva_ _Bhuteshu_ ') state is attained. The One who has the vision that all Souls are pure Souls is the absolute Self ( _paramatma_ ). After Self-realization (Gnan), it can be said that the progression toward the absolute Self has started!

## [3] Settling of Files with Equanimity

The world has existed because of lack of equanimity, hurtful intent ( _visham_ _bhav_ ) and it ends with the equanimity ( _sambhav_ )!

While settling the files, there should be the awareness that, 'I am pure Soul', right? After deciding to go to Bombay, it will be there in the awareness that, 'I will be going to Bombay.'

What is a file? Sleep, hunger, cold, hot; all sensations are called files. Getting pushed around in a crowd, wife and children at home; all are called 'files'.You are to only keep this resolve in the mind that 'I want to settle the files with equanimity', that's all. The scientific effect of this resolve happens on to the other person and it helps scientifically and it gives results. Instead, if there is the hurtful intent ( _visham_ _bhav_ ) of, 'what does he think of himself? I will sort him out!'; its' effect will also fall on the other person and bring the results accordingly. The files will go on increasing. Considering that these are the files of Kaliyug, should one lift up a weapon against a weapon or not? No. One is only to settle with equanimity. These words are so laden with energy that if one keeps in mind the intent of 'I want to settle with equanimity'; not a single pain can touch him! There is no need to be concerned about whether there is closure in the other person's mind or not. Just cling to the decision that 'I want to follow this Agna!' And if there is the slightest wavering about this in the mind, keep on asking for the energy from Dadashri. Don't wait after asking for the energy. It is a mistake to wait for it here! Whatever the result, unfavorable or favorable, we are not responsible for it, afterwards! One may have frequently and firmly decided to settle files with equanimity and yet sometimes big bomb blasts may happen, but even then, there is no problem. Don't be afraid, see the bombs and tell Chandubhai, 'I must say! You even have this kind of stock within coming out!' 'Go to the station and do not look back'- with this instruction (Agna) you are sent to the station. You have decided not to look back and yet if you happen to look back once or twice by mistake; this is not considered as a mistake! The decision of 'I do not want to look back' has been made and that is enough! What is the meaning of equanimity ( _sambhav_ )? It is where one has no attachment ( _raag_ ) for the one who gives praise and no abhorrence ( _dwesh_ ) for the one who insults him, this is equanimity.One may even go to court to fight his case but there should be no attachment-abhorrence. There is no attachment-abhorrence in discharge; there is attachment-abhorrence in charge karma. Who is swearing and at whom? It is just a fight of the body-complexes and that too, is dependent on karma! Why do we need to spend money to go outside to see a fight? Hurtful intent ( _vishamata_ ) is there where there is, 'I am Chandulal' and equanimity prevails naturally where there is, 'I am pure Soul'! What is the difference between absolute equanimity ( _samata_ ) and equnimity ( _sambhav_ )? Absolute equanimity, _samata_ is when one'sinner result (response) doesn't change even if someone slaps him repeatedly, moreover, he will bless the person beating him. Whereas, in equanimity ( _sambhav_ ), the inner response may change, but then, he will settle it and will not allow attachment-abhorrence reactions to advance further. And natural settlement ( _sahajbhaav_ ) is done without effort, the settlement happens naturally! This happens with Dadashri! A state of natural inner intent ( _sahaj_ _bhaav_ ) is the result of the previous life's intent that bears the result in this life; it comes into existence to give result now. A state of natural inner intent is not the result of efforts made in this life. Gnani has the expertise ( _kaushalya_ ). What is the Gnani's expertise like? There may be a situation where one person says something that hurts seven others. In such a situation the Gnani uses His expertise and uses such words that the speaker is not hurt and the pain of those other seven listeners will go away! This expertise is a part of the art of the intellect ( _buddhi_ - _kada_ ). The beginning is done by settlement with equanimity and slowly it results in a state of freedom from all attachments ( _vitaragata_ ). The _Vitarag_ Lords did this only!What is the difference between the tendency to bring about a solution ( _samadhan_ _vruti_ ) and to settle off with equanimity ( _sambhavey_ _nikaal_ )? Our tendencies ( _vruti_ ) are such that they look for solutions everywhere they go. At times these tendencies seek justice! And when it comes to settlement with equanimity, one is to settle with the equanimity ( _sambhav_ ) whether the solution arrives or not. Say you lent someone five hundred rupees and you go to collect it but instead of returning the money he starts using hurtful words like, 'When did you give me money? You are the one who has to return my money!' Now, in this situation, the who want become free should not look for justice, he give the money demanded, only then he will be free. The situation is such that one will never get a solution. Only those who have attained the Self can settle with equanimity and Dadashri settles with absolute knowledge. The Gnani looks like the emperor of the entire universe! What should you do if someone slaps you? You should feel happy 'I got a prize today!' Or You should 'see', 'who is he? Who am I? Who is beating whom?' - 'See' all of this. Dadashri had once publicly announced a reward that, 'If anyone comes and slaps me once, I will reward him with five hundred rupees'- but no one came forward to slap him.It is not because of the people of the whole world but because of just two to five hundred files that one's liberation is being prevented. Once, settlement with equanimity is done with these people, liberation will be attained! In the Akram path, pure Soul is acquired ( _grahan_ ) after Gnan Vidhi and ego and 'my-ness' ( _mamta_ ) are renounced ( _tyaga_ ). Thus, the whole worldly life ( _sansar_ ) is renounced and then one does not have to go through the trouble of acquisition-renunciation!In the step by step path ( _kramic_ path – the traditional path), singing of religious hymns and songs is acquisition ( _grahan_ ); and in the direct step-less (Akram) path, singing religious songs is for settlement ( _nikal_ ). In Akram, everything is for settlement. How do you know that? In the _kramic_ path, the person singing will become angry if stopped and in the Akram path, the singer has no effect or change at all! All worldly activity are for settlement and 'this' _satsang_ is something worth acquiring. In Akram, nothing is done with the intent of doer-ship ( _karta_ _bhav_ ). She may wear sarees and jewelry but if they are not available, she has no effect and she stays as the Self only; whereas, in the _kramic_ path, she will be upset if they are not available. The world has continued to exist because of enmity ( _veyr_ ). By settling with equanimity, old enmity ends and new enmity is not created. If a man wants to clear out his business (vacate his shop) and be free, how does he do it? He pays off those whom he owes and may even let go what is owed to him and thus become free! With people with whom there is enmity, bring about the solution by doing _pratikraman_ ; by asking for their forgiveness. Pleasure derived from the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ) will increase enmity and with the bliss of the Self enmity leaves. Individuals that are liked or disliked are all just files only. Both are the alike. Be free from both. Even to those whom you dislike, show dramatic love. Ask for forgiveness and be free from enmity! Be free from enmity even if you have to satisfy by nurturing the ego of the other person.If a man has come to commit murder but you have the intent of 'I want to settle with equanimity'; it (intent of equanimity) will change the murderer's heart and he will leave the knife or the gun and leave you. If you get rid of the prejudice for a file, the file will do what you say. One cannot leave (abandon) the file and become a recluse in order to be free. Those (files) within will make claims. The claims from outside will be settled off in one life time but the claims from those within will lead you astray life after life!This world has existed because of enmity and not because of love. By settling with equanimity, one can be free. One person said to Dadashri, 'I want to be free quickly from all the files. Dadashri answered, "As long as there is strength in your arms, tell all your files to come over and get paid (pay off account of karma while you have the capacity)'. How can you pay off in your old age? It is your account only and you should pay it off, right? How to settle off with equanimity? The other person may come to you smiling or angry; have the same inner intent, equanimity. One does not have to attempt to please the files; it is enough that they are not unhappy with you! Stay in equanimity there. Even if the other person lets go of the claim and goes away, you have been freed. It doesn't matter how much or what it took to convince him; you have become free then. Don't get involved in the truth or the falsehood as defined by the world. As long as the other person gets the solution, you have become free.When file number one eats, You are to 'see' that. Talk to it and finish up. Tea, snack, meals etc.; whatever it asks for, give it that and be free. If there is no sugar in the tea, drink it anyway. In the Akram path, one is not to attain the 'disinterested state' ( _udasinata_ ) but one is to attain direct absolutely detached state ( _vitaragta_ ). As much settlement of the files with equanimity is done, that much absolutely detached state is attained.Whereas in the _kramic_ path, disinterested state ( _udasinata_ ) comes after dispassion ( _vairagya_ ) and then comes the absolutely detached ( _vitaragata_ ) state!One should not take the files from the 'home department' (the Self) to 'foreign department' (non-Self) or elsewhere and the files from 'foreign' to 'home'. Don't think about business when you are at home and when you are at business don't think about the home! Moreover, no one else should know this! Being at home means staying as the Self and being in foreign is going out in the worldly interactions of worldly life. You are to remain superfluous in the foreign department. Such a tremendous Akram Vignan has been received and yet why can we not go to liberation _moksha_ in the present era? It is because of the previous faults and the cases are still pending in 'court'. Once these responsibilities are dealt with and resolved, one can go to the final liberation! One can be free from these faults only by 'Seeing' one's own faults!All the files can be placed in only one category (word) and that word is 'circumstance' ( _sainyog_ )! Circumstances by nature are such that they will come to an end ( _viyoga_ ). Hence, one is to just 'See' them. They will depart on their own. In this universe, there are only two things; the pure Soul and circumstances ( _Atma_ and _sainyog_ , respectively). Once we stay as the pure Soul, everything will function by itself!Both, what is liked and what is disliked are to be settled off with equanimity! If there is a foul smell from the sewer on your way, should you rebuke the government? Cover your nose with a handkerchief and keep on walking; this is called as settlement with equanimity. If someone throws burning coal on us, he is the pure Soul and the falling of the burning coal is an account of our karma! He has made us free from that account today! But we see him as the enemy and we see some other person as our beloved! When we face interactions of adverse kind, they manifest our energies! If we remain dramatic in our interactions, meaning superfluous; not with involvement; the files can be settled off with equanimity. These dramatic interactions should, moreover, be done heartily. In order to settle the files; keep the intent of 'I am' projected in a dramatic way. If you must scold someone in the worldly life, do this _vidhi_ ; have his pure Soul take a seat outside. Then, rebuke or punish the fault of his non-Self complex. There should not be the slightest attachment-abhorrence for him within you. Then, nothing from the other person will touch you! To cut and remove the rotten part from a papaya is called settlement with equanimity. If a buffalo has entered into your home and you say, 'Dear buffalo, please go out, go away', will it work? Here, you have to talk in the buffalo's language. Wave a stick in front of it or hit it lightly in the leg with a stick, then the buffalo will know and run out of the house; this is known as settlement with equanimity. Do not interact much with a worthless person. Let him be in their place and you be in your place. What if someone abuses (takes advantage of) our act of settlement with equanimity? Is the authority of 'scientific circumstantial evidence' in only one person's hands? No one has the independent authority or power. Hence, there is no need to be afraid. You decidedly want to settle of the files with equanimity, and yet are unable to do it; what should be done there? It is not your concern then. You have followed the Agnas, therefore, you are not responsible now! If the other person does not leave you alone, can you do settlement with equanimity unilaterally? Yes, you can. How is it done? It is done with _vitaragata_ (absolute freedom from attachment and abhorrence).You may get nervous that a sticky file will not leave you alone even before the file comes before you; this should not be there. You are not to see the result, you are to hold on to the resolve that You want to settle the file with equanimity. Thereafter, it doesn't remain as your responsibility and that is guaranteed! While dealing with the sticky file, it is best to follow silence nevertheless if the file is unhappy, you should get freedom from the file even by allowing yourself to get cheated. However, in _satsang_ matters, you should hold on to the resolve to go to _satsang_. Whatever loss may be incurred because of that, you can handle it later! How will one reconnect with a file with whom one is deeply attached ( _raag_ file) in the next life? No, it does not happen. That file will go to another person in the next life but the attachment that may have persisted within you, will have to be brought to a closure; that attachment is to be settled with equanimity. Then, there is no relation with that file at all. No matter how sticky any file may be, hold on to the inner intent of 'I want to settle it with equanimity', till the end. Don't give up on that inner intent. Thereafter, whatever happens is 'scientific circumstantial evidence'. Then, 'scientific circumstantial evidence' is at fault, not you.There are infinite energies within the Self. One has to only keep the decision that I want to settle the sticky files with equanimity. It shall happen. There may be two to four sticky files at the most!Just as there are layers of an onion, it is the same with the sticky files. Each time, while settlement with equanimity is done, one layer is removed and in the end, one can be free!The sticky file actually helps us to go on the path of liberation! Dadashri always called his sister-in-law as his sticky file. He said, 'I have been able to achieve this because you were there.' After Gnan, a sticky file is beneficial for every mahatma.What is sticky, is it the glue, is it the person sticking it, or the strip on which the glue is applied? How can the stickiness touch that which is pure?How does one exhaust sticky karma? If one stays in pure Soul, in the Knower-Seer state, the sticky karma will be exhausted rapidly! Before facing the sticky file, start seeing the pure Soul in the file. Then, decide in the mind that you want to settle of it with equanimity. Keep on doing _pratikraman_ for the file. This will definitely settle that file with equanimity.These files have obstructed us. Once they are settled off with equanimity, we can be free. After receiving Gnan, there is no attachment-abhorrence for the Self ( _nischaya_ ) but they have remained in the worldly interactions (in the self). When those attachment-abhorrence happen, they are to be 'seen'. This will exhaust attachment-abhorrence. While settling with equanimity, be especially careful that it doesn't affect you. Agna is to be followed for that purpose only. Once we stay in equanimity, the file is settled. When the file comes before us again, another layer has come. Yet, the previous layer has already gone!When everyone in the family is against you and say all kinds of things, remain silent there. Time will cool them. What should be done if one person feels good and the other person feel bad while you are settling with equanimity? Keep the resolve that you want to settle with equanimity. Then, whatever happens is correct and you are not responsible. Wherever clash happens, free yourself from it even if you have to act like a crazy person. If a mistake is made with children, accept it and be free, otherwise, they will keep poisonous intent! Just because a father accepts his mistake before his children, is his son likely to become his father? If there is worry that there may be loss in the future while settling with equanimity; what should be done there? Do you want to be concerned with profit-loss or do you want to go to _moksha_? This viewpoint will not leave you without making you unhappy. You are to follow the Agnas for settlement with equanimity. Then, whatever happens, is correct! If there is a situation to fight in a court of law, it is the relative self fighting with another relative self, how does it concern You? And live as if nothing has happened. While in court, there shouldn't be attachment-abhorrence; then it is not a problem. While in court, conduct yourself with care. With care means doing what the lawyer tells you to do without calling it right or wrong and doing it without attachment-abhorrence. Even if you made a machine, will it leave you alone if your finger gets caught in it? Even for property, settlement with equanimity should be done without fear. Then, if you have to go to court, it is not a problem. There should be no abhorrence. If you are the creditor and the person that owes you money has no money, let it go. If you go to court or hire a lawyer, the expense on top of it, will be additional liability on you! While doing settlement with equanimity, if adverse thoughts for that file come to you, do instant _pratikraman_ for it. Its' echo will affect the other person. _Pratikraman_ makes us change the opinion for the other person. Dadashri has given this wonderful law of nature that, 'one is not to do the right; in 'doing', the wrong is done every time. Right happens by itself and this is the natural law! When there is strong disharmony and enmity between husband and wife, how does one settle of the file with equanimity? By remaining in Gnan one sided only? What if the other person does not understand in any way? Should you get separated? What happiness will separation bring? Stay determined that settlement with equanimity has to be done. Then, leave it to scientific circumstantial evidences. And you want to be free, therefore do not look at what the other person has done. The solution will be easy if you go on breaking down the opinions for the other person. Is it necessary for one to know the art to 'settle with equanimity'? It is not the art but it is the firm determination ( _nischaya_ ) that is required. No one knows the art of becoming a husband. One or two out of one hundred thousand may pass the examination of qualifying as a husband! While settling with equanimity with children, never become violent; do not hit them. If children are displeased about some expensive thing, you remain at ease and 'see' that. And hand over the dealing of money matters to the wife. She is more adept to handle it better.

Even if your child is stealing, deal with him in such a way that he will realize his wrong doing himself. Then someday he will change. If a firm decision of 'I want to settle the file, with equanimity' is there, then everything will be resolved. These children are not Yours; they are the 'files'. You have duties towards them that you should fulfill. Do not keep the illusion of attachment ( _moha_ ) with them within you. How does one settle with equanimity one's own file? One should never become agitated. Should one become agitated, he is to 'see' that and talk to file number one to calm it down. Gnani is never perplexed or agitated. Warn file number one repeatedly; it may become elevated at one moment and depressed the next. Warn it to remain in equanimity during both these times. What the ego says is that 'I am like this and like that', whereas, and _pragnya_ says is that 'you are like this or like that!'Some people say that they have too many files. Hey you! Is a clerk more important or the files? Moreover, they have become attached by your own doing, no? Only those files that were created in the past life will come. There will be no new ones. 'I want to settle with equanimity'- if this remains, it will happen otherwise with, 'I can not do it' it will spoil. Whatever files we come across are only old files created in the past life; they are not new. After Gnan, no new files are created. Only _bhaav_ karma ('I am Chandubhai') is verily new file created in this life in the ignorant state.Can you settle files quickly? No. Those meant for the year 1980 will be settled of in 1980 only and those meant for of 1981 will settle in 1981. When the train arrives at Vadodara station; the coach of Vadodara will be unhooked. When it arrives at Surat, the coach of Surat will be unhooked. In wondering 'when will it be settled?...when will it be settled?...' means the intellect has gone in the wrong path.As the files go on decreasing, pure applied awareness ( _shuddha_ _upyoga_ ) goes on increasing. Wherever the _shuddha upayoga_ is missed, cleansing will have to be done there again. Now, no more new binding happens. Because of the files, one remains less in the Self. The awareness gets used up on the files in front of us. Once the files are finished completely, unlimited bliss will be experienced! As one stays in increasing contact of the Atma Gnani, and _satsang_ , great benefit will be attained! The one who wants to bring an end to worldly life ( _moksha_ ) will surely attain that. One should learn how to use the infinite energies of the Self!When do you know that the file's account has ended? When no attachment-abhorrence happens, when the file comes before you, you don't feel any burden and you are at ease; know then that the files have ended now! When do you know that the sticky file has completely ended? When that file says all kinds of wrong things about you and no hurt is felt in the mind. At that time, it can be said that the abhorrence is gone. The mind always remains clear. The thoughts cease to come for that file. What is it called when there is a fight between _mahatmas_? Dadashri says that the _mahatmas_ may fight but they should do _pratikraman_ within and repent for it; hence they get freed from that file! _Mahatma's_ fault shouldn't be seen. Someone asked Dadashri, 'Dadashri, we are all your files, right?' Then Dadashri said, 'Yes, files of course! But these files are not felt as burdens; these are all known as the voluntary files whereas those other files are compulsory, they won't leave you alone even at two in the morning!' File will give you depression and elevation! Dadashri says that even if you combine the states that are attained by all ascetics-preceptors, all the saints and devotees, and compare that to the state the _mahatmas_ have attained; theirs is nowhere near the _mahatmas_ ' state!In the _kramic_ path, all the twenty two _parishahas_ (any of the twenty-two calamities or troubles like cold, heat, hunger, thirst, etc.) are to be won over whereas in Akram, they are to be settled with equanimity!If facing death by hanging; what _purushartha_ is to be done? Settle with equanimity.After attaining the Self , one enters from a state of the ignorant self ( _moodhatma_ ) into a state of the Self ( _antaratma_ ); this is the state of the interim government. When all the files are settled, one attains the full government and that is the state of the absolute Self ( _Parmatma_ )!! As long as there is any fault left, there will be the interim government. In ignorant state, there was the belief that 'I made the mistake' or 'I crushed an insect'. Now, in the state of Knowledge; keep the belief that all this was done by file number one. Therefore, it is not 'Your, the Self's' responsibility. You were the doer before, now You are the Knower. What is the objection in staying as the Self? There absolute bliss prevails. For worldly interactions, one may say 'this belongs to me' but from within 'nothing is mine' exists. Therefore, 'my-ness' ( _mamata_ ) is gone. The belief that 'I am this body' is gone hence the body's ownership will be gone. The interference ( _dakho_ ) of file number one (becoming 'I am Chandulal') will go away just by 'seeing' it. If the other file has claims against you, _pratikraman_ must be done. But, who will make the claim of interference with file number one? Therefore, it will end by 'Seeing' it.

Continue 'Seeing' file number one. Will the eyes get burnt if you are seeing a fire? When negative karma effect of file number one is unfolding, You should not be in agreement with it. There should be a constant intense opposition against it. When can it be said that file number one has been settled with equanimity? When file number one gets terribly angry and upset, at that time the Gnan presents that this is a circumstance ( _sainyog_ ) and it will dissipate ( _viyog_ ) and thus absolute equanimity ( _samata_ ) prevails; then we can say that the file has been settled with equanimity. How is file number one to be settled with equanimity? As such, file number one has not been settled with equanimity in so many different situations. When one is sitting in a lecture or a meeting, does he not swallow his spit even if wants to spit? Does he not hold his bowels or urine for an hour or two? Even if the stomach is full, does he not eat more while in a restaurant or at a party when someone forces him to eat? By doing all this, one has not allowed the body to remain natural. He would keep on walking even if he is tired. During exams or reading a book that he likes, he will stay up all night and force himself to read. In a crowded train, he will stand up and not sit on the floor. He will lose face, if he did so, no? Even if he is hungry, he will not eat because he is busy working or talking to someone. If the train is ready to leave the station, he will drink the tea even if it is very hot. This is how he becomes unnatural. This is how he has not settled file number one with equanimity. As a matter of fact, one has to settle only file number one!Whose files are these? Are they the files of the Self or the non-Self? Neither of the two; they are actually files of of _pragnya_ - _shakti_ . And it is only _pragnya shakti_ that settles the files with equanimity. Once one says,'file number one', there is instant separation within. Not even one percent Self is there in file. This is the wonder. As soon as one uses the words 'file number one', one has attained spiritual victory! This is because He has become pure Soul and has called all the remaining parts, (the non-Self as file number one! Until he says 'file number one', he will not be able to experience the separation!

One experiences the separation between the Self and the non-Self in the one hour of the Gnan Vidhi! Afterwards, as soon as the word'file' is used, 'my-ness' ( _mamata_ ) ends. This happens because it is a scientific process! The word 'settlement ( _nikal_ )' itself creates a great effect. There is no acquisition, and there is no renunciation, but there is 'settlement'! Soon after saying the word 'settlement', the effect is understood that 'all this has become separated'. Whereas, the rule is, 'the one who renounces shall get it back in future'; this is so because ego is there in acquisition and renouncing. And in the path of Akam, the ego is completely fractured in the Gnan Vidhi. Hence, one is to do the settlement, to become free and clear while staying in the ego free state! This is Akram Vignan. There is tremendous energy and strength behind each and every word. This science has been attained as a result of Dadashri's research of infinite lifetimes, and one can experience it. Hence, it is proven to be very spontaneously active ( _kriyakari_ ). Due to the current time many English words have been used. Such as 'real', 'relative', 'file', 'scientific circumstantial evidences' etc.; they are quite effective and they readily enter the minds of the present young generation. Words of Sanskrit or scriptural language are not understood, so how can they be used? What is the difference between the state of _mahatmas_ and the state of Lord Mahavir? Lord Mahavir has no files and _mahatmas_ have pending files. As such, both are free of worry! The One that is within everyone is the pure Soul ( _shuddhatma_ ). The pure Soul without file is God and as long the files are there, it is pure Soul. When one settles all the files and becomes free, one becomes absolute God ( _Siddha_ _Bhagwan_ )!

## [4.1] Inner stock of karma

After attaining the awareness of the Self, it often happens that one makes a mistake and realizes that 'this is wrong, this should not happen' and yet it happens, what about that? Dadashri explains that that is the filled stock of karma from past life ( _bharelo_ _maal_ ) that is coming out. The liberating energy of the Self ( _pragnya_ ) 'sees' it and makes one do _pratikraman_. It is enough if one says 'this is not mine'. In ignorant state, where is the awareness that 'this is the wrong thing happening'? One remains adherent in the state of 'I am correct'. All these filled stock of karma that are there, was filled without asking the Gnani. When they come out after Gnan, one cannot tolerate their effects. But now, one has no choice but settle them with equanimity. For _mahatmas_ now, there is no new charge karma. The filled tank is getting emptied. Let it get empty and whatever comes out; we are to keep 'Seeing' it. The three batteries of mind-speech-body that were filled in the past life will now get discharged. No new charging will happen. Whatever material was filled in the tank will come out. Pride, sexuality, greed, violence; whatever was filled will come out. As such, one is not to settle with equanimity the filled stock, it is happening automatically. As long as 'I am pure Soul' is at the level of conviction ( _pratiti_ ); the filled material is to be settled with equanimity. In the advanced stages when the Gnan has taken effect into experience, one will be in the state that 'the settlement is happening'. Hence, the filled stock has to come out, only then one can be free. Whatever was filled in the sack will come out. What was filled last will come out first! All these debts that were filled will have to be paid off, no? And the debt that is paid off will be counted as profit, right? How much fun it is after the debt has been paid off? One is the absolute Self, but is entangled because of previous debts! As _pratikraman_ happens, settlement will happen. After the water shut-off valve of the main line is closed off, the water will still pour out for a hundred miles why? The answer is that the water that is in the pipes will continue to flow! Hence, there is no reason for one to be concerned. Once the pipes are drained out, it will end. The mind- _chit_ -intellect-ego all are to be emptied now. New charging will not happen, this is guaranteed. The filled stock may then be good or bad; both are for settlement only! Both are to be 'Seen'! We are not to look at whether the other person follows the Agnas or not. Everyone should look out for himself. We have to follow the Agnas ourselves. Dadashri says that in His subtle presence, not a single tendency shall wander. His direct presence is the best but if He is 'visualized' internally, that is considered as His subtle presence. For those of us who are headed towards _moksha_ -final liberation, helping others, and merit karma ( _punyai_ ) are all stock to be settled off. That which shows Dadashri's faults is also filled stock. That is to be 'Seen'. Make Chandubhai (file number one) do _pratikraman_ for that.

When the filled stock is coming out and there is no interference with it, then it will fall off by itself.

## [4.2] Charge-Discharge

After attaining the Self, what is is to be done and what is not to be done? How is one to live life? Dadashri gives the solution to these questions that one is to 'See' how life is being lived. _Mahatmas_ are often baffled by this question: what should they do when no matter how much opposition there is within; the wrong and hurtful deeds happens? There, Dadashri says that whatever Chanubhai does; it is all discharge; it cannot be changed. What Chandubhai does is not Your concern at all. Yet, _mahatmas_ still question whether that will charge new karma or not? There, Dadashri gives this scientific explanation that, if one loses the _laksha_ (awareness) of 'I am pure Soul' and he becomes 'Chandubhai' with surety, then new karma will be charged, but not otherwise. When, 'I am pure Soul' and under the influence of scientific circumstantial evidences, 'this is being done by Chandubhai' is there, then You are not the doer of it, and therefore, there will be no charging. Nevertheless, if someone gets hurt as a result of 'our' discharging karma, the self has to made to do _pratikraman_ for it and doing this will release You. One is to bring about a resolution without attachment-abhorrence. What is the line of demarcation between charge and discharge of karma? Charge is done through ego. Yet, often _mahatmas_ question, 'I was overcome with ego, I was not able to maintain awareness of _Shuddhatma_ , I had a lot of suffering, so does that mean karma got charged?' Here, Dadashri explains that even if you feel this way, no charge happens. Yes, those karma that were not settled with awareness ( _jagruti_ ) will remain in stock, but new karma is not charged, that is certain. And it is because of this reason: that one is in a non-doer state in spite of doing everything and is able remain inactive ( _nivrut_ ) in all the activities! All the outer activities are in the form of discharge and no new charging happens and that is why one is in the inactive state internally. _Mahatmas_ feel a lot of grief when what they do not like happens. They keep feeling as to 'why this happens?' Here Dadashri gives them courage that one should shout out to such unpleasant karma that 'you all get together and come over!' If there is new charge, then there is worry. Here, it is getting discharged, so why worry? There, be happy that this is getting over sooner. If you lose the awareness of 'I am pure Soul' for a long time, will karma charge? Dadashri says, there will be no charging. If you forget your name for a little while, you don't assume a new name. Once you remember it, it starts from there again! Discharge happens as its natural function ( _swabhav_ \- intrinsic high level); it doesn't have to be done. Just as water cools off by its' natural function; it doesn't have to be done. _Mahatmas_ have a question that, when all this discharge happens, is there new ego arising in that? Dadashri explains to them that, 'I keep a close watch on the _mahatmas_ in every aspect. They don't get new charge. The egoism they do, even that is discharge egoism.' _Mahatmas_ follow the Agnas with resolve ( _nischaya_ ) and so those Agans are not considered as _nikali_ -discharging, therefore, only that much charging does happen. Also the reason being, there are one or two lifetimes left. To be in Dadashri's service, to massage his legs, this is actually discharge, it is the result of merit karma ( _punyai_ ). Whatever service is done in this life as a result of discharge karma, is rewarded in this life time only. And the result of the charging done by following the Agnas comes in the next life. If an ignorant person (one without Self-realization) swears bad words at someone, he get the 'reward' (karmic consequence of his action) for it in the next life whereas, if a _mahatma_ swears bad words at someone, he gets the 'reward' for it in this life. This is so because the ignorant person is charging karma and for a _mahatma_ it is complete discharge of karma. Discharge means suffering (pain or pleasure) and charge means planting of a new seed! Where should be the _purushartha_ of _mahatmas_ ? _Mahatmas_ are to do the _purushartha_ of the Self. It is that which is done after attaining the Self ( _Purush_ ), and it is to be the 'Knower-Seer' ( _Gnata_ - _Drashta_ ). This is the only real _purushartha_! We may have to use the words that 'it has to be 'done'', but it is natural and of the Self ( _swabhavik_ ), there is no doer-ship at all. _Mahatmas_ do not have _bhaav_ - _karma_ (charge karma). Bhaav karma means anger-pride-deceit-greed. Anger-pride-deceit-greed do happen to a _mahatma_ but as the pure Self, they remains separate when they happen and does not get mixed in and therefore, it is not _bhaav_ - _karma_ (charge karma). Anger may happen but within he feels 'It should not happen like this', and so anger dissipates. How do _mahatmas_ misuse the term 'discharge'? If a mistake is made and _pratikraman_ is done heartily, it is cleansed off and this is not called misuse. But if, instead of repenting, it is felt, 'This is just my discharge and it is not objectionable'; it is considered as misuse. There, even the repentance will be missed out if one feels this way. For the _mahatmas_ of Akram path, whatever happens through the mind-speech-body, is all being settled ( _nirjara_ – discharge). Since there is no new charge, this is known as settlement with completion ( _samvar_ - _purvak_ _nirjara_ \- no charging while discharging: end of that karma) and in the ignorant state, settlement is done with bondage ( _bandha_ - _purvak_ _nirjara_ – charging of new karma whilst discharging old karma). _Mahatmas_ often question as to whether they should seek treatment of significant illness. Dadashri says that if treatment is available, that is discharge and if it is not available, that too is discharge. Except there should be no 'why me?' or 'what will become of me now?' Akram science has cleaned off all one's beliefs with a bull-dozer! If a shovel were used instead, when would the end be in sight?

## [4.3]Cause-Effect

After attaining the state of the pure Self, new causes are not created. Thereafter everything that is experienced with the five senses and the mind is only an effect. What is included in the causes? Anger-pride-deceit-greed, attachment-abhorrence ( _krodha-maan-maya-lobha, raag-dwesh_ , respectively) all these are causes! But, if _pratikraman_ is done heartily, for them, they become effects for the _mahatmas_ and new causes are not created.How are causes known? When there is repentance or _pratikraman_ is done within; the cause is completely changed. After becoming pure Soul, there is neither a cause nor an effect. Whatever is there belongs to Chandubhai, the relative self. It is to be 'Seen'. And after all, it is all 'scientific circumstantial evidences.'

## [5] "Not Mine"

What does right-vision ( _samyak_ _darshan_ ) say? From the moment you attained the knowledge of, 'I am not Chandulal; I am pure Soul'; whatever dirt comes out, is 'not mine'! Regardless of what kind of 'file' there may be; the moment You say 'not mine', it will get separated. When 'not mine' is said, there is no attachment-abhorrence and when 'my' or 'mine' is said, attachment-abhorrence will readily happen. Attachment-abhorrence may happen in unfolding discharge karma, _kashaya_ (anger-pride-deceit-greed) may happen in discharge karma, but as soon as 'not mine' is said, they will not touch You. However, You have to say to them, 'Hey, why did you enter here? You are not welcome here.' Wherever there is the slightest confusion, say 'not mine' at once. It will all disperse. As soon as You say 'not mine'; You will be steady in the Self. Whatever circumstance ( _sainyog_ ) arises, tell it 'not mine' and it will be separated! The mind, the vagrant _chit_ ; is all in the form of circumstance – _sainyog_ only! After getting engrossed in them, if You say 'not mine' at the next minute, it will get separated even then! If it ('not mine') is said a little later, there is that much less awareness but that too is not a problem either. When external problems are there, when such karma are there; just say 'not mine'. Then, there will be no effect from them. The Self and karma are two separate things altogether. Who converses within? _Pragnya_ (liberating energy of the Self) does. _Pragnya_ keeps on telling Chandulal from within that 'you are separate and I am separate. You and I have no relation at all.' It is the 'self' (relative self, Chandubhai) that gets engrossed in the phases of the mind and because of that the worldly life ( _sansar_ ) has persisted. Therefore, one has to keep on breaking down the phases of the mind. How are they broken down? As soon as You say 'not mine, not mine', You become separate and free from them. One is unable to become free from them because of endless habits and because the ego finds 'sweetness' in them; hence, as soon as one says 'not mine', one becomes freed. When depression comes, as soon as one says 'not mine', one experiences the Self. Outwardly there is depression and inwardly, there the blissful state. As soon as 'this is not my nature' is said, one becomes steady in the Self. Good or bad, each circumstance belongs to the non-Self complex. Not a single one belongs to the Self. Circumstance verily are of the non-Self . Whatever circumstance comes before us; it is the result of our previous fault. The words 'not mine' have a scientific effect. Whether one can remain in the Knower-Seer state or not, there, as soon as one says 'not mine'; separation happens instantly! Anyone that gives us pain, how can that person be Ours? That which gives us pain is from a different source; it is not related to Us. There is pain because we believed it to be related to us. If that is believed to be unrelated, there will be no pain. Any addiction binds more by saying 'mine, mine' and one can be free from it by saying 'not mine, not mine', over and over again a hundred thousand times. As soon as one says 'there is no problem with smoking cigarettes', the addiction of cigarettes is extended; it gets tremendous protection. If there is weakness is the body, then saying 'nothing is happening to me', no effect will touch You. As soon as 'not mine' is said, You can be free from the effect. Once your house is sold and full payment is received and you hear the news that the house burned down in a fire, do you feel any pain? Why not? Because there, the house, has become 'not mine'. If your house is burning down or if you have attachment-abhorrence for a certain person and you sit in a corner and say, 'not mine' five thousand times; separation will happen. Dadashri says, 'I am totally without my-ness ( _mamata_ ). I demonstrate 'my-ness' to sixty thousand _mahatmas_ but it is dramatic. I am only doing drama all day long. What does drama mean? I remain as the Seer. Does a person doing drama forget who he is? In drama, there is my-ness without ownership.' In the same way, we too should make the worldly life a drama. Who has the intent of ownership? The ego does. No matter what type of karma come before You, pleasure or pain bearing karma ( _shata_ - _ashata_ _vedaniya_ _karma_ ); they will not touch You once 'not mine' is said. They cannot be removed but You can become free from the suffering. The Knowledge of "I-the Self, am eternally free from pain and suffering – _maru swaroop avyabadha swaroop chhey_ " should be present.

## [6] Anger

Anger as defined by Akram Vignan is to be understood with the new view attained after the Gnan Vidhi. Anger that happens even after getting Gnan is life-less ( _nirjiv_ ). The filled stock of karma are getting exhausted. Only after they get exhausted can one be free. When they come out to give result, one is to see it as separate from the Self and when _pragnya_ shows that 'this is wrong', then one has to do _pratikraman_! That will lead to total liberation. Anger-pride-deceit-greed are qualities of the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ) and not of the Self. Therefore, they cannot be considered as Yours. They are considered as belonging to the one who owns them. How can that which increases or decreases, be considered a quality of the Self? There is a difference between anger ( _krodha_ ) and _gusso_ (discharging hot subatomic particles) apparent anger. Anger charges new karma. And _gusso_ is a discharge karma. There is link of continuity ( _tanto_ ) in anger, there is violent intent in anger; because the self (ego) is engrossed in it at that time. Once the _kashayas_ (anger-pride-deceit-greed) cease, _sheel_ conduct associated with absolute lack of _kashaya_ and _vishaya-_ sexuality comes into existence! The person with such _sheel_ has aura of this energy which impresses all around. _Kashayas_ are weakness of the self. There was link of continuity ( _tanto_ ) of ignorance before Gnan (Self-realization) and now the link of continuity of Self-realization has set in. That is why there is constant awareness of the Self in Akram Vignan! No matter how much anger 'Chandubhai' has, if 'this is happening to me' is not there at all; 'You' are not responsible. Be vigilant about any hurt that may happen to others because of you; keep the separation and make Chandubhai do sincere _pratikraman_ of the person that has been hurt. Anger is a part of the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ) and Knowing part is of the Self. Thus, after Gnan, everyone's anger ( _krodha_ ) goes away in this Akram path. This is because the self does not mix in-engrossed, when anger happens. The self ( _pratishthit_ _atma_ ) here means the one who has arisen in wrong belief, 'I am Chandubhai,' in the past life, and is now discharging in this life. The absolute Self never gets engrossed in anything at any time. And that absolute Self is who 'we' are. All the rest is non-Self! One is to only keep this level of awareness that even the _pratishthit atma_ (one who believes 'I am Chandulal' in discharge) does not get engrossed!

## [7] Sainyam – Absence of Kashaya

Who can be called a ' _mahatma_ '? The one who has inner _saiyam_. Chandubhai may get angry outwardly and inwardly there is 'this should not be there'- this is known as inner _saiyam_. A true _saiyami_ (one free from _kashayas_ ) is one who does not allow any pain to happen to the other person even if the other person is hurtful through _kashaya_! Only he who is on fire will burn others. He who is cool will never burn others! The _sainyami,_ the will see the person who insults him as being innocent, fault-free.

In connection with the lives of many _mahatmas_ who have taken Dadashri's Gnan, it has been heard and seen that if a taxi or rickshaw driver accidentally causes them to fall off and that _mahatma_ sustains a fracture, he would tell the driver who has caused the loss, "Brother, you run away from here, otherwise, people will beat you up. I will be well taken care of.' And they make him run away! This is known as _sainyami_!

The one who has separated from the relative self ( _prakruti_ ) is known as _sainyami_. A mahatma may do something bad but inwardly his opinion about it is against it and therefore, he is _sainyami_. The one whose belief, 'I am this body' is gone, is _sainyami_. The one whose adverse internal meditations ( _arta-dhyan_ and _raudra dhyan_ ) have stopped; is called _sainyami_.

Freedom from anger pride-deceit-greed is known as _sainyam_. After getting Gnan, one can become _sainyami_ by following the five Agnas. _Mahatmas_ are _sainyami_ all the time. They have inner _sainyami_ which takes them to the final liberation. The ascetics and religious preceptors have outer _sainyam_ which results in worldly-material pleasures. As long as ego is there, true inner _sainyam_ cannot manifest itself. Worldly people interpret _sainyam_ as control of tendencies, and control over the five senses. However, Dadashri calls it as _Hathayoga_ (bodily practices). They are trying to do it with ego.And when does ego go away? It goes away when the knowledge of Self is attained. And only after that does one attain true _sainyam_ which then takes him to final liberation. The _purushartha_ of following the five Agnas is also called as true _saiyam_. When the filled stock of karma comes out, 'See' it with _vitaragata_ (absolutely devoid of attachment and abhorrence).If one can remain in _sainyam_ just once, when insulted; this is called as the true, pure _sainyam_. Gnanis get very pleased with this and this help him climb up many steps! And one can get the experience of this as well!

## [8] The Penance for Liberation

All the scriptures have recommended to do penance ( _tapa_ ). Fasting, standing in water and doing _japa_ (repeating mantras), suppression (of desires) etc. etc. Against this, Dadashri has put forward a new approach for penance in the Akram path. He says, 'Suffer the penance that has come before you'. In Kaliyug, there is no need to create new penance. Penance in abundance will come before you where you are. At home and at the office and everywhere else there is conflict and bickering and there is penance to be suffered all day. If someone insults or picks one's pocket; the heart will become red with anger, tremendous confusion will be there; and if he settles these situations with equanimity and without attacking others even in his mind; that is known as the true penance. And if an occasional attack happens in the mind, one has to do hearty repentance and _pratikraman_ for it! In circumstances where _artadhyan_ (adverse internal meditation that hurts the self) and _raudradhyan_ ( adverse internal meditation that hurts the self and others) are about to happen, if he remains in equanimity and does not allow them to happen; that is true penance. This is known as inner penance ( _antarik_ _tapa_ ). There are two types of penances; one is outer penance ( _bahya_ _tapa_ ) and the other is inner penance ( _antarik_ _tapa_ ). Everywhere you look, people are taught to do outer penance and that is what is done. Dadashri has given much significance to inner penance. Inner penance gives liberation. _Samyak_ _gnan_ (right knowledge), _samyak darshan_ right vision, _samyak_ _charitra_ conduct as the Self and _samyak_ _tapa_ inner penance; these four are the foundations for liberation. 'I am pure Soul' is _samyak_ _darshan_ (, to experience this is _samyak_ _gnan_. _Samyak charitra_ , conduct as the Self manifests proportionate to the state that is absolutely free from attachment-abhorrence. This is proportional to the experience as the Self. And the fourth pillar is penance. When the heart is on fire from anger and one 'sees' it as separate; then that is known as _samyak_ penance. This results in liberation. The entire inner-self may be shouting in rebellion and yet one remains separate and 'sees' it and 'knows' it; that is known as inner penance; it is unseen penance – penance that is not visible ( _adeetha_ _tapa_ ). The penance done for liberation is such that it is not visible. This penance exhausts _kashayas_. Dadashri is seen talking at different places and at different times about His penance. Sometimes- 'I am in continuous penance' and sometimes- 'There is no such thing as penance for me'. Here, the well-informed reader may find controversy. But these words have come out at different places and are dependent on different questioners. Therefore, it should be interpreted with high level understanding. 'There is no such thing as penance for me'- here, the inner intent is- no matter what may come now, He has no penance like suffering arising in the mind. Such penance has ended. And the statement 'I am in continuous penance'- the purpose here is- He never allows the union of knowledge and ignorance, He does not get engrossed, He remains forever alert at the junction of the real and the relative. This is the ultimate and the subtlest form of penance; this form of penance is seen only in Gnanis nearing absolute knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ) state; such was Dadashri's subtlest form of penance! Penance is to be done bravely. The path to liberation is for the brave ones. And when this non-visible penance for liberation is done, the mind-intellect-chit and ego start to jump and skip inside and the one who just 'Sees' all this with equanimity and not get engrossed in it, attains tremendous grandeur of energies of the Self ( _aishwarya_ ). _Aishwarya_ is already there in each Self but when it manifests, one attains the final completion, the final liberation! Dadashri says, 'I do not have the slightest effect from physical pain, different tastes, from insults or from any discomfort. When there is horrible agony, 'I' 'know' it. And yet, the Tirthankaras' state is wholly completed and I have four degrees less!' The inner penance should be done with purity so that it will make one more pure; it will burn off all the dirt (evaporate sins)! Now, if one attempts to protect himself here, to defend himself and to take the opposite side or even have an intention to defend himself; he has not taken the full benefit of the penance. He is considered to have taken a bribe. If the mind has the slightest ill-feeling towards the other person, 'Why did he do this to me?' - this is known as taking a bribe. That much shortage in his penance has been shown and he will have to do the penance again and settle it off. He will have to become pure. Penance means to burn. Thus, during penance there is burning inside, the inside heats up. The mind needs food at that time and of course, it wants sweet food. While there is worry inside, instead of 'seeing' it with the vision as the Self; he will go off to watch a movie or watch TV or go out and have fun and thus, he changes a hundred rupees note into two rupees- whereas, if he does penance here, the hundred will turn into a thousand! At such times of perplexity, if one goes out and sees the pure Soul in everyone and does _pratikraman_ for those with whom he has karmic accounts; one will attain a great benefit inwardly. Often times, during troubles or some physical sickness or fever, we tell someone else of our illness in order to get solace and because of that, there remains a shortage in our penance. Dadashri says, 'I never let go of the chance to do such penance. To us, it does not even feel like penance. It feels like a gift instead. I look forward to such penance'. And in fact, Dadashri had never let anyone know about his physical troubles. Even when obvious, he would say, 'There is nothing wrong with my health' and would then change the topic. Moreover, he would teach everyone that, "You should make the intentions to do the same and you will be able to attain this as well. If you say, 'I am unable to do penance', it will spoil your chance of doing it. At best, you should say that, 'I have been telling this Chandubhai to do penance but he is unable to do penance!" Is penance included in 'scientific circumstantial evidence'? No. 'Scientific circumstantial evidence' is the discharge part and while doing penance or _pratikraman_ ; one should not stop doing _pratikraman_ by saying that it is discharge; that would be considered as misuse of Agna. When can it be said that true penance is done? When there is pain on the outside and at that time he is in the Knower-Seer state inside and has tremendous inner bliss prevailing within.

## [9.1] To Suffer ( _bhogavavoo_ ); To Feel ( _vedavoo_ ); To Know ( _jaanvoo_ ).

Gnanis settle off the physical pain. Others suppress the pain with drugs. While remaining in Knower-Seer state, painful feelings do not touch You, the Self. 'Let millions of painful feelings ( _vedana_ ) come'; you should say and the pain will run away from You! And if you feel, 'what will happen if there is pain?' then, it will be so. Who gets the pain? 'The head does or the neighbor gets the pain, not me, I am pure Soul' - when this knowledge is present, pain will not touch You. And if, 'I am in pain' is said; the pain will be doubled. It can even increase manifold. _Vedakata,_ the experience of feeling is applicable to Chandubhai and _vedakata_ meaning 'to know', applies to the Self as well. Mahatma have questioned whether by getting an operation, one has to carry forward the karma in the next life. Dadashri says, "No, that karma is considered as finished. Whatever happens is 'scientific circumstantial evidence'. The surgery becomes instrumental in the completion of one's karma that one has to suffer. All of that are circumstances only." The body is the neighbor. One is to remain as the Knower-Seer of it but one is to care for the body too. _Mahatmas_ question how they can remain in the awareness of separation during sickness. Dadashri answers strikingly, 'Do you remain separate while eating? Whatever has been tasted shall give the rewards, no? If you take pleasure in the taste, you will have to suffer the pain while sickness is there, right? The eater, the food and the non-eater are to be kept as separate!' Then, the separation shall prevail even while sickness is there. How is the ' _vedak'_ (one feeling or experiencing pain or pleasure) to be settled of? Through feeling - _vediney_! Gnanis settle of karma by the use of Gnan (knowledge) and _mahatmas_ settle of karma by feeling the pain but they should use the remedy of Gnan by saying 'this body is not mine, the body is a _gneya_ , a thing to be known and I am the Gnata, the Knower' etc. The method used by the Tirthankaras and Gnanis is worth learning. They truly consider pain as pleasure! Then how can there be pain for them?The feeling of pain stays with the person from the state of experiencing it to the state of Knowing it. Gnanis do not feel the pain, they merely Know it; hence, their inner bliss is never lost. _Mahatmas_ feel the pain sometimes and at other times become the Knower of the pain, thus, they go 'to and fro', and the ignorant person (one who does not have Self-realization) will experience nonstop pain and have the suffering from it! _Mahatmas_ will slowly become steady in the Knower state, until then, they should keep Chandubhai (relative self) separate and be patient. They should stand in front of a mirror and pat their shoulder and say to file number one, 'I am here for you, why are you worrying? You will get better!' No matter how horrible the pain may be; to remain separate from it is the penance. While doing this penance, one is said to be in the true Knower state. The one who feels the pain is separate from the one who Knows it. The Knower is verily the Self ! The sufferer is the ego and the Knower is the _pragnya_. The one who suffers from pain is not the Self, the Self is only the Knower. The Self is the Knower of the sufferer ( _vedak, bhogavanaar_ ) and also the knower of the pain or pleasure sensations ( _vedan_ ); the Self is the Knower of both. People may become the knower of the sensations (pleasant or painful) but they do not become the knower of the sufferer ( _vedak, bhogavanaar_ ). "My headache is gone"; they may say this because they have become the knower of the sensations ( _vedana_ ) but they do not become the knower of the sufferer.If one feels the pain, how is _pratikraman_ to be done for that? There is no _pratikraman_ for that. _Pratikraman_ is done only if others, get hurt by us. Otherwise, just by 'Seeing' the pain that one is experiencing, one can be free from it! When a _mahatma_ has a toothache, he may keep it separate but when there is strong throbbing pain from the tooth, he may become engrossed in the pain. But then, he will soon become aware and keep the pain separate from the Self. He may have dozed off but then he wakes up later. This is quite a wonderful state that the _mahatmas_ have attained in this era.

## [9.2] Pleasure from non-Self complex – Bliss from the Self

Why is there suffering? Whatever pleasure from the non-Self complex was enjoyed while one was in the ignorant state (before Self-realization), whatever pleasure was derived; a repayment for that is inevitable. How much pleasure was enjoyed from the body, from the mind, from the speech and from things and people! Even though one experiences many times that the mind, speech, external things and people have caused pain and one learns his lesson and gets freedom from them but for how long does the conviction that the body also causes pain last for him? Only the Gnanis are in this state of Knowledge that the body is a permanent source of pain ( _dukha_ ). That is why Dadashri used to remove the blanket in winter time and did not take pleasure in eating-drinking etc. This was because it persists in His awareness, that such pleasure is borrowed pleasure and He will have to make the repayment for it. The pleasure that the mind enjoys is one where one eats, drinks and has pleasure, has enjoyment of taste. The pleasure of speech is when the husband scolds and after a little while he comes back and talks sweetly and she 'feels' the sweetness in that talk; that is taking pleasure of speech. When one relishes taste from the non-Self complex, it prevents the absolute Knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ). _Mahatmas_ are not aware of this at all. So much pleasure is still being derived from sleep, from food, from respect ( _maan_ ), from comforts, from sex! Once the belief sets in that 'this is wrong', taking of pleasure from them becomes less and less and ultimately ends.

After _mahatmas_ attain Gnan, they experience the absence of all worldly pain. This is the first state of liberation. Thereafter, the absence of body, the experience of the absolute-Self's bliss; the prevalence of natural bliss- this is the second state of liberation; it is also called as the liberation of the _Siddha-khshetra_ (place where all Librated Souls live).

## [10] Understanding the Goal of the absolute Self

The word 'purpose' ( _heytu_ ) is used essentially for worldly life and the word 'goal' ( _dhyeya_ ) is used for the Self. The absolute Self is the goal. There should be only one goal that, 'I want to be pure ( _shuddha_ ) only.' No other goal should be there. 'I want to be like Dadashri, I want to be a Tirthankara'; the goal higher than this is 'I want to live as the Self ( _swaroop_ ) and attain final liberation.' And one can achieve completion of this by remaining in Dadashri's five Agnas. After getting Gnan, one has attained the goal for the Self and the Self has now become the Knower. Therefore, One is to move towards this goal. If the Knower ( _dhyata_ ) contemplates about the goal ( _dhyeya,_ absolute Self), one becomes that ( _dhyeya_ _swaroop_ ). When terrible cold or hot weather is there or when other severe external catastrophes come, if one enters into the Self instead of making attempts to save the self from them; a great revelation will happen. There is a vast difference between goal ( _dhyeya_ ) and determination ( _nischaya_ ). Determination is a small thing whereas, goal means attaining the Self and then to go on to the final liberation.

## [11] The Majesty of Satsang

After Gnan Vidhi, it is very essential to attend _satsang_ ( _sat_ \- eternal, _sang_ – company) specifically for the purpose of remaining in the Self. What happens if one does not pay attention to his business? Similarly, one has to go to _satsang_ for the Self. Some people say that they are doing _satsang_ at home and that they read the books at home. If that is the case, then what is the need for anyone to go to school? Make a strong determination that 'I want to go to _satsang_ ', then there will be favorable circumstances. And Dadashri had even guaranteed that if one comes to this _satsang_ , there shall be no loss in his business. The _satsang_ of the Self here is that of the final and the ultimate station ( _moksha_ ). Nothing is left out beyond this. Just by sitting here, changes of the tangible and subtle type will happen. Even if there is beating or scolding in _satsang_ , one should not leave _satsang_. This is _satsang_ of the Self and doing it is credited in the account of the Self. This _satsang_ is such that even the celestial deities come down to listen to it! When there is the unfolding of terrible karma, do _satsang_ and the karma will cool down. What should _mahatmas_ do to attain the absolute state? They should spend their life with Dadashri; that is all. They should stay in Dadashri's vicinity day and night. What measures should one take for the extra-ordinary awareness ( _vishesh_ _jagruti_ ) of the Self? The answer is: remain in _satsang_! One should never trust _kusang_ (bad company; anything that takes one away from the Self). Should cyanide be tasted? Go to the Oberoi Hotel for a cup of tea and see the effect! Oh! As soon as you go up the steps, you will feel the effect of the surroundings. If you heat up just one clove of garlic in oil, what will be its' effect outside the room? What takes one from the _kusang_ to _satsang_? It is his merit karma ( _punyai_ ). There, the Self or _pragnya_ are not at work. The absolute Self does not get attached to anything. It is absolutely unattached ( _asang_ ) by nature. People are running around in order to make it _asang_ ; they leave everything (renounce) and go away. _Satsang_ is necessary in worldly life. Those who are in _satsang_ will attain the final goal, how can this happen for those who are in bad company? Many _mahatmas_ have the question as to what they should do for progress in this knowledge during the later years of their lives. Dadashri says, 'Take measures to remain in the Agnas all the time.' These days the effect of bad company will happen at every step; at home, on the outside and at religious places. Therefore, those who have sacrificed the life for the attainment of one final life should spend the later years of life in the company of _mahatmas_. In _mahatmas'_ crowd, bad company ( _kusang_ ) will not touch you at all! Everyone here has the goal to attain final liberation, everyone here has one goal!

## [12] Freedom from fear in the state of Knowledge

How to break down the tuber of fear? After attaining Gnan, most fears go away spontaneously. And to become completely fearless, one has to live with the Gnani for a period of four to six months. As one understands 'scientific circumstantial evidence' high levelly, the fears start to go away and when 'scientific circumstantial evidence' is completely understood; absolute Knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ) will come to manifest! The ignorant person ( _agnani_ , the one without the knowledge of Self) will feel fear everywhere he goes, whereas, Gnanis are always without fear!

" _The Self is vitarag, free of fear" -Bhagavad Gita_. Describing His life experience, Dadashri says, "One time, a policeman threatened to imprison me. I told him sincerely, 'Imprison me! At home I have to close the doors and here, the policeman will close it for me!' and the policeman was startled." Where there is a steady state ( _stheerta_ ), no fear is felt. No one can shake him. After Gnan, there is no fear, there is a reflex startle response. To be startled is a physical high reflex. If there is sudden loud noise, even the Gnani's body will be startled, but He remains as the Self within. This startle response is known _sangi_ _chetna_. Due to close association, it has a derived a life-like response.Dadashri tells _mahatmas_ , "If the pain does not move away, You move away. You have attained the Self, therefore, enter into the cave of the Self!" Even if a bomb were to drop, nothing will happen to the Self. Whatever happens, will happen to the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ). If a bomb drops and this knowledge is present, then one has attained the goal of liberation.

## [13] Soul or Self Oriented Resolve ( _nischaya_ ) and Worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ )

The worldly interactions of _mahatmas_ in Akram path range from high level ( _uchit_ ) to 'pure' interactions ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ). What is high level worldly interaction? It is the interaction where no one can find even the smallest defect in it.

Dadashri says that the _mahatmas_ ' worldly interactions have variations, from high-level interactions up to pure interactions. Thus, after attaining Gnan, the interactions are of the pure type only but there are variations. It may range from high level-pure interactions ( _uchit-shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ) to pure-pure interactions ( _shuddha-shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ), meaning that it begins with high level-pure interactions and it ends with pure-pure interactions.

What does 'pure interactions ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ )' mean? If someone insults you, causes loss for you and yet You see that person as pure Soul, You see him as _nirdosh_ (fault-free or innocent); to even see the faulty person as innocent – it is called as pure-interactions. _Mahatmas_ have this type of pure interactions. The interactions that are visible outwardly are called as pure interactions ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ) and the interactions that are not visible outwardly are called as high-level interactions ( _uchit_ _vyavahar_ ). Dadashri says that my pure-interactions are at 356º and Tirthankaras' pure-interactions are at 360º and it is spontaneously natural. What is perfect pure-interactions like? Pure worldly interactions are where no harm or hurt is caused to anyone even in the slightest, through the mind, speech or actions.If Dadashri's five Agnas are followed, it is called as complete pure-interactions. Whatever part they are followed, it is apportioned as pure-interactions and the portion that is not followed is counted as high level interactions. And by doing _pratikraman_ for it (the time the Agnas were not followed); _mahatmas_ do purify it out in the end.In Akram-path, the interactions are of the pure type ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ); they are not necessarily of ( _parmartha_ ) that which leads to the Self or good type ( _sada_ - _vyavahar_ ). If there is imperfection in the pure-interactions ( _shuddha-_ _vyavahar_ ) and if one wants to count it as good interactions ( _sada_ - _vyavahar_ ), that is fine. If someone swears bad words, insults badly and the mahatma decides inwardly that 'I want to settle of this with equanimity'; then this is his worldly interaction. 'I don't want to fight'- this awareness that he has, is verily his worldly interaction in itself. What he said or spoke is not considered as interaction. His inner process is ideal and pure; and if he swore bad words; then that is the discharge part, it is the outwardly part. How can people on the outside (those who do not have Gnan) understand the inner intent of this matter? There may be anger outwardly and at the same time, inwardly there is the feeling that, 'This should not be happening'; this is pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ). This warning is given by _pragnya_ that is in the middle and the Self is the Knower of all of this. When there is no ill-feeling even for the person who swears bad words, it is considered as pure interaction and it is the cause of _moksha_ while living ( _pratyaksh_ _moksha_ ).While following the Gnani's five Agnas, all outwardly interactions become pure interactions. The Gnani places us in the state of pure-interactions! What are the criteria for pure-interactions? When there is no use of anger-pride-deceit-greed! _Gusso_ (anger without violent intent) may happen but there is no anger. In anger, there is continuity and violent intent. These are not present in _mahatmas_. Once the body itself is considered as 'file number one' and the relatives and others are seen as 'files'; separation from the self is attained!Even though one eats and drinks, it is considered as pure interactions. This is because it is done with the awareness that, "The eater eats and I, the non-eater only Know of it." In pure-interactions the Self is only the Knower and there are no other interferences and the worldly interactions keep going on. In pure interactions, there is no 'my-ness' ( _mamata_ ). Where there is no my-ness, there is absence of anger-pride-deceit-greed ( _kashaya_ ). When pure Soul is seen in the trees, animals, birds, humans and in every living being; it is known as pure worldly interaction ( _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ ). Pure-interactions cannot be done without Self-knowledge. Pure Soul in every living being can only be seen after Self-knowledge. In pure-interactions, there is no doer-ship ( _karta_ - _bhav_ ) at all and there is no ego ( _ahamkar_ ), there is no _kashaya_ , there is uninterrupted lack of response to _kashaya_ ( _antarik_ _sainyam_ ) although the outward response may or may not be there. In good interactions ( _sad_ - _vyavahar_ ), in good conduct ( _sad_ - _achaar_ ) and in good or bad interactions ( _shuubha_ - _ashuubha_ _vyavahar_ ); there is presence of ego. What is good interactions ( _sad_ - _vyavahar_ )? It is when the _kashayas_ are not hurting anyone else only but one's own self. If someone hurts him, he accepts it. Pure interactions ( _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ ) are free of _kashayas_. In the _karmic_ path, adjusting one's conduct based on the scriptures is known as good interactions ( _sad_ - _vyavahar_ ). When there are measures for attainment of liberation in one's worldly-interactions; it is known as good interactions and when there are measures for attainment of the worldly benefits, it is known as the good interactions – _shubha_ - _vyavahar_.What is the difference between good ( _shubha_ ) versus pure ( _shuddha_ ) interactions? The one with Self-knowledge has pure interactions and the ignorant person has good interactions. Since Gnani is in the non-doer-ship state, he does not have to do pure or good interactions, it happens by itself. And good interaction has to be performed. Since there is ego in it, it has to be performed. These days, there are plenty of bad worldy interactions ( _ashubha_ _vyavahar_ ) such as, picking-pockets, verbal and physical fighting etc. Then, only a few people have impure worldly interaction ( _ashuddha_ _vyavahar_ ). The worldly interaction that causes one to go to hell is called as impure worldly interaction.Pure state of the Self ( _shuddha_ _nischaya_ ) exists only where there is pure worldly interaction ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ). What is identified as pure conduct? Interactions done without anger-pride-deceit-greed are identified as pure interactions. If someone kills a human and eats human flesh, it is known as impure worldly interaction ( _ashuddha_ _vyavahar_ ). Or, if someone kills a deer just for pleasure, it is known as impure worldly interaction. And if a deer is killed to feed the children, it is known as bad worldly interaction ( _ashubha_ - _vyavahar_ ). And if the third hunter kills a deer to feed the children but repents sincerely, it is known as good-bad interaction ( _shubha_ - _ashubha_ _vyavahar_ ). The bad can be converted into good by doing true _pratikraman_!The pure Self ( _shuddha_ _nischaya_ ) is based on the pillars of pure worldly interactions ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ). Where there is no pure worldly interaction, there is no pure Self there. To keep the Self as the Self and to keep the worldly interactions as worldly interactions is called as pure worldly interaction. In the Akram-path, pure worldy interaction and pure Self are maintained together. Both are given equal importance. However, the Self is to be acquired ( _grahaniya_ ) and worldly-interactions are worthy of settlement ( _nikali_ ). After Self-realization (Gnan), the worldly interactions that are done dramatically (performing worldly role with constant awareness of the Self) are considered as pure worldly interactions. If you are not a tea drinker and someone pressures you to drink tea, rather than not drinking tea and being tense about it or doing _kashaya_ about it; quietly drink a little tea. Worldly interactions should be adjustable. It should be done dramatically. It should be such that there should be no complaint from anyone.It is pure worldly interaction when the Self is 'seen' in someone swearing bad words or offering you a garland of flowers. Pure worldly interaction is the foundation of the pure Self. Pure worldly interaction causes no hindrance to anyone. The worldly interaction after attaining the the Self is considered as pure worldly interaction. Until then, the worldly interaction is not considered even as worldly interaction. Where there is the Self ( _nischaya_ ), there should be pure worldly interaction and if pure worldly interaction is not there, the Self ( _nischaya_ ) has not been attained yet. However, there should not be any insistence in it. One is to cling to the Self and settle the worldly interactions! 'To settle with equanimity' is the basement on which Akram Vignan is grounded. Worldly interactions are going to exist until absolute Knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ) is attained. _Mahatmas_ attain the Self and pure worldly interaction within four or five years; this otherwise cannot be attained by millions of efforts over millions of life-times!Worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ ) and the Self ( _nischaya_ ) have no relation. Worldly interactions are in the form of discharge karma. The physical body exists because of the ignorance of one's own Self. Once the ignorance is gone, the body and worldly interaction will leave.What is the mark of attaining the Self ( _nischaya_ )? _Vitaragata_ absence of attachment and abhorrence is evident in worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ ). The Self is verily pure, but when the worldly interaction becomes pure, then total benefit will be gained. The one who neglects worldly interactions will lose the Self. How can Self exist alone? The one who ignores the Self, will lose the pure worldly interaction. The worldly interaction in which the Self has not arisen is worthless. Pure element; the eternal element is known as the Self ( _nischaya_ ) and phases of the elements; temporary things are known as the worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ ). After attaining the Self, the worldly interactions are setting (settling) and before that (Self-realization), the worldly interactions are rising as well as setting. Where Self and worldly interactions do not coexist, the religion of the Self ( _Atma dharma_ ) does not exist there. The person following the 'religion of the Self' only ( _nischaya_ _dharma_ ) will somehow achieve the end but the person following the 'religion of worldly interactions' ( _vyavahar_ ) only, will never reach the end. The person following the 'religion of the Self' will build up merit karma ( _punyai_ ) and will have worldly pleasures but the person following the 'religion of only worldly interactions' will bind demerit-karma ( _paap_ ) if he says, 'I have sinned'.In the Akram path, worldly interactions and the Self, go hand in hand. The Self is the eternal energy ( _chetan_ ) and worldly interactions are the non-Self. If someone tries to move forward unilaterally, he will fall back and the person who is balanced in both will go to final liberation. The Self means original natural state ( _swabhaavik_ ) and worldly interactions do not belong to the Self ( _vibhavik_ ) and they keep on changing. 'Where there is worldly interaction, the 'doer' of worldly interaction is also there; and the Self is not the doer at all!' In this single sentence, Dadashri has opened up such a wonderful science! If one wants to eat, the fingers will be working towards that aim by themselves, because all this is mechanical. Akram Vignan shows the doer of the worldly interactions. Hence, 'We' keep on 'Seeing' and the doer of worldly interactions is already present; so where is the necessity for 'our' interference? Worldly interaction cannot be quit or cut off. That's would be considered as the escapist tendency ( _bhagedu_ _vruti_ ). Can you cut the nail all the way to the nail root? Only the nails that grow over the fingertip should be cut. In Akram path, the worldly interactions are to be settled. In construction of a building, centering (support wood poles for pouring concrete) is likened to worldly interactions and to fill it with the slab of cement is likened to the Self. Centering is not there forever but the slab can't be filled without it. Is centering ever done with expensive teak wood or one with carving on it? The centering is removed soon after the slab is finished. After getting Gnan, the worldly interactions gradually become ideal as one increasingly stays in the Agnas. The part of worldly interactions that is not ideal will hurt him and eventually will leave.The person whose worldly interactions have become ideal, has become complete pure Soul ( _sampoorna_ _shuddhatma_ ). Thereafter, even following the Agnas has come to an end for Him! Ideal interactions are those where everyone is pleased. Dadashri's worldly interactions are close to Tirthankaras' interactions. Ideal interactions are those where one does not clash in places where clashes do happen and if by chance, clash does happen; he will ask for forgiveness either in person or in his mind. Ideal worldly interactions are those where his neighbors, relatives and acquaintances, his wife and children and his aging mother as well, will say that he is a good man. He is not a hindrance to anyone and causes no pain to anyone. Ideal worldly interaction should be life's goal. As much ideal worldly interaction is there, that much the Self manifests. Gnanis' worldly interactions are ideal. Devotees' worldly interactions will fall short. Hence, they are known as devotees. Devotees are immersed insanely in devotion and for that reason, they forget about the worldly interaction. If a devotee's wife asked him to buy sugar or if his child asked for school-fees, he will go out to get it but if he happens to see a group of devotees there, he will forget everything and stay with that group of devotees. At home, they will be waiting for him till night without sugar or money! The person whose worldly interactions are 'spoils' the Self. Dadashri's worldly interaction was ideal. At home, he did not have a single incident of divisiveness due to difference of opinion ( _matabheda_ ) with Hiraba for fifty years! _Mahatmas_ do not find it easy to 'decorate' their worldly interactions. Those with decoration will sometime say, 'I will give my life for you'; and the same person will fight with you the next moment! _Mahatmas_ do not find this convenient. They do not resort to flattery and they cannot talk back and forth either. Dadashri says, " 'We' (the Gnani Purush and the Lord within) may go to attend a marriage but 'we' do not get engrossed there. 'We' remain in a state without attachment or aversion ( _vitarag_ ). You become engrossed." Dadashri says, " 'Our' speech, actions and humility wins people's minds. Even the opponents have respect for 'us'! This Akram Vignan does not neglect worldly interactions at all. This is a complete principle ( _siddhant_ ). This is without controversy. This will make one a _vitarag_ -free from attachments and abhorrence . This is the great wonder of our time!" Who is the most beneficial for this world? The one who is completely free of attachment and abhorrence! How should _mahatmas_ handle worldly interaction? If they put too much emphasis in handling worldly interaction, _nischaya_ the Self will be left behind. They are to take care about making sure that there is no attachment-abhorrence ( _raag_ - _dwesh_ ). Everything else is scientific circumstantial evidence. For the _mahatmas_ , if the daughter gets married, it is worldly interaction and if she becomes a widow, that too is a worldly interaction. This is happening in the relative, it is not happening in the real. Worldly interaction done with _saiyam_ (without anger-pride-deceit-greed); is known as exact pure worldly interaction.The one who is untouched by worldly interaction, is considered true worldly interaction. If it does not touch absolutely, that is the state of absolute Knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ). In the path of the flowing current of development in life in the universe ( _samsaran_ _marg_ ), the worldly interaction have simply arisen; just as the worldly interaction arise for a sparrow if it comes in front of a mirror, no? The worldly interaction that is devoid of interference and is absolutely free from attachment-abhorrence is called _vyavahar_ worldly interaction. That much _vyavahar_ has left. When it leaves completely, then absolute Knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ) manifests.

Jai Sat Chit Anand

# [1] Importance of Agna

## The One who follows the five Agna, attains the state of Lord Mahavir

**Questioner:** You have given us the knowledge of the Self ( _Atmagnan_ ) and you have told us to live in the five Agna and read the _Charan Vidhi_. Is there anything else we need to do?

**Dadashri** : It is more than enough if You constantly abide by one of the five Agna that 'we' have given You.

**Questioner** : So then you will put us in the 'lift', will you not? The rest of the responsibility is yours, is it not?

**Dadashri** : All the responsibility is 'ours'. You can experience the state that of Lord Mahavir if You remain in the five Agna. You will experience the _samadhi_ (absolutely unaffected state despite mental, physical or external problems) like Lord Mahavir - this much I guarantee you. Yes, the responsibility is still 'ours' when You follow even one, instead of all the five Agna.

There is nothing else to be done after 'we' give You the Gnan. You just have to remain in the five Agna that 'we' give You. These Agna contain the entire Vignan of the world. Nothing is left out in them. And all the five Agna are beneficial to You during the whole day.

When One remains in these Agna; it is enough. They are such that one can attain the absolute state in this very life, even if one has only five or ten years to live.

## Awareness and _moksha_ through the Agna only

**Questioner** : What should I do to experience a constant awareness of the Self?

**Dadashri** : The Agna that have been given to You give you the awareness ( _awareness_ ). It is more than enough if You remain in them. The five Agna themselves is Gnan; there is no other Gnan.

**Questioner** : Is this causal liberation ( _karan moksha_ ) that has happened to us?

**Dadashri** : You have attained 'causal liberation' but our Gnan is such that it is only good if You live in the Agna. If you do not remain the Agna, the Gnan will leave. These Agna are the most important thing. The Gnan will disappear if there is no 'fence' (in the form of the Agna) around it. Hence after taking this Gnan, You will come into the Agna and then you will have attained _moksha_ too.

## Agna verily is religion and penance

There must be thousands of people here who, if asked, 'Do you have Dada on your mind?' will tell you, 'we do not forget Dada all day, not even for a second! Not a single day has gone by where we have forgotten Dada, not even for a second!' And so when they have not forgotten Him, they do not feel any pain or unhappiness ( _dukha_ ), do they? When Dada is never forgotten, then the world will continue to be forgotten ( _vismrut_ ), will it not? Remembering one means forgetting the other. Remembering Dada means forgetting the world! Many people get on to worshipping ( _bhakti_ ) Dada by constantly remembering Him. There are others who remain in Gnan. And amongst them, only a few remain the Agna completely, but each one of them will either become _ek-avtari_ (have one more life before attaining _moksha_ ), _bey-avtari_ (two more lives before _moksha_ ), _panch_ - _avtari_ (five lives before _moksha_ ) and find the solution. Even those who have gone into worshipping will have the solution because they are free of other external problems, are they not?

## Value is of the Agna only

**Questioner** : Those who have attained Gnan, will attain _moksha_ within two to five life times, will they not?

**Dadashri** : Yes, but provided they remain the Agna along with the Gnan. It will take more life times to attain _moksha_ if they do not remain the Agna. The value is in the Agna, not the Gnan (after one attains the Gnan Agna are more important). Agna is 'I', I veryily am Agna only, and thus, 'I' am with You. Dada will be present for twenty four hours. He will be constantly in your memory even when you do not think of Him. And for many, Dada comes in their dreams every night. Right now, Dada must be in many people's dreams in India; they also write to me, here, saying they had a dream.

## Is Dada important or the Agna?

**Questioner** : What is the topmost awareness ( _jagruti_ ) for the _mahatmas_?

**Dadashri** : However much one follows the five Agna; that is all awareness. Otherwise to constantly remember Dada is also considered awareness.

**Questioner** : Which awareness is higher, one of living in the Agna or one where there is constant remembrance of Dada? Which of the two increases awareness?

**Dadashri** : Living in the Agna. There is no _purushartha_ (after Gnan _Vidhi_ , the intent to remain in five Agna) on one's part in remembering Dada.

**Questioner** : If there is no _purushartha_ in it, then is there more reverence ( _bhakti-bhaav_ ) in it?

**Dadashri** : Whatever you say, but there is no _purushartha_ in it, whereas to remain the five Agna; it is all _purushartha_. And _purushartha_ is the main thing. The other one ( _bhakti_ ) is something that one has 'attained', and something, which can also be lost.

## It is necessary to remain Agna

To remain Agans is verily awareness itself. Otherwise, doing anything else like the ignorant people do; is not called awareness. That is called 'sleeping with open eyes'. Do you like to follow the Agna?

**Questioner** : To follow the Agna means that there is a 'follower' of the Agna, is there not?

**Dadashri** : Yes, there is a 'follower'. So what will You do now?

**Questioner** : I do not want to keep the 'follower'.

**Dadashri** : Oho! So do you expect to reach Delhi by getting off the train here in Ahmedabad?

Some people who did not remain the Agna have disappeared altogether. If you live by the Agna, You will become "solid". Otherwise this 'bulb' will blow out. This Gnan, which is given, does not go to waste entirely. In the Gnan _Vidhi_ his demerit karma ( _paap_ ) have been destroyed; therefore his intent ( _bhavna_ ) remains good. One becomes a better person than he was before but he does not remain on the path of _moksha_. He remains on the path of _moksha_ as long as he lives in the Agna. These people ( _mahatmas_ ) constantly remain 'our' Agna; all twenty four hours. Follow them as much as You can. Make an effort, there is no problem if you cannot remain them but you should keep having remorse for not being able to do so. You should regret that it should not be so, that is all. This 'we' consider as completion ( _purnahuti_ ).

## Ocean emptied into Your pitcher

You have been given the path in every form and in addition, it is not long.

**Questioner** : Not long and so when we put our focus ( _kendrit_ ) on it, we realize how succinctly Dada has given this.

**Dadashri** : Otherwise, in this current time era, you will forget it.

**Questioner** : But some of our _prakruti_ (the relative self) is such that, however succinct it is, it tries to complicate it.

**Dadashri** : Had I given you a lengthy Gnan, then you would leave aside that which is to be followed and you would remain in that which is not to be followed. But because this is short, You have to remain in one and not in the other, so where will You go? If the hole is only three feet wide, if you turn one way or the other, it is the same. You cannot go anywhere! So that is the kind of Gnan You have been given. 'We' knew that if 'we' were to give people of this current time cycle, a lengthy Gnan, it would become a problem. Instead of revering one thing, they would end up revering something totally different! So You have been given a very high class Vignan ( _vignan_ ), there is nothing to be read, no effort to be made; nothing at all to be done. One will have constant awareness and even amidst worldly difficulties, One will be able to remain in the five Agna beautifully.

**Questioner** : But Dada, you gave us a sentence of great importance that 'now after attaining the awareness of the pure Self ( _Shuddhatma_ ), You have to remain the five Agna and You don't have to do anything else'.

**Dadashri** : Yes. You do not have to do anything. Just only five fingers worth! Is there any more hassle? It would be a hassle if it were twenty fingers worth. But here there are only five fingers, and even if You were to hang on to just one of the five fingers, it would be more than enough.

## That which gives satisfactory solution is Gnan

'Our' word itself is in the form of Gnan, therefore you do not have to read anything. You do not forget it, do You? Have you had to read anything after that?

**Questioner** : No, Dada.

**Dadashri** : But the Gnan is present, is it not?

**Questioner** : Yes, the understanding keeps increasing.

**Dadashri** : It is present everywhere. The five Agna are present. There is power and energy in these words ( _vachanbud_ ) and so You will not forget it. When the time comes, the Gnan will present without fail; it will be present.

This Gnan is such that it solves all problems. It brings a satisfactory solution in any place, any state or any circumstance. How can you call it Gnan if it does not bring a resolution? If there is any residual entanglement, how can it be called Gnan?

**Questioner** : We see that whoever has attained the Gnan, it continues to work from within, for Him. That is the greatest wonder.

**Dadashri** : It will continue working within. Science ( _vignan_ ) means that it is living energy( _chaitaniya_ ). It continues to work. You do not have to follow the Agna; it will make You follow the five Agna from within.

This is an amazing Vignan that it constantly cautions you from within. If you are involved in negative activity, it will quickly alert you from within. Therefore You do not have to do anything. This Gnan itself will do everything. You just have to make a decision that You want to remain Dada's Agna. These Agna can save you from all kinds of circumstances; it is a protection. It will caution you even in your sleep. Now what more do You need?

## Guarantee of attaining the Self

**Questioner** : Dada gives the guarantee that the Self ( _Shuddhatma_ ) has been attained.

**Dadashri** : Yes, 'we' do guarantee that. The Self that 'we' have given to You; the one that has manifested within You is the real Self. It is now in Your hands to take care of it.

**Questioner** : Now You have changed it (from what you were saying before). You are also telling us that since you have put us in the elevator, we are bound to go to _moksha_.

**Dadashri** : There will be no progress at all, if I do not say that. But this is a completely new talk, you will not understand if 'we' do not say that. The rest of the responsibility is 'ours'. Eat, drink and enjoy but remain 'our' Agna; that is all.

## Moksha guaranteed for the one who lives in the Agna

**Questioner** : Does the Gnani Purush take everyone to _moksha_ or does He take them as far as whatever one has brought forth, from past life, in his inner intent and leave them there?

**Dadashri** : No, it is not like that. If one lives in 'our' Agna, that will take him all the way to _moksha_ and if he does not, then he will be left behind. But at least some of his demerit _karma_ ( _paap)_ get washed away. He becomes lighter, but what happens when he does not remain the Agna? He will have to wander for some time more. It is a guarantee that he will be taken to _moksha_ if he lives in Dada's Agna.

**Questioner** : Who amongst us here is going to _moksha_? Dada knows this, does he not?

**Dadashri** : Everyone; those who have attained the Gnan to go to _moksha_ from Me and are living in my Agna, they have My guarantee for _moksha_.

**Questioner** : Jai Sat _Chit_ Anand! (cheerful approval)

**Dadashri** : And the Agna; one does not have to remain hundred percent in it, _moksha_ is guaranteed for the one who lives by them even seventy percent. He will become like Me if he lives in them one hundred percent. There is no problem if one cannot remain in them one hundred percent. Follow by seventy percent.

**Questioner** : I want to become like Dada.

**Dadashri** : So then You have to remain in them one hundred percent and there too I am giving a leeway of five degrees; so remain in Agna ninety-five percent.

**Questioner** : Since attaining Gnan three years ago, I feel that I do remain the Agna. But looking at me, can you tell whether I am remaining in them or not?

**Dadashri** : Yes. I can understand that, it is not that it is difficult to know. To those who remain in the Agna, I do not tell them to do so one hundred percent. No one can remain in them one hundred percent, one can do so only eighty percent if he tries hard, but it is more than enough even if he remains by only sixty-five to seventy percent. It is tantamount to following my Agna completely. For the rest, you can say that you cannot remain in them due to your weakness and you are asking for forgiveness, and so that makes it one hundred percent. You followed sixty-five percent and you are asking for forgiveness for the thirty-five percent that you cannot remain. That makes it one hundred percent. There is a weakness, is there not? It will take one or two more life times. (8)

**Questioner** : The worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) starts for the _mahatmas_ from the time they get up in the morning. They have to carry on worldly conversations and in doing so, if this vision (Agna) does not prevail, is it considered as being asleep (unawareness, _ajagruti_ )?

**Dadashriy** : He is 'awake' if he is living by our Agna; seventy-percent, not a hundred percent. Everyone will fail in the hundred percent. People will ask, 'Sir, how can a man remain in them one hundred percent? He has no capacity!' So I said, 'No, I pass people at seventy percent.' Then can I be at fault if I give them freedom at seventy percent? If one follows them by seventy percent, I will make it one hundred percent. Because I realize that the current time era is a difficult one and so people cannot remain in them a hundred percent. I have to give them higher marks for following just this much, do I not?

## I take the responsibility for the one living in the Agna

**Questioner** : After attaining your Gnan the bliss that is beyond this world is experienced. We will do whatever necessary to protect that Gnan, but do You also protect that Gnan or not?

**Dadashri** : 'Our' protection is always there if you remain the Agna. 'We' have to be present when You remain our Agna. 'We' are present whenever you are following the Agna. Should You not follow 'our' word? You follow the instructions of your doctor, do you not? If he tells you not to eat sugar for the time being and to eat yogurt and rotlo (millet bread), then if we ask you, 'why are you not eating shrikhand (sweetened creamy yogurt) when everyone else is; you will say, 'the doctor has said not to.' Hey you! If you are so cautious in following the doctor's advice to live just one life, then why don't You become aware in the face of deaths of infinite life times! For now, You have attained the bliss of the Self that is beyond this world, have You not? This bliss will remain, and it will increase.

Dada Bhagwan shows you that all the paths come together here and He puts You on the path to _moksha_. The responsibility is 'ours' when You remain 'our' Agna. That is why, do 'we' not tell you that you can file a lawsuit of two lakh rupees if you have a single worry when You remain 'our' Agna? This Gnan is such that you will not have even one worry, so protect it. Now what can anyone do if you do not remain in the Agna? Is there any problem in following the Agna? What do you think?

**Questioner** : We cannot remain the Agna completely. You have said that you take some responsibility for some of the Agna we forget to follow.

**Dadashri** : No, 'we' will take on the responsibility if there is sincerity on Your part. 'We' will not take the responsibility if you are insincere. 'We' will immediately recognize your insincerity. People will even say, 'Dada Bhagwan has said that, so we do not have to worry'; this 'we' will recognize immediately. 'We' will immediately get the message that this person is starting to become insincere. If that happens because you are having some difficulty, then there is no problem. If that happens due the force of unfolding _karma_ ; then there is no problem.

**Questioner** : How do you take care of such responsibility?

**Dadashri** : If you live by 'our' instructions, 'we' take the full responsibility. Not in anything else; only in the five Agna. Otherwise, eat whatever ice-cream you like and do whatever you want to. You should remain the five Agna at least seventy percent of the time. 'We' give you that much flexibility; otherwise it should be followed a hundred percent.

## The Agna is verily My presence

**Questioner** : I am not able to remain the five Agna. I become anxious and upset in the process.

**Dadashri** : Is that so? Are the Agna not letting you do that or do You not remain them?

**Questioner** : I do not remain in them.

**Dadashri:** So then what can the Agna do there? Agna are easy and straightforward.

**Questioner** : What should I do to remain in the five Agna?

**Dadashri** : Nothing needs to be done. You should decide upon the intent ( _bhaav_ ) that, 'I want to remain in the Agna.'

**Questioner** : There are obstructions that arise.

**Dadashri:** Obstruction will arise for sure! Worldly people are never without obstructions but against all those obstructions, the Self has infinite energy.

**Questioner:** I feel so much at peace in your presence but when I go out, many obstructions remain.

**Dadashri:** Five Agna verily represents 'our' (referring to the Gnani Purush and the fully enlightened Lord within) presence. These Agna will give the same fruit as 'our' presence. So for the One who wants to remain the Agna, nothing affects Him. The one who wants to interfere in the worldly life – he will have problems.

**Questioner:** Dada, but I still become increasingly entangled and confused in the worldly life interaction ( _vyavahar_ ).

**Dadashri:** _Karma_ will come into effect but at that time if You remain in the Agna then all entanglements will leave. Agna is a great thing. Do You remain in the Agna somewhat?

**Questioner** : Yes Dada, I do a little bit.

**Dadashri** : What do you remain in otherwise? The worldly life interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) will push you into forgetting the Agna.

These five Agna are such that they will resolve all conflicts with equanimity at any place, at any time. You will find a solution if Agna is there. Agna is your safe side, complete safe side!

This has become very easy if one understands the facts. It becomes so easy after receiving this Gnan. You don't need to read scriptures. It is enough if You can remain in these Agna. Now that You have attained this _purusharth_ (of being in the five Agna), it is possible for You to grasp it. I am not denying that there are forces which can create obstructions. Effects from past still exist; they will keep pushing you, but You have to maintain awareness. Keep doing _pratikraman_ , then the awareness will remain. The benefit You gain will be in direct proportion to the level of the awareness and complete awareness is called _keval_ - _Gnan_ – absolute knowledge.

If you remain these five Agna then that is 'Our' direct presence ( _pratyaksh_ )! They are equivalen to 'Our' direct presence. So then what is it to you if this Dada (the Gnani Purush A. M. Patel) goes to America? He gave you the five Agna and left, so then what else is left for You? He is the Agna, is He not?

**Questioner** : Dada is giving us the answer to 'what will we do when this Dada goes?'

**Dadashri** : Yes. You have to look for the permanent Dada (the eternal Self). This Dada is seventy six years old, you never know when this body leaves. Instead, will there be a problem if You find the permanent Dada (five Agna)? Then we do not have a problem even if he lives a hundred years. You have to find the Self and then rest.

**Questioner** : Dada, how absolutely independent ( _niralumb_ ) You make all who come to You!

**Dadashri** : What else can 'we' do? Should one not have courage? You should remain steady, should you not? So You should sit on the seat of the of five Agna. Living in the Agna means you have found Your platform-the Self; that is all.

## Attain the energy from the Gnani

**Questioner:** I need a lot of energy _shakti_ to remain the Agna.

**Dadashri:** It is more than enough if our Gnan (awakened awareness as the Self) remains, that's it. Only see to that. Our Gnan will credit more in the account of _Shuddhatma_. The more you remain the Agna, the greater will be the credit. Are you crediting less? What is wrong in crediting more? The Agna are not that burdensome; none of them are difficult.

**Questioner:** If I get your blessings and the _shakti_ (energy) then it is not that difficult.

**Dadashri:** Our blessings and energy flows continuously.

**Questioner:** Following the Agna is not that easy. It is possible only if I get your _shakti._

**Dadashri:** That is the only reason we have continued to let our _shakti_ flow. It will stop from flowing if you shut the 'faucet' off. Otherwise 'we' have let it flow. How can man live in today's storm of illusory attachment ( _moha_ )? How huge is the tempest of illusion!

**Questioner:** If we can progress further in this then why should we not proceed?

**Dadashri:** It is possible; I will make a way for You. After becoming _purush_ (the awakened Self), Your energy depends directly on Your _purushartha_ (being, remaining in the five Agna).

**Questioner:** You should also give us such energy so that no weakness in our _purushartha_ remains.

**Dadashri** : We give that every time in this _vidhi_ (special blessings performed by the Gnani for the salvation of the _mahatma_ ).

**Questioner:** Then please give us such blessings, so that it will happen. This is all we want; give us that.

**Dadashri** : We have given you only that but you try to interfere ( _dakhal_ ) and 'fix' things and so that other becomes unsteady. We have given the very same pure Self to everyone so now if you make an effort to remain the five Agna then You can reach the goal. Put some more effort in following the five Agna. Do You want to accomplish the goal or not? Fast. Besides 'we' have given You the energy. Now remain in the five Agna so that the energies manifest.

If you cannot remain in Our Agna properly and if that is the only weakness, then you have to make Your decision ( _nischaya_ ) to be in them even more firm and unflinching. This is because You have become the _purush_ (the Self) and have the _purushartha_ (the state of the five Agna). And other than the Agna, nothing more is left to do.

Nobody can confuse or trouble the One who has made the tenacious decision to remain Dada's Agna. However if one takes the approach of 'It is fine if I can remain in the Agans and it is fine if I can't remain in them', then everything is ruined. These Agna are such that they can take a person all the way to _moksha_ – ultimate liberation. This train is such that You will not need to do any steering!

**Questioner:** And the other thing is; if one decides that he does not want to forego the focused awareness ( _upayoga_ ), then...

**Dadashri:** Yes, if You make a decision then it will help a lot. The approach of 'If it happens it is good, otherwise it does not matter', will not work. If a decision of, 'Come what may, I definitely want to do it', is made then seventy-five percent of the task will be accomplished.

**Questioner:** If the decision is made then will everything automatically happen just that way?

**Dadashri** : Once You make the decision ( _nischaya_ ), all the energies will turn in that direction. If you decide you want to go down stairs then the decision will take you down each of the steps stairs carefully.

**Questioner:** The decision is definitely there.

**Dadashri:** There is no problem if the decision is made. Everyone's decision is certainly there, so then there is no problem whether he lives in them seventy percent or by sixty percent. As the Self, say five times every day, 'It is my firm decision to definitely remain in the Agna, no matter what happens.' Having done this if they could not be followed, then 'we' allow You a bonus. But, no one makes such a decision at all.

## How brilliant Dada is!

**Questioner** : There is no penalty against us for not being able to remain in the Agna that You have given us.

**Dadashri** : That too, for those who want to remain in them a hundred percent, but are not able to do so; then if they ask for forgiveness, then that is as good as having followed them.

**Questioner** : That is an added benefit.

**Dadashri** : Yes, an added benefit, a secondary benefit to the one who wants to remain in the Agna. But this is not for anyone who wants to be shameless, for anyone who wants to tell lies or who wants to do negative things. 'We' take on the responsibility for those who want to remain in them but are not able to do so. How much more leeway can 'we' give? If one cannot attain _moksha_ after so much freedom, then there is no solution for it, is there?

It is not a problem if You cannot remain in the Agna completely, but if you remain outside of the Agna (not follow the Agna at all), then I am not responsible for that. That is the rule, is it not? How can I come to take care of you? You have been given these Agna and all the freedom. Have 'we' left anything out? Have 'we' not given you freedom to even watch movies?

**Questioner** : You have given us the freedom to watch movies but we have lost interest in them.

**Dadashri** : Whatever you may say; everything to enjoy has been kept with you but I have kept the 'keys' with me. That is the greatest wonder of this Akram Vignan.

It is possible to get Your work done if You remain 'our' Agna, and the Agna are easy, they are not difficult. You are free to eat and drink whatever you like, nothing will touch You in the city of Bombay which is full of illusory attachment ( _moha_ ). You will not feel like buying anything or you will not feel attracted to anything even if you are in the Fort area (high end shopping center of Bombay). Before you used to grope around here and there, but now that attraction has gone away.

The worldly life will go on but it will not have any effect on You and You will be able to get Your work done. You just have to remain 'our' Agna.

## The liability lies with the one giving the Agna

Nothing will affect You if You remain 'our' Agna. That is because whose responsibility is it? One would say that it is of the one giving the Agna. So does the responsibility sticks to the one who gives the Agna? No. He is doing it for the good of others ( _parhetu_ ). Hence it does not stick to Him and the work will be done and everything will dissolve.

Otherwise, this enlightened vision ( _samyak_ _darshan_ ) would not happen even once in a hundreds of thousands of lifetimes. And yet You have attained it so naturally and easily, free of cost. You are enjoying the bliss while living with your wife and without having done any penance or renouncing anything. So enjoy this _lahvo_ (pleasure in the relative, bliss as the Self) now. This is the _lahvo_ of Akram.

## Swachhand ceases with Agna of Gnani Purush

**Questioner** : But we have now met the Gnani Purush, have we not?

**Dadashri** : So then all has been cleared for You. If You remain 'our' Agna, then it is 'our' liability. After meeting the Gnani Purush, if You remain His Agna, then _swachhand_ (to be guided by intellect and ego and desire of the self) does not remain at all. Does it?

When you remain the Agna 'we' have given You, your _swachhand_ is considered gone. Acting according to your own wisdom is gone. Not following the Agna fully is a different matter. But what is Your vision now? You do not agree with that, your decision is to remain the Agna. What is your inclination? You are dependent on the Agna and so there is no _swachhand_ and this state of ours is one where _swacchand_ has gone away; no overwiseness remains any longer. That is why whosoever has met me, and who follows the Agna, his _swachhand_ too has goes away. The disease called _swachhand_ has been eradicated.

Here, those who have attained this Gnan remain in 'our' Agna twenty four hours. That is why the worldly life does not bind them. Otherwise the worldly life is always in the form of bondage. When one follows the Agna, his _swachhand_ does not exist even for a moment. That is why 'we' say that _moksha_ has come in the palm of your hands. This _swachhand_ is gone one hundred percent. That is _moksha_. You have your own _moksha_ with You; I do not have your _moksha_. It should be attained here, in this very life. From the moment You remain in 'our' Agna, You have your _moksha_. Until now you have not followed a Gnani's Agna. Had you done so, _moksha_ would have happened inevitably. He who follows the Agna, his _swachhand_ will stop.

## Awareness as the Self remains naturally

**Questioner:** Is it necessary to practice anything else to maintain constant awareness as the Self?

**Dadashri:** Awakened awareness ( _jagruti_ ) as the Self remains constant. There is no need to practice anything else, except it should be Your firm decision that, 'this awareness as the Self must remain constantly'. Why do you feel that it is not constant and continuous? You should investigate the causes, which are creating the obstruction. Therefore, awareness as the Self does remain constant but your energy of decision ( _nischayabud)_ is needed. If you say, 'awareness does not remain', then it will not. If You say, 'awareness must remain, why would it not?', then it will remain. And the obstacles will not come either. You just remain in _satsang_ – company of the Self.

## Plus the Agna is fresh

It is very good for those who have attained this Gnan from 'us' that the five Agna are fresh; just like fresh food! One does not know how old other agna are; they are so many years old. Whereas these are very fresh and wonderful and so enjoyable to 'eat'! There is no better _moksha_ than following the Agna.

One is said to have understood the Gnan when he follows the Agna. And the one who does not remain the Agna has not understood the Gnan at all _._ Gnan can be endless, but it is worthless if he does not remain the Agna.

## Awareness to remain in the Agna is needed

Know only the Gnan you have known from Dada. You may feel in your mind that there is still a lot more yet to know. No, there is nothing more to know. Know only what you have been told by Dada. Otherwise, if one tries to do something else, he will forget the main thing.

For us, remaining in the five Agna is verily _moksha_ ; the rest is considered interference ( _dakho_ ). Whether You can remain to a greater or a lesser extent is immaterial, but the awareness ( _laksha_ ) of the Agna must remain. When one is driving on the road, he is aware ( _laksha_ ) of what the traffic rules are. He is aware of them; otherwise he will collide. That collision is visible, but this other collision, consequence of not remaining in Agna, is not visible, is it? This too is subject to severe crushing. This, people are not able to know.

## Only the _nischaya_ is required for the Agna

There is no problem if you cannot remain the Agna but it should not be in your mind that you don't want to remain them. Have the firm decision of, 'I want to remain in the Agna; come what may'-this is _nischaya_. Thereafter, if you cannot, then You are not at fault. You have made the decision that you want to remain in them; then I am responsible for that! After that, if you cannot remain in them, then the responsibility for that will come over 'our' head. You made the decision and then you cannot remain, then who is at fault in this?

I am not saying that You have to remain all the five Agna. It is more than enough if You can remain in even one. You have to decide that, 'I want to remain in the five Agna.' That decision of Yours must be made so tenacious, that it will not be breached even for a day. And you must never be opposed to this.

## Five Agna keep You constantly as the Self

**Questioner** : How can one constantly remain in the Self?

**Dadashri** : If You remain in the five Agna given to You, then You will remain constantly as the Self, will You not? If You constantly follow the five Agna for a day, then for that day You will become Dada. I remain in the five Agna and so do You. Hence, if You remain the five Agna for one day, then You become Dada for that day. If you remain in them for two days, You become Dada for two days. I have You remain in the same Agna that I remain in, Myself. I do not have to remain in the Agna, they are natural to Me. Agna are Mine only, but I am making You walk on the same path that I have taken; it is no different. So it is a short cut, otherwise how can there be another shortcut?

## Only the One with great merit karma receives special Agna

You should not feel that you are being made to do _satsang_ the whole day, every day. You should think to such an extent that, 'Oh ho ho! I received the Agna! Otherwise, from where would one get Agna these days! Today I received Dada's Agna (a special Agna; not the five Agna generally referred to)!'

We all want to do it for the love of it. We want to do it for our own Self. Agna is _dharma_ (duty, religion) and that itself will bring _moksha_. If you come here from a faraway place and within an hour I do a _vidhi_ and tell you to go back, you should be elated that, 'Wow! I received an Agna! So I will follow it without fail.' You have to decide that. What a joy you will experience at that time! What would You do here?

**Questioner** : I would say to myself what Dada says is correct and would leave.

**Dadashri** : No. But that is meaningless, at that time you do not benefit from that.

**Questioner** : Yes, that understanding should be there.

**Dadashri** : 'I have received an Agna! An Agna which otherwise I would never receive in my life.' That is how valuable an Agna is. Nowhere will I be refused or turned back. That is why I received the Agna. How bright my merit _karma_ ( _punyai)_ must be that I have received an Agna!' One should feel tremendous joy within. The thought should be that 'Wow! I received an Agna today!' He looks at its reason, that the Gnani's Agna is _dharma_ (duty) and that verily is _tapa_ (penance). Acting as per one's own desire is danger in itself. When one does not remain in the Agna, it means that he is doing it according to his own wishes. Follow it, the special Agna, if you want to, but to do it against your will – there is so much danger in it! In doing so, it may someday lead to dislike towards Dada. Agna is considered the greatest gift. Who would receive one? 'I came all the way from Baroda to do the _darshan_ , having gone through so much difficulty; and then Dada says this!! How great must be my _punyai_ (merit _karma_ )! He would not do that otherwise, would he? Dada would not say that even if one were crazy. Is He one to say so? But how great is my _punyai_ , that I received the Agna!' Grave demerit _karma_ are destroyed; one can attain _moksha_ through following the Agna. Therefore understand Agna. The Lord has said that Agna is verily _dharma_ and Agna is verily penance ( _tapa_ ). One should not act according to his own understanding.

**Questioner** : Then it is not his responsibility if he follows the Agna of the Gnani.

**Dadashri** : Leave aside responsibility issue. One only wants to do things according to his own understanding. Giving way to one's own understanding (intellect) will not work. One has to go when Dada says so, but if he does so with a frown on his face, it becomes worthless. To act according to one's own thought, and as one wills ( _dharana, dharyoon_ ), is called _swachhand_.

One will feel awed his whole life if he has been given an Agna of celibacy ( _brahmacharya_ ). The worth of that Agna will be tremendous. Do you understand the value of Agna somewhat? If one realizes the value of it, then that is the time when real penance is called for and that is where joy is.

**Questioner** : I feel that we should remain Dada's Agna and I also feel bad for not being able to remain in them.

**Dadashri** : You have not understood the value of that Agna.

**Questioner** : One is sure to follow it, if he understands it.

**Dadashri** : Have your _pratikraman_ started now? Does all that happen? Has some awareness arisen, within?

**Questioner** : Yes, some has but not as much as it should.

**Dadashri** : There was nothing but restlessness before. That worldly awareness was a lot, and so this Gnan awareness would not arise, would it? As the restlessness in worldly interaction goes down, this awareness of the Self, arises.

**Questioner** : As I able to remain in Dada's Agna, along with taking adjustments with everyone at home, when all that happens, the awareness will increase afterwards right?

**Dadashri** : Then everything will fall into place, until then it will not, will it? One continues to act according to the dictates of the mind ( _mati_ ). Find out all the mistakes you have made so far.

Even if 'we' give you the Agna to play cards, you should follow that Agna. Value is not in playing cards; value is of following the Agna. If you say 'no', then it is all over. With Agna You get everything. 'Our' Agna verily is _dharma_ (duty; religion), and it verily is _tapa_ (penance). If Dada tells the two of you to go to sleep, you should go and as you are going, in your mind you should believe, 'I got an Agna. I got Dada's Agna! Today I received Agna!' What is the essence of the world? It is Agna. Then if He tells you eat twice as much, you should eat twice as much. And if He tells you not to eat, then do not eat.

**Questioner** : But one should remain in the Agna.

**Dadashri** : When you get an Agna, the whole night long You should experience tremendous joy over it; that is how it should be. It is very difficult to receive an Agna; one does not get one.

**Questioner:** Even one word coming from the Gnani Purush should be accepted as Agna (special instruction to be followed).

**Dadashri:** Even so, this specific Agna when given is special and exclusive! Scripture writers have clearly written about Agna "Agna verily is _dharma_ (religion; duty). Agna verily is _tapa_ (penance)" Everything is included in this. Do you have the deep inner intent ( _bhav_ ) to remain in Agna, constantly? What if I tell you to go to Ahmedabad, right now, what would you do?

**Questioner:** I would leave.

**Dadashri:** Immediately? Agna would help a lot. It would be good if You remain in the Agna as much as possible. Therefore, the value is of the Agna only. If You were to get an Agna today, bliss will be there the whole day, after that it does not matter whether you had been asked to leave from here, but You received such Agna, did You not? There is much internal empowerment ( _khumari_ ) because of it. Because it verily is _dharma_ and _tapa_ , all the rest of the things you do are not _dharma_ or _tapa._ That five Agna that You remain in is _dharma_ , and the special one You receive and follow is greater _dharma_.

**Questioner** : There is tremendous bliss when I follow the Agna you have given to me.

**Dadashri** : It is not your responsibility; it is 'ours'. And that verily is _dharma_ ; that verily is bliss and joy.

**Questioner** : And it is easier to follow and remain in it, when You tell us to do so.

**Dadashri** : It is easy for the one who wants to remain in it.

**Questioner** : Dada, when one follows the Agna, then follower becomes the Self?

**Dadashri** : He begins to serve causes for becoming the Self. Whatever percentage, seventy percent or sixty percent.

**Questioner** : So then it means that he does not remain in the Agna, for the rest of the time, does it not? Because he, the self, is going his own way.

**Dadashri** : Everything gets ruined when one does it in his own way; that is _swachhand_. It is to act according to one's own 'wisdom'(intellect). He will not realize it now, but he will when it gives its fruit (effect).

**Questioner** : Dada, what is it that when you give the special Agna, there is no opposition to it, there is penance, and the grandeur ( _dhanyata_ ) of it is not felt?

**Dadashri** : It is because there is lack of understanding. If I received one Agna, I would not be able to sleep the whole night. 'I got an Agna!' There will be joy from it. 'We' do not get the Agna but if an Agna were received, I would consider it as wondrous fortune. You may get _vidhis_ and other blessings, however a special Agna is very very rare.

**Questioner:** What will be the result of that, Dada? What is the result if one follows an Agna enthusiastically?

**Dadashri:** That verily is _moksha_ \- liberation.

**Questioner:** And if he follows them unenthusiastically and without having any choice, then what will be the result?

**Dadashri:** It is meaningless to follow it grudgingly. It is like tying up a buffalo and mercilessly pulling it to a vet, while flogging its behind. Where can one find the Agna of the Gnani Purush? People sit here waiting to receive Agna from Me. They would ask me to give them the Agna.

Serving an Agna is the same as serving Dada! To serve the Agna and to serve Dada is one and the same.

**Questioner:** Is Agna superior to _seva_ (service)?

**Dadashri:** Agna is higher. That verily is _seva_ of Agna. That verily is _seva_ of Dada. Everything else is futile. Did you understand that well? I told him, 'Go, 'Dada' will talk to you. He will say very helpful and wonderful things.'

**Questioner** : Has Lord Mahavir not said that Agna verily is _dharma_?

**Dadashri** : All the Gods have said the same. Agna has tremendous energy and power; it can remove all kinds of 'disease'. How much benefit there is in joyfully following a single Agna!

All these young men and women are able to practice celibacy ( _brahmacharya_ ) because of the special Agna, otherwise they will not be able to do so. If one tries to be wise and do it on his own, he will be finished. Agna means absence of one's own interfering intellect. If indeed it were wisdom, then we would not have this current state of madness, would we? But these men are crazy, and so are the women; they are all suffering, are they not? When Agna comes, it will remove all the pain. Agna is living energy ( _chetan_ ). Otherwise, how would these young men be able to practice celibacy? Agna means it will be present during any situation and it will give the necessary protection. Normally one would not receive any Agna. People have received the five Agna, but no one would receive special ( _vishesh_ ) Agna.

**Questioner** : Dada, I forget about the five Agna that you have given us and so that weakness remains.

**Dadashri** : It will come gradually. Before, _niddhidhyasan_ (internal visualization of Gnani and Gnan), was difficult for you, no? It will come when the obstacles are destroyed. All those things are going to come.

**Questioner** : But for now, all the time is being wasted.

**Dadashri** : No, time does not go to waste. When you put something to cook, is that time wasted? Be assured that no time is being wasted. For the one who does not want to waste time, his time does not go to waste. Do You have good _niddhidhyasan_?

**Questioner** : Yes Dada, just the way I want.

**Dadashri** : And if you receive an Agna, it is more than enough. Consider it a fortunate day when you receive an Agna. Your intellect ( _buddhi_ ) will show you that your time is being wasted; seat that intellect aside. Anything done heartily (sincerely) will never go to waste. It is necessary to become strong in following of the five Agna; nothing else.

**Questioner** : Has Dada given us everything or is he holding back something else to give?

**Dadashri** : I have given You everything, nothing is left to give. Do you feel that there is still something lacking? Do you have a shortage of snack or something on the way? I have not given you something that you will run out of. You are not going to run out of anything all the way to _moksha_. But You should open the package and eat as instructed. You have been given the five Agna, open that package only and eat.

**Questioner** : And we keep getting something new every day.

**Dadashri** : It is new, but it continues to help You in that which has been given to You initially. It helps You in what You have already been given. All these are new things; there are all kinds of new things in Akram Vignan as you go further in it.

## Agna removes _koosang,_ detrimental influence

I gave You these five Agna when I gave You this Gnan. They were given to You for You to do _abhyaas_ (to study, practice and progress). This worldly life ( _sansaar_ ) is the result of practice ( _abhyaas_ ). The _abhyaas_ of the worldly life has resulted in _adhyaas_ (to move away from the Self). Why did it become as _adhyaas_? Because one did _abhyaas_ of the other (of the worldly life, in the past life) so now one will become free by doing this _abhyaas_ (of following and remaining in the five Agna).

**Questioner:** Thus _purnata_ (the full or the absolute state) continues to happen by itself. At what point does our inner state ( _parinati_ ) has to be in order to attain _purnata_?

**Dadashri:** It is dependent upon following the Agna, nothing else. If one's inner state is based on following the Agna, then he will reach the final state. That is all; nothing else is necessary. The one, whose goal is to remain in the Agna, will find himself automatically on the unimpeded path towards total liberation – the final _moksha_. He does not need to do anything. He does not need to seek any other _darshan_ (of Dadashri). He does not need to read anything. If he is following the Agna, he does not even need to meet Dada in person.

**Questioner:** Meeting You should be there. That is included in the Agna too.

**Dadashri:** The only reason to meet Dada is to get the work done faster. And if one was to be around me for six months, his work will be done faster, will it not? His work will be done a lot quicker.

For You, following the Agna is verily Dada. A direct one-to-one meeting is another matter. When You remain the Agna, it will be fine even if Dada is not around. The value is of the Agna. The direct meeting is only to receive the direct energies. The energies are received indirectly through the Agna, and here the energies are direct.

**Questioner:** Is _satsang_ for the sole purpose of following the Agna?

**Dadashri:** Everything is meant for You to remain in the Agna. With _satsang_ (to be with the eternal Self; gathering of _mahatmas_ to study Gnan) all _karma_ become weak; they lose their hold over you. This makes it easier for You to follow and remain in Agna. How does a person look after he has had a bath? His laziness and fatigue departs, he looks fresh, does it not? Likewise all fatigue leaves after _satsang_. The worldly life interaction ( _sansaar_ ) is nothing but sheer _koosang_ \- that which takes one away from the Self. One has no choice but remain in it, even when one dislikes it.

**Questioner:** Dada, please explain how these five Agna are interlinked and work in favour of the pure Self - _Shuddhatma_?

**Dadashri:** The five Agna is protection. Otherwise the environs of _koosang_ will devour you and everything of yours. These Agna protect you from that. These Agna do not affect the Self in any manner. As it is, in the home or at the office, in the current era of this time cycle of Kaliyug, there is _koosang_ everywhere. Nothing touches the One who follows these Agna. He remains in _samadhi_ – the bliss of the eternal Self.

## Agna are not to be recited

**Questioner** : So should one keep the five Agna as naturally as he can remember? Or should one not try to think ( _manan_ ) on them or recite them?

**Dadashri** : One cannot think repeatedly ( _manan_ ) on them. How can he deep thinkng on Agna's attributes? The mind is physical. 'You' no longer have the living mind ( _chetan_ _mana_ ). Where will you go with this kind of overuse of intellect ( _dahapan_ )'? The mind that you have now, it is physical mind. Now can there be any compatibility with something that is physical (mind) and something that is _chetan_ – living energy? Will it ever coexist?

**Questioner:** No.

**Dadashri:** The _chetan_ (living, animate) mind, which was not truly _chetan_ but rather it was _power_ - _chetan_ (energized in proximity-presence of the Self ); it too is gone now, separated from You. You have now attained something that one could never attain in this world, so now remain in our Agna; that is all. And are the Agna easy or difficult?

## Gnani's closeness is verily moksha

Tell me, how many hours old is our familiarity ( _parichaya_ ) with each other? Mainly your familiarity is with worldly people; for that you used to spend the whole life. You used to do it to attain the path of liberation by the _kramik_ path. But here it is to receive cash (instant) _moksha_. You used to spend your whole life on that other path of _moksha_ , on which you may even get lost. So should you not be familiar with the giver of this direct _moksha,_ the Gnani Purush?

To attain Gnan means that You have become free from worldly familiarity ( _loka parichaya_ ). Yet it is necessary for You to have a deep inner intent ( _bhaav_ ) to get maximum familiarity ( _parichaya_ ) with the Gnani Purush. Always, whether you are coming or going, whatever familiarity you gain, that is Your gain.

**Questioner:** The problem is my health remains a little weak so I cannot take benefit of Dadashri ( the Gnani Purush) and that is an obstacle.

**Dadashri:** It is like this, as many days You get the benefit of this Dada, it is all good. So you must take as much benefit as you can of Dada. When he comes here, come and get the benefit immediately. And until You see Him again, You should remain in _niddidhyasan_ (Visualization of the Gnani and His Gnan). Who is Dada? Dada will be present through _niddidhyasan_ , but Agna (Gnani's instructions that sustain the enlightened state after the Gnan _Vidhi_ ) is the real Dada. Your main goal should be remaining in Agna only; nothing else is worth doing. What you see is not Dada. 'We' (The Gnani Purush) have become separate from this Dada (Dada Bhagwan, the fully enlightened Self). When you think of 'Dada', he will be with You only.

**Questioner:** Have you become separate from this Dada too?

**Dadashri:** I remain separate, that is why you all get the benefit. Here , whosoever remembers Dada, he gains. Do 'we' not say that, 'we' are separate'? This Dada (A. M. Patel-Gnani Purush) is not that Dada (Dada Bhagwan, the fully manifested Lord within). This (the physical body of the Gnani Purush A. M. Patel), is a 'public trust'! Whosoever gets his hands on it; it is his. It is not in even 'our' hands.

## Akram's flywheel

If the Agna's flywheel turns one hundred and eighty-one degrees, things will start to move forward. You have to make the deposit for up to one hundred and eighty. When it becomes one hundred and eighty-one, then it will turn on its own force. If these huge flywheels are turned upwards just half the way, then they will turn the remaining half with their own momentum. Similarly this too will turn the other half through its own force. You have to apply the force just up to that point; that is all. Thereafter, the whole wheel will turn naturally and spontaneously ( _sahaj_ ).

Therefore, you have no reason to worry once it reaches one hundred and eighty-one (degrees). It will then turn on its own. 'We' had discovered this at a young age as to up to what point we have to turn it out of the whole three hundred sixty degrees. Thereafter we discovered that once it reaches one hundred eighty-one degrees, it turns on its own.

We have flywheels like these in the mills, do we not? Similar is the flywheel of Akram. The flywheel of Akram will not go up, but Your work is done when You take it to one hundred and eighty one.

People still ask how they can remain in the Agna one hundred percent. I tell them, you don't have to remain in it a hundred percent, why don't You remain in them by just eighty percent?! The person of eighty percent asks me how he can remainin it by eighty percent. I tell him to remain in it sixty percent. Follow fifty one percent and I will make up the rest of the forty nine percent. It is because I have seen it. There was a flywheel in a mill. They would turn it up half way then it would turn on its own momentum, provided it goes up to fifty-one and not at just fifty. And if it were to stop at forty-nine, it would turn back. There must be some such "helping" in this world; there is always some help behind any task. If you are not aware of the help, then you are not considered a scientist. I go as far as to tell you that you will not meet Dada like this again and again and you will not get this Dada's Gnan again. You will not get to see this Akram Vignan again, so get your work done at fifty one percent. Otherwise there is no time in this world. At present it is only this - the second day moon of _moksha_ has arisen; now the third and fourth day should happen. Therefore get your work done now.

## Only awareness is needed

**Questioner** : Why does it not become natural and spontaneous ( _sahaj_ ) like this for the Agna?

**Dadashri** : That is one's weakness.

**Questioner** : What weakness?

**Dadashri** : Weakness of the awareness, one has to apply some _upyoga_ , awakened awareness, should he not?

One man was doing the Charan _Vidhi_ lying down. He took two and half hours to do the _vidhi_ , which would normally take him twenty-five minutes if he did it sitting up and awake. Why is that?

**Questioner** : He would nod off to sleep in the middle of it.

**Dadashri** : No, laziness ( _pramad_ ) arises so then he forgets how long he has been saying it and so he says it again. Our Vignan is so wonderful that no interference will happen. Do you experience some of that?

**Questioner** : It is not easy to remain in all the five Agna at the same time, is it? That other worldly things pulls the mind away from them.

**Dadashri** : What is so difficult in 'seeing' the _Shuddhatma_ (pure Soul) in every living being as you are walking along? What is so difficult? If the doctor tells you not to eat with your right hand for eight days, then remembering that is the only work you have, is it not? If you do not maintain that awareness, then your right hand will end up going there. Since eternity, you have had the practice of doing the wrong thing.These are very powerful five sentences (Agna). They are very basic to understand, but basic is very difficult, one will understand them gradually. They seem very easy, and they are easy, but there are many other obstacles, are there not? When there are all kinds of thoughts going in the mind, clouds of entanglement and entaglement are happeneing within, then how can one 'see' the relative and the real?

**Questioner** : Dada, following these five Agna of Yours, are they not rather difficult?

**Dadashri** : It is only difficult to remain in the Agna, because past _karma_ keep pushing you and shoving you. It is because of the past _karma_ that you get to eat _doodhpak_ (sweetened milk with nuts, cardamom and saffron) today. Then you ask for more, overeat, and so then 'dozing' (sleepy from eating too much, leading to clouding of awareness) happens and you are not able to remain the Agna. Now, this is the Akram path. In the _kramik_ path, one progresses towards _moksha_ by discharging his _karma_. He dissipates his _karma_ ; he suffers the _karma,_ gains the experience and then moves forward. Whereas, here in Akram, _karma_ have not been discharged. So You have to say to him, 'Dear fellow, remain in these Agna and if you are not able to, then there will be a delay of up to four more lives, but what are you going to lose in that?'

## Agna protects the Self

If there is a loop hole in following the Agna, then there will be damage. If there is a large gap in the fence, the cattle will come and graze everything in the farm, so protection is the first thing we need, do we not?

**Question** : Are the Agna the protection, themselves?

**Dadashri** : It is the greatest protection of all. Gnan has manifested and on the outside these five Agna are given for its protection. If it is kept 'full' (full adherence to the Agna) for about two to four years, then it is enough. Then whatever remains thereafter; it will become natural and spontaneous. Then You do not have to be so careful. Just as young plants need to be nurtured till they mature, then there is no need to care for them.

**Questioner** : Dada, this firm decision ( _nischaya_ ) of following the five Agna, what does it come under?

**Dadashri** : All that does not go into the Self, it is for the protection of the Self. It is considered as _pudgal_ – the non-Self part.

**Questioner** : So is it placed there so that the _pudgal_ does not become one with the Self?

**Dasdashri** : So that it does not become one with it and so that the external environment does not touch the Self. It is a protecting fence between the two. It is a fence; that is all.

**Questioner** : Just in case if we become one due to our unfolding _karma_ , then they (five Agna) help us if we have such a firm decision ( _nischaya_ ).

**Dadashri** : Yes, they protect you during unfolding of _karma_. Unfolding of _karma_ will not touch you at all if You remain the five Agna. Nothing will touch the One who wants to remain the five Agna.

**Questioner** : Dada, does following the Agna a hundred percent mean a hundred percent applied awakened awareness ( _upayog_ )?

**Dadashri** : One can never remain in them a hundred percent. Have I not said that it is more than enough if You can remain in them even by seventy percent? One is considered to have become a God, if he can remain in it a hundred percent.

**Questioner:** So Dada, does this mean that wherever we miss following Agna, we are missing the _upayog_ (applied awakened awareness as the Self), in that instance?

**Dadashri** : Of course, you missed it! You don't need to worry about that too much. Now you have to focus on how to make progress. You are bound to miss it; mistakes are bound to happen. However many mistakes you 'see', that many mistakes will leave, giving you that much energy ( _shakti_ ). The weakness was due to the mistakes. The energy of the Self will arise due to dissipation of mistakes. Mistakes are your superior; no one else is your superior. The blunder of 'I am Chandulal' is gone!

Our Gnan is such that it starts to become natural by itself. As time passes, it comes into naturalness. You just have to make a firm decision that You want to remain in 'our' Agna. Whether You can remain in them or not, that is not the issue. You must decide that You do not want to miss the Agna. Thereafter if you happen to miss any, then You are not responsible for that. In this _Dusham kaal -_ the current time cycle of lack of unity in thought-speech and action - if this much freedom is not granted then who will attain _moksha_ (liberation)?

**Questioner:** I do forget to remain in the Agna occasionally, but I do feel that I definitely want to remain in them for sure.

**Dadashri** : You must do _pratikraman_ for the time you forget. It is not your fault when you forget to remain the Agna. I have given You the solution, that you must do _pratikraman_ , when you remember that you forgot the Agna, as follows 'Dada, I couldn't remain in your Agna. Two hours have gone completely useless. Please forgive me. I will not make such a mistake again.' Even if you say this much, everything is approved. 'We' will give you hundred percent grades, not ninety-nine. Now what more do you want?

If you remain in the Agna, then your work will be done naturally. And that is why people say, 'Dada, my work is done with your grace.' Hey you! Grace ( _krupa_ ) is not involved in this. Grace is bestowed only occasionally, when there is a problem. This is a Vignan- science. If one remains in the Agna, his work is done naturally.

## Numeral 'one' on a blank slate is always clear and clean!

So understand it methodically. What happens when one tries to solve his complex entanglement by himself? If he remains in the Gnani Purush's Agna, then he will experience s _amadhi_ (bliss of remaining as the Self) right now. But he cannot remain in the Agna, can he? How can he? His past gnan (knowledge before Gnan _Vidhi_ ) entangles him, does it not? If the past knowledge is fractured, then there would be no interference.

It is possible for one to be constantly in _samadhi_ if he follows the Agna 'we' have given to him. Those Agna are not even difficult. Do You see any contradiction in them? Here, whoever has a clean slate; will have a quick solution. One has kept on studying books (scriptures). He would have been in a much higher state, had he not read those books. These books keep on creating entanglement ( _goonchwado_ ) for him.

'We' have given many people this Gnan and they all remain in _samadhi_ , because there is no interference of any kind, is there? He has realized that 'whatever I had believed in has turned out to be wrong based on what Dada is saying'. Therefore let's leave all that talk aside. Here, the one who does not understand anything will find the solution fast.

He has to remain in the Gnani Purush's Agna. He will constantly experience _samadhi_ if he follows the five Agna. 'We' write out a bond guaranteeing this. It is possible to experience constant _samadhi._ Do you remain in the Agna, at least some?

**Questioner** : Yes I do.

**Dadashri** : You will be blessed if You remain in them all. How much do you remain?

**Questioner** : I remain in them whenever I remember to do so, Dada.

**Dadashri** : When you remember it? Follow the five Agna with fervor. It is still possible now that you are going to live, so do something, otherwise how will you do it when you are not alive? How can you trust your body? Who will save you? This Gnan will go away, and so will your _moksha_ , if You cannot remain the five Agna, and then you will remain in this disorder and entanglement. Nothing will be attained by not following the Agna. Is this some kind of a falsehood? This is Vignan.

## When one does not remain in the Agna after attaining Gnan

**Questioner** : You give us the five Agna after you give us the pure Self ( _Shuddhatma_ ) in the Gnan _Vidhi_ and the awareness of the Self ( _laksha_ ) begins. What if one does not remain in the Agna at all, and proceeds believing that the _laksha_ that You have given, has been established? Will that work.

**Dadashri** : That awareness will leave. It will work for now, but it will gradually go away.

**Questioner** : So does he remain in the same place from where You 'lifted' him up?

**Dadashri** : No, not at the same place. He will all go on the wrong path. Yes, because he was better off where he was before. Here he has taken Gnan but he is not living in the Agna. There is danger in not following the Agna. He will go on to the wrong path. Many women are excluded from this. For women only _bhakti_ (devotion; reverence) prevails. Gnan does not reach them at all. They just have the _bhakti_ (reverence) for Dada. They will keep thinking about Dada the whole day long. That is why Krupadu Dev Srimad Rajchandra (Gnani Purush of the _kramik_ path) has said that Gnani Purush verily is one's own Self. Hence for women; whatever they have is a good thing. They will not understand the Agna very well.

**Questioner** : Do they remain only in _bhakti_ , devotion?

**Dadashri** : Yes. They remain in the _bhakti_. For men, there is danger in not following the Agna. There is protection through the Agna. What protects the experience ( _anubhav_ ), awareness ( _laksha, jagruti_ ) and conviction ( _pratiti_ )? The answer is Agna.

**Questioner** : So Dada, the importance is of the Agna, is it not?

**Dadashri** : Importance is verily of the Agna. That is why _dharmadhyan_ (absence of adverse internal meditation) arises externally with Agna and _shukladhyan_ ('I am pure Soul' state) within with _Shuddhatma_. So in this way One is in _dharmadhyan_ externally and _shukladhyan_ within. It is a different matter if one can remain the Agna to a greater or lesser extent, but the one who does not remain them at all, the one who has no awareness at all, you never know where he will be thrown off, do you? Because that awareness ( _laksha_ ) of _Shuddhatma_ , will gradually go away.

## Protection by the ticketless Dada

It is like this; it is enough for women to chant Dada's name ( _naamsmaran_ ). Men have to remain in the five Agna because they have the awareness, whereas women have less awareness. Men should make inner arrangement to remain in the five Agna.

**Questioner** : Dada is on our mind almost the whole day. We cannot forget Him at all.

**Dadashri** : This is something that one does not need to forget. On the contrary, the more one tries to forget, the more Dada will come to mind, and His protection is there to that point. Here, it is not the Gnan that is working; that is how immense Dada's protection is. It is always present. And because it is present all the time, it is ever protecting. What is the need for being present? It is so that nothing else (non-Self world) will take over, if the protection were not there.

**Questioner** : People liked what you said at the airport. You said, 'Dada with the ticket is leaving and the ticket-less-Dada is always with You.'

**Dadashri** : That is correct, ticketless Dada is with You only.

## He who understands Agna, has understood everything

**Questioner:** Between making a firm inner intent ( _bhav_ ) to remain in the five Agna and understanding the Agna accurately; which of these two gives results quicker?

**Dadashri** : If one understands Agna, then nothing is better than that! Having understood the Agna, one can remain it naturally. Nothing can be attained by following them without prior understanding. Still _mahatmas_ will attain at least something, since they are pursuing it.

**Questioner:** So now we have to understand the Agna in exactness and also the _Atma_ (the Self) which is in absolute form?

**Dadashri:** I have given you the Self. If one understands these Agna that means he has indeed understood the Self. So now, Agna is _dharma_ (duty; religion) and Agna is penance ( _tapa_ ). But you never do get any free time, do you?

**Questioner:** Agna is such a thing that time factor is not involved there.

**Dadashri:** Yes. Time factor is not involved in that.

**Questioner:** It is possible to continue following Agna by connecting the link again, from where it was broken.

**Dadashri:** Yes. You can connect.

**Questioner:** If one understands what Dada's Vignan is, then he can remain in the five Agna or is it that when he understands the five Agna first, then Dada's Vignan begins?

**Dadashri:** First one listens and understands Dada's Vignan, after that the five Agna are there for its protection. The five Agna protect the Vignan.

**Questioner:** Now when will I understand this mind-intellect- _chit_? It is possible to attain the applied awakened awareness of the Self ( _upayog_ ) on the mind-intellect- _chit_ , when one is completely in the five Agna?

**Dadashri:** There is no problem if such _upayog_ is not there. You don't need the mind or the intellect. If you remain in the five Agna then You have got it made. It is more than enough if You remain in the five Agna. There is no need for the mind and intellect, is there?

**Questioner:** Many times I think that if I understand Dada's Vignan first then it is possible to remain the Agna automatically.

**Dadashri:** You will be able to remain in them, if You want to in remain them. You make a firm decision to do so; then You will be able to remain. If You completely understand this Vignan then the energy to remain in the Agna will arise.

## Contracts of karma of past life create obstacles

**Questioner:** The Agna are not difficult. I try to remain in the Agna but sometimes I cannot remain in them.

**Dadashri:** The inability to remain in the Agna is not the result of Your wish at all. And yet You cannot, so someone's interference ( _dakhal_ ) is there. Now, on the one hand I am telling You that no one is there to interfere in your worldly interaction in this world, but since you had signed those agreements before, in the past life, they are the ones that are now creating the uproar and interference. Didn't you sign these contracts before attaining this Gnan?

**Questioner:** Yes.

**Dadashri:** So these are the very interference ( _dakho_ ) which you had created and now they are the ones arising as all the interference ( _dakhal_ ) . All that interference must end.

You all are ready to do _purushartha_. I know that You all are capable of doing _purushartha_ (remain in five Agna). Yet what is the reason that _purushartha_ does not commence? The things you had signed before, you had made agreements in the past, and so whichever agreement is due for payment, it will come before you. If you say, 'Hey! Why did you come now? I am in the middle of having a good time', it will say, 'No, pay up our account, then you can enjoy.'

**Questioner** : In that way, it will take very long time because a lot of account of _karma_ has to be paid off.

**Dadashri** : No, it is not going to take long. There is a rule for that, see how many mangos this mango tree has? If you try to count them, there will be no end but as soon as the month of _Ashadha_ (the ninth month of the _Vikram Samvat_ Indian Calendar) arrives, you will not see any mangos on the tree. So don't be anxious. Upon seeing these mangos, don't be worried that 'when will I reap and when will I count and when will it come to an end?' Don't count anything. There is a timing for that, so do not be afraid in those matters.

The creditors (account of _karma_ ) will come only at that time. At that time tell him, 'Come, now I have Dada. I want to settle all my contracts so come and collect your payments. Come and get it. Come all of you, why only four of you have come? I will make payments till midnight, but at least come and collect it.' You have no choice but to pay them off. Any work that you have no choice in but do, will interfere, and so you have to settle that first.

If someone tells you, 'Come and eat, you are hungry, are you not?' Tell him, 'Let me settle with this creditor, then I will sit down to eat in peace.' Then Your _purushartha_ will happen in a proper way, after the interference is gone.

I am showing You the same way through which my interferences ( _dakhal_ ) have been resolved and eradicaticated. I have 'seen' all the interferences that have now disappeared for 'me'. So this is the path I am showing You. And you do not see mangos on the mango tree in the month of _Ashadha_ , do you?

**Questioner:** No.

**Dadashri:** Why? There were so many, were there not? Oh, you could see them till the month of _Vaishakh._ After _Vaishakh_ the mangos will not stay up there, once the time is past, they will not stay on the tree. They do not have the pain of falling on the ground; none of them will stay up there. If there is no one to eat them, the birds will, but their end will come. So don't get upset about any interference. On the contrary when the time comes to pay off, You should say, 'welcome, come and quickly take your payment.' You made the agreements so you have to fulfill them, do you not? You complain, 'This is what I got. My mother-in-law is bothering me.' Hey you! You had such a contract with your mother-in-law so fulfill it! Is the mother-in-law harassing you? This is nothing but a contract that you had made. Whatever the agreement, you have to fulfill it, do you not?

**Questioner:** Yes.

**Dadashri** : So this is the stock of _karma_ that you had signed a contract for in the past life. You are not losing any _shuddha upayog_ (pure awareness as the Self) in this. Your energy of _saiyam_ (a naturally prevailing state free of _kashays-_ anger, pride, deceit and greed), will increase as the settlement of these accounts happens with equanimity. _Saiyam_ verily is the _purushartha_. And as _saiyam_ increases, settlement happens rapidly. And as settlement happens rapidly, _saiyam_ starts to increase. All this continues to happen automatically until it reaches _keval_ Gnan—absolute enlightenment.

You don't need to do anything. You want to remain in Dada's Agna, and that too if you cannot remain in them, then you don't need to worry about that. It should be Your firm decision ( _nischaya_ ) that You want to remain in the Agna. You must remain in the Agna. If you complain to me, 'Dada, my mother-in-law is scolding me.' Then you should decide in your mind before you see your mother-in-law; 'the file has arrived' and then You decide that you want to settle this file with equanimity through Dada's Agna and consequently if it does not happen then You are not responsible for it. You are only responsible for following the Agna.

You are responsible for Your firm decision ( _nischaya_ ); you are not responsible for those actions. What are You responsible for? You only have to have a firm decision ( _nischaya_ ) that You want to remain in the Agna. Then if you cannot remain in them and you end up slapping someone, you don't have to be remorseful about it. If you end up slapping someone, come to me the next day and ask me what you should do about it. I will show you how to do _pratikraman_ for it. Do _pratikraman_ for the _atikraman_ (aggression through thoughts, speech and acts) you did. You simply have to understand this path only, which is so straightforward, direct and easy to undertake.

## Ticket for the ultimate destination

**Questioner** : What is going to become of all these _mahatmas_ who are sitting here?

**Dadashri** : Whatever is going to become of them, it will happen. Dada is looking over them and they have attained the 'visa' from Dada, so they will end up at the 'station' of their choice.

**Questioner** : We have come to Dada. Dada has said that when one comes to Him, one will definitely go to _moksha_ in one or two life times. Then where is the point of going anywhere else?

**Dadashri** : At Palghar Station, 'we' have given everyone a ticket for Bombay Central station. So your station (destination) has been fixed. Now You will be able to go wherever you like. You will be able to disembark at any station on the way. (Palghar is the outermost of the suburbs in Bombay and the trains end at Bombay Central station with many suburban stations on the way, eg, Borivalli, Andheri, Dadar etc.)

The mind will prompt, 'Now, I will be able to go forward from here anyway'. So then he will get off at Borivelli. Therefore, one can go all the way to the final destination if he follows my Agna fully. However much he follows, his mind itself will tell him that he cannot remain in them fully, so then he gets off there in the middle. So some people will get off at Andheri and some at Dadar. I do not have to make them get off; they do it on their own.

**Questioner** : Will those who get off in the middle be able to proceed forward again?

**Dadashri** : They will if their _bhaavna_ (effect of one's _bhaav_ , intent from his past life-cause) is such. However, 'we' have given a ticket which will take One all the way. Yes, but it is valid for only a certain period of time.

**Questioner** : But how long is the ticket valid for?

**Dadashri** : It depends on which station one gets off, does it not? The One who follows the Agna by at least seventy percent has the ticket for all the way to the final destination.

Someday, look in the mirror and scold him (file No. 1), 'Why don't you straighten out now? You will not get the final station again'. In the _kramik_ path, each person gets off at his own station but then he has to buy a ticket for the station ahead. Whereas this is the ticket for the final station , and how much bliss there is in it?! There is restlessness and turmoil in the middle stations. So the train is not going to go further from here, the final station. So eat, drink and enjoy, and remain Dada's Agna.

## Agna without Gnan

**Questioner** : Dada, my question is, what is the difference between a person following the five Agna without attaining Gnan and the one following them after attaining Gnan?

**Dadashri** : No one can remain the five Agna at all without attaining Gnan, can he? How can he 'see' the 'real', the Self? And he cannot understand _vyavasthit_ as long as he cannot see the real, and settling with equanimity will not happen.

## Gnan without Agna

**Questioner** : What if one does not remain in the Agna after attaining Gnan?

**Dadashri** : What happens if one does not sow anything after the rains? Is anyone going to take away the ground? The ground remains the same, does it not? But one enjoys the bliss of _moksha_ by following the Agna.

**Questioner** : Do other mistakes happen when one does not remain in the Agna?

**Dadashri** : Nothing happens. The ground will not go away just because you do not sow anything after the rains. Your seeds go to waste.

It is like this; however much You remain in the Agna, You will reap the fruit by that much only. You have already attained the Self. Now the Agna is the protection around the Self; they are an absolute protection for the Self. Whatever protection You maintain, that is for You; otherwise some leakage will happen. Nothing of the Self will be lost, but some leakage will happen; you will not get the bliss of the Self that is coming to you and it will entangle you in the worldly life again. You will continue to experience suffocation, but when You remain in the Agna, You will not experience any suffocation and You will feel independent.

## Where there is Agans, there is Liberation from all misery

When You remain in these five Agna, even if there is war going on in your worldly life and hundreds of thousands of people are dying in it, You will not be affected by it.

This Vignan is such that worldly pain ( _dukha_ ) will not affect the one following the Agna. This is the first stage of liberation. And the second state of liberation comes upon _nirvana_ (ultimate liberation, no rentry in any body form). There are two stages of liberation ( _mukti_ ). When one attains the first stage of liberation, he becomes free from all pain. One will not be affected by anything if he follows 'our' Agna. He will not be touched by pain even when it is around him. He will experience _samadhi_ (bliss of being the Self) amidst _upadhi_ (external problems). In the midst of _aadhi_ (mental problems)- _vyadhi_ (physical problems)- _upadhi_ (externally induced problems), even if there is extreme _upadhi_ , one will experience _samadhi_. Such is this Vignan of the twenty-four Tirthankaras; it is extremely beneficial.

## The essence of all religions in the five Agna!

Now does _shuddha upayog_ (applied awakened awareness as the Self), come in our Agna or not?

**Questioner:** It does, of course.

**Dadashri:** So Agna is verily _shuddha upayog_ , is it not? What do You think? Or will 'we' need to improve the Agna again? Will we need to 'remold'—change them?

**Questioner:** Nothing is missing there.

**Dadashri:** Yes. These are the fundamental sentences. These sentences are such that they can save the entire world. These are with the separation of _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ ( _vyavahar_ \- relative; of the non-Self. _nischaya_ \- real; of the Self). Others (those who do not have Gnan), are either in one hole or the other.

That is it; all the (spiritual) Vignan of the entire world is included in these five sentences. Nothing is excluded at any place. All the scriptures are included in these five Agna.

**Questioner:** It is acceptable to say that these Agna are the essence of all the scriptures.

**Dadashri** : This is the essence of the entire world! This is the essence of Lord Mahavir's forty-five Agams! Everything is included in just the five Agna; 'we' are just saying all this for the understanding - to clarify things in detail. Otherwise if you look carefully, everything is included in them; nothing has been left out.

## Keep understanding the Agna

Did You understand the main thing; the five Agna? That is all, understand them in short and then start following them.

These are so many tools that one cannot say enough. One machine has so many parts that it is very difficult to put it together once you pull it apart. So then what would happen if you try to put this together to make it fit? Why don't You use it as is? Follow these five Agna and Your work will be done. They have to be understood. All of You have understood them completely and so do not delve deeper into it anymore; that is all. Deeper down, there is more intricate 'machinery'.

**Questioner** : You tell us to continue understanding it, so what do we have to understand?

**Dadashri** : Understand all this at the gross level so that Your work gets done without any problems. You will get confused if you try to understand too much.

**Questioner** : We will have to understand that sooner or later, will we not?

**Dadashri** : Yes, but that is what You have to understand, nothing else. When One is able to understand this much, everything will open up and he will be able to see very clearly. Eventually it will become completely clear. This can be achieved bit by bit.

**Questioner** : When does that happen?

**Dadashri** : When these five Agna are over, then everything clears up. Otherwise, at least you have become free from the worldly entanglements. You have been given these five sentences! Nothing extra is given to You, so there is no cause for any entanglement.

All the five Agna fit into one

**Questioner** : These five Agna that we have, they are numbered as one, two, three, four and five but when I think fully about just one Agna, then all the five fall into it.

**Dadashri** : All the five fit into one. But what is in each Agna is that there is fifty percent in the Agna that one is following, and the other fifty percent is of the remaining four. It is the same in all of them. So from whatever point You are 'seeing', You will see the results. Fifty percent adherence will come if You hang on to any one of the Agna. Then there will be some percentage from the remaining ones too. So they help everyone. This is a scientific method and this is all a Science.

## The Self and the non-Self are enveloped in the five Agna

**Questioner** : Yesterday it came up in _satsang_ that three of the five Agna refer to _vyavahar_ (worldly life interaction) and two of them are of _nischaya_ (real;of the Self). I want to understand that, please explain how?

**Dadashri:** To 'see' _Shuddhatma_ and to 'see' the 'packing' as relative; those two are of _nischaya_. The other three are of _vyavahar_ only. Those three address the worldly life interaction and these two, the Self. This path of ours is one of _vyavahar_ - _nischaya_ ; it addresses the _vyavahar_ as well as _nischaya_. From the real vision it is _Shuddhatma_ and from the worldly vision only the goat is seen. That is why those two Agna fall under _nischaya_ and the remaining three are for the worldly application. They keep a balance of both _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_. These five Agna will keep working all the way till You attain _moksha_. They are easy, straightforward, not crooked or complicated. You have not been asked to renounce anything at all.

## Based on the Agna, there is one more life

_Karma_ no longer can bind to You - the Self. The only exception is when You are following 'our' Agna, there _karma_ is charged. For that there will one more life.

**Questioner:** Are we to remain in the five Agna only as long as the Gnani is present (living) or are we to continue doing so even afterwards?

**Dadashri:** Even afterwards. They are to be followed forever.

**Questioner:** Will this link remain in the next two or three lives?

**Dadashri:** The link that was remaining from the past life will come to an end in this life and whatever is left in this life will finish in the next life.

For You, now You have to spend only one life in 'doing' this, remaining in the Agna. The next life will come automatically in accordance with You following the Agna. Your next life is dependent upon the Agna and the life that is based on Agna is one of magnificence and wonder. What is the causal basis for the next life? The Agna. It is the cause of the manifest Gnani and his Agna.

**Questioner:** You said that new _karma_ have stopped charging for me and that now only discharge remains. But You have also said that there is charging of _karma_ in following the five Agna that You have given us. Please clarify.

**Dadashri:** The five Agna are the charge themselves; because you are following our Agna. Because You are living by our Agna, because you are doing things in accordance with the Agna, there is that much charging but there is only a certain amount of charging. All other charging has stopped. And only for this much there will be one, two or three more lives.

## Faster progress through Agna

**Questioner** : What does a _mahatma's_ speed of progress depend on after attaining Gnan? What can he do to speed up their progress?

**Dadashri** : When he remains in the five Agna, it will speed things up and the five Agna is the very reason. As You live in the five Agna, the veil of ignorance begins to break and the energies manifest. The unmanifest energies begin to manifest. Godliness ( _aishvariya_ ) manifests by following the Agna. All kinds of energies manifest. It all depends on how much One follows the Agna.

To remain sincere to 'our' Agna is the most important quality. The one who becomes _abuddha_ (does not use his intellect) through our Agna, becomes like 'us', no? But only as long as he nurtures the Agna and also provided no changes are made in the Agna. Then there will be no problems.

If one follows the Agna through Gnan, then it will produce results everywhere and if one follows the Agna through his intellect, it will not give any results at all.

## Following the Agna pleases the Gnani

However much one follows 'our' Agna; it earns him that much of 'our' _rajipo_ , pleasing the Gnani, is there, without fail. If You have a firm decision that You want to remain in the Agna of the Gnani, then through the grace of the Gnani you will be able to do so. You will experience the bliss of the Agna when you remain in them.

**Questioner** : One can remain in the Agna through Your grace ( _krupa_ ), and following Your Agna earns him grace. Which of this is true?

**Dadashri** : With grace You can remain in the Agna, and if You can remain in the Agna, then it increases the grace.

**Questioner** : What comes first?

**Dadashri** : Pleasing the Gnani comes first.

**Questioner** : Does pleasing come with following the five Agna?

**Dadashri** : It happens for sure by following the five Agna. Otherwise it happens with staying around the Gnani and serving the Gnani – that will earn You the Gnani's _rajipo_.

I am very pleased that You are following 'our' Agna. Interference will happen if one does not remain 'our' Agna. There is no greater _dharma_ (duty) in the world than to please the Gnani Purush and it is in Your hands to please 'us'. As You go higher by following 'our' Agna, our _rajipo_ , towards You will increase.

Now, why is there a difference in the Gnani's grace? Why does the grace of the One who does not want anything, differ for different people? It is said that, 'When one has never fallen short in maintaing absolute humility ( _param_ _vinaya_ ) towards the Gnani Purush; that person is in the Gnani Purush's _dhyan_ (awareness here), the Gnani is aware that he has never fallen down from the state of absolute humility ( _param_ _vinaya_ ) to the state of humility ( _vinaya_ ). That is where the Gnani's extra grace flows. Because a person who has fallen from _param_ _vinaya_ to _vinaya_ , absolute humility to humility; there is no telling when he will fall down to complete lack of humility ( _avinaya_ ).

The only intent ( _bhaav_ ) that must remain is one of 'I want to always constantly live in the five Agna' – only this much of intent must remain within. There is no other grace of giving-receiving. There is no such thing as the one who massages 'our' legs receives more grace and the one who does not, receives none. One just needs to understand the inner intent ( _bhaav_ ) and absolute humility ( _param_ _vinaya_ ) and to have a firm desire to remain in the Agna exactly as prescribed by Dada. 'We' would recognize whether one's desire to do so is strong or weak. Would 'we' not know that? A teacher would have his grace on two to four students out of a class of twenty five to thirty students. He will be pleased with those students, who do as they are instructed for things like doing their homework, will he not? And with those he is displeased with, he will make them touch their toes and put a little stone on their back.

**Questioner** : Many times it is said that when one follows Your five Agna, _vishesh_ _krupa_ (special, extra grace) flows upon Him.

**Dadashri** : However much one follows 'our' Agna, he will receive that much grace.

**Questioner** : What is this _vishesha_ _krupa_ (extra, special grace)?

**Dadashri** : _Vishesha_ means complete, full. His work will be done.

**Questioner** : This extra special grace ( _vishesh_ krupa); is it of this Dada Bhagwan (within A.M.Patel) or is it of the 'Dada Bhagwan' within us?

**Dadashri** : Not mine, it is of Dada Bhagwan. I would tell Him, 'Give Him your grace; He follows the Agna wonderfully.'

You have to say, 'Dada, the weight of my worldly life is on Your head and Your Agna is on my head'.

**Questioner** : Can you tell me if I am following Your five Agna well or not?

**Dadashri** : You are living in them properly, you are following them well. It does not call for any scolding; you do not need to be scolded. You are following well and that is more than enough. Now if you ask me whether you are following them fully, then I say, 'it is not worth scolding.'

**Questioner** : Yes, I know that it is not easy to remain in the Agna completely.

**Dadashri** : Hey! Is it some child's play!? Otherwise a person would become Lord Mahavir! I have given these Agna and they are My own and I would be constantly remain within the Agna, no? I have given them, but still I cannot become like Lord Mahavir. But he (the _mahatma_ ) can become a Mahavir because the shelter is Mine, is it not? So the One who bestows the shelter cannot come in that state himself, but others can.

**Questioner** : How is that, Dada?

**Dadashri** : Yes, if one follows the Agna completely, then he will enjoy the state of Lord Mahavir and that state is higher than Mine. Those who remain in 'our' five Agna, they can become like Lord Mahavir.

Agna are relative-real

**Questioner** : The five Agna are not _pudgalik_ (non-Self, relative), are they not?

**Dadashri** : What is that _pudgal_ (non-Self complex; relative body) like? It is a _pudgal_ , but it is relative-real; it is not completely real. Only the Self is completely real. All the steps that lead to the Atma (Self) are relative-real.

## Follow Your goal, not the mind

**Questioner:** What should I do, when I make a decision to remain in the five Agna and get My work done by staying close to and near Dada and yet I fall short of that goal?

**Dadashri:** Just look at this! What do you mean by 'what should I do'? Your mind will tell you, 'Do it this way', then You should realize that this is contrary to your goal and will lead to a decrease in Dadaji's grace. So tell the mind, 'No, it has to be done according to My goal.' Having realized what earns You Dadaji's grace, You must make the arrangements accordingly.

All these problems arise because one does what the mind tells him. For a long time I have been talking on this topic. I keep explaining this very thing again and again. You should just remain in Your goal and not follow the mind. Otherwise there is no telling in which 'town' you will end up, instead of at Your main destination. To act in accordance with Your goal; that itself is called _purushartha._ How is the mind of the people in foreign countries? It is straightforward and the mind of Indians is filled with interference; it uses unnecessary intellect. Something or the other is drastically erroneous. So we have to become the master of our minds. Your mind should be such that it follows Your instructions.

**Questioner:** When the mind hears such talk it will remain and be subservient for fifteen to twenty days, but then something happens and it goes back to its old nature.

**Dadashri** : It is the mind that turns, why should 'You' turn? You are the very same; You never change, do You?

**Questioner:** Sometimes even following the Agna become natural and spontaneous.

**Dadashri:** Slowly and gradually they will become natural and spontaneous ( _sahaj_ ). They become natural for the one who wants to remain in them. His mind itself will become woven in that way. The one who has a _nischaya_ (firm decision) of following the Agna; he does not have any problems at all. This is the highest and supreme Vignan (science); and one in which there is uninterrupted _samadhi_ , The _samadhi_ does not go away whether someone is hurling insults,whether the business incurs a loss or even when one sees his house on fire.

**Questioner:** Does the _pragnya-shakti_ (liberating energy of the Self) increase to such an extent that all the Agna become woven within?

**Dadashri:** The Agna become woven. _Pragnya-shakti_ will grab hold of them all. These five fundamental sentences (Agna) are the essence of all the scriptures of the world.

## Discharge _moha_ goes away through Agna

No rituals are necessary for those who want to attain _moksha_. Those who want a life as a celestial being; those who want comforts – for them; rituals are necessary. Those who want to attain _moksha_ ; all that is necessary for them is the Gnan and the Gnani's Agna; they need just these two.

Gnani Purush's Gnan removes _darshan_ - _moha_ (right vision blocking _karma,_ charge _moha_ ) and Gnani's Agna removes _charitra_ - _moha_ ( right conduct blocking _karma,_ dischage _moha_ ). Therefore 'we' give You both, Gnan and the Agna. Gnani's Agna purifies the mind. Knowledge of the Self will give a satisfactory solution to the mind in any circumstances.

## He who does not have the slightest intellect is a Gnani

Our five Agna encompass everything; they include the Vignan of the whole world. There is so much energy in these five Agna, that the Lord's – the Tirthankara's all forty-five Agams are in them.

You have been given five Agna that include all forty-five Agams. So one is constantly devoted to the Agna. One should then remain in the Agna constantly; He should not fail to do so even for a moment. And living in the Agna is _moksha_ itself. That is because whose Agna are they? The Gnan of the Tirthankaras has come to be expressed through the medium of the Gnani Purush and that Gnani Purush's Agna is considered _moksha_. There are a 'dime-a-dozen' of these so called 'Gnanis' in India, but they cannot be called Gnanis. Anyone who has even an iota of _buddhi_ (intellect) cannot be called a Gnani. Who is considered a Gnani? It is the one who does not have _buddhi_ (absolutely devoid of intellect that interferes).

## Dada's Agna verily is one's everything

**Questioner** : I do not have enough _buddhi_ (intellect) or physical strength to raise any questions; if I receive Dada's protection; that is enough for me.

**Dadashri** : All this talk is such that if you say this on the outside (to non- _mahatmas_ ), it will not reach them; these talks are of a very different order. Such talks are not to be found in the world. Here we have discussions about the _Atma_ (Self) and of the _Paramatma_ (absolute Self); whereas on the outside they are talking about the Atma (Self) and the _pudgal_ (non-Self complex). So these talks that we have here can never be found outside, can they? If our talks do not reach and we keep on talking unnecessarily; what is the point in that? Just keep on listening and take the protection of the Gnani.

If you cannot understand, then the best protection is to say 'whatever happens of Dada-the absolute Self, may the same happen for me'. You should do what Dada tells You. If He tells you to stand up, then stand up. If He tells you 'don't marry', then say 'I will not marry'. If he tells you 'marry two women', then say 'I will marry two women'. With the Gnani, you should not interfere by saying, 'Sir, the scriptures have said no and you are telling me to marry two?' – If you do then you are unfit for _moksha_.

You cannot compare scriptures with the Gnani's Agna. Gnani is superior to the scriptures. Gnani is even superior to Gnan. You should remain the Agna he gives You. That is why 'we' give you the five Agna, do we not? These five Agna are not very difficult, are they?

**Questioner** : They are difficult if one believes so and they are also possible to follow. If one keeps absolute faith in You and if he becomes resolutely firm in his mind to remain the Agna; then nothing else remains to be done. The Agna are complied with.

**Dadashri** : And what if you are told not to eat sugar? What would everyone do if they are given an Agna not to eat sugar? Will it not be difficult to follow?

**Questioner** : No it will not be difficult.

**Dadashri** : What if one is told not to eat sugar? One ascetic had given an _agna_ (routine instruction from a master) to another ascetic like him, to not eat sugar. He did insist that the _agna_ be followed. That ascetic had willingly asked for the _agna_ ; 'someone give me one _agna_ '. So the other ascetic asked him 'what can you manage? Can you manage this...can you mange this?..can you manage not eating sugar?', so he replied 'I can manage not eating sugar'. So he took that _agna_. Forty years after he took this _agna_ , I met him. It so happened that we sat down to eat together. They were serving _shrikhand_ (sweetened creamy yogurt with nuts and saffron) for dinner. He told me that he had taken a vow of not eating sugar. So I thought that he will not eat _shrikhand._ But here came a large serving of _shrikhand_ for him and he ordered some molasses (jaggery), which he mixed in the yogurt and he ate it! That was fine too! Then he tells two or three people 'Do not ever take a vow to not eat sugar. I did so, and so be it but do not ever take such a vow.' So what would people do if they were given such a vow? What I have given is easy; it is not difficult at all. I have even given you the freedom to eat anything you like.

Do not take Agna from a Gnani Purush but if you take one, then remain it completely. Gnani's Agna are considered solid and will accomplish the goal ( _sachot_ ), without any adulteration. It is considered unadulterated. It will do Your work for You if You remain in them, but if you spoil it within, then it can also go bad. Do you eat jaggery? Jaggery in _shrikhand_? Now what would be so wrong if he did not eat the _shrikhand_ and just ate the daal-rice-vegetables instead? Then he tells others, 'Do not do anything like that. No one should take the vow of not eating sugar. I suffered a lot.' One can never say that when one has taken an _agna_.

It will spoil your mind; on the contrary it is better not to take the _agna_. And if you do take one, then keep it pure, keep it correct and be true to it.

The Gnani Purush is considered correct, like a Tirthankara. He has fallen short by only one to four marks, so there is nothing wrong in that. For the rest, he is correct like a Tirthankara. Just because he fell short, is there anything wrong with that? He became useful to all of you. How would he have been of any use to you, had he not fallen short?

## This Agna is of Dada Bhagwan

When one follows the Agna, it is not an Agna of A. M. Patel. It is of Dada Bhagwan Himself; the Lord of the fourteen worlds ( _lokas_ ). I give you the guarantee of that. All the talk comes to you through me, so You should remain my Agna. These five sentences (Agna) are also not of Lord Mahavir, they are not of Dada either; they have been there since the time of the _Vitarags._ Dada is just a _nimit_ (instrument, evidence) in giving them to You.

If a person follows these five Agna in 'our' presence or if he takes just one word of 'ours'; he will attain _moksha_. If he simply grabs on to just one word of this Akram Vignan and thinks deeply on it and reveres it, then it will take him all the way to _moksha_. Because this Akram Vignan is living knowledge ( _sajeevan gnan_ ); it is Gnan that is constantly working on its own. And this is a complete incontrovertible principle that accomplishes the ultimate ( _siddhant_ ). There is not a single sentence from books or scriptures in it. Hence if a person understands even one word of it, he will understand all the words.

## Who follows the Agna?

**Questioner** : What _purushartha_ does a _purush_ have to make?

**Dadashri:** _Purushartha_ in the form of Agna, what else? For You it is in the form of Agna and for 'me' it is without Agna. It is the one and the same. For You it is done with the Agna and for Me it is done without the Agna. As Your practice increases, in the end the Agna will slowly go away and its main root will remain.

**Questioner:** Dada, You made us _purush_ (the Self) after dissipating _agnan_ (ignorance of the Self), so which part is considered _purush_?

**Dadashri** : Gnan is verily _purush_ and _agnan_ (ignorance of the Self) is _prakruti_ (the non-Self). The joint form of _gnan_ - _agnan_ is _prakruti_ and Gnan itself is _paramatma_ (absolute Self) and that verily is _purush_.

**Questioner:** Is the nature of the absolute Self ( _paramatma_ ) a knower and a seer ( _gnata-drashta_ )?

**Dadashri** : Its main nature ( _swabhav_ ) is to be the knower and the seer. But what does _purush_ mean? One has not become _purushottam_ (the absolute Self). The One who becomes _purushottam_ is called _paramatma_. After becoming _purush_ (the Self), one is in the process of becoming a _purushottam_ – the absolute Self.

**Questioner:** _Atma_ (the Self) is pure ( _shuddha_ ) for sure so then what need is there for it to become _purushottam_?

**Dadashri:** 'The Self is pure' is in your convition ( _pratiti_ ) only; it is not that You have become so. You still have to become that. How do you become that? By following the Agna.

**Questioner:** Who follows the Agna? Is it the _pratishthit atma_ (the mixture of the Self and the non-Self behaving as 'I am Chandulal')?

**Dadashri:** Where is the question for the _pratishthit atma_ to remain in the Agna in this? It is Your _pragnya_ _shakti_ (the liberating energy of the Self); that is making You do it. It is the energy of the Self. So what else remains? There is no interference by anyone in the middle in following the Agna. _Ugnyashakti_ (energy of ignorance; the non-Self) was not letting you remain in Agna and _pragnyashakti_ is letting You stay there.To remain the Agna means, You now have in Your conviction ( _pratiti_ ) that 'I am pure Soul' and you also have it in your awareness ( _laksha_ ) but in Your experience ( _anubhav_ ) is little and thus You have not become that full state of the Self yet. In order to become that, you have to remain in the five Agna.

**Questioner** : Who does the _nischaya_ – who makes the firm decision?

**Dadashri** : It is all the work of _pragnyashakti_ and it is all under the control of _pragnyashakti_. Everything happens under its control.

## Thermometer of the Agna

**Questioner** : In the daily worldly interaction of talking that goes on from morning to evening, how can I tell whether I followed the Agna by seventy percent?

**Dadashri** : Many people know whether they are going to pass or fail their exam. Some will tell you that it is a hundred percent guarantee I am going to pass. One knows how much he followed the Agna. He even knows the percentage. The Self is a 'thermometer'; it knows everything.

**Questioner** : How can I tell whether I remain in the Agna or not?

**Dadashri** : Everything is known as to how much one lives in the Agna – that is why One constantly remains in _samadhi_. Whether someone is insulting him or saying something else to him, he is not affected by it at all. It is completely a different matter for the One who follows the Agna. You will know it from his talk; his talk does not have any _kashaya_ (anger-pride-deceit-greed) in it. There is great awareness in it.

When You remain in the Agna; it is considered as remaining in _shuddha upyoga_ \- applied awareness as the Self. You are the pure Soul ( _Shuddhatma_ ) and Your _upyoga_ is to be kept only in the five Agna. When does _upyoga_ not remain in them? It is when you have a bad toothache. So then 'we' excuse you for that. Misuse of 'our' Agna is wrong. There is no problem if you cannot fully remain them. 'Our' Agna help You maintain _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ \- pure worldly interaction.

## Prakruti takes over upon failure to remain in the Agna

**Questioner** : I came to You and attained Gnan and _nirakudata_ (beyond any state of easiness and uneasiness, the bliss of the Self) definitely arises. Then the energy of that joy ( _masti_ ) still remains, whether I remain in the Agna or not.

**Dadashri** : But if you do not remain in the Agna, the _prakruti_ (the non-Self complex) will gradually take over.

**Questioner** : Yes, that is it; I want this point.

**Dadashri** : The _prakruti_ will take over. But if You remain in the Agna, then nothing will bother You. Otherwise, the _prakruti_ will devour you. Through Dada's grace, you will experience peace ( _shanti_ ). It will remain for two to five years, but it is meaningless; the _prakruti_ will devour you.

**Questioner** : What do you mean by, ' _prakruti_ will devour you, or _prakruti_ will take over?'

**Dadashri** : _Prakruti_ will somehow or other, turn you into its own form (Chandulal). And Agna is the easiest thing; it is not difficult. And 'we' have given You all the freedom with that. Enjoy whatever you want to eat while You remain in the Agna. What more do You need? You have been given the freedom to eat what you like. Had you been restricted in that aspect, then how could one afford to have Gnani's restrictions in all other matters? But the Agna are easy and straightforward. 'See' everything as it is; what objection do You have?

**Questioner** : There is no problem in 'seeing', but I am not able to do so.

**Dadashri** : If one is controlling all the five 'horses' of the senses, (organs of sense pleasure; _indriyas_ ), then he has to pull the reins and he has to pull it up or relax it. Instead, I told him, 'Dear fellow, why don't you just let go? These horses are so good that they will take you home on their own. And on the contrary, _mooah_ (the dying one) you are making them bleed!

## Where there is Agna, there is saiyam and samadhi

**Questioner** : What is the gauge to measure whether I missed following the Agna?

**Dadashri** : You will feel suffocation within. It is the payback for missing the Agna. The one following the Agna experiences nothing but constant _samadhi_. One experiences _samadhi_ as long as he follows the Agna. There are many on our path that remain the Agna very well and experience _samadhi_. It is because this path is straightforward and one of equanimity. It is natural! Now if this path is not suitable then how is that other path going to be suitable? Having set aside all other problems, You are not to pay any attention to the problems of the mind. Simply maintain the relationship of _gnata-gneya_ ( _gnata_ is the Self as the knower and _gneya_ is 'Chandulal the non-Self' as the 'object' to be known). The mind is in its own _dharma_ (carrying out its own duty), what is the need to interfere with it? Why do You have to interfere in it unnecessarily? You can constantly remain in the Agna and in _Samadhi_ ; such is this path. It is not difficult at all. You are free to eat mangos and everything else.

**Questioner** : After coming to the Gnani's shelter, if there is a sense of some deficiency, should I take that as a deficiency within me, or in the other person? I feel that I am following the Agna, but where is the problem?

**Dadashri** : When there is a slippage from the Agna, then all the external problems ( _upadhi_ ) will arise, you will feel restless, you will get bored, all those things will happen. But if You remain in 'our' Agna, You will not lose _samadhi_ (constant bliss of the Self despite problems of the non-Self). This Gnan is so powerful that one experiences uninterrupted bliss from within and He attains liberation within one or two life times. He will experience constant inner _kashaya_ free state ( _saiyam_ ). The external _saiyam_ is what you can see on the outside. But inner _saiyam_ does not harm anyone. He would not hurt anyone, not even the person who curses and swears at him. Anger-pride-deceit-greed will not arise; such an inner _saiyam_ will prevail. Such is the power of Gnan! And if a mistake happens, it will correct it.

**Questioner** : When I remain in the Agna of the _Satpurush_ (one who has attained the Eternal – the Self) yet it does not manifest in my conduct, whose fault should I take it as? Mine or the _Satpurush's_?

**Dadashri** : No. If You remain in the Agna and the conduct ( _charitra_ ) as the Self does not arise, then the fault is of the one who gave you the Agna. But if you do not remain the Agna and that happens, then the mistake is yours.

## Get the work done, how?

**Questioner** : Dada, when we come to You, many times You tell us, 'Get Your work done...get Your work done'. How are we supposed to get our work done?

**Dadashri** : What do I mean when I tell You to get Your work done? 'We' are not telling You to remain the Agna completely. I will not keep telling you every day, but by telling you 'get your work done' you have to understand that Dada is telling us to increasingly remain in the Agna; He is telling us to maintain awareness in the Agna. So maintain awareness in the Agna; that is what I am telling You. Then Your work is done. What does a professor say about an examination? The professor says give such an examination that I don't have to give you bonus marks; give such an exam that no one will need to be given any credit. So the student should understand that he needs to study more. Everything should be systematic. That is what I mean when I say, 'Get Your work done'.

It is possible to get Your work done if You remain in the Agna. When Tirthankaras are present, they say 'no' to scriptures, religion and penance. Just remain in the Agna they give You. Agna will take you to _moksha_. Similarly, 'we' tell you not to read the scriptures. Follow the Agna and Your work will be one.

Get Your work done means that if You can remain 'our' Agna properly, then it is fine if you come once every two to four months and do Our _darshan_. But if you cannot remain in them, then you should come here often, everyday and do _darshan_.

# [2] Demarcation between Real and relative

## After attaining Gnan...

**Questioner** : You have separated the Real and the relative. Now what do we have to do after this separation for the progress of the Shuddhatma?

**Dadashri** : When such separation happens, the real (Self) is the _purush_ and relative is the _prakruti_ (non-Self complex). The purush and the _prakruti_ have become separate. So this purush then continues to become _purshottam_ – Absolute Supreme Self. The purush will continue to become purshottam naturally. It could not make any progress when it was in its unnatural state, but it will now end up achieving its ultimate state. One may ask what he has to do to achieve that. The answer is to follow the Five Agnas. These Five Agnas will keep the Self in the Self's own nature ( _svabhaav_ ). When the Self remains as the Self, its light continues to increase until it becomes complete light.

## _Mahatmas_ have attained _Bhedagnan_ , the knowledge of separation

When you wake up at night, does the awareness that you are Shuddhatma come or not?

**Questioner** : Yes, it does.

**Dadashri** : That is called _sakshatkar_ (direct perception, seeing face to face; revelation; manifestation; realization).

**Questioner** : So Dada, can we say that you have helped us attain the knowledge of separation ( _bhedgnan_ ; separation of the Self and the non-Self)?

**Dadashri** : Of course, you can say that. You have attained that for sure; there is no doubt it.

## Shuddhatma is not in the form of word

**Question** : Is it necessary to turn rosary beads in the name of Shuddhatma?

**Dadashri** : There is no need for that at all. Do not turn the beads of the Self. The Self is not in the form of a chain of beads. The Self is not in the form of a word. 'I am Shuddhatma' should be in your awareness; that is all. And to have constant awareness of 'I am Shuddhatma', that is considered as having _dhyan_ , meditation or contemplation of Shuddhatma. That is _shukladhyan,_ Absolute Pure Meditation as the Self). Then you are blessed, you do not have to fool around with anything else. Do you read that book, the Charanvidhi?

**Questioner** : Yes I read all of that.

**Dadashri** : Read that, that is all you need to do. Secondly you have to see the pure Soul (Shuddhatma) in everyone. That will be good. That is the best way.

**Questioner** : Now I read the Charanvidhi and Namaskar _vidhi_ everyday.

**Dadashri** : Yes, but you will find it very good if you follow the Agnas. Agna is its protecting fence, otherwise all that will rot away.

## You have to turn the handle in the beginning

**Questioner** : I am aware of the Agnas, but I do not follow them as naturally as I should, what about that?

**Dadashri** : You do not have to focus on that. It is not that difficult that it cannot happen naturally. It is the easiest thing, but you have to do _abhyaas_ (repetition, practice, use or exercise; learning, study; habit); practice them. Currently there is _anabhyaas -_ no practice _._ Anabhyaas means that you do not have the practice of seeing the Real and the relative, do you? So practice that for a month and then it will become natural for you. So at first, you have to 'crank the handle' that 'this is Real and this is relative'. It is fine if someone with great awareness does not do that. But people do not have so much awareness, do they? One with a lot of awareness does not have to do anything at all. He does not even have to 'crank the handle'. It will all remain natural and spontaneous.

## The Effect of Seeing the Soul benefits the Self

You will get the benefit of Shuddhatma when you see the pure Soul in the water buffalo, the donkeys and all the animals. If you see it as a buffalo it will pass by, and it will also pass by if you see it as a Shuddhatma. If you see Shuddhatma in a man, he will still pass by you, and he will do the same if you call him a rogue and worthless. Whatever your vision, the other person does not care about it, does he?

**Questioner** : But whatever is the inner intent ( _bhaav_ ) of our Soul, does it not affect the inner intent of the Soul of the other person?

**Dadashri** : It has no effect. You and the other person do not have anything to do with each other. The only connection is with the _pratikraman_ that you do. You also have to understand _pratikraman_. Because Atma being vitraagi by nature; the _pratikraman_ reaches him. 'We' have placed that ( _pratikraman_ ) having personally experienced it. You too may have had some such experiences, right?

You are Shuddhatma, and he is a Shuddhatma too. What do we (the Self) have anything to do with the 'clothes' (external physical non-Self)? Clothes may be silky or they may be rough. All these physical bodies are 'clothes'.

## This is the samayik of Pooniya Shravak 'Pooniya' to avoid confusion with _Punyai_

Do you see Shuddhatma in all these people?

**Questioner** : I do, but I forget sometimes.

**Dadashri** : Not that you forget sometimes, but you do see sometimes, do you not?

**Questioner** : Yes, I do.

**Dadashri** : When one practices seeing so, the samayik, like that of Pooniya Shravak happens within him. He experiences oneness with the Self (Samadhi) the whole day. When you go out for an hour and you see Shuddhatma in everyone as they go by, is anyone likely to get upset with you and ask you 'what are you looking at?'? You see the relative with these (physical) eyes, and the Shuddhatma with the inner eyes (of Gnan). That is divine eyes, divine vision - _divuyachakshu_. You will see Shuddhatma everywhere you look. Even that requires practice at first and then it will become natural for you. Then you will continuously see the Shuddhatma, naturally and spontaneously, in everyone. It requires practice at first, does it not? Your prior practice was wrong, so now you have to practice on this, do you not? So you have to turn the handle for a few days.

You should definitely follow the Five Agnas as much as you can, and if you cannot, then at least have remorse within, that 'what kind of karmic effect have I brought that today it will not let me sit in peace?' We need a supportive partnership of unfolding karmas in order to remain in Dada's Agnas, no? Do we not need it? Otherwise, see the Shuddhatma in the passer-by for an hour as you walk. This way you achieve Pooniya Shravak's samayik as you walk and move around.

**Questioner** : Please explain the essence of the samayik of the one Lord Mahavir so praised.

**Dadashri** : That (Pooniyo Shravak's samayik) was a pure samayik. Humans are not capable of doing such a samayik, are they? Pure samayik, it was a samayik through the divine vision ( _divyachakshu_ ), just like the kind that I have given you.

His samayik was pure, whether he was sitting at home or wandering outside. His samayik was based on divine vision. He would make cotton wicks ( _pooniyo_ ) and sell them and that is why he was called 'Pooniya Shravak'. When he was making these cotton wicks (pooniyas), his mind was on the cotton threads, while his _chit_ was in the Lord. He did not pay any attention to any other external things. He did not meddle in anything else. He kept his mind in _vyavahar_ (relative life, worldly life) and his _chit_ in _nischaya_ (the Real; the Lord); that is considered the highest samayik.Pooniya told King Shrenik, 'I will give the samayik to you.' King Shrenik asked him, 'What is the price? Tell me?' So Shravak told him, 'the Lord will decide on the price, I cannot.' So the King thought that the most the Lord will ask him to pay will be five or ten million rupees, how much could the Lord make him pay for just one samayik? So he had no idea of the value in his mind, did he? He comes to the Lord and says, 'Shravak has agreed to give me the _samayik_. Sir, please find me a solution now so that I do not have to go to hell. So the Lord asked, 'But did the Shravak agree to give it to you just like that? Free of cost?' The King replied, 'No, it will be at the cost the Lord would assess.' So the Lord asked the King, 'King Shrenik, do you realize the value of that _samayik_? Your entire kingdom will go into paying only the commission for it.' The King was shocked to realize that 'if my entire kingdom would cover just the commission on it, where else will I get the rest?' So that is how tremendous its value is.

Such are the relative and real sentences (Agnas) I have given to you. Now with applied awareness if you follow them for an hour, with a true mind and _chit_ \- with your mind look ahead so that you do not trip and with your _chit_ see the real and the relative, then it is possible for you to do the same kind of samayik as Pooniya Sharavak did. But now if you do it; it is yours.

That is how valuable this samayik is, so take advantage of it. When you do the samayik, you experience wonderful samadhi within, do you not? It is so easy; it is not even difficult. You do not even have to sit like this.

Samayik meaning what does one have to do? You have been given two view points, so when you go out to buy vegetables then on your way there and back, as per the Agnas, see the Shuddhatma, in all those you see; there may be a donkey, a bull, cow, goat and other living beings. Now, someone in the family tells you to go and buy some vegetables, it did not cost you anything (in seeing Shuddhatma in others), and what other benefit did you gain? You followed Dada's Agna. The third benefit is that you did a samayik, and the fourth benefit is that you experienced Samadhi of the samayik. So follow all these Agnas. At least spare an hour for this, can you not do that?

## Divine vision blossoms through practice

Will you use the _divya-chakshu_ (divine vision of the Self) when you go out? You are familiar with _agnan_ (ignorance) from time immemorial, so a diligent application of this Vision will begin the process of seeing the Self by being the Self.

**Questioner** : We realize that there is pure Soul in each human being but we cannot put into practice seeing the pure Soul in the trees and plants.

**Dadashri** : You have to practice that. Since time immemorial the practice has been wrong and so you have continued walking in the wrong direction. If the doctor tells you not to use your right arm when you eat, you will end up using it inadvertently. You have to maintain some awareness for four days when you are eating. Practice this (seeing pure Soul in everyone) from now on. Look through the divine vision as you walk pass any living beings. Practice that gradually so that it begins to 'fit'. The pure Soul is in cows, buffalos and everyone; it has not changed. The 'packing' (the non-Self) has changed, but the pure Soul has remained the same; the Soul is eternal.

## Not 'thou are that' but 'I am that'

Otherwise, instead of saying 'You are that...you are that', should one not say, 'I am Shuddhatma (pure Soul)'? I often tell our _mahatmas_. When you are wandering around in a car say, 'I am that (pure Soul), I am that...I am Shuddhatma'. 'I am Shuddhatma and so are all others'. This is what you have to see as you go along. In doing this, there will no longer be the discrimination of 'I' and 'you or them'. Where there is a difference of 'I' and 'you, there is discrimination, and that is caused by the discriminating intellect ( _buddhi_ ).

**Questioner** : As _dehadhyas_ (identification with the body of 'I am Chandulal', 'I am this body') goes down, that much difference (separation) is reduced!

**Dadashri** : Yes, the difference goes down. One has to get rid of this difference, does he not?

## The Pure Soul in Others remains in Awareness

**Questioner** : Should we be naturally and spontaneously aware that Chandubhai and the Soul are separate, or should we make an effort to know that through practice?

**Dadashri** : No, the awareness will do that for you. Such awareness will remain with you. Say you have a diamond in a box; you had seen it the day you placed it in the box, then if the box is closed you can still see the diamond inside, can't you?

**Questioner** : Yes I can.

**Dadashri** : 'You can see it', what does that mean? You will then remember your whole life that there is a diamond in this box. Would you say that 'this just a box' or would you say, 'there is a diamond in this box'?

**Questioner** : Sometimes I remember Dada. It happens that as I am walking along, I keep seeing Shuddhatma in people, but as clearly as I can see the diamond in the box, I do not have the same clarity in seeing Shuddhatma.

**Dadashri** : There is no need to see it clearly.

**Questioner** : Then it seems mechanical.

**Dadashri** : No, no! It is in your awareness ( _laksha_ ) for sure that the diamond is there. It just feels that way to you.

**Questioner** : When we take a walk in the morning, we say, 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma', and when we see the trees and plants around us, we end up saying, 'I bow to the Shuddhatma', so which of the two is better?

**Dadashri** : All that you say is fine. Eventually when the speaking part comes to an end; it will be better. You will not have to say it and it will remain (in your awareness???) on its own.

**Questioner** : So, which of the two is better?

**Dadashri** : There is no need to say either, but still when one says it, it is good. But it will be good when the need of having to say that goes away gradually. You cannot bow down without saying it. But there is no problem if you say that quietly from within (not say it aloud). It is not a problem even if you feel so in your mind.

## 'I am Shuddhatma' \- should this be in words or in awareness?

**Questioner** : Prior to attaining Gnan, I did not have to keep saying 'I am Chandubhai...I am Chandubhai'. But it was understood; it was in our conviction anyway. Now after attaining the Gnan, you have given us the awareness of Shuddhatma; so what is the reason behind telling us to keep saying 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma'? What is the essence behind this?

**Dadashri** : We have to say that if we have a debt. And when we say 'I am Shuddhatma', we are speaking so from being in that main place. Once you have the knowledge, then it will remain in your awareness; then that is it. But from here (the main place) we have walked a thousand miles in the wrong direction, and there we attained the realization of 'I am Shuddhatma', so then we will have to walk back, won't we? If you stand there and ask, 'Sir, have I become Shuddhatma now?', But _mooah_! You went so far in the wrong direction, you will have to turn around and come back, and then you will become the main Shuddhatma. That is why you have to keep saying, 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma' for it. You have to do all this for that. It is fine if one says 'I am Shuddhatma...I am shudhatma' for two to five minutes or so and when he is doing _vidhi_ here – it is fine. Just as you are Chandubhai, and if you were to go on the terrace and keep saying 'I am Chandubhai...I am Chandubhai...' people will tell you 'You are Chandubhai so why do you keep saying it over and over? Similarly, you are Shuddhatma for sure, yet you have to say, 'I am Shuddhatma', because you were that far on the wrong path and so you have to turn around by that much. But otherwise the 'I am Shuddhatma', will continue to remain in your awareness. This (belief of) 'I am Chandubhai' had gone in the wrong direction, and that is why you used to say 'I am Chandubhai', so now you are now saying, 'I am Shuddhatma'. So, by doing that; that other turns around. When you were saying, 'I am Chandubhai'; you were being affected by Chandubhai. And now if you say, 'I am Shuddhatma', you will have the effect of the Shuddhatma on You. Then the two will become One. The Self had separated but will now become One.

The _chit_ that had become impure, has now turned around and so when it becomes pure; it becomes one (with the Self). Then you will enjoy the bliss similar to that of the Self. If anyone falls short, then they should say 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma'. What is wrong in saying we are what we are?

## One can Say That Only After being Awakened

**Questioner** : Can one become a pure Soul by just saying, 'I am a Shuddhatma – pure Soul'?

**Dadashri** : No, that is not going to happen. There are many people who say, 'I am Shuddhatma', but nothing is attained by that. When a sleeping man tells you he is giving you money, can you believe him?

**Questioner** : No we cannot.

**Dadashri** : It is only worth something if he says it when is awake. That is how I awaken you and then make you say, 'I am Shuddhatma'. I do not make you say it just like that. And I give you the whole _moksha_ within an hour. _Moksha_ means that you will never have any worries; such is the _moksha_ I have given to you. However, it is a causal ( _karan_ ) _moksha_. That ultimate _moksha_ still remains.

## It is not mechanical for the _mahatmas_

**Questioner** : Does it not become mechanical to keep saying, 'I am Shuddhatma'?

**Dadashri** : It does not become mechanical for our _mahatmas_ , but for others it will. Others are mechanical themselves, and therefore it will become mechanical for them.

**Questioner** : What if one says, 'I am Shuddhatma' mechanically in ignorance (without realizing the Self)?

**Dadashri** : He attains nothing by that and the one who has attained Gnan does not say that mechanically. It may seem mechanical, but it is not. And the one who has not attained Gnan, he will not attain anything even if he says, 'I am Shuddhatma...Shuddhatma', all night long.

**Questioner** : Is it mechanical even if he says is directly?

**Dadashri** : Yes, even if he says it directly, it is mechanical. Because the belief he has of who he is; that belief has not been broken. And what is more he even keeps on saying 'I am Nagindas'!

## Is it not the subtle ego?

**Questioner** : When we say, 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma', is that not also some subtle type of egoism?

**Dadashri** : No, no. It is egoism when one does not know who he is. Egoism is to claim to be what one is not. You are a Shuddhatma, so there is no egoism in saying, 'I am Shuddhatma'. But if in spite of being Shuddhatma, you say 'I am Chandulal', then you have made a false accusation there. You do not know your real Self and people named you Chandubhai, and so you believed yourself to be so. Then you believe, 'I am this lady's husband...I am his uncle...I am his maternal uncle...' – you have been surrounded with all the webs. To believe yourself to be what you are not; that is called egoism. But here having attained your Real Self and to then say so – that is not considered egoism.

## Remember that

**Questioner** : If we say, 'I am Shuddhatma', when we are sitting idle and do its _japa_ (chanting), is that acceptable or not?

**Dadshri** : It is not a thing of _japa_ , who is the one doing the _japa_ in this? So it is not a thing for doing japa; it is to be kept in your awareness. 'I am Shuddhatma' should remain in your awareness.

**Questioner** : But by saying it (japa), will it not increasingly come into the awareness?

**Dadashri** : It is to be said for a short while. You have become Shuddhatma after I gave you the Gnan. So why do you have to recite it?

## You do not have to repeat 'I am Shuddhatma' again and again

**Questioner** : After attaining Gnan, what is the difference between repeatedly saying (doing _rattan_ ) 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma', and repeating the name 'Ram...Ram...'?

**Dadashri** : O ho ho! There is not a lot of need for repetition at all. You can do the rattan of 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma' for some time during the night, but there is no need for you to do so all day long.

**Questioner** : We do not do that, but 'I am Shuddhatma' comes automatically.

**Dadashri** : No, but there is no need to do _rattan_. There is a difference between doing rattan for it and it coming to you automatically. Is there not a difference? What is the difference?

**Questioner** : That other ('I am Shuddhatma') comes naturally and spontaneously (sahaj).

**Dadashri** : Yes naturally and spontaneously. So what comes naturally and spontaneously is very valuable. If the value of _rattan_ is a quarter rupee, then the value of this (Shuddhatma) is in billions of rupees. You put these two vastly differing things together. Right now, is your awareness that of 'I am Chandubhai' or is it that of truly 'I am Shuddhatma'?

**Questioner** : 'I am Shuddhatma'.

**Dadashri** : So then that is called _shukladhyan_ (pure contemplation). In your awareness you have, 'I am Shuddhatma'; that is called shukladhyan, which verily is the cause for _moksha_. Hence, what you have in hand ( _silak_ ) right now; is not to be found anywhere in India or the entire world. So use it judiciously. And do not compare it (I am Shuddhatma) with this (Ram...Ram). What did you compare it with?

**Questioner** : With the name 'Ram'.

**Dadashri** : That is called _japa_ (name reciting), and japa is necessary to attain a kind of peace, whereas this (awareness of being Shuddhatma) is a natural and spontaneous thing.

## You cannot do Japa or Penance in Gnan

**Questioner** : Dada, in the _kramic_ path one is told to do _japayagna_ (ceremony of name reciting) to attain mental stillness. Now, if we recite 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma' we too will get stillness of mind in the same way, no?

**Dadashri** : No we do not need mental stillness.

**Questioner** : But is that not a kind of a _japyagna_ also?

**Dadashri** : No we do not need japyagna. What is a japyagna? It is children's game. It is for the kindergarteners, meaning that the one who does not have mental stillness, he repeats words like, 'Rama...Rama...Rama', or 'Sohum...(I am thou)...Sohum...Sohum'. So he tells me 'I keep reciting only 'Sohum'', so I tell him, 'you will get the same benefits whether you say 'khiti' (a small peg) or 'Sohum'!

What is japayagna? It is to keep repeating any word so that you will not hear any other things that sprout in the mind. They die down. That is called _ekagraha_ (concentration). If concentration prevails, then peace will prevail. So then if instead of 'Ram' one were to keep saying 'khiti...khiti..', that too will work. This is nothing but concentration on words ( _shabda_ _ekagrata_ ). We (those who are Self-Realized) do not have anything like that, do we? We do not have to beat the mind. We have to analyze the mind and 'see' all the karmic stock it has brought along from the past life. It is a ' _gneya'_ – (that which is to be known), and You are _Gnata_ – the Knower. Gnata has a value because of the existence of gneya. We no longer have to do any _japa-tapa_ , mantra reciting or penance. Ultimately you have to remain in the Knower-Seer State (Gnata-Drashta). There is no place of japa in there.

## His main nature is this

There is a lion cub that wanders around with a herd of sheep. When the sheep go to graze, the cub too goes with them. So the cub becomes just like the sheep. The cub met with the circumstances and _samskar_ (impression or influence on the mind of education and upbringing) later on. The sheep see the physical form of the cub but they are not afraid of it, because they have been wandering around together, and they have not seen any violent tendencies in the cub, there no reason for them to fear it. And the cub never harasses them and so it becomes lovable and thus forms a loving relationship between them.

Then one day the sheep and the cub were drinking water at a water hole, when they heard a lion roar from the other side of the hole. The cub heard this and its inherent nature came alive. So then it too started to roar. So the sheep ran away one by one, but the cub did not chase them because its violent nature had not been awakened, but the sheep ran away from it. They did not remain with it anymore. That is because its inherent nature became awakened. Similarly, Your nature has been awakened. You are sitting at such a stage; a wonderful stage. It is like this; a child would not be able to appreciate it. But does the value of this stage go away? No it will not, will it? Not even if you do not understand it?

## Moksha through worshipping the hidden Self

The authors of scriptures have said that if one attains the Self even for one _samaya_ (the smallest indivisible unit of time), it would be more than enough. If one says, 'I am the Soul – the Self,' after attaining the Self for even a _samaya_ , then his work is done. After giving you this Gnan, when you again say, 'I am Shuddhatma,' you are saying so as the Self and it comes automatically. Therefore you have become the Self.

Lord Mahavir has said that saying I am the Soul (Self) even for a fraction of a second after becoming the Self, is liberation. This you have been saying now for quite a significant amount of time, whereas the other folks say, 'I am Shuddhatma' but not after becoming the Self. Become the Self and then say, 'I am Shuddhatma', for just once. Then it is enough. Thereafter one has understood that 'this state of the Self alone is mine, and all the rest is of the non-Self; it is temporary and not mine'; then the work is done.

**Questioner:** It is said, ' _Ey gupta tattva ne jey aradhey chey, te pratyaksha amrut ne paami abhaya thai chey_ ', meaning the one who pursues and worships the hidden element (the Self), attains the nectar of immortality directly and becomes fearless, is it not? (70)

**Dadashri:** Yes, the one who worships Shuddhatma, says 'I am Shuddhatma', after becoming Shuddhatma; will attain the direct eternal Self and become fearless. Until one attains the Self, the drops of poison, arising from the (belief) state, 'I am Chandulal,' keep dripping constantly within, and due to this his speech, conduct and mind-thoughts will come out poisonous. And when 'we' give the Gnan, immediately drops of nectar of immortality (amrut) start to drip, so the thoughts, speech and conduct begins to become laden with the taste and energy of immortality.

## How much Agna should one follow?

**Questioner** : Please explain the statement, 'You are Shuddhatma but you have to attain this awareness (of this state)'.

**Dadashri** : You are Shuddhatma for sure. After I gave you the Gnan, you are Shuddhatma, but you have to become aware of that. If you follow the Agnas, then I would know that you have the awareness (of I am Shuddhatma); fifty percent Agnas, not more. Hey! If you follow twenty-five percent, even then I will say that you have the awareness, so tell me at what percent I should pass one?

**Questioner** : That is true; one should follow at least twenty five percent.

**Dadashri** : Now, is it acceptable to put just twenty five percent sugar in your tea? There you need one hundred percent sugar and in doing this you are happy with just twenty-five percent!

## Unawareness of Agnas due to diet

**Questioner** : Dada you say that following the Agnas is easy and straightforward and that is true, but is it so easy to constantly follow the first two Agnas?

**Dadashri** : There is no problem with following them, but try and see if you can them or not while fasting?

**Questioner** : I did not understand that, Dada.

**Dadashri** : Fast all day and then see if you can follow them or not? Because dozing starts when food is consumed.

All 'we' are saying is that one has never had this Vignan (Akram science) in any previous lives. Protect it now that you have it. It is Akram, so it is possible to attain Atgmagnan (Knowledge of the Self) within an hour. It is such a Knowledge that you will never experience any breach in peace; you can experience constant _samadhi_ if you so desire, even in the midst of eating-drinking, doing whatever you are doing and while living with your wife. If you cannot, then ask me where lies the hinderance and I will tell you which point to press. There is no need to say, 'I am Shuddhatma'; just keep seeing the Real and the relative.

## That reduces the suffering

**Questioner** : If one is going through the unfolding of a _nikachit_ karma, karma for which the effect is inevitable, can that karma become lighter by starting a japa-yagna (chanting) of 'I am Shuddhatma'?

**Dadashri** : Yes, of course it can become lighter. In saying 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma...' one's steadiness will not be perturbed and so it will become lighter. Nikachit means that even God can not move that karma if He were to come down and try; such is nickachit karma. One has no choice but to experience or endure it. But if You keep saying 'I am Shuddhatma', it will not touch You. The karma will remain as karma and discharge as non-Self (paudgalik). It will not touch You.

## Shuddhatam forever pure

Now that you have become joint with 'I am Shuddhatma', nothing will touch you or obstruct you. By _nischaya_ (from the Real perspective), the Self is pure. So that can never change again. The _prakruti_ (non-Self complex) by nature is dependent on the unfolding of karma; it is not dependent upon the Self.

Therefore, the Self is truly pure, and it is decided that 'that is who I am!' And by _nischaya –_ from the absolute Real perspective – it is pure. That purity should not change by saying 'I did such (a bad) thing' 'Chandubhai' does something and you take it upon yourself that it happened to you. You have become Shuddhatma by _nischaya_ (Real perspective) and not by any other method. Shuddhatma by _nischaya_ means that now under certain circumstances, you cannot question whether you are Shuddhatma or not. If the worst of things happen, it is dependent on the _prakruti_ (non-Self complex), what has that got to do with You – the real Self? But people lose even this after becoming Shuddhatma. 'I am no longer pure', they will say.

**Questioner** : Yes, but why does he lose it like that?

**Dadashri** : Yes, one should not lose it like that; that verily is his _purusharth_.

**Questioner:** It is true that there is no duality when we say we are Shuddhatma (pure Soul), so then why is it necessary to use the word 'shuddha' – pure?

**Dadashri:** Yes, it is very necessary, it is a very scientific word, and that is why you have to say 'shuddha'. Why not just the word 'Atma' (Soul) alone? Why did we not use another word? This is because the Gnani Purush has given the state of Shuddhatma to you. And after that if Chandubhai (non-Self) does something that is improper and unacceptable to the whole world, you are not to let go of the fact that, 'I am shuddha (pure).' Then there is no one who can hurt you. You will suffer if you lose that faith. Do not let go of that purity. That karma will go away. Karma will leave after giving its fruit. Otherwise you will start thinking in your mind that, because of this bad deed, I am spoiled. Spoiled means gone. Therefore no matter how bad a thing you do, even if the whole world criticizes you for it, your pure state of Shuddhatma remains intact. Such is the Gnan 'we' have given you. However, if someone takes it for granted and believes that 'nothing is going to happen to me. Now I am safe', then he is in a limbo. Yes, it is important to have some fear. One must be cautious. 'You' should caution Chandubhai by saying, 'Chandubhai, tread with caution. Lord Mahavir too had walked with caution.' What should you say to the 'neighbor' (the non-Self; Chandubhai)? 'Do not be afraid but do exercise caution'.

**Questioner** : The Self is pure but his belief was wrong.

**Dadashri** : Yes, one verily is pure. The belief that was wrong has now become right. Now, do not let go of the belief that you are pure so that the wrong belief does not get in again. Because, what is the Atma like? Lord Mahavir said, 'Make one understand the Shuddhatma. If the _sadhak_ (one seeking liberation) attains emancipation, then in his emancipation make him understand that he verily is the Shuddhatma.' So then one would say, 'instead of saying Shuddhatma, will it not work if we say Atma?' 'No it will not work, because when certain karmas unfold, he himself will feel, 'I did this...I did this.' And the moment he says that, he is in a limbo. Because who is the doer? It is _vyavasthit_. Of whom did it happen? The answer is, 'of the relative; I am the Real'. Now what is the attribute of the Self? It becomes whatever it envisions. It becomes Shuddhatma if that is what it envisions, otherwise it becomes that other (whatever he contemplates).

## Atma becomes what it envisions

Atma is the only thing that becomes whatever it envisions or imagines. 'I am a lieutenant' and that is what he becomes. If he says, 'I am agnani (ignorant)', then that is what he becomes, 'I am an angry man', and that is what he becomes. It becomes whatever it envisions. So what do we make it do? 'I am Shuddhatma', so it starts to become that. You have been given the Five Agnas. All the wrong doings are of Chandubhai, what do you have to have to do with them? So, when you take on what is not your, then you become that. This is a Vignan (science). Atma is the only thing that has the inherent attribute that it becomes whatever it envisions. What is more, it is an immediate effect; it does not take any time. If Chandulal says, 'Sir, I am very sick, I am very sick.' I will tell him, 'No, do not say that. You should say, 'Chandulal is sick.' When you say, 'I am sick', then that is what you will become the moment you say that. Do you or do you not become that way? And what happens when you say, 'I am full of infinite energy'? You become one with infinite energy.

## Wrong or right is of prakruti only

Once one says 'I am Shuddhatma,' he starts to become _nirvikalp_ ('I am Chandulal' is _vikalp_. 'I am Shuddhatma' is _nirvikalp_ ) and if he says anything other than that, like, 'I am like this' or 'I am like that,' all that is _vikalp_. This (vikalp) has given rise to the worldly life. And that other, 'I am Shuddhatma,' goes into the _nirvikalp_ state. Now in spite of this for Chandubhai - the relative self; both the tasks will continue. Will the right and the wrong work continue or not? The nature of _prakruti_ is such that it will not refrain from doing wrong or right. Nobody can do only the right thing. Some do few wrongs and some do more wrong. You do not want to do wrong, but even then it may happen therefore make a decision ( _nischaya_ ) that 'I am Shuddhatma' and then you 'see' all the right and the wrong that happens. This is because if something wrong happens to him (the non-Self), then you should not think 'I did wrong. My Shuddhatma has become ruined'. Shuddhatma means it is Your own main form. These 'wrong things' or 'right things' are only the results which have come in to effect. They are the results of mistakes committed in the past. Keep 'seeing' those results, and settle everything with equanimity. Wrong or right exists in the language of the worldly people. There is nothing wrong or right in the language of the Lord. (74)

**Questioner:** Should the awareness of, 'I am Shuddhatma' remain all the time?

**Dadashri: '** The Self is pure,' that inner state will not leave. If someone were to hurt you or hurl abusive words at you even then your intent of 'he (the other person) is pure – _Shuddhatma_ ' must not be neglected.

The Self verily is pure. If any living creature were to die at the hands of Chandubhai, then to not forsake the Self's pure state (shuddhata) is called Gnan. The Self must not become prey to the illusion, 'I killed it.' This is because you are not the killer. You are the pure Self. You are not the doer ( _karta_ ) or the sufferer ( _bhogta_ ) at all. It is the fault of the one who is the doer-sufferer. Therefore, you are to 'keep seeing what Chandubhai is doing.' And if the living being dies on his account then You should give him advice, 'Chandubhai, it would be better if you are careful while you are walking.'

If Gnan works scientifically, then there is no harm if you remain silent ( _maun_ ), but it does not remain in a scientific way for our _mahatmas_ (those who have received the Gnan). That is why you should speak (the process of conversing internally with Chandubhai) something like this, because the one who speaks is not Shuddhatma, it is the inner energy called pragnya that is speaking so. Therefore the pure Self does not have to speak at all, does it? So the energy called pragnya says, 'why are you doing such things? This should not happen.' Saying this much is enough. Or if your conduct is such that it hurts someone, then pragnyashakti will tell Chandubhai, 'you do _pratikraman_ (apologise), do pratyakhyan (resolve never to repeat the mistake).' That's it, only that much. Is there anything difficult in this?

**Questioner:** No, No. It is so easy.

**Dadashri:** And at such time if pratyakhyan does not happen then one will get a couple of more life times (to resolve this error). Hence, it is better to resolve it right here (in this life). There is nothing difficult in this.

## How should one remain in the Self?

**Questioner** : Now I want to remain only in the Self, not on the outside, how should I do that?

**Dadashri** : How did you remain in Chandulal before? Was there a room or something like that for it? You were Chandulal before, were you not? Were you really Chandulal?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri** : If you overhear negative talk about Chandulaleven through the wall, your mood will be spoiled. So that shows that you were definitely Chandulal. Now, if You are the Atma (the Self), then You are absolutely not Chandulal, no matter how much talk there is of Chandulal. Even if they tell you things to your face, You are the Self. What have You and Chandulal got to do with each other? So there is no such thing as a room or anything similar here. You have to have the _upyoga_ (the applied awakened awareness) to remain in the Self. The awareness (upyoga) of 'I am Chandulal' is gone and the awareness of 'I am Shuddhatma' remains. Know that the other awareness (I am Chandulal) does not enter into this awareness (of the Self), maintain that awareness. Are there any problems there? That is it; that is all. Just as when Chandulal was there, you did not have to have a room. Without having a room, the hands, the legs and the whole body were all of Chandulal. And now it should all become the Self. 'I am Shuddhatma', now whether that other conduct happens or not, You do not have anything to do with it. But the awareness of 'I am the Self' should remain constantly. That is because when the intoxication (of 'I am Chandulal') existed, it pervaded throughout (one's belief of one's being). And what does it say? I am the President of India. Hey fool! Two hours ago you were saying that you are Chandulal and why are you saying this now? Someone will say that he is under the influence of something that is making him say those things. When that influence goes away, he will revert back to saying he is Chandulal. Therefore, you are being influenced by this world, like all the other people. That is why you said Chandulal, but You are really Shuddhatma.

But that other influence (the intoxication of 'I am the President of India') will go away automatically after two hours. This one (of 'I am Chandulal') is not likely to go away. That is because it will be fed everyday, will it not? The intoxication of alcohol will go away if one stops drinking. But with this one ('I am Chandulal'), one keeps chugging it down day and night and so the intoxication keeps on increasing. Then he will find a few people who will say, 'What can you say about Chandubhai? He spent two hundred thousand rupees.' So then the intoxication in Chandubhai increases even more, as soon as he hears that. People keep intoxicating him with this 'alcohol' (of false pride). He will also find someone to lower it too. His intoxication will go down for a while when someone tells him, 'You do not have any sense.' And he will not like that when it goes down. Hey you fool! It is good if it goes down. But he will say, 'But that hurt my reputation, did it not?' It does not matter if he remains intoxicated but at least he had a reputation! The intoxication will go down if you insult him, but at the same time he will create enmity. He will say, 'Wait till I get my chance!'

Therefore, you are not Chandulal and you have to become Shuddhatma (pure Soul). What else do you need? You are convinced that you are really not Chandulal. His wealth is his own, what do 'I' have to do with it?' And we have seen all that 'wealth'. It is all perishable wealth, the kind that would be hard to find once lost. And if you were to find it, you would lose it again. Whereas this wealth (the Self) of mine is permanent, it is eternal. That wealth is different. First, the awareness of, 'I am Shuddhatma' happens, then one starts experiencing that and becomes that form. Therefore the writers of scriptures have written, '

become the Atma for just one second and then as an Atma say 'I am Atma (the Self)', otherwise do not say that. So then when does one become the Self (Atma)? It is when the Gnani Purush makes him (the one with ignorance) stable in Gnan; when that happens, he will say that he has become the Self now. Then one can say this (I am Shuddhatma). But what are you going to achieve by saying, I am Shuddhatma, I am Shuddhatma', without becoming Shuddhatma first? You are Chandulal, and then you say, 'I am Shuddhatma...I am Shuddhatma', all night. But you revert back to Chandulal the moment someone insults you.

The reason to follow the Five Agnas is that you are surrounded by nothing but bad times, there is nothing but plundering wherever you look. So that is all _koosang_ (bad influence). The company (sang) itself has become _koosang_ – of negative nature. Hence, if you follow these Five Agnas, this _koosang_ will not touch You. And these Agnas are easy, they are not difficult.

## The inner burning has stopped

**Questioner** : Is the desire to advance in what I have attained, considered as _antardaha_ \- inner burning sensation?

**Dadashri** : _Antardaha_ can never happen to 'You', can it? Antardah will never arise again. Wherever the state of the Self happens, antardaha stops there. There is antardaha of another kind which happens when you take on the suffering of the neighbor's (Chandulal; the non-Self) house that is burning. And it is that non-living ego that is burning, and if you take that as yours, then it becomes yours. 'You' have to 'know' that there is a battle going on externally. Now _antardaha_ does not happen, having attained the state of the Self. Otherwise, there is antardaha for the whole world. The _antardaha_ that you see is occurring on the exterior part and that is what you take on as your own. Nothing touches or obstructs you; that is how the Self is. Once one experiences the bliss of the Self, he will never experience _antardaha_ (inner suffering).

What is _antardaha_? One will continue to experience an inner suffering. One _parmanu_ (indivisible sub-atomic particles) burns and when it is just about to burn out, it ignites another one. And when the second parmanu is just about to burn out, it ignites the third one, and so on. That is how the course of action goes on constantly; like electricity. And you have to endure that suffering too. And that is called _antarhaha_. And when additional parmanus burn, that is when people will say, 'my _jiva_ (soul) is burning...my jiva keeps burning'. It is the parmanus that are burning, how can he bear that? When the antardaha goes away and the _kadhapo_ - _ajampo_ (grief, mental torment and restlessness) stops, you are free,

**Questioner** : Dada, it is true that the antardaha is gone. What should I do about the antardaha of attaining Kevalgnan that arises?

**Dadashri** : That other business is over and the new one has started. Why is there more profit in this business? There is an inner intent ( _bhavanna_ ), is there not? However much is your purushartha (spiritual effort), that many degrees of Kevalgnan are being deposited.

What is considered as _purushartha_? However much is your awareness and however much you follow 'our' Agnas; that is your purushartha. And with that purushartha, degrees of Kevalgnan are deposited. When those degrees add up to 360 degrees, Kevalgnan is complete. Until then it is considered fractional Kevalgnan – _ansha Kevalgnan_. One would know that he has fractional Kevalgnan. The inner burning ( _antardaha_ ) will stop only when the degrees of Kevalgnan increase, otherwise it will not. Antardaha is such a thing that it will never stop. It will remain till the tenth _gunthanu_ (level of spiritual development). There it is in a subtle form; at a minute level. However much _kashaya_ one has, he will have that much antardah. There is an insignificant amount of _kashaya_ present. There, it is subtle _kashaya_. In the tenth gunthana, exists the last of the greed, smallest of greed is there in that state. Until then this meddling remains.

## Safety in a strong room

Now there is happiness, wherever you sleep. You will be happy even if you had to sleep on the terrace on a cold night. You will get back into the 'cave' of Shuddhatma in your own way and the cold will go away, whereas a rich man will feel cold in his warm bungalow, because he keeps groping around on the outside (in the non-Self). Hey, why don't you go back into your own 'room'? But how can he do that when he has not seen that room in the first place? Whereas you sleep in your own 'room' (remain in the domain of the Self); let it rain or be cold on the outside!

You will not waver now even if there is a huge storm outside, will you?

**Questioner** : Not at all!

**Dadashri** : You have a strong-room of Shuddhatma. No one will bother you; such is that strong-room. You have to get back into your home department (the Self), all this is the 'foreign department' (non-Self). Let them scream as much as they want to, once you get into your 'home department', there will be no one to bother you. You will now experience that; the experience will begin only after you sit in the 'home department'. Till then you will keep going into the foreign department. Even now, having become a Shuddhatma, you do not get into the 'home department'; you keep going out into the 'foreign department'. That is because you do not have the practice of going into the Self. There is a lack of practice, is there not? Should you not reduce that other practice?

When all kinds of storms appear within, you still have to resolve them with calm. What kinds of storms will come? They are the storms of past karmas. So it is the stored karmic baggage. It was charged ( _puran_ ) in the past life, and now when it discharges ( _galan_ ); it kicks up a storm. At that time you have to maintain calm. 'You'are Shuddhatma, You 'see' that storm while sitting in the 'home department'.

Because for you, the Atma exists one hundred percent separately and the _pudgal_ (non-Self) exists one hundred percent separately. You have been given the state of Shuddhatma, you experience the Self hundred percent separate and the _pudgal_ (non-Self) separate. Now nothing ever is going to be ruined for him (the one with Gnan). If you deliberately try to uproot it, then it will be uprooted, otherwise it will not. The understanding may be more or less but that is not an issue. There is no need to understand that. It is the fruit of Gnani's grace. This is Akram Vignan, and so you do not have to do anything.

Many people have benefitted here and they have personal experiences of what state they were in prior to attaining Gnan and the state they are in now.

## Akram Vignan, a scientific way

The Shuddhatma has to be attained from the Gnani Purush just once. So this is scientific; it is a scienctific method. Otherwise, have you ever heard of something like this happening within two hours? Have you ever heard of one becoming a Shuddhatma within two hours? But this is a scientific method and it is the Gnan (Knowledge) of the tirthankars. This is not exclusively my own method. This method of Akram is my own method.

This science is the science of all the three periods. It was there in the past, it is here in the present and it will not change in the future. Such is this science. Do you not feel that this is a science of Dada? You will know it when you verify it. Do you not feel that it as a non-contradicting principle?

**Questioner** : Dada, the answer to that is that _kashayas_ have started to become light and go away. If someone comes to cause any harm, I feel that Chandulal is being harmed. So that is the only proof I have.

**Dadashri** : No matter how bad the result is, you still keep 'seeing' them; do not waver because you are not the doer. Today, you are not the doer of them.

## Support for the kashaya is destroyed

When you said, 'I am Chandubhai', you became the support for all the anger-pride-deceit-greed. Now when you say, 'I am Shuddhatma', they all lose their support. What is left when they become unsupported? Nothing will ever survive in an unsupported state. Everything will fall. Before you used to say, 'I became angry', 'this happened to me and that happened to me.' Now they (the _kashayas_ ) have lost their support, the anger appears unsupported. There is a difference between a man with support and one without support, so much so that the anger will appear dead (ineffective). There is no substance to it. Now anger-pride-deceit-greed will not cause any other harm, they will obstruct the experience of the bliss; they will not let one experience the bliss of the Self that arises within.

_Pratistha_ means that one sits around as the father-in-law of his son's wife. He is called a father-in-law when the son brings home a wife, is he not? And when he takes _dixa_ (renounces worldly attachments), he breaks this pratistha of of being a father-in-law. And when he takes the dixa, he gives rise to the pratistha of 'I am a _Sadhu_ (acetic)'. He leaves one pratistha and gives rise to another one. But he still gives rise to a pratistha, does he not? If he becomes a Shuddhatma, then there is no problem. But one gets rid of one pratistha and replaces it with another. Then as he studies more scriptures, it makes him leave that pratistha (of being an acetic) and gives him the one of _Upadhyaya_ (spiritual teacher). Then they make him leave that of the Upadhyaya and give him that of Acharya (higher ranking spiritual teacher). Then he is made to leave that of Acharya and is given the title of _Suri_ (head of Jain acetics). But he will remain in his pratistha. And as long as pratishtha remains, anger-pride-deceit-greed will not go away.

This world of anger-pride-deceit-greed remains because of the pratistha of 'I am Chandulal'. 'I am Chandulal' was in your gnan (knowledge), and 'I am his father' etc., all that is pratistha. But now you have let go of that pratishtha and you have the belief of 'I am Shuddhatma and 'Chandulal' is the photograph (reflection) of the stock of my old karmas, and that is the only thing that needs to be faced. That is all my punishment. It is my incurred liability. And it has to be endured. But otherwise I am not truly Chandubhai. They (the _kashayas_ ) will remain only if the pratishtha is done. But as I have become the Shuddhatma, that pratishtha is destroyed.

## The real is permanent, the relative is temporary

There are two kinds of visions; a permanent vision and a temporary one. Actually the Self's main vision is permanent. But the vision has been placed in the temporary. And that in turn has given rise to temporary intents.

The awareness of 'I am Chandulal' – people told you this and you got entangled and your vision became temporary by believing them. So you became aware that you are temporary ( _vinashi_ ).But then it also bothers you that you were there even in the past life, and you even say so. So if you were there in the past life, then you are eternal ( _avinashi_ ), are you not? You are not perishable ( _vinashi_ ), if you were there also in the past life. It is the body that is _vinashi_ (perishable). Your eternalness (permanent existence) is there, because you are a Shuddhatma, and that is the Real thing. And everything that is Real, is permanent and everything that is relative, is temporary.

**Questioner** : Many times in certain worldly affairs, if we remain superficial with the awareness that 'this is relative', then there is tremendous bliss within.

**Dadashri** : You will experience bliss from the moment you think of it as temporary. By saying that it is relative, it proves that you are Real. Even if you do not say, 'I am Shuddhatma', the fact that you say 'all this is relative', that in itself proves that you are Shuddhatma.

## Both are inseparable

**Questioner** : Establishing the state of Shuddhatma means it is Real thing.

**Dadashri** : Yes, the Real thing.

**Questioner** : So one has to maintain the awareness over it. That is Agna number one. Everything else is relative and he the Self is Real.

**Dadashri** : And that has quickly put the whole world in the relative. Do you now follow any of the Agnas? Which Agna do you follow?

**Questioner** : Of seeing the Real.

**Dadashri** : Is that so? Just the Real or the relative as well? The Real and the relative can be together. They cannot be alone. Therefore, when you see one, you see the other too.

**Questioner** : So we can see the relative when we see the Real.

**Dadashri** : Only if the relative is there can the Real be seen and if the Real is seen, then the relative is seen without fail. It is an inseparable relationship, if one is there, then the other is there for sure. The Real is that which is 'seeing' the relative.

**Questioner** : But one can see the Real by becoming the Real, right?

**Dadashri** : Yes he can. That which has no other action other than knowing-seeing the relative, is the Real. The whole world is in the relative; it is involved in all other activities except for knowing-seeing.

**Questioner** : So is seeing-knowing the relative the only action of the Real?

**Dadashri** : Yes, nothing else can 'see'.

## What separates the two is pragna, the energy of the awakened Self

**Questioner** : When one goes out seeing the Real and the relative, who does the 'seeing'? Is Shuddhatma doing the 'seeing'?

**Dadashri** : It is pragnya, the energy of the awakened Self, doing the 'seeing'; the Self does not. And when pragna 'sees', it goes in the 'account' of the Self. There is a difference between the seeing and knowing done by the intellect ( _buddhi_ ) and the seeing and knowing done by pragnya. That done by the former is based on the senses ( _indriyagamya_ ) and the knowing-seeing done by the latter is beyond and above the senses ( _ati-indriyagamya_ ).

We can recognize all that is temporary (relative), can we not? All that we can see with the mind-speech-body; what we see with our eyes, hear with our ears; it is all relative.

**Questioner** : That is true, but who separates the Real and the relative?

**Dadashri** : It is pragna within that separates the two. It separates what is of the Real and also what is of the relative.

**Questioner** : So that means that there are these three things: Real, relative and pragnya. So then pragna is a separate thing from the Real, is it not?

**Dadashri** : Pragnya is the energy of the Real but it is the energy that has come outside. When there is no relative on the outside, then pragnya becomes one with the Real, the Self.

## Line of Demarcation between Real and relative

Only the tirthankars have made a line of demarcation between the Real and the relative. No one else has done that. Kundkundacharya had done so but that too he did so through a connection with Shri Simandhar Swami. Ours is Real, that is why a line of demarcation has been made between the Real and the relative. From that point onwards it became eternal. A very good line of demarcation has been made. Only that is of value, no?

People believe the relative to be the Real. In some cases they believe the Real to be relative. That confusion has been removed, has it not? That is why the day after attaining this Gnan, one becomes alive (enlightened) the Self becomes awakened. That is the reason, is it not? Otherwise one can never be enlightened.

Our line of demarcation between the Real and the relative is very accurate. And the whole world is trapped in it. People are not aware of this line of demarcation between the Real and the relative that is necessary, and so an accurate line of demarcation is never drawn for them and consequently the whole world has become trapped. Conflicts between the Real and the relative do not stop and that is why they cannot attain the Self.

**Questioner** : When one knows the Real, then only one will know the relative as the relative.

**Dadashri** : One will know the relative when he knows the Real. Otherwise, if he comes to know the relative completely, then he will know the Real. Just as if one knows what wheat is, then what else is left? The grit mixed in it. And what if one knows only the grit, then what remains? The wheat. He will be able to recognize that the wheat and grit are mixed together, will he not?

**Questioner** : Dada, that means that people today have not even known the relative as relative, have they?

**Dadashri** : They have not known anything, have they? It would be good if they completely know the relative, but people have not known even a fraction of the relative. They have not known anything. On the contrary they have incurred loses. If they know the relative, that leaves only the Real to be known. Otherwise the proper line of demarcation of 'this is Real and this is relative', will not be made, will it?

**Questioner** : One cannot do it on his own.

**Dadashri** : No. One has no awareness at all, does one? He does not know what is written in the scriptures. The scriptures cannot contain the complete word (Gnan).

**Questioner** : Hence, ultimately that will be established only if he meets a Gnani.

**Dadashri** : Otherwise it will not happen. It has not happened. Because the four Vedas themselves say, 'This is not that...this is no that.' The Self cannot be put (for the purpose of attaining) in the books.

## Every Atma is Shuddhatma

When one starts to see Shuddhatma (pure Self) in every atma (self), one becomes a _Paramatma_ (Absolute Self) himself from there on. Otherwise, 'this is my brother-in-law', 'he is my uncle', 'he is my servant', 'he is my secretary' or 'he is my boss'; all that is an illusion ( _branti_ ). The one who realizes that there is Shuddhatma in everyone, has attained the state of _Paramatma_. But this is the beginning of the progression towards the _Paramatma_ state. The climbing of the real steps comes now. He is considered to have entered the gates of _moksha_ and started the progression. All the religions have to come together here; at the point of entry into the 'gates of _moksha_ '. They have to come together at this point when they being the progression. That is considered as making progress; the progression begins from the moment the awareness of Shuddhatma is attained. From there on he will continue to attain the experience ( _anubhav_ ) step by step. Hence the moment one realizes that 'every atma (self) is a Shuddhatma', the progression towards the _Paramatma_ begins.

# [3] Settle files with equanimity

## With equanimity, the world goes out of memory

The world has arisen from _vishambhav_ ( _raag-dwesh,_ attachment-abhorrence), it will cease with _samabhav,_ (absence of _raag-dwesh_ equanimity )

**Questioner** : There are many files, so when they come...

**Dadashri** : There is no problem if the files come but does 'I am _Shuddhatma'_ remain in Your awareness ( _dhyan_ , _laksha_ ) or not? If you decide that you want to go to Mumbai this evening, will that not remain in your _dhyan_ awareness or not?

**Questioner** : That will be in my awareness; that _laksha_ will be there..

**Dadashri** : That verily is the awareness ( _laksha_ ). That awareness should not be missed. There is constant awareness ( _jagruti_ ). The files will come and go, come and go. Then it will gradually become less in number and light. As You now listen to _satsang_ , the layers (veils of ignorance) will go away. Now onwards, You have to listen to _satsang_.

**Questioner** : Sometimes there is a delay of two-four hours in settle a file with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : It takes time but he (the relative self) does settle with equanimity, does he not?

**Questioner** : Yes, he does.

**Dadashri** : There is no problem even if that does not happen. You have to have the inner intent of settle with equanimity. You should not worry about whether it happens or not. Then later have You settled with equanimity?

**Questioner** : Yes, that has happened.

**Dadashri** : As You do it, the energy to do so will multiply.

## Settling the file of eating with equanimity

A file is that which keeps coming into your memory; that is a file. If it does not come in memory, it cannot be called as a file. When Chandubhai asks for a snack, give it to him. When that is over, there will not be any claim from him. There should not be any claim from him, so feed him breakfast in the morning and ask him, 'Would you like some tea?' he will say, 'No, I do not drink tea.' So You say, 'Fine then'. And give him tea if he does drink it. Otherwise, he will have unnecessary complaints. So when you are talking to someone, he will keep nagging you about it, so settle everything with him; settle with equanimity.

When 'file number one is eating or drinking, You (the Self) simply keep 'seeing' what the file ate and drank. It is in its own natural state ( _dharma_ ). 'Knowing-seeing ( _gnata_ - _drashta_ )' is Your _dharma_ and eating-drinking is file number one's _dharma_. All actions are of the file and non-activity is 'Yours – the Self's'. As such, no action ( _kriya_ ) is 'ours'. 'We' are _gnata_ - _drashta_ ; we have to know and to see. Actions and activities are of all kinds; they are all of file number one. When tea and snacks come to you in the morning, settle with the file with equanimity. If there is not enough sugar in your tea, then understand that You have to settle with this file with equanimity. Do not say a word and drink it. You have to do _sambhave nikal_ – settle the file with equanimity. Then she (the wife) will know, 'Wow! He does not say anything.' She will realise there in not enough sugar when she drinks the tea, will she not? But on the contrary she will feel that you do not even say a word. She will realise that she made a mistake and so she will correct it the next time around. You do not need to improve anyone. She will nag at you if you say something. 'Do you never make mistakes?' she will say. She will disrespect you. That is how it is. Instead why not maintain your self-respect without expecting respect from others?

It is a very easy path. There is no need to read the scriptures. Everything is a file. The food that comes before you, is a file, and so is the tea you receicve. You should settle with them with equanimity. 'I do not drink tea, I do not do this and I do not do that...'; there should be none of that. And if you do not drink tea, then just put the tea aside without bringing it to anyone's attention. Why must you make a big settle of it? 'But I don't drink tea!' he will say. People create so much fuss, don't they? They do a lot of interference ( _dakho_ ).

You will not find a solution in the _kramik_ path. Our Akram path is such that You will find a quick solution. Starting with the body and everything related to it is considered a 'file'. One can let go of his attachment to his wife and children, attachment ( _raag_ ) to his home, but how can one let go of attachment to hunger?

## What is considered a file?

You have settled the file of sleep with equanimity?

**Questioner** : Yes, I did that.

**Dadashri** : That is a file too. So if You do not settle with it, then you will fall asleep sitting down. So if You settle with it, then it will settle down. Similarly, when you feel hungry; that too is a file. Anything that causes you pain or suffering is a file. If you want to go to the toilet and there is a que for it, then that is considered a file. A problem! Sitting down to eat is a file too. Hey, even a hot breeze is a file. Do you not have to settle with equanimity? Cold breeze is a file too. What is not a file?

**Questioner** : Pushing and shoving in a train, should I consider that a file?

**Dadashri** : It will be settled only if you consider it a file, will it not? You have to settle the files with equanimity; only then will the file not remain pending. Until that account is settled, the books of _karma_ will not be cleared; it will not be discharged ( _nikal_ ) completely. This is _roonanubandha,_ account of _karma_ bound in the past life. There are all kinds of names in the account book. Even the who asks, 'How are you Chandubhai', is a file. Do other people say anything to you? They do not have anything to do with you. You have some connection to only some five to twenty-five thousand people (files), that is all. Just for that account, You have to come back and interact with the whole world. Therefore, if You clear the accounts, if You settle the files with equanimity, if you settle with all the files with equanimity, then they will be cleared. Dad is also a file. After you get married, file number two will come, will it not? Is everyone not a file?

**Questioner** : Why is it necessary to settle the file with equanimity – _samabhavey nikal_?

**Dadashri:** Before you had done the wrong _bhaav_ (deep inner intent) so now it is necessary to do the right _bhaav_. You have not maintained equanimity; you have done it the wrong way therefore now You have to maintain equanimity. When you have a sum that is a result of a multiplication, then you have to divide it to arrive at the original value and if the sum that presents now is the result of a division, then you have to multiply inorder to arrive at the undivided value. Therefore, both need to be brought to a zero, and that is settle with equanimity.

## Only the _nischaya_ does the work

**Questioner** : Is there any _kriya_ , action, involved in settle a file with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : There is no action involved. You just need to decide in your mind, 'I want to remain Dada's Agna. I want to settle the file with equanimity'; that is it. Then You don't need to do any action. You want to settle the matter with equanimity; that is Your exclusive deep inner intent. After that whatever happens is a different thing. However, it has a scientific effect. If you decide this way from within, then it has an effect on the other person and it helps in a scientific way and if you decide from within that 'I want to sort him out today', then also it will have an effect on the other person. So this is the best instrument that has been given to you; do _samabhave nikal_ – settle with equanimity.

After becoming a _purush_ (the Self), only _purushartha_ (remaining in five Agna) is required. The settlement of file will happen on its own for sure. You don't need to do anything. Previously intents like, 'what does this man think of himself?' - such wrong _bhaav_ used to happen. These should not happen now. He may do anything to you, he may throw a lot of tantrums; it will not affect You, the Self. You have to decide with tenacity to settle the matter with equanimity. Then things will happen just that way.

## Can weapons be picked up in equanimity?

**Questioner** : How is it possible nowadays to settle with equanimity as you suggest? In our daily life, how can I tell whether certain incidents merit picking up a weapon or not?

**Dadashri** : You are not to pick up any weapon. Even if the other person is picking up a weapon, You should not. You should not even if he does not pick up a weapon. You just settle with him, with equanimity. You do not need to know anything else; You only need to keep in mind the sentence 'I want to settle with equanimity'. This is Akram Vignan; no one will bother you even a bit if You remain the five Agna.

## So much power and energy in the word 'file'!

When You say 'our' words that, 'I want to settle with equanimity', then no matter how bad the other person is, even then the settlement with equanimity, will happen for sure. There is so much _vachanbada_ energy and power placed in these words, that no pain ( _dukha_ ) will touch the One who uses it; not even the _dusham kaad_ (the current era of the Time Cycle) will touch him; that much of 'Vignan' (that which brings ultimate results on its own) has been placed in it.

What is considered a file? It is not a file if you have nothing to do with it. Are these Americans (tourists) our files? If they are passing, we will not have attachment ( _raag_ ) or abhorrence ( _dwesh_ ) towards them. That, which causes attachment and abhorrence in us, is our file. Wherever you have attraction ( _aasakti_ ); that is your file. So you should understand that your file has come. Before Gnan, you used to say, 'My sister-in-law has come', and attachment ( _raag_ ) used to happen on her. The moment you say, 'My sister-in-law', attachment happens. But attachment breaks the moment you say, 'file'. When you say, 'the file has come', attachment breaks. Really, attachment as well as abhorrence, for us _mahatmas_ is gone; we have become _vitarag_ (absolutely free from attachment and abhorrence). But you still have to settle with all the accounts of the worldly life, right? If the family is big, then it will take a little time.

All mental problems, physical problems and externally induced problelms ( _aadhi_ , _vyadhi_ and _upadhi_ , respectively) are only with the files. If you say, 'my...mine...' then the files will latch on to you; _aadhi, vyadhi_ and _upadhi_ will latch on to you, but if You say 'this is a file', then it is separate and so are You. Therefore You will experience _samadhi_. That which _aadhi, vyadhi_ and _upadhi_ does not touch, is called _samadhi_.

## The understanding of settling with equanimity

**Questioner** : The main thing I have to keep in awareness ( _laksha_ ) is to interact in the world with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : That is all; You have to settle with equanimity. All You have to do is to remain the five Agna and that verily is _samabhave nikal_ , settle with equanimity. Whether the other person settles or not is a different matter. If the other person is behaving badly, we do not have any problem with that. We are not responsible for that.

When you see a man coming towards you and you know that he is going to get upset, then right away you should decide in your mind that you want to settle with him, with equanimity. Inspite of that, he gets upset with you and even 'Chandubhai' (file number one) gets upset with him. 'You' had decided not to and still Chandubhai got upset with him, that itself is considered as having done _samabhave nikal_ , dealt with equanimity. What was Your decision? You wanted to settle with him with equanimity, and yet the 'arrow' got released. You are not responsible for that.

**Questioner** : But if I adjust to the other file, is that not considered as settle with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : When a file comes and in the mind there is a decision that there is going to be a problem with him, then You should decide that You want to settle with him, with equanimity. Having decided this, know that whatever happens thereafter is correct, those are all natural circumstances, I do not have any problem with that. If it does not happen, then to have the inner intent of 'I want to settle with equanimity the next time round for sure' is an intent in which the _purushartha_ _bhaav_ is inherent. You are told to be careful because the slope you are approaching is slippery and you will fall. That is why you have to settle with that file with equanimity. If you slip having decided You want to settle with equanimity, then there is no problem. Did You not remain in our Agna? So the One, who remains in the Agna does not incur any liability.

## The inner intent of equanimity should not be broken

**Questioner:** If a file is an obstruction in the path of liberation, and does not settle with equanimity, then can I tie it with a red string, and file it away high up on a shelf and say, 'I will take care of you when I become alert and cuationed. But right now you leave.' Will it work or not?

**Dadashri:** You don't have to do such a thing. You have to make the intent of, 'I want to settle with equanimity,' nothing else. So your deep inner intent for the other person, will not spoil; for the file. Why do You need to worry whether it happens or not? Why are you doing a difficult thing and setting aside such an easy thing? It is so simple and easy. It is simple because You just have to remain in the Agna. 'You' don't have to see anything else. Other than this, it is not possible for a human being to do anything else. If settlement does not happen with equanimity then what else can be done there? Do you need to take unnecessary trouble? Should you bang your head the way people bang a coconut? Whatever happens is right and correct. Yes, Your intent should be exact.

**Questioner:** I often ask from You, 'Dada, You give me the _shakti_ (energy) to bring about a settlement with these files.'

**Dadashri** : Yes, you should ask for that too. But after making the request, you should keep on doing your work. Do not stop asking. In regards to asking, if a file is difficult and sticky, then you have to ask for the energy. But you should not wait after asking; to wait for anything is an offence.

**Questioner** : Dada, is it so that when the other person's mind does not get satisfied then he yells and complains?

**Dadashri** : It is not like that! He complains on the basis of _karma_. He may even complain after the resolution ( _samadhan_ ). What You have to decide is that you want to resolve ( _samadhan_ ) every file. 'I want to settle every file with equanimity; come what may,' this must be Your tenacious decision. You don't need to see whether it happens accordingly or not. What happens based on which _karma_ – this you will not be able to understand. But since You made a decision not to commit any fault, You have become faultless. No matter how bad that file may be, no matter how good it may be, You don't need to see whether it is your fault or his fault; You don't need to see that, Your only duty is to settle the file with equanimity.

'You' have decided so there is no problem. What is the extent of your responsibility? You are liable for the your lack of decision. People will behave badly with a bad person and nicely with a nice person; people keep doing things that are topsy-turvy, but You have to remain nice even with bad people and remain nice with a good person. We want to remain equanimous with everybody, because we are travelers of another town, not of this town. We are travelers of _moksha marg_ \- path of liberation; we are not travelers of _sansar marg_ – the worldly life. If you are a traveler of _sansar marg_ then you have to leave the wrong thing and do good things.

**Questioner:** Dada, even then occasionally, all of sudden, 'he—Chandubhai' throws a bomb.

**Dadashri:** That will happen, no problem. You don't have to worry. When he explodes, 'You' have to 'see' that too, 'Wow Chandubhai! You still have some bombs! ' You have to hassle Chandubhai a little but do not reprimand him too much.

Our decision ( _nischaya_ ) must not break. 'He is like this and it is his mistake... it is your mistake – where is my fault in this?' Such things should not be there. Fault is yours only. It is not a question of whose fault it is. You just have to settle with equanimity.

## Don't look at the resolution; remain in the Agna

**Questioner** : I feel that if a resolution ( _samadhan_ ) happens in a certain way for the other person, then I have settled the file with equanimity, but this does not happen, in the unfolding circumstance.

**Dadashri** : Resolution ( _samadhan_ ) may or may not happen; You don't have to see that. That is not what I have told You. I have given You the Agna to settle with equanimity ( _samabhav_ ). If You remain the Agna, it does not matter to Me whether the resolution happens or not. I do not want that. It depends on the _prakruti_ (the non-Self complex) of the other person. On the contrary if you 'do' try (doership) to settle with equanimity then he will come after you with his shoes. It depends on his _prakruti_. Our Agna is not like that. Our Agna is for You to settle with equanimity, Your decision must be tenacious. The decision must not change.

You don't have to see whether a resolution happens or not, all You have to 'see' is whether You followed Dada's Agna or not? Later if you want to find out ways of bringing about a resolution, it is fine. But at that time, such resolution ( _samdahan_ ) may not happen. That depends on the _prakruti_ of the other person.

**Questioner** : If the other person is not satisfied then everybody will start doubting my equanimity.

**Dadashri** : No. There is no need to see whether you are in equanimity or not, is there? To remain Dada's Agna, is it Your decision or not? Why do you need to harbor a doubt? You have followed Dada's Agna.

Say I tell you to start walking to this man's home without looking back. Then if you had made up your mind that you don't want to look back and yet your eyes happened to glance back, then there is no problem. Your decision is the must, after that even if you look back twice; I don't have a problem with that. You must not lose Your tenacity to follow the Agna . You are not to doubt at the time you looked with, 'I made a mistake in looking back, and now what will Dada say?' Not like that. 'I want to definitely and tenaciously remain in Dada's Agna.' That is all. The _prakruti_ will look at everything. The biggest thing is to make the decision to remain in Dada's Agna.

**Questioner** : I decide with tenacity every morning that I want to remain in Dada's Agna only. Then the _prakruti_ may or may not let it happen accordingly.

**Dadashri** : It will not let it happen but that does not mean that you should think that _prakruti_ does not let you do that. So should You let it loose? You should tell the _prakruti_ , 'do whatever you want to, I am not with you.' But, You should remain just that tenacious and unyielding.

**Questioner** : Then the mind says that despite the decision, I cannot stay in Agna, so then, am I not being disobedient to Dada? Am I?

**Dadashri** : No. You are not being disobedient but along with this be vigilant that the _prakruti_ does not trap you. The _prakruti_ may tempt you. What this _prakruti_ cannot do? The _prakruti_ is _nischetan-chetan_ , lifeless living element. It is not an ordinary thing. You just need to decide that You want to remain in Dada's Agna.

## Cling to the decision tenaciously

**Questioner:** Many times I miss doing the settlement of a file with equanimity.

**Dadashri:** When you do not miss this; that is the real thing.

**Questioner:** I continue to feel remorse that I am not able to settle with equanimity after attaining Dada's Gnan.

**Dadashri:** Your decision that you want to settle with equanimity is necessary. I pardon the fact that you are not able to. In interacting with a file, you forget Your _nischaya_ to settle with equanimity; such unawareness ( _ajagruti_ ) should not be there. There _purushartha dharma_ , the religion of the Self, remaining in five Agna, should be there. You must not forget.

**Questioner** : If I make a decision ( _nischaya_ ) and constantly keep in my deep inner intent that I want to settle these files with equanimity, then is it all right?

**Dadashri** : Your _nischaya_ is fine. Gradually however, You also need to check and 'see' if the inner result of being in equanimity ( _vartey_ ) is there or not.

**Questioner** : I will 'see' that, there is no problem in that.

**Dadashri** : Then there is no problem; then it is correct.

_Nischaya_ is independent, _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) is _paradhin_ dependent on other factors, and the result ( _parinaam_ ) is _paradhin_ of _paradhin_. We are in _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) but what about result? Therefore You should make the decision ( _nischaya_ ) only. _Vyavahar_ is _paradhin_ , dependent on other factors . You should not worry at all about the worldly life interactions - _vyavahar_. You have to make a decision that You want to remain in the Agna, after that, in the worldly interaction, if You are able to follow them or not, is dependent on _vyavahar_. However, in your mind there should be no loophole such as 'never mind, I can let go a little here!' There is no need for You to make it slack.

You make a decision that, 'I want to follow the five Agna for sure.' If you cannot follow them, then do not feel responsible for that. Don't 'we' know that too? 'We' also know that _vyavahar_ is _paradhin_ dependent on other factors. But you should not misuse the fact deliberately. From within you should not feel that 'what's wrong if I am not able to remain the Agna?' or even the lax attitude of 'it is fine if I am able to remain in them', that should not be there.

What 'we' are certifying as 'Agna followed', is whatever Agna You are able to remaining, remain in them with ease. And if you missed following it, then the inner state should be of 'it should not be so'. That is all. Both the above qualify as having followed the Agna.

## Neither attachment nor abhorrence; that is equanimity

**Questioner** : Dada has not said 'settle the file'; He has said to 'settle the file with equanimity'. Why is that? What comes in equanimity ( _samabhav_ )?

**Dadashri** : Equanimity means it is wrong if a loving feeling for anyone. Do not let the loving feeling come to You. And if someone does anything that you do not approve of, You should not let any aversion arise towards him either. 'You' should not become pleased or displeased.

**Questioner** : But I am not able to maintain absolute equanimity ( _samatabhav_ ) that You are talking about.

**Dadashri** : You do not have to keep _samatabhaav_ (absolute equanimity); You have to settle the file with equanimity. Equanimity ( _samabhav_ ) means that You should not have attachment ( _raag_ ) for the one who says nice things about you and You should not have abhorrence ( _dwesh_ ) for the one who curses you. That is how You have to settle with equanimity. Should one not understand what _samabhave nikal,_ settle with equanimity, means? One should understand this from the Gnani Purush. One person is cursing him and another showers him with flowers, and yet He does not feel attachment towards the one showering flowers, or abhorrence towards the one cursing him.

You have to settle with everyone without _raag_ or _dwesh_ , attachment or abhorrence; nothing else. You are not to do any _raag-dwesh_ even if a person takes you to court. _Raag-dwesh_ should not happen even in the slightest, towards the other person, during any interaction. There is no such thing as right or wrong with the Lord. You just have to settle the discharging _karma_.

There should not be any _raag_ - _dwesh_ in the discharge of _karma_. Discharge is the stock of _karma_ filled in the past life. 'We' (the Self) do not mix with it, so it is not considered _raag_ - _dwesh_. _Raag_ - _dwesh_ happens when new _karma_ is being charged. There is discharge in the state of Gnan, therefore settle it with equanimity.

_Samabhaav_ (equanimity) does consider profit and loss as equal and similar. In _samabhav_ there is no problem if instead of profit there is loss and there is no problem if profit comes along. There is no elevation from the profit and no depression from the loss; hence there is nothing there. You who have attained the Self have become _dwandvatita_ , beyond all dualities. This whole world is trapped in duality.

## See with equanimity, the wrestling of the non-Self complexes

**Questioner** : There is only this much of a problem. If the other person is cursing, then equanimity ( _samabhav_ ) does not remain.

**Dadashri** : You will not have that problem now. Do not say that again. You had that problem when you were Chandubhai, is that not so? Now you have become _Shuddhatma_ , You have gone through a whole change within, so You will not have any problems now. Through worldly interaction, through the relative view-point, he too (the other person) is there through the name and from the real view-point, he is a _Shuddhatma_. So if he is a _Shuddhatma_ , then the one doing the cursing is the relative entity. And that too he is not cursing You, the Self; he is saying it to the relative self. So the wrestling of the _pudgals_ (non-Self complexes of thoughts, speech and acts) is dependent upon _karma_ ; that You have to keep 'seeing'. 'You' keep 'seeing', when the two _pudgals_ (non-Self complexes) are clashing. 'See' who won and who lost, who struck whom? Can You not 'see' all that? Have you not seen a wrestling match? Now 'see' this wrestling. So this is a wrestling between the _pudgals_ ; your _pudgal_ and his _pudgal_ wrestle and that is dependent on unfolding of _karma_ ; is either one of you at fault in that? All of that should be seen as _shuddha_ pure only. Do You see it that way or not?

**Questioner** : That is still the problem; equanimity does not remain.

**Dadashri** : Why not? Who cannot mantain that? It is Chandubhai who cannot? What have You got to do with it? Why are You unnecessarily siding with Chandubhai?

**Questioner** : That separation does not happen, that is the problem?

**Dadashri** : It has already been separated. You have to arrange that in conduct ( _vartan_ ). If it moves away this way, You have to push it back into place and repair it. When it becomes separate, do You not have to crank the handle for a couple of days, to keep it separate?

The wrong belief 'I am Chandubhai' will not refrain from bringining on _vishamata_ (attachment and abhorrence, _raag-dwesh_ ) and with 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' settlement with equanimity happens for sure..

## The secret of equanimity and settlement

**Questioner** : I want to settle a file, but in that You mention only one intent; intent of equanimity ( _samabhav_ ).

**Dadashri** : When you make a decision in your mind with equanimity, it will have an effect on the other person's mind.

**Questioner** : Then please explain the meaning of the word _samata_?

**Dadashri** : If _vitaragata_ (absolutely free from attachment and abhorrence) remains within, then externally there will be _samata_ (absolute equanimity). In order to attain the state of _vitaragata_ , You are told to settle with equanimity. When You settle with equanimity, the result of doing so, will be a gain of few degrees of _vitaragata_. As one continues to settle with equanimity, degrees of _vitaragata_ will be attained.

**Questioner** : But what is the difference between _samata_ and _samabhav_?

**Dadashri** : Difference is there. You have to 'do', You have to settle with equanimity.

**Questioner** : But something can be settled even with maintaining _samata_ , can it not? If this man tries to provoke me and I bow down to him, is that not called _samata_?

**Dadashri** : No, that is not considered _samata_. That is considered settle with equanimity. It is _samata_ , when someone slaps you and you bless him; there is _samata_ at that time (absolute equanimity). When not a slightest of change happens within, that is _samata_. Whereas this settle means that there maybe changes within, but he settles it with equanimity. He will not let it get any worse. The problem will not go any further from there; it will decrease or resolve.

What does _samabhav_ mean? If a scale tips on one side, one will add something on the other side to balance it out. For how long can a weighing scale remain steady if you use a frog as your weight? Still _samabhav_ is considered the best intent ( _bhaav_ ). One is trying to balance it, is he not? Whereas _samata_ means that there is no _raag_ (attachment) towards the one who is showering you with flowers and no _dwesh_ (abhorrence) towards one throwing stones at you; on the contrary you bless him (one throwing the rocks).

**Questioner** : Now the third word; please explain settle with natural and spontaneous intent ( _sahaj bhaave nikal_ ).

**Dadashri** : Settle with natural and spontaneous intent ( _sahaj bhaave nikal_ ); that is 'ours', in many things. _Sahaj bhaav_ means that it happens without any effort.

**Questioner** : So that is not for us worldly people?

**Dadashri** : Of course it is. That stock is there too. But for 'us', a great settlement of it is _sahaj_ – natural.

**Questioner** : In order to 'settle naturally and spontaneously ( _sahaj_ _bhave_ _nikal_ )' give us an example for the worldly people.

**Dadashri** : What does _sahaj_ _bhaav_ (spontaneous and natural intent) mean? It has to be _pragamelu_ \- has come into effect). _Pragamelu_ means that intent made in the past life manifests naturally and spontaneously now. And to settle means that right now it is possible for you. Whatever intents you had made in the past life, they will help you today. But those old intents are _sahaj_ (natural), they are simply discharging; that is all an effect.

**Questioner** : That is correct. It comes very easy to You.

**Dadashri** : Naturally and spontaneously.

**Questioner** : Yes, now the fourth one. _Chaturya_ (cleverness; smart), _chaturai_ (to employ cleverness), _kaushalya_ (skill)?

**Dadashri** : Yes, there are two kinds of _kaushalya_. One is worldly _kaushalya_ and the other is spiritual _kaushalya_ , which is the Gnani's _kaushalya_. Gnani's _kaushalya_ is such that, when someone says something and it hurts seven other people, the Gnani will use his _kaushalya_ and use such words that they will not hurt the one who said the hurtful thing and alleviate the hurt of the other seven. That is called _kaushalya_ , which we refer to as _buddhikada_ (intellectual skill). _Gnankada_ (spiritual skill) and _buddhi-kada_ (intellectual skill). _Kaushalya_ goes into _buddhikada;_ it is kind of an intellectual art. Just a few words will pacify everyone.

**Questioner** : Out of these four words, You said just one word ' _samabhav_ ' to settle the files. It is not worth using the rest of the words.

**Dadashri** : Yes. You have to maintain _samabhav_. If You do _sambhave nikal_ (settle with equanimity), then only, will all those steps come to You. Did you understand ' _samabhave_ _nikal_ '? That is it; there is nothing else in it. 'We' do only that which the Vitargas did and that is exactly what 'we' show You.

## Want a just solution or want to settle with equanimity?

**Questioner** : What is the difference between _samadhan vruti,_ inclination for satisfactory closure and _sambhave nikal_ , settle with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : Of course there is a difference between the two. _Sambhave_ _nikal_ and _samadhan_ _vruti_. What is our _vruti_ (tendency) like? What is the nature of our tendencies ( _vrutis_ )? They seek satisfaction everywhere in every situation. And this _sambhave nikal_ (settle with equanimity) means to settle with equanimity (without _raag-dwesh_ ) whether we get a satisfactory solution ( _samadhan_ ) or not. So You have to settle, with equanimity. So when is there a tendency to look for satisfactory closure?It is there in worldly interactions where you look for justice and injustice; whereas in _sambhave nikal,_ You are not to look for justice or injustice.

Once I had loaned five hundred rupees to an acquaintance. This incident happened before Gnan. 'We' would never ask for the return of the money. So our accountant one day asked, 'Should I write him a letter. It has been two years since he borrowed the money?' I told him, 'No do not write to him. He will feel bad.' Then I met him in the street one day. So I told him, 'The accountant was thinking about writing you a letter. Please return the five hundred rupees.' So he tells me, 'Which five hundred are you talking about?' I told him, 'Did you not borrow them two years ago? You may come and check the books.' He says to me, 'You are mistaken, I loaned you the money.' I realized that I would never get to see or know such a 'design' again my entire life. So it was my tremendous fortune that this man had come to teach me the great lesson today. So what did I tell him? I said to him, 'Perhaps it is my mistake, why don't you come to my home this afternoon.' Then I gave him a cup of tea, gave him the money and got a signed receipt from him. I am not going to meet another person like this in my life again. Alas! I lost not five hundred but a thousand rupees, but at least I got to learn that there are also these kind of people in this world. So then one will have the intent of being cautious in future, no? But what kind of a man I met! We would never have imagined such a man in our dreams! Let alone his benevolence!

Now in this case, if you were to seek inner satisfaction ( _samadhan vrutti_ ) where will you find it? 'We' settle it promptly, with equanimity. Did you understand what I am saying? After all we do not want to stay in this _bhanjghad_ (recurring cycle of destroying ( _bhanj_ ) and creating ( _ghad_ ) relationships) and the fact that he took the five hundred rupees is not under his _satta_ (realm); he is a _nimit_ \- evidentiary instrument in the realm of scientific circumstantial evidences ( _vyavasthit_ ). He wants to do such business so _vyavasthit_ provides him all such circumstances, his intent is such and you were meant to lose from your account. Thus 'we' get to learn a lesson. You might not have seen such a person in your life, have you?

Otherwise how discouraged would you get about five hundred rupees? As it is you easily end up spending five hundred rupees for a hotel; would you not? If you were to visit Mumbai and if there is a nice hotel then will you not spend five hundred rupees for two days? And when you lose five hundred rupees this way, you feel like someone stabbed you in your chest. That is because you are looking for inner satisfaction. How is that going to happen? It will not happen with the one who speaks totally wrong. Therefore settle with equanimity. Right or wrong, close that case. Vengeance ( _veyr_ ) will not be bound (for an effect to continue in the next life) or anything of the sort. Do whatever it takes. 'We—the Gnani' allow ourselves to be cheated by the greedy one to make him happy. 'We' give respect to a _maani_ (the one established in pride and self-validation) and make him happy. 'We' would try to make them happy anyway 'we' can and we move forward. 'We' would not get stuck with these people. Adjust everywhere; there is no place or situation where 'we' will not adjust.

**Questioner:** If we try to adjust like this, will the purity of worldly interaction ( _vyavahar shuddhi_ ) remain?

**Dadashri:** It will definitely remain. What is the meaning of _vyavahar shuddhi_ \- purity in worldly interaction? When one does not hurt anyone - that is called life. To seek justice is not called _vyavahar shuddhi_. And when you try to bring about justice-injustice in this, one will become unhappy and another will become happy. Do you understand me exactly what I mean by _samadhan vrutti_ (the inclination for satisfactory closure) and _samabhave nikal_ \- settle the matter with equanimity?

Questioner: Yes.

**Dadashri:** That's all, enough. One never attains _samadhan_ -satisfaction in all situations. If you try to look for satisfaction, you will get it ten places and not in two places; on top of that it will fracture your mind.

Not a single stain has tained 'our' mind. If someone were to call me a rogue right now, I would tell him, 'brother you are right. Do you have anything more to say? Now explain to me on what basis you are calling me a con man.' Then he says, 'it is written on the back of your coat, 'con man'.' Then it is correct.

## Should you tolerate it or swallow it?

**Questioner** : So, then does settle with equanimity mean to swallow it? Should I keep the intent that it should manifest in my conduct?

**Dadashri** : To swallow does not mean that You remained in _samabhav_ (maintained equanimity). You just have to have inner intent that You want to settle with equanimity. When you decide that you want to go to a certain town, then there is no problem if you cannot go there, but you have to decide that. Before you did not use to decide that You want to settle with equanimity. Thus this tradition began. Now if You decide that, and then accidents happen, that is a different matter. But You have to decide that You want to settle with equanimity every time. You do not have to swallow it, tolerate it. Whether you swallow it or throw it up, it is a different matter. Both are considered as 'vomiting'. You should not suppress vomiting. You will cause a 'disease' if you suppress it.

When you settle with equanimity, that verily is presence of _Shuddhatma_. Thereafter if Chandubhai becomes irritated, that is different matter, and You the One settle with equanimity, are separate.

**Questioner** : Dada, who can settle with equanimity? Is it the One who has attained Gnan or can others also do so?

**Dadashri** : Others do not have words like ' _samabhave_ _nikal_ ' (settle with equanimity)! Others - those poor people have to endure through it but to tolerate or endure is a mistake ( _guno_ ). One can tolerate little matters; trivial matters can be tolerated, but when he has to suffer a major thing, the spring will rebounce and blast everyone; it will blow everyone away. So you should not tolerate; you are not to swallow anything, You have to settle with equanimity. All these people settle with equanimity.

**Questioner** : Does Dada himself swallow anything? When all these _mahatmas_ do whatever they please; Dadaji do You not swallow-put up with it?

**Dadashri** : 'We' do not have to swallow anything. 'Our' Gnan is such that, no matter what 'our' _mahatmas_ are doing, it is still acceptable to 'us'. Such is 'our' Gnan. Gnan means light. If the _mahatma_ is green, he will appear green, and if he is red, he will appear red. We see only the light and that too the _mahatmas_ is pure light. 'We' know his _prakruti_ (non-Self complex), that this is his _prakruti_. 'We' do not have to swallow anything. Tension will arise if 'we' swallowed such things. 'We' remain free, like an emperor of the whole world; with grandeur and pomp!

## Blessed is the day of the special prize!

**Questioner** : What should I do when someone slaps me?

**Dadashri** : When someone slaps you, write down that you won a prize that day. Make a note that you have not had a day like this. It is a blessing! Where can you find such a day when someone can slap you? Where would it come from for you? It would not come for you, and when it does, consider that day a blessing; a blessed day!

**Questioner** : Then how should I settle with that? What should I 'do' in settle with it with equanimity? When he slaps me, do I have to 'see' it?

**Dadashri** : Who is he? Who are 'You'? Who is 'doing' the slapping? Who is he slapping? 'You' should 'see' all that. 'You' should 'see' that this file is slapping 'Chandubhai'. He—Chandubhai too sees that this file is slapping this file. The 'seer' does not get hurt.

**Questioner** : But should I not slap him back?

**Dadashri** : Now, if 'Chandubhai' slaps him back, 'You' have to 'see' even that; You should not worry about whether to hit him back or not.

I had once, in 1961-62, said that, 'I will give five hundred rupees to anyone who comes and slaps me.' No one would come to slap me. I said, 'Why don't you slap me, if you are strapped for money?' so they said, 'No, what would become of us if we did?' Who would slap? Who would do so? When the slap comes for free, consider it a great _punyai_ (merit _karma_ effect) that he gave you such a great prize. This is a great prize! That too, you have not refrained from doing the same in the past, have you? And this is all a pay back for that.

## Then it will be solved, will it not?

You have equanimity with the whole world for sure. You have a problem with only some two hundred to five hundred people with whom you have a connection of account of _karma_ from past life ( _roonanubandha_ ). They are the ones with whom You have to settle with. Just because this has not been settled, you wander for endless lives and take on the dangers of the whole world.

**Questioner** : Dada has given this greatest discovery that we are _vitarag,_ free from attachment and abhorrence, with the whole world and that we have _raag_ - _dwesh_ , attachment-abhorrence, towards only our two hundred to five hundred or so files.

**Dadashri** : That is all; there is no other problem at all. This is the only thing you are sitting around for (before attaining _moksha_ ). If the problem were with everyone, then you can say that, 'Let it be, whatever happens is fine'. But you are stuck because of unsettled accounts with some two hundred to five hundred people. Out of the population of five billion people, we do not have any problems with everyone; it is only with some five hundred or so people, no? So settle with equanimity with these people! Follow My word please! Then final solution will come!

## Is singing of pados, spiritual songs, a charge or an effect?

What is it called when you hear or read of something you have never read or heard before? It is called _apurva_ \- unprecedented. Akram is an _apurva_ thing. The ego and attachment were to be renounced ( _tyaga_ ) and that has happened and your own pure Self was to be attained ( _grahan_ ) and that has happened. Now both tasks of acquiring and renouncing have been accomplished. So now, the problem of renouncing and acquiring is no longer there. Now remains the task of settle with equanimity. Everything is a discharge (effect), so allow settle of everything with equanimity. What other work remains to be done? You just have to settle.

**Questioner** : When that man was singing a _pada_ (spiritual hymn) You had mentioned that people must be singing this _pada_ even in the _kramik_ path too. So the _pada_ is being sung over there as well as here; it is being sung proplerly in both the places, so what is the difference?

**Dadashri** : The only difference is that he (in the _kramik_ path) is doing _grahan_ (acquiring, here charging _karma_ through the belief, 'I am singing') and here in Akram, You are doing _nikal_ (discharging _karma_ through awareness of file number one singing). There is no difference between the two in the "photography" - external conduct; the external actions are the same for both. People are looking for a change in the photography (external conduct). No; attempting to change the "photograph" (effect, conduct) means problems.

**Questioner** : How do You say that they are doing _grahan_ (charging _karma_ ) when they sing and we are settle _karma_ (discharging) by singing?

**Dadashri** : Ours is _nikali_ – being settled as it discharges without new charging. In this singing of _pada_ , we are doing _nikal_ only, are we not? One sings to do _nikal_ (settle his _karma_ ). Here everything You do, it is all being settled ( _nikali_ ).

**Questioner** : You are saying that singing _pada_ is for the clarity of Gnan; it is to strengthen the Gnan or for its clarity?

**Dadashri** : No. Not to strengthen the Gnan. He is not strengthening Gnan with it. When the _karma_ effect is unfolding, when a _pada_ comes in his hand to sing, he is simply doing _nikal_ – he is settle that matter; that is all. There is nothing left to strengthen. The Gnan is what I have given to You, there is no other Gnan. And these five Agna is the fence around it. The rest has to be settled when the unfolding of _karma_ happens.

**Questioner** : And that it is being settled does come in the awareness, but for the one in the _kramik_ path, the one who singing the _pada_ , if someone stops him in the middle of singing, he will become very angry and that will cause a problem.

**Dadashri** : He will have a huge problem. And those doing the _nikal_ , discharging the _karma_ , will stop singing without any problem. So You come to know that this is different, this is of a different quality.

A person in the _kramik_ path visits his in-laws and so does the one in the Akram path. But the one in the _kramik_ path is acquiring ( _grahan,_ charging _karma_ ) everything at his in-law's place and the one in the Akram path keeps settle (discharging _karma_ ). That is only the difference, nothing else.

One matter is that of discharge ( _nikal_ ) and the other is that of acquisition ( _grahan_ ). That is it; there are only two, no? How many departments are left? Eating-drinking, earning money, worldly life, they are all _nikali_ things and this ' _satsang_ ' is the only _grahaniya_ (being attained) thing. There are only two departments, what is the point of making a third one? The rest is unfolding of _karma_. This is all a discharging ( _nikali_ ) thing; it is not a charging ( _grahaniya_ ) thing. It is in the form of discharge. It is not happening with the intent of doership. If someone says, 'This way', I will say, 'Yes, this way.' In the _kramik_ path, they eat, drink, wear saris and jewellery and you do the same here in Akram too. The Akram method is different and that other method is different. There a woman will say 'I can't do without it' and she will pout for four days, and here in the Akram path she will do the same too; she will pout but she will settle with equanimity. The Atma – the Self remains separate. One just has to settle with equanimity. You neither have to do _grahan_ (attain) nor do You have to do _tyaga_ (renounce) anything, do you? Eat, drink and enjoy, but settle with equanimity!

## Nikal does not mean to dispose

**Questioner** : Does doing _nikal_ mean to dispose?

**Dadashri** : No, you do not have to dispose. Even small children will say 'dispose'. Doing _nikal_ is a big thing.

Dispose is applicable to goods. But you cannot say 'dispose' here, can you? Disposing is related to the main value of the thing and it also relates to its lesser value, but that is applicable to goods. Here we are making a settlement for those who are trapped; this is settlement or discharge of _karma_.

You have to do _nikal_ of (settle _karma_ ) what you like and also that which you do not like. There should not be any acquisition ( _grahan_ ) of what you like and renouncing ( _tyaga_ ) that which you do not like. There should not be any _raag_ (attachment) towards what you like, or _dwesh_ (abhorrence) towards what you do not like; settle the matter (file) and move on. That is called _nikal_.

## Keys for doing nikal

_Nikal_ means to not buy anything new and to keep getting rid of what is already there. And if you have to make a collection, coax and persuade him gently and slowly get your work done, and if you owe someone, then give it back to him; because the collectors will come even at two in the morning for the collection. They are free to come whatever time they want to. And when one does not give you what is owed to you, you will not have any _kashaya_ , anger-pride-deceit-greed, because you want to go to your 'country' ( _moksha_ ) and he wants to stay here. He will not let you go to your 'country' if you do any _kashaya_. So for you, if it is your account of _karma_ ( _heesab_ ) then let go of it and move on. If someone owes you money but does not pay you back, make as much an effort as possible to collect it. Get your work done through gentle persuasion; tell him, 'sir, I am in great difficultly', then out of one hundred whatever five or ten he returns is correct. Otherwise, settle with whatever is left. So in this Kaliyug (current time era of disunity of mind, speech and action and spiritual and moral decline), the 'shop' merely needs to be emptied. And I am saying just that. What does this Akram Vignan mean? It is absolute Vignan; everything has to be settled , that is all. You don't have to anything else.

If a Gnani is not around and if one understands exactly that 'I have to get rid of my shop', he will attain salvation. The 'shop' verily needs to be emptied, now. If you have to restock the shop or start a new one, then there is a problem. You empty the shop, empty the cabinets and sell off everything. But instead one will say, 'I will get rid of this item for thirty'. Hey! Not thirty; take twenty eight and get rid of it. You have to go back to your 'country' ( _moksha_ ). So then someone will ask, 'Why are we taking money for it?' We tell him, 'Will you not have to pay back to those you borrowed from?' We have to level off everything; borrowed or lent; you will find a solution if you look for it.

## The worldy life survives on the pillar of enmity

Did you settle the files with equanimity or not? You will not create vengeance ( _veyr_ ) with anyone if You settle with him, with equanimity. Do not bind any vengeance and settle the old ones. If you do not know how to do any _purushartha_ ; then do at least this much; settle the vengeance. If you have created vengeance with someone, you will know that there is vengeance towards that person, will you not? 'He keeps giving me a hard time even when I do not do anything to him', so then you will know that there is vengeance bound with him; and so settle with him, with equanimity. And settle that account of enmity ( _veyr_ ); is the greatest _purushartha_. This whole world is stuck here because of enmity . The basement of this worldly life wandering verily is vengeance; nothing else. This world does not exist on attachment ( _raag_ ) or love ( _prem_ ), but it exists on vengance. The moment you provoke someone heavily, he will vow to take revenge. This is the kind of people they are, they will say, 'let all my penance go towards it but I will destroy him!' they will make such a _niyanu,_ a strong resolve of wanting something wherein all one's merit _karma_ are used up in order to attain it. Therefore do not create any enmity. If you make a mistake, then ask for forgiveness and resolve that mistake. But solve that case. This world is based on vengeance, and so if there is any vengeance pending anywhwere, then give forgiveness, ask for forgiveness, even bow down to that person and do whatever it takes, but do not bind an account of vengeance. And break free from all vengeance towards that person so that it will make him happy and he will feel, 'no brother, now I don't have any problems!' Bring about a closure with him so that he does not create any obstacles for you.

It is like this; after attaining Gnan, when someone takes revenge, what is that revenge for? He is taking revenge for revenge ( _veyr_ ). As the Self he is not taking revenge. As the Self You will 'know' that revenge is being avenged, but it will still be resolved. After attaining this Gnan, You will find solution even if you have hundred enemies seeking revenge. Before attaining Gnan; if you had just one enemy, you will sow many new seeds of revenge again. You will not sow anymore such seeds after Gnan. _Karma_ will not be charged, You will not bind any _karma_ at all. So there is no problem at all, is there?

The Lord has said not to increase enmity in this life and to let go of the old one. How much peace you will experience if you let go of old enmity! Otherwise, before, our people arrongantly kept increasing enmity but they should not do that now. You have to reduce enmity day by day. This 'Dada' has no enemies because He has come having settled all enmity. In this life he has come having settled all enmity and that is exactly what 'we' are teaching You; that do not increase enmity in this life.

There are some patients who do not pay you and on the contrary get upset with you. Even if you tell him, 'Sir, it is fine if you do not pay me', he will still say, 'Doctor, I will see you in court'. 'Hey what is the point of seeing me? 'I' have already seen 'him''. Just settle the case whichever way you can. Do not do anything that will make you end up going to the court. The day your 'date' comes (the day the problem arises), settle with equanimity, otherwise the problem will become a legal issue and it will linger on and vengeance will continue to increase. You should not do that for sure.

Now when does enmity end? It is when You remain in bliss. What kind of bliss? It is the bliss of the Self and not of the non-Self – _pudgal_. Enmity can increase even when there is pleasure from the non-Self, whereas the bliss of the Self which arises in being with the Gnani Purush in _satsang_ or anywhere else; when that bliss arises within, it will break all enmity.

## Whether you like it or dislike it, it is a file only

Now, what we like, we consider even that as 'file' and what we do not like, we consider that as 'file' too. With that which you do not like, you have to settle everything sooner and with that which you like, the settlement will just happen. When you do not like a file, it means that it is a tremendous file from your past life. You will not like him the moment you see him. What should You do when such a file comes and sits in front of you? You should decide in your mind that, 'I want to settle this file with equanimity.' Then tell him, 'It is very good that you came. You came after a long time. I like that you came', 'Bring some tea and snacks for our friend here.' When You start to settle the file, it will begin to settle. But you have to do all that superfluously; dramatically (like acting in a play where there is no attachment or abhorrence within)! He will think, 'Wow! He is showing good feelings for me!' He will be happy and forget all about the vengeance. When the enmity goes away, it is settled with equanimity. When he gets up to leave, you should tell him, 'If I have done anything wrong to...', and he will say, 'No, no, you are a very good person.' So then that is settled. These people do not want anything. Just feed their ego and that is more than enough.

If someone has come to beat you up, if he has come to kill you, but if an inner intent of 'I want to settle with him with equanimity' keeps arising in your mind; then his intent will change immediately and he will put down his weapon and leave.

If you let go of prejudice towards a file, then it is possible that, that file will do as you tell him. If You remain in 'our' words, then your worldly life will run well and You can also go to _moksha_. That is how good this Vignan is, but You should know how to use it.

## The visa for moksha is in hand but the files have to be settled

_Sushamkada_ (time cycle segment of golden ages) was good, but this time era of the time cycle is the _dushamkada_ in which there is mainly pain. There is ninty-nine percent pain and one percent pleasure. So therefore, how long can you wait around? Even if one is a king, the mind will gnaw away at him, the whole daylong. How can one live like that?

Otherwise, there will be light (presence of the awakened One) after eigty four thousand years, until then how long can you keeping wandering around in pitch darkness? Instead, You should all go and sit down in Your Own place; the Self. You have met Dada and he has given You the ticket (to _moksha_ ), he has given You the visa so you can go; how can you go otherwise? You cannot even expect to do so otherwise, can you? When all the files have been settled, then You can go. They will not be settled even if you were to become a _sadhu_ (ascetic, renunciate). How can one settle files being a _sadhu_? However, one can settle all these files, sitting at home. They cannot be settled by running away (by renouncing the the family and the worldly life), can they? Will they all be settled if one were to run away?

**Questioner** : The files will chase him anyway, Dada.

**Dadashri** : The files will not chase him, but a claim against him will be made from within, will it not? Claims may not be made externally, but claims made from within will not let him go, will they? External claims are better, because one can be free of them in this very life, but inner claims are not good, they will have paid off in the next life.

## The worldly life wandering is perpetuated by enmity

Therefore let go of the enmity. This world does not stand on love. People believe that it is based on love, but no, its foundation is on vengeance. That is why 'we' ask You to settle all enmity. That is the reason for settle files with equanimity. If you love, it will arise as enmity on its own for sure. Do you know what happens to attraction ( _aasakti_ )? It will bring enmity ( _veyr_ ). And the only reason to settle with equanimity is because the world stands on vengeance. Attachment ( _raag_ ) is 'I am Chandubhai'; that verily is the _raag_. 'I am Chandubhai' is gone for You, so the _raag_ is gone. So how can you let go of enmity towards all these people? It is by settle with them with equanimity. Yes, even if someone is cursing you, You should say, 'Chandubhai, it must be your mistake, only then people will curse you openly'. Otherwise, not even a fool has time for that.

One day go to your town and advertise to everyone that you will give a hundred rupees to anyone who comes and curses you. But no, not even the poorest of poor will come. He will say, no I would rather work hard and earn five rupees than do that! Those that will do, do so only to the extent of your account _karma_ with them. If you had cursed him twice, then he will leave having deposited two curses with you. So then you wonder why he cursed you twice. Hey, if it is not from this account book of current life, then it must be from one of the previous life. From here on, why don't You make the account without profit or loss (zero out the account)? There is nothing but pending accounts. Therefore, You have to settle the files. Make the accounts without any profit or loss. You do know how to do that, do You not?

## Settle the account of karma sooner than later

**Questioner** : Whatever files I have, I keep having the inner intent that it would be good to settle them quickly.

**Dadashri** : That will remain. If your intent is of that happening soon, then it will settle soon. And some people say, 'Sir, it will be better if the obstacles do not come now.' So for him it will come late. It will come at the time of old age. He will have the obstacles at the time of old age, when the body is not strong. So do not call for it to come later. Tell everyone, 'I still have the strength; the body is strong, so if everyone comes, I will pay them today. Dada's bank is open. Come and get it. I will not give you any runaround.' This is Dada's bank; it is not a runaround-bank. This is cash payment. "This is the cash bank in the world". Therefore, you have to bring about the ultimate solution.

This is your own account of _karma_. It is your account and your signature is on it. So let them come and get it. So if someone shows you a document signed by you, then you have to tell him to come and take his payment. If the signature is for twelve hundred and you give him two hundred, a thousand will remain. Then again if you give him two hundred, eight hundred will remain. In this way when it dwindles down to nothing, then if you tell them, 'Come and get it'. They will say to you, 'Why do we have to do that now, you do not owe us anymore?' If you tell them, 'You are in pain, so why don't you pester me for some more?' He will tell you, 'How can I pester you? I can only do so if there is an account between the two of us. Even if only five rupees remain, I can pester you for five hundred. But when there is nothing to give or take, how can I come after you?' So if there is no account of _karma_ , no one is going to come after you, that is how just and orderly the world is.

## By what method do I settle?

You just have to make the decision that you want to settle with equanimity. Before, when someone came to you smiling, you used to settle with him, with a smile. If someone came to you angry and upset, you would settle with him in the same manner. But now You settle with people, with equanimuity, whether they come to you with a smile or irritated and angry. Now we just want to settle with equanimity; that is it. If there is a line of policemen standing here and they are shouting and screaming, what can we do? We should just settle with them, with equanimity, as you walk by, no? What would happen if you did not settle with them, with equanimity? A policeman may strike you with his baton. You will smarten up in this situation, will you not? That is how you have to become smart and wise up and settle with equanimity. So now do something that will maintain equanimity completely.

## Do not hurt, that is critical

**Questioner** : Is there a difference between settle with someone with equanimity and pleasing him?

**Dadashri** : You do not have to please anyone but equanimity will be maintained if you do not displease anyone. You should conduct yourself in a way that does not hurt the other person; then equanimity will be maintained. If he becomes hurt, then equanimity will not remain.

**Questioner** : When I am trying to please the other person; should I not be concerned about what is beneficial to me?

**Dadashri** : You do not have to please the other person but do not displease him. 'We' conduct ourselves in such a way, that no one becomes displeased. How can'we' please everyone?

**Questioner** : If I eat as much as he eats, then he is pleased, but should I not eat only the amount that is beneficial for me?

**Dadashri** : You should eat only the amount that is beneficial for you.

## Satisfaction for the other person will free you

What does doing _samabhave_ _nikal_ , settle with equanimity mean? It is to bring about a satisfaction in the mind of the other person. But that does not mean that because you have one hundred, it is wrong not to give him all the hundred; 'Right is right', it is not like that. That is a 'tail', you fool! (tail here means insistence, hanging on to the tail of anything). If you have only ninty and not the full hundred, then tell him that right now you do not have it all or something like that. Ask him, 'will that do or not?' He will say, 'That will do, it is fine.' Then, that is it. You should not hang on to the 'tail' of the truth, because what is truth for the world, here, it becomes untruth, if you insist on the truth. What is believed to be the truth in the world; is a societal truth, not the Lord's truth. It is relative truth and as long as one has to live a worldly life, it is useful for him. For the one who is going to _moksha_ , he has to bring about a solution in whichever way he can. The reason for telling You to 'settle the file' is so that you do not bring any rules or regulations in it. Settle it whichever way you can and put it aside. If you canot give him any closure, then bow down to him and ask him to let you go. If he does that; then the matter is considered settled. Free from any deceit. If you have it give it to him, and if you are strapped, then settle with him by bowing down to him. If he lets you go, then it is considered as _nikal_ – settled. That is enough. 'Yes, that is enough. It will do. I will now tear up the papers', he will say. But if you go to fight with him, then people are such that they will fight fiercely. 'Come on!' he will say.

**Questioner** : On the other side, I feel that if I do not tell the truth and do wrong, then that is _kapat_ (deceit).

**Dadashri** : You have to cook the rice whichever you can (You have to do whatever it takes). If it does not boil with fresh water then boil it with salty water. And if does not boil with salty water, then use any kind of water, you may even have to use the water from the gutter. But go ahead and boil the rice. You are interested in what works. These worldly people do not do that. They maintain certain insistence that, 'This is the only way I want to do it.' And our motive is for the Self. You should not be stuck in the problems of the _pudgal_ (non-Self).

## If it is not settled then is there bondage?

**Questioner** : Until a file is settled, I remain bound, do I not?

**Dadashri** : No, you are not bound at all. You should say that, 'I want to settle the file with equanimity.' Maintain such a decision.

**Questioner** : A relationship does not break by just breaking it, does it?

**Dadashri** : On the contrary it increases by breaking it. It can be solved by settle with equanimity. You have to bring about the settlement of the relationship by remaining in the parliament and not by being separate from it.

The only thing that is to be 'done' is to settle the file with equanimity. This is all ' _vyavasthit_ ' (scientific circumstantial evidence) only. In it there is no reason to harbor any fear or worries or stress. Keep on doing your work. What am I saying? Keep on doing the work as much you can. Thereafter, it is all _vyavasthit_. But there is no reason for you to harbor fear. Settle the files with equanimity; that is the only thing You have to do.

**Questioner** : I do settle files with equanimity, but what should I do if, despite this, severe emotional upheaval ( _udvega_ ) still happens in the mind?

**Dadashri** : Whether severe turmoil ( _udvega_ ) or depression ( _adhovega_ ) happens in the mind, whatever _vega_ (motion) happens, You have to keep 'seeing'. You should remain in knower-seer ( _gnata-drashta_ ) state. All the rest is lifeless ( _jada_ ). It appears as living ( _chetan_ ) but it is inanimate.

## No need for indifference in the Akram path

**Questioner:** After attaining the Self in Akram, one will be disinterested and apathetic ( _udasin_ ) in worldly life. Is this true?

**Dadashri:** There is no need for indifference ( _udasinata_ ) at all. This is not the path of indifference and apathy at all. Here, we settle. When mango juice is brought to you, you can say, 'Look, make sure you add such and such condiments in the mango juice.' And then enjoy it. You do not have to give away your favorite dish served to you. Here, you have to proceed through suffering the pleasure; there is no need to bring in indifference - _udasinata_.

**Questioner:** I am not bringing the indifference on, it happens naturally ( _sahaj_ ).

**Dadashri:** But, there is no need at all for natural _udasinata_ , in this path. This is not a path of cultivating indifference. Here, You remain My Agna and settle with equanimity. If a mango comes in front of you, eat it; whatever comes in front of you, eat all. Don't think about anything; just eat whatever comes in your plate. The state of indifference ( _udasinata_ ) happens in the path of _vairaag or vairagya_ – dispassion and indifference ( _udasinata_ ) arises from _vairagya_ dispassion. Here, in the Akram path one attains _vitaragata_ – freedom from _raag_ and _dwesh_. Here, we do not have _udasinata_ even a little, only direct _vitaragata_. You are allowed to eat sweet bread, sweet foods and everything - what is the reason? Otherwise, I would say, 'don't eat such and such things'. You can eat whatever comes in front of you. 'We' have 'seen' this in Gnan as to what is discharge and what is charge. We have called discharge as discharge. We are not telling You to interfere in discharge. The whole world believes discharge _karma_ to be charge _karma_. So, it is necessary for the world, to become indifferent.

## The home department and the foreign department

All these files of the foreign (non-Self) department should not be taken into the home (Self) department. You should leave outside the files of the foreign department and then go the home department. It is when one makes a mistake that problems arise. If you have been told at your office, 'Please do not bring these files into the office, keep them at your home.' Then will you do that the next time or not? That is what you have to do here. What else is there to do? Keep the foreign files outside. You do not need them when you are sitting in the office of the home department. Then when you go outside, then you look at them and inspect them. But there should be no files at all when you are sitting in the office of the home department. That is how we settle with them here. Do we not sign the files in the office?

**Questioner** : Yes we do.

**Dadashri** : Yes, that is how you should settle with it. Do you take them to the office? They (files) will not know that they have been kept out as the foreign. Only you will know that you are leaving them outside. They think that you are taking them to your office. That is how you have to make them believe. 'We' do that. People think, 'Wow! He took the files to his head office.' 'We' leave them outside.

There is no reason in this world that deserves getting into a conflict over it. So there is no reason at all, that should cause you pain within. This is because the Self is the state of bliss. One is the Self and no one can take away His bliss. By nature it is _avyabadha_ , beyond pain, it never renders nor receives any pain. The awakened One has such a glorious and splendid state and one should not depend on or be involved with that which is the non-Self, the foreign department. Foreign means foreign, there You have to be superflous.

If Bangladesh has floods, the Indian Prime Minister will write to their President saying he is very worried for the people there. But here in the Indian Prime Minister's office he is having tea and snacks with other leaders. The Prime minister of India all all other countires will continue with tea and snacks and write letters of condolence. That is called being superfluous. That is how You should be.

Dada gave You Gnan, now nothing is Yours. On the contrary this mind-speech-body, which used to be Yours, have been entrusted to Dada; You have surrendered these three bags. Once surrendered, one cannot use them without asking Dada. However 'we' have given you the permission saying, 'go settle the files.'

## The Gnani Purush settles with equanimity

Speak one such word, which incorporates all the files and none will be left out. So if we want to put it in only one word, then whichever _sanyog_ (situation or circumstance) comes in front of You; it is a file. Will all files be included or not included in this word ' _sanyog_ ', if you make the calculation?

The numbers of files that arise are directly in proportion to the number of circumstances ( _sanyog_ ). It may be in the form of a human being or it may be in another form or maybe in this form. The number of files is directly in proportion to the number of circumstances and they are all prone to dissociate - _viyog_. That is why, do _samabhave nikal,_ settle files with equanimity. These three people came and the files were settled with equanimity; is there any problem at all? Do ten-fifteen files not come to 'us' everyday?

**Questioner:** A lot more.

**Dadashri** : 'We' settle them all, 'we' settle with equanimity. Some maybe of a tough nature and some may be of some other such nature, but we do have to settle with equanimity, don't we?

It is in 'our' awareness for sure that 'he is _Shuddhatma -_ pure Soul' but right now he is as a 'file' for Me. You have to understand what You should do with a file. You have two visions ( _drashti_ ); from _nischaya_ , i.e. from the real view point he is faultless ( _nirdosh_ ) for sure, but with _vyavahar_ , i.e. the relative view point he is faultless also and then You have to settle with this file, with equanimity. From now on, no claim will have my name on it anywhere. So the Vignan that You have been given is such that no _sanyog_ , circumstance; can hinder You. A circumstance may happen wherein someone is snatching your purse, then you will fight or fuss in your worldly conduct ( _vyavahar_ ) but it should not affect You internally at all. Everything is a circumstance only. And no circumstance will remain forever.

Circumstances ( _sanyogo_ ) by nature are prone to dissociation ( _viyog_ ). Any circumstance that will come in front of You, is by nature, prone to dissociation. So You will not need to push it. Otherwise no one would become a _vitarag_ (absolutely free from attachment and abhorrence).

## Circumstances by nature dissociate for sure

**Questioner** : When there comes a lot of pressure from the files, how can I become free of them?

**Dadashri** : Pressure from the files is a circumstance (sanyog) and those circumstances by nature are such that they will pass, dissociate ( _viyog_ ). If you say, it will be nice if they (files) do not leave, but they will still leave. You should not ask how you can become free from them. And if you ask the files to stay, they will still go away. Because they dissociate by nature. Have I not said that?

**Questioner** : But Dada, we will have to finish what we have brought with us (from past life), will we not?

**Dadashri** : You will have to settle the files.

**Questioner** : Every moment of time is a file, is it not?

**Dadashri** : Every circumstance is a file. But those with less understanding consider important people as files. Those with greater understanding consider attraction as a file, and those with complete understanding consider every circumstance a file.

There are only these two; circumstances and _Shuddhatma_. So settle all files with equanimity and circumstances dissociate by nature. There is no need to renounce anything. If you renounce them, they will come back. If you renounce anything, it will come back in front of you again.

## Akram Gnan is working on autopilot

Our Gnan is constantly working on its own. It does not work by one 'doing' it. Gnan itself is doing everything. This is called active or working Gnan ( _sakriya_ _Gnan_ ); it works on its own. The worldly knowledge ( _gnan_ ) is inactive knowledge ( _akriya_ _gnan_ ). You have to do something for it. The knowledge (gnan) of not telling a lie, works only if you do not tell a lie; otherwise that knowledge is wasted. Whereas this Gnan, it continues to work on its own. If someone says something negative, at that time the Gnan itself from within will say, 'settle with equanimity', whereas that other does nothing. And no action ( _kriya_ ) happens without circumstance. Circumstance itself is action and action itself is a circumstance. And that verily is the _pudgal_ (non-Self complex). There is only the Self and the _pudgal_ (non-Self); only the Self and the circumstances, and circumstances are by nature prone to dissociation. So if it becomes necessary for you to push a circumstance aside and you try to do so, then you are not remaining as the Self, You lose the state of the Self. The ego arises when you go to remove or push a circumsrtance. Therefore circumstances will dissociate by their nature, so they will be settled on their own if You just 'see' them.

When the leg sustained a fracture; the circumstance of 'not walking' had met the leg, but that too, it left on its own, no? No matter what the circumstances, they all come together and then dissipate, do they not? They do not come to stay.

If 'we' were not in bliss ( _anand_ ), then the difficulties would have doubled. Difficulties have arisen and they will slowly pass. Because, the difficulty that has arisen is a circumstance; is by its nature, prone to dissociate. You should not try to get rid of it. It has come but it will leave. So you need to be patient. If you try to push it away, it will give rise to a mistake, for which it-the circumstance will have a claim against you.

**Questioner** : I experience great equanimity.

**Dadashri** : That is enough; that will come. Does the wind not blow very hard at times? Does the wind blow or not? Do wind gusts not blow things away? So that too will stop and things will get back to how they were.

**Questioner** : Dada, right now it feels as if a hurricane has come.

**Dadashri** : Hurricanes will come. Then it will be safe when it goes away. The hurricanes will come for everyone. When that happens, close the doors and windows and sit inside. And when it goes away in two hours, then open the doors again. Similarly, when a hurricane comes to you, close the 'doors' for one or two days and 'sit' inside the home department-the Self. And continue to 'see' any and all turmoil that happens in the non-Self complex. Does that not happen?

**Questioner** : So we have to be patient and maintain equanimity.

**Dadashri** : That is all, what else? 'You' have to continue 'seeing' and settle with everything, with equanimity, and the hurricane that comes is considered a file. Settle it with equanimity and it will go away. And only those that are in the account of _karma_ will come, no other.

Is this a falsehood here? All this is scientific. No one's interference will work here; not even The Lord's. How can even The Lord interfere in that which is scientific? Then he cannot be The Lord because The Lord never interferes.

## Settle the likes-dislikes with equanimity

Whatever types of circumstance You encounter; it is all a file. As you are travelling from here and you come across the sewers of Bandra (place in Mumbai), then you face that circumstance. Is that not considered a file? There, if you say, 'Look at the Government, they do not repair the gutters, and all that', then you ruin it. You have to settle that circumstance, with equanimity. If you cannot do that, then pinch your nose for a while. Otherwise if you want to settle it with equanimity, then it will not bother you even if it smells. The whole world puts up with 'smelly things' only, does it not? There is nothing sweet and fragrant out there, is there? What if you get a smelly pillow and you have to spend the whole night on it? Do you have to kick up a fuss? So then how should you settle that situation with equanimity?

**Questioner** : I have to adjust to it.

**Dadashri** : Yes, you have to adjust to it. If it is not good, then you have to say, 'It is very good. The other side is good; just turn it over on the other side.' Say that and then go to sleep.

What else is there besides the Atma Self? Circumstance ( _sanyog_ ). What is a circumstance? It is a file. Settle the file with equanimity.

**Questioner** : So then even thoughts of the mind are files only, are they not?

**Dadashri** : Everything is a file. There is nothing besides files. All the circumstances are files. If something that you like to eat; comes on your plate, then make an inner arrangement, and with equanimity, find the way, as to how it will not harm you, and at the same the same time the mind is fully satisfied. There is no problem with eating more of what you like, but if you do that then take out some other item from your plate or something like that and settle with it that way. So that it will not cause the body complex any harm. Then if you come across fried potatoes; that is a file. If vegetable you do not like come on your plate, that is a file and you have to settle with it with equanimity. When you come across a shirt you like, you have to settle it with equanimity.

Yes, so you have to settle all the files with equanimity. You only settle certain files don't you? You do not eat potatoes and so you criticize potatoes. You have to settle the issue of potatoes, with equanimity. But how are you going to do that when you do not eat them? You think, you are following the Lord's Agna, when you do not eat them. So if someone is serving you fried potatoes in your plate, tell him to put only a few. Then take one piece of it and eat it. That settles the file with equanimity. The Lord is not going to take offence to that. The Lord did not say to leave it completely either; He just said to economize there. If you stop eating them altogether, then it will give rise to the intoxication of 'I have renounced potatoes' in the ego and when you see potatoes, you will get irritated at the sight of potatoes. What happens when a person sees onions if he has renounced them? He will get upset. What will he say? He will say, 'why do you hoard these damn onions everywhere?' You fool, what is it to you? Why are you cursing the onions, when they do not bother you, or they have not deprieved you of anything? Will the onions leave you alone for the aversion towards them? And what if you had dealt with them, with equanimity? Will you not have the solution? How do you like this Akram Vignan?

**Questioner:** It is very precise and solid.

**Dadashri** : So with it, nothing will become weak or unstable.

**Questioner** : It has been done after so much thinking that it feels as if everything has been decided through the intellect, even if later the intellect is neglected.

**Dadashri** : Yes, You have experienced it, have You not? Otherwise, one would one say, 'why are you hoarding onions?' Hey _mooah_ (the dying one)! The Lord did not tell you not to eat onions for that! He did not tell you to leave it so that you can do _raag-dwesh_ (attachment-abhorrence). And that is precisely what one does; nothing but _dwesh_. The Lord is not going to get upset or you are not going to die if you happen to eat a piece or two. Why don't you settle it with equanimity! A person will eat too much of it just because he likes it and he will not even touch what he does not like. What do 'we' say? Settle with equanimity.

If a person does not like someone, he will treat him with contempt. 'You fool! Stop doing such things!' Instead say to him, 'when did you come? Please come and sit. Will you have some tea?' The dislike is on the inside but can you not keep it from him? If You want to settle with him with equanimity, can you keep it to yourself or not?

**Questioner** : Yes I can.

**Dadashri** : That is not considered as deceit ( _kapat_ ). It is considered a deceit when you do it to get something out of him or to take advantage of him. Settle with equanimity is not being deceitful but it is a great thing; it is a great principle.

**Questioner** : Am I not being scornful ( _tiraskar_ ) towards his ego?

**Dadashri** : The one who is contemptuous is doing _adharma_ (going against religion) and _mahatmas_ are doing _dharma_ (religion) by telling him 'Come on in and sit down. I am glad you came, we meet after a long time.' And what are we saying? We are doing this as if we are in a play in this theatre of life, are we not? We are saying it in a dramatic fashion.

Settle with equanimity, that which you do not like is the greatest penance ( _tapa_ ). What does settle with equanimity mean? It means there should not be any dislike ( _abhav_ ), or anything else towards the other person. It means that one should not protect the dislike within, by walking away; he does not feel comfortable in going away either. Running away, avoidance reaction, is also wrong. You have to settle with it. Many people will say, 'Let us go, I do not like him.' That is a tremendous mistake. When someone or something you do not like comes, you have to remain sitting there, for sure.

## Your own account of karma only

When hot coal falls on you, the whole Gnan will come alive for You instantly, that the one droping the coal is a _Shuddhatma_ , is he not? This is your _heesab_ (account of _karma_ ). You are a Shudhatma, he did not drop it on You, he dropped it on 'Chandubhai'. It was 'Chandubhai's account. He has just settled the account, it was unfolding of Chandubhai's _karma_ and the other person is just a _nimit_ , instrumental evidence. 'You' have to settle with equanimity. On the contrary You should bless him for helping you become free from that _karma_.

The other person has to come inorder to free you from _karma_. This whole world is looking to free you from _karma_. But at that time, you feel 'he is my enemy' or 'he loves me'. The whole world wants to liberate you from _karma_ , but some people become increasingly entangled and make that _karma,_ _nikachit_ \- _karma_ the effect of which will have to be suffered.

## Difficulties from others awaken the energies of the Self

Our energies will not blossom if there were no negative worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ ). Therefore, be grateful to person who hurts you and say, 'Thank you for developing some energy ( _shakti_ ) for me.'

**Questioner** : Yes, that is correct. That is an absolute truth.

**Dadashri** : If one understands that, then it can be settled, otherwise it is not possible to do so. _Dharma_ (religion) cannot be found in books, it is found only in worldly interaction. Can _dharma_ be found in a book? 'You' should maintain that you want to have ideal worldly interaction. Maintain such an inner intent. Your worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) should not spoil. And if it does spoil, then settle it with equanimity.

Do we have any interference ( _dakho_ ) and its results ( _dakhal_ ) in the life of Akram Vignan _mahatmas_ at all? Minor divisiveness due to differences in opinions ( _matabheda_ ) does happen, problems arise, all that happens, but that is all a discharge ( _nikali_ ). There is no _tanto_ (a lingering grudge linked to certain circumstance) in it, and in the morning he'll get a nice cup of tea. If he had a fight in the evening, this is like putting salt in the milk. Despite this, the milk will be good for making tea in the morning. The milk has not gone bad, even after twelve hours, i.e. even though there was conflict at night, nothing is spoilt and there is no lingering effect in the morning.

**Questioner** : I should get our work for _moksha_ accomplished. The files will not leave me alone.

**Dadashri** : No one will be yours, only the Self will be. Your inner intent will only be to go to _moksha_ , will it not? Will that which is not yours be of help to you?

**Questioner** : No it will not.

**Dadashri** : Yet, you cannot abandon your worldly life, can you? You have to settle it. Settle it in such a way that it does not appear wrong to people. 'We' too, settle with whatever 'we' do not like, do 'we' not?

## Remain dramatic (superficial) and then settle

When someone tells you, 'You are a worthless person', you should tell him, 'Sir, you just found that out today, I have known that from the start.' So then that is settled. Would You not know that from the beginning?

**Questioner** : If I tell him, 'You have just realized it but I have known that from the start', then he will say, 'You are not only worthless but you are also shameless.' He will say that.

**Dadashri** : Then, tell him, 'Sir, But I understood it this way.' However, do not say anything if possible. If the problem can be solved by remaining silent, then do that. But you have to tell this to your mind, because the mind looks for a satifactory solution ( _samadhan_ ), does it not?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri** : So dramatic means that it is 'heartily' (sincerely) for sure. Your whole heart is in the drama. 'You' are outside of the drama. "Heartily drama!"

**Questioner** : But even when I am talking heartily- dramatically, should there not be the awareness that the other person not be hurt to the slightest extent?

**Dadashri** : Such awareness is automatically there. The speech is heartily- sincere, is it not? When you speak dramatically, it is heartily for sure. When it lacks awareness it is not called heartily. Full awareness, itself means dramatic. 'I am King Bhratruhari on the stage, and within, I am Lakshmichand Targado,' all this awarness should be there simultaneously. (This is the famous play, in which the role of the King Bhratruhari, was played by actor Lakshmichand Targado, in the thirties in India).

You will not ruin anything with any file, if You speak dramatically, otherwise, these files are going to come with You. You are not going to be able to dismiss the files so easily. They are going to come with you, because they have reacted (bound a _karma_ in the past life), have they not? So do not ruin anything with the files; they are not going to to away.

In order to settle the file, doit as if you are in the role of 'I am in a drama'; and maintaint that intent or view (bhaav). You will have to settle the drama, will you not?

## Reprimand but after separating the Self

**Questioner** : If something goes wrong in the process of meeting my obligation and I have to point it out to the person responsible and I have to reprimand him, he feels hurt, what should I do? That person may even feel contempt towards me; what kind of _bhaav_ should I keep?

**Dadashri** : You have taken Gnan, so tell his _Shuddhatma_ to seat on one side, by saying, 'Hey _Shuddhatma Bhagwan_ who are separate from the mind, body and speech, _bhaav_ _karma_ , dravya _karma_ , no- _karma_ , of (name of file); this _pudgal_ is causing problems for me and I have to train him through scolding.' Then there is no problem.

And you have to teach him a lesson, don't you? You are bound by your obligation and you have to enforce discipline. What would happen if all the bank security guards allowed everyone to come in?

**Questioner** : There will be more robberies.

**Dadashri** : Yes, it is a job involving a duty; so they have to fulfill their obligations. So then there is no problem, but you have to seat the Self of the other person, on the outside!

**Questioner** : If the other person later becomes contemptuous towards me, should I not worry about that?

**Dadashri** : You do not have to worry. If You seat his Atma (Self) outside, then that has nothing to do with You and then whatever contempt he directs towards you, it will be in the absence of his Self and so it will be meaningless, no? The Self is sitting on the outside; if he does it being the Self, then there is liability.

## Special ways of settling files with equanimity

**Questioner** : Say if a person working under me comes to work late or does not carry out his work properly; I try to settle with him, with equanimity but I also have to reprimand him as part of my responsibility. I am bound to get some negative reaction from him, so does that bind _karma_ for me?

**Dadashri** : There is no binding of _karma_ , if You have attained the Gnan. But you have to make sure that you do not incite a reactionary response from him. It is because he is ignorant that he will take it in a reactionary way. So you should write it down on paper and tell him to read it and give it back to you. Go to his desk and ask him to read it twice. Do you understand the intent behind that?

All these people have sensitive minds. So they will retaliate if they are provoked. What would you do if 'I' were to hit you?

**Questioner** : Nothing will happen. The inner intent will not be spoilt.

**Dadashri** : What if 'I' hit you again?

**Questioner** : It will still not spoil.

**Dadashri** : And if 'I' tell you 'I' am doing wrong by hitting you, what will you say?

**Questioner** : Then I will have the desire for more beating from You , Dada.

**Dadashri** : 'Our' speech is _syadvaad_ (does not hurt anyone to the slightest extent and is acceptable to all). So 'we' will ask and then hit him to see whether it is acceptable to him. And we will take him higher up the steps by conferring with him. There is nothing sensitive in 'our' approach. Wherever there is intellect ( _buddhi_ ), there will be sensitiveness and sensitiveness means provocation. And when there is provocation, the other person will bind enmity. Therefore, wherever there is a possibility of provocation; those who do not know how to say it verbally should give it in writing. There is no provocation involved in writing. There will not be enough provocation to shock the other person. You should write it on paper and in which you write, 'You will be fined and suspended.' You will have to say something like that to him. There is no problem with that and at the same time have an inner intent that no harm comes to him.

**Questioner** : Yes, that is correct.

**Dadashri** : On one side you have to make sure that no harm comes to him and on the other side you have to scold him otherwise he will get on the wrong track.

**Questioner** : Dada, I need further clarification on what you said about giving it to him in writing that he will be suspended. Suppose I tell him verbally once or twice. I know that he is a _Shuddhatma_ and I am trying to settle with him, with equanimity. He does not respond when I give it to him in writing, he puts the paper aside and continues with his old ways. I give it to him again in writing and he still continues with his old ways. So then I threaten with action. When I take the action, he immediately runs and gathers a group of sympathizers or he tells me that even though I have taken Gnan he cannot see an iota of that Gnan. He talks like that and then when action is taken again, he ends up being my opponent. All this is done according my duty. Internally I have pure ( _shuddha_ ) intent, so then what should I do under such circumstances?

**Dadashri** : You should tell him that you will take action against him the next time, but keep that action such that you can retract it if you have to. When you try everything and keep the action in such a state that you can revert that decision, then you are not considered at fault. Your intention is not to harm him. You are only looking to do good for him. Then if he is made useless-jobless through your hands, even then there is no liability to you.

## Maintain the pure intent of equanimity

**Questioner** : Dada, you say that I should settle with equanimity. For example, say only one position is open and there are four applicants for it. And say, I am one of those four. I work hard for it and do everything, and I get selected for that position. The other three get upset and I become their enemy without my having anything to do with it. Now how can I solve that problem?

**Dadashri** : 'Our' Vignan is such that it does not tell you that it is mandatory for you to do it this way. You just to have to decide, in your mind, that You want to settle with the situation with equanimity. You just have to make such inner intent, you should not be concerned whether it happens or not. That is My concern.

**Questioner** : But I have nothing to do with those people.

**Dadashri** : You should not concern yourself with that.

**Questioner** : But I still upset them, did I not?

**Dadashri** : It is not a question of what happens to them or to you. At that time Your inner intent was that You want to settle the matter (file) with equanimity; that is all. When You remain 'our' Agna, then the responsibility becomes 'ours'; after that You are not bound. 'We' have said that, it is 'our' liability when someone follows 'our' five Agna and if he experiences obstacles, that responsibility is Mine, and if he experiences one worry he can file a law suit for two hundred thousand and he will get it. I guarantee that.

## Cutting off the rotten part is settling with equanimity

**Questioner** : How do I settle with equanimity when someone working under me is fired by me? When some is fired, he will be hurt, will he not?

**Dadashri** : 'You' have to settle with it with equanimity. If you feel that he is hurt, or if you wonder whether he is hurt, then recall his name and do _pratikraman_ that you had to take that step as a last resort. You have to do such _pratikraman_. But you have to carry out whatever obligations you have in this world.

**Questioner** : One of the principles in worldly interaction is to cut out the rotten part of the papaya and put it aside. Is that a good principle?

**Dadashri** : Yes, that is correct.

**Questioner** : Is that considered as having settled with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : Yes.

## Settle in the language of the water bufallo

If a water buffalo comes to the door and looks around like this, and you settle with her, with equanimity by telling her, 'Go away from here, shoo go away from here', she will get all confused if she enters the house. Is it better if she gets confused or is it better if she stays outside?

**Questioner** : It is better if she stays outside.

**Dadashri** : That poor thing is not aware, so what should you do if she enters the home? You do not have to settle with her with equanimity by saying, 'Madam, please go out, you go out.' You have to take a stick and lightly hit her on the leg because she will not understand it when you call her madam. You have to talk in her language. When you strike her, she will understand that you do not want her to come in. So you stopped her from more harm; that is called _ahimsa_ (nonviolence)

What is considered _ahimsa_? Stopping more harm to both, to the buffalo and to yourself. Otherwise, if you let her in the house by practicing the other _ahimsa_ , then the poor thing will get confused and so will you. What is the meaning in that? And do not have any resistance about settling with files with equanimity, in this manner. Everything is possible. This is a Vignan, not a religion. Religion has all the problems.

Opinion against an individual

**Questioner** : Dada you have said that after taking Gnan I should settle with equanimity but if a person is unworthy, should I settle with equanimity with him?

**Dadashri** : What does that have to do with You? If he is unworthy, that is his problem. You should not create any new accounts with him.

**Questioner** : My intention is clean and well meaning, but I am talking about the retaliatory ( _pratibhav_ ) reactions that I face.

**Dadashri** : When they arise, you have to keep settling with equanimity. And if negative thoughts arise towards him; then do _pratikraman_ that, 'Chandubhai, why are you thinking negatively about him?' When negative thoughts about him, arise within you, it will echo on to the other person.

**Questioner** : Will he receive those in confirmation within?

**Dadashri** : Very well, yes he will. That is why this world exists. It is because of just this one thing that the world exists. Do _pratikraman_ the moment a negative thought arises and then see what that person does for you. This is a Vignan. I am telling you this through a scientific vision. What do you do when you get a negative thought? Do you nurture that thought from within?

**Questioner** : I try to push it away.

**Dadashri** : Why do you have to push it away? It has come but it is at a distance for sure. When you do _pratikraman_ it is the same keeping them far away. When you do _pratikraman_ , you are saying that is not your opinion. What does _pratikraman_ mean? The thought that comes, that is not your opinion. If you do not know how to say the whole _pratikraman_ , then just say, 'I ask for forgiveness for that, and ask that I not have such thoughts.' Say something, even if it is short; as short as two words, but your opinion should change with that.

## The other person is irrelevant in your settling with equanimity

**Questioner** : If the other person is not ready, then how can I settle with equanimity? How is it possible to clap with just one hand (it takes two to tango)?

**Dadashri** : You have to decide, in your own mind, that You want to settle with the file that is coming, with equanimity; that is all You have to do. You should not concern yourself whether the other person is ready or not. When You change your inner intent, then it will all be settled.

**Questioner** : All these files I have, large or small, they will have to be settled, will they not?

**Dadashri** : You have no choice but settle them.

**Questioner** : But how many files can be settled from only one side? Can files be settled just from one side?

**Dadashri** : No, there is no such thing. You have no choice but to settle the files.

**Questioner** : But, many times I want to be free, but the other person will not let go of me, so can I become free from my side?

**Dadashri** : Yes You can.

**Questioner** : How can I?

**Dadashri** : Your _vitaragata_ (absolute absence of attachment or abhorrence) is needed. You can be free from anything if Your _vitaragata_ is present. You do not have to see whether the other person accepts it or not. Otherwise, no one would be able to become free in this world.

**Questioner:** When I settle with equanimity and if the other person takes advantage of that, should I continue to let him?

**Dadashri:** No one has the energy to take advantage or abuse you. And whatever misuse is going to happen, will happen, no one can stop this, no one can change it. So do not harbor any fear of that. Get rid of all fear completely. Get rid of all fear, at least enough for one life. I do have a guarantee that this can be done.

## The responsibility is not yours, thereafter

**Questioner** : Dada, the files that come now, they are heavy files. **Dadashri** : They may be heavy but You will be able to settle them. Keep readiness on your part that you do not want to have any like or dislikes, no matter what. Be very firm about that.

**Questioner** : Inspite of all that if the file does not get settled with equanimity, should I leave it to nature?

**Dadashri** : Then it has nothing to do with you. You have settled it with equanimity. You followed the Agna, so You are not responsible.

## You should not see the result, just settle with equanimity

**Questioner** : Many times I feel that certain files are very heavy and wonder whether I will be able to settle with them with equanimity or not. I think about whether I will be able to do it or not, the file is difficult...

**Dadashri** : Yes, those are called sticky files. They are very sticky.

**Questioner** : Yes, that is when I lose confidence in whether I will be able to do it or not. I feel that the file will not let me go.

**Dadashri** : There is no need for you to lose confidence. Whether it lets go of you or not, you do not have to worry about that. What are you doing right now? You are here to settle the file with equanimity. You are not looking for the outcome of that. I have not told you to look for the results. I have told You to remain the Agna of settling the matter with equanimity. But you are looking at the result that 'this file is not likely to let go' or 'I am not able to let go of this file'. I have told you not to look for such results. You will sink in the mud if you start looking for results. You are free after You settle the file with equanimity. The rest of the responsibility is Mine, if they do anything to you.

**Questioner** : That is it, now I understand. It was a mistake on my part in understanding.

**Dadashri** : You are to settle with equanimity, that is all, after that, you are not to see whether it produces results or not. It is good and easy, is it not?

For this lady here, it is good, she does not have a single sticky file. So there is no problem, is there? If someone spits on your shirt and you keep washing the shirt like this, your hand will get dirty but you will not get rid of the stickiness; that is called a sticky file.

## Equanimity against sticky file

Furthermore, the 'sticky' file will only be around you and not wandering far away outside anywhere. Sticky means even if we wash with soap, it will not get cleaned. What will happen if we rub soap on a cloth soiled with tar? On the contrary, the tar will stain the soap. Such are these files! You should apply awakened awareness ( _jagruti_ ) in these instances that, 'sir, now what should I do? My soap is very precious and when I rubbed it on this (tar laden file), it soiled my soap.' Then when the Gnani Purush brings some kerosene, soak it in there. It may waste two liters of kerosene but keep it soaked in it and it will be cleansed. Gnani Purush shows the way. Otherwise it will not get cleaned with water. The more you pour water over it, the stickier it will become. Our people keep pouring water (making it more difficult) on sticky files.

**Questioner:** To clear the account of sticky files one has to take birth, again and again, no? The problem is only due to these files, no?

**Dadashri:** He is saying it right; it is to clear the files only, no? Be very vigilant and careful not to bind an account of revenge with these sticky files again. Vengeance is the reason why these accounts are in existence. In the end, you will have to leave all the files, right? If you do not have a sticky file then your worldly life will be pleasant. That situation is harmful for _moksha_.

**Questioner:** Dada, please show us the art of settling the account with such sticky files.

**Dadashri:** You have to settle those files with equanimity. Hang on to silence as if you have suffered brain damage. There is no other solution. Any utterance will ruin things.

**Questioner:** Despite remaining silent, the interference of the other person continues to bother me...

**Dadashri:** Yes, that will remain, for sure.

**Questioner:** So teach us that art by which that other file remains happy and gets settled.

**Dadashri:** It is very difficult to keep the other file happy. She will not remain happy if things do not happen according to her will.

**Questioner:** Dada, in my case it happens that I have to allow myself to be cheated deliberately if I want to make the other person happy, only then will he be happy, otherwise not. The current pain that is experienced by her or I, is because she is holding on to hers and I am holding on to mine. We are both insistent.

**Dadashri:** She will keep holding on. When one lets go, the solution arrives.

**Questioner:** Dada, in the home, if she keeps on holding to her point of view and if I let go of mine, then I end up missing _satsang_.

**Dadashri:** If you are going to lose _satsang_ then keep your grip; you should not miss _satsang_. You will take care of the rest later. You should conduct your life in such a way that minimum loss happens from hereon. Minimum loss means, if you attend _satsang_ then you gain 100 rupees profit. Holding on to your point will penalize you 30 rupees, so your net gain is 70 rupees, no?

**Questioner:** Amazing! What a wonderful Vignan of the _vitarags_ this is! Indeed, there is a net gain.

**Dadashri:** So if you gain some profit then it is good, other than this there is nothing like profit or loss. This all is the projection of the ego. What is the worldly life? It is the projection of the ego, to hurt the other person and win.

**Questioner:** My wife does not like my coming here to _satsang_. Why is she cross in spite of the fact that I treat her well and never misbehave with her?

**Dadashri:** That account of yours is one of suffering, so until it is over, how is she going to be happy and pleased with you?

**Questioner:** There is no problem if she does not become happy, but at least if she remains normal, then I will like it.

**Dadashri:** She will not remain 'normal' at all. Even when she is 'normal', you should believe that 'she is happy indeed'. She does not like you. Despite knowing that she does not like your interaction and thoughts, you still have to sit and eat with her, live with her, sleep with her, say yes to her; so what can be done? There is no way out at all! You have no choice but suffer that _karma_. Whatever has to be suffered; with what matter, space, time and inner intent ( _dravya, kshetra, kaad_ and _bhaav_ , respectively) have come together; has to be suffered, and in that there is no choice. If you run from it, how long can you avoid it?

All these close relations have come along with you for your protection and help and you have come to support them; both the agreements have to be concluded and settled, do they not? They need to be settled not with attachment ( _raag_ ), but with with time as the circumstances unfold. Time should pass. Settle all credits and debits. These are files only, no?

You embraced this files by saying 'mine, mine', didn't you? This book will feel good as long as I do not say 'mine' to it. But as soon as I say 'mine' the book too will feel bad, it will start to sulk. Everybody is like that, no? The moment one says, 'mine,' it clings, just like a ghost that possesses. Nevertheless there is no harm in using the words 'mine'. If you are going to say 'mine' dramatically (heartily), then go ahead and say it. In a drama (play) people say lines like 'this is my kingdom; it is vast...it is like this or that...' – they speak this way in a play. So You also have to do such a drama, but with inner vigilance.

## Maintain equanimity and leave the stress of a file

**Questioner:** Dadaji, You gave this Gnan, now if I see the pure Soul in everybody, and from within I do _namaskaar_ (reverence filled ego sublimation) and apply the skills to remain silent; then the sticky file will get settled, right?

**Dadashri:** File means thoughts will arise for sure, and one would not refrain from speaking. There, the skill of refraining from speaking will not work there.

**Questioner:** Dadaji, but there has to be a way, in that, no?

**Dadashri** : You have to keep a trained discipline ( _niyam_ ) that at the time you don't want to speak. Even then, when speech comes forth, that is the sign of a file. The speech will come out depending on the stickiness of the file. Otherwise if you decide you don't want to speak, then the speech may even not come out. With a file that is sticky, you will end up talking even though you don't want to. But you should decide that you don't want to speak. You should decide in your mind; that with reference to that individual, you do not want to speak; you don't want to think, and you do not want to act; and thereafter, settle the file with equanimity. By calling them 'files'; we consider them as files. You cannot openly say, 'this file is obstructing me.' A file will automatically settle for sure. What is causing the impediment? The weakness in your awareness as the Self is the impediment. The file will definitely settle; the settlement of that file will happen even after six to twelve months. You don't need to pay too much attention towards that file. You should decide that You want to settle the file. So whenever you meet a file, that decision of settle will come into Your awareness.

**Questioner:** That means if there is full awareness then the file is not impeding at all. And if it is impending, it is due to weakness in my awareness.

**Dadashri:** You want to bring about settlement and he does not want to settle. Even then You should persist, 'come on, I want to definitely settle.' You will win; he will not because he is outside the _paudgalik_ (of the non-Self complex) laws. This, the wanting to settle with equanimity is inside the _paudgalik_ law. He will say, 'I will not let you go to _moksha_.' You say, 'I want to go.' Then You will go. For a while, that file will harass and bother you and then he will run away. Kamatha was Lord Parshvanath's brother, and for ten lives he harassed the Lord severely, but in the end he had to run, and the Lord attained _moksha_.

## The file will leave but attachment will remain

**Questioner** : How do the file of attachment ( _raag_ ) come back for me to suffer it again?

**Dadashri** : Sticky file of _raag_ (attachment) and sticky file of _dwesh_ (abhorrence) are equally sticky. It is not that the file of _dwesh_ is stickier. 'You' have to stop your _raag_ and _dwesh_. You will have to bring a settlement of your _raag_ for sure. The other file does not have anything to do with it. That file is gone but the _raag_ remains. Now, the _raag_ that remains within, You will have to settle it, and you will have to put your signture on it again.

**Questioner** : It does not matter how it unfolds, I am not in agreement with it; is that how separate, I should keep it?

**Dadashri** : No. It will be through a connection with someone else and there will be the same kind of attachment ( _raag_ ) with that file. Then that file will be settled. There will no connection with the former file; that files is gone.

## Spend this life in settling with equanimity

**Questioner** : The intent may be great, but what if the file cannot be settled with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : If You cannot settle with equanimity, the liability is not Yours. Your intent is there, and when it does not get settled, You have to make sure that you do not change your intent to one of 'I do not want to settle with equanimity'. You have to maintain the intent that You do want to settle with equanimity. You should not let go of that intent. If it does not happen, it is _vyavasthit_ (scientific circumstantial evidence).

**Questioner** : But, sometimes I think that, if not today, it is bound to happen tomorrow or the day after.

**Dadashri** : Eighty percent will happen on its own for sure. For some ten to fifteen percent it will still remain. If the file is very sticky, then it will not happen, then it depends on _vyavasthit_. _Vyavasthit_ is liable for it, not You. You have decided that You want to settle with equanimity; then all Your efforts should be towards doing that.

You are not the only one with sticky files; everyone has them. All people have brought them from past life, have they not? And if one has not brought any sticky files, then does he have to remain with a Gnani constantly? But how many sticky files has one brought with him?

**Questioner** : Do something so that they all go away instantly; that they get dissolved.

**Dadashri** : If 'we' do that, then the energy of the Self will not manifest. As long as I do that for you, Your energy will not manifest. You want them to manifest, do You not? If you want to remove the veils of ignorance, they will begin to go away from the moment You decide to settle with equanimity. You do not have to make any effort there. All you need is to have an inner intent ( _bhaav_ ), that You want to settle with equanimity. Even if the file tries to be difficult, You should still settle it with equanimity. Otherwise, the Self will never become absolutely independent ( _niralumb_ ), will it? Dependency will still remain as long as the files are not settled, and as long as there is dependency, the Self cannot become absolute. _Niralumb_ Atma, is the absolute Self; that is where You have to reach. There is no problem if You cannot reach there in this life. It will happen in the next life, but following the Agna in this life is the solution. To settle with equanimity is a very high Agna. And how many sticky files are there? There are not two to five hundred, are there? There are only two to four. But there lies the real fun!

**Questioner** : Many times while doing that, it raises my temperature by four degrees!

**Dadashri** : No, that increase of temperature is all the weakness going away. However much of that weakness goes away; that much energy will increase for You. It will be more than You had before.

## Layers of sticky file are shed just with the _nischaya_

**Questioner** : So many a times, I try to settle with equanimity with certain files, according to my intellect, according to my understanding. The intent to settle with equanimity does come but in fact I cannot see equanimity.

**Dadashri** : That equanimity is not visible nevertheless equanimity is its name. Equanimity has not happened, but still you said the words that You want to settle with equanimity, did You not? That is all You are responsible for, equanimity happens in other ways. This is a very profound Vignan. Just like the layers of an onion, when You settle with equanimity, it removes one layer, but to you they will seem like the same layers again. Therefore in the way you settle with equanimity; there are thousands of such layers. So do not think that you are seeing the same layer over again. There are thousands of layers, so however much you do, that many layers are shed.

**Questioner** : So I have to take it that one layer was shed.

**Dadashri** : Yes. That is called a sticky file. That which has more layers is called a sticky file.

**Questioner** : Dada, when I make an inner intent of settle with equanimity, it should come in action, but why does it not come into action?

**Dadashri** : No, it is settled. The moment You say I want to settle with equaimity, it happens although it may appear the same as before; you do actually lose one layer. There may be thousands of layers, but they will go away in this maner. Be satisfied that You settled with equanimity; that You followed Dada's Agna. It is an exact Vignan, is it not?

**Questioner** : But in that, whatever stage I take it to, Dada, the inner intent to settle with equanimity is there. Then when the matter is settled with equanimity, the bliss ( _anand_ ) that arises is indeed something very different.

**Dadashri** : No. There is no need for whether it really settles or not. You just need to remain in the Agna. 'You' have no right towards anything that is of the non-Self.

**Questioner** : No, Dada what I am saying is that when I make an inner intent, it gives rise to vibrations, the result of which is that it does settle with equanimity for sure. It satisfied the other person.

**Dadashri** : Whether it satisfies the other person or not; when You settle with equanimity; and he curses you, then realize that there are still many more layers. So do not worry. Tell him politely to curse as much as he wants and then ask for a cup of tea. Is the cursing that the other person doing dependent on him?

**Questioner** : If my vibration reaches the other person and satisfies him, then only I get the satisfaction that the file was settled with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : Even if the other person is not satisfied, You should 'take' the satisfaction; and say, please make some tea and serve that snack, and having enjoyed that, go out.

## Sticky files push You towards moksha

Who is most beneficial to You on the way to _moksha_? It is the sticky file. Sweet files will not let you get out. They will not help you towards _moksha_. They will tell you, 'Go if you want to, otherwise stay and enjoy the snack.' That is why I have deposited everything (settled with equanimity). That is why, everyday, I used to tell my sister-in-law 'it is because of you that I attained _moksha_ , I would not have otherwise.' They are sticky files, are they not?

If you think about it, then you will realize that sticky files are helpful. If you did not have Gnan, it would make you crazy and take you on the wrong path, it-the file will take you to a life in the lower life form. But they are beneficial, if You have attained Gnan.

File is defined by that which speaks very weird and oddly ( _trutium_ ). It will say something so odd and irrelevant that it will give you a headache! They are words that give you a headache. Now, why does she-file one use those words? It is because it is a file; a sticky file. Then, because You have Gnan, You feel it should not happen. Otherwise she-file one becomes stuck in thinking 'I am right'; that is what she-file one will believe! But here she-file one will immediately understand 'I am wrong'. Do you realize that you made a mistake after an hour or so?

**Questioner** : I will know it immediately.

**Dadashri** : Immediately! See. How powerful this Gnan is? How much effect this Gnan gives!

## The sticky tape has to removed gently

If a very sticky tape is stuck on your arm and you try to pull it off, you will even pull out some hair. So when it is very sticky, it becomes difficult, does it not? It is very good if it is not sticky, it will drop off the moment you say so. There is no problem there, is there? Sticky file is very difficult.

You have very few sticky files like a tape that will remove your hair when you pull it out. You have to carefully get your work out of it. You have to wet the tape with water and then remove it slowly. Otherwise, it will burn a lot when you peel it off along with some hair. If a single tape gives you so much pain, then how much pain, will this 'tape' (file) give you? Files are 'tapes' too. The Self in him is separate, but the file-he, is the 'tape'. What if you peel off the tape fast? It will even pull off hair with it. So people will say, 'You cannot remove it fast.' And they will get upset with the one peeling it, will they not? So you should do as you are told. Make some warm the water, slowly wet the tape with it and then gently peel it off. All these files are tapes that are stuck to you. What are they like? They will 'remove the hair too' in the process of separating, and that will bind enmity ( _veyr_ ). Therefore, if you do it carfully, you will not remove even a single hair. People used to peel off postal stamps from envelopes if the post office did not stamp it, without anyone's knowledge. See how 'intelligent' they were!

## What is sticky? Is it the file or the glue?

This is not under Your control, is it? Did You do this or did Chandubhai do it?

**Questioner** : It is Chandubhai's doing. Chandubhai did it.

**Dadashri** : Then why do you latch on to it?

**Questioner** : No Dada it was a mistake. 'I' have pulled away; I should not latch on to it.

**Dadashri** : That is called a file. That glue is sticky. The one trying to stick to you (the tape) is not sticky. It is not the 'tape' that is sticky.

**Questioner** : Please clarify that. Please do something so that the 'glue' can be removed?

**Dadashri** : It is gone. I have made You pure ( _shuddha_ ) without stickiness ( _raag-dwesh)_ for sure. What can I do if you fail to understand that?

**Questioner** : In just two words, Dada, You gave us the whole Vignan. You say that the glue is sticky, not the person and not even the tape. And You say that You have made us pure, but we get stuck.

**Dadashri** : What can 'we' do, if that awareness ( _khyal,laksha_ ) does not remain? When 'we' have already got you married, you tell me, 'Sir, why don't you get me married?' What would people say if you say that?

**Questioner** : He is weird and crazy.

**Dadashri** : They will say, 'Put him in the 'third class - in the mental hospital'.

**Questioner** : You said a very good thing. It will separate the two, what You have said.

**Dadashri** : I have separated them (Self and non-Self) for sure. It is separate and as a result,You accept that, everything, the ego ( _ahamkar_ ) and my-ness ( _mamata_ ) are gone, don't You? The glue is gone is also what You accept, no? The tape is never sticky. If the tape does not come off, why do you destroy the tape? _Mooah_ (the dying one)!, it is not the tape; it is the glue ( _raag-dwesh_ ) on it that is sticky. If light glue was applied in the past life, then it will be light and peel off easily. The tape is neither sticky, nor light. And the one sticking it is not like that either. You are the one who knows what kind of glue you have used. Whether you used super glue or of some other kind, you know that.

## How can stickiness come to an end?

**Questioner:** I had asked you a question that I do have the experience the but I don't feel the bliss. You said the reason for it was sticky _karma_ , so then how can these sticky _karma_ be settled faster?

**Dadashri** : If You remain in _Shuddhatma_ –the Self, then they will dissipate faster. If you do not stick with that sticky _karma_ and if You remain as the 'seer'; then it will exhaust faster.

**Questioner:** That process is definitely ongoing.

**Dadashri:** All right, then it will exhaust, it will not take a long time. One has brought forth from the past life, sticky _karma_ with family files and loose, non-sticky _karma_ with non-family files. Do you have the experience that _karma_ are sticky with family files?

Now if you talk to a passanger on the train and he offered you a cup of tea, then such _karma_ are loose, non-sticky files. To settle these sticky files is very difficult. Even if You settle with equanimity, you will feel the stickiness repeatedly. 'You' must say this much that 'I definitely want to settle with equanimity.' It will happen automatically. The reason is that these files have been attached and sticky for a very long time as pending _karma_ accounts. A big account of _karma_ has been laid down.

Now if one sticky file was scheduled to arrive and if You want to settle with equanimity, then You should 'see' the pure Soul _Shuddhatma_ in that file, before it arrives. Thus You 'see' the real and the relative, and You decide to settle the file with equanimity, and therefore, it will settle with equanimity. If the that file is hostile then settlement may not happen; You don't need to 'see' that. It must be Your _nischaya_ to settle the file with equanimity; after this You 'see' what happens.

**Questioner:** We are saying that some files are sticky, but whose stickiness is that? Who makes it sticky?

**Dadashri:** The one who is the doer, who is suffering now. Because he made it sticky in the past life, he has to suffer now! He made it sticky—in the past life—that is why he has to suffer.

**Questioner:** Dada, the stickiness is because of multiple causes, no? It is not one sided, is it?

**Dadashri:** Yes, there are multiple interdependent causes.

**Questioner:** So then how can the sticky file be shoved away?

**Dadashri:** One cannot shove it away at all.

**Questioner:** By shoving away, I meant, how can the syickiness be shoved away?

**Dadashri:** With _vitaragata_ —without any attachment or abhorrence. The stickiness is continuously dissolving but if we make it stickier (through interference of 'I am Chandubhai') then it will arise again. If we show _vitaragata_ (no attachment or aversio ), then it will leave. So You have to settle with equanimity; that is the part of _vitaragata_.

**Questioner:** But if we happen to make it stickier then we must do _pratikraman_ for it, right?

**Dadashri** : Yes. If it is required then do _pratikraman_ , but that too You (the Self) don't have to do it. Even this You have to tell Chandubhai, 'brother, do _pratikraman_!' You, the Self are not doing the _atikraman_ are You? Chandubhai did the _atikraman_ so there You have to tell Chandubhai, 'do _pratikraman._ '

**Questioner** : The biggest work of this worldly life interaction is to settle with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : That is it; the only trouble is with these files. You are obstructed due to only these files. Only these files have besieged you. Nobody else is there to stop You. You are _vitarag_ everywhere else.

## Layers of files removed just by 'seeing' them

**Questioner** : You said that, having attained Gnan, _raag_ - _dwesh_ (attachment-abhorrence) go away, but _raag_ - _dwesh_ happen when a sticky files comes, what is that?

**Dadashri** : _Raag_ - _dwesh_ are gone through _nischaya_ (the exact state of the Self), but those of _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) still remain, do they not? Do you not get irritated with people in worldly interaction? 'Your' work will be done when all of that is gone. They will all go away if You remain the knower-seer. If You continue to 'see', when it happens to Chandubhai, then they will all go away.

**Questioner** : So, should I continue to 'see' even if he gets irritated?

**Dadashri** : It is not possible for you to continue to 'see'; that is the main point.

**Questioner** : When I 'see' that Chandubhai is getting angry, even then my intellect ( _buddhi_ ) will say that the file still remains pending.

**Dadashri** : If it still remains pending, then it will come back again.

**Questioner** : If at that time, I get very annoyed, and if I continue to 'see' that, is the file considered settled?

**Dadashri** : If the 'seeing' was done exactly then nothing will happen, it will not return. If you believe in the mind in your own way, then it will remain; because you did not 'see' it exactly.

**Questioner** : Does it have an effect on the other person, if 'I' am 'seeing' it exactly?

**Dadashri** : The other person will get all kinds of effect ( _asar_ ). 'You' will not experience the effect. The 'seer' is never affected.

**Questioner** : Are we settling the files with equanimity because they have an effect on us; is that why?

**Dadashri** : Who else is it for? Is it for him?

**Questioner** : Dada, the other person meets us because of my account of _karma_ and at that time whatever comes out, if I 'see' that, then is that considered as settled? If I 'see' it correctly? If I 'see' it exactly?

**Dadashri** : It got settled because equanimity ( _samabhav_ ) remained for You.

**Questioner** : When this got settled, then that _nimit_ will not meet again, will he?

**Dadashri** : He may, if there is another layer. If there is another account, then he will come again.

**Questioner** : That is for something else, but it will not be for this one, right?

**Dadashri** : No. This one is gone.

## Settling with family files with equanimity

**Questioner** : Dada, I am living in a joint family and the other person does not have the awareness of, 'I am _Shuddhatma_ '; then what should I do?

**Dadashri** : You do not even need to know whether the other person is aware of that or not.

**Questioner:** If I 'see' _Shuddhatma_ in him and not say a word to him, and tolerate him, then why is he misusing-abusing me?

**Dadashri** : The other person is under the illusion ( _bhranti_ ), so he will misuse or also make a good use of you, You have to 'see' that too. You have to 'see' that he is doing it to file number one and not to You. Sooner or later, You have to let go of file number one, do You not? 'You' have nothing to do with file one, do You? File number one will make whatever payment is due to him from the account of _karma._ It is being settled even in illusion but he says, 'I suffered it'.

**Questioner** : I have attained this Gnan, but my sister-in-laws and my husband have no interest in this talk whatsoever, and they do not like it even when I come here to _satsang_. So in the whole family, they talk negatively about it and continue to criticize me, so what is the solution for this? How can I remain in that with Gnan? For now, I remain quiet; I do not say anything.

**Dadashri** : Yes, you should remain quiet and if she (file No. one) wants to fight, then let her and if she wants to remain silent, then let her. 'You' continue to 'see' all that. They will cool down one day. But also do not believe that they will cool down by you remaining silent and also do not believe that they will cool down by you fighting; time will cool them down.

This is our Vignan! Not for a moment will One be trapped. It is such that one will not get stuck if one understands this completely. This is an exact Vignan. The Vignan that I live by is the Vignan that I have given You.

## Right for one but wrong for the other

**Questioner** : You talk about settling a file with equanimity. If there are two files in a home and I try to settle with equanimity with one, then that upsets the other file. The other file feels that injustice is being done towards him and that I am siding with the other. So what should I do there?

**Dadashri** : You have to keep in mind that You want to settle with equanimity and then whatever happens is correct. Do not make any alternative adjustments; do not play the role of a lawyer. If you just keep in your mind that You want to settle with equanimity, then whatever you end up saying, you are not responsible for it. You have to have it in your mind that You only want to settle with equanimity. Then you do not worry that you will hurt one by doing something for the other. You have keep all that in the mind. Then whatever dealings happen with others, it is correct. You are not responsible for these dealings. It just needs your inner intent ( _bhaav_ ) that You want to settle with equanimity. You do not want to increase any enmity.

**Questioner** : What if enmity ( _veyr_ ) increases, inspite of that?

**Dadashri** : It will seem that way to you. But You do maintain that you want to settle, do You not? If enmity increases, even that You do not have to see. You should not abandon this one established incontrovertible principle that will lead to the ultimate ( _siddhant_ ) that You want to settle with equanimity.

## Become free, even if you have to act crazy

It is a mistake to say even single word that will hurt anyone. If you happen to say something, then you should say, 'My dear, I have gone crazy, something has gotten in my mind and that is why I said what I said, so please do not feel bad.' He will let you go, when you say that. Otherwise, he will not let you go.

Do you understand what I am saying to you? Act cracy if you have to and free yourself. Even the wife will tell you, 'You are crazy'. Tell her, 'Yes, I have really gone crazy. Otherwise, would I be saying something like that?' so she will say, 'Do not worry, but do not cause this kind of a problem again.' So you should turn the situation around.

**Questioner** : So this is the main thing, is it not? We get to learn this art of turning things around, from You, Dada!

**Dadashri** : 'We' would teach you that. 'We' would teach you that, but you should know how to say, 'I am a fool', should you not?

I would even make Hiraba (Dadashri's wife) happy by saying that. Then, Hiraba would say, 'You are a very good man, why do you say such a things?' You should turn things around this way. Your intentions are not bad. It is wrong if you do that to get something worldly out of the other person. You have to turn things around to clear the mind of that person. The stones you have thrown at others, those 'stones' will bind enmity.No matter how weak or powerless a person is, if he has no power against you, but if you hurt him, he will bind enmity with you. So, even there you have to do whatever it takes and clear his mind. 'I have been like this from the beginning. I am a fool, please forgive me', say that. So then he will say, 'This happened, but you are a good man.' He will immediately remove your name from his 'book' of intense mental note ( _nondha_ ). Would it not be easy for you to say that 'I am a fool?'

Everything becomes pure _shuddha_ by resolving the files with equanimity. You should clear the files. 'We' cannot afford to have any mistake of any kind. The moment a mistake happens; 'our' inner machinery would start working, so mistakes will not remain.

If you leave home after getting angry and clashing at home during mealtime, then she will feel the pressure and tension the whole day, it will continue until you meet again and you too will be under stress till then. There is no harm if you get late reaching the hospital where you work, but you should take some time and gently tell her, 'bring me some cardamom, bring some clove', by saying this you should settle the file and accept readily that, 'the faults are mine, however you are very good woman. See, what kind of dumb mistakes I make in hurry?' so it will settle. Do you have a problem in this?

Say I have had a conflict with you and if then I tell you, 'Chandubhai, pardon me if I was wrong.' will that solve the problem or not?

**Questioner** : Yes it will.

**Dadashri** : So then will you let go or not? And instead, if I say, 'You did not understand what I am saying. Are a fool? What are you going to understand?' This problem would not have arisen, if you had understood it, would it? This becomes a problem because he does not understand it. So You have to settle the problem. What would happen if you made it sticky? It will become entangled. That is why _karma_ of these people are all entangled. Why don't You settle the matter?

If you make a mistake towards your son, because he is your son, you do not accept your own mistake. So what happens there? Would the son not hold a grudge in his mind that you do not even believe the truth? You should tell him, 'Son, I am wrong. I misunderstood you.' It will be settled right away. Is there any problem there? If you accept your mistake, is your son likely to become your father? He will still remain your son. But if you do not accept your mistake, then the son will become the 'father' (a force to reckon with)!

## Quick settlement with commonsense

I had learned through experience. My nephews who own a mill in Bharooch, told me, 'Uncle, you have become estranged after getting into this religion. Your thinking has changed.' I asked them, 'Why, what happened?' They told me, 'Before you were very good, you were worthy of being famous.' So I asked them, 'How do you know that? Do you live with him? I do, so I know what he (Ambalal Patel) is like. He has been like this from the beginning.' So they started to wonder who I was talking about. Who is that? They got confused and so they forgave me. I made them happy. All those who were not agreeable, I would go make fun with them and make them happy. These, poor humans are good people. What can others do, if you cannot unlock their lock that is closed shut? I know how to unlock all the locks, because I have a certain kind of commonsense, which is applicable everywhere. It will open all the locks. You will learn to open some of those locks as you spend time with me. And you do not have many locked locks, do you? And you do not even have to open them. I have locked a lot. So I have learnt the art of unlocking them. You do not have that problem, do you? You have to go to _moksha_ , having cleared everything.

## You cannot look at profit or loss in settling a file

**Questioner** : Should I go through this process of settling with equanimity, even if I feel that loss is going to come in the future?

**Dadashri** : Whether loss or profit is going to happen, You still have to settle with equanimity. You have not come here to stop the loss, you have not come here for profit; you have come here to go to _moksha_. Do You want to be free from all these miseries, or do you want to remain within these miseries?

**Questioner** : That is true.

**Dadashri** : Follow the Agna of 'settle with equanimity', whether loss or anything else is happening. If you do not remain in Agna, more loss will happen.

## When lawsuits arise, maintain Your equanimity

On the path of settlement with equanimity if a circumstance of litigation and court appearance arises, then there is no harm in proceeding with it. This is simply the arrangement that is the unfolding of the account that you had created previously in the past life; a crazy account. So You have to settle with this on your own. In your mind you may even feel, 'Alas! From where did this court and law suits come about?' Those circumstance will arise, but, You are to remain as if nothing has happened. _Prakruti_ is fighting with _prakruti_ , what is Your concern in that? This _prakruti_ is fighting to get one lakh, one hundred thousand rupees that were lent. And the other _prakruti_ is fighting to not return the money. All that, needs to be 'seen'. There should not be any complaint in this. It is a mistake to complain.

There are gears in this machine that is running. If you stick your finger in it, will it spare you? Will it not crush your finger? Even if you had built this machine, will it leave you alone? At that moment, if you scream and yell, 'brother, I have created you', will the gears let you go?

**Questioner:** No, it will not.

**Dadashri:** All these are gears. They appear as humans, nonetheless they are gears. So it is meaningless to scream and holler, no? That time will pass. Thereafter such a time will not come again. The account needs to be paid off. Once that time passes, such a time will not come again, ever. You have to pay off the accounts. What should You do until then? _Maunam_... _dharyate_ —Hold the silence!

## You may fight in court but do so with equanimity

**Questioner** : Dada, I am going to ask you just the other question. Say that I do not worry about going to the court but someone else is dragging me to court; what should I do in that case?

**Dadashri** : 'You' have to 'see' them taking Chandubhai to court, and if 'Chandubhai' gets fed up, then tell him, 'Why are you getting fed up? Why don't you settle your account? He is taking you; it is not as if you like going there. He is dragging you there.'

**Questioner** : There are his abundant _kashayas_ in that.

**Dadashri** : Yes, he-Chandubhai may have _kashayas_ , and You are free from _kashaya._ It is a different matter altogether, is it not?

**Questioner** : Certain complications are such that they cannot be resolved without going to court, then what?

**Dadashri** : Yes, then you have to go. If there is no solution and you have to go to court, then go ahead and do so. Tell 'Chandubhai', 'Hire a good attorney, so that you do not have to keep going to the court again and again. And tell a little lie, if you have to, but do what is appropriate to the court. For the sake of discretion, you should not do anything that looks odd in the court. The custom there is not that of truth or lie; it is one of discretion.' This Vignan is Akram. Otherwise people will call you crazy, how can you give such a testimony in court? How can you say, 'My father's wife' (Instead of my mother)?

**Questioner** : Where and when, whatever is appropriate, that is what one should do.

**Dadashri** : The Lord has said, 'Do everything, but without _raag_ - _dwesh_ (attachment-abhorrence)'. Do whatever you want to do, but if you do it without _raag_ - _dwesh_ , then you are not liable for that action, and in this Vignan that 'we' have given You, 'we' believe that You will experience _vitaragata_ (absolutely free from attachment and abhorrence), if You remain in the Agna, by fifty percent. Hence, this is a different kind of Vignan. That is why 'we' do not tell anyone anything; do 'we'? Would 'we' otherwise not scold people as to why they go to court? Or say,'Why did you do that?'

**Questioner** : It is necessary to understand this talk about discretion ( _vivek_ ).

**Dadashri** : It is about discretion. What does discretion in the court mean? It means, if the attorney had told you to speak in a certain way and you insist that you will say it the way it happened and no other way, people will laugh at you. So say it the way your attorney tells you to.

**Questioner** : In our village this verily becomes an issue over division of inheritance of estate. Now, if I settle with them with equanimity, I lose my share of the estate, I have to forego my inheritance, so what should I do?

**Dadashri** : It is never that you will forego it; it is never like that. You will benefit, if You settle with equanimity. And when you settle with it with aversion, then you will lose your entire wealth and you will lose yourself too. Settle with equanimity without any fear. Nothing ever goes away. Ask me and tell me what exactly happens.

Ask me when You settle with equanimity; ask me whether in a situation where someone picks your pocket, does to settle with equanimity there means to just 'see' all that? No, you should catch him and hand him over to the police. But if he threatens you with a knife, then let him go.

What is our business? It is not to do _raag_ - _dwesh_. If someone owes you money and he is not able to pay you back, if he is in a bind; then let him go, because that is a cause for _raag_ - _dwesh_. If you pursue it further, you will have to look for an attorney. Do attorneys come free? He will tell you to pay seventy-five rupees first, before he will file the complaint. Hey _Mooah_ (the dying one)! Seventy-five rupees? In India, where advice used to be free, and not only that but they used to give you advice and then feed you a good meal after that. But now, they will say, 'No, give me seventy-five rupees first.' Hence, it will give you pain. Still, if you do not have any other means; then there is no problem with filing a lawsuit but do not do _raag_ - _dwesh_. You have to settle even that with equanimity. You can file a claim as within your legal rights and settle with equanimity. Ask me, and I will show you everything. 'We' have all the avenues here. Settle with equanimity does not mean that you let go of it completely.

**Questioner** : I did not quite comprehend, when you said I should let go, in settling with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : You are not to let go. Our aim is not to let go; it is to settle with equanimity. Do not get upset with the other person. Talk to him, but if you get upset in doing so, then do not talk. Settle with him with equanimity. There should not be any _dwesh_ (abhorrence) towards him, no matter how much harm he is causing you. You can file a lawsuit for all the damage he has done to you, or anything else, but do not do any _dwesh_ , because there is _Shuddhatma_ in him and that is fact, is it not?

**Questioner** : Yes, that is true.

**Dadashri** : And that _dwesh_ reaches the _Shuddhatma_. So settle with him, with equanimity. So you can file a lawsuit, there is no problem. At times, if you have to slap him, try not to, if possible. But if you do, then do so after doing a _vidhi_ for an hour. Say, 'Dear _Shuddhatma_ Lord, please sit outside, I want to slap him today.' But you have to do a _vidhi_ for an hour; instead it is better not to get involved in all that.

**Questioner** : But Dada, if I do a _vidhi_ for an hour, then the thought of slapping will disappear, the intent of slapping him will go away.

**Dadashri** : Not like that, if you do _vidhi_ for an hour, and then slap him, I take the responsibility for that. Make the request and the _Shuddhatma_ will sit outside, but not otherwise. If you want _datan_ (a special twig used as a toothbrush), you have to tell the _bavadya_ (babul tree), 'Dear Lord, please sit outside. I want to take two pieces of _datan_.' Do not waste too much. Take the two pieces. For the _datan_ , say it once, you do not have to say it for an hour. So sit The Lord outside and then do that much, otherwise there is a liability for breaking the _datan_ from it; because there is the Self in there. Is there a problem in saying that?

## 'Doing' ruins; 'seeing' improves

You do not see even one percent of Tirthankara's Vignan anywhere outside. Not even a cents worth. That is because it has all been overturned. _Dushamkada_ , the current era of the time cycle of enmity! Even the time has become dusham –adversarial and _gnan_ (knowledge) too has become _dusham_ and that is why this world is suffering in torment. This is the main problem. And here in Akram, one constantly experiences _moksha_.

**Questioner** : But Dada, there are certain family files that cannot be settled, they are stuck unrelentingly to me; what should I do about that?

**Dadashri** : Even if you keep waiting at the station, the train will leave only at its appointed time. It is foolish to keep looking outside the window. This is the Vignan of the _Vitarags_ , remain in Your _moksha_ and do the work. All the work will be done. Where the Vignan of the _vitarag_ Lords is present, there is nothing that one is attached to, there is no oppression, there is no suffering; there is nothing there. What a Vignan! How great the twenty-four Tirthankaras were! Had people realized that, they would have attained _moksha_! They would have been eternally blessed, had they understood even a single word of Lord Mahavir.

You should not think about turning things around (improve things); things continue to turn around on their own. If you are having a very hard time with external problems, come here and take blessings and everything will be fine. Do not do anything to improve; by doing, it will ruin for sure. The natural law is that if you try to 'do' anything, it will be ruined; it will improve on its own.

**Questioner** : Beautiful! What a wonderful thing You have given us. You made it so easy, Dada.

**Dadashri** : Then what else! Everything improves on its own, 'doing' ruins it.

**Questioner** : Dada, you have disclosed a very great secret. People go around trying to improve everything around.

**Dadashri** : By 'doing', everyone is doing wrong! If you want to do wrong, then 'do it'; if you want to do the right, then remain _gnata_ - _drashta_ the knower-seer. Remain in the Agna.

## File two problem settled with equanimity

**Questioner:** I am not able to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ – settle files with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : You are not? Then what happens?

**Questioner** : For me it is like this – the file. 2, is very much against me. And that is why I have conflict and quarrels with her and I am not able to settle with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : Here, You have to tell Chandubhai, 'Do _samabhave_ _nikal_ '. But if it is very sticky, if it is _nikachit_ (effects of _karma_ which have to be suffered) then it will take a while.

**Questioner** : With others it happens easily but not with her.

**Dadashri** : Now, be careful and then do it. Just like when you peel off a band-aid, do it in a way that it does not hurt; do it slowly and gently.

**Questioner** : For us, our divisiveness due to differences of opinions ( _matabheda_ ) are increasing.

**Dadashri** : But why are your _matabheda_ increasing? Should You not follow the Agna of settle with equanimity?

**Questioner** : But despite following the Agna of _samabhave_ _nikal_ , it always comes down to this persistent conflict due to _matabheda._

**Dadashri** : No, it is not like that. I want to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ , settle with equanimity. If You follow that Agna then nothing will remain standing. There is so much power and energy that has been placed in this sentence ( _vachanbada_ ) that you can't even imagine!

**Questioner** : But in doing _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity the thinking is just one sided, no?

**Dadashri** : Don't say things like 'one-sided'. You just have to make a decision that You want to settle with equanimity. And so it will happen on its own. Even if it does not happen, it is like the layers of an onion; one layer is definitely peeled off. Then you will see another layer of the onion. Then the next time another layer will be gone and so in this manner the onion will be gone completely. This is a Vignan- science. There are instant rewards here; there is "exactness" here. 'You' simply have to 'see' what Chandubhai is doing. 'You' have to 'see' the _Shuddhatma_ in the other person and as a 'file' settle with equanimity.

**Questioner** : Yes, but in doing _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity, if I am faced with worldly difficulties then...

**Dadashri** : Worldly difficulties will come and go. "Ebb and tide" – the water will increase and decrease. Every day in the ocean it increases and decreases twice.

**Questioner** : Our differences in opinions ( _matabheda_ ) are such that we are not able to live together.

**Dadashri** : Even then after doing _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity, people have been able to live together very beautifully. And what benefit are you going to get by living separately?

**Questioner** : She is never ready to understand. She does not get on with any of my relatives and she does not want to keep any relations with them; if she is comfortable in doing that, what should I do?

**Dadashri** : You don't to have a method; you need to know the methods by which you can stay together. This is not an approach of design (intellectual solution). This Gnan is not a design. You simply have to 'see' the methods by which you live.

**Questioner** :This method – is it acceptable from the worldly viewpoint or not?

**Dadashri** : You don't have to see that. 'You' have to live in this method (Settle the file with equanimity and'see' what happens). If you want peace, if you want bliss, then live in this way. Otherwise take the other method. If you do 'design', then you will take a beating. You will not get anything new out of it. Taking a beating is the sign of ignorance, nothing else. This is called as being 'over-wise'! People try to put in their bit on top! After getting the elemental vision, seeing the Self ( _tatva-drashti_ ), why should You look at it in any other way? If you did not attain it, then the other method was there anyway.

**Questioner** : So then I should tolerate this current condition with the belief that it is _karma_ bondage?

**Dadashri** : You don't have to believe anything. What do You have to believe? You, the Self are _gnata_ - _drashta_ ; You just have to 'see' what is happening and what is not. "What happens?" Yesterday when you went home, did you get dinner or not?

**Questioner** : That I get anyway, food.

**Dadashri** : Then what is the problem? You get your meals; you have a place to sleep! Then what more do you want? If the wife does not speak to you, just tell her, 'Please go and sleep in your bedroom.' If she does not speak with you, does that mean you have to plead with her? No you cannot. So don't start any new headaches. If just one life is passed in the Agna of the Gnani, there will be joy in the relative and bliss of the Self in the real.

**Questioner** : Regardless of the situation, I just have to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : Our only duty ( _dharma_ ) is to do _samabhave_ _nikal_. If a certain file is challenging, then we just have to make a decision that we want to settle with it with equanimity. Other files will take adjustments; there it is not so necessary.

**Questioner** : But where there is total dis-adjustment - what should I do there?

**Dadashri** : Keep the intent to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity – keep this decision firm in your mind. 'I want to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ ' – use only these words.

**Questioner** : If the other person does not take any adjustments, then what should I do?

**Dadashri** : You do not have to see whether he makes adjustments.

**Questioner** : So what should I do then? Should I leave?

**Dadashri** : 'You' have to keep 'seeing'. Anything else is not in their control or your control. Therefore You just have to 'see' whatever is happening. Even if you become separated, there is no problem. Our Gnan is not telling you that you separate or that you don't become separate. Just keep 'seeing' what is going on. Even if you both separate, no one will object as to why you are separating and if you live together, even then no one will object. But these "dis-adjustments" is a wrong thing.

**Questioner** : If her nature is to oppose and be hostile, then how can it be changed?

**Dadashri** : The name of this world is _virodhi swabhav_ , attribute of opposition and hostility. The very meaning of the world is opposition and hostility. And if we do not settle with this hostility with equanimity, then it will come every day without fail and then again in the next life! Instead why not settle the account right here? After attaining the Self, one is able to settle accounts.

'I want to follow the Agna' – You have to say this much; that is all. In whose hands are all other adjustments? In the hands of _vyavasthit_.

If You decide that You want to do ' _samabhave_ _nikal_ ' settle with equanimity, then everything will fall into place for You. There is magic in those words. They will bring about a resolution automatically.

**Questioner** : Does _samabhave_ _nikal_ mean that I have to agree to everything that she says?

**Dadashri** : If she tell you to sit here, then sit. If she tells you to go out, then go out. That person is not the doer; it is _vyavasthit_ that is the doer. The poor woman is a _nimit_ (instrumental in the process)! But otherwise you don't have to agree all the time, 'You' have to 'see' whether Chandubhai is saying 'yes' or 'no'. Besides it is not in your control to say 'yes' to her all the time either. 'See' what _vyavasthit_ is making you do. This is a very simple fact but people make it complicated.

**Questioner** : But if she is happy to separate then should we?

**Dadashri** : In that case she is a very nice woman; Elsewhere women bgive their husbands a very hard time! She gives you food in time, does she not? Then that is very good! 'I am so fortunate' you should say that.

**Questioner** : Then she can live the way she wants to.

**Dadashri** : Why are you imaging that she will do this?

**Questioner** : She is doing it for sure; I am experiencing it for sure.

**Dadashri** : No. Even if you are experiencing it, you should not imagine. This whole thing has come about because of imagination. If One lives in My Agna to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity, then he will not have even the slightest of problem and that too even if he is amidst snakes. And here she is not a snake; she is a woman, no? There is nothing there; you have made all this sticky yourself.

## Freedom from conflicts with file two made easy

One has to know the art of living a life.

**Questioner** : Dada, certain skills are required to settle a file with equanimity, is it true?

**Dadashri** : If one does not have that skill even then if he will speak thus then he will learn the skill. If one affirms 'I want to remain in Dada's Agna!' Then even if he does not know the skill, he will learn because he is following the Agna.

**Questioner** : If one didn't learn to adjust with such skill then it will not settle completely, will it?

**Dadashri** : How would you expect such skill in this current time cycle? One does not know to live life, then how will one know the skills? All these women come to me and tell me, 'take an examination of these husbands.' Then out of hundreds and thousands may be two or three will pass, even if I take the examination impartially. One becomes a husband then what does he have to fight for? Why does the separation due to differences of opinions arise? The separation due to differences in opinions ( _matabheda_ ) arises, so you don't know how to become a husband.

We said to settle matters with equanimity, the reason for that is that the one you got married to, you have to bring about settlement with her. Do you not? And in that there is nothing that can excel the attainement of freedom ( _chhootkaro_ ) from her ( _brahmacharya_ ). Sooner or later one has to become free from the bondage of sexual interaction, does he not? Until then one cannot cross the ninth _gunthanu,_ spiritual stage. And if one cannot finish ninth _gunasthanak,_ then he is blocked in his spiritual progress.

## The way to settle with children with equanimity

**Questioner:** The teenagers make demands that, they want a scooter, they want a television. Now I don't make that much money even in a year. So Dada, show me how I should do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity here?

**Dadashri** : Tell the young son, 'why don't you get it? Earn and bring them. I don't have any objection. I have bought things according to my earning power. You can earn and buy what you want. I do not have any problems. I will not get upset with you.' So what did you do? Did you get a bank loan?

**Questioner** : No. When I refused, he became upset and he walks around sulking. So how can I do _nikal_ here?

**Dadashri** : If he is sulking, you have to 'see' what that 'design' looks like. If you ask someone to start sulking, that sulking does not count. The sulking has to be exact. That is why you enjoy looking at the design. You should 'see' that leisurely and be happy. I am 'seeing' and 'knowing' as Dadaji has told me to do. Look you fed them; nurtured them and brought them up and now they have learnt to sting and bite. Right here only, within the household! Hey you! Why don't you bite others on the outside? But there they are quiet as a lamb! They will bite only inside the home. You are very fortunate that you have people that bite! The daughters will not bite but the sons will.

**Questioner** : They ask for money for movies.

**Dadashri** : How much do they charge? About five rupees.

**Questioner** : It costs more Dada; now everything has become expensive.

**Dadashri** : Yes, so they must be seeing two or three a month.

**Questioner** : He sees about fifteen or so a month!

**Dadashri** : He must be taking the money from his mom, no?

**Questioner** : Yes. Sometimes he takes them from me.

**Dadashri** : No, you should not give. You should leave that to his mother. If there is any hassle with the children or they have to be told off, let it be with the mother. How are we to do all that? The fight is always with the cashier, 'why aren't you giving me? Why aren't you giving me?' they will say. Then she will tell them, if it were to come out of the tank then I would give it to you. But the son will bite only the _nimit._ Therefore you should pass it over to his mother. And so his mother will pass it on to him. Then if she does not give him anything, the two of them will fight. Then 'You' can 'see', 'so this is how the world runs!' And the wife will be pleased that you handed over the control to her. So you will be cozy from both the sides. I know how to do all these things.

' _Na chalaniyu nanu_ ' means coins that are not acceptable anywhere; no one will be ready to take them and so they end up sitting near the Lord, in the temple. Instead of running the home your way, just let go of the reins. I let go of reins and so there is no problem at all.

**Questioner** : But Dada I still have that feeling of 'I am the head of the household...I am the father...I should rule the house...'

**Dadashri** : Is it to take the heat from these children that you have to become the father? Who would want to get involved in such suffering unnecessarily? People would understand that you are very shrewd. You must have done some special training. The Tirthankaras were very shrewd! They would not touch money. 'How to escape' is what they knew – the Tirthankaras! And they and leave with a lot of respect and reverence filled ceremony! They would not make a mess like this!

## Should children be scolded or not?

**Questioner:** If my son is telling lies, doing something wrong, should I as a father, repreimand him, or should I accept it as a _karma_ effect?

**Dadadshri** : You should tell Chandubhai, 'How is it that you have become a father? At least say something to this son. How can this be acceptable? As a father if you do not play your role as a neighbor, then both of you will look bad'.

**Questioner** : If I tell the children as it is, do I bind _karma_?

**Dadashri** : How can _karma_ bind You – the Self? This is an account. So whatever account there will be of one life, let it happen. You have to tell Chandubhai, 'dear man, improve this child. This is not acceptable.'

As the father he is responsible and so he has to say things to the child but he must not hit the children. Hitting children makes them _jada_ insensitive and obstinate. What do 'we' emphasise the most? 'We' tell you to explain things to the son or daughter. 'Look if you steal and get caught, do you know what the police will do to you?' So explain things to him. So if you explain things to him over many days, the knowledge will then 'fit' within him. And if he does it after understanding this, then he will be repenting from within that 'this is wrong'. You just have to take him to that point. People keep hitting their children, but they are not to be hit. The poor boy is dictated by his _karma_. At that time he does not even have the awareness.

**Questioner** : But even in those circumstances, can it be said that I have followed the Agna to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle with equanimity, ?

**Dadashri** : Yes, you have followed it of course! The moment You decided that You want to settle with equanimity, it is the same as having followed it.

**Questioner** : Dada, but when the decision is made to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ , 'I' becomes separate and then Chandubhai will continue to do whatever is necessary?

**Dadashri** : You, the Self, have to become separate everywhere in everything for sure.

**Questioner** : But then I have to tell Chandubhai, 'do it this way'?

**Dadashri** : Yes, You have to tell Chandubhai, afterwards what do You have to do with it? It is Your duty to tell the neighbor.

'I' even go as far as to tell him-Ambalal, 'dear fellow, what have I ruined for you in the past life that you are after me in this way?' I would turn him around by saying this to him. So then he himself would say, 'No Dadaji, You have not ruined anything.' I would turn him around. Do 'we' not scold some people sometimes?

**Questioner** : Yes, You do.

**Dadashri** : I have to reprimand those who live with me, but what is it like? It is done "dramatically" - So that it would not have any other wrong effect on them. It would have a good effect on them.

## Equanimity and teaching _pratikraman_ when he steals

It is like this – what do we teach here? If a man has made mistakes and is at fault in every way, then those mistakes of his have to be destroyed.Now the mistakes are conduct and conduct is dependent upon _karma_ effect. So nothing can be achieved; Your continuous scolding him would not work and he does not change. The scolding on the contrary will lead him to make negative _bhaav_ inner intents. The father tells him off for eating out everyday. The poor fellow, he goes even when he does not want to; he has no choice. He does not want to go but even then his _karma_ effect will take him there, and on top of that the father demands, 'why did you go?' So when parents keep nagging their children, the child will say, 'I will not go' but in his mind he decides, 'I am going to go for sure. Let him say it'. Thus the nagging parents spoil their _bhaav_. These people still do not know how to live as fathers. They don't know how to live like mothers. That is why I have to complain and say 'they don't know how to live at all.' They are merely eating, drinking and walking around.

**Questioner** : If I have a son who steals, should I let him steal, is that so?

**Dadashri** : No. You have to object. On the outside you have to object but from within You have to maintain equanimity ( _samabhav_ ). On the outside you have to show your objection but you should not have even a hint of heartless stone cold attitude ( _nirdayata_ ) towards the one who steals. Be careful, if the equanimity within breaks, then you will become harsh; and the whole world becomes harsh. Then when you tell him, but he will understand that, 'my father is upset but he does not have abhorrence towards me.' This is because there is equanimity within. If he maintains equanimity, then what will the father do? He will say to his son, 'sit down dear' he will gently rub his hand on his back. So the poor boy feels a sense of calm within. His heart will be soothed. Then you can tell him, 'Son, what reputation will we have? Who are we? We are reputable family.' And so his intent will turn. So then he will decide that 'I must not do this at all. This is something that should never be done'. He will decide, 'this is like taking poison', and he will become convinced of it.

If he decides this, it means that you have elevated him but otherwise he will create causes for a lower life form in the coming life ( _adhogati_ ). As such, a father does not know how to be a father. I had to write, "unqualified fathers and unqualified mothers". Such are the men and women of India. Does it look good that I have to write something like this?

First thing you have to ask him is, 'are you doing this deliberately or does it just happen?' He will then say, 'I don't want to do it. I did not want to do it several times, but even then I ended up going there'. So even the son understands; that it happens even though he does not want to. So there is some third 'ghost' there. That ghost is the effect of _karma_ ( _udayakarma_ ). So from the moment he tells you that it happens even though he does not want it to, you should understand that he has turned. So when his understanding turns, you have to tell him to do _pratikraman_ whenever he errs. At that time teach him to do _pratikraman_ thus, 'Oh Lord, today I happened to do this, I ask for your forgiveness. I will not do it again'. That is all.

## It is a file that brings pleasure or pain, not your relative

This is why he is called a file. When you get an unfair unexpected _ajugato_ inner kick _godo,_ that is called file. That is why 'we' have not used the name 'file' without a reason. There was a young boy about 9 or 10 years of age; he would not do _darshan_. His father picked him up and touched his head (to Dada's feet). So the son hit his dad, he hit his dad a lot. Do _samabhave_ _nikal_ with the files – settle the file with equanimity.These are all files; they are not your relations. Those who tried to do mine-yours – all of them took a beating.

Your obligation begins with pregnancy and childbirth. Thereafter if he has to be nursed then nurse him or else get milk from outside and feed him and bring him up; do all that – that is your obligation. Then make sure he studies well in school, give him money; that is your obligation. He graduates and gets a job. When he tells you that he gets wages, then you are done. That "item" of yours is now finished. "Item completed!"

**Questioner** :That file is completed.

**Dadashri** : Yes, that file is finished. Now if you were to interfere and involve again and again in that file, what would happen?

You want to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle the file with equanimity; it's meaning is completely different. If something happens then settle with equanimity but as a _Shuddhatma_ , You have no relations of any kind. This is simply an account of given and take. That too it is not a give and take of money. It verily is _shata-vedaniya_ (that which brings the suffering of pleasure) and _ashata vedaniya_ (that which brings the suffering of pain); that has to be paid off. When your son comes home dressed up nicely having passed his exams, that day you suffer pleasure of _shata vedaniya_. Then one day he brings home a girlfriend you do not approve; then that day you suffer pain of _ashata-vedaniya_. You ask him, 'who is this?' He will say, 'she's my friend. Don't you say anything!' At that time you suffer pain and hurt. It is simply the account of suffering of pain or pleasure that is being paid off. You will know within, whether he has come to give pleasure or pain. Based on this, draw your conclusion whether there is a relationship of giving or taking, pleasure or pain, from him. Don't people say 'our son is a blessing?' It means that he gives them more _shata_ pleasure. Ultimately, You will have to understand something, won't You?

## Which is more important, the office worker or the file?

**Questioner:** I have a lot of files to settle _nikal_ yet.

**Dadashri** : Yes, but You have to settle _nikal_ the files, no? Who is more important, a clerk-office worker or a file?

**Questioner:** The clerk.

**Dadashri** : Yes, the office worker may say, 'one room file is of no consequence, bring on five more files!' Does he get tired? Bring on as many as you want.

**Questioner** : I want to leave all the files, but they just keep increasing. What should I do?

**Dadashri** : You want to become free from the files but what happens when you don't make the attempt to do so?

**Questioner** : They will increase. But here as I attempt to get rid of them, they stick even more. What should I do, Dada?

**Dadashri** : Before you were not even aware of, 'this is a file' right? Until then you never made the attempt to become free, did you? And as long as the awakened awareness is not there, one does not even feel the hurt and pain from the file. Once You come to 'know' that these are all 'files', then you 'see' the load of it. One does not feel burden of even twelve children but the moment he says,'there are twelve files', then he will feel the burden. Therefore to 'know' that this is a 'file', and to have that experience-Gnan happen is no ordinary thing. Then it does not matter if the number of file increases. If they increase, they will be settled with.

**Questioner** : From one file arises another.

**Dadashri** : The files will come for sure. You have created the files and so they will come, no? Look if someone else had created them, then we could even scold and take him to task.

## Collective settlement of the files

**Questioner:** Before I have finished settling with equanimity, even one file, two more arise. And sometimes I get so tired that I feel I will settle it one way or another. So I try to follow the Agna but I do not have the _shakti_ ; the energy, to follow it. So what should I do?

**Dadashri** : For that You have to do _nikal_ settle the files collectively.

**Questioner** : But I don't have that much strength to do _nikal_. So they keep increasing over and over.

**Dadashri** : No. It may appear that way to you. You just have to say, 'I want to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ settle the file with equanimity,' and it will happen. If you feel in your mind that you will not be able to follow the Agna, then it will be spoiled.

**Questioner** : No, not that I will not be able to follow the Agna; it is not like that. As I attempt to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ , I feel that they increase even more.

**Dadashri** : You only have to decide that, 'I want to follow Dada's Agna,' that is all. You don't have to 'do' the effort. Then it will automatically become natural.

**Questioner** : As the worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) increases, I am not able to follow the Agna well.

**Dadashri** : Whatever the amount of _vyavahar_ there is; that is the only amount there will be. No new _vyavahar_ is going to arise. So it is all unraveling. There is no reason for you to become anxious. Just make a decision that You to live in the Agna!

## There are no more new files after Gnan

**Questioner:** I know that I have to settle with equanimity _samabhave_ _nikal_ all the files; I understand that. But also there is that statement that I should not create any new files.

**Dadashri** : New files will not arise for sure.

**Questioner** : I do not create these new files, but the new files keep coming.

**Dadashri:** That does not happen with files. 'We' are telling you this one hundred percent. The files you feel are new is because you have not taken a comprehensive analysis ( _taravani_ ) of them from all the sides. When You 'do' the analysis, You will find scientific circumstantial evidences behind them. And because there are scientific circumstantial evidences, it is an old file for sure.

**Questioner** : But all the members of our family that are there, amongst them if there is an addition, some child is born or else someone marries into the family, so are they not considered as a new file?

**Dadashri** : No. Without an old 'file-account', a child would not be born. Those that come across You in life are old files.

**Questioner** : I do not know that this individual is my file.

**Dadashri** : No you come together due to past life accounts. Coming together can only happen if that individual is a file and not otherwise.

**Questioner** : So that means that there are no new files really. Whoever we come in contact with in our life is really our old file; there is no such thing as a new file.

**Dadashri** : Without being old files, they would not meet us. To come together, meeting; is scientific circumstantial evidence.

**Questioner** : So then what do you call a new file?

**Dadashri** : There is no such thing as new file. New files arise for those who have not taken Gnan. That is called _bhaavkarma, karma_ of causation. What is _bhaavkarma_? That which is called as charge _karma_ – that is the new file. Those who do not charge _karma_ , cannot have new files. So whatever old files there are, they are the ones you meet. Do you understand?

**Questioner** : Yes, now I understand. Now I will remember.

**Dadashri** : So if one does not have Gnan, he will charge _karma_ and create a new file. For us whatever old ones we have; they continue to discharge. The child that is born, he too is your old file.

**Questioner** : You explain to us in the Agna to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ and to not give rise to new files; so this too will be settled?

**Dadashri** : Yes. To not create new files, means not to create a charge of any kind over it, so it will discharge. There is no charging in that anyway but this is just a point 'we' are making in general to you, so that you will not remain weak. But otherwise, there is absolutely no charging there.

**Questioner** : If we create new work, then will the files increase?

**Dadashri** : It is like this. However many files there are, that much work will increase. Now, new files will not arise. If your work increases, understand that you still have files. Therefore if there are no files; then there is no work, right? Your business may be big, but if there are no files then you will not have any work, will you?

## Quickly or at the right time?

**Questioner** : But Dada, please do something so that all these worldly interaction files can be settled quickly.

**Dadashri** : It is like this, these files will come to an end when the time comes. If it supposed to come to an end in 1979, then will end in 1979. If in 1980, then it will end in 1980. If in 1981, then it will end in 1981. This marriage between the engine and the passenger compartments is not a marriage forever. When two train comaprtments are joined, then if the one in the front is meant for Baroda, then it will be disconnected there. The engine always continues to move forward. For 'us' too there are compartments at the back and everything continues to move on.

## The exact application of upayoga in settling a file

**Questioner:** But Dada I feel, 'when will this file come to an end quickly?' What do I do about that?

**Dadashri** : That very interference and hassle is hurting you. The file is going to end for sure, so you should engage in some other tasks. The files themselves have no choice but come to an end. So if you wait around for this, then some other task will remain unfinished. So do some other work. If you wait around for the files to settle, then the files will say, 'oh ho ho! We are really important!' Otherwise the settlement ( _nikal_ ) is going to happen for sure. So you must not be preoccupied about that.

**Questioner** : So instead of applying the attention (relative _upayoga_ ) on doing the _nikal_ of files, should the energy and attention be on something else?

**Dadashri** : Yes, let your focus be elsewhere, the files will discharge for sure; when the time is right, the bell will ring. Soat that time remain present as the Self. 'You' have to tell the files to come, whenever they want, the house is theirs. Then promptly settle them with _vitaragata_ (without any _raag_ or _dwesh_ ); Jai Sat _Chit_ Anand!

**Questioner** : So I should not become preoccupied in trying to settle files.

**Dadashri** : 'Oh when will it end? It should end quickly' – all that is the intellect going off on the wrong track.

## As the files decrease, shuddha upayoga increases!

**Questioner:** After coming to Dada, our files have decreased.

**Dadashri** : In that way, the _atmashakti,_ energies of the Atma – the Self, will manifest. One begins to become the Self. When the file ends; the energies will increase immediately. As files decrease, one's _upayoga_ , applied awareness as the Self, will increase. The current _upayoga_ that is there for You, is incomplete because of the files, and therefore You are not able to remain in it. As the files decrease, Your _upayoga_ will increase. When the files end, the _upayoga_ will become completely pure ( _shuddha_ ). What else will remain?

**Questioner** : Then 'I' will be able to remain in _upayoga_ constantly no?

**Dadashri** : As many files decrease, that much _upayoga_ will become whole, complete.

**Questioner** : What method of _upayoga_ should that be?

**Dadashri** : There is no method in _upayoga_. The Self is pure _shuddha_ and the one who insults is pure too. If the other person is insulting Chandubhai, and at that time if Your purity ( _shuddhata_ ) does not go away, then that is called _shuddha_ _upayoga_ but if at that time in your mind you feel 'that man is worthless', then you missed staying in _upayoga_. And therefore you will have to cleanse that much. This is because this is a Vignan (science). It-the file- will not go away completely but you will have to wash it again. You will have to settle with equanimity, the file again. That which has been bound through ignorance ( _agnan_ ) will have to be washed off through Gnan. And if it is not washed through Gnan but dealt with in ignorance, then the same file will have to be washed again. _Karma_ can no longer bind You but you will have to wash the files for sure.

**Questioner** : Dada as the files decrease, here the number of thoughts increase in the _upayoga_.

**Dadashri** : There is no such rule. As far as thoughts are concerned, they will come all daylong for someone who has not decreased any files. Therefore we can say the same thing about him; 'are his files decreased?' No. For You it is because as the files begin to clear, You are now able to 'see' thoughts you could not see before. And so you feel as if they are increasing. They are not increasing; they were there but you could not see them but now everything is being settled ( _nivedo_ ). They have come and so therefore that much settlement will be attained. A circumstance ( _sainyog_ ) will not refrain from coming to an end ( _viyog_ ). So if it dissipates, while You are in the Agna, then it has become cleansed for you. But if your awareness was some place else, then you will have to wash it off again.

## Entanglements in files dissipate awareness

**Questioner** : If I become absorbed in the Self ( _nij_ - _swabhav_ ), does that mean that I am in the Self state ( _nijpada_ )?

**Dadashri** : Yes, to be the Self ( _swabhav_ ) is verily the state of the Self ( _nijpad_ ).

**Questioner** : So is the inability to remain as the Self is the reason for inability to follow the Agna?

**Dadashri** : No, no. It is all those files! When you become entangled in those files, at that time your awareness gets used up there. That is why all this falls short. So sooner or later, you will have to settle the files, without fail. You will have to waste that much time, no? When You come to place where You have no files, then You will have different kind of joy (bliss). And those files that are beginning to empty out, they will end for sure. The files do not remain at all after, ten, fifteen, or twenty years.

## Clear experience of the Self is obstructed due to files

**Questioner:** Dada, after this Gnan, _mahatmas_ have understood this much that the Self is the abode of infinite bliss. Now One should get _spashta_ _vedan,_ clear experience of the Self. What then are the obstructive causes that prevent this clear experience?

**Dadashri:** The obstructive cause for clear experience of the Self is a lot of force of the files. If the force of the files does not prevail in a heavy manner then the experience will tend to increase.

It is like this, if someone asks you whether there is any problem in him going out at 1:30 PM? Then your reply will be, 'brother, it is 1:30 PM right now. Go at 5:00 PM, otherwise the agitation and harassment of moving about in the hot sun will affect you.' It is because of the force of these files that everything happens thus. When files will decrease, changes will happen automatically. 'Do' that which decreases files. Remain within the five Agna. Only this much needs to be done, nothing else needs to be done.

When all these files will decrease then the bliss ( _anand_ ) will not remain contained; it will overflow. The bliss will overflow and the neighbor (Chandubhai) will also benefit. This is because anything that overflows it will come out and when it comes out, it will be helpful to others. The neighbor, file one, will also get the profit. At this time you do not feel the bliss while settling the files. Those interferences do not let you taste that bliss.

**Questioner:** After attaining this Gnan, within how much time will the files settle?

**Dadashri:** It depends on how sticky they are, if they are very sticky then it can continue throughout your life and if it is loosely attached ( _maudi –_ not sticky), then it can dissipate in ten to twelve months.

**Questioner:** No, but can it settle in one life or two to four lives or how long can it take after attaining Gnan?

**Dadashri:** No. One to two more lives. To the One who wants to settle, it will not take time. For the one who does not want to settle, it can take a very long time. For the one who wants to bring total closure at all costs ( _nivedo_ ), it will not take time. The nature of original _Atmashakti_ , energy of the Self, is that if You want to bring to an end then it will help you to bring a closure. If you want to bring to an end then you should come on over in Akram, the path of no doer-ship, and that path exists at this time. However you are not staying in _satsang_. Tell me, how many hours had you stayed in my _parichaya,_ familiarity with the Gnani and _satsang_?

**Questioner:** I might have stayed about full ten hours.

**Dadashri:** Now you are asking for this magnanimous Gnan in ten hours! It is a great wonder that at this time this Gnan has come to you! You are enjoying this big fruit in just ten hours, aren't you? It requires lots of merit _karma_ ( _punyai_ ) to spend one to two hours with the Gnani Purush. You are getting this much fruit, reward by spending ten hours, then how great would it be for spending six hundred hours?

So have your accounts been paid off?

**Questioner:** I have to pay off my accounts from the past life. Now if the account book opens up, I let go for one time that 'OK, you are correct'. But the second, third, fourth time – how many times do I have to do this?

**Dadashri** : As long as that circumstance ( _sainyog_ ) is in front of You. The circumstance ( _sainyog_ ) will automatically go away and you will not encounter it again. The account has been paid off. Then it will not come again at all.

**Questioner** : How can I tell whether an account has been paid off with a certain person?

**Dadashri** : When You no longer have attachment-abhorrence ( _raag_ - _dwesh_ ) towards him; nothing of the sort. You will no longer feel a burden about him. When that file comes, there is "easiness" and when the file leaves there is "easiness". If this state prevails, then You have become free.

## When is the file completely settled?

**Questioner:** Dada, when can one say that these sticky files have dissolved completely?

**Dadashri:** If he speaks negative about you and even then you do not feel hurt in your mind, then it is dissolved. First it will happen from your side, after that it will clear from that file's side. If you make a sound from one side then it will make a counter-sound (echo). It will last up to a certain limit and when your sound will stop then the echo will stop. So whatever that file does; whether wrong or right, you should not have abhorrence ( _dwesh_ ) towards him. Then You become free.

**Questioner:** It has dissolved from my side but what if it has not dissolved from other side?

**Dadashri:** You do not have to see that. If you have not hurt that file from your side then you will not feel the hurt. If you have abhorrence then you will feel the hurt. If you do not have any abhorrence then you will not feel the hurt at all.

**Questioner** : When can we say that the file has become completely unraveled, that it has been settled completely?

**Dadashri** : When that files does not remain in the mind, it means that it is done. It is done when nothing remains in your mind or the file's mind.

**Questioner** : So it should not remain in his mind also?

**Dadashri** : If it does, there is no problem. As long as it becomes completely cleared in your mind; it is done.

**Questioner** : So we should not even have any thoughts about him, is that it? Thoughts about that person will stop.

**Dadashri** : Yes.

## Emotional outbursts amongst _mahatmas_

**Questioner:** _Mahatmas_ sometimes experience distaste in the mind in their interaction with each other, the effect lingers on ( _tanto_ ), so how can they bring about a settlement ( _nikal_ )?

**Dadashri** : For that they only have to settle with it, with equanimity, nothing else. Whatever stock that is filled within, will continue to come out. But from within You have to understand that 'this is the stock of _karma_ coming out'. The garbage is coming out; You need to 'know' that. And that too, if it clashes, then You have to 'see' that. It will not refrain from clashing.

**Questioner** : But the _mahatmas_ that are Dada's...

**Dadashri** : It will happen to _mahatmas_ only. People outside will clash and they will have fights for sure. Clashes amongst _mahatmas_ are not regarded as fights.

**Questioner** : If a _mahatma_ is overcome with emotion and ends up hitting the other person, then who of the two is at fault?

**Dadashri** : You don't have to look at mistakes, at all. In that, the _mahatma_ with awareness; will do _pratikraman_ , with, 'this is a very big mistake of mine, it should not happen.' And he resumes 'seeing' what happens.

**Questioner** : During that outburst, the other person too hit him back but from within does _pratikraman_ , he is repenting his action, then the awareness ( _jagruti_ ) remains, so is that considered as having settled the file with equanimity or not?

**Dadashri** : Yes, the file was settled with equanimity for sure. He does not need to do any other interference, does he?

## _Mahatmas_ are Dada's files ?

**Questioner:** Here when You settle with a file, it is wonderful to see that.

**Dadashri** : That is if one understands that the file has been settled, how was it is settled – one has to have that understanding, no? So You have to 'see' and then learn.

**Questioner** : Each and every _mahatma_ is your file, Dada?

**Dadashri** : Yes, they are all files.

**Questioner** : You have to settle with them, with equanimity, because our ego is likely to become obstinate at any time.

**Dadashri** : You know! He may say all kinds of crazy things. He will say whatever he pleases, but what can 'we' do about that?

**Questioner** : We are all your files, right Dada?

**Dadashri** : Yes, they are files, for sure. But I do not find these files to be a burden and even other files, I do not find burdensome; so it feels like there is no burden. But even eating, drinking; it is all considered as files, but there is no burden about it; there is no effect from it!

Most of the files have been settled then these are called files only, no? Now these ( _mahatmas, satsang_ ) are all voluntary ( _marjiat_ ) files. There is no difficulty in these. And those other files will not let go of us even at two in the morning ( _farjiat-_ mandatory)!

**Questioner** : Does that mean that based on this, you have many files?

**Dadashri** : Many, there is no end to them.

**Questioner** : The _mahatmas_ and their families, they are all files!

**Dadashri** : The family and the entire crowd. Many files, but 'our' understanding is different, that is why! I get rid of all the mistakes within.

**Questioner** : But there is no _raag_ - _dwesh_ with any of the files; You are _vitarag_ with these files.

**Dadashri** : _Vitarag_. So all these people are not files in the true sense. There is no 'stickiness' between 'us' and you. It is called a file only if there is stickiness in it. 'We' do not have files. 'We' are not your file and you are not 'our' file. File is that which elevates one moment and depresses the next.

## You cannot become like Dada

**Dadashri:** Have You benefitted from this _satsang_ or not?

**Questioner** : Now only the files remain to be settled.

**Dadashri** : If there are no outside files, there are files within. When one becomes a complete Gnani, then there will be no files at all. 'We' do not have files.

**Questioner** : Not for You but until we attain _kevalgnan_ , will the files not remain?

**Dadashri** : No, _kevalgnan_ is the station ahead. It is the station after 'Mine'. But if they come to the station where I am, that is more than enough.

**Questioner** : Can the _mahatmas_ reach to your level in this life?

**Dadashri** : No they cannot. You know! This status that You have attained is such that if you were to gather all the Jain and Vaishnav saints and tell them about it, they would refute it saying that it is not possible. It was not the case even in Satyug – past time cycle of golden ages. 'Your' status is such that it is impossible to attain; that is how glorious it is. You should not have the desire to go too much further than this. Remain in Our Agna. If You can remain in the five Agna; then it is more than enough. When the time comes, the station will arrive. You just have to stay seated in the train. 'You' don't have to 'go' anywhere. The station will arrive on its own. When you embark the train at Dadar station, then you have embarked for sure. So even if you remain seated, Aurangabad Station will arrive. Even though You are not going there, Aurangabad will arrive. And others will go for sure (they become the 'goers')!

**Questioner** : I don't feel like moving from here at all.

**Dadashri** : You don't feel like it but you have not choice, right? You have files and so You will have to settle those files, will You not?

**Questioner** : Dada, will there come a time when I will be able to stay with You constantly for twenty-four hours?

**Dadashri** : Yes it will come for the one who has made that intent _bhavana_. This train is now on its way. Then whoever wants to go to Mumbai, he will go to Mumbai and whoever wants to go to Surat, he will go to Surat. One can go wherever he wants to go. One goes as per his decision, no? If that is your _bhavana_ , then You will be able to stay close.

## What now remains is the settlement of parishaha

In the _kramik_ path they tell you to win over all the _parishaha_. When you feel cold, that is _parishaha_. Now the cold is felt on the outside but alas the _parishaha_ arises within. Heat is felt on the outside but agitation arises within. On the inside, it just happens. When there are hunger pangs, that is _parishaha_. When one gets very thirsty, that is _parishaha_. What would happen if one is thirsty but finds no water to drink? Would he think about a woman or ask for water? The woman (sexual desire) too is _parishaha_. 'Win that' that is what they say. But this is Dada's Vignan and what does it say? It says to settle _parishaha_. When is it to be won? We do not have any weapons. We have become _ahimsak_ , non-violent. _Shuddhatma_ means _ahimsak_. If you have the weapons then use it and go ahead and become victorious over the _parishaha_. But You do not have the weapons so it all has to be discharged.

_Parishaha_ – now when will one ever win them over? Not one of them is winnable. If you are feeling very cold, it feels like it is going to snow, you have no blankets; you just have to curl up and go to sleep. You should not even think about the day you had blankets and how cozily you slept.

_Parishaha_ means that if Chandubhai has a habit of waking up early, and he is told, 'you are not move from this bed until eight' – that is _parishaha_. And this man has the habit of waking up late but if he is made to wake up early, _parishaha_ will arise for him. _Parishaha_ does not arise for 'us'. You have to settle the _parishaha_ with equanimity.

If you are not able to sleep at night, then you have to settle with it, with equanimity and even if you were able to sleep, settle that too with equanimity; _samabhave_ _nikal_. Just keep 'seeing' what is happening. Whatever path 'we' have walked on, is the path 'we' are showing You, 'we' are not showing You any other path. So we are showing the path of experience ( _anubhav_ ) only. That will not take long, will it? Nothing has to be done; You only have to 'know' everything.

## Even if you are to be hanged, settle with equanimity

**Questioner:** Now after taking your Gnan, I do not have _artadhyan_ (adverse internal meditation that hurts the self) or _raudradhyan_ (adverse internal meditation that hurts the self and others), but in case they do happen, what kind of _purushartha_ , should I do?

**Dadashri** : You have to do the _purushartha_ (remaining in the five Agna) only. You, the Self do not have _artadhyan_ or _raudradhyan_. Even if they put a noose around your neck, what _purushartha_ do You have to do? You have to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ – settle the file with equanimity.

**Questioner:** We have to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ of _artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_?

**Dadashri** : _Artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_ are trivial. If they announce that you are to be hanged; if they tell you that you will be hanged after three hours, even then You are to settle with equanimity _samabhave_ _nikal._ Because, what do You have to settle? You have to settle with equanimity that which is settling ( _nikali_ ). The One who is 'not _nikali'_ (eternal) is the One who does the _nikal_ (to settle); and all matters that need to be settled ( _nikali_ _babat_ ); the two are separate. The One who is not _nikali_ is very still ( _sthir_ ) and all that is _nikali_ is unstill, restless and changing ( _asthir_ ) and it will go away. It is in the _nikali babat_ (that which is to be settled) that _artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_ happen. It is not in the One who does the _nikal_. The understanding must be there in everything. You get burnt by the mistakes you make due to lack of understanding. It is a Vignan that if you make a mistake, you get burnt. So what am I saying? I am telling You that You must have the understanding.

## The two tasks of antaratma, the awakened Self

When one became _Shuddhatma_ , pure Soul, then, 'this is file number one'. That which was our entrapment in fault ( _ganeygari_ ), has resulted in this file number one, and no one else was at fault in this. As long as this fault-laden file exists we have not become absolute state of the Self ( _Shuddhatmaroopa_ ) _._ This is because as long as settlement of file one's accounts are pending, one cannot become the pure Self completely. That state is when One is in the state of _antar-atma_ (the Self in an interim government state) - awakened but not completely free. _Antar-atma_ has two tasks. When no file is there to be settled, it enters into the meditation as the Self and when there is a file to be settled then it settles the file.

The _antar-atma_ (the awakened Self) has come on just one thing and that is 'do _nikal-_ settle the files' and 'I am _Shuddhatma_ '. After attaining the _Shuddhatma_ the Self, in the Gnan _Vidhi_ , the _antaratma_ also known as the interim government state, is attained.

**Questioner:** But what about the one who has taken Gnan?

**Dadashri** : He verily is the one who attains the _antar-atma_ ; others do not attain the _antar-atma._

**Questioner** : You said about one becoming _Purushottam_ , the absolute Self, and that the interim government will remain until all the files are settled; so which is the quickest way to become free from the files?

**Dadashri** : The one who wants to do it quickly, becomes obstructed. If the files were to come to an end, you would start complaining. If You simply 'see' everything like you see a movie, then would there be any problems? Until the complete level is reached, until the government becomes full, the semi-government is bound to remain, no? For how long will the semi-government stay? Until all the files are settled. Once the files have been settled, you will move from the interim government to the full government. Why interim government?The answer is because the work concerning the files is still pending otherwise it would be full government. The conviction ( _pratiti_ ) that You have is of the full government for sure. For others it is very difficult to attain that conviction. They do not have such a conviction; had it been such a conviction, then nothing would remain to be done.

## Have conversations with file number one

**Questioner:** File number one is one's own self. Sometimes it becomes very hard to handle it. I then have to scold it.

**Dadashri** : You have to explain things to it and appease it inorder to get your work done. If it is acting a little superior and riding high, You have to tell it, 'come down'.

**Questioner** : Even when I say such things, the file does not listen. This happens a lot.

**Dadashri** : It will work if you use Dada's name. Tell the file, 'at least listen to Dada!' If there is weakness there, You will have to settle with it again. Then there will not be any problems. But You do talk to the file, don't You? From the moment you talk to file number one, You become _Shuddhatma_ – is that not a wonder? Is that proof not enough? When You talk to file number one, what are You?

**Questioner** : _Shuddhatma_.

**Dadashri** : So is that anything small? When You say 'file number one', at that moment You become the complete _Shuddhatma_. Now what else remains besides file number one? The answer is 'only the _Shuddhatma_ '.

If he becomes hyperactive, tell him, 'Chandubhai, calm down. Don't do this. Do your work slowly.' Both are separate for sure. The one giving instructions—the Cautioner and the doer –the cautioned, are both separate. The one giving instruction is the one who is the Cautioner. Who does the cautioning? _Chetan_ – the Self. The Cautioner and the cautioned are both separate. So then You have to say, 'why are you fretting needlessly; easy does it'. If he gets upset just one day, he will ruin it for five people. That is why You have to tell him, 'you were agitated when you left home but don't try to hurry things over here'. 'You' have to say all such things to him. Without settling with equanimity, how is it going to work? If you are angry and you sit down to cook, is it going to work? Cooking has to be done in a very methodical way. It is natural to become agitated. Being human, who would not get agitated? Only the Gnani will not get agitated. Everyone else is bound to become agitated. Do you get agitated?

**Questioner** : Often I even get depressed.

**Dadashri** : 'You' have to tell him, 'don't be depressed. Why are you getting depressed; 'I' am with you!'

**Questioner** : Is it possible for file number one to be depressed?

**Dadashri** : Of course it is. If it does not get depressed then what else? It becomes elevated and it will get depressed. It will become happy and it will become unhappy, what work does it have? But You, the Self do not have any problems.

## Understanding the ego and pragnya

It becomes easy for 'Us' to see what we were like. This current life is a picture of our past life. Today all the activities that are taking place, is the projection of our past life. The projection is of the past life. Presently the 'film' is running. So we can 'know' what we were like in the past.

**Questioner** : Who is the entity that knows that we were like this before and we are like this presently? Does such a question arise for the one who is the knower-seer _gnata_ - _drashta_?

**Dadashri** : All this is, is of _pragnya_ (the liberating energy of the Self). The ego also says 'alas we were like this'. _Pragnya_ says 'you were like this'. Both 'Us' and 'you' are there for sure. Here 'you' is the file and 'Us' is Us – the Self. Here, 'you' is the file number one. Do You 'know' this file?

**Questioner** : Yes, I do.

## The body complex is gneya and I am gnayak

**Dadashri** : File number one is dependent upon _karma_ \- _karmadheen_. So if file number one does something wrong, what is it to Us-the Self? Today You have become _Shuddhatma_. And the Self knows what the file does. Now You have become _Shuddhatma_ and file number one is dependent upon _vyavasthit_. So if file one happens to do something wrong, if it ends up crushing a large insect, then in that, You are _Shuddhatma_ and so that is not Your responsibility. You are the _gnayak_ , the One knowing continuously. Now it is necessary for You to remain in Your own _dharma_ , in Your own attributes as the knower-seer. On that day (before Gnan) in ignorance you had carried out your _dharma_ of doership. Now You cannot do the _dharma_ of doership. That is in the control of _vyavasthit_.

Knowing continuosly ( _gnayak_ ) is the innate nature of _Shuddhatma_ ; its nature is not as a doer. What is wrong with being in the _swaroop,_ the nature of the Self, that You have become? That is the very nature You need to remain in. What is the fruit of (remaining as) the _gnayak_? It is eternal bliss. That is what You want, and You will continue to get that. And the settling of files with equanimity, will continue to happen. You were the one who called the files, did you not? You called them by mistake, no?

Now there is no problem in saying 'it is mine', but it is not so from within; it is not in Your belief. In Your heart You know that 'nothing belongs to me'. Even the 'my-ness' ( _mamata_ ) is gone, no? Not even for an hour can anyone's ownership of the body go away. When we talk about the body, they will say, 'the body is mine so naturally I am the one feeling the pain. I got hurt, I am having throbbing pain'; that is what they say. Even the ascetics and the preceptors say the same thing. There is no other way there, is there? Because as long as there is the _dehadhyas_ , 'I am this body', they do not say anything else, whereas You are saying, 'my file number one is ruined. File number one' - that Gnan is nothing small; this Gnan is no ordinary thing. This Gnan is so straightforward and easy!

**Questioner** : We are able to settle with all other files with equanimity ( _sambhave_ _nikal_ ), but can you explain in detail how I should settle with equanimity with file number one. Because all the interferences are from only file number one.

**Dadashri** : Those intereferences will go away by 'seeing' them; by seeing the file. Whether is it is awkward or straightforward, there is no hassle with the file. They will go away only by 'seeing' them. If the other person is making a claim, then you have to do _pratikraman_. Here (in Akram) there is no plaintiff, is there? And so they will go away by simply 'seeing' them. If bad thoughts are sprouting in the mind, if they are a little negative and the intellect is getting spoilt – you have to just 'see' all that. There is no problem with whatever activity he (file number one) is doing, it simply has to be 'seen'. This is the most straightforward path to liberation; it is the easiest.

**Questioner** : To 'see' means I should not agree with he is doing?

**Dadashri** : There is no agreement with him in that at all; just keep 'seeing'!

**Questioner** : Yes but the interference I caused, if I 'see' that and 'know' that, then because of my intereference if the other person is hurt, I have to do _pratikraman,_ do I not?

**Dadashri** : Why was the _atikraman_ done such that it hurt the other person? So for that the _pratikraman_ has to be done. You should not do anything that hurts the other person.

**Questioner** : 'He—Chandubhai' is doing _pratikraman_ everyday but even then nothing is improving.

**Dadashri** : No, a vast quantity of stock-of _karma_ has been filled. Tremendous amount of stock. Doing _pratikraman_ is _purushartha_ itself.

**Questioner** : We are not making excuses in saying 'a lot of stock has been filled', are we?

**Dadashri** : No, no. There can never be excuses in this at all. The entire world will not do _pratikraman_. To begin with, the entire world will do _atikraman_ and then it will claim, 'I did the right thing'.

## Settling file one by seeing it

**Questioner:** When can I say that the account of file number one has been truly settled?

**Dadashri:** When the file number one is very upset and boiling and then if it cools down; then know that file number one is properly settled.

**Questioner:** Please explain that exactly.

**Dadashri:** The file will boil and behave angrily for sure, but now onwards it will all go away. Always whatever _sanyog,_ circumstance, is there will dissociate ( _viyog_ ) for sure. So it will definitely dissociate by itself. Until then You should not leave Your steadiness and stillness. It will go away. You had created the circumstances, in the past life. Is there anyone else's interference ( _dakhal_ ) in this, within? If there is, then a compliant would be justified. You cannot even speak, can you? Should we not understand the result of our own interference ( _dakhal_ )? Therefore, if you 'see' with separation, it will leave.

**Questioner:** Dada, when I settle this file number one, whatever is happening within it keeps arising in the vision; so does that mean that settlement of file number is happening?

**Dadashri:** Why it will not happen? Before You did not even have the vision that file number one is there. Whatever you were doing you used to say that 'Truly, I am doing it.' Now file number one is doing it, and You are 'knowing' that.

**Questioner:** It happens that conflict is happening within and simultaneously I am 'knowing' that too.

**Dadashri:** Conflict can not happen at all for sure. This Vignan is such that conflict does not arise at all.

**Questioner:** So then what is it that happens inside?

**Dadashri:** It is suffocation. When entanglements arise, due to lack of understanding, you get entangled.

**Questioner:** Dada, how can I get rid of this suffocation?

**Dadashri:** You remain in the Agna of the Gnani Purush properly and systematically.

## The details of settling file number one with equanimity

There is no intrference and hassle with file number one, is there? None whatsoever? Oh ho ho! So no faults have been created of file number one?

I am asking our _mahatmas_ , 'Have You settled file number one with equanimity?' Then someone says, 'what is there to be settled in file number one?' Hey You, the real file is verily file number one. This pain ( _dukha_ ) that you have, the pain and suffering that is felt within, is due to unnaturalness ( _asahajata_ ). Someone had asked me, 'this is file number one, what is the problem if we do not consider it as a file? How does calling it a file help us? It is not help much in this.' Then I answered, 'this living being has harassed and interfered with this file very much and intensely for a long time, and as a consequence it has become unnatural'.

So he tells me, 'if I have done wrong with other files, I understand that but I don't understand what wrong I did with file number one'. Alas! Only when this is explained in details can one understand all the wrong that was done.

He asked, 'I do _samabhave_ _nikal_ with all other files. Then if I fight with file number two, or have any other problems with file number two, I do _nikal_ settle that too, but this file number one, which is my own file; what _nikal_ settlement has to be done with it?' So these people have no idea of what needs to be done. There is no end to _nikal_ settlement that has to be done. I explained that to him. So then he too said, 'this fact needs a lot of thinking'.

Outside when the lectures are given by a President or other dignitary, at that time even if one wants to spit, he will not. He is sitting in the audience and wants to go to the bathroom to urinate, he will not go for and hour or two. Does that happen or not? Even if he wants to empty his bowels, he will wait an hour. Otherwise if he were to get up in the middle of the audience, his impression will be ruined, no? If he wants to empty his bowel, will he not try to stop it for an hour or so?

**Questioner** : Yes. Even then he will stop it. He will go only when he can no longer hold it.

**Dadashri** : But in doing all this, the natural spontaneity of the body is broken down. People have not let it remain natural and spontaneous. And this has been done in many instances. And so a lot of damage and wrong has been done to file number one.

You have not let this body remain natural and spontaneous ( _sahaj_ ) andtherefore You have to settle with equanimity _samabhave_ _nikal_ this file number one. It has become unnatural ( _asahaj_ ) because its natural tendencies have been repeatedly suppressed. One will keep on walking even if he is tired.

If he is eating at a restaurant and file number one gets full, he will still keep shoving the food in, because the food tastes so good; that is doing damage. Our people have harassed file number one a lot.

If a book is interesting, he will keep on reading it even when it is time to go to sleep. He becomes interested no?

**Questioner** : But Dada how are we to even get the idea that file number one is like this – that there is a file number one?

**Dadashri** : Yes, 'I am the one only', is everywhere.

**Questioner** : Yes. It is only because we came to You and you performed some magic that we realized that 'this is our file'. Otherwise we too were just the same way.

**Dadashri** : 'I am the one, for sure' – if that is the case then why do you tie your hair? (Dada referring to the practice of students studying for exams would tie their hair to the chair so if they nod off, the tug on their hair will awaken them!) So then he says, 'Because I have exams right now'. Hey you If it is you for sure, then why don't you do it – why don't you read? He'll say 'but I keep falling asleep!' So are you not that? But he does not understand the difference.

If he wants to see a play and file number one wants to sleep, he will not let file sleep but he will go to see the play instead. He will see the play till three in the morning and he may even doze off once or twice. At that time someone else will say, 'why don't you see the play, why are you sleeping?' so he wakes up. And if nothing else he will put something in his eyes to stay awake; but oneway or another, through force and coercion he gets work out of it (file number one). He created obstructions for the file's sleep. For what? So that he could see the play, he obstructed its sleep.

This has all become very irregular. When it becomes irregular it becomes unnatural. When it becomes unnatural, it makes the self unnatural. The one whose body is natural, his self is natural too. So first, file number one has to be made natural. Do people stay awake at night or not? You are fortunate that in your share of things you don't have plays and other distractions. In 'our' times, there were a lot of plays. Now is file number one at fault in that? Is file number one not worthy of due consideration?

**Questioner** : Yes Dada. File number one for sure.

**Dadashri** : When people go from here to Mumbai in train, do people not obstruct their sleep? Even when they are supposed to be sleeping, they travel to Mumbai by train so they stay awake all night. The body will sway back and forth and fall on top of someone sitting next to him! The other person will feel 'a prominent contractor like this and he leaned his head on my shoulder!?' Even our coat becomes greasy from the person's oily hair, but what can he do? What can we say to that other person? Because he is not at fault, we sat next to him so it is our fault. How is he at fault? That poor man was sleeping naturally! But we did not allow our body to be natural and hence all this hassle. What did the Lord say? 'Make the body natural', whereas these people, made it unnatural.

He would not sit down on the floor in the train even if he is tired. What does file number one say? 'I am very tired', but even then this proud man would not sit down. Would that happen or not? I would tell him, 'now why don't you sit?' No people will see. But who knows you here and even if they know who you are, so what? Is there anyone with 'true respect' here? Have you seen anyone with 'true respect ( _abroodar_ ) in this train? If indeed there was someone worth respecting, then we would lose our respect, but that is not the case here. I had 'seen' many so called 'respectable' people in my life. So I had come to understand, so when I travelled by third class, I would put the bag down and sit on top of the bag. If the bag got dirty, it would not be a problem.

So the point I am making is that we make the body so unnatural and then we say 'I am not hurngry right now. I will eat when I feel hungry but what's the hurry? Let the discussion continue. An hour and half will pass by and this is what people do. Then he says, 'Now I have completely lost my appetite'. You mooah (the dying one)! how is the appetite going to remain active? These are all the 'experiments' he's been doing. You fool, you become hungry but you eat two hours late because you are playing cards. So many people get stuck in fun and enjoyment and they put off things by saying, 'I'll do it in a minute...I'll do it in a minute...', and then they will eat two hours later when their appetite is gone. So this is how everything has become unnatural.

About thirty years ago I had seen this man order tea at the station where the train stopped. The man gave him a cup of tea in his hand. The train then started to get ready to pull out, so this man thought he'll waste his money so he quickly poured the whole cup in his mouth, the fool got scalded! I saw this with my own eyes. Yes he poured the whole cup in his mouth. First he drank out of the saucer but when three quarter of the cup was left, the train started to roll and so the tea vendor told him, 'hey hurry up and drink up' and so this man did! After drinking it, he got burnt so badly, the poor man. Our people are so clever, they will not let their money go to waste, will they? Not even a penny would be wasted.

So when I explained all this in the _satsang_ , people told me they had done a lot of things like that. I told them, 'come and I will explain it to you very briefly. Why not understand based on that?' Not a single settlement with equanimity ( _samabhave_ _nikal_ ) has been done with file number one. This file has to be made _sahaj_ , natural, by doing _samabhave_ _nikal_ with it.

## Whose file is it?

**Questioner:** You have given us the Agna to settle the file with equanimity _samabhave_ _nikal_ , so then who does the settlement of these files? Is it real or is it relative? Because the real—the Self has only to 'see' everything and relative-Chandubhai is all under _vyavasthit_.

**Dadashri** : _Pragnyashakti_ does it all, in order to take You to _moksha_.

**Questioner** : This file number one – whose is it? Is it _Shuddhatma_ 's or the absolute original Self's – whose is it?

**Dadashri** : It is of the _pragnyashakti_ liberating energy of the Self, that is inside. _Pragnyashakti_ has been established to take him to _moksha_ , the one who had become bound. Therefore, this Chandubhai is the file of _pragnyashakti_ ; because this 'file' creates obstacles for taking You-the awakened Self- _antaratma_ to _moksha_. The original absolute Self does not get involved in this at all.

## F-I-L-E distinguishes the awakened One of Akram Vignan

**Questioner:** Instead of saying 'I am Chandubhai', more separation remains by saying, 'this is file number one'.

**Dadashri** : Yes, more of a separation remains; it remains separate for sure. There are many things that possess Chandubhai. Nothing remains bound if You call it a file, no? File means 'clearance' of everything. The Self is clear; and that other is called file.

**Questioner** : Calling it file number one one means there is separation on the spot.

**Dadashri** : Separation for sure.

**Questioner** : Instead of remembering 'I am Chandubhai', I remember 'file number one', more.

**Dadashri** : With Chandubhai, there are a lot of things. Chandubhai has commonsense, he does not have enough commonsense, he is short, he is tall, he is dark – all those things belong to Chandubhai and when You say the word 'file', then everything falls in that.

**Questioner:** It is not necessary to describe in detail; everything is automatically included in it.

**Dadashri** : F...I...L...E – when you say file, everything falls inside it.

This is a file. File number one, there is no Self ( _chetan_ ) in that entire file. And when 'we' separated this file, in the Gnan _Vidhi_ ; there is no mixture with that file anymore. And in this file, there is not even a cents worth of the Self in it. Is this not easy to understand?

**Questioner** : That is correct.

**Dadashri** : That is why, which part do 'we' call 'file'? The answer is, one that has not even a cent's worth of _chetan_ – the Self. And besides the file, which part is _Shuddhatma_? The answer to that is the one in which there is not even a cents worth of _achetan_ (non-Self) in it. Yes it is absolutely clear. You using the term 'file number one'; is really a spiritual victory. You having become the Self and are 'saying' it. And this is really a 'file'. 'You' have not believed the body as Yours, have You? It has become just a file, no? File means separate. The Self is separate and the file is separate. Then would any relationship remain?

The body is a file, the house is a file, the ring is a file, the jewelry is a file, the clothes are a file, your suitcase is a file – everything is a file. I (the Self), and these files are separate. So the body is a file; the body is separate from 'I'. The mind is a file and so the mind is separate. This separation should remain in the awareness. That is called the greatest of all knowledge, Gnan. For You everything is a file, no?

From the moment One knows that these are simply files, He begins His journey towards _moksha_. No one can raise objection towards that. But otherwise what can even a prominent saint do? He will say, 'my stomach, my legs' – when all these are understood to be files, then One's work is done no? When One has understood files, then His work is done for sure, no? The one who has come to know the files, the word 'file' itself means, 'I' and this are separate.

This Gnan has been placed so beautifully. The word 'file' is used from the start and he starts to accept it; he even agrees to it.

**Questioner** : People are educated and so this language immediately comes into acceptance and understanding, ' this is a file'.

**Dadashri** : But where will one get such _punyai_ , merit _karma_? From where will we get the _punyai_ such that one can earn two million in two months? Such is the kind of _punyai_ that has accumulated for these people. That which cannot be attained in millions of lifetimes, is attained in one hour.

**Questioner** : And in this day and age.

**Dadashri** : Yes, in this day and age.

Here we separate him on the very first day. He then says, 'I am _Shuddhatma_ and the file is called Chandubhai'. From the moment he says 'file', the Self becomes separate. Otherwise no one calls it a 'file'.

It is good that we have called it a file, no? When You say file number one, it means you have become the Self.

**Questioner** : This Vignan is such that it automatically becomes separate.

**Dadashri** : This Vignan is completely different.

**Questioner** : People will start thinking the moment they hear the word 'file'.

**Dadashri** : That is it; everything will be solved with just that. ' _Amcha pot, amcha pot_ – my stomach, my stomach', but how long can one go on saying 'mine'? What are they referring to when they say ' _pot_ '?

**Questioner** : ' _Pot_ ' means stomach!

**Dadashri** : In the _kramik_ path one believes the body to be 'my body'; 'these are my legs,' and that is why one looks ahead and walks carefully, incase 'I might accidentally crush an insect'. And here in the Akram path, the Self is attained directly and this body is a file.

No ascetic or preceptor will call the body as a 'file'. 'This is my body', would they call it a file? 'My body, my teeth, my nose, the eyes are mine, and this body of mine has become very fat...my body is very thin...I have lost some weight. I am like this and I am like that. All these are hassles of the body only, no?

'I am _Shuddhatma_...I am separate' if one speaks like that, then that self is not in the Self , but when he says, 'all this is a file' then He is the Self, because everything except the Self falls into it. And with file number one, it proves that the Self is there. I am the Self, _Shuddhatma_. This Vignan is very big.

This world has no awareness that 'this is a file'. One person asked me, 'when we use the word 'file' in this, it means that besides the Self, everything that remains, You are calling as 'file'. So when you say file number one, it means you have become _Shuddhatma_. This is because the Self has become separated. The moment You say 'file number one', the Self becomes separate. Because You are _Shuddhatma_ and that which is in front, internally, neighbor is 'file number one'; there is just these two. Who has the intent ( _bhaav_ ) of, 'I have to settle with equanimity with file number one'? The answer is 'the other one who has becomes separate'. So we ask, 'where is this _bhaav_ in the Self?' And the answer is that, 'as long as _pragnya_ is there, there will be _pragnya_ 's _bhaav_ there. _Pragnya_ arises and that _pragnya_ does all the work. The main absolute Self does not do any work. Whenever right vision ( _samyak_ _darshan_ ) arises, that is when _pragnya_ arises. That which Lord Krishna has called as ' _sthita_ _pragnya_ ' is a different thing. The state of _sthita_ _pragnya_ is different and this is _sahaj_ _pragnya_ state, natural state of the awakened energy of the Self. It will not let You go until it takes You to _moksha_. It will keep cautioning you. Its very nature is to take You to _moksha_. It will beat You and force You; it will shake you up from here and there and ultimately accomplish the goal with ease.

## My-ness, mamata vanishes with the word 'file'

**Questioner:** The word 'file' You have put in place, the English meaning of the word 'file' is so huge, that when the word file arises within, then it feels like, all this is not mine. So it becomes easy within, to settle with it, with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : The word 'file' is placed such that, the 'speaker' of the word, 'file number one,' is the Self, that fact is decided. This is a very profound fact.

**Questioner** : When one intent in the mind ( _manovruti_ ) arises that 'I want to settle with equanimty', then the 'seeing' ( _drashtabhaav_ ) comes into play and the ego vanishes.

**Dadashri** : Yes it will vanish.

**Questioner** : So in Gnan, using this process of 'file' and ' _samabhave_ _nikal_ ' settle with equanimity; by simply using the word 'file' a kind of understanding arises from within that 'this is not mine. It is of the non-Self' and that is why it becomes easy to settle it with equanimity. If I believe it to be my own, then it would be difficult to settle with equanimity.

**Dadashri** : 'File' means it is something that is separate – everyone will be able to know this. Such are the words that have come out!

**Questioner** : Dada it feels that whatever you say will become scriptures of the future. It feels that this sentence is of this scripture of the future. The word 'file' that has been used, people who analyse, will go deep into, what it meant by it.

**Dadashri** : Whatever words that have come out; they have become exact.

**Questioner** : They have become exact.

**Dadashri:** There is a relationship between him and the children, but there is no relationship between the Self and the file. Because file is always separate.

**Questioner** : If the word 'file' is used, myness ( _mamata_ ) will not remain.

**Dadashri** : When there is no myness ( _mamata_ ), only then there will be a file – thereafter the _mamata_ too will vanish. This is a complete scientific method. It is a path which is scientific itself and that is why it gives result within an hour. When you took Gnan, did it take you just an hour or longer? And see how it has flourished! Otherwise it takes so many lifetimes for Gnan to manifest. Because ours is Akram Vignan, we can understand that 'this is file number two, this is file number one; one is able to recognize file number one. This Vignan is very much "first class".

**Questioner** : This phenomenon of 'this is file number one' is an incredible discovery.

**Dadashri** : It is like this, each and every word is a discovery. Otherwise man cannot become free even after hundreds of thousands of life times.

## The energy of the word nikal

**Questioner:** The word ' _nikali_ '(that which is settling, discharging) that you have used has a psychological effect for sure; the word ' _nikali_ ' itself is like that.

**Dadashri** : The effect of the word ' _nikal_ '(to settle) verily happens. Each and every word is effective. Not just the word ' _nikal_ ' but 'real,' 'relative' are also so effective for people; so all these words are effective and the word ' _nikal_ ' is a very great word. Not just today but in the time to come, each and every word here is going to be analyzed by people.

You like the word ' _nikal_ '? This word ' _nikal_ ' is nowhere to be found in the scriptures. It can never be in any scriptures, can it? "Do _samabhave_ _nikal_ – settle with equanimity" That is the magnificent splendor of Akram Vignan! And people have become so pleased with this science.

**Questioner** : After using this word ' _nikal_ ', there is no insistence ( _pakkad_ ) in any situation, otherwise there is insistence everywhere for sure.

**Dadashri** : Yes, there is nothing but insistence – but here there is nothing to attain ( _grahan_ ) or nothing to renounce ( _tyaga_ ) – just settle _nikal_! For this settling the file with equanimity _sambhave_ _nikal_ with files, chant-penance-renunciation ( _japa-tapa-tyaga_ ) are all included in it.

When he says, 'I want to do all settlement _nikal_ of this shop', then we can understand what it is that he is trying to settle and what the result will be. When he uses the word settle- ' _nikal_ ' we can understand and if he says he wants to 'sell it off', then we do not quite understand, because what merchandise must he have and what does he want to sell? But when he says ' _nikal_ ', we can immediately understand that he wants to get rid of it.

Because it is _nikali_ , it means yours is _nikali_ and so is his _nikali_. You-the Self are separate and so is the _nikali_ (that which is to be settled) part. And that is why oneness with the Self ( _abhedata_ )- 'I am the Self'- and arises. This is such a scientific thing that when an analysis of it is done, when some foreign scientist meet with Me, that is when this fact will be understood more.If such an opportunity arises, if they meet me, then I will give them an outline of all the things ahead.

Then the wife, children etc. are all _nikali_ matter; it is not matter that needs to be attaind. Even if it were something that had to be renounced ( _tyaga_ ), then it would be something that is a hassle that binds ( _vadagan_ ). If it were something that needed to be attaind ( _grahan_ ), then it would be a hassle that binds ( _vadagan_ ), too. But there is no problem for that which is _nikali_. If there is renunciation ( _tyaga_ ), then is there not a difference between renounciation ( _tyaga_ ) and settling ( _nikal_ )? Tell me what is the difference?

What does renunciation say? We have a saying, ' _tyagey oosko aagey'_ , the one who renounces, will get more of the same in the future. Have you heard that saying? _'Tyaagey so aagey'_ If a man renounces a woman here then there in the celestial world, he will have much better women. So by renouncing, one binds _punyai_ (merit _karma_ ) and the fruit of that will be even greater. Do you understand this? _'Tyagey oosko aagey'_ – whatever one renounces, he will get the fruits for it later on. If you take several hundred pounds of grains from our home and plant it in the field; that is considered as doing _tyaga_ (renounce). Then later you will get the bountiful result, no? So similarly, in this world, there is ' _tyagey oosko aagey'_. It says, 'if you want it, then renounce it'.

And this _nikal_ means You cannot take it nor can You give it. Just do _nikal_ – settle it. We have nothing to do with it anymore. So the Vignan of all that which is _nikali_ , is different altogether.

There is _nikal_ and file. In the Vignan that does not call for renunciation or acquisition ( _tyaga-grahan_ ) only settlement _nikal_ has to be done. Here with Us 'we' do not have to attain or renounce. Renunciation or acquisition, is done by one with an ego. The entire world is caught up in acquisition-renunciation. The ascetics renounce all conduct associated with being a worldly person and they attain conduct associated with being an ascetic. And such a one can never get _mukti_ –liberation. _Mukti_ (liberation) is not such a thing that one can find with ease at all. Liberation should be such that from the very beginning each and every sentence fill us with liberation. We feel liberated. We find sweetness in those sentences. So that is something very different. Everything else is nothing but botheration and entanglements.

## This is Dada's Vignan!

This is the only thing worth doing; this is a Vignan, it is not a religion. So here you ask Me the questions and then You have to do only according to what 'we' tell You to 'do'. You have to do _samabhave_ _nikal_ – settle with equanimity. There is tremendous energy in that. There is so much energy placed in those words. And in that there is never going to be any harm or loss. But otherwise from the moment one arrives in this world, profit and loss is always going on.

When You say You want to settle with equanimity ( _samabhave_ _nikal_ ) then everything within will start to turn. It is due to the power and energy in our words ( _vachanbada_ ). _Vachanbada_ has been placed in that sentence. And Your work will be done very beautifully because of that. Then in the end, even after five or ten years, settlement with equanimity will happen with it-the file. There will no longer remain any worldly interaction relationship with him. There will not be a relationship of _raag_ - _dwesh_ (attachment-abhorrence) with him; there will not be a 'file' with him.

Now, what do the words 'I 'did' _samabhave_ _nikal_ ' say? That much of _punyai_ is bound, and it will lead to a resolution ( _ukel_ ) in the next life. The very meaning of doing ' _samabhave_ _nikal_ settlement of files with equanimity' is; that it makes the self, the Self. This has never happened in any time cycle. Today no one would find this fact credible. They will believe it when they taste it!

## Aho Aho This wonderous Akram Vignan

I am telling you that this Akram Vignan is very scientific; it is a Vignan. One will know what it is when it will all come out. The entire world will one day, in a hundred to two hundred years, five hundred years will become awed by it. And Vignan means it is a non-controvertial and incontrovertible principle that brings the ultimate result of liberation ( _siddhant_ ). It can be called a _siddhant_ only when it can never become a non- _siddhant_. What other places do we find _siddhant_? You will never see a _siddhant_ anywhere. After reading twenty-five pages or so, you will find a contradiction. Never before has non-contradictory speech ever been uttered. It is fresh, it is new and it helps people.

It is one and the same but it is fresh. But the word 'file' is a very nice English word that has been placed. Because later people are going to investigate as to which time cycle it arose. They will discover that it took place during the time of the English people. Then the sentence, ' _koyee bapoye rachnar nathi_ – there is no _baapo_ , father-figure, who created it' - that is the Charotari dialect (Gujarat). So this language itself will say everything. Those investigating will find the answers.

## This Vignan has manifest after a million years!

**Questioner:** In this Vignan of Dada, the most precious thing we found is that Dada shatters the ego completely. He destroys the ego. We have not seen the destruction of the ego any place else.

**Dadashri** : It can never be. It is not possible. And it has never happened either. But that is why 'we' said one million years. Akram has come after one million years. So with the vanishing of the ego, the difference between You and Lord Mahavir is, that in Lord Mahavir's state, He does not have to do _nikal_. He had no files at all whereas you are entangled in the files; that is the only difference. But otherwise He did not have any worries and nor do You.

## The Lord was without files

There is no one else. There we have to suffer the results of our mistakes. The ownership was ours, but there is no superior. The One that is sitting within; He verily is our Lord. This _Shuddhatma_ is verily the Lord. The one without the file is called _Shuddhatma_ Bhagwan and the one with the files is called _Shuddhatma_.

As long as Chandubhai has files, You are _Shuddhatma_. As long as the files are there, the intellect will remain but You- the Self are separate. 'You' are not in anyone of them all. From the moment Dada has separated You, if there is a file, remain seated within the Self, remain seated and then move along with the crowd. Even though you don't like it, you will have to stay with the crowd, so it will bother you from within but having become separate from within, everything is separate for sure. When You settle with equanimity, _samabhave_ _nikal_ with those files, You will start to become free from those files.

**Questioner** : Dada I want to attain the state You are in, whereby even if all the files are there, they do not touch Me at all.

**Dadashri** : Yes, you have brought them as files, now you have to settle them with equanimity _samabhave_ _nikal_. That is all. Then it is all over; all Your work is done.

# [4.1] Filled stock of karma

## Become free by saying 'not mine'

**Questioner:** I know that this is is not worth doing and that it is wrong but I still make the mistake. Does that happen due to past _karma_ that I have brought with me?

**Dadashri** : That is all garbage that you have brought with you. It is the stock you filled in the account of _karma_ without asking anyone in the past life. It is the stock that makes sense to people who do not have Gnan ( _agnani_ ). You will have to get rid of that, will You not? What ever was the stock, that stock has to be discarded.

The science of the Self ( _atmavignan_ ) begins with the understanding that wrong stock has been filled in the past life and brought forward. There there is _pragnya_ (the liberating energy of the Self) that 'sees'.There is _pragnya_ in the seer. It will be more than enough if you do _pratikraman_ and say 'this is not mine'. By saying 'mine', it got stuck to you. So now You can let go of it by saying, 'not mine'. After Gnan it will remain nicely. It will not work without Gnan. All the demerit _karma_ ( _paap_ ) are destroyed when You attain Gnan. Then onwards One becomes light (without load). Otherwise poor people keep listening to _satsang_ but without any gain.

**Questioner** : Why do I not seem to get any resolution even though it has been five years since I took Gnan?

**Dadashri:** Now resolution has been attained for sure. What kind of resolution are you seeking?

**Questioner** : In regards to these mistakes.

**Dadashri** : It becomes clean within. The stock will still continue to come out. It was only garbage that was filled, so it will come out no? Otherwise the tank cannot become empty, can it? Before you did not even know that garbage was coming out, did you? You used to think good things were coming out, did you not? That is called _sansaar_ – the worldly life. And now that You know ( _jaanyoo_ ) that it is all garbage; it is the sign of becoming liberated.

It is like this. As the years go by, the _moha_ (illusory attachment) decreases; it does not increase. Then after certain years, it will be completely gone. If You go to look in the tank, there won't be anything in it. At that time there will not be any problems; at that time there will be a lot of bliss.

## This is siddhant, the ultimate principle

**Questioner:** I feel that on the outside I appear to be nice but my innate nature is just the same.

**Dadashri** : 'We' know that the stock is exactly like that. Everyday 'we' make You drink one bottle of Gnan. That nature will change completely. The family will come to look for you. Because this Gnan is very powerful. It is not haphazard but what can be done about the stock that was filled was garbage?

Then someone will tell me, 'Dada this man was fighting at home'. But even in fighting, he is emptying out his filled stock, is he not? He is not filling anything new, is he? And because he is starting to use the stock, it will finish up. We no longer have any new stock coming in. If there is no new stock coming in and the old filled one is being used up, so is it likely to remain?

Otherwise this is a _siddhant_ –incontrovertible principle that accomplishes the ultimate. If this principle is breaking down anywhere, then tell me. Our principle does not break down.

When you were filling the stock, did you ask me before you filled it?

**Questioner** : I did it without asking you.

**Dadashri** : Yes, everything was filled without asking me. When you went to the store, you took whatever you liked but you did not ask Dada, 'Dada shall I take this one or that one?' Had you asked me and then filled it, none of it would have stuck to you. That is because that would have been my Agna, no?

Now all the stickiness ( _raag-dwesh_ ) has peeled off but the filled stock is still coming out.

**Questioner** : In order to keep this car in control, I have to follow some of the laws that are in place. I have to make sure that I do not go over the speed limit. If I speed at 90-95 mph, then I may have an accident. In the same fashion, in our life, do I have to keep Chandubhai, his body under some control?

**Dadashri** : For that 'car' the controller is there no? If you become the controller then you have to make an effort to keep him in order. But even then he does not remain under control. Because it is _parsatta_ \- under some other control; the control is not in Your hands at all. People believe it to be under their own control and so they keep beating at it. They believe the control is in their hands and then they try to control him. If one does not empty the tank and control it, it will take longer to empty. This 'discharge' means a filled tank.

**Questioner** : I still did not understand it properly.

**Dadashri** : We no longer have the charging. There is no doer of _karma_ anymore. The causes are no more. Only the effect remains. Effect means a filled tank. But if we try to slow it, control it, then it will linger on longer. Instead let it come out as quickly as possible. And whatever is coming out, simply keep 'seeing' it. Always, what is the effect like? Just as we put batteries in a cell, then if we do not use the batteries too much, then they will last longer and we use it a lot, then it will come to an end quickly. The batteries will become separate and so will we. This mind-speech-body are three batteries. And they are charged with power. That power is now being used up. No new charging is taking place. So if the power gets used up faster, then things will be resolved earlier. Thereafter will prevail a constant state of _samadhi_ (a state of absolute freedom from any effect of mental, physical or externally induced pain) and Our work will continue to run on its own.

When the tank is filled, it depends upon how big or small it is. A person with a big tank will have a lot of stock and a person with a small tank will have lesser stock. There is a variety of stock; if a person has filled a large amount of sexual ( _vishaya_ ) stock, then he will have an increased discharge of sexuality. If someone has filled more stock of pride ( _maan_ ) , then more pride will discharge. If someone has filled more stock of _himsa_ (violence), then more _himsa_ will come out. Whatever the stock one has filled, that will be the stock that will come out. You simply have to 'see' all that.

Having become free from doership, if You now try 'to do' anything – it is not likely to happen. As it is, no one has been able to do anything. In fact in this universe, "it happens" on its own and he believes he is the doer. The three batteries (mind, speech and body) are charged with power. When new charging is stopped, the batteries will get completely discharged. When they are completely discharged, You will become liberated (final _moksha_ ). Currently You have become free from pain (first stage _moksha_ ). Now pain can not remain at all for sure. _Raag_ - _dwesh_ (attachment and abhorrence) no longer happen and a state of _vitaragata_ (freedom from attachment and abhorrence) remains. So You simply have to 'see' what Chandubhai is doing; that is all the 'work' You have to do.

In this life You have attained _kshayak_ _samkit_ (eternal right vision) Now as much as You are able to live in my Agna, that much _samadhi_ will prevail. Now You wish to remain in 'our' Agna but the filled stock within; will not let you. So You should make as many attempts as You can to 'do' so. What is the nature of the filled stock? It is to not let you remain in the Agna. So what is the stock that has been filled? The answer is that from this side, _parmanus_ (indivisible subatomic particles) of attraction ( _moorchha_ ) were filled, from the other side _parmanus_ of ego, from the other side _parmanus_ of greed were filled. All the _parmanus_ that have been filled, when their time is right; they will play the drums. 'You fools! Why are you playing the drums?' one may ask. They will respond, 'we are here inside you'. So You have to discharge them with equanimity.

## Are the _karma_ to be discharged or is the discharge taking place?

As the stock comes out, it is emptying out. Filled stock is called _dravyasangraha_. It can be good or it can be bad too; both kinds will be there. It comes out after one attains the Self ( _bhaav_ - _jagruti_ ) and not otherwise. People outside do not have awarness as the Self and so all the stock will keep piling up in _dravyasangraha_. If it is good, it is good; and if it is bad, it is bad.

**Questioner:** And after attaining the Self and the awareness, both , the good and the bad, continues to discharge.

**Dadashri** : It continues to discharge.

**Questioner** : So Dada you have now talked about awareness as the Self _bhaav_ - _jagruti_ , after which, the stock continues to discharge. So someone may have good _karma_ discharging so let it be good; it may be very 'fragrant', but until and unless it discharges completely...

**Dadashri:** Until then it cannot be called as ' _nikal'_ (settlement). But 'good-bad' is what we refer to it as here, but it is not so there ( in the langauage of the Lord, the Self).

**Questioner** : But Dada you talked about discharging _karma_ ( _nikal_ ) and that even if it is good, it will still have to be discharged. So even for the good; no insistence ( _abhinivesh_ ) towards it will remain within at all, will it?

**Dadashri** : That will not be there at all, will it?

**Questioner** : Because not matter how good it is, even then it has to be discharged.

**Dadashri:** It has to be discharged. That is why the word ' _nikal_ ' has been used. It has to be discharged with, settled. Good or bad is not applicable there at all. Therefore it all has to be "discharged"; the _nikal_ has to be 'done'.

**Questioner:** Now even when the _nikal_ has to be done, our Gnan is such that the _nikal_ does not have to be 'done' but that the _nikal_ is simply taking place, if the Self remains as knower-seer ( _gnata_ - _drashta_ ).

**Dadashri:** That word must come into one's understanding. The _nikal_ is taking place. By telling one 'to do _nikal_ ', it will come into his understanding and for sure he is doing the _nikal_. This is because through the discharge ego; the discharge (effect), settlement ( _nikal_ ) is happening. And so he is doing the settlement for sure. Then the statement ' _nikal_ is happening', is applicable to a stage that comes ahead, when the 'seer' becomes ready, then. So as long as one has in his conviction ( _pratiti_ ) that 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ', till then he will say 'I am doing the _nikal_ '. As the conviction grows into Gnan experience ( _anubhav_ ), then the Self can 'see' that _nikal_ is happening; that is the state that will prevail.

## Filled stock must come out

**Questioner:** Dada, if some incident has happened that is harmful to my goal, now if I evaluate this whole incident in my mind and understand thoroughly, then such incident should not happen again, no?

**Dadashri:** No. That will definitely happen. It must happen. If it does not, then it is wrong. The stock that will come out depends on how much was filled in the past life. If it was not filled then it will not happen. You have to keep doing _pratikraman_. Who is that 'doer' of, 'it should not happen again?' The 'doer' has become the 'non-doer' Lord. One says this due to lack of understanding.

**Questioner:** Dada, this happens for me. That is why I asked that why such thing happens again?

**Dadashri:** What can be done, if you have doen something wrong and bad in the past life? It will not happen in every task, it will happen only in certain tasks.

**Questioner:** How can the energy of taking that _bodha,_ knowledge and _taaran,_ quick final assessment, blossom, Dada?

**Dadashri:** The energy ( _shakti_ ) is verily there within. You have taken _bodha,_ knowledge of the Self, too. 'You' know that it is wrong too, but it will not stop, will it? If a large amount of stock is filled, it will not stop and if less of it was filled, then it will stop.

**Questioner:** When my Self becomes so much pure ( _shuddha_ ) then I will attain _moksha_ after one to two more lives, is that so?

**Dadashri:** The Self has become pure. Now you have to be free freom your shop. You were a businessman, so you used to grow your business. Thereafter you got tired and became unhappy. Then you say, 'what the heck, now I want to get rid of this shop.' So you started to close down the business. But how can you be rid of this completely? You can but only if you meet a Gnani Purush in this life. The Gnani Purush will show you the ways to be rid of this shop. You should remain in the rules which the Gnani Purush gives to You and settle all with equanimity.

## Profit is not seen because of heavy debt

**Questioner:** After attaining Dada's Gnan, why do all the streams of the light of Gnan not open up?

**Dadashri** : They have all opened up but the debits of your previously incurred debts of _karma_ , keep presenting themselves. Otherewise all the Gnan has opened up. Now these debts are being paid off, as long as these debts are being paid off, you are not able to get any spending money! At the moment you are still living frugally. All this is like that. And the debt is very large. All these people are paying off their debts. As the debt decreases, he will begin to feel light.

You have to understand this talk but otherwise after attaining this Gnan just once, You will attain salvation. One's heart is not in it. But if your heart is in Gnan, then the light within will become exact for sure.

Things are still entangled and muddled for you because of your debt. You have been given the state of _Paramatma_ – the absolute Soul. 'Our' debt is all finished. 'We' are enjoying the bliss of the _Paramatma_ state. Your debts are starting to come to an end, no?

## The stock of karma is cleansed through _pratikraman_

**Questioner** : I decide in the morning that I want to remain only in the five Agna, I don't want to hurt anybody, even then I end up hurting them, why it is like that?

**Dadashri:** It will happen because that stock of _karma_ that is filled within. Now you have decided anew that you want to do clean business, so now onwards it will get cleaned.

**Questioner:** Many times no matter how strong a decision I make to not say anything hurtful, even then I end up speaking.

**Dadashri:** One ends up speaking, even if he does not want to. The bullet will not refrain from being fired, that bullet is not in your hand. If you suppress it for two to four hours, it will fire nonetheless.

**Questioner** : I decide in my mind that I should not do such a thing, yet I end up saying hurtful things.

**Dadashri** : That does not work. The only solution is that you must do _pratikraman_. There is no other solution. You don't have to stop but You have to say to Chandubhai that, 'it is better if it is not like this.' However the stock—past life _karma_ —that was filled will not remain without coming out. If coal and tar were filled in the tank then coal and tar will come out and if it was filled with kerosene, then kerosene will come out. Whatever was filled in it, will come out. But this is Akram Vignan, so _karma_ are filled compactly, lots of _karma_ remain to clear, and then this Gnan has manifest, so what happens there? All those worries and everything stopped and only the discharge remains to be settled. As you begin to settle, the bliss will begin to increase. Worrying will stop completely; _upadhi,_ pain from external sources, will stop. Do you have any worries or _upadhi_?

**Questioner** : No.

**Dadashri:** So the load of _karma_ effects will decrease as the settlement of the files continues to happen.

The files will finish after fourteen years. This is because the tank is full but there is no new inflow of _karma_. Then this tank begins to empty and afterwards in a few years, everything will be resolved. If very sticky stock is filled, then it will take five to seven years more, but it will all empty for sure.

**Questioner** : Can it not clear ( _nikal_ ) before fourteen years?

**Dadashri** : It can! It depends on one's own _purushartha_. One may clear within three years. There are such people who can clear in one hour. Such _purushartha_ does exist too. But you have brought such a sticky stock, that such awareness towards your _purushartha_ will not arise at all.

## Now, only the water in the pipe line remains

It is like this. The stock has been filled in the tank. Now what kind of stock is it? Say there is a large lake seven hundred miles away from here and the water from that lake comes here to Bombay. We have a small pond here that we want to fill. The municipality tells them to let the water come from over there. So the water is flowing in from there and the pond here is nearly full but there is a little ways to go. So the municipality calls them and tells them to turn off the water. And those people turn it off. But even then the water keeps flowing in and the pond spils over and so they call them again and tell them 'shut if off! Shut it off'. Those people reply, 'Am I a fool! The water was turned off ages ago'. So it is the water in the 700 mile long pipe that is flowing in. You will have to understand this much, won't you? So you will have to have patience till all the stock comes out. New stock is not coming in and the old stock is discharging. You will have to be patient, no? Does yours not come out? Is it turbid or is it clean?

**Questioner:** It is turbid.

**Dadashri** : So the mind and the _chit_ within is Chandubhai's filled stock. You are _Shuddhatma_ and You just have to keep 'seeing' what kind of stock is in Chandubhai's control. You have to 'see' in which direction the mind is turning, and wherever the _chit_ may be wandering, there is no objection. It is all emptying out and after it becomes empty nothing will remain. Then if You look for the 'water', You will not find any. So You should not harbor any objection, just keep 'seeing'.

## Good or Bad – both are to be discharged

'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' – you should remain in that _upayoga_ (applied awareness); that is called _shuddha_ _upayoga_ – pure awareness. Then it does not matter what kind of stock is filled, no matter what kind of _karma_ was charged, the mind will continue to discharge, no? What do You lose in that? When You are ready to throw away the bad as well as the good stock, why then should there be any suffering in the matter? It is possible to maintain very good applied awareness with Me. My _chit_ is very good but even then it is to be thrown out and your _chit_ too has to be thrown out. So then they are both worth the same so why should we let Our applied awareness enter into that? 'You' just have to keep 'seeing' what Chandubhai is like; and without the filled stock; is anything likely to come out?

## Liberation even in Dada's subtle presence

**Questioner:** Dada why is it that in Your presence not a single inner tendency ( _vruti_ ) becomes restless at all and as soon as You leave, this file number one reverts back to what he was; everything starts up and it is a daily thing!

**Dadashri:** If You are able to maintain 'Our' subtle presence, then that would not happen.

**Questioner** : How do I maintain that subtle presence?

**Dadashri** : When you close your eyes, You can 'see'. Wherever You 'see' You 'see' Dada. When You 'see' Dada, then there is no danger for You. Here when You remain in the Agna, the responsibility is of the one who has given the Agna.

**Questioner:** What about the _mahatma_ who is following the Agna ends up being benevolent and helpful to others?

**Dadashri:** Whether one ends up doing _paropkar_ —benevolence or _par-apkaar_ —malevolence to others, both are settled ( _nikal_ ). That which is to be settled ( _nikali_ ) You don't need to remember at all, do you? Benevolence or malevolence done, both are discharge—effect in this life of causes laid in past life. If one does not have Gnan, then benevolence earns merit _karma_ , _punyai_. But after receiving Gnan, benevolence to anyone or malevolence to anyone, both represent opposite ends in the relative realm and they have no relationship to Agna. Nothing impedes or touches the process of following the Agna. There is not anything in entire mass of scriptures that can come near Agna. Yes, but, the giver of the Agna should be exact.

That's it, now You have to get Your work done. If your mind is thick (more layers) then you will have to sit longer in _satsang_ , you will have to wait little longer. But bring _ukel,_ ultimate solution! This is the stock of Kaliyug, and this means you have filled lots of stock of _karma_. Amidst all this, it is tremendous merit _karma_ that You attained this Gnan, it is indeed very tremendous merit _karma_ !

## The filled stock will even show you faults of Dada

**Questioner:** I have tremendous _bhaav_ (reverence filled intent) for Dada but even then my _bhaav_ towards you sometimes become negative and then I cry a lot.

**Dadashri** : There is no problem with that. This Science is such that You have to keep 'seeing' what is going on. So this Vignan itself will liberate You. This Vignan itself is so beautiful that it will get Your work done for all the way. After giving You this Gnan, I have not seen any _himsak_ (hurtful, violent) _bhaav_ in You at all.

**Questioner** : But even then please grant some grace so that I can become free from that.

**Dadashri** : It is like this, I know everything that is happening to you. I even know that your _bhaav_ spoils towards me but even then I know that You will become free. Because You are aware that, 'this is a wrong thing that has happened'. What is the reason behind those _bhaav_ arising towards me? It is all a discharge ( _nirjara_ ) of past life. You can now know that the discharge is wrong and that it should not be so.

**Questioner** : Yes, I am able to know it instantly.

**Dadashri** : So I know You, I know too well that You are having such _bhaav_ towards me. Now what is the reason for that? 'You' are not seeing anything wrong in me but it is the ego from past life. All this stock that is coming out is the garbage from the past life and our Gnan is showing You that it is wrong and that it should not be so. Even though you are having these negative _bhaav_ , there is no _himsa_ (violent intent) in it, this I am telling You. This Vignan (spontaneously working science) that I have given You, that Gnan itself is working to give results ( _kriyakari_ ). This Gnan itself is doing all the work on its own. Otherwise one cannot become free in a million lifetimes. Here You have only one more life time left; such is this _ekavatari gnan_ – Gnan that grants liberation in one more lifetime.

## When there is no interference; the filled stock will fall away

This Vignan, is such that filled inner stock will automatically fall away; You will not have to bring it out. This is because it is dying, discharging. In the worldly person who does not have Gnan, all the worldly stock is alive. In the one who has received Gnan, the stock is dying; it appears to be living but like a lizard's tail, even when it is cut off, it moves on its own, but it does not move forever, does it? For how long will it move? There is no life in it; there are other elements in it and those elements are beginning to exhaust and so it will come to an end. So here in Akram Vignan You don't have to let go of anything; there is nothing that needs to be undone; nothing to let go; it will fall away and depart on its own.

**Questioner** : This will 'fall away'( _kharii padey_ ) is what you've said – I really like those words. I am thinking how natural and spontaneous it is when we say it will 'fall away'!

**Dadashri:** And You have to keep 'seeing it' till it 'falls away'.

**Questioner** : I do not have to make any effort.

**Dadashri** : No. There is no interference and the result of interference ( _dakhodakhal_ ) at all.

**Questioner** : So it will fall away when the right time comes for it to do so?

**Dadashri** : It will fall away on its own. Do not mind it when people say this or they say that; let them say whatever they want to. But if You interfere ( _dakho_ ) with it, then it will become entangled ( _dakhal_ ).

**Questioner** : But Dada You have placed that medicine in the main root of the tree and so the leaves and the branches are all slowly falling down. Now slowly and gradually all our 'cupboards' will become empty.

**Dadashri** : Yes. So the cupboards are going to become empty for sure! Because now the desire to go to _moksha_ has arisen for You, your _bhaav_ , intent, towards the worldly life has broken on its own. You want to go to Mamanipoda (Dadashri's residence in Baroda) from here so when we walk in that direction, then you will not be going in the direction of the tower; that has been decided. So you have turned in the direction of _moksha_ and the other (worldly life), has been renounced; so _bhaavtyaga_ , a natural state of renunciation in intent prevails. And so it should fall away naturally on its own. Did you understand the words 'fall away'?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri** : When there is no attraction ( _moorchha_ ), the filled stock will fall away. When the time comes for it, it will come to an end.

**Questioner** : Dada the question arises as to why awarenss does not stay ( _ajagruti_ )?

**Dadashri** : But it will happen when that other force (of discharging _karma_ ) is greater.

**Questioner** : You gave us the example that our finger will remain steady under the flow of water coming out of a .5" wide pipe but it will not remain steady in the force of water coming out from a pipe one and .5" wide.

**Dadashri** : If someone has a 5" wide pipe, how will it remain? But that will not be the case all day long. But during that time, by remaining in _satsang_ , it will all empty out. Because by remaining with 'us', by seeing 'us'; You will attain direct energies from 'us' and so Your awareness ( _jagruti_ ) will increase tremendously.

**Questioner** : I are able to 'see' after it is all over but when it is all happening, I are not able to maintain that much awareness whereby I can 'see' the separation at that very moment.

**Dadashri** : At that time You were 'seeing' the separation but because of the force of that _karma_ , the awareness moved away.

## Thoughts too are filled stock!

When bad thoughts arise in the mind, that too is a _sainyog_ , circumstance and when a good thought arises, that too is a _sainyog_. 'Good' or 'bad'- these are adjectives given by people. There is nothing of the sort as far as the Lord is concerned. They are _gneya_ , that which is to be known and You are _gnata_ , the knower. You have to keep 'seeing' that a bad thought has arisen. When good thoughts about this gentleman here arise, that too is a _gneya_. One will get thoughts about getting married even at age sixty. That too is discharge that has to be settled ' _nikal'_ . That which was filled ( _puran_ – to take in; to charge) is coming out ( _galan_ – to put out; to discharge). When it is discharging coming out, 'You' have to settle it.

**Questioner** : Dada when thoughts about getting married come at age sixty, should I get married or should I simply remain as _gnata_ - _drashta_ , as knower-seer?

**Dadashri** : Now filled stock ( _bharelo maal_ ) means You have to 'see' what kind of stock was filled. At sixty it will say things that have no substance within. So 'You' should not do _raag_ - _dwesh_ (attachment-abhorrence) towards the filled stock and an _agnani_ , one who does not have Gnan, will do _raag_ - _dwesh_ when the filled stock is coming out and that is why new stock is filled all over again. So the filled stock that was charged is now expressing ( _ashrav_ ) and is getting ready to empty, and when it is emptied completely it called _nirjara_ (discharged). During that effect (when the stock is discharging) if one does _raag_ - _dwesh_ new _karma_ is bound ( _bandha_ ).

**Questioner** : What should I do when something comes in memory?

**Dadashri** : When it comes in memory, You have to keep 'seeing', 'oh ho ho – there is still such stock inside?' If You keep seeing it this way everything will be resolved. Now, You-the Self, no longer become one ( _tanmayakar_ ) with it. The filled stock should be 'seen' and then let go. Today I have no need for it. When the time comes, it will go away.

**Questioner** : But what should I do with it when it is coming out?

**Dadashri** : 'See' what was filled.

**Questioner** : But when such things are coming out, I do not like it!

**Dadashri** : Why don't You like it? On the contrary, it is likable. It is decreasing no? If it does not come out, then it will remain within. As much stock there is within, that much will continue to come out.

'See' whatever state becomes of the _pudgal_ – the non-Self complex of mind, speech and body undergoing _puran_ (intake) and _galan_ (output). Whether there is suffocation or something else, keep 'seeing' it! Then no matter what it is like; it is all a discharge. Rubbish will come and go; You -the Self have to keep 'seeing'. You should 'know' that the rubbish is dissipating. Which warehouse is it coming out of? Warehouse number one, warehouse number two..?

## Become suspicion-free but not arrogant

**Questioner:** Kindness ( _daya_ ) and _ahimsa_ (non-violence) keep coming to the mind; how do they come?

**Dadashri** : It is all filled stock. Just like when someone goes to the market and fills his bag, a stock of 'violence' may have been filled, if stock of _dwesh_ has been filled, _dwesh_ will come to him. If the stock is of _ahimsa_ is filled, _ahimsa_ will come. If it is of kindness, kindness will come. Whichever stock has been filled the most; that stock will come out the most.

**Questioner** : Dada many kind of _jiva_ - _himsa_ (violence to living things) happens in my business, so what kind of awareness do I need to keep? What kind of _bhaav_ should be there?

**Dadashri** : If a person does not have Gnan, he does have to bear the liability for the _dosh_ mistake. How can the one who has Gnan be liable?

**Questioner** : But Dada, he (file number one) still becomes instrumental ( _nimit_ ) in the violence _himsa_ , does he not?

**Dadashri** : He will get the fruits of being instrumental. What does it mean to bind a new mistake? It means to plant new seeds of _karma_. But the One with Gnan does not sow new seeds and so he is not liabile, is he?

**Questioner** : Therefore Dada should he understand that it is the result of unfolding _karma_ of past life( _udayakarma_ ); should he accept this and stop there?

**Dadashri** : It is verily the unfolding _karma_. But You cannot accept that and stop there. If you hurt someone a lot, then tell Chandubhai, 'Dear fellow, you hurt him, so do _pratikraman_ '.

**Questioner** : Yes and this is unfolding of _karma_ ( _udaya_ ).

**Dadashri** : It is exactly that. But sometimes if you speak in a manner that hurts someone, then you have to tell Chandubhai, because it does have an effect ( _asar_ ) even in result (discharging _karma_ ). This is because You are _purusharthi_ (following the five Agna). So You have to tell him, 'hey, do _pratikraman_. Why do you hurt others?' Besides this, generally there is nothing much else to be done. You just have to continue to do the general _nikal_ settlement for sure. In this way in business and daily life, you have to make Chandubhai do _pratikraman_.

**Questioner** : Dada I can do _pratikraman_ for a living person in front of us but what about the _himsa_ that takes place in my business place which is similar to the _himsa_ that takes place in the cotton business and in the bean farms? In every occupation, there is a certain level of _jiva_ _himsa_ taking place.

**Dadashri** : Violence _himsa_ exists in all business and occupations. That will not touch You. It will touch you, if a suspicion ( _shanka_ ) arises.

**Questioner** : Doubt about who, for my own self?

**Dadashri** : One will have doubts himself if he is too wise; he will have doubts of, 'who is this new entity that is having doubts about what Dada is saying? (The doubt comes to the one who becomes'wise' and listens to intellect rather than listening to Dada).

**Questioner** : I have absolutely no doubt ( _nishanka_ ) in what Dada is saying.

**Dadashri** : In that, it is in matter of the Self, that You must remain doubt-free ( _nishanka_ ).

**Questioner** : Yes, but this talk is related to worldly life interaction ( _vyavahar_ ), no?

**Dadashri** : Even in this matter, if I have told you that there is no problem in this. This is a result. But then he starts to have doubts as to on what basis it must be so.

**Questioner** : Yes. So by sitting with You everything can be clarified that all that is due to the unfolding of _karma_. I am not to have any doubts in that matter. There should be no doubts.

**Dadashri** : There should be no doubt either. Along with that there should not be any _uddhata,_ arrogance filled indifference. It is the nature of man that if he is not solid in the middle, then he may slip on the either side; he can become arrogant and careless. Because it is a result (effect of past _karma_ ), there should be no arrogance filled carelessness that 'what do I have to do with it?' ( _marey shoo_ ). It should not be that way. 'We' are telling you to get rid of your doubts but that does not mean that you have to become careless. In the absence of doubts one can become careless. In order to keep a balance between the two states, I have to speak a lot in this manner. But it will happen; both the sides will settle down, and balance will come.

# [4.2] Charge-discharge

## After attaining Gnan...

**Questioner** : After attaing Gnan, what should I do in life and what should I not do? How should I live my life?

**Dadashri** : 'You' have to 'see' how it is being lived.

**Questioner** : So how should the decision of what is good or bad be taken? How to decide this?

**Dadashri** : What do You want with 'good or bad' now? You have to see what 'Chandubhai' is doing.

**Questioner** : Is there no problem if Chandubhai does anything?

**Dadashri** : Whatever Chandubhai is doing; it is in the form of a discharge. No changes can be made in that. Always, no changes can be made in discharge.

**Questioner** : But if he does wrong, he will have difficulty in his next life, no?

**Dadashri** : No he will not. You simply have to tell Chandubhai, 'do _pratikraman_ '. Now You are no longer the 'doer' at all. Good or bad, You , the Self have nothing to do with it. You have to settle with equanimity _nikal_ ; You have to let it all discharge. This 'shop' has to be vacated and dispensed with. So therefore whether the merchandise is good or bad; all of it has to be dispersed from the shop. This is all a result now!

## The understanding of charge and discharge bhaav

After attaining this Gnan, you have stopped charging _karma_ and only the discharge remains. So for You now it is all _vyavasthit_ scientific circumstantial evidences for sure. Now You have to make the effort ( _purushartha_ ) towards the Self – the Soul. All this will continue to happen on its own as _vyavasthit_. For You no kind of doership remains. Can You understand this about the discharge?

**Questioner** : How can we tell the difference within between this is a charge _bhaav_ intent and this is a discharge _bhaav_ intent?

**Dadashri** : When you have the faith that 'I am Chandubhai', then you will have the charge _bhaav_. But when You are the _Shuddhatma_ , that charging _bhaav_ comes to an end and bondage of new _karma_ stops.

**Questioner** : What should I do when from the inside I am being cautioned that 'this that is happening is wrong' and yet the wrong continues to take place?

**Dadashri** : That which happens is done by Chandubhai, what do You, the Self, have to do with that? You are not the doer of that and it is in the form of discharge; it is not a charge. All that Chandubhai is doing; is all a discharge. The charging would only take place if you are really Chandubhai. Right now if someone were to ask you with a true heart what is your real identity, what would you say?

**Questioner** : _Shuddhatma_.

**Dadashri** : So then You no longer have any charging. This 'Chandubhai' is a identification for only worldly life interactions; he is not the doer – he is the doer from the worldly vision. 'I am truly Chandubhai and I am the doer' – with this belief _karma_ continue to bind. Before you used to say 'I am really Chandubhai', no? Because you did not have the other knowledge (of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ). Now that is gone!

Once charging has taken place, there is no choice but for it to discharge. After that discharge, new charging may or may not take place – that is not necessary. Discharge does not have expectation of charging. Charging does have expectation of discharge, without fail. After 'we' give the Gnan, only discharge alone remains. But if Gnan is not given, then from the discharge, again the charge will arise. Causes and effect, effect and causes, causes and effect; effect is a discharge and charge is cause.

## Discharge has to be seen with Gnan

This wind is blowing and you are sitting here – that is discharge _karma_ being released and if you go over there and it becomes unbearably hot, even then the discharge _karma_ is being released. To become irritated and stressed is also a discharge. It is also discharge when you get irritated with someone. You have to resolve everything without _raag_ or _dwesh_. Up to what point can _raag_ - _dwesh_ exist? As long as the ego is there, _raag_ - _dwesh_ will remain. What is _raag_ - _dwesh_ when You become the Self? All _raag_ - _dwesh_ is of the ego.

Fame or infamy - You no longer have any desires of any kind. Now You are only concerned with becoming free. Nevertheless if you get disgraced, then it is a discharge and it is also a discharge if you become famous. So now a little of this discharge is left. Whenever you get a little free time then keep 'straining' ('seeing') everything with this Gnan. When he tells lies, that too is a discharge and when he tells the truth; that is also discharge. Why have you been given so much flexibility in eating? It is because if you give away your food to someone, it is a discharge and if you eat it yourself, it is also a discharge. But if you take away someone else's, then resolve the issue with him. Explain everything to him, plead with him, even do _pratikraman_ but do resolve it. If he does not understand or accept your direct _pratikraman_ , then do _pratikraman_ internally. Discharge does not mean that there should be only certain good _karma_ , whatever they are; they will be what they are. You cannot change them to anything else, can You?

## Become free through _pratikraman_

One man made another man happy. One man insulted another man. So one may ask where justice lies in that through our Gnan vision. The Gnan says this man has become free and so has the other. This man has become free from his charged _bhaav_. The other man became free from what his charged _bhav._ This is what he had charged and he became free from it. They both become free, did they not? If the multiplier was seven; then it cannot be divided by nine. It will only apply; if it is divided by seven.

**Questioner** : So Dada with Gnan, the Self remains unanointed ( _nirleyp_ ) right? He remains unanointed with Gnan!

**Dadashri** : Yes He is _nirleyp_ for sure. He is _nirleyp-_ unanointed, _asang,_ absolutely free from any company; but this too is there along with all that. The accounts are being paid off. But when one has charged an insult, it can only be discharged with an insult ( _upmaan_ ), no? Charging of _maan_ (pride) will discharge with _maan_. In order to get rid of them both, they will have to be settled ( _nikal_ ), right?

**Questioner** : But Dada, the one in whose discharge insult is happening, as insulting someone, what kind of _bhaav_ intent should he have in his mind?

**Dadashri** : When he insults, he does _pratikraman_ for it. 'He' (the Self) tells Chandubhai, 'Why did you do _atikraman_ ; do _pratikraman_ now!' And when he does something good, _pratikraman_ is not needed for it.

## That is precisely why we became worry free

**Questioner:** Is there a line of demarcation between whether it is a charge or a discharge?

**Dadashri** : Yes of course! The charging is done by the ego. The charging cannot take place without the ego.

**Questioner** : Sometimes I lose that awarness ( _khyal, laksha_ ).

**Dadashri** : No, but now there is no charging for You; whether there is awareness ( _khyal_ ) or no awareness.

**Questioner** : Even if I do not maintain awareness ( _jagruti_ ), it does not charge, does it?

**Dadashri** : It will not charge. But the same _karma_ will go with you; it will come again. Those _karma_ that have not been discharged will remain in stock. But when can _karma_ charge? When you decide that 'I am Chandubhai', then _karma_ will charge again. At it is decided that 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' and from the wordly interacting view he is Chandubhai and so it will not charge.

**Questioner** : I say it through words but I not able to grasp it completely.

**Dadashri** : Whether it is grasped it or not; 'we—the Gnani _Purush_ ' are not concerned with that. 'We—Dada ' only have to see what kind of a contract was made. The fruit of that contract will come without fail. Once You made the contract, then whether you conduct yourself properly or improperly, what concern is it of 'ours'?

**Questioner** : In that case everyone will become worry-free!

**Dadashri** : They have become that for sure! Does anyone have any worries?

## Despite activity there is complete inactivity

Discharge means all the work that is happpening through the five senses. The five senses themselves are in the form of discharge and whatever work is being done through them; it is all discharge. That is why we have said ' _vyavasthit_ '.

So what is seen through the five senses, it is doing all the work all day long, despite that nothing is being charged for 'Us-The Self'. Inactivity ( _nivruti_ ) prevails in activity ( _pravruti_ ) for _mahatmas_ , and activity is the state in the inactivity for the worldly ( _agnani_ ) people. When they go home and are sitting leisurely and fall asleep, if the mind becomes just a little restless, their activitiy ( _pravruti_ ) begins. And so there is activity even in inactivity and for _mahatmas_ inactivity prevails despite activity. Which is better? That is why there is no charging; only the discharge remains. Discharge means only the account that has set in place has to be suffered and no more.

**Questioner** : Is it true that if one charges for only good things then his discharge will be good only?

**Dadashri** : No, it is not like that. Discharge will be good and also not good; both will come. There is no such rule. If the bad was charged in the past life, the bad will happen now. For that you have to repent and wash it off.

**Questioner** : Past life means, in this life or is it also be from several past lives?

**Dadashri** : If it is from only one past life and the discharge of mistakes of that life sometimes may be good and sometimes may be bad. If we made a blunder, the results may be bad. But now onwards, new mistakes (charge) will not be made; but the old mistakes are bound to come, right? Therefore the discharge may be good or bad. Just settle ( _nikal_ ) it.

## Oh karma! Come, you are welcome!

**Questioner:** After taking Dada's Gnan, I do not like certain discharge that happen in the worldly life, so how can I accept it?

**Dadashri** : So if you like them, they are yours and if you don't like them, they are someone else's? Whether you like them or dislike them; both have to be settled with equanimity. And for those that you do not like; go on the terrace and shout out, 'all of you come together!' Otherwise you don't have to worry at all about charging.

**Questioner** : You had said that I should not worry about discharge.

**Dadashri** : What do people say about discharge? They say, 'Why do all these things happen to me? I still have anger, I have this...' Mooah ( _the dying one_ )! This is a discharge that is talking place; it is good that it is happening. If the discharge were not to happen, it would become a problem. When 'we' are saying that it is discharging, you are saying you are fed up with it. Really you should have the approach that 'it would be good if the discharge were to happen as early as possible' – that is what 'we' mean when 'we' are saying so. So when the discharge is taking place, you should be happy that, 'oh ho ho! It is very good that it came out quickly. If the discharge is not taking place, then on the contrary you should take the trouble to do something about it. It is not happening so you should make it come. I was telling you to 'do' the contrary. Call them and tell them, 'come, welcome', you should take care of it.

## The fact is very subtle

**Questioner** : But 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' does not remain all twenty-four hours!

**Dadashri** : No, it does not go away for even a minute in the twenty-four hours. Once it has been decided, then even if you were to forget your name, what of it? Even then you will not take on another name. Twenty-four hours, You verily _are_ _Shuddhatma._

**Questioner** : This is a very subtle talk of Yours. It is not something I can grasp of in a short time. This is something worth understanding.

**Dadashri** : You will have to understand it! That is why you continue to sit here. If you have the desire to understand, then I am ready. The talk is very subtle; it is straightforward and easy.

Who is the one that does the charging? Before Gnan you had the belief of 'I am Chandubhai'. If someone told you 'no you are not Chandubhai, you are _Shuddhatma_ ', you would say, 'no, I am Chandubhai, for sure'. That was the 'charger' (the ego)! Now 'he' is gone and the discharge _karma_ are automatically happening. Even the 'discharger' (ego) is gone. That doer of that discharge is indeed the worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) of Chandubhai.

The discharge is happening naturally. To heat up water is considered as charging. But to cool the water, someone may ask, 'Sir, what is the solution?' Then we can tell him, 'nothing. You just go to sleep. Through it's _swabhav_ , its intrinsic nature, the water will become cool. That is what discharge is .

## Acquisitiveness-nonacquisitiveness both are discharge

You have to understand the facts. Our- _mahatmas'_ worldly life interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) is short now. Now the other ( _agnani_ ) keeps interaction with the whole world, because he has not drawn a limit, so what can be done? That is why the Jain scriptures encourage that even if you are not enlightened, at least have this much limits in your interaction, and that you do not want to cross that boundary. And so your account will be bound from within that limit, otherwise one's _vyavahar_ proliferates with the entire world. For us, a limit has arrived. A limit has come for the discharge; there will be only this much.

**Questioner** : Only those that are pending from the past.

**Dadashri** : Yes! Those _parmanus_ (indivisible sub-atomic particles) have to be settled ( _nikal_ ).

**Questioner** : So should one shrink or place boundaries on acquisitiveness ( _parigraha_ )?

**Dadashri** : Everything is a discharge. To increase acquisitiveness is a discharge and to limit acquisitiveness is also a discharge. And to remain non-acquisitive _aparagrahi_ is also a discharge. This is because it was the _bhaav_ intent made in past life to become _aparagrahi_ (non-acquisitive) that has come in effect in this life. But that too is a discharge; that too will have to be let go. That also will not come with You to _moksha_. It will help at whatever 'station' (stage) it is meant to help. It will not help You now in Akram. At this station You have to bring about its settlement-resolution ( _ukel_ ). They all need to be solved.

Where is the need to look for any fault in discharge?

So everything is a discharge (an effect) in this world. Now, to find faults in that which is discharging is meaningless and will not help you in anyway. This worldly life is perpetuated by looking at faults in the discharge of others. What you ( _mahatmas_ ) consider a result, an effect, a discharge is considered as a cause by the people who are not Self realized ( _agnani_ ), and that is precisely why they continue to get more entangled. They will say to you, 'you did this' and You ( _mahatma_ ) will say that, 'No, this is the result, this is discharge. I am not the doer.' That is why You are fearless. He ( _agnani_ ) feels your discharge as cause and will say, 'Why are you behaving this way?' Hey _mooah_ (mortal one), We do not have any fear and why are you afraid? And if it all, if anyone has to fear anything, let it be Dada, because we are all his followers. But 'I' would know that this is the stock has been filled in the past life, is now discharging. From where is he going to get any new stock?

## After Gnan, even the ego is ego-less!

**Questioner:** Based on our Gnan, now everything is a discharge, but will one not misuse it and say, 'this is my discharge'?

**Dadashri** : It has not been left in a way that one can misuse it. There is no room for doubt here.

**Questioner** : I do not doubt it. What I am saying is that is it not a kind of an ego to say that 'this all is my discharge'?

**Dadashri** : No, it is not like that. That is egoless in that way! That ego too is egoless.

**Questioner** : Your state of Gnan is correct but what is the _mahatma_ 's state in that?

**Dadashri** : It is a very good state; a "high class state". I do check into it; I check minutely, but really it is a very good state. But some will be weak too, no? I have to do the checking without fail.

Discharge means discharge, so where is the problem? The ego one does or has, even that is not ego; it too is a discharge.

**Questioner** : If we look at it that way, if we look at it as it is, then everywhere in the world, it is a discharge, no?

**Dadashri** : No, that is not discharge! It is charge plus discharge.

**Questioner:** But here if one does ego, is charging not happening?

**Dadashri** : No. What are you calling as ego? After this Gnan, the ego is no more. The ego that used to happen is finished. Here it is a "clear discharge!"

Many people have in their mind that 'is ego happening to me?' I tell them, 'no, it cannot happen. How can ego happen in that? How are You going to do ego without asking Me? In order for You to 'do' the ego, You will have to come to Me; the key is with Me.'

**Questioner** : But Dada, what if that key has not given properly to You?

**Dadashri** : No, any method by which it was done will do. Even if he gave me the wrong key, I have kept it securely. So I am telling you not to be afraid, You simply remain in My Agna and nothing else. I don't have any problems. Remain in My Agna, and then if the ego arises, there is no problem.

**Questioner** : But You have also told me that if I cannot remain in the Agna, I have to make a firm decision that I want to remain in them.

**Dadashri** : You only have to make the decision that You want to remain in them. I am not telling You to remain in them. You only have to decide that You want to remain in them. This is a principle ( _siddhant_ ); no changes can be made in a _siddhant_.

**Questioner** : There is no problem in the principle; there is problem in its application.

**Dadashri** : No, it does not matter how it was applied, even if the application was wrong, it will do. Because this is not a 'goldsmith's scale' (where everything has to be very precise; no room for errors); this is a 'scale of compassion' ( _karoonyata_ ). The goldsmith scale will say 'Hey! It is less, go away!' Hey! If it is a little less, what harm is there?

**Questioner** : If I am not aware ( _jagrut_ ) and I end up having some other intents ( _bhaav_ ), then does it not get charged?

**Dadashri** : It never happens that You are not aware. You are always in awareness ( _jagruti_ ).

**Questioner** : But there are circumstances where there is a lot of pressure.

**Dadashri** : Even during pressure, the awareness is there. He knows the pressure of the circumstance; therefore He-the Self is aware.

**Questioner** : I understand about the Self properly. But this _pratishthit_ _atma_ , the relative self does not charge anything new; that is what I am trying to understand.

**Dadashri** : It does not have the right to charge. The _pratishthit_ _atma_ does not have the right to charge. If You remain in our Agna, then nothing will charge. The keys are with 'Us'; the keys for the charging part. So how can You do the charging?

## Following the Agna is charge

**Questioner:** Where I am not following the Agna properly, is there not some charging there?

**Dadashri** : No, no charging is happening. The Agna that have been given is what makes the charge happen. Now You are no longer the doer. The Agna have been given to You and you are following my Agna; that is being charged. The Agna are for protection; they are to give You protection. Because protection was done through the Agna, that is why there will be one or two more lives.

**Questioner** : So Dada, is there doer-ship in following Your Agna?

**Dadashri** : Yes, there is doer-ship in them. Because you are following my Agna, _karma_ for one or two more lives are bound. There is doership in them; there is _bhaav_ in them. So in one or two more lives, safe-side will happen. The _bhaav_ that You want to follow the Agna – it is an exact _bhaav_. That is not discharge. That is why it is for the coming life. It is for one or two more lives.To take care-to serve Dada, to massage his feet etc., is really a discharge, because the fruit of it will be received in this very life. Whatever one does in this life as discharge, he will realize the fruits of it in this life and the fruit of charge will be realized in the next life. When You follow the five Agna, You will realize the fruit of it in the next life and the fruit of your _seva_ (service to Dada) you will get in this life. If someone were to swear at another person, he will get the result in the next life but if you were to swear at someone, you will get the result in this life.

**Questioner** : Why is that Dada?

**Dadashri** : For You it is a discharge and for him it is a charge. With this seva you are 'binding' _punyai_ , but it is discharge _punyai_. This is a discharge but you will get the benefit of it in this life. Discharge means to suffer ( _bhogavavoo_ ) and charge means to sow seeds. If you sow the seeds, it means that you have that much lesser seeds in your home. If you plant wheat, you will have that many less wheat to plant, no? But what about when it is harvested? That is called discharge – when the fruit comes. And this charge means, you bind _karma_ for the next life and then you will have to suffer that _karma_ (effects). Those fruits will be both bitter and sweet.

**Questioner** : Dada you told us that after Gnan I do not need to do any more _bhaavna_ intent and that no new causes are going to be created, so where does _purushartha_ fit in this?

**Dadashri** : _Purushartha_ means to remain the Self. Having become the _Purush_ (Self), we now have to do _purshartha_. So to remain as knower-seer ( _gnata_ - _drashta_ ), that is the _purushartha_. That _purushartha_ is really called your ' _swabhav_ ' – a things own instrinsic nature. The Self's very nature is _gnata_ - _drashta_. Nothing remains to be done. The _swabhav_ (knowing-seeing) is there but we have to use words for the world; _purushartha_! But otherwise the Self's nature is to know and see.

**Questioner** : So the _bhaav_ that arises after Gnan is discharge _bhaav_ , not charge _bhaav_ ; is that what it means?

**Dadashri** : All those are discharge _bhaav_ intents. What is _bhaav_ _karma_ (charge _karma_ )? The answer is 'anger-pride-deceit-greed, _raag_ - _dwesh_ ' – all that within is _bhaav_ _karma_. The anger-pride-deceit-greed takes place within, but You remain separate from them and so they are not considered _bhaav_ _karma_. The body discharges _karma_ and when anger arises, you say 'No. This should not be so!' and so it is gone. Your _bhaav_ - _karma_ is gone now. If the _bhaav_ - _karma_ were there then even today _artadhyan_ - _raudradhyan_ , would be applicable to you and you would never get anywhere. When one's _artadhyan_ - _raudradhyan_ ends; that person is called a free man ( _mukta purush_ ) by the Jain ascetics. But at the moment if you all were to go to these ascetics and tell them 'my _artadhyan_ - _raudradhyan_ have gone', then those ascetics will think to themselves, 'he is a little crazy'; that is what they would say. Such is the belief that prevails there! Now tell me!

**Questioner** : They will say, 'it is not possible in this era. What are you talking about?'

**Dadashri** : They will say all kinds of things. They will say 'otherwise we are so capable and yet this has not happened to us so how can it happen to them?' Who is going to accept this fact?

**Questioner** : Right now all the _bhaav_ that comes to me, is that all an effect, is that not charging?

**Dadashri** : No. The new charging is the part where You are following my Agna. So it will take one or two more lives for that. So there is no _dharmadhyan_ equivalent to the one of following the Agna. Therefore you will bind very great _punyai_ , merit _karma_. That _punyai_ is such that wherever you are born, you will not have to worry about building your home or buying a car. The house, the cars, everything else will all be ready for you. They will take you to Simandhar Swami every day and bring you back. Everything will be ready for you. And if the _punyai_ is not proper then you have to dig for your own home and go out and buy your own car. Everything will be ready for those with _punyai_.

## Discharge of discharge

**Questioner:** All these energies that we ask for, we ask for energies in the Nine Kalams; how will we experience all that?

**Dadashri** : You have to keep saying it over and over. What other experience do you have to have? When you keep asking for it over and over, those energies will manifest within and begin within. It is not something that is to be done in the worldly life interaction because 'to do' is a discharge and this is charge.

**Questioner** : Is asking for energies ( _shakti_ ) a charge?

**Dadashri** : Yes, that _shakti_ , energy, is a charge. Meaning when we ask for _shakti_ ; it is a charge - it is charge of discharge. So we also do charge of discharge and so the discharge will start after sometime.

**Questioner** : What is charge of discharge? I did not understand.

**Dadashri** : All this is discharge, in that if we eat, then we will pacify the hunger, no?

**Questioner** : But is feeling hungry a discharge or is eating a discharge?

**Dadashri** : To be hungry is discharge, then to eat is discharge, but it is also a charge of discharge. Then when you go to the bathroom, it is discharge; it is discharge of discharge. So the control ( _satta_ ) is not in your hands. But when you receite these Nine Kalams, after some time those energies will manifest. You have to receite these Nine Kalams everyday.

**Questioner** : But how am I going to get its experience ( _anubhuti_ )?

**Dadashri** : That very experience is happening later.

## Misuse of discharge

**Questioner:** What should not be believed as discharge?

**Dadashri** : Now what is this wrong question you are asking? All these things that you are doing – that is why your falults are not subsiding; that is the very reason. You should wash it off with repentance. You have never done any repentance at all in your life. I said 'discharge only' and so you took it the wrong way. By calling it summarily as discharge and then showing this lack of care, ruins it.

'It is discharge for me and for them it is charge' – you cannot talk this way. You have to simply know that 'this is discharge and that it does not hinder You the Self', but you cannot say this to anyone.

A young man in college had caused a big problem for another young man, to the extent that it ruined his career. So that he could secure his own career, he did things to ruin the other man's career. So I talked at lenght to that young man, 'what kind of a person are you? You have hurt someone else's career...' and so he started to feel remorse about his actions. He had an older brother, who then told him that his action was all a discharge and that it will not cause any problems. And so whatever remorse he was feeling, ended there. You, the _Shuddhatma_ is not to feel remorse, but if Chandubhai (file number one) does not feel remorse, how is it going to cleanse the inside? The 'cloth' will have to be washed, will it not? When his brother told him it was discharge, his feelings of remorse went away. Is this how discharge is to be misued?

## In Akram the discharge happens without charging

**Questioner:** So anger-pride-deceit- _charitramoha_ (charge illusion) and _darshanmoha_ (discharge illusion) exist in the _kramik_ path, it the same in the Akram path, is it not?

**Dadashri** : Everything for sure. Yes, it is all there.

**Questioner** : The discharge ( _nirjara_ ) that has to happen there is the same discharge that has to happen here too, no?

**Dadashri** : Everything discharges. Except here there is 'full stop', meaning the discharge takes place without new charging; there it takes place with charging ( _bandha_ ) with discharging ( _nirjara_ ).

What the body does is all discharge. What the mind does is all discharge too. What the speech does is all discharge also. You, have to keep 'seeing' what is discharging. What does Akram Vignan say? 'Everything is discharge'. Where does the discharge come from, sir? The answer is, 'from all the binding ( _bandha_ ) that took place'. Now we want to become free from _karma_ bondage and the bondage that was created is discharging on its own. Whatever the amount of bondage; that much will be the discharged. Thereafter is any more discharge going to take place?

**Questioner:** No.

**Dadashri** : Only that which was bound will discharge, no? For the world, out of their discharge, new causes are created. There is discharge for the whole world too. Every living being has discharge but at the time the discharge is taking place, new charging is also taking place.

Right now no matter what kind of a thought comes to the mind, it is all a discharge. Whatever Chandubhai is doing; it is all a discharge. You – the Self should not interfere in that but simply 'see and know' that 'this is what Chandubhai did'.

**Questioner** : How can we tell whether in the discharge charging is happening?

**Dadashri** : You are _Shuddhatma_ and _puran-galan_ (filling and emptying) is a separate thing, and charging ( _bandha_ )- discharging ( _nirjara_ ), is something separate. _Puran_ - _galan_ is what you can see directly. If the charging was for thoughts, then the discharge will be in the form of thoughts. This discharge of _puran_ - _galan_ is putting in food. You ate potatoes and got flatulence. You know that you got flatulence and you also know that it was put out. You have to know all this. All this is discharge of previous causes and You are _Shuddhatma_ – if this remains in your awareness, then there is no bondage for You. There is bondage in _dharmadhyan._ _Puran_ - _galan_ (input-output) is bound to take place in the body, no? No matter what you are eating, the nose will inhale and that is called _puran_ (intake). Then it will also do _galan_ , exhale; output. That _puran_ - _galan_ is the discharge of the body. As the discharge continues without charging, one becomes lighter.

When you don't do _raag_ - _dwesh_ , attachment-abhorrence, the discharge happens and no more cause-charging ( _bandha_ ) is created. _Samvar_ means the charging has stopped.

**Questioner** : So what do I have to do in the daily activities?

**Dadashri** : 'You' have to continue 'seeing' those activities. All day long, 'see' what Chandubhai is doing. From morning till night, till he goes to bed, 'see' what Chandubhai is doing; You have to 'see' only that. Whether he is doing good or bad, You just have to 'see and know' it. That way there will be no charging ( _bandha_ ) for You.

**Questioner** : Then who incurs the bondage?

**Dadashri** : The charging no longer remains; it is called discharge only. When you keep seeing, it means you have remained in your own _swabhav_ – in your nature. When you remain in your _swabhav_ , the discharge remains. Just keep seeing whether Chandu is doing right or wrong, if he gets angry, whether greed arises within, keep seeing it all that 'yes, there is still greed inside!'

When the _dhyan,_ awareness, of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' remains; then a constant state of _samvar,_ discharge of _karma_ without new charging, prevails. And with the _dhyan_ of 'I am Chandubhai', there was _ashrav_ , influx, and _bandha_ , binding of _karma_. And now there is _ashrav_ , influx but blocked _bandha_ called _samvar_. That which came in ( _ashrav_ ) will discharge ( _nirjara_ ) for sure. Even when you were Chandubhai the discharge was going on and now that You are _Shuddhatma_ , the discharge is going on. Except when you were Chandubhai, new binding ( _bandha_ ) was taking place whereas now, new binding has stopped. This is our Vignan. If you interfere ( _dakho_ ) in Vignan, it will become a muddle ( _dakhal_ ).

Whatever stock was filled, it will discharge with the same intent. If it was charged with a calm intent, it will discharge as a calm intent. If it was charged with a _kashaya_ _bhaav_ , it will discharge as a _kashaya_ _bhaav_. So with whatever _bhaav_ it had charged, that discharge will take place, no? But if You simply keep 'seeing' it, then _samvar_ (no binding) _bhaav_ will remain; this is all our Vignan is trying to say.

**Questioner** : If the bondage ( _bandha_ ) was created with a _kashaya_ _bhaav_ and it discharges with _kashaya bhaav_ , then is new _bandha_ (charging of _karma_ ) not created?

**Dadashri** : No, binding of _karma_ ( _bandha_ ) will not take place. With whatever _bhaav_ the _bandha_ , took place, it will discharge with the same _bhaav_. There is discharge for even the animals and we also have discharge. There is no difference between the two discharges, except there is difference in the way people see it. They say, 'this is happening to me'. In the ignorant state ( _agnani_ ), one feels in his mind that 'this is happening to me and that is what is happenig'. But after this Gnan, I am separate and there is experience of the separation; that is called _samvar_ (blocked binding of _karma_ ). Despite this, if it is discharging with a _kashaya_ _bhaav_ and you happen to utter words that hurt someone, then You have to say, 'Chandubhai, why did you do _atikraman_? Now do _pratikraman_!' We have not come here to hurt anyone. Otherwise you will not be able to settle that account. Can you not tell whether _atikraman_ took place or not?

## _Pratikraman_ erases the 'design'

Because of the effect of this life, a little weakness remains. His (file number one) effects cannot change all of a sudden, can they? The habits one has, are they likely to improve all of a sudden?

**Questioner** : When I am suffering the effect, then sometimes I feel that 'I did it'.

**Dadashri** : Yes, that does happen but can You not know right away who that 'I' is? The answer is 'Chandubhai did it'. At that time You do know 'which part is Mine and which part is Chandubhai's'.

**Questioner** : But those bad effects that happen now...

**Dadashri** : It will happen without fail; effect is bound to happen, no? The Self knows that 'right now this effect is happening to Chandubhai'. The Self remains as the knower till the end.

**Questioner** : But the good or bad effect that takes place, if from the worldly interaction view it appears as bad, then...

**Dadashri** : 'This is wrong', it is felt by Chandubhai and it is so from the worldly interaction viewpoint. And You also 'know' that 'this is wrong'.

**Questioner** : That is correct. I know all that. But even then through doing _bhaav_ , should I try to stop the effect or should I let the discharge happen?

**Dadashri** : No, 'this is not Mine' that much awareness ( _khyal_ ) should remain. If that awareness does not remain, then You have to say, 'not mine', and then it is separate for sure.

**Questioner** : What I am saying is, say for example I steal things. Now I know that it is an effect from the past life, but while stealing I feel that 'this is wrong', then should I let that effect discharge ( _nirjara_ )?

**Dadashri** : No, at that time the discharge ( _nirjara_ ) is happening. A discharage of everything is happening. There is no _purushartha_ in that. To believe 'this is wrong', is also a discharge ( _nirjara_ ) and even if he does not believe so, it is a discharge.

**Questioner** : So say I am stealing $5 from someone's pocket; that is an effect taking place. Now I feel that 'this is wrong', so should I take the $5 and let the discharge happen or should I not take the $5...

**Dadashri** : Just 'see' what is happening. Whether to take or not, You are not to make that decision. If you end up taking the money, it is _nirjara_ (discharge) and if you end up not taking it, even then it is a _nirjara_.

**Questioner** : Now when I am stealing, at that time the _bhaav_ that arises within of 'this stealing should not take place'; is that considered as _purushartha_?

**Dadashri** : No, for that if one has not attained the Self (through Gnan _Vidhi_ ), then it is _purushartha_. After realizing the Self, it is discharge. It is an effect. But it is good if there is remorse because that 'design' will be erased quickly. Otherwise if there is no remorse, the 'design' will not be erased. Therefore there is a benefit in doing _pratikraman_.

## If the _karma_ are docile, then the suffering is light

**Questioner:** Dada you had mentioned that whatever I have to suffer; if I suffer it at the moment, then it will discharge. Now I have to live amidst the worldly life. If I get hurt or get a headache then I have to take a tablet and go to work right away, so does that mean that I have discharged it or have I impeded the suffering of it?

**Dadashri** : No. That is regarded as having discharged. You getting the medicine is a discharge, or not getting the medicine and delaying it by five days, is discharge too. Do not become emotional (discharge _raag-dwesh_ ) at such times, or else then the discharge will remain pending. That which you get naturally and spontaneously ( _sahaj_ ), it is all discharging.

If the _karma_ you have bound is simple ( _bhodoo_ ), then you will get the medicine quickly and if it is sticky and complex like the vanias (certain cast of people who tend to be nitpicky), then it will be delayed; it will take time or you will not get the medicine.

Can _karma_ be simple or not? A person who is simple will have simple _karma_. Cunning people will have cunning _karma_. One, who is worthless, will have worthless _karma_. One, who is worthy, will have worthy _karma_. So whatever the person is, his _karma_ will be corresponding in nature. If someone is a tyrant and torments people, then his _karma_ will torment him.

The unfolding of one's own _karma_ ( _udayakarma_ ) will settle ( _nikal_ ) for sure. One can become free after suffering them. Sweet or bitter fruits will have to be tasted; then they will go. If you bind _karma_ , then you will have to taste that fruit. So why not taste the fruit in the daytime (now) so you don't have to do it in the night (versus later)?

**Questioner** : The worldly beliefs that have carried on for so long has just been bulldozed by Dada's Gnan!

**Dadashri** : If 'we' don't use the bulldozer then we cannot become free even after a hundred thousand lifetimes. All this _kramik_ path means one can only do it a certain complex way, whereas in this Akram path it is this simple and easy way. It is only so after the bulldozer has been used all over. But if One were to grab on to just this Gnan, even then He will get his work done. The way this Vignan is, is exactly how it has been revealed. How much is happening on its own? How much has to be done? How much of it just happens? 'I' have revealed all of it. No one else has said the word discharge. 'We' are the first to give facts about discharge and its nature. Whatever 'we' are saying in Akram Vignan is all for the first time.

# [4.3] Cause and effect

## It is an effect even when you sign it

**Questioner:** So only if I properly understand the causes during an effect can I create proper new causes, right?

**Dadashri** : No, Your new causes have been stopped, but if you are deliberately making this design, then what can anyone do?

**Questioner** : With every different circumstance, because of the old stock, I retaliate that 'this man is harassing me a lot'. Now am I not placing a signature, agreeing, with those retaliatory intents _bhaav_ ?

**Dadashri** : That will happen; there are no problems, even in that.

**Questioner** : Then if the Gnan remains present, then I retract that endorsement or else I do _pratikraman_ at night. But if I still maintain in the mind that 'that man is harassing me'; then does that not go into charging again, if I do not retract it or do _pratikraman_ for it?

**Dadashri** : Nothing of the kind is going to be charged or otherwise. It will charge only if you say, 'No, I am Chandubhai for sure'.

**Questioner** : But if someone were to slap me, then at that time, for an instant it feels as if 'I am Chandubhai'.

**Dadashri** : Nothing like that happens. It is all an effect. All this that you are saying, it is all an effect. In this world, whatever one can see, one can hear; it is all an effect. This giving of discourses; it is all an effect and the listener is also an effect.

**Questioner** : That is fine but I am putting my signature in that effect. What about that?

**Dadashri** : Yes, even when you sign, that too is an effect.

**Questioner** : Yes, so then how can I become free?

**Dadashri** : You are free for sure. But this is a doubt that has arisen in in the mind with, 'what is happening?' Someone may have a desire of eating _ladva and jalebis_ (Indian sweets); that is also an effect. That which is seen with the eyes, which is heard through the ears; is all an effect for sure.

## _Raag_ - _dwesh_ verily is the cause

What is there in causes? Anger-pride-deceit-greed, _raag_ - _dwesh_ – those are all causes.

**Questioner** : There is still a heapful of them.

**Dadashri** : No. They are not happening to You at all; You simply feel they are happening to you. Do they sometimes happen in you?

**Questioner** : Yes it does happen, but I end up doing _pratikraman_ for it. Dada, 'Chandubhai' has a lot of desires and has a lot of _bhaav_ to enjoy many things; I can see all those desires, here and there.

**Dadashri** : All those desires are merely only an effect.

**Questioner** : But some time will be needed for them to come to an end, right?

**Dadashri** : Are you doing _pratikraman_?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri** : Then, You are "not responsible".

**Questioner** : Some tendency of greed arises and to employ that greed, deceit arises within, without fail. Now in that unfolding _karma_ , if its impression ( _sanskara_ ) is very strong, then only will it be set in motion. So then what should I do inorder to destroy the roots of those impressions?

**Dadashri** : It is like this. This is all in the form of discharge. Discharge means effect. Effect has to be kept on 'seeing'.

**Questioner** : But its effect does fall upon me, does it not?

**Dadashri** : If a person has not taken this Gnan, then he will have to make all the changes. Through his ego, he has to change those _sanskara_ (impressions). But here (after Gnan), now the ego no longer remains and now only discharge remains. So in that, no matter what kind of deceit one resorts to, no matter what one does; it is all discharge only.

## The first change is in the cause

First the cause changes and then the effect changes. Therefore now one attains the conviction ( _pratiti_ ) that 'now there is no use for any jewelry and no need for any money'. But when he is counting money, he is very focused and careful. Because counting is an effect of past causes and this conviction is a cause. That is why 'we' do not look at the effects; we only check to see what his conviction is. Then we move away; 'we' know that this is the cause now and so the effect will come in due time. 'We' do not reprimand him but others will keep nagging, 'even though you have taken Dada's Gnan, you are still the same!' Dear fellow, these are effects for her. But he does not understand this and she too gets irritated with him. Then she will say, 'the heck with it. Instead of this, everything was better the way it was before', and so she loses even what came into her conviction.

Therefore when one sees things the wrong way; it is an effect of past causes. All conduct is an effect and the conviction ( _pratiti_ ) within is the _purushartha_. The fruit of that _purushartha_ is yet to come. And this effect here is the fruit of past life _purushartha_. You still get irritated when the business suffers a loss, why is that? Irritation is the effect of past life causes; it is not the effect of this life.

## What that too is an effect?

**Questioner** : After taking Gnan when good _bhaav_ intents arises, _bhaav_ to do good things arises, so then are those too an effect?

**Dadashri** : That is an effect only.

**Questioner** : If it is an effect, then its fruit will come, no?

**Dadashri** : No, when you get the _bhaav_ to do good things, it means its fruit will come later on, without fail. But you getting these good _bhaav_ is also an effect and the fruit that comes later on, is an effect also. There are no causes in this. Causes are created when one becomes the doer such that 'I am the doer of these kinds of intents _bhaav_ ', then causes will be created. But otherwise it is a different thing to have good _bhaav_ ; and to become a doer is a different thing. To become a doer is to create causes and having myness ( _mamata_ ) also creates causes.

After receiving this Gnan, no new causes are created. Today there is only effect from past life causes. This effect cannot be changed. So You have to keep 'seeing' the effects. If they were causes, then 'we' would have to tell you, 'be careful; make sure you do it this way or that way...' But these are not causes; these are effects. Only effects! And it is _vyavasthit_. You have to keep 'seeing' what kind of effect Chandubhai is having. If some _mahatma_ 's wife is beating him up, he will come and tell me and so I will tell him to settle it with equanimity, because all this is an effect. And the _mahatmas_ are also maintaining equanimity; tremendous equanimity.

**Questioner** : What is this an effect of? Of previously accumulated _karma_?

**Dadashri** : It is an effect of whatever causes that were created in the past life. Now new causes have stopped and so now no new effect is going to arise. Now you have to suffer the effect of past causes; which our people call as _prarabdha_ – that which will have to be suffered.

**Questioner** : In order to attain _moksha_ , I will have to dissipate all the _karma_ that I have created in the past, no?

**Dadashri** : That is an effect. Effect means it will continue to happen on it own. You do not have to interefere in it again.

## Understanding suffocation after Gnan

**Questioner:** If a man were to become established in the Gnan and live his daily life, then everything would become peaceful and that he would become established in the Gnan that He is beyond birth and death, but sometimes that Gnan slips away from him. Is that the reason that worldly life continues?

**Dadashri** : It is like this, if the effect is very heavy and profuse, then it will give him a little suffocation. You are not likely to have a heavyduty effect and so your Gnan will not move aside, right? So for those who have to suffer a heavyduty effect, for them all this will move aside. Actually it does not move aside, there is only suffocation; that is all.

And only 'we' have called it causes and effect. Until now no one has said it so. And if anyone has not given any importance whatsoever to the effect, it 'us'! But otherwise the whole world is stuck on effects only. They do not pay any attention to the causes. Whatever is to take place in the causes, so be it, but they keep pampering the effects and that is why causes are created and nothing but demerit _karma_ ( _paap_ ) is bound inside. If the effect is good, of what use is it? The heck with it!

Why does this worldly life arise? Causes and effect. If causes come to an end, then, only the effect will remain. Then in due time, the filled stock will empty out. Once the causes have been stopped, one only needs to 'see' the effects. Effect is a movie and You are the 'seer' of the movie. Everything that now remains is _vyavasthit_ ; it is all an effect. Whatever Chandubhai has to suffer; it is all an effect.

# [4.3] Cause and effect

## It is an effect even when you sign it

**Questioner:** So only if I properly understand the causes during an effect can I create proper new causes, right?

**Dadashri** : No, Your new causes have been stopped, but if you are deliberately making this design, then what can anyone do?

**Questioner** : With every different circumstance, because of the old stock, I retaliate that 'this man is harassing me a lot'. Now am I not placing a signature, agreeing, with those retaliatory intents _bhaav_ ?

**Dadashri** : That will happen; there are no problems, even in that.

**Questioner** : Then if the Gnan remains present, then I retract that endorsement or else I do _pratikraman_ at night. But if I still maintain in the mind that 'that man is harassing me'; then does that not go into charging again, if I do not retract it or do _pratikraman_ for it?

**Dadashri** : Nothing of the kind is going to be charged or otherwise. It will charge only if you say, 'No, I am Chandubhai for sure'.

**Questioner** : But if someone were to slap me, then at that time, for an instant it feels as if 'I am Chandubhai'.

**Dadashri** : Nothing like that happens. It is all an effect. All this that you are saying, it is all an effect. In this world, whatever one can see, one can hear; it is all an effect. This giving of discourses; it is all an effect and the listener is also an effect.

**Questioner** : That is fine but I am putting my signature in that effect. What about that?

**Dadashri** : Yes, even when you sign, that too is an effect.

**Questioner** : Yes, so then how can I become free?

**Dadashri** : You are free for sure. But this is a doubt that has arisen in in the mind with, 'what is happening?' Someone may have a desire of eating _ladva and jalebis_ (Indian sweets); that is also an effect. That which is seen with the eyes, which is heard through the ears; is all an effect for sure.

## _Raag_ - _dwesh_ verily is the cause

What is there in causes? Anger-pride-deceit-greed, _raag_ - _dwesh_ – those are all causes.

**Questioner** : There is still a heapful of them.

**Dadashri** : No. They are not happening to You at all; You simply feel they are happening to you. Do they sometimes happen in you?

**Questioner** : Yes it does happen, but I end up doing _pratikraman_ for it. Dada, 'Chandubhai' has a lot of desires and has a lot of _bhaav_ to enjoy many things; I can see all those desires, here and there.

**Dadashri** : All those desires are merely only an effect.

**Questioner** : But some time will be needed for them to come to an end, right?

**Dadashri** : Are you doing _pratikraman_?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri** : Then, You are "not responsible".

**Questioner** : Some tendency of greed arises and to employ that greed, deceit arises within, without fail. Now in that unfolding _karma_ , if its impression ( _sanskara_ ) is very strong, then only will it be set in motion. So then what should I do inorder to destroy the roots of those impressions?

**Dadashri** : It is like this. This is all in the form of discharge. Discharge means effect. Effect has to be kept on 'seeing'.

**Questioner** : But its effect does fall upon me, does it not?

**Dadashri** : If a person has not taken this Gnan, then he will have to make all the changes. Through his ego, he has to change those _sanskara_ (impressions). But here (after Gnan), now the ego no longer remains and now only discharge remains. So in that, no matter what kind of deceit one resorts to, no matter what one does; it is all discharge only.

## The first change is in the cause

First the cause changes and then the effect changes. Therefore now one attains the conviction ( _pratiti_ ) that 'now there is no use for any jewelry and no need for any money'. But when he is counting money, he is very focused and careful. Because counting is an effect of past causes and this conviction is a cause. That is why 'we' do not look at the effects; we only check to see what his conviction is. Then we move away; 'we' know that this is the cause now and so the effect will come in due time. 'We' do not reprimand him but others will keep nagging, 'even though you have taken Dada's Gnan, you are still the same!' Dear fellow, these are effects for her. But he does not understand this and she too gets irritated with him. Then she will say, 'the heck with it. Instead of this, everything was better the way it was before', and so she loses even what came into her conviction.

Therefore when one sees things the wrong way; it is an effect of past causes. All conduct is an effect and the conviction ( _pratiti_ ) within is the _purushartha_. The fruit of that _purushartha_ is yet to come. And this effect here is the fruit of past life _purushartha_. You still get irritated when the business suffers a loss, why is that? Irritation is the effect of past life causes; it is not the effect of this life.

## What that too is an effect?

**Questioner** : After taking Gnan when good _bhaav_ intents arises, _bhaav_ to do good things arises, so then are those too an effect?

**Dadashri** : That is an effect only.

**Questioner** : If it is an effect, then its fruit will come, no?

**Dadashri** : No, when you get the _bhaav_ to do good things, it means its fruit will come later on, without fail. But you getting these good _bhaav_ is also an effect and the fruit that comes later on, is an effect also. There are no causes in this. Causes are created when one becomes the doer such that 'I am the doer of these kinds of intents _bhaav_ ', then causes will be created. But otherwise it is a different thing to have good _bhaav_ ; and to become a doer is a different thing. To become a doer is to create causes and having myness ( _mamata_ ) also creates causes.

After receiving this Gnan, no new causes are created. Today there is only effect from past life causes. This effect cannot be changed. So You have to keep 'seeing' the effects. If they were causes, then 'we' would have to tell you, 'be careful; make sure you do it this way or that way...' But these are not causes; these are effects. Only effects! And it is _vyavasthit_. You have to keep 'seeing' what kind of effect Chandubhai is having. If some _mahatma_ 's wife is beating him up, he will come and tell me and so I will tell him to settle it with equanimity, because all this is an effect. And the _mahatmas_ are also maintaining equanimity; tremendous equanimity.

**Questioner** : What is this an effect of? Of previously accumulated _karma_?

**Dadashri** : It is an effect of whatever causes that were created in the past life. Now new causes have stopped and so now no new effect is going to arise. Now you have to suffer the effect of past causes; which our people call as _prarabdha_ – that which will have to be suffered.

**Questioner** : In order to attain _moksha_ , I will have to dissipate all the _karma_ that I have created in the past, no?

**Dadashri** : That is an effect. Effect means it will continue to happen on it own. You do not have to interefere in it again.

## Understanding suffocation after Gnan

**Questioner:** If a man were to become established in the Gnan and live his daily life, then everything would become peaceful and that he would become established in the Gnan that He is beyond birth and death, but sometimes that Gnan slips away from him. Is that the reason that worldly life continues?

**Dadashri** : It is like this, if the effect is very heavy and profuse, then it will give him a little suffocation. You are not likely to have a heavyduty effect and so your Gnan will not move aside, right? So for those who have to suffer a heavyduty effect, for them all this will move aside. Actually it does not move aside, there is only suffocation; that is all.

And only 'we' have called it causes and effect. Until now no one has said it so. And if anyone has not given any importance whatsoever to the effect, it 'us'! But otherwise the whole world is stuck on effects only. They do not pay any attention to the causes. Whatever is to take place in the causes, so be it, but they keep pampering the effects and that is why causes are created and nothing but demerit _karma_ ( _paap_ ) is bound inside. If the effect is good, of what use is it? The heck with it!

Why does this worldly life arise? Causes and effect. If causes come to an end, then, only the effect will remain. Then in due time, the filled stock will empty out. Once the causes have been stopped, one only needs to 'see' the effects. Effect is a movie and You are the 'seer' of the movie. Everything that now remains is _vyavasthit_ ; it is all an effect. Whatever Chandubhai has to suffer; it is all an effect.

# [5] 'Not mine'

## Then You will have to go to moksha!

Ours is _kshayak_ _samkit_ (eternal right vision-understanding), meaning it is way higher than _samyak_ _darashan_ (right vision-understanding). Now _samyak dharshan_ means that from the day You attained the knowledge of 'I am not this (Chandulal), I am _Shuddhatma_ '; from then onwards whatever garbage comes out, 'is not mine'. The day You attain _samyak darshan_ , the bliss for 48-minutes ( _goonthanu_ ) tasted – is I, the Self, everything else is rubbish goods; everything else is _udaya karma_ (unfolding karma that give effect). Sometimes good stock will come out, sometimes bad stock will come out, but You tell yourself, 'not mine'. That is why _samyak darshan_ says, 'after you attain Me, even if you don't want to go to _moksha_ , You will have to. Therefore, think before you come here'.

## There is no attachment-abhorrence in 'not mine'

**Questioner:** The inspiration that arises within is called a 'file', so I have to settle that file with equanimity ( _sambhavey nikal_ ), do I not?

**Dadashri:** Settle with equanimity or else even if You say, 'not mine,' then also you become free, but not otherwise. If You see it as separate, then You become free. What does it mean? It means, 'if you do _raag-dwesh_ attachment-abhorrence, then it will stick to you, if not, then it will not stick'. If You see it as separate, then there is no attachment-abhorrence, or else even if You say 'not mine' then also there will be no attachment-abhorrence. Attachment-abhorrence is to 'my things' right?

## The puzzle due to kashays

After Gnan, _kashays_ , anger-pride-deceit-greed become weak. These _kashays_ are only worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) _kashays_. These are not _nischaya_ _kashays_ ; they are of the Self. But they tend to become weak. Finally one should not have even relative _kashays._

**Questioner:** These _vyavahar_ _kashays_ are the ones that entangle and cause problems.

**Dadashri:** No. After Gnan how can _kashays_ confuse-entangle You, the Self?

**Questioner:** These _kashays_ which happen in file number one are very troublesome. Therefore uneasiness arises and then conflicts continue to happen.

**Dadashri:** But it does not happen to You, do they?

**Questioner:** In the belief part it is so that it is not happening to me, but the experience that is there, I do not like that experience.

**Dadashri:** You just say this much that this is 'not mine,' then it will not touch You at all. If you say just that which is in the belief, 'not mine,' then it will not touch You. If you do not treat it this way, it will manage to get in and take hold of you.

**Questioner:** But do I have to say this again and again?

**Dadashri:** Yes, you have to definitely say it at that time. When it tries to get in then can you not understand and reject it by saying, 'hey, you are not mine, why are you trying to get into someone else's house?' You have to speak like this. _Vyavahar_ (internal converstion), means one has to speak each and every word.

**Questioner:** I become aware that it is not mine an hour later.

**Dadashri:** If you speak so then it will not come again at all. It will simply say, 'I am leaving.' This will not touch You at all.

## The instant you say 'not mine,' it vanishes

So why don't you get clarification for all these facts. This is all a science. And it remains scientific. But from the moment You are given Gnan, everything becomes separate "exactly". Otherwise when you are in some difficulty and you say 'this is not my swaroop, my State', even then You become free, because a "line of demarcation" has been placed between the 'I' and 'my'. So if there is any quarrel between the two, by saying 'not mine' it becomes separate. The rubbish of the mind, the rubbish of the _chit_ , no matter what kind of thoughts the mind becomes entwined in, by saying 'not mine', becomes separated; just with this one word. It is necessary for you to say this and so it will not 'touch' You. It is not the Self's at all! If you become perplexed, then it will become stuck on you, and you then feel a burden. And when the perplexity arises, then say, 'it is not mine', because all these entanglements are not Yours. All the entanglements are Chandulal's. The world claims, 'this is mine...this is mine...' and that is why they have been possessed by this 'ghost'. In fact, it is not theirs either and yet they believe it is and as far as You are concerned, what problems do you have in truly saying ' not mine'? It is not 'Yours' at all.

## When You say 'not mine', You are the Self

**Questioner:** For the one for whom applied awareness of the Self _(upyoga)_ does not remain, that person is outside the Self; right?

**Dadashri** : Any relative thing that arises, in saying ' not mine' means one is in the Self; in _swaroop_. That is when he is in the Self and speaks. Otherwise one cannot speak this way. If he is outside, he cannot say it. 'This is not mine', - this means he is in the Self. When it is so clear, does anything else remain?

**Questioner** : But Dada 'not mine' does not remain in all circumstances.

**Dadashri** : Do you feel that it 'is yours'?

**Questioner** : There is no such _bhaav_ intent as to whether it is mine or not.

**Dadashri** : So it means that it is not with _upyoga_ , the applied awareness of the Self. It remains otherwise, but to say,' not mine' must be with _upyoga._ When we say, 'it is not mine', then all those entities sitting within will hear and say, 'oh ho ho! Now he is speaking very clearly with us'. The intellect ( _buddhi_ ), mind _(mana_ ) and _chit_ are now convinced that you now side with the Self, and that they no longer have a say in anything.

**Questioner** : I have to speak this way in the beginning, but eventually it will become permanent, no? So for the time being, I continue saying it?

**Dadashri** : But the beginning has just started. What objection do you have in saying 'not mine'? Just say it softly in the mind; you don't have to say it out loud. Say it in the mind, 'not mine'. There are police and security guards around large bank vaults and safes. (This was the practice in India) So when it is midnight, they will sound the gong, then again at one o'clock and at every hour they will say, 'al bel...al bel...' So all the other police officers will hear this and sleep soundly. What are they saying when they say, 'al bel'?

'Al bel', means 'All well!' So even when they say just this; the other policemen will sleep soundly, won't they? If they don't say it, then they will start to become suspicious, 'it is 12:30 am why are they not saying anything?' Just as these warnings come on the beat, You have to do the same. By saying it, it proves that one is in the Self and is awakened and aware ( _jagruti_ ) and is saying 'not mine'.

What is the proof that one has remained as the Self? The answer is, if someone throws a stone at you, You will instantly be aware of 'this is not mine'. What does that mean? It means that He is 'sitting' in the Self, and speaking this way. No matter what kind of a worldly situation arises, by saying 'not mine', You become free.

**Questioner** : Many times the awareness ( _jaguruti_ ) prevails that this is 'not mine'; it prevails naturally. Often it does not remain so and I become engrossed with the relative circumstances.

**Dadashri** : Yes, so if You say, 'that is not mine', if You make a practice of it, the awareness will come. 'You' have to practice.

**Questioner** : When there are no circumstances or other relative things I feel that I remain in the Self.

**Dadashri** : Yes that is correct. There is no problem. Only if circumstance ( _saiyog_ ) comes, there is a possibility of it (awareness) changing. To that circumstance, you just have to say, 'not mine'.

**Questioner** : When there is no circumstance, are we in the Self?

**Dadashri** : What do you mean 'no circumstance'? You have not understood this matter. At that time not even the mind is there. But if the mind is thinking, then that is called a _saiyog_ – a circumstance. Even then You are in the _gnayakswarup_ – in the nature of the Self as the Knower. If You keep 'seeing' the wandering _chit_ , then at that moment You are in the Self. It is the nature of the _chit_ to wander around but to become engrossed ( _tanmayakar_ ) with it spoils everything. Did you ever become _tanmayakar_ with it?

**Questioner** : I did. Up until now I used to be engrossed with it.

**Dadashri** : That is called _tanmayakar_ (to become the body mind form); it is called _tadakaar_ (to take on the form of that which is being contemplated); whatever is the form and shape of it, one becomes that.

**Questioner** : Dada sometimes for a minute or so I remain engrossed and the very next minute the awareness comes that 'these are not my thoughts'.

**Dadashri** : There is not problem with that. Then if You say it in the next minute, even then there is no problem. If you are about to sneez at that moment, you will not be able to say it. You can say it after sneezing. To say it a little later means that the awareness is a little dim, but what's wrong with that? But later You should say it immediately.

## The Gnan of the line of demarcation maintains separation

**Questioner:** What solution should I resort to for not letting the Self become one with the non-Self?

**Dadashri** : We have put a line of demarcation between two farms, which says, 'this is yours and this is his'. Now the other farmer will become a little suspicious if someone tells him that a man took some okras from his farm. So, upon hearing only this much; his mind will turn. When he 'sees' with his turned mind, it will feel like it is his own because it is very close to his own. So he starts shouting and complaining, he starts cursing at people and so someone who has knowledge of the situation comes along and tells him 'dear man, why are you getting so mad unnecessarily?' So he will say, 'Hey you! My okras are gone, why wouldn't I be upset? You too would do the same.' So the other man will tell him, 'dear man, at least take a look. Your farm is up to this line, the rest is his', so then he becomes happy!

So if we are in the department of 'I am Shuddhatma', and some agitated vibrations arise, some difficulty arises; it will separate if You say, 'not mine'. Just as with a farm when you say 'not mine' to the other side, it becomes separate. As long as you say 'it is mine', anxiety and problems will come along. That is why You have to say this. What do You have to say? 'You' say, 'not mine'. Then at that time, it will remain exact.

If some one touches slightly on the arm, the reaction is to pull away the arm. That sensation of feeling the pleasant touch is the nature of the non-Self complex, and the pulling away of the arm is also of the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ). Then the very next minute I said,'not mine'; then nothing happened. If at any place a trace of 'mine' remains, then by saying ' not mine', there will be no problems. By saying, 'not mine', both become separate.

## Karma are separate and the Self is separate

**Questioner:** Having eaten out in restaurants, I keep getting thoughts about the food there. I feel like I want to eat biscuits or something else. So should I do _pratikraman_ for it or just simply 'see' all this?

**Dadashri** : There You have to say, 'not mine'. You are not to keep seeing there. 'It is not mine', it is Chandubhai's. Tell him, 'Chandubhai, I do not suffer your pain ( _dukha_ ) either'; that is what You have to say.

**Questioner** : So I should not take the burden of anything that happens?

**Dadashri** : Yes, You should not take on the responsibility for it. 'You are separate and I am separate', this much You have to say; that is enough! 'You' have to say this much. You have to say, 'I am separate,'at that time so that Your Gnan does not take a nosedive, You have to say this much. The _Shuddhatma_ is separate and so it this; both are completely separate, no? So we have to speak as it is. As much as You have come to know (experience). Then it will not affect You at all. If inside there is even the slightest change, then saying, 'you are separate and I am separate,' is enough. You cannot say such lies about, 'I am here, and 'seeing' what happens,' here. This matter is not for imagination!

We are _Shuddhatma_ and this is karma. The karma is the surrounding condition; it is a circumstance. It will keep changing. To that You have to say, 'you are separate and I am separate', in doing so, it will not affect You. The karma will play their own part. But there is no effect; they are uneffective and in the other, even when you become involved with it, nothing will improve; and on the contrary it will obstruct whatever bliss of the Self there is. You have attaind the habit of getting involved with it and so it does not go away easily. Now You have to develop this habit of saying, 'you are separate and I am separate. Later I will help you.' That is what You have to say.

## Pragnya separates it

**Questioner:** The conversation that takes place within; that is being done by the _pratishthit atma_ (relative self), no?

**Dadashri** : The _pragnya swaroop_ (the liberating energy of the Self) that we have, that _pragnya_ is always taking care of everything. The Self does not have to do anything. As long as there is the presence of karma, the _pragnya_ 's presence will remain. When the karma comes to an end, _pragnya_ will come to an end. Till then, _pragnya_ will say, 'you are separate and I am separate. We have nothing to do with each other'.

**Questioner** : Often there is aversion and dislike towards karma effect.

**Dadahri** : It is because you let it touch you, that is why you feel aversion. Always whenever it touches you, You have to immediately say, 'not mine'; then nothing will happen. At least speak this way once and see what happens. Say this five to twenty-five times, then you will get the practice. The moment You say, 'not mine' it will disconnect immediately. It is not Yours at all. What is wrong in saying 'not mine' to that which has become disconnected? And all this is _charitra mohaniya_ (discharging illusory karma) No matter what; it is still _moha_ – illusory attachment.

Whenever suffocation-entanglement happens within, You have to say 'not mine'. In fact, that suffocation does not do much damage but it prevents the bliss of the Self. How can we call that is which is not ours, after it has become separate from us? Otherwise before we used to say, 'this is mine...this is mine', no? Now that it has been decided that it is not Yours, when You say 'not mine', then it will become disconnected. When subatomic particles ( _parmanoos_ ) of anger arise within (Chandubhai), then if You say 'not mine', then it will cool down immediately. But it will not have an effect on You. At times even if he (Chandubhai) is furious and boiling, it will not affect You. Say 'this is not mine' to that which is not Yours; whereas the worldly people say, 'it is mine' to what is not theirs. We are saying 'no' that which is not Ours and 'is' to what is Ours. We are stating this directly and in a straightforward manner.

## Engrossment in phases of mind will have to be broken

**Questioner:** You had once said that if one does not become worry-free ( _nischint_ ) and fearless ( _nirbhaya_ ), then even the Self that has been given, will go away.

**Dadashri** : In that (state of fear and worry) nothing of the Self remains. But that does not happen to _mahatmas_ (those who have attained the Self through Akram Gnan _Vidhi_ ). In fact one has to check as to why from infinite life times the worldly life is perpetuated; it is because the support on which it rests is not broken. So it is the support that You have to keep breaking. What do You have to keep breaking after taking this Gnan? The foundation on which this worldly life rests; that is the support You need to break.Now for many that support breaks and for many it remains standing. So, one has to keep breaking that support and nothing else.

Now on which support does the world remains standing? The answer is that the self becomes engrossed in all the phases ( _paryaya_ ) of the mind, the different situations ( _avastha_ ) of the mind and that is why it remains standing. The intellect ( _buddhi_ ) is not interfering; nothing else is interfering. So You have to keep breaking away the different phases ( _paryaya_ ) of the mind; 'these are not mine, these are not mine,' keep shaking it up within from this level. If You keep breaking it, You will become free. It is the old practice of infinite lifetimes, which does not let you become free. It is 'he, the ego' that finds it sweet, not the Self – the _Shuddhatma_. It is the ego that finds it sweet and that is why it has to be broken. 'You' have to 'see' the two as being separate. By saying 'not mine' You have separated it and then only can it be 'seen'.

## Even in difficult times there is endless bliss

And if depression comes along, do not become one with it; confront it. In any situation, whenever depression comes,one can experience the Self, provided he has taken this Gnan of ours. In that depression, where there is constant bliss; that is Your place. This Gnan is such that it will help You find that place. Sometimes if there are problems in the worldly life, even then there is bliss within; that place is Yours. This is how You can find that place 'this is my place and this place is not!' Otherwise no matter what kind of karma it is, just say, 'this is not mine', and it leaves You, because this is Yours and it is someone else's. It has been separated in this way, no?

**Questioner** : Can I say, 'this is not my state ( _swaroop_ )?

**Dadashri** : It is fine if you don't use the word ' _swaroop_ '.

**Questioner** : This time I had a good experience.

**Dadashri** : It was good experience, no? It is of use only, if the experience increases.

## That is where the experience of the Self becomes steady

**Questioner:** In circumstance that arises outside or within, if I know that 'this is not my nature', is that when the experience of the Self ( _atmanubhav_ ) becomes steady?

**Dadashri** : Yes it does! 'This is not My _swabhaav_ (nature)' – from that point the experience becomes steady and increases. When that awareness prevails, the experience becomes firm. 'This is not My nature' – the one who understands this much, becomes established as the Self. A division has been made between 'Mine-yours'; what is Mine- the Self ( _nischaya_ ) and 'yours' relative interaction ( _vyavahar_ ). The relative part all goes into 'yours' (non-Self complex, Chandulal)'. The entire spectrum of what is relative does not come into 'Mine- the Self'. For the sake of worldly interaction you may have to say otherwise, but from Your vision, it is _parayu_ and _parbharyu_ \- foreign and belongs to the non-Self complex respectively.

## All circumstances are of the pudgal, the non-Self complex

Now whatever the other person says, You have to check as to whose 'mail (letter)' it is; is it the mail for the _pudgal_ , the non-Self complex of mind, speech and body? Every mail of the _pudgal_ is a circumstance ( _saiyog_ ). And no circumstance is the mail of the Self; therefore whatever circumstance arrives, it is of the _pudgal_. Now that person said something negative; that too is a circumstance, no? To that which is of the _pudgal_ 's; You have to say 'not mine' and it will be set free. Because a habit of infinite past lives cannot be let go of easily. That is why for a short while, for a few months or so, if You keep saying, 'not mine', then everything will fall into place. First You have to say, 'not mine'. After becoming _Shuddhatma_ , there is not a thing that belongs to You, the Self. This _prakruti_ of 'Chandubhai' is the result of the liabilities from past life causes. So now You have to settle it, with equanimity, which means to 'clean' it and then let it go. That is why Krupadudev Srimad Rajchandra (Gnani Purush of _karmic_ path) has said, 'those that were bound in ignorance, cleanse them with Knowledge (Gnan)'. The only thing that remains is for You to dissolve the account through the awareness as _Shuddhatma_ ; all other work is done.

Now You just have to say 'not mine' to the circumstances that arise. Those circumstances have come together due to the _baahyabhaav_ (intent for the worldy life). They are there because of _sansaarbhaav_ , (past life) worldly desire. When the circumstances arise, just say 'not mine' and You become free. Whosoever's mail it is; give it to him. If You open someone else's mail, that person will get irritated that you have opened their mail. 'We' (the Gnani purush and the Lord within) will say, 'Here Ambalal, this letter has come for you'. This is a science ( _vignan_ ). This Gnan that I have given You is such that it will not stir even an atom within. And if You hang on to these words of 'ours', then You will not have any problems. But the old habits are still there, no? The habit of believing the 'foreign' to be the 'home' has not gone. You still end up going into the 'foreign'. But You have to maintain this much awareness that any circumstance that arises, is not of the Self. The Self is _asaiyogi_ , free from circumstance and the circumstance are of the outside, the non-Self and it is a 'film', which You have to keep 'seeing'. And if Chandulal, the relative self, ends up fighting in the circumstances, even then there is no problem. 'You' still have to keep seeing that. If Chandulal is fighting with another person, that too You have to keep seeing. Then when the other person leaves, You have to tell Chandulal, 'Chandubhai, do not do this kind of a thing. Keep it turned down.' If You say it when the other person is there, it would look wrong. He will say, 'now who are these two people? He is telling himself off!'

## The scientific effect of the words 'not mine'

**Questioner:** Despite doing everything, when pressure from external circumstances comes, the pressure has an effect on the body and on the _antahkaran_ , (the inner complex of mind-intellect- _chit_ -ego), so what should I do at that time?

**Dadashri** : At any time, whatever comes along, no matter how complex; even if you become entangled with it for an hour, it will detach the moment You say, 'not mine'. Because a partition has been made between 'what is Mine' and 'what is yours' (between the Self and the non-Self); 'we' have divided it up. At that time we had told him, 'dear man, this is not mine. This is yours and this is Mine!'

**Questioner** : Whatever circumstances arise, the _prakruti_ is bound to react and become agitated in accordance to the circumstances, so even if I say 'not mine', it is not going to come under control, is it?

**Dadashri** : But when You say 'not mine' it separates - for those who have been given this Gnan. It is not so for those who have not been given the Gnan.

**Questioner** : That means when I say, 'not mine', along with that I am in the Knower-Seer state and that is how I am solving it.

**Dadashri** : No. Whether or not You are in _Gnata Drashta_ (Knower-Seer) state within is a different matter but when You say 'not mine', it becomes separate. With those words, instantly, there is a tremendous scientific effect.

## That which creates any effect is 'not mine'

Our science says that this line of demarcation has been drawn. Thereafter this 'plant' is no longer Yours. If You believe it to be yours then you will feel hurt. Why did this plant dry up? Dear man, it is not your plant anymore. It belongs to other person, the non-Self. The problem starts from the point you start to believe that which is not yours, as Yours.

**Questioner:** Now I realized that I should definitely let go of that which is not mine; what else is there then? I used to become the owner.

**Dadashri:** You have to quit that ownership. This useless burden....

**Questioner:** Dada, when you gave us Gnan at that time we surrendered everything but we are taking back secretly.

**Dadashri:** That is because of the old studied practice, which is wrong. The doctor tells you not to eat with your right hand, yet the right hand will go in the plate at the time of eating, because of the old practice. So the line of demarcation has been laid down, that it is 'not mine'. You should keep this much in your mind that whatever gives you any pain, whatever brings an effect; then it is 'not mine' and that which is 'mine—the Self' will not create an effect. That is it; understand these two things. It is easy, isn't it? That's it!

## The one that hurts is your step-relative

Step-relations – when you come to know that someone is your step-relative ( _ormayu_ ), mind becomes a little distanced- separated. As long as you believe that your _mama_ , mother's brother, is related to you, you have a very close relationship with him. But if your mother tells you, 'he is my step-brother; he is not really related to you', then from the moment she tells you this, your mind will becomes alienated. Will it not? All these are step-relations ( _ormayu_ ).

One man tells me, 'my leg hurts a lot'. So what can be done if it hurts? So he tells me, 'can you rub your hand over it?'. I told him, 'here, I will rub my hand over it.' He then tells me, 'the pain is not decreasing', so I told him, 'this leg is your step-leg; it is not Yours. You believe it to be related to you but it is your step-relation'. I told him to say 'this is my step-leg and this One (the Self) is my own. The leg that is hurting is my step-leg and this (the Self) is my own.'

When you said that, your pain went away, right?

**Questioner** : That day I had a fever and you gave me this example, so I sat down for five minutes and did what you told me and the fever went away.

**Dadashri** : It will come down. When you say this is my own relation and this is my step-relation, from that moment your _bhaav_ (relative intent) will break and everything will settle down. So make it as a step-relation, so it will not remain in the mind. 'You' have to show it like that, in person.

**Questioner** : The way I look in the mirror, in that way?

**Dadashri** : Will that solution be good for you or not? Whatever keys Dada gives, you will be able to open all locks with that.

## The method of becoming free from addictions

'I like it' – this is how one gets married to cigarettes. 'I don't like it' will set your free. In five or ten days say it about a hundred thousand times sitting down peacefully for one hour. An hour during the day and an hour in the evening, even for two hours one should do it in this way. Keep the cigarettes in front of you and say 'I do not want to smoke cigarette, I do not want to smoke cigarette...'.

**Questioner:** Dadaji can one become free from any addiction by placing it infront, and saying it a hundred thousand times? Any kind of addiction?

**Dadashri** : Everything will become detached if you do it this way. When you were sitting at the wedding alter and you said 'mine' (to the wife), that is when you made a twist (entered into 'my-ness'). For the past ten years you have kept on twisting the threads by saying 'mine, mine'. And so when the wife dies, he will even cry. Hey you! Before the wedding there was no relationship with her at all. So by saying 'not mine, not mine', the 'my-ness' will be set free.

**Questioner** : Will it get rid of any bad habit?

**Dadashri** : Alas! It became bound with 'mine' and 'not mine' will set You free. If it is very strong, then You have to do it for a longer period of time. But in the end it will become detached. This is the very method. This world is nothing but a psychological effect.

If you have said it for seventy fifty thousand times and suppose it is getting ready to become detached by saying it twenty-five thousand times more, but someone comes along and says, 'you can't even get rid of your cigarettes. How can you be a devotee of Dada?', and you reply, 'there is nothing wrong with smoking', then the instant you say 'Nothing wrong, no problem', it becomes alive again.

**Questioner** : No, but I will not say that. What if I say I am getting ready to quit?

**Dadashri** : Yes, you can say, 'it is my weakenss for sure and it is not mine' for sure'. 'It is my weakenss it is not mine' – You have to speak in this same precise method. If you say it any otherway, it will not work. Or if you defend the addiction, even then it will not work. You may end up defending the habit in order to save your reputation.

**Questioner** : We give nourishment to something by saying 'this is a discharge', right?

**Dadashri** : Yes, you've nourished it. By saying, 'yes, this is my weakness,' you are not protecting it and so it will not become live.

## Where the awareness is dim, there effects will continue

**Questioner:** The state of absolute fearlessness ( _nidarata_ ) does not come. Because there is not that much _nirleypata_ (untouched; unsmearable; unanointable), there is lack of fearlessness. It lacks a little.

**Dadashri** : No matter what or how much of this world you see, when nothing of it touches You within, that is called _nirleypata_. 'You' are _Shuddhatma_ ; _Shuddhatma_ can never be affected, because the Self is not effective. But when an effect happens, it is due to weakness in Your awakened awareness ( _jagruti_ ). There You have to say, 'Chandubhai, why are you taking this on to yourself? What do you have to do with it?' This is all You have to say. Then it will become separate. 'You' have to keep that much awareness. Otherwise if you are not able to do anything else, then become free by saying, 'not mine'.

**Questioner** : Dada, such Gnan does prevail. 'Why did I get involved with this? This is relative'.

**Dadashri** : Even then it happens. When it happens, instead of saying 'relative', by saying 'not mine', everything will disconnect. What did we say? We said, 'this is Your state, and this is not'. So when You say, 'this is not mine.' then You become free. Then it will not stick to You at all.

**Questioner** : However much I become engrossed ( _tanmayata_ ) in things, there is that much weakness, right?

**Dadashri** : Yes, of course, that is it. So there is no other reason for the engrossment. The awakened awareness simply becomes dim. Why does the awareness dim? The answer is that it is due to previous practice. So You have to place an increased awareness in that so that it will becomes separate. No matter how bad my health becomes, people will say, 'today Dada your health is weak', and so I tell them, 'nothing has happened to me'. What can ever happen to Dada?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri** : I travel to so many towns, but nothing happens to me. What's going to happen? If you say, 'it is happening to me', then it will stick to you.

## House catches fire after it is sold

Once you decide that 'this business is not mine' then from that moment onwards, you remain very careful in your own business. You are not concerned about that other business. There you will not spend any more money towards it. Whatever you had spent on it before can be dealt with, but you will not do it any more. So You have said, 'sir, this is not my business; My business is this one.' The mind will turn from that moment onwards, will it not?

If a person's house were to burn down, he would suffer so much pain. But if he sold it today and got paid for it and the title deeds were turned over, then if the house were to burn down tomorrow, then what?

**Questioner** : Then he would not feel anything, Dada.

**Dadashri** : Is that so? The very same house? It is decided that you have sold the house and you have been paid for it. Then it does not matter if you do not have the money in your hands, 'but my house is sold' one will say. So the _chit_ will not be in the house. Then he will not cry. On the contrary, he will be happy that 'oh ho ho! I am very clever. Look after it is sold, I am not crying'. After it is sold, if the money is not in his hand, he will think 'what if there is a problem? It is sold, the deed is turned over but he has not paid for it yet. What if the buyer turns and will not give the money, then what? So he will start to have doubts. Once the money is in his hands, then there will be no complaints. For You, I have even placed the 'money' in your hands. I have given You everything in your hands. When You said, nothing more remains (after the Gnan _Vidhi_ ) that is when I set You free.

This is Mine and this is _parbharyu_ \- someone else's. What I believed to be mine; was a mistake. That mistake has been broken and so whatever there is in that, nothing of it is Mine (the Self). Whatever is there is exactly per his (self) account; whatever belongs to him, I give it to him and that is the end of it. I don't hassle with it anymore.

**Questioner** : So this is the relative business and this is the real business, so there is similarity between them, right?

**Dadashri** : It is similar. They do have a similarity! Before you were making the mistake and that is why you were taking all the beating – it was simply just that. Now the mistake is broken and so You no longer take the beating.

## The one who says 'not mine' is the winner in the end

Enjoy tea and snacks. Invite friends. Decorate the home too, do everything but if the house catches fire, then sit in a corner and say 'not mine' five thousand times and it will become disconnected.

**Questioner** : 'He is not mine, he is not mine!', but what about the husband saying, ' she's mine, she's mine' – what happens there?

**Dadashri** : Even then the one who says, 'not mine' becomes free.

**Questioner** : But the wife says, 'he is not mine, he is not mine,' and I say, 'she is mine, she is mine', so what happens here?

**Dadashri** : Even then the one who says 'not mine' will win. The one who says 'mine' cannot win. The one who says 'not mine' will win. When you sit together, _mamata_ (my-ness) arises and when you are away from each other, it vanishes. When he goes out alone; that 'myness' will become detached. In this manner that other practice will vanish.

Dramatic myness

**Questioner:** If someone has my-ness ( _mamata_ ) for me, what kind of effect does it have on me?

**Dadashri** : What effect is it going to have on You? It will have an effect on you if you get involved with it. If You do not pay attention to it, then nothing will happen. So no one can bother You, provided You are straightforward. 'You' don't get involved! So many people had so many _(bhaav_ ) feelings and intents for Lord Mahavir – but it would not work!

**Questioner** : I have wife and children so I have to keep worldly my-ness ( _mamata_ ) on them, do I not? If they have my-ness for me, I have to keep it too, no?

**Dadashri** : Even if you do not keep it, it is there. 'You' have to take it out; You have to get rid of _mamata_ , my-ness. _Mamata_ will be there without fail. Even dogs have _mamata_ for their 'little ones', but only until they are little puppies, once they grow up, they don't have any _mamata_.

**Questioner** : Do I have to keep it dramatic, like a drama?

**Dadashri** : Everything dramatic. There is _mamata_ with sixty thousand _mahatmas_ , of course it is there, but what is it like? There is myness but it is like in a play!

This world is a drama. "World is the drama itself". This drama has happened. One does myness in the drama. 'This is mine and this is yours!' There is nothing wrong with saying 'mine', but say it dramatically, like in a drama. Even when you get married, keep it dramatic. But here people truly get married. So then he has to become a widower. Then he has to grieve. So You should not do anything in a real manner. This is all a drama.

All day long, I am in a drama. What do I mean by 'drama'? I remain the Seer; I remain separate in all this. What happen in that drama of King Bhartruhari? The actor plays the part of King Bhartruhari, but if at that moment we were to ask him, 'who are you?' He will reply, 'I am Laxmichand. I never forget that and that I have to eat khichadi (simple basic food) – I don't forget that either'. 'I have to eat khichdi at home' will be in his awareness, no? You have to remain dramatic like this.

## Ownership but without mamata

Just as you play a role of a King Bhartruhari and say 'this is my queen' in a drama and after the play is over, if you ask her, 'let's go home', will she come with you? She will not, will she? This is how all this has happened. What is the ownership like in a drama? It is ownership ( _maliki_ ) without my-ness ( _mamata_ )! You will show her to the world and even say, 'this is my queen Pingda and this and that,' however it will be without my-ness; without any inner link of attachment. The Gnani Purush is in the ownership without any _mamatva_ , my-ness! You have to learn this by 'seeing' it in Him.

Those old habits that are there, you become a little slack and weak due to those past habits. Let the habit of drinking tea be there. Go ahead and drink tea. There is no problem with that, but 'know' (awakened awareness knowledge) and then drink! But here you become so engrossed in it; you become _bebhaan_ – totally unaware. That is what obstructs you.

There is no problem with having ownership ( _maliki_ ). When there si the sense of the _guruni_ (female spiritual master), there is ownership with _mamata_ my-ness. This is because _mamata_ will remain till the end. 'This is my monestary ( _oopashraya_ ), and this is mine, and these are my _shishyaas_ (female disciples) and this is my _cheli_ (female disciple). If all that is without any myness _mamatva_ , then there is no problem. One will say, 'my monastery,' but if they throw her out of the monastery; then there is no effect. This is not very difficult. People become the owners only. Take out this link of _mamata_ (my-ness), then keep the ownership.

**Questioner** : This my-ness ( _mamatva_ ) cannot be rid of without the Gnani Purush.

**Dadashri** : No it cannot be. But if you see someone who does not have any _mamatva_ , then you get the courage. How can you feel encouraged otherwise? If you see _mamatava_ gone in someone, that is when you feel encouraged that 'oh ho ho! He does not have it'. 'You' now have conviction ( _shraddha, pratiti_ ) that You have been pulled out of _mamata_ , and that very conviction will get rid of the _mamata_. 'You' will not have to do anything. After meeting the Gnani Purush, 'You' will not have to do anything.

## Beyond pleasure and pain

**Questioner:** Can one decrease the four _aghati_ karma, (karma which cannot be destroyed), namely _ayushya_ karma (lifespan-determining karma); _vedaniya_ , (karma of suffering of pain and pleasure); _naamroop_ , (name and form determining karma); _gotra_ , (worldly status determining karma), by doing self analysis?

**Dadashri:** One can decrease them in the sense that one is unaffected by them, like pleasure ( _shata_ ) would not 'touch-affect' as pleasure, and pain ( _ashata_ ) will not affect as pain. When 'we' have _shata_ _vedaniya_ , that which brings pleasure, 'we' keep 'our' Gnan present and say that 'this pleasure is not mine' so that the ghost of pleasure will not enter and if it is very hot outside then 'we' will say 'this is not 'our' (the Self) effect'. Either with _shata_ or _ashata_ 'that result (effect) is not mine', such awareness will arise promptly in 'our' Gnan.

When eating a sweet juicy mango; there is awareness that, 'this effect (pleasure of taste), is not mine'. The taste that arises gives rise to _shata vedaniya_ , suffering of pleasure, to 'it' (the non-Self complex). The Tirthankaras (the fully enlightened Ones), will never become one with the sufferer of the taste, not even for a second, not in anything whatsoever! So the Self is _avyaabaadha_ , beyond pain or pleasure. It is an attribute of the Self, which makes it neither the receiver nor the giver of pain or pleasure. That which affects the _avyaabaadha_ state, even to the slightest extent, is 'not mine'. When the slightest effect is known then speaking and affirming, 'this is of the non-Self; not mine, not mine' will immediately give rise to the separation of the Self from the non-Self. This is because the Self has been absolutely separated in the Gnan _Vidhi_. In instances where one does not have the energy to remain as the Knower-Seer ( _Gnata-Drashta_ ), then by saying, 'not mine', it separates! But if he does not say this, then it will 'attach' and it will feel like a burden, and then it will bother.

**Questioner:** And even in the worldy interactions, if I say ' I have nothing to do with it', then it makes a big difference.

**Dadashri** : Yes, if you say, 'I have nothing to do with it,' you will immediately be released. This is the same here (Self and non-Self separation level). If you don't know how to say, ' _parbharyu_ – load of another', then even upon saying 'it is not mine', it becomes _parbharyu_. Once you say 'not mine', it is over. If any difficulty arises for the ' _avayaabadha_ _swaroop_ – the state beyond pleasure and pain', then You should say 'not mine'. The Self's _avayaabadha svaroop_ does not go away even for a second.

## The Self and the non-Self

Except the Self (Atma), everything is subject to rot and decay. The Self never decomposes. When one becomes the Self, the work of human life gets done. One needs to become the Self, nothing else. The body may be cut or whatever may happen to it, You should not become the body-self. If one enters in the _para_ - _kshetra_ , the non-Self, then the world will feel like bitter poison. Now You should tell the body, 'if you want to leave then leave, I will stay in my home.' 'You' should not worry too much about it. For infinite lives, the body has been nursed and pampered like a new born. Surrender the body of this one life to the Gnani Purush, and if there is no further pampering, then the work is done. I have not pampered this body for even a second. Not for even a second do 'we' know, that 'this body is mine'. After the manifestation of this Gnan, this body is not 'ours'; it is of the non-Self. This property of the non-Self will not remain in our hand and 'we' do not even want it. That which is of the Self, is one's own, that which is of the non-Self, is of the non-Self.

We are watering other people's farms. Here we slog ourselves to death working hard and the water runs off into other people's farms. Nothing is growing in our own farm. People will even tell us, 'hey, you took the water out, so where is your water?' And we say, 'I don't know', and it has run off in some other farm. It runs of into someone else's farm. This is how the water is running into someones else's farm. From the moment we realize that this is someone else's farm, we relinquish our rights. So we should not take any harvest or anything similar from it. When we explain it to him, he will come around and say, 'yes, you are right.' But later his awareness goes away and he is back to where he was before!

## Whose intent of ownership is in this?

**Questioner:** Who has the ownership intent ( _maliki bhaav_ )?

**Dadashri** : Those who with the ego; the ego does. The one that says 'I' – it is his. When the 'I' sits in the wrong place, it means ownership. This ownership is for the body complex ( _pudgal_ ). And when the 'I' is in the right place, then the ownership will be for the attributes of the Self. Just sell off everything that does not belong to You, the Self, then if the property burns, you will not have any worries; there will be peace. Am I right or wrong?

**Questioner** : You are right. The feeling of ownership has come about due to the belief only, right? Only the belief needs to be changed, right?

**Dadashri** : Even the belief is not likely to turn so easily. Only when you actually count the money and take it, will the belief (of this is not my house anymore) change. If it were so easy to change the belief, then we can say, 'dear fellow just think that you sold the house yesterday.' But he is not likely to believe that. For that you will have to take the money and count it. Then it does not matter if that money gets spent in speculation in the stock market the next day; that is a different matter. But at least he will be convinved that he's been paid. The mind looks for closure. That other approach of make-believe will not bring closure. If right now you were to think 'I am married', does that mean that has happened? Can anything happen just because you believe it has? For that the mind will be satisfied only when you actually do get married. What do you think?

**Questioner** : You gave us the example of the home, that I sold it and took the money, and so I am satisfied that the house is no longer mine. And so it does not even hurt me, the my-ness is gone. So what is it like for us in the matter of the Self?

**Dadashri** : For that One becomes free when One really knows (exprerience) of what is under His ownership. Once He knows where His boundry lies, then He will not stick his hand in other person's boundary. He will keep the ownership of the non-Self, as long as he lacks the understanding. The minute He finds out, He will let go. Tell me where is your ownership?

**Questioner** : Ownership is according to what Dada has said that once the boundary of the Self is known one wound not have ownership of anything beyond that.

**Dadashri** : Just see and confirm the plot that You ae the owner of, and there see the exact boundary of the plot. Then what do You have to do with anything or anyone else's? For the One who has decided what is His, there will never be any my-ness _mamata_ anywhere. It has been decided that this part is of the _pudgal_ (the non-Self) and this is of the Self (Atma), so how can there be any my-ness?

## Myness is inversely proportional to Gnan

**Questioner:** When the karma was bound, one was involved in it but when the karma is being released, is he bound to remain involved in it?

**Dadashri** : No.

**Questioner** : At that time is it such that he can truly remain separate?

**Dadashri** : He can. In certain accounts, he can become free. Take away all that is of Your own, and clear out all that accounts that are mutually owned. In karma, there is joint ownership.

**Questioner** : So does the karma unfold along with the ownership?

**Dadashri** : The ownership taken during the unfolding karma will depend upon one's Gnan. If the Gnan is full, then He will pull away from all ownership of the non-Self. He will have ownership of the Self only, not of the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ).

**Questioner** : So when the karma starts to unfold, is one able to pull His ownership out of it?

**Dadashri** : Whatever the level of Gnan, the ownership will have been retracted by that amount for sure.

**Questioner** : But at the time of the unfolding karma, there is the presence of both (the Self and the non-Self), no? The Self will be present at the time the karma unfolds, no? In order for the karma to start unfolding?

**Dadashri** : You- the Self, have nothing to do with it. Just as even when you are sleeping, the sun will come out.

**Questioner** : So everything is separate; now, does a new intent of ownership enter in the current unfolding karma?

**Dadashri** :By whatever level the Gnan is lacking, that much feeling ( _bhaav_ ) of ownership will remain. 'I am _Shuddhatma_ and I am separate in this way', when You attained this Gnan then Your ownership became separate and whatever little weakness remains in that, that much ownership remains. But our Gnan of Akram Vignan is exact; it is in form of absolute Knowledge ( _keval Gnan_ ). So the exact separation will verily happen. Here worries will not arise, otherwise one cannot become free from worries. The Gnanis of the _kramik_ path will continue to have worries about worldly things.

## Now there is purification for the pudgal

**Questioner:** One is sentenced to prison as per his unfolding karma and to completely pull out ownership there, what kind of awareness must be there in the midst of it?

**Dadashri** : The intent of ownership ( _maliki bhaav_ ) has already been retracted. So now what is the _pudgal_ (non-Self complex) saying? It is saying, ' In order to settle the accounts, keep 'seeing' ( _joyaa kar_ ). Keep seeing what I am doing. What the mind is doing, what the intellect ( _buddhi_ ) is doing; keep 'seeing' all that. Nothing else is to be 'seen'. Don't forget to 'see' at that time; do not become unaware ( _ajagrut_ ). You remain in Your awareness and I will remain in my action ( _kriya_ )'. Each will remain in his own _kriya_ ( _function_ ). Then that unfolding karma has to be 'seen'. All the phases of the unfolding karma will have to be 'seen'. It will become pure ( _shuddha_ ) by simply 'seeing' it.

**Questioner** : One time it was mentioned by You that unfolding karma _udaya karma_ , is verily that in which one is engrossed.

**Dadashri** : Yes.

**Questioner** : And _purushartha_ is that where One separates from it.

**Dadashri** : He will become detached for sure. The moment You say, 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ', You are free. What does the _pudgal_ say? 'You have become _Shuddhatma_ but don't think that because of that, you have become free. You had defiled and ruined me and so now You will have to purify me so you can be free, and so can I' So if You ask, 'how can I set you free?', it will reply, 'whatever I do, You just 'see'. Do not interferene at all. Just keep 'seeing' without _raag_ - _dwesh_ (attachment-abhorrence); that is all. Then I will be free. I have become defiled because of _raag_ - _dwesh_ ; because of your _raag_ - _dwesh_. Now with _vitaragata_ (absence of attachment and abhorrence), I will become free.' The _parmanus_ (subatomic particles) will become pure. That which was filled in, will not refrain from coming out. _Puran_ , influx and _galan_ , output; nothing belongs to You. And that which is Yours; nothing charges or discharges from it; that is how pure ( _shuddha_ ) it is.

On what do you have an ownership for now? You do not have the _maliki bhaav_ intent of ownership over anything. This sense of ownership that you have for Me is not considered as ownership. Everyone has the right to have intents of ownership for 'me'. Here there is always attachment that leads to liberation ( _prashashta_ _raag_ ). And this kind of attachment is the very thing that will destroy all other kinds of attachment. All other types of attachment will leave when _prashashta raag_ is present. Otherwise if you did not have attachment here for the Gnani Purush, they would not leave.

**Questioner:** What is the definition of _vitarag_?

**Dadashri** : The one who has become completely separated from the body complex ( _deha, pudgal_ ) is a _vitarag_. All this is because of the body complex. In the worldly life, this body complex is the owner of everyone. When one becomes free from that owner, He becomes free from everything and so He becomes _vitarag_. Just as in worldly interactions, the belief (I am Chandulal, this is mine) is the owner, here (between the Self and the non-Self) the non-Self body complex is the owner, no?

**Questioner** : Meaning of this worldly life interaction? What did you say this body complex is the owner of?

**Dadashri** : The body complex is the owner, no? Who else is there?. When You become free from it, You are free. The One who becomes free from this body, becomes free from everything. The body is the owner of everything.

**Questioner** : So can the body be called the medium of all worldly interaction with this world? Is that what You are saying?

**Dadashri** : The body verily is the owner, who else? The body only; it is what we refer to as _dehadhyas_ , 'I am this body'. Really 'one-he' is not even the owner of this body; that verily is the wrong belief.

**Questioner:** Whom do you mean, when you say 'one-he'?

**Dadashri** : The self. Up until now whomever you considered your self (worldly self).

**Questioner** : If there is no ownership of the body complex, then does it mean that one has not taken any support ( _avlumban_ ) from the body complex?

**Dadashri** : Dependency is from only the worldly perspective, no? There is nothing of the sort from the Vision of the Self ( _nischaya_ ). We are in the worldly life only and we have the conviction ( _pratiti_ ) of the _nischaya_ , the Self. But we are living in the worldly life, no? We eat, we drink; for Us it has been decided who 'we' are. But it is not complete. We have not given up possession. Can we give up possession? When all possession is surrendered, then nothing will be left. Then 'we' will become free from all dependency ( _avlumban_ ).

**Questioner** : Complete freedom from dependency will happen when One goes to the _Siddhakshetra_ , the abode of all absolutely liberated Souls.

**Dadashri** : How can one go as long as he has not given up possession? Even Lord Mahavir went there when He gave up possession. For 72 years, the 'place' he had rented, he vacated, He paid off the rent. He vacated the place and gave it back.

**Questioner** : So Lord Mahavir stayed in a 'rental place' for 72 years, what did He do while He was renting it?

**Dadashri** : Slowly and gradually He kept retracting the ownership. When all ownership was promptly relinquished, He departed. Those who have retracted ownership will walk forward; they just simply surrender ownership. When ownership is given up, people will take it (body) and cremate it. Whatever rubbish there is without any ownership, 'we' – (the Self) do not have to burn it. People will automatically burn it, no?

**Questioner** : The One who lives in it will not burn it?

**Dadashri** : How can the Occupant burn it? The One who lived in it has gone with a lot of ceremony, along with four coconuts, whether they have water in them or not!

How many years have You rented it? Why not live for a hundred years or so, for the purpose of salvation of the world! Is that right or wrong? This desire does exist in these people to do salvation of the world ( _jagat kalyan_ ). If One turns in this direction (towards _jagat kalyan_ ), He will make tremendous accomplishment.

# [6] Anger

## Stored anger becomes empty!

**Questioner:** The settlement of file does not happen and anger ( _krodha_ ) happens with the file.

**Dadashri** : That anger will happen. It is the stored baggage within. You-the Self have to know that the anger is happening to Chandubhai. It is stored within, no? You have to tell Chandubhai, 'Dear man, why are you doing this?' But it is better if this stored baggage empties out. If the stored baggage empties out, then everything will be resolved. The anger is stored in the tank. If you don't take it out, it will ruin things even more. What's wrong if it is coming out on its own? Let it come out, even if it stinks. So it must all come out. 'You' are able to know right away, no?

**Questioner** : Right away. Therefore, it feels that it is not mine.

**Dadashri** : Yes, that's it! You have to keep 'seeing' it. Even greed ( _lobha_ ), You will know. Nothing is spoiled. All this will improve as days go by. All the mistakes will be seen increasingly in Gnan.

**Questioner** : Whenever the file comes, he (Chandulal) gets angry with the file and after the task is completed, the awareness comes that wrong thing happened.

**Dadashri** : Yes but before taking this Gnan, did you ever have this awareness ( _khyal_ ) that the wrong thing had happened?

**Questioner** : No.

**Dadashri** : Yes, you did not, that means that there is someone else in this. That fact has been decided, no? That verily is the Atma – the Self. It is the _pranyashakti_ (liberating energy of the Self) that is showing You (the awakened Self) the error. It is the energy of the Self, that is such. Until You attain _moksha_ , the _pragnyashakti_ does the work; that is the Atma – the Self.

## After Gnan, the kashaya are of the non-Self

**Questioner:** Once one enters and remains the Self ( _swaroop_ ), then no more anger, pride, illusory attachment ( _maya_ ) or anything else will happen, right?

**Dadashri** : Anger-pride-deceit-greed are attributes of the _pudgal_ (the non-Self complex); the Self does not have such attributes at all. Therfore they are not Your attributes. So why should You take on the responsibility for them? All that increase and decrease are attributes of the _pudgal_. And that which never increases or decreases, never becomes fat, skinny, short, tall, heavy or light, is the attribute of the Self. All else is _pudgal_.

**Questioner** : The Self remains in its own nature ( _swabhaav_ ) , so  
what does it think of interation with everyone else?

**Dadashri** : No other interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) can happen. The interaction that happens is the Self's natural one only. Whatever is the attribute of anything; only that much of interaction can happen. Knower-Seer ( _Gnata Drashta_ ) and in eternal bliss ( _param anand_ )– that is the attribute of the Self and so it's 'interaction' is going to be verily that. There can never be any other interaction, right? _Vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) is a _vadgan_ – that which possesses; that which seizes and takes control.

Here when one takes Gnan from 'Us', for him, anger-pride-deceit-greed are attributes of the non-Self complex ( _pudgal_ ) and for those who have not taken Gnan, they are the attributes of the self (worldly self). In fact they are not of the Self. But the one who says, 'I am Chandulal', he claims to be who he is not, so even these attributes are not his, but he takes them on as his.

So it is like that. If one takes Gnan from 'Us' and remains in Our Agnas, then even if anger-pride-deceit-greed happen, they do not touch You; nothing happens and the equanimity of the Self ( _samadhi_ ) never leaves.

## Freedom from kashaya in the Akram Path

In the time that has passed since taking Gnan, how much of the uprising of _kashaya_ that used to happen has stopped for you! Has it not stopped up to a certain extent?

**Questioner** : More than fifty percent.

**Dadashri** : Now to the cessation of this uprising is called _mukti_ – liberation. Then nothing will remain within, so this path of liberation of ours is very beautiful. In one or two life times, it will solve everything!

**Questioner** : Dada I can see the results. I experience that the _kashayas_ (anger-pride-deceit-greed) have become weak.

**Dadashri** : No, not weak; You have become free from _kashayas_.

**Questioner** : To say that I are completely free is a little too much.

**Dadashri** : Of course You can say it! It is not too much.

**Questioner** : The weakness of _kashayas_ is definitely being experienced.

**Dadashri** : Look, if you are Chandubhai then there is weakness of _kashayas_ and if You are _Shuddhatma_ , then You are free from _kashayas_.

**Questioner** : Yes, that is right. So from that perspective, I am free from _kashayas_.

**Dadashri** : If you are Chandubhai, then there is weakness. The weakeness is of Chandubhai and it is in the form of discharge and there is no escaping discharge. Now anger-pride-deceit-greed has gone away from You. Nothing remains within You at all. 'You' have become pure ( _shuddha_ ). Now whatever baggage there is in Chandubhai, will continue to discharge. Now charging of new baggage has stopped. So the baggge that is stored will continue to discharge. It is that discharge baggage that is coming out. In that you may feel that there is anger-prided-deceit-greed but really it is not anger-prided-deceit-greed. It is discharge _bhaav_ ( _kashaya_ ). When Chandubhai gets mad with someone and gets angry it is a discharge; it is not a charge. This is a science. One only needs to understand the science. Thereafter not even a moment of worry or any effect of external problems ( _upadhi_ ) will arise ; this science is without _upadhi_!

## Anger is charge and gusso is discharge

When Chandubhai (file one, non-Self complex) 'does' _gusso_ (anger without violent intent), 'he-the awakened Self' feels remorse from within 'why is this happening, why does this happen?' 'He' does not like it and yet it keeps happening. It happens, because it is an effect. Do You like it at that moment? No You don't like it. And so You remains separate. 'You' do not like it and yet this keeps happening. There is not a single opinion of 'Yours' in it, 'You' do not agree with it. The Self has become separate. Before when there was oneness with it (Chandubhai, non-Self), there was anger there. Where there is intention to hurt ( _himsakbhaav_ ),that is called anger. And where there is no intention to hurt, it means the Self is separate. When the Self does not like it; it cannot be called anger ( _krodha_ ).

_Shuddhatma_ does not have _gusso_ at all! _Gusso_ comes to whom? _Gusso_ comes to Chandubhai; and You, the Self, do not become engrossed in it and therefore it cannot be called anger _krodha_ ; it is called _gusso_. _Gusso_ is bound to happen. That _gusso_ is stored within and it will not refrain from discharging, will it? Anger ( _krodha_ ) must not happen. Anger happens when the self gets engrossed with it – that is called anger.

_Gusso_ is a discharge; _krodha_ (anger) is a charge. There is no choice in the discharge that is happening, is there?

## Taap

**Questioner:** Now, when my children become mischievious I cannot do _gusso_ (become angry) even when I want to.

**Dadashri** : No, but there is no need at all! When you do not do _gusso_ , then your _taap_ (the energy of the one without _kashaya_ which impresses and awes others) will increase. Here when I do not do _gusso_ , my _taap_ increases; everyone around feel a tremendous _taap_ and _gusso_ is an obvious weakness. This _taap_ is such that it will radiate on its own'. There is no need to do _gusso_ ; they feel the _taap_.

**Questioner** : Dada before I used to have _gusso_ but now it does not happen, even when I try to do it.

**Dadashri** : Yes, then that is considered as emerging _sheel_ so then the others feel the _taap_ (the energy of the one without _kashaya_ which impresses and awes others). _Prataap_ (high level of _taap_ ) will arise in sich a One. When one has _krodha_ (anger), there is leakage of energies and so he becomes useless and when a person has a lot of anger, he is finished. When one becomes _krodhit_ entire bodycomplex becomes angry, he even starts to shake. That is such tremendous weakness and what must Lord Mahavir be like that even when others were hitting him, cursing and swearing at him, there was no reaction in Him. That is what we have to 'see' and become.

When someone has _gusso_ (as _mahatma_ ) and does _pratikraman_ for it, it means the gusso is not happening to Him-the awakened Self. The Self is separate and _gusso_ is separate. Despite having this Gnan, He makes Chandubhai do _pratikraman_. What happens with _pratikraman_ is that not even the least of karma error-impurity will stick to Him.

## Taanto: the link of continuity of kashaya

Here in Akram there is the experience of the Self every second. When Chandubhai get upset with someone, what does the _Atma_ the Self within say? 'It should not be like this.' Therefore the Self remains separate for sure and that verily is the experience of the Self ( _Atmanubhav_ ). And whatever Chandubhai is doing is separate and this too is separate, can You not see the separation between the two?

**Questioner** : That I can see.

**Dadashri** : Before you used to be one ( _ek-akar_ – to take on being the form and shape of-) with it, the moment anger arose; you immediately became one with it in the mind. And that is why one can never stop one's own anger. This here after Gnan, cannot be called anger, _krodha_. Now anger-pride-deceit-greed no longer remain with You-the Self, at all. That which happens to Chandubhai, cannot be considered as anger-pride-deceit-greed by law. And why is that? The answer is that the definition of anger ( _krodha_ ) is that it is always associated with hurtful intent ( _himsak_ _bhaav_ ) and it is associated with link of continuity ( _taanto_ ).

_Taanto_ means when you have a disagreement with the wife at night, when she serves you tea in the morning, she will bang the cup slightly. That is called _taanto_. The link from the night is still there. Then you too will speak with _taanto_ , 'Huh! You still haven't shaped up!' – all that is called _taanto_. Now, after Gnan, if you have a quarrel at night, there is nothing in the morning. It will be forgotten. There will no _taanto_ with her. Otherwise with _taanto_ , if someone did you wrong fifteen years ago and you have forgotten about it, but say you go to Bharooch and you see him in the market at Bharooch, you will immediately remember the _taanto_ (link). So a _taanto_ will never go away. And here there is no such _taanto_.

Now what is the sign that anger-pride-deceit-greed are gone? The answer is that _taanto_ no longer remains for us; otherwise it would not go even after forty years. Here even if someone were to insult us, even the next day there would be no _taanto_ for us. Even if he is terribly disrespectful, there would be no _taanto_ , whereas with the other, even if someone does something very trivial, the _taanto_ would not go away even after forty years. The moment he sees that person, he would immediately remember 'here comes that man!' And now if there was any quarrel at night, there would be no _taanto_ for him in the morning. Does a _taanto_ remain for You? So there would be no _taanto_ of greed, _taanto_ of _krodha_ anger; there is no kind of _taanto_ at all. For Us, there is no _taanto_ at all. He becomes straightforward ( _sarad_ ), as if nothing happened last night. That very night of the quarrel, the file will be settled with equanimity. No _taanto_ would remain.

The Lord has verily called _taanto_ as anger-pride-deceit-greed. If there is _taanto_ , then there is anger-pride-deceit-greed and if there is no _taanto_ , then they are non-living attributes. So _taanto_ remains for those who have illusory vision ( _mithyatva_ ). All worldly people have _mithyatva_ _tanto_ , _taanto_ due to illusory vision, whereas for You, a _samyak taanto_ , a link of the Vision as and of the Self, has taken over; it is always _samyak_. A _taanto_ of _kshayak darshan_ , eternal right Vision has become established and that is why the other _taanto_ is gone. Now You have this _taanto_ and that is why You remember the Self more. Where there is a _taanto_ , there is the self there. That is why this entire _kshayak darshan,_ eternal vision as the Self has been established, so constantly there will remain a linkof and with the Self. There will constantly be a 'wire' that links.This is called _kshayak samkit,_ eternal vision as the Self. That is why this conviction ( _pratiti_ ) is called a _taanto_. The conviction will always be there. The conviction of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' constantly remains.

## The part that does anger is separate and the Self is separate

No matter how angry Chandulal is getting, if the awarenss-sense (bhaan), 'it is happening to me' does not arise for You, then You are not liable. Such is this science _Vignan_. 'You' must remain absolutely certain and assured in this, and if at that time anyone gets hurt, then You have to say, 'Chandubhai, do _pratikraman_ , why did you do _atikraman_?' 'You' are separate and Chandubhai is separate. One is doing the anger and the other One is saying 'no' to it. The part that is saying 'no' is the part of the Self and the one doing the anger is the part of the _pudgal_.

**Questioner** : All that comes in awareness _khyal_.

## The definition of exact awareness

**Dadashri:** So even though there is anger ( _krodha_ ) in everyone (those who have taken Gnan), 'we-Dadashri' say it is gone. Why do 'we' say this? What is it called anger? When one becomes engrossed ( _tanmayakar_ ) with the anger, then it is called anger. Otherwise it is not called anger. If the self becomes engrossed with it, then the other person will be hurt, but not otherwise.

Now there are two kinds of engrossment – ( _tanmayakar_ ). The main absolute Self never becomes engrossed at all. The Self ( _Shuddhatma_ ) that I have given You, never becomes engrossed. But when the _pratishthit atma_ (the one used to believe 'I am Chandubhai' yet continues to behave now as Chandubhai) becomes _tanmayakar_ engrossed, then the other person feels hurt. When the _pratishthit atma_ (discharging self) becomes involved, the interaction result becomes ugly. Otherwise why would the other person find it so ugly? Even the _pratishthit atma_ must not become engrossed in it. That is where You have to maintain awareness ( _jagruti_ ).

'We-Dadashri' reprimand some persons, 'we' scold some persons, we do everything, but no one gets hurt. Our words never put a dent in anyone's sense of the self, whereas the anger of these people will even burn the other person completely! The Gnani's words will not put the slightest dent in anyone. People come out without being hurt at all, even though 'we' tell them off!

# [7] Saiyam

## Saiyam with asaiyami is true saiyam

Now, who can be called a _saiyami_ (without anger-pride-deceit-greed)? It is one who does not hurt even in the least, the other person, who is _asaiyami_ (with anger-pride-deceit-greed). That poor person is _asaiyami_ for sure, the moment one is in the world of duality, 'I am low, you are high.' _Saiyami_ has no pain and the _asaiyami_ has pain ( _dukha_ ). Therefore the custom of 'ours' (all in Akram Vignan) is that the _asaiyami_ must not get hurt. Is that a good rule?

People today act in such a way, that they end up hurting the other person, without fail. It takes no time at all! And if someones says anything to them, they too feel hurt. So always, a person who is hurting within will hurt others. You (the Self) do not have any pain or hurt. So howcan You hurt anyone? You (the Self) do not have pain at all. 'You' do not have any hurt, do You?

**Questioner:** No, I don't have any pain at all.

**Dadashri** : So then what is the reason for hurting anyone? You have make him happy.

Othewise if you simply claim, 'I have _saiyam_ ', that kind of _saiyam_ will not do.

You all have to keep that as Your goal. For Me that goal has been realized but if someplace if there is a little weakness, I make the adjustments. Sometimes a little weakness can set in. Can there be closure ( _samadhan_ ) in every matter? Oh! The different kinds of 'brains' that come here! But we have to remain focus on the goal of not hurting anyone to the slightest extent. Yes this this truly is Your goal but sometimes a mistake happens. But your _bhaavna_ desire and intent is just this; that is why 'we' are referring to You as a _saiyami_ , (One who having attained the Self in Akram Vignan has now the intent not to hurt anyone). The fact that mistakes happens is a different matter but what is Your _bhaavna_ (intent in discharge)? In the ' _saiyam_ ' of today, people do not even have such _bhaavna_.

## Even the offender is seen faultless

When someone insults with a curse, at that moment all one's spiritual study ( _swadhyaya_ ) is set ablaze. The Lord has said 'no' to such spiritual study and practice. First one must put in place a safety fence. Otherwise, one has done _swadhyaya_ for infinite lives, anyway! Despite an entire's day worth of external restraints _saiyam_ , even just one insult will not let him sleep the whole night long. _Mooah!_ (the dying one) – just let go of this hassle! What have you have done in all that? How much of your precious life has gone in vain! So the Lord has said 'no' to this. The Lord is saying something different. The Lord says, 'become _saiyami_ ' (without _kashaya_ ).

_Saiyami_ is he who, inspite of receiving insults and curses, will see the other person _nirdosh_ , flawless. No one will appear as _doshit_ , at fault to him!

This man here; was hit by a person on a scooter, and his leg got fractured. So the poor man on the scooter got very scared (In India people get very angry when pedestrians are hit, regardless of who is at fault). People around grabed him. At that moment, this gentleman had awareness of Gnan. He told the people to let him go. He told them to keep him completely safe and to let him go. He pleaded with everyone to let the man go otherwise they would have beaten him up. Now this is called _saiyam_. This is the greatest _saiyam_. This kind of _saiyam_ will make a person a _Paramatma_ \- the absolute Self. From the Self he becomes absolute Self _Paramatma_. For You (speaking to this _mahatma_ ), not even your thoughts were spoilt, right?

**Questioner** : No, not at all Dada.

**Dadashri** : This is the only way a man can become a _Paramatma_!

## The karma settles only with saiyam

Only when there is _saiyam_ , can we say ' _nikali_ ' (discharge karma that has settled with equinimity), otherwise it cannot be called as discharge, can it? First there is _saiyam_ and then there is discharge. Without _saiyam_ , there can never be _moksha_ , right? Discharge is always in the presence of _saiyam_ ( _saiyam_ - _purvak_ ). For the person for whom the word 'discharge' is applicable, know that he is doing so with _saiyam_ and then if anyone gets hurt, then You have to tell Chandubhai, 'why do you behave in a way that hurts the other person? So do _pratikraman_ '.

If anger happens, it can be 'turned around' ( _nivaran_ ), because it is a discharging baggage. So no consequences of karma are incurred. But when the other person is hurt you need to settle up the account by that much; you have to do that much _pratikraman_.

Only if there is _saiyam_ , is the anger settling down ( _nikali krodha_ ), otherwise anger is not settled. There are two kinds of anger, one is a settling anger and the other is real anger that does not setle. _Nikali_ _krodha_ means life (ego) has departed from it and the other anger has life (ego) in it! When anger comes to you, do you not feel from withthin that 'it should not be so'?

**Questioner** : Yes, I feel very bad and that the wrong thing has happened.

**Dadashri** : When that happens, there is _saiyam_ going on and this anger is the external part, playing its role. You are doing _saiyam_ on that by saying, 'this should not be so'. Whatever goods are in the external part, the 'tank', is discharging, is coming out. That is when he does not like it and he says 'it should not be this way; this does not look good'.

## Opinion that becomes separate from prakruti is saiyam

_Saiyam_ means whatever Chandubhai is doing; if he is doing something that hurts someone, despite that if Your opinion is completely contrary, that is called _saiyam_. If Chandubhai is cursing someone, Your opinion is completely different that, 'this should not be so. Why are you saying such things?' So when it prevails ( _vartey_ ) as if the two, are completely separate, that is called _saiyam_.

Do You remain in _saiyam_ properly? Good then. We need _saiyam_ ; that is all. There is _moksha_ with _saiyam_. You will not be agreeable with whatever Chandubhai is doing; so Your opinion will be separate, no? If Chandubhai gets upset with someone, You-the Self, don't like it, do you? There is restlessness within, no? That is _saiyam_. _Saiyam_ is when Your opinion becomes separated from the opinion of _prakruti_ non-self complex

## There is no saiyam where there is dehadhyas, the belief of 'I am Chandulal'

The Lord has said that where there is _dehadhyas_ (I am Chandubhai; I am this body and I am the doer), there is no _saiyam_ there and where there is _saiyam_ , there is no _dehadhyas_. Despite this, just look at the kind of language they use for defining _saiyam_ nowadays!

**Questioner** : Is it _saiyam_ to remain as Knower–Seer ( _Gnata_ - _Drashta_ )?

**Dadashri** : No. To remain as Knower-Seer is not _saiyam_ ; remaining as Knower-Seer is Gnan. To remain in the Knower-Seer state is the ultimate level; that is called Gnan. And what does _saiyam_ mean? _Saiyam_ is when _artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_ (adverse meitation which hurts the self and adverse meditation that hurts the self and others, respectively) stop. The Lord has not called _dehadhyas_ as _saiyam_. The Lord does not consider this as _saiyam_. _Saiyam_ is present when there is no _dehadhyas_.

Here they themselves say that they believe in _dehadhyas_ ; they say, 'we believe only in _dehadhyas_ ', but they do not use the word ' _dehadhyas_ '. What do they say? Leave all that is harmful and sinful and do what is helpful and good. To 'do good' is _dehadhyas_. On the contrary they have increased _dehadhyas_ ; it was less and they increased it. Now, all this cannot be understood, can it? How can one understand it at a time? The Gnani Purush's Vision can 'see' everything in a second. It can do plus-minus and come to the main point, because the Vision has become pure ( _nirmal drashti_ ). Here in the world, there is no _saiyam_ , is there? And yet people will say, ' _Saiyami_ has come'. That is a worldly _saiyam_. The Lord does not accept the _saiyam_ that people have accepted. The Lord accepts the _saiyam_ of our _mahatmas_ , as _saiyam,_ because even when anger happens and there is _saiyam_. There is _saiyam_ even in _asaiyam_ (absence of _saiyam_ ).

**Questioner** : Many people will comment, 'what change has taken place in your conduct?'

**Dadashri** : 'I-Gnani Purush' do not have to consider that conduct. When _asaiyam_ happens, You are able to see _saiyam_ – we are able to see that this _saiyam_ has departed. 'You' will continue to to feel that You are in _saiyam_. Chandubhai is in _asaiyam_ and You are in _saiyam_.

For 'us' (the Gnani) practically all of it has been cleared . There is _saiyam_ outside and also _saiyam_ within. Otherwise our 'Gnanis ( _mahatmas_ )' will say, 'Dada, then what is the difference between You and us?'

**Questioner** : How can I tell whether My awareness ( _jagruti_ ) is adequate or not?

**Dadashri** : That You can tell again and again from Your _saiyam_. If someone comes along and tells you-Chandubhai, 'this child you are teaching, you are doing a very bad job of it; you are doing it all wrong'. If he blames you like this directly, then at that time you will blame him in return. 'You' will know that Chandubhai became _asaiyami_. The One who 'knows' that Chandubhai became _asaiyami_ ; that Knower is _saiyami_. So can You or can You not tell whether this awareness is there or not? When someone swears at you, You will 'know' in Your awareness. Or else if you dressed up nicely to go to a wedding and someone spits on you, then the awareness of 'do not attack the evidentiary doer ( _nimit_ )' will arise within. If Chandubhai does happen to attack the _nimit_ , then even at that time within You 'feel', 'this should not be so'. That verily is awareness ( _jagurti_ ) and that verily is _saiyam_. To 'see' _asaiyam_ is verily _saiyam._

## Real saiyam is the saiyam of kashaya

**Questioner:** Dada, when the inner heat begins, is that first the _tapa_ (inner penance which results in 'burning or heat') happens within, then and the _saiyam_ arises?

**Dadashri** : _Saiyam_ started verily the moment You became _Shuddhatma_ and Chandubhai separated from You.

**Questioner** : The penance ( _tapa_ ) too will arise when the circumstances ( _saiyogo_ ) arise, right?

**Dadashri** : That is when penance arises. But as for _saiyam_ ; it has already begun. Everyone ( _mahatmas_ ) is a _saiyami_. This _saiyam_ started from the moment You were given Gnan; You became _saiyami_ from that moment onwards.

To see and take anger-pride-deceit-greed in _saiyam_ (to remain in equanimity against them) is _saiyam._ Otherwise the entire world is bound by anger-pride-deceit-greed and these very _kashayas_ constantly gives them pain ( _dukha_ ). God does not give any pain. So when there is _saiyam_ of anger-pride-deceit-greed; that is when it is considered as _saiyam_. When there is _saiyam_ of the ego; that is called _saiyam_. When does _saiyam_ of the ego happen? When one attains the awareness of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ '. Until then there can be no _saiyam_ , no? But according to worldly view it can be said that 'this man is a _saiyami_ '. In worldly interaction we can say, 'here comes a _saiyami_ ', but truly that is not _saiyam_.

## Saiyam is when there is no artadhyan or raudradhyan

**Questioner:** What is this, 'to become angry'?

**Dadashri** : That is the _prakruti_ ; You, the Self have to 'see' it. That too is a _saiyam_ of a kind but one will feel that it is not good. There when You follow the Agnas, _saiyam_ will arise. That _saiyam_ is verily the _purushaarth_. So that on the basis of which the _artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_ that go away in our Akram Vignan is _saiyam_. The definition of _saiyam_ is where _artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_ do not happen.

Anger-pride-deceit-greed is happening to Chandubhai, but the Self feels it should not be so. As the Self, You feel that 'this should not be so'. Both these _kriya_ (individual functions of the Self and the non-Self) are happening simultaneously. Chandubhai is getting angry and You 'feel' within that, 'this should not be so'. Two _kriyas_ are taking place at the same time – that is called _saiyam_. There is _saiyam_ on top of _asaiyam_ ( _kashaya_ ); that is called _saiyam_. What happens to the worldly people? There is _asaiyam_ on top of _asaiyam_. So the point is short and simple, but without this understanding everything is being ruined.

## Five Agnas – that verily is saiyam

_Kshayak_ _samkit_ , eternal vision as the Self, means a consant prevalence of inner _saiyam_. There is no need for external (visible in conduct) _saiyam_. On the outside there is _charitra-moha_ , _vartan-moha_ (illusory attachment in discharging conduct). So that _moha_ (illusion in discharge) will not refrain from manifesting. You have no choice but wear glasses, wear a watch, wear a shirt, comb your hair but the internal _moha_ must go away.

Whatever baggage that belongs to Chandubhai; whether it is of _saiyam_ or _asaiyam_ ; to 'see' it with _vitarag bhaav_ (without attachment or abhorrence) is called _saiyam_. If Chandubhai is getting agitated, Y should not get agitated with him; You just have to 'see' it. And at the most You may say, 'this does not look good'. Such an intent remains within; it is not necessary for You to say anthing.

'Our' five Agnas – is verily absolute constant inner _saiyam_. Provided you are able to follow them completely and ideally, otherwise if Your following them is incomplete, then it is less than ideal. These five Agnas are the very reason that inner _saiyam_ prevails for everyone. Regardless of what the file is like, the _mahatmas_ do nothing but settle all the files with equanimity. How much _saiyam_ is needed to settle files with equanimity? This inner _saiyam_ will always remain!

After attaining this Gnan and becoming _Shuddhatma_ You are called _saiyami_. Now You are considered _saiyami_. Worldly people will make statements such as, 'you have not changed your clothes (clothes of a renunciate), you still have a wife, you have this or that' they will give you all kinds of excuses. But for our _mahatmas_ , _saiyam_ prevails constantly. So the inner _saiyam_ will remain, not the outer _saiyam_. So when You follow the five Agnas, in that, You constantly are in inner _saiyam_. That _saiyam_ will take You towards _moksha_. And outer _saiyam_ will bring worldly pleasures. Both types of _saiyam_ are beneficial, but with the latter you will get worldly pleasures, whereas the other will give You liberation. Where there is inner _saiyam_ ; the outer may or may not be there – there is no problem with that. There is a problem if there is outer _saiyam_ but no inner _saiyam_. This can never happen. Such time does not come. Otherwise those who have outer _saiyam_ will not get anywhere. Inner _saiyam_ will give _moksha_ , outer _saiyam_ will give the worldly life ( _sansaar_ ), but it is like shackles of gold! _Question for Pujya Deepakbhai gp286, para4, end._

**Questioner:** But the worldly people make a different meaning of _saiyam_. It is to bring some control; to bring on control over one's tendencies ( _vruti_ ).

**Dadashri** : No that is _hathayoga_ (to unite mind speech and body and then insist through ego). That is nothing but forcing the mind. Here one is not able to become free from the addiction of this pinch of snuff, this liitle beetlenut, so where is he going to go with _saiyam_? They are doing the ego of it – that is all. _Saiyam_ should appear completely different. Anything that is done through the ego; it cannot be called _saiyam_.

What is our _saiyam_ – it is one where if we are not able to remain in Gnan, we make the attempt to remain in the five Agnas – that is called _saiyam_. So to stop anger-pride-deceit-greed – that is called _saiyam_. If we remain in Gnan, then anger-pride-deceit-greed will stop.

## Complete saiyam is natural with Self-realization

If just once someone hurls a hurtful word at you and You keep _saiyam_ ; the Lord calls that as pure _saiyam_. The Lord is hungry for pure _saiyam_. Just try it once; it will carry You many steps higher. Just with 'doing' _saiyam_ once, You will climb ten to twenty steps effortlessly; that is called the elevator path! Then You will realize, 'oh ho ho! Where was I and how far I have reached?'

Now it is possible for You to 'do' _saiyam_. You have such a Gnan whereby You will be able to 'do; _saiyam_ very well. And if just once You have done the _saiyam_ in exactness, it will carry You so many steps. You will wonder 'where is this fragrant air coming from when before it was foul-smelling?' As You climb higher, the more fragrant the air will become. Do changes not happen in the air? Do You come across such steps of fragrance? You have a lot of _saiyam_ that comes along, no? Many stations of _saiyam_ come, no?

# [8] Penance for moksha

## Penance in Kaliyug while sitting at home

What do the writers of scriptures say and what do those who guide people do? They make you increase the 'business'. They tell you to do penance _tapa_ , do _japa_ repetitive name chanting . Which penance did the Lord say for us to do? He said that in Kaliyug (current era of the Time cycle) one should do the penance that presents itself while he is sitting at home. This penance that comes for free, who would let it go? If you are sitting in a bus with five hundred rupees in one pocket and eleven hundred in the other pocket, and someone picked the pocket with eleven hundred rupees, the inner tendencies will start screaming, 'I have to give three hundred to him and I will have to give him five hundred.' When You are trying to deal with the situation with equanimity, what do the inner tendencies _vrutis_ say to You? They will tell You, 'No, no, why are you dealing with it with equanimity?' That is when You have to do _tapa_ penance. The inner core _hridaya_ will burn red hot from within. 'You' have to 'see' all that. There will a lot of uneasiness and agitation inside you. However, You should understand that you are not as upset as yesterday. And then, when you are less upset, know that it has decreased. As it is being acquired _grahan_ , You will know that acquisition is increasing and increasing. And once having increased, as it goes decreases, You should say, 'Now it is becoming free from acquisition. Now let us do it all after an hour.' But, You know that You will be free from this _tapa_ penance, even after an hour it will be over. Yes, the core within will heat up to red hot level. When it starts heating up within for the people of the world, it becomes intolerable and therefore they counter attack. You will not do any attack on the person who apparently hurt you. By attacking the inner heating process of penance shuts off. So it is tantamount to taking out a new loan and paying the old one. And this penance is to pay off the old loan without taking out a new one. It becomes difficult, no? It becomes difficult.

One gentleman from America asked me, 'When does one have to do more penance _tapa_?' I told him, 'The day you lose your job!' It does not take long for one to lose his job in America, and therefore on that day real _tapa_ penance comes. It heats up a lot within on that day, to the point where sleep does not come in the night. It heats up but yet there is no attack. No attack in the mind, with the mind, no attack through the hand, and no attack through speech. None of these three kinds of attacks. How many kinds of attacks will a person resort to if he does not have this Gnan? He will attack with his mind, lying in bed, he will say, 'I will do this, and I will do that.'

**Questioner** : Physical or verbal attacks may not happen but mental attacks happen readily.

**Dadashri** : Do _pratikraman_ if that happens. Actually it would not happen, but when it heats up a lot, mental attacks will happen, so then just do _pratikraman_. This is called right penance _samyak_ _tapa_. You have to keep doing penance of the type, which is without any interference from anyone (within). Such penance comes to everyone; they have no choice. Do they? Once the inner heat has been 'seen' on a specific matter, and once that penance _tapa_ has been completed and thus gone, you will not have to 'do' that penance again. Therefore, as the number of penance decrease, that much _nivedo_ final work has been attained.

Most of my penance has gone away. 'I' do not have any penance. I too had penance, and I am 'showing you-how to deal with' the penance. No attack. No mental attack, no physical attack, no verbal attack. People attack in all these three ways so that they do not have to do any penance.

_Adeetha_ invisible _tapa_ penance means that, say you loaned a hundred thousand rupees to a certain person only a month ago and he goes bankrupt. The moment you hear of the news, _tapa_ inner heat will start within you. At that time You should 'do' the _tapa_. You and you— _apney_ should do the penance, maintain equanimity _samata_ and do _pratikraman_ for any bad thoughts towards him that arise, so then you will be clear. Such 'clearance' will have an effect on him.

_Artadhyan_ (internal adverse meditation that hurts only the self) and _raudradhyan_ (adverse internal meditation that hurts the self and others) will not happen and penance _tapa_ will begin. Those who have not attained Gnan; they will have _artadhyan_ and _raudradhyan_. Whereas this penance really heats up, it really heats up! So therefore for you all, when someone insults you, then the penance heats up.

The Gnani Purush will give all the clarification. In this time of Kaliyug , suffer the penance that presents itself before you. If you suffer the _tapa_ penance that comes to you, it is more than enough. But one does not do that, and quarrels and attacks others and creates an account of give and take with others.

## Difference between inner penance and external penance

**Questioner** : If one eats the food that is not to his liking, is that _tapa_ penance too?

**Dadashri** : Yes. But real penance is the inner penance. In external penance, people will notice that you have not eaten today; that you are fasting today. Standing on one leg, sitting in _padmasan_ (a cross-legged sitting position used in yoga), these are all external penance; the fruit of which is worldly life _sansar_ and the fruit of inner penance _antar_ _tapa_ is _moksha_. Inner penance; invisible penance _adeetha tapa_. _Adeetha_ means that it is not visible.

**Questioner** : Inner _antar tapa_ penance and _prapta tapa_ – penance that presents naturally, are they the same?

**Dadashri** : _Prapt_ that which has come- type of penance is different. _Prapta_ penance comes to you on its own, whereas with the other one, you have to go and do it. When you do not get to eat anything; that is _prapta_ penance. When you do not get anything to eat, you should say, 'Today, I will fast'. That is _prapta_ penance. Say, ' Penance has arisen today, so go ahead and do the penance.' You found _tapa_.

**Questioner** : If someone insults me and I endure it, is that considered _tapa_ too?

**Dadashri** : That too is considered _prapta tapa_ present penance too. Why did your penance come soon? It is because You are going to find a resolution sooner; you are going to become pure quicker; speedily! The _tapa_ heat happens within at the time of uprooting it, does it not? Is there pain in the _chit_ (subtle inner component of knowledge and vision)? That is called _tapa_. 'You' have to keep 'seeing' that _tapa_. Do not believe that as pain. If you believe it as pain _dukha_ then the penance will cease instantly.

## Gnan-darshan-charitra-tapa

(Knowledge-vision-conduct-penance)

I am Shuddhatma' is _darshan_ vision as the Self. Experience _anubhav_ of that is Gnan. However much You experience it, that much is the _vitaragta_ absolutely free from attachment and aversion, and that much verily is the conduct _charitra_. Therefore, with _gnan-darshan-charitra_ and _tapa_ , you will have to settle everything with the fourth pillar of _tapa_ , will you not? When the inner core _hridaya_ heats up hot red _tapa_ , You have to continue 'seeing' it, and that is called _tapa_ penance.

**Questioner** : What is _tapa_ , is there inner friction _gharshan_ happening?

**Dadashri** : No, there is inner restlessness and agitation _ajumpo_. One may not say anything but inner restlessness happens within. That _tapa_ has to be endured. Externally, the files are being settled with equanimity, but internally the endurance of the restlessness without hurting the other person, is considered _adeetha_ _tapa_ internal penance.

Our _mahatmas_ (those who have attained Gnan from Dada) tell me, 'Our conduct becomes so bad and yet nothing bothers You.' I tell them, 'Why would it bother me? I have experienced all that so what else is going to happen? You tell me to tell you, otherwise I would not even tell you anything.'

Beginning with tremendous penance heat _doing tapa_ , one will move from _darshan_ -vision as the Self to Gnan-experience as the Self.

**Questioner** : Dada, does it not make a difference in when one does penance unwillingly as a last resort and one does it with an understanding?

**Dadashri** : Even though he does it unwillingly, his loss will gradually diminish.

## Equanimity lost in the opportunity for penance at hand

So 'we' make you understand only that what 'we' do.

**Questioner** : I do not remember to do _prapta tapa_ penance which presents, when an opportunity arises and that gives rise to _kashayas_ (anger-pride-deceit-greed).

**Dadashri** : That will happen for a while and then you will adjust. You will feel that this keeps happening. Then everything gets ruined. Will it be fine if you remove _kadhee_ (yogurt soup) from the stove within a minute? You have to let it come to the boil, let it come to the boil about eighteen times like _doodhpak_ (reduced sweet milk), that is when the kadhee is cooked properly. Do we not have to make the same effort here? You have to 'do' the inner intent _bhaavna_ for awareness _jagruti_. Ask, 'Why does this happen?' You have to tell Chandubhai, 'Endure the _prapta_ currently presenting penance, why are you doing this?'

**Questioner** : But why does that stillness not remain?

**Dadashri** : When you say that, it will become like that, will it not? When you say, 'I am sad', then you will become sad.

**Questioner** : Everything becomes shaken up once, then....

**Dadashri** : Do _pratikraman_ when that happens. You should always do _pratikraman_ whenever it gets shaken up, then the chances of it shaking up the next time will be less. In this way it will become still; then this (enduring penance without agitation) will start. You should keep doing _pratikraman_. The greatest _purushartha_ spiritual effort is to do _pratikraman_.

## Understanding penance at the time it is happening

**Questioner** : What should be the understanding while _tapa_ penance is happening?

**Dadashri** : It should be 'what is happening is for my own benefit. Whatever Dada says is mine and whatever He says no to; is not mine.'

**Questioner** : There is so much burning within that I feel like I will not be able to tolerate it. And yet inside I feel that it is for my benefit, and so I am not to put it out.

**Dadashri** : Gnan will not be burn; it is the _agnan_ ignorance part that burns. So You have to be careful and go to sleep. Let it burn; let it all burn down. Nothing of the Gnan is going to burn, that I guarantee you.

_Antara tapa_ inner penance makes one a God. When you have inner penance, realize that knowledge-vision-conduct-penance _Gnan-darshan-charitra-tapa_ , are the four pillars; that is confirmed. When there is only knowledge-vision _Gnan_ - _darshan_ , all the four pillars are not present. Therefore, you are the bearer of merit karma effects _punyashadi_ that inner penance continues for you. You cannot give rise to it at will. Would it arise even if you were to instigate it? If someone grabs hold of your hand and says, 'Come with me, where are you going?' inner penance will commence.

'We' are constantly in penance. Your penance is gross, ours is very subtle penance _tapa_. But after this gross _sthula_ one burns, then after that the subtle _sookshma_ penance, and then, you will have subtler _sookshmatar_ penance. After all that, your penance will come close to that of Mine.

So, you will understand all this the more you listen to this. Where do you have to do _tapa_ penance? Where penance is needed, you retaliate and make others do _tapa_. Then the other person will do the _tapa_. Why don't you deal it with equanimity? 'We' have _tapa_ night and day! You have not done any _tapa_ at all; you fall fast asleep till the morning!

## Penance needed where it is contrary to your goal

Experience _anubhav as the Self_ will happen only after _tapa_ happens. How can you have experience _anubhav_ otherwise? Inner penance _antar tapa_ means; that in which matter Your inner 'heats up'; You try to remain separate from it; and when that inner part 'heats up' You definitely gain experience _anubhav, Gnan,_ out of it.

**Questioner** : So in whatever matter penance arises, one become free from that matter?

**Dadashri** : You will be free of it, and the experience of that verily is the experience of the Self. Bliss _sukha_ and the light _prakash_ of the Self will continue to increase, that is all.

**Questioner** : What is it that arises, that one has to do the _tapa_ penance?

**Dadashri** : When you try to do anything against the mind-intellect-chit-ego _mun-buddhi-chit-ahamkar_ , they will fight you; that is when You have to do' be in _tapa_ (let it heat up). It will heat up and burn within.

**Questioner** : But _tapa_ will not arise if it is in accordance with my goal, will it?

**Dadashri** : It will not happen there. _Tapa_ penance will arise when it is against Your goal, and it should; not forever, but there should be _tapa_. If _tapa_ is not there, then the foundation pillars are wrong. You have to have all four foundation pillars (Knowledge-vision-conduct-penance) of _moksha_.

Having decided that he does not want sex, His goal now is that he wants to remain celibate _brahmachari_ ; now when he is tempted upon seeing a woman will he not have to enter into penance? If at that time he heated up in the exact right manner of what is called the right penance (samyak _tapa_ ), whereby temptation did not sway Him even a bit, then his experience _anubhav as the Self_ would be immediate. That is called _tapa_.

**Questioner** : Therefore, where pleasure was felt before, the vision _darshan_ now is that, 'this is not I', therefore the _tapa_ starts there. In that if the pleasure is felt again and the _tapa_ inner heating disappears.

**Dadashri** : No. When he cannot bear it, he gets back into tasting the pleasure. One needs the energy of _nischaya_ unflinching decision for _tapa_. One man told me, 'Stick your thumb out.' I said, 'Here, it is'. So he tells me, 'I am going to burn you with a cigarette.' I said to him, 'Go ahead and light the match.' He lit two matches. I just stood there. What is the basis of _tapa_? The ego within. 'Whatever is going to happen; let it happen' – the same _nischaya_ has to be there too. 'Whatever is to happen; let it. I will no longer become trapped with you (Chandubhai). I have been trapped for infinite past lives, now I will not be trapped' – such should be the _nischaya_. Now it is not my intent to destroy my goal. If the _nischaya_ is not there, the pleasure will drag you in.

A very strong wind can blow a person away; if it is your _nischaya_ , that you will not let it blow you away, you will sit down and that nothing is going to happen, then you will be spared. And the other person will say, 'Hey, I will get blown away, I will be blown away', he will easily be blown away. He will fly in the sky!

**Questioner** : There, the wind will blow him away, who blows him away here?

**Dadashri** : This too is a wind that will be blowing in such a way that the currents and the waves of attraction will pull him away. He used to like the attraction, and therefore attraction will continue to happen. If one wants to realize His goal, then He will have to let go of what he likes, and if His _nischaya_ is wavering then nothing will be achieved.

**Questioner** : It is because of the habits of endless life times, no?

**Dadashri** : Chandubhai's habits. What else then? All these problems are because of these habits that have formed. There is no problem at all if there is no habit. But he consistently protects those habits when they arise, and thus becomes subservient to the _prakruti_ the non-Self complex.You were saying that pleasure comes; that does not come into penance; it does not fall into _adeetha_ _tapa_ invisible penance. There _garvaras_ sweet taste of doership is tasted, enjoying continuoes and on top of that he asserts 'I am _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul only'. So why should 'we' bother? Therefore, 'we' tell all the _mahatmas_ and are done with it. From here on, if anyone does it wrong, that is his responsibility.

## Dada too has invisible penance

'We' too have to do _adeetha tapa_ invisible penance, according to our own standard. One has to do invisible penance all the way (till he attains _moksha_ ). Even when the mind gets vexed, the intellect _buddhi_ gets vexed, 'You' have to keep 'seeing'; that is when 'Your' penance happens.

**Questioner** : It is said that one has to do invisible penance, is that true? If I keep making the mind-intellect understand frequently, then will it stop whatever restlessness he--Chandubhai has?

**Dadashri** : No it will not stop at all. You have to do the penance _tapa_ within. That penance will happen automatically. Now in that situation, when Chandubhai (file # 1) scolds someone and in his mind he is satisfied that 'I was right in scolding him', then the _tapa_ no longer remains for him. Then there is no _tapa_ for him there. When someone tells you something and you scold him, then at that moment You do not have to do the _tapa_. So there, now when you do not scold him, then the _tapa_ inner heating will happen, will it not? The mind will continue to get irritated!

**Questioner** : But will that irritation not go away with Gnan of Dada?

**Dadashri** : It will, but it will do so slowly. It will be irritated one or two times and it would have been gone the third time. Then it will get irritated again when some different matter crops up, then when the practice increases, it will go away. But you will achieve that if you keep up with this. Has _tapa_ ever happened for you? How many times?

**Questioner** : Countless times, many times Dada.

**Dadashri** : Oho! Does that still happen many times? Until You are in complete Gnan, that will continue to happen.

**Questioner** : So what is a penance-free state like?

**Dadashri** : That is the _vitarag_ state, absolute like that of Tirthankar Lord. 'We' have _tapa_ in certain things, not in trivial things like when someone insults 'us' or something similar.

**Questioner** : Dada, You are saying that You constantly have inner penance?

**Dadashri** : 'We' do for sure. 'We' constantly have the penance _tapa_. 'Our' penance does not give rise to any result in any pain _dukha_ , does not give rise to any result in any taste _swaad_ ; it is such that no pleasure will give rise to any result; that is how it is. 'Our' _tapa_ penance is very subtle.

**Questioner** : What do You mean by, 'does not give rise to any result?

**Dadashri** : _Vastu_ matter does not affects 'us'. All these things that are in this world, 'we' remain absolutely separate from them. Even in taste there is no result in 'us', we remain unchanged-without any result-in _dukha vedana_ pain sending signals. When the _vedana_ pain sending signals of the teeth are happening, there is no result in 'us'. 'We' continue to 'know' that _jaaniye._

**Questioner** : What kind of _tapa_ do you have, Dada?

**Dadashri** : Actually on the most part it is not there; it is there once in a while, but because 'we' lack four degrees, 'we' have to 'do' it. It comes only sometimes; otherwise it does not. For 'us' if there are certain things, if sometimes 'we' are trapped in a plane...

When something becomes physically unbearable, then _tapa_ has to be done. One will appreciate that, when he has a toothache, no?

**Questioner** : When we turn unbearable pain into bearable, that is _tapa_ , is it not?

**Dadashri** : That is called _tapa_. One does not holler and clash; there should not be any interference from You in what is happening to the body.

What is _tapa_? No matter what the circumstance, even when the hand is being cut, the continued awareness as the Self, and the lack of slippage from the Self state is _tapa._ At that time if the inner core _hridaya_ heats up, then that _tapa_ has to be allowed _tapavoo._

## Penance for moksha

Now what penance do you have to do? All the _tapa_ that you can see with your eyes, hear with your ears; all those _tapa_ penance are 'fruits'—presenting effects in this life. Fruitful means they are fruits with seed that will bear more fruits. Therefore, if you want to be free, _tapa_ that gives you fruit will not do, you need _tapa_ that does not give fruit. You need that which does not give the fruit and you have to do penance for it. In all these rituals of penance that are going on in the world, within it _punyai_ merit karma for the next life, gets bound. You have taken this Gnan, and therefore, You want to remain in the Gnan only. But, if someone comes and harasses and interferes by saying, 'You are the one who ruined this for me' and this and that then because of this Gnan, there is no entanglement for You at all. 'You' can find a solution for that, but it does affect 'Chandubhai' soemwhat, and then Chandubhai's inner core _hridaya_ starts heating up. At such times, before You used to become _tanmayakar_ body-mind form-Chandulal, and to not become so, is penance _tapa._ Hence, it is this very _tapa_ that will take you to _moksha_.

Therefore, the Lord said to do this _tapa_. If we say there is no need for external _tapa_ , then people will think that you got rid of the _tapa_ said by the Lord. No, there is no _moksha_ without _tapa_. What can we do if the world misunderstands us? And only one word can come out at a time, you cannot show both the negative and the positive at the same time. It can show either the negative or the positive. It is different if one says the negative again, but ha cannot express both the intents at the same time, can he?

Our mahatmas do approximately five-percent _tapa_ only. Should You not do _tapa_? Right now when You do _sambhave nikal_ deal with equanimity, are You not doing _tapa_?

**Questioner** : I have to do it for sure, Dada.

**Dadashri** : Those are the small ones. But later bigger ones, big ones should happen. Even if your son were to die, if someone were to rob you of your jewelry worth one lakh rupees; not even an atom will stir within - such is Dada's science _vignan_. If you do what your intellect tells you, then have You not become the way you used to be? That is where You have to let _penance_ happen—allow file one to get red hot within. What would you do if you get robbed while you are somewhere in a street?

**Questioner** : I would not make a big fuss about it, I would not be bothered if I do or I do not get back what they stole; but in my mind I would continue to feel that I was robbed.

**Dadashri** : What do you gain out of that? You should see how that helps you, should You not? He is not robbing You; he is taking back what was his. No one can take that which is Yours.

**Questioner** : How does _tapa_ arise within? What should one do after he has been robbed?

**Dadashri** : When that inner core of the self –Chandubhai –non-Self 'heats' up inside, he cannot tolerate that and so then the one who has ahd the Gnan—You also start complaining and You too get 'hot'. You have to do _tapa_ there—let it heat, let it heat, until it cools down.

**Questioner** : 'He' adjusts with Gnan and the Five Agnas, but from within it keeps screaming that I got robbed.

**Dadashri:** Your inner core _hridaya_ will get red hot at that time. It is difficult to tolerate. You will have one thought after another; a whirlpool of thoughts will arise. At that time continue 'seeing' only. At that time the mind should not spoil-develop any negativity-towards that other person. How can you call it _tapa_ , if the mind spoils even a little? Maintaining equanimity in any circumstance, that verily is _adeetha tapa_ – invisible inner penance. What else? Everything is yours, nothing of this all, is of the other. Suffering will not arise for you, if it belonged to someone else. So You have to remain pure in it, no impurity should remain. All the garbage comes out and with Dada, everything comes out. Dada makes everyone God. Have You not seen that change?

These external _tapa_ are visible to others and with _antar_ _tapa_ inner penance You are the only who one knows it. You should become still where something is not of your liking. You may not like it but still You should remain in peace and stillness without causing problems for anyone. Whereas people, lash back when any _tapa_ suffering arises. They defend their selves; You do not have to do that. When the intent of defending your self arises, You did not take the full advantage of that _tapa_. You took a bribe there.

**Questioner** : When one does _adeetha_ _tapa_ , is that considered as having settled with equanimity?

**Dadashri** : Everything is settled. If you take a 'bribe' in that, then some of it is left unsettled. However much of a bribe you take, that amount remains unsettled. And when You settle; it is all gone. The Self becomes light at that time, and You experience nothing but bliss. What do you do when it heats up a lot? Do you become irate? Did you create quarrels before? He then takes out the anger of one person on another. Whatever the file, you should settle it right there and then. This file and any other file have no connection with each other yet he dumps his anger about someone, on someone else.

You should keep 'him—the one who slips from 'knowing into suffering the penance', separate and away from that. As 'he' is about to mingle and join, and generally 'he' remains separate only, but when someone says, 'You caused me damage of five thousand', he joins in. At that time he feels an inner jolt that, 'I am not the one who has done it. Why is this kick felt? The mind will show that this man is accusing me. So then will , 'I am _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul' prevail or that will prevail? why is he telling me?' If someone tells you this, then you have to do penance at that time. That is when he has a push from within, 'I did no such thing!' - why does one get such a push? From within he feels that he is being accused, so then will he have the awareness of 'I am Shuddhatma' or the other thing?At that time he should do the _tapa_ and have the awareness of 'I am Shuddhatma.'

## If pleasure then the tapa will be broken

Your _tapa_ should be such that you should heat up, let the mind get hot. When the mind begins to get hot, it needs some food. At that time if You 'feed' the mind with something sweet that it likes, or if You feed the mind by recalling something nice about the house, or something that the mind likes, then that is not called _tapa_. But if at that time You connect it with the Self; if You maintain pure awareness as the Self _shuddha upayoga_ , then that is called _tapa_.

I ask these boys, 'What do you do when worries or external problems arise within?' They told me, 'We tide over the time by going to a movie or something like that.' So they give in and lose the time. When time comes to do _tapa_ , they go and have fun at the movies. That is like giving away a hundred dollar note in return for two dollars. You should do something that will make the hundred dollar note become a thousand dollars worth. Therefore, when that happens, 'see the _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul in everyone, 'see'-- _jovoo_ the next, 'see' the third; or else 'do' do _pratikraman_ for all the relatives at home. Recall all the relatives (and do their _pratikraman_ ), because some sorts of problems have happened with the relatives, have they not? So do _pratikraman_ of everyone, all your neighbors around you, one house at a time. Do _pratikraman_ of everyone in your free time. Arrange to do all that. When you clean all that, You will become pure. You will have to do all that; no one else will help you with it, will they? Will others help you with it? Will your wife help you? Will she do it for herself or help you with yours? So You have to arrange something like this, and that is when it is considered _tapa_. Tapa means to not give the mind what it likes and to divert it to something else. You give the mind what it likes, do you not?

**Questioner** : Only sometimes I do.

**Dadashri** : That is fine. There is no problem with sometimes. Otherwise you will not find _tapa_ like this, will you? In those instances, when You take the mind to the restaurant and please it; it will not do.

## Wrong or right is verily a relative view

**Questioner:** In adverse circumstances there is a shift from _chetan_ _bhaav_ 'I am the Self' to _paudgalik_ _bhaav_ 'I am Chandulal.' Later the awareness _jagruti_ returns that this has happened. So then what should be done to maintain the awareness?

**Dadashri:** It is like this, there are only two things: _Shuddhatma_ \- the pure Self and _sainyog_ circumstance- gathering of evidences. In that there is neither the wrong nor the right. When you label a _sainyog_ circumstance as wrong and bad, it becomes bad; and when you label it as right or good, it becomes good. There will always be the sweet and the bitter, but when 'aa—he' says this is bitter then it will feel bitter. The effect arises and is felt then. Sweet and bitter will be there for sure, will it not? It is the nature of every thing.

**Questioner:** So if anything is seen as sweet or bitter, then the intent of the _pudgal_ non-Self complex comes into play?

**Dadashri:** Right-wrong in itself is the relative itself. Right or wrong, good or bad is verily the intent-vision of the _pudgal_ non-Self complex.There is no wrong. To see it as such is prevailing weakness itself. Circumstances are there and they by their nature are prone to dissociation _viyoga_. Someone may say, sir, there is fire on this side and ice on the other, so is there not a difference between the two? The answer is 'yes there is a difference'; both are only circumstances. But none are right or wrong and by nature they are prone to dissipate. If there is piece of ice here, no one will move it. If there is a fire here then even if I do not move it, someone else will. So those circumstances have come to vacate their place. So then you will have to have patience, will you not? The Lord has said for 'us' to 'do' _tapa_ – penance. _Gnan-darshan-charitra-tapa—_ experience as the Self-vision as the Self-conduct as the Self-penance as the Self. (The four foundation pillars of _moksha_.It (circumstance) is not wrong; there is weakness in Your penance. You will have to have all the four pillars, will you not? If a bed were to have only three legs, it will fall down on one side, will it not? A bed with all four legs is needed.

That is why it is written that 'Dada does invisible penance _adeetha tapa_ '. Invisible penance is considered the final penance. 'We' continue doing this final penance. On the border that divides the Self and the non-Self _anatma_ ; it never goes towards the non-Self at all. It never goes into the 'foreign department'; it always remains in the 'home department'. That is where the penance has to be kept; that is _adeetha_ _tapa_ – invisible penance! So for You, from this ongoing 'doing' of current penance, later, will come the invisible penance.

## Taking consolation from others weakens the penance

**Questioner:** Sometimes it happens that if there is a very heavy force of karma and I am not able to bear it, I end up telling file no. 2 so that I can get some sympathy. So in doing this, does that leave some weakness in my ability to suffer the penance?

**Dadashri:** If you take sympathy from others, then it is bound to remain weak, no? If I get burnt then others will put a little water on my burn. It has to be endured completely. Despite this if you are not able to suffer it; then you should tell someone.

**Questioner** : I tell someone because I not able to tolerate it. I end up saying it for sympathy; is that not considered a 'taped record playing'?

**Dadashri** : Of course it is a taped record! You found a solution, did you not? You found a solution because you are not able to bear it!

Even when I had a fever of a hundred and three degrees in Baroda, I never told Hiraba.. What is the use of such consolation? Hiraba will say quickly, 'let me get this and let me get that and something else.' On top of it all, she would notify people and they would come and visit me and create problem for me. Instead, ' _ek nanno sau dukh ne hane_ – one denial destroys hundred miseries.' People cannot do anything and cause useless trouble. And again if someone comes to visit me, then I have to invite him and have to sit with him. So _mooah_ (addressing A. M. Patel) why did you create this interference again? That visitor would think that if he did not come then I would feel bad. I would think, 'why did he show up at this time?' Then I have to ask him, 'how are you' and all that for no reason. Otherwise I would just sit at ease. Hiraba would ask, 'do you have fever?' Then I would say, 'no, Baa. I do not have any fever.'

**Questioner:** Suppose she touches your forehead and says that you have fever then what can you do?

**Dadashri:** Then 'we' may reply, 'it has come and it will go down, right now it is not worth informing anybody.' Then she will say, 'all right then.' Or please make me some _ukado_ (hot drink made with ginger, spices and other herbs) and the fever will go down. There is no problem with that. But what are you going to do by telling everybody? And people who come to see you, will they take away your pain _dukha_? And even if you tell someone about it, will they take away your pain? If some _mahatma_ tells me, 'Dada, I suffer like this and like that.' Then I would say, 'no problem, I am here for you.' Does it mean that I am going to take it away from him? Nevertheless it gives a person some consolation.

## Penance at the time of obstructions for _satsang_

**Questioner** : When the circumstance does not arise for me to come to _satsang_ , I should do _tapa_ penance, should I not?

**Dadashri** : You have to do _tapa_ at that time. When your family obstructs you, you should do the _tapa_. They obstruct you because of your own obstacles exist. At that time, you should not kick up any kind of fuss; do _tapa_ at that time.

**Questioner** : Should I not think 'why are they saying no to me'?

**Dadashri** : Nothing like that, do the _tapa_ without any fuss. Those poor people are just the _nimit_ (apparent doers; instrumental in the process).

## Is there a difference between tapa and artadhyan?

**Questioner** : When the mind becomes restless, and we 'heat' it up with Gnan, does it sometimes go into _artadhyan_ (adverse inner meditation that hurts and bothers the self), does that ever happen?

**Dadashri** : No, it cannot be considered _artadhyan_ at all, can it? It is called _tapa_. It does not go into _artadhyan_. A 'doer', 'I-ness' is needed for _artadhyan_.

**Questioner** : So Dada, is it necessary to do such a _tapa_ in order to go to _moksha_?

**Dadashri** : No, it is automatically there. You do not need to do it, it is there. One would not become free, if it were not there, will he? _Gnan-darshan-charitra and tapa_ (Self based: Knowledge-vision-conduct and penance), the fourth pillar is always there, and if he does not, it remains.

## Dada did such penance

'We' would not torment the stomach by fasting. Let Me do the _tapa_ that already is within! What is the point of making the stomach suffer? The _tapa_ that comes when 'we' sleep here in the night, those are the ones that will heat up, are they just a few?

**Questioner** : What are they? Where do they come?

**Dadashri** : Many kinds of _tapa_ penance come. When the coughing bouts come, sleep does not come. Something may happen that will not let you sleep even on a good day.

**Questioner** : How do you do _tapa_ in that?

**Dadashri** : Whatever it is, 'we' stay in 'our' Gnan, as if 'nothing has happened'. That way! You all _mahatmas_ remain in _niddidhyasan_ (inner visual contemplation of-on 'Dada'); 'we' remain in the Gnan. Whose _niddhidhyasan_ will 'we' stay in?

**Questioner** : What do you mean by 'in Gnan'?

**Dadashri** : 'Our' Gnan is different and your Gnan is different. 'Our' is the clear and experiential _spashta_ _vedan_. Therefore, it is _niralumb_ absolutely free from any dependence on any non-Self evidence. Yours is an unclear –hazy experience of the Self _aspashta vedan_ , and therefore Yours is with support _avalamban_ , yours is with the support of the words, 'I am _Shuddhatma_ '. Whereas 'ours' is different, how can 'we' talk about that?

**Questioner** : Can you please clearly explain clear _spashta_ and hazy _aspashta_ _vedan_ experience?

**Dadashri** : This leg part that you are touching, to see that you are touching my leg, is the clear _spashta_ one. And if one wonders in the mind, 'what is this happening? Who is touching?' then it is the hazy unclear _aspashta_ one. It (Gnan, experience as the Self) has been given to You, is it not? Is it something that you have earned yourself? You have to gradually accumulate the earnings. You have not earned it yourself, have you? The One who has earned it himself, knows how to suffer _prapt_ _tapa_ the heat of adversity that arises within, because he has walked that path exactly. 'We' had walked that path.

This letter has come that says, 'Dada I will shoot you with a bullet.' So what kind of _tapa_ do 'we' have to undergo? 'Ours' is a state of experience and so 'we' do not have to do any _tapa_. That poor man is writing from lack of understanding, is he not? The poor man says, 'If I had the authority, I would throw you out!' Some may have that authority and some may not; is there a shortage of such people?

**Questioner** : But this is the first such letter you have received?

**Dadashri** : Yes, the first. It is a prize; only rarely will one get such a prize.

**Questioner** : 'This prize I received, _tapa_ came my way', all these words are wonderful. When the words, 'I received this prize' become present, then that other problem does not remain at all.

**Dadashri** : 'We' look for such things, but no one will say such things will they!? One will not say that even if 'we' gave him ten thousand rupees. He will say, 'what will become of me if I said that!?' He will not do it even if 'we' offered him money. So can we not consider it a prize, when someone does it without such an offer.

**Questioner** : One will find a good satisfactory solution if words such as 'this is a prize that has come' become present.

**Dadashri** : You have not passed on your own; you have been passed. You would have the ability had you passed. This, what You have, is itself more than enough. But if you do _bhaavna_ intent in discharge, it will happen; continue doing _pratikraman_ , keep doing the _bhaavna_ , but if you say 'it does not happen' then it is ruined. If you are going to say, 'it does not happen', then say it with the awareness of separation 'I have told Chandubhai a lot, but it does not happen for him.'

**Questioner** : Even there, I have to speak whilst having the awareness of Gnan _upayoga_?

**Dadashri** : Yes, so then it will not have any effect on You. But this 'I cannot do it' has its effect _asar_. Then the Self- _Atma_ becomes that very form, it becomes what it envisions!

## Tapa is not in the _vyavasthit_

**Questioner** : Where is the need for one to do _bhaavna_ intent in discharge, in the _tapa_? That happens automatically, does it not?

**Dadashri** : Can it happen automatically? _Tapa_ has to be done. It needs _purushartha_ (subtle effort as the awakened Self). Can that happen automatically? Is it a discharge? What kind of people are you? Are you looking for this kind of a thing? It is a _purushartha_. It is a _purushartha_ of those who have become a _purush_ (Self-realised); it is a great _purushartha._ What is the _purushartha_ of after becoming a purush? It is the purushartha of Knowledge-vision-conduct and penance ( _Gnan-darshan-charitra_ and _tapa_ ).

**Questioner** : Does _tapa_ penance not come into _vyavasthit_?

**Dadashri** : No. Can _tapa_ ever be in _vyavasthit_? Knowledge-vision-conduct and penance cannot be in _vyavasthit_. It is a thing of _purushartha_ (Self-effort; cause). In _Vyavasthit_ there is _prarabdha_ effect, it is a discharge.

This young man had made a big mistake and that is why he had remorse for his mistake and he was doing _tapa_ for it. So his brother told him that 'it (making a mistake) is a discharge'. So then he stopped doing the _tapa_ he was doing. This brother of his had no awareness, so he ruined it for him. On one side one has to 'do' _tapa_ and on the other side he has to 'do' _pratikraman_. And you are sitting here looking at it as a discharge only? But this is a misuse! For the one who says, 'everything is a discharge', there is no effect at all. He remains as he is. He stops doing _purushartha_ where there is _tapa_ to be done, and leaves it to _vyavasthit_ , by saying, 'It is a discharge.'

**Questioner** : Show us another short cut, if I cannot do the _purushartha._

**Dadashri** : I showed this short cut, did I not? This is the short cut. That other is a discharge. After this is the _tapa_. _Purushartha_ is to be done through _tapa_. This is not a word that should be misused. Do the _tapa_. What do we do so that it will constitute as _tapa_? You have to do _tapa_ , when the mind within troubles you. Discharge means that discharge is always accompanied by _tapa_. Just simply calling it a discharge will not work, will it? This current state of yours is the result of misusing the term discharge in that way; two to three years have been wasted away in doing so.

## What stops it from manifesting into one's conduct?

In the _kramik_ path there is Gnan- _darshan_ - _charitra_ and _tapa_ , and in this Akram path it is _darshan_ -Gnan- _charitra_ and _tapa_ —vision as the Self-expereience as the Self-conduct as the Self-penance as the Self. Where was your Gnan ever existent at all? You had no scriptural knowledge or knowledge of any other kind, and all of a sudden You attained the _darshan_ vision-'I am _Shuddhatma_ '. Therefore, after _darshan_ comes the Gnan, then conduct _conduct_ and the _tapa_ penance. One has no choice but to attain the Gnan. You can preach this Gnan to others, because it is experiential knowledge- Gnan. And that other person's in the _kramik path,_ his conviction is the experience. In the _kramik_ path, according to the experience of _gnan_ knowledge, the corresponding amount of _pratiti_ conviction happens. Whereas, in the Akram path, the experience _anubhav_ happens according to to the level of conviction _pratiti_ ; that much Gnan-experience as the Self manifests.

**Questioner** : _Tapa_ has to be done before _charitra,_ does it not?

**Dadashri** : Yes. That has to be done first; then only will conduct as the Self _charitra_ come into effect, no? For the one whose these three pillars are clean and clear; the _charitra_ conduct is clear. Without _tapa,_ _charitra_ does not exist. You did do _tapa_? That is why You attained that experience. That experience is such that, ' I will not do it again,' that is how indelible it is.

**Questioner** : How does one know that _charitra_ conduct as the Self, exists when _tapa_ penance arises?

**Dadashri** : _Charitra_ verily is there.

**Questioner** : So is 'seeing' _tapa_ considered _charitra_?

**Dadashri** : That verily is the _charitra_. 'Seeing-knowing' _joyoon-jaanyoon_ the penance _tapa_ verily is the _charitra_ conduct as the Self.

**Questioner** : But why has _tapa_ been placed last in the sequence of _darshan_ (vision), Gnan (knowledge), _charitra_ (conduct) and _tapa_ (penance)?

**Dadashri** : It is like this; the poor _tapa_ will sit together with these as it has been placed but what is its worth as compared with Gnan- _darshan_ - _charitra_? This one is necessary in it. For us, the first is the _darshan_ ; this Gnan 'we' give you, the whole _darshan_ vision becomes complete in and with it. At that time, you have attained some Gnan _anubhav_ experience as the Self for sure; and completion of the Gnan-full clear experience as the Self, comes through these talks. When you discuss everything through _satsang_ and when Gnan and _darshan_ , the two combine, then _charitra_ conduct as the Self arises automatically, while the penance _tapa_ is happening continuously within. The heating within has to be allowed _tapa_ where something is not liked. One is not to starve and punish the body in _tapa_.

All the four foundation pillars, Gnan- _darshan_ - _charitra_ and _tapa_ are necessary. Whatever is necessary at any point will be needed. The _darshan_ vision _pratiti_ conviction, 'I am pure Soul,' has happened to You. That which has happened in conviction-vision _darshan,_ for that to become the experience _anubhav_ as the Self is termed as , 'Gnan has happened.' And the Gnan that has happened, and the conviction that had happened, when they combine, then the result is conduct as the Self _charitra._ But what stops it from manifesting in conduct? It is because one does not do. Doing penance it comes into conduct.

## Penance in the Akram Path is within

Those who attain all these four pillars, have attained everything. Here, externally no matter how much perfume and lotions you use, I do not have any problem with that. 'We' just need inner _tapa_ penance. With external _tapa_ , one is rewarded with worldly fruits-comforts, and with inner _antarik_ _tapa_ there is _moksha_. You need that inner penance _antarik_ _tapa_ ; there is no need for external penance. The whole world has sought nothing but external _tapa_.

Akram means inner penance and _kramik_ means external penance. To mill, that which has already been milled, is tantamount to external penance. One did the 'milling' in his past life, and he now says, 'I am milling', that is called _kramik_ penance; the fruit of which is this worldly fruit (happiness and comfort). The whole world is trapped in it and it continues sinking deeper and deeper. It does not attain anything ever and the _dehadhyas,_ 'I am Chandulal' does not go away. The weakness of anger-pride-deceit-greed does not go away; divisiveness due to differences of opinions _matabhed_ do not go down, and they have never seen ceasing of worries. Have worries stopped for you or not?

**Questioner** : They have stopped.

**Dadashri** : Then that is the end of that. _Moksha_ is round the corner for the one whose worries are over. Who can do this inner penance _antar_ _tapa_? Even all these ascetics do the external penance! Lord Mahavir and his eleven _ganadharas_ cardinal disciples did the inner penance. One binds _punyai_ merit karma with the penance _tapa_ that is visible to people. People cannot see that other _adeetha_ _tapa_. When Dada gets off the plane on a hot summer's day at New York airport in his warm coat, he is doing _adeetha_ _tapa_ inner penance inside.

## Should you ask for penance or bliss?

**Questioner** : In our Charan _Vidhi_ booklet, it is written, Gnan (Knowledge)- _darshan_ (vision)- _charitra_ (conduct) and _sukha_ (bliss)!

**Dadashri** : The _tapa_ after attaining the _darshan_ vision as the Self- verily is the _purushartha_ effort of the awakened One. What is the fruit of that? It is the conduct as the Self _charitra_ and bliss of the Self _atma_ _sukha_. First, there is _tapa_ in the _purushartha_.

**Questioner** : _Tapa_ is the _purushartha_ and _sukha_ bliss as the Self, is its fruit. So then why have you written Gnan- _darshan_ - _charitra_ - _sukha_ and not _tapa_?

**Dadashri** : That is correct; the fruit of _tapa_ is the bliss _sukha_. Because bliss verily is the fruit of Gnan and _darshan_ , but you need the _tapa_ first, that is the fourth pillar of _purushartha_. And we do _bhaavna_ our intent in discharge, for it; we ask for it. 'May my result be same as Yours'. Knowledge-vision-conduct- _tapa_ ; the four pillars. Therefore, it is said that even when You have the two, Knowledge-vision (Gnan- _darshan_ ), you will not attain the conduct. So then when will conduct come? However much _tapa_ you do, you will attain that much of conduct _charitra_. By however much the burden has decreased, that much of _charitra_ prevails. _Darshan_ is there from the moment You attained it, now as You experience the Gnan, You will attain the conduct as the Self, within. However much _tapa_ You do, that much conduct will arise.

When does conduct arise? It is when _tapa_ happens. To do _tapa_ goes into conduct. Whatever _tapa_ happens, that is the conduct.

**Questioner** : Dada, the resulting conduct, does it happen along with _tapa_? Are they both together?

**Dadashri** : Conduct comes only after _tapa_ gets completed. Whenever there is conduct, the _tapa_ is over. If _tapa_ is not done when it arises, then it will put the conduct out.

**Questioner** : Will there come a time when even the inner penance _antar_ _tapa_ comes to an end too?

**Dadashri** : When the inner penance comes to an end, _charitra moha_ discharging karma effect through 'I am Chandulal', has come to an end.

**Questioner** : So, as long as there is _charitra moha_ , there verily is _tapa_

**Dadashri** : Yes, _tapa_ is always there whatever _charitra moha_ is gone, As much the _moha_ illusory attachment decreases, then it _moha_ illusory attachment becomes weak _kshinmoha_.

**Questioner** : Does _keval Gnan_ absolute knowledge happen after _charitra_ _moha_ illusory attachment that is happening in effect-in discharge-ends; when inner penance _antar_ _tapa_ ends?

**Dadashri** : Thereafter absolute Gnan happens. Till then it is called _kshinmoha_ weak or exhausted _moha_. _Keval Gnan_ happens in short time after that.

## Tapa happens while settling with equanimity

**Questioner** : But there can be _anand_ bliss even as _tapa_ is happening no?

**Dadashri** : There is always the receiving of pain _dukha_ on one side, and there is the bliss of being the 'knower-seer' _gnata drashta_ of the _tapa_. It heats up in _tapa_ , but again there is bliss _anand_ there.. If someone comes to the office and insults this Chandubhai by saying, 'You do not know how to do business and you have caused a lot of trouble for us,' and thus, he says bitter words. At that moment, Your vision instantly goes on the Gnan and inquires, 'what does 'our' Gnan say? It says, 'Settle this file with equanimity'. Will that not happen? But the mind and all that is within; the _antahkaran_ in the body will immediately latch on to what the man said and becomes 'hot' in there, ready to give a violent answer. But instead he does not answer at that time and decides to deal with it, with equanimity. So when he 'sees' within, 'Wow! It has become so very red hot', and 'seeing' that the Self becomes cleared of the file. That which 'sees' the penance _tapa_ is the clear-free Self. Having 'seen' it red hot, he 'sees' it coming down to its baseline cool state. Always, whenever a circumstance arises, whether it is red hot and unpleasant or cool and pleasant, it is, at that very time of the nature of _viyog_ dissociation. That boil over will settle down after a little while. But for once it may heat up quite a bit! Thereafter as You see this exercise, then bliss happens spontaneously, but penance _tapa_ does not leave and go away. The heating, the _tapa_ is there.

**Questioner** : You said that I should deal with it, with equanimity and once You taught us, ' it is that which was verily yours, is what is coming back to you.'

**Dadashri** : Why did I tell you to deal with it, with equanimity? It is because it has come back to you, and so you have to settle with it, with equanimity. It is all with reference to that. There is connection with each and every sentence.

**Gnani's penance** 'We' never have to undergo gross heat _tapa_ penance. There is nothing that heats up within! Nothing heats up. The _tapa_ penance is there continuously at a subtle _sookshma_ level.

## Questioner: Is it because it has come into _charitra_ conduct?

**Dadashri** : It is because it has come into _charitra_. Despite knowing about _charitra_ , for some reason the _charitra_ conduct as the absolute Self does not remain as it should. Those with _charitra_ will not say all this.

**Questioner** : Will not say what?

**Dadashri** : I am saying what the Lord used to say, but the Lord did not meddle like this, whereas I do. Hence that much of the conduct is meddlesome.

**Questioner** : So then is there _tapa_ at that time?

**Dadashri** : No, there is no need for _tapa_ ; I never had to do the _tapa_. _Tapa_ will ruin the mood. Tension remains with _tapa_.

**Questioner** : You said that for You the _tapa_ remains at the 'activity and experience' of the junction of the Self and the non-Self, such that the two continue to remain separate.

**Dadashri** : There, it is 'our' Gnan only that is working constantly. 'Our' _tapa_ is over at that time. Those two never become one. Our conduct _charitra_ is such that this _pratiti_ conviction and _anubhav_ experience do not change. There is no _tapa_ left for us within.

## The son; is he yours or is he the source for penance?

**Questioner** : But what if a person does not get that much of _tapa_? The penance that he gets, is all the penance, right?

**Dadashri** : But it will come, will it not? If not now; then later. If such arrangement is not there for now, does that mean that all such arrangement is gone forever?

**Questioner** : So such arrangement comes to everyone for sure, does it?

**Dadashri** : It does. It will come, if it is there and it will not, if it is not there. What happens if your son talks back at you tomorrow? Now who knows who will strike back at you? No one is Yours here, it is easy that he only talked back at you; otherwise he may even hit you. This all is the stock of Kaliyug. They hit their mothers, hit their fathers, they hit everyone, do the parents not have to do _tapa_ at that time? So be careful, when it comes to doing penance.

What is _tapa_? Whatever happens, after a child dies the mind-intellect-chit and ego will become very restless, even people will keep saying 'who will get the inheritance; who will take this and who will take that?' etc. One should do _tapa_ in all this. Why would you want to fret over the worldly dealings? The son or the daughter; whether they become widowed or not? If he dies, then he is gone. Whose children were they for the past infinite lives? Whose son was he in the past? In fact whose body was it? The problem would have been over if one had done the 'plus-minus' from the beginning, is it true or not? Then there would be nothing in the account of the book of karma that one can be cheated about, can there? I have done plus-minus right from the beginning. Should you not have a safe side? Dada's Gnan should be present immediately upon the death of your child. People will not even think of such a _tapa_ , they will lament and be grief stricken at that time. Worldly dealing is such a thing that it can give rise to _atma_ - _aishwarya_ energy of the Self. But instead, one uses up the energy of the Self.

## The brave will seize the tapa

Discussion about _tapa_ came out today, so seize this _tapa_ once. Start the _purushartha_ of _tapa_. Lord Mahavir has referred to this _tapa_. When I said it, people say how can one go to _moksha_ without external penance ( _tapa_ )? That is not this _tapa_. This _tapa_ (external visible penance) is an instrument for one to wander from life to life in the worldly life ( _sansaar)._

Does anyone have any desire ( _bhaavna_ ) of doing penance ( _tapa_ )? Raise your finger, you look brave, have some braveness. You are not going to keep having this opportunity. You are not going to get this _darshan_ again. You will not even meet this Dada again.

**Questioner** : What should we understand by, 'you are not going to meet this Dada again?'

**Dadashri** : 'You will not meet Him again' means learn and get as much out of this One (Dada) you have met. No one ever will teach you a word of this again; who has the time to do so? Who will have time to make you do _tapa_ like this?

'We' do not discuss too much about _tapa_. Man does not have the capacity for it. Otherwise, it is only occasionally that we do so. What is the capacity of man? One will complain the whole day if the vegetable curry goes bad. What does dealing with equanimity mean? It means to do _tapa_. How much energy of the Self it gives rise to, in front of You! 'You' attain one huge empire. Whatever you let go of on this side, that much empire you attain on the other side. And what do You have to let go of in this? It was not Yours to begin with! They will immediately carry you out and leave you (on the funeral pyre) with four coconuts, if you were to die now, no one even cares about you. Therefore get your work done. You have found this place in which You can get Your work (for _moksha_ ) done through this body. So, why don't You get Your work done? Do You not want to do so? Then stand up and say, say it heroically, why are you saying it like that? Do You want to get Your work done or not?

**Questioner** : I do, Dada.

**Dadashri** : Yes, so get it done now; instead of dying uselessly and unnecessarily. No one will come and visit you. And when they do, they come to see the body, are they going to come to see the Atma? Unnecessary worry about it! For infinite lives you have been begging in Your own world. 'We' cannot say this, not even a word, to those who have not attained Gnan. That worldly life is everything for them. This can be said only to those who have attained Gnan, and only they can do the _tapa_ , no one else can.

## Energy of the Self manifests through penance

**Questioner:** Dada, when we do _adeetha_ _tapa_ , is it not doership?

**Dadashri:** No, _adeetha_ _tapa_ means it is the penance of the Self only; it is the _purusharth_ (inner endeavor of the _Purush -_ the Self). If a doctor says that you are not going to live two days and you know your physical state is such that you will be able to live longer, then your mind will be filled with confusing thoughts that now what will happen of me? So, at that time You have to do penance. Mind-intellect-chit and ego, all will become restless; all this 'You' have to keep 'seeing'. Is it about 'I' - the Self' or someone else? Yes, then You will last. If it (the non-Self complex of body-mind-speech) dies then it will go but 'You' have to continue doing penance. In such a situation, 'Our - the Self' things manifest. On the contrary _aishwarya_ (energy of the Self) manifests. What kind of _aishwarya_ manifests? Tremendous _aishwarya_ would manifest by doing penance just once. If your whole house is on fire, if it is your one and only house that is burning then you have to go there. You also have to take the bucket and help all who are pouring water to stop the fire. You have to perform all the outer actions but inside there will be the penance. What is 'Yours' in this at all? 'You' will have the awareness that 'this is not mine'.

Energy of the Self arises the moment one does _tapa_ ; firstly the energy of the Self arose through this _samyak darshan_ (enlightened-right vision). In this Gnan 'we' give you, there is no _purushartha_ on Your part, is there? Then as _purushartha_ happens gradually in Gnan, it will come into Your experience ( _anubhav_ ).

This has manifested due to the manifest energy of the Self ( _aishwarya_ ) of Dada. People have not yet seen the _aishwarya_ that has arisen. As it comes out, manifests, One will realize what a wonderful _aishwarya_ it is! And such _aishwarya_ is in every Atma – the Self. It has not manifested (as yet), and when it does manifest, it is considered manifest divinity. For now it lies unexpressed within you. 'Our' divinity has been expressed.

# [9.1] BHOGAVAVOO – VEDAVOO – JAANAVOO

SUFFERING – RECEIVING SIGNALS – KNOWING

## The state of the Gnani during physical pain

**Questioner:** Does a Gnani too have to suffer bodily pains?

**Dadashri:** Only the Gnani is to suffer. Others take injections or tablets and thus suppress pain. This is the taking of an overdraft. 'We—the Gnani Purush and the fully enlightened One within' do not take an overdraft—taking value for which a repayment will be due. 'We' settle it and are done with it. Krupadudev Srimad Rajchandra (Gnani Purush of _kramik_ path, 1868-1901) had endless pain _dukha._ For years Laghuraj Swami (enlightened follower of Rajchandra) had blood in stools. Lord Mahavir too had unending pain _dukha._ That is why he came to be known as _mahavira_ the great courageous one.

The thought of this kind should come: How does the Gnani deal with and settle physical signals _vedana_ that are painful?

## Unaffected state even during pain and discomfort

This Gnan—the knowledge as and of the Self—verily is of the Knower-Seer _gnata-drshata._ This Gnan is such that it is present continuously even during _ashata_ painful _vedaniya_ signals circumstance. Pain signal suffering circumstance _–ashata vedaniya_ cannot come near the one who is abiding in the five Agnas at all. Having attained the Self _Atman_ (in the Gnan _Vidhi_ ), the moment one wakes up from sleep, the Self presents instantly; that is called attainment of the Self. And having attained such a Self, there is nothing further left. Therefore, do not fear anything. Go ahead and say, 'let painfulness _vedaniya_ of a hundred thousand fold come.' But pain will not come at all. This Gnan is such that it will maintain _samadhi_ unaffected state, even during _vedaniya-_ pain bearing circumstance. But if you say from the very beginning, 'what if it comes? What if it comes?', then an effect like that will arise. Therefore say, 'come.' None of it will touch if it is invited.

**Questioner:** And bliss arises on top of that!

**Dadashri:** Bliss arises! Whereas here, when the head hurts, he says, 'my head is hurting a lot.' 'Hey you! Is it your head that is hurting or Chandubhai's? You are _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul!' Then he will admit, 'yes its Chandubhai's head. I am _Shuddhatma._ ' Now Chandubhai's head is hurting and in that his head begins hurting. When he says, 'my head is hurting' the suffering gets multiplied by two. The multiplication happens the moment he says, 'my pain.' And if he maintains, 'this is not part of My Self,' he is free from it.

One knows _jaaney_ whether his health is good or not. This confirms that he is separate from the body. Previously it used to be in good health, and that too he knows. He also knows when it is not remaining in good health. Now he knows that it is good. He knows everything.

## The neighbor suffers the pain; I do not.

**Questioner:** Why is it that internal problems _parishaha_ and externally induced difficulties _upsarga_ come only to the _mahatmas_ who take Gnan?

**Dadashri:** What can happen then? Should it stop? They experience less _vedana_ suffering of pain. The impact of a thousand pound ball of steel is experienced as the impact of small pebble; the effect cannot be prevented, it will happen. The _nimit_ the external evidentiary object or person, will not let go without fulfilling its role, will it?

What did Lord Mahavir say? People said,' The celestial beings tested you by tormenting you. Did it not affect you and cause you problems? The Lord replied, ' _Gnani vedey dhairya thhi, agnani vedey roi –_ The Gnani suffers with equanimity, the ignorant one suffers by crying.'

**Questioner:** The Gnani suffers with equanimity, but nonetheless he does suffer, no?

**Dadashri:** _Vedana_ the sensation of pain will not leave but he suffers _vedey_ it with _dhairya_ patience, steadiness and equanimity. Everyone has different capacity and level of patience. Lord Mahavir was only the absolute knower of the sensation. If a bedbug bites him, he would simply know it, and not suffer _vedey_ the bite at all.

For you all this Gnan has happened and is accomplished. But you have become a pure Soul _Shuddhatma_ at the level of _shraddha_ conviction. When you become the Self at the level of Gnan _experience,_ then there will remain only the knowing _jaanavoo_ ; until then suffering _vedavoo_ is there. In the suffering 'we—the Gnani and the fully awakened Lord within' tell You to sit separate (from the sufferer). Do not stir up anything in 'Our (the Gnani and mahatmas of Gnani who have been separated from the non-Self complex') home department. Even if there are constant doorbells ringing, do not leave your place from the home department—the Self. Let the doorbell ring, even if there are twelve hundred rings, why should you leave your office at all?

**Questioner:** But there is a lot of pain in that.

**Dadashri:** There can be no _vedana_ suffering of pain whatsoever at all. Suffering of pain happens because you become Chandubhai. You should not become that. When Chandubhai experiences _vedana_ pain sensation; if You continue to 'see' it _joya karo_ , the pain will stop.

**Questioner:** When I 'see' this _vedana_ suffering of pain, I wonder why it happens to Chandubhai.

**Dadashri:** The _vedana_ pain sensation suffering has to happen to Chandubhai for sure. This is because he had nurtured the causes of this _vedana_ (in the past life). The effect of the causes, are being expressed as pain in this life. It has to happen indeed. You have to tell him that Chandubhai has to have the effect of the pain sensation. When one says why the pain, then know that this has not been prearranged by someone nor is there a superior above you who is doing all this. If indeed someone is interfering in this, then you can ask why this is happening. So therefore You have to say, 'Chandubhai, you deserve this only.'

Its like this. In the _kramik_ path, _vedakata_ suffering is attributed to the soul-self _atman._ Here in Akram this word _vedakata_ has two meanings. _Vedakata_ suffering of pain (or pleasure) applies to Chandubhai and _veda_ component of _vedakata_ means knowing state _janavaa panoo_ and that is applicable to You—the awakened One in Akram Vignan and ultimately the absolute Self. So _vedakata_ can mean suffering and it can also mean knowing. That knowing is Yours that this much _vedana_ suffering of pain arose for Chandubhai. Now if You deliberately slip from this state and become absorbed in the pain as the sufferer, due to the intensity of the pain, then you will experience a greater effect of the pain. If You remain a little distant, then there will be less suffering. But, sooner or later, You will have to settle with it, no?

You are the cub of a lion. All these others will keep confusing and entangling the problems saying, 'why did the stomach hurt? What caused it to hurt?' Then reply, 'It hurt in order to get healed.' In fact, the pain was lying there within, all along. Its time to express _udaya kaal_ had not arisen. So at this time of its unfolding, it will heal, take it easy and go to bed. That which was in stock, has to empty, does it not?

'We' too get physical aches and pains on some rare days, it is not as if it does not happen. 'We' know that now it is happening; the healing has commenced. On that day no one has come to beat me. We know the one who comes to beat, and we know the one who comes to heal.

**Questioner:** Suppose my health deteriorates and I have to undergo an operation to improve it. Do I have to suffer that karma in the next life again?

**Dadashri:** No, no, there is nothing like that. All You have to take care to be aware of is, in this, am I Chandubhai or am I _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul? Then, am I the doer or is _Vyavasthit_ Scientific Circumstantial Evidences, the doer? Then nothing will touch You at all. There will be no seeds planted for You (karma will not be charged for next life). Now the sweet-bitter fruits have to be suffered _bhogavava padey._ If the bitter one comes, the bitter one has to be suffered, if the sweet one comes, the sweet one too has to be suffered.

**Questioner:** Because I underwent an operation, I did not suffer the karma completely, so do I have to complete the suffering in the next life?

**Dadashri:** No, there is nothing of the sort. That in which scientific circumstantial evidences gathered, that karma is now completed and done with, whether one got a hospital in it or whatever else. That means he is not going to be subject to the happening of a new _vedana_ pain sensation event. The old _vedana_ pain that is there is an effect. It is the effect of causes. New causes will not arise.

**Questioner:** Yes, but how long will that effect last?

**Dadashri:** That will last as long as we are living. Simply, You just have to continue 'seeing' the _vedana_ pain sensation. New pain suffering sensations do not arise and the old ones simply have to be 'seen.' 'We—the awakened Ones in Akram Vignan' are their _gnata drashta- '_ knower-seer'!

**Questioner:** I am _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul, I am the 'knower-seer', it feels that way too, but why does the _vedana_ of pleasure and pain that arises in the mind, why does it happen?

**Dadashri:** That must happen, for sure. Whatever the number of cups of tea that you are going to drink in this life, you have brought that along with you, within, and you will have to drink both the bitter and the sweet. When the sweet sensation arises, the mind feels good, when the bitter sensation arises, the mind feels bad, and 'we' are the 'knower' of both. We do not do _raag-dwesh_ attachment-abhorrence.

**Questioner:** Being the 'knower' of them both, thereafter, are we sure that we are not taking steps in the reverse direction?

**Dadashri:** No, not a backward step but we are taking an advancing step. You are proceeding forward with great energy and speed, otherwise I would have had to come to your home and admonish you that why are you doing this after having received such a beautiful Gnan. Despite this if you experience regret, even then my mind (Dadashri) holds that there is no problem. The scripture writers have said that what can be done of the one who has the understanding, but does not take advantage of that? The answer is that whatever was done with lack of understanding, even the merit karma _punyai_ done in lack of understanding, will unfold such that their effect in suffering will also be with lack of understanding.

**Questioner:** Dada, please explain that in more detail.

**Dadashri:** Merit karma _punyai_ performed (created, caused) with lack of understanding result in the suffering of the effect without understanding. And sinful or demerit karma _paap_ performed or caused with understanding result in the suffering of the effect with understanding. So on the basis of this, the _vedaniya_ karma of suffering, harasses a bit. And whom does it harass? Chandubhai. We have no connection with it. For us what does the Self within say? 'It is not this way. It should not be thus.' That is the _vitarag_ the unattached one. That is our _swaroop_ Self-form, the Self. And before it used to be, 'this is how it should be for sure, this is how it is.' Now we remain separate and distant.

As much as You are _gnata drashta_ knower seer, by that much You are the knower of what happens, how much ruffled this neighbor of Yours becomes.

**Questioner:** But Dada, You too are a _gnata drashta_ knower seer, no?

**Dadashri:** Yes, of course, what else then? There is nothing at all for 'Him' except _gnata drashta_ knowing seeing. There is no state beyond it. Except for _gnayakta_ knower ship _gnayak swabhav_ natural state of knowing there is nothing at all, and You too are in that for sure. For You all You have to do is to look after this _padoshi_ neighbor. If the neighbor cries, You are not to cry with him. For the neighbor You just have to Be there and apply Your consoling hand saying, 'I am there for you. I am with you!'

## Dadashri's upayoga while dining

What do 'we—Dadashri' do while having a meal? Longer time is taken in the process of eating. We eat little, and while eating 'we' do not converse with anyone, we do not get into such trouble. So there is _ekagrata_ focused concentration while eating. We are able to chew, so we chew and eat, and in that what taste there is, we do not suffer _vediye_ it but we know _janiye_ it. The people of the world suffer (the pleasure of) _vedey_ it; we simply know it. What beautiful subtle tastes are extracted (by the chewer), and that is known that, it was like this. Exact knowing _jaanavoo_ , suffer subtly _vedavoo_ and suffer it at gross level _bhogavavoo._ People of the world either suffer (pain or pleasure) at a gross level _bhogavey_ or at a subtle level _vedey._

**Questioner:** What is the difference between _bohagavoo_ and _vedavoo_ , Dada?

**Dadashri:** If it is a gross, overt and evident thing or object it is called _bhogavavoo_ and if it is suffered subtly it is called _vedavoo_. The Self is above all this and knows _jaaney_ it all. And through knowing everything is detached and done with. It sticks through subtle suffering _vedavoo._ So when You converse with the one who suffers (enjoys subtly) saying, 'for what purpose are you eating this?' then it becomes free-separate and detached. If You converse with the eater, then You are free and detached.

**Questioner:** Last time around You had said that, 'we' eat with _upayoga_ applied awareness, like what kind of ingredients were used in the final spice frying mixture _vaghar_ in the _kadhee_ yellow colored yogurt and chickpea flour soup. To 'take' the individual taste of each of the ingredients is the _purushartha_ independent spiritual effort, or is there even a more subtle _purusharha_ in this?

**Dadashri :** Yes, there is. In that subtle _purushartha_ things are not necessary. All these are things; there is _bhaat_ rice, _shaak_ curried vegetable, _daal_ curried lentil dish.

So when we eat, we mix the rice and daal and then eat. Then you will not know how genuine the rice grain is, whether it is the fine fragrant Basmati rice or not. Many times, I eat everything separately. Then after a while, I taste it after mixing some part of the food. All food items are taken separately.

What happens by separating is that the one placing the morsel in the mouth is separate, the chewer is separate, the taster is separate. The one who tastes the food is also separate. The one who is satisfied after tasting is also separate, and whether all of them are satisfied or not, the knower of that is separate.

**Questioner:** So are the doers of all these _kriya_ internal and external activity different?

**Dadashri:** If we split them, they are different, otherwise there is one only. When we divide and separate, we understand that it is the hand that is feeding, then the teeth are chewing. Now if the teeth do not do the proper work of chewing then, the one who derives satisfaction _trupti_ will start yelling from within that proper taste is not coming. So therefore chew in such a way that no yell will come from anyone. The one who belches, belches; the chewer chews; then the taster tastes whether its too salty or peppery hot. Then the one who derives the taste, derives the taste. He tastes the full and total taste. He knows that it's a very beautiful taste, but the satisfaction is not his domain. The one deriving the satisfaction _trupti_ takes the satisfaction, and the one who knows all this is the _Atma_ The Self.

Now to keep the presence of the Self, then this is what happens in our Akram Vignan, the eating happens separately. It is not possible to 'eat separately' in _kramik_ the ego-based path to the Self, in _kramik_ one becomes stuck. This is because in the _kramik_ path, the hand is mine, I am the eater, I am the taster, I am the chewer, and I am the one enjoying the taste, and there is no _trupti_ satisfaction and hence there is no _Atma._ He will not experience 'this' _trupti_ satisfaction. Here in Akram it happens with satisfaction. This is because the Self is the total knower. In the _kramik_ there is no Self. It is there as a tiny percentage and to that extent everything is a mixture, and because of the mixture, _trupti_ total satisfaction does not come, temporary satisfaction _santosh_ happens.

## The one who tastes the pleasure has to suffer the pain

**Questioner:** When You talked about _jagruti_ awakened awareness, You talked about remaining in _upayoga_ and then to enjoy the air around. Please explain that to us Dada.

**Dadashri:** If one does not remain in _upayoga_ then just as air brings him the effect _asar_ of pleasure _sukha_ , these other thing brings the effect of pain _dukha._ That means pain arises. The Self is free from all and any effect.

**Questioner:** So as one receives the external relative pleasure, if the same intensity pain comes, one receives that too.

**Dadashri:** When pleasure arises or comes one misses the _upayoga_ awakened awareness that is focused through the Self on the individual components and happenings in the self. Now having taken pleasure from here (the non-Self complex) means pain to will have to be taken for sure. It has to be taken as a matter of a natural law _niyam._ If one is not a customer of this relative pleasure, then one is not a customer of the pain too. And one was going to get its real pleasure—bliss for sure.

**Questioner:** Supposing I have sat down to dine, and if that _shaak_ curried vegetable tasted good; then there is no problem in eating it with gusto and taste, and there is no problem in saying that it is good, no?

**Dadashri:** There is no problem in tasting the good, and to experience the good, but one has to know _jaanavoo_ that.

**Questioner:** What is the method by which one 'knows' that, Dada?

**Dadashri:** That awareness; its name is awareness _jagruti_ ; its name is _upayoga._ There is no method in it.

## Separate during eating is to be separate during suffering

If You know the art of living separately, then _vedana_ suffering of pain will not touch You.

**Questioner:** So then the physical afflictions and pains _aadhi_ do not touch me?

**Dadashri:** Yes. Therefore, for the one who knows the art of remaining separate, all these pains of the body, this atmosphere does not touch Him. Both, the pleasant or the painful, does not touch Him.

**Questioner:** How do I know this art _kada?_ When illness comes, it is difficult to remain separate. Please teach me.

**Dadashri:** But how are You going to remain separate? Do You remain separate while eating? You become _ekakar_ one form- engrossed while eating. If you taste it-become the enjoyer, then it will give its effect will it not? If You remain separate while eating, then only You will remain separate in this _vedana_ physical pain.

**Questioner:** But, by which method am I to remain separate?

**Dadashri:** It has already been said, that who is taking in the food? In that (Chandulal eating), You should not interfere within.

**Questioner:** Correct. Now there is this chronic sinusitis for 60 years for him. How should he remain free from it?

**Dadashri:** When one knows one's Self as without any disease then He verily becomes _mukta_ free ! One is convinced for sure that He is free from disease, and therefore He is free, is He not?

**Questioner:** But how can one establish the surety of being healthy when he has the disease?

**Dadashri:** That verily has to be seen that despite having a disease, He is convinced that he is without disease, and thereafter He remains without disease.

**Questioner:** There is watery discharge draining from the nose, then how can I live? How can I become without disease?

**Dadashri:** Did this gentleman here not suffer a heart attack? In that He was living separate. One can remain separate in that manner. He had an attack, but he said, I am not that, I am separate.' Such _bhaan_ awareness has to happen, no? Otherwise one says, 'It happened to me, this happened to me,' and this gives _asar_ effect.

**Questioner:** I do think that, no, this is not happening to me, it is happening to him. But when pain and suffering arises, then he mixes and becomes engrossed from within.

**Dadashri:** Again he takes it upon himself. Thereafter it happens that I am in pain. The Self neither decreases or increases due to the pain, in all this, so then what else is happening within?

**Questioner:** I am seriously and constantly thinking that pain is not happening to me, not me; but when the pain burst arises, there suddenly it becomes mixed.

**Dadashri:** Therefore whatever taste (pleasure) this body has taken that much aversive taste (pain) will have to be tasted. This is because the loan of pleasures of this body has to be taken on the condition that you will have to pay off the loan in installments. The loan will have to be repaid. Whatever pleasure was tasted, its fruit will have to be suffered. Even in that You are separate. The Self remains the same as it is.

**Questioner:** The Self remains the same. But,'pain happened to me,' should not happen.

**Dadashri:** You invite the pain that does not exist. This head that ached, where did it ache? I have a blooming headache? Has it become a balloon?

This science reaches the level that even if the thumb is cut off, it does not touch the Self. But one cannot remain that still in this era. This era of the Time cycle _kaad_ is weird. Otherwise the knower continues to know, constantly; does not suffer _vedavoo_ at all. It is the _vedak_ the sufferer that suffers _vedey_ through 'this happened to me,' and once this arises, that is the suffering.

**Questioner:** So how is the sufferer _vedak_ to be resolved?

**Dadashri:** Through suffering. Its resolution and settlement _nikal_ will happen through suffering only. That Gnan is unlikely to prevail in this era of the Time cycle. There is no way out but to suffer. But one can try its solutions like these that, 'its not mine.' When one tries all this, it decreases somewhat!

## The way of the Tirthankaras during pain

'We' had learnt the method of the Gnanis and the method of the Tirthankaras which is to believe pain as pleasure. So when the molar tooth is hurting, we know _jaaniye_ that there is pleasure _sukha_ today, a good thing has happened! This is because the psychological effect is such that the self becomes what one imagines _kalpey_ (envisions _chintavey_ ). It is hurting me, saying that, that is how it becomes. If You just say this much that it is hurting Chandubhai, then there is no problem felt. And when pain is happening and one says, there is no one as happy as I am, then one becomes that, but the _bhaav_ vision must not break! But one breaks that _bhaav_ after a while.

It is as the Self that 'we' say that let the body become ill! The Self remains as it is, eternally. And 'we' have become _Atmaroop_ the Self! Having become the Self once, the awareness _laksha_ of the Self (as the Self) remains constantly. How many sins have to be washed before that thing remains continuous! Here all the sins have been finished. The ones that were in the form of steam are gone; the ones that were in the form of water are gone. Only the ones that are in the form of ice remain and they are sticky. Therefore suffering is the only way to be relieved from them. Even I have to suffer them to become free from them.

## Pain suffering : from the experience to the knowing state

**Questioner:** _Veda_ means to know only, but does not _vedavoo_ means to experience?

**Dadashri:** _Veda_ in real terms means to know only. But people are suffering pain _vedey._ Suffering means experiencing, becoming the shape of mind and body _tanmayakar._ That is called _vedey_ suffering. This pain causing problem _dard_ that creates _vedana_ pain sensations, how long and far is its meaning? Its meaning has the whole spectrum from the experience to the knowing of it. Now _vedana_ happens to 'us—Dadashri' and also to this brother here. But I remain in the knowing state and he remains in the suffering state.

**Questioner:** To know means the suffering ceases?

**Dadashri:** To know means one does not become _tanmayakar_ absorbed as 'I am the mind and body, and therefore he does not get the fruit of suffering, he only gets the fruit of knowing. What all is happening in the body, 'we' simply are to continue 'seeing' _joyaa karvanoo_ that. You are _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul, the newly set awareness _laksha;_ and You have to continue 'seeing' what is happening within the body. Continue 'seeing' the sharp pains that are happening in the leg, the molar tooth that is hurting. That it is giving pain means the telephone is reaching. It's a real telephone reaching, but it is reaching the neighbor, but if it feels that ,'its happening to me,' then it begins. 'Not me, its hurting the tooth,' is what You should say. For sure, where is it hurting You? If you say, 'it is hurting me,' then there is a very direct effect. After having become the Self, who will be accused as being 'me'? So then what is this, 'it is hurting me?' Therefore You should say that Chandubhai's tooth is hurting.

If it is hurting, we do come to know that, the _vedana_ sensation of suffering reaches 'us' too. Whatever _bhaav_ intent intensity is there in this from previous life cause, is the effect of _udaya karma_ unfolding karma. That much _vedana_ pain signals will reach You but as the _bhaav_ are let go and shed, by that much the pain signals to will cease reaching. Then there is the knowing only. Here let him suffer, both happens. But it does not happen like before, 'I am Chandubhai and pain is happening to me.' That does not happen. Now You can say as if addressing a neigbor, 'Chandubhai is experiencing pain.' There is no problem in that. If the neighbor is hurting, what is it to You? One may get some indirect spray splashes from the neighbor. But what is one going to gain by crying over and over about the pain? Will it decrease? Instead You should say, 'Pain is happening to Chandubhai.' 'Who is feeling cold?' 'Chnadubhai.' So get a blanket for him. Do the entire worldly interaction with him as if he is a neighbor. Ultimately worldly interaction clearly states that we will have to leave him here, when 'we' leave, will 'we' not? We know that, so why not clear this worldly interaction from the very beginning?

**Questioner:** Now the one who is suffering pain _vedey_ will become the knower of it, is that so?

**Dadashri:** Yes, thereafter gradually He will become the knower only. This is because the _asar_ effects gradually keep diminishing. The effects really speaking do not reach the Self. The reaction of the past that arises, its result has to be suffered. Therefore pain will happen, but what is the solution to decrease it? Say that, 'The tooth of Chandubhai is hurting.' Then if it hurts more, then say, 'it has decreased somewhat.' When you say it has decreased, it decreases. You will get the result of how You say it, this is how this is. And if someone yells, 'Oh my God, I am dying in pain,' then the effect will be accordingly so.

The Self is not troubled at all now. Before the way it used to become trapped in misery, is not the Self. Physical problems will continue to happen, if the head is hurting, You should say, ' Chandulal, I am with you.' The body may get troubled and involved, the head may hurt, the mind may become a bit restless, but nothing happens to the Self _Atma._ And that Self is You. All this is external stock and baggage. It may come out crooked or weird.

## Penance is to remain separate from pain sensations

And it has to be with the four foundation pillars of _Gnan-darshan-charitra and tapa_ experiential knowledge as the Self _Gnan_ -vision as the Self _darshan_ -conduct as the Self _charitra_ and invisible penenace _tapa_. We cannot negate this. Now when do You have to do penance _tapa?_ You are _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul but Chandubhai is standing there too. You have become the Self, but Chandubhai remains the same old self, no? Therefore, Chandubhai may feel suffocation and restlessness within. The heart heats up. But that old companionship of both, is broken, is it not?

Since we have separated as _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul, Chandubhai has to tolerate and suffer, and his _vedakata_ suffering 'touches' the Self subsequently. This is because until the complete experience of the Self happens, the _vedakata_ suffering of pain remains. If that experience becomes complete, then it is called the state of the knower. And if the knowing state is not complete, it is incomplete, then it sticks and therefore it stings and burns. And to keep it separate there, is called _tapa_ penanace. Penance is that which becomes red hot from within. Would it not become red hot? It is likely to arise sometime no? Does penance come?

**Questioner:** Yes it heats up and there is the suffering of pain _vedan_.

**Dadashri:** Now to remain separate in that _vedan_ suffering is called _tapa_ penance ! Then it is called the state of the knowing _janavapanu._ If it is not possible to remain separate in that suffering then it is called _vedakata_ suffering or _vedavapanu_ the state of suffering. In the _kramik_ path there is only the _vedakata_ suffering. Suffering only, no knowing. Here we are in the state of the knowing, but because of the old unfolding stock and its stickiness, a little _vedakata_ suffering of pain may happen. Nonetheless if he sits with the setting that, I am knowing only, then that will remain. What else is there? Its religion verily is of _gnayakpanu_ to continue knowing only.

**Questioner:** The suffering _vedavoo_ may remain for Chandubhai till the end, no?

**Dadashri:** But You are to 'see' that. It may remain, but for You it remains as that to be known, and You are the knower.

**Questioner:** Yes, but Chandubhai has to suffer, no?

**Dadashri:** There is no other way out! He suffers on a rare day, no? So then lead him up to a mirror and say, I am there for you. Such cases do not come 200 times a day do they? Only two or three, no? Chandubhai has a lot to suffer. The pleasant and the good. There is lot of cold (pleasant) and then the hot (unpleasant) comes once in awhile. When it is cold the entire night one gets sleep, no? And when the hot arrives, be done with it. Will you settle and be done with it?

## The sufferer and the knower are absolutely separate

**Questioner:** When the karma of suffering _vedaniya_ unfolds, who is the one that suffers? The pain that arises, who is the knower of that?

**Dadashri:** Ego is the sufferer and _pragnya_ is the knower. _Pragnya_ knows the sufferer _vedak_ too. And this _vedak_ sufferer is suffering _vedey_ the _vedana_ the pain or pleasure signals. Just say that the sufferer _vedak_ is the ego _ahamkar._ Everything comes in the ego. The ego believes that this pain is happening to me only. Therefore he suffers it. That is why it is called the _vedak_ the sufferer. Sufferer means that he is believing that he is suffering. And the _pragnyashakti_ liberating energy of the awakened Self knows all that. Now many of our _mahatmas_ leave out _pragnya_ and therefore they come into _vedakbhaav_ vision-state of suffering, and that increases pain. Nothing else. If the Self becomes _tanmayakar_ shape of mind and body and engrossed as that, then pain will increase.

So if we become mixed with this sufferer _vedak_ then much pain will happen. If one can remain as the _gnayak_ knower then pain will absolutely decrease, there will be no pain at all.

The Self is not the sufferer, _vedak._ The Self is only the knower _jaannar,_ is the knower of the sufferer, and the knower of the pain signals. Therefore the Self is the _gnayak_ knower of the pain sufferer and the pain. Wheras people become the knower of the pain _vedana_ but not the knower of the one who is suffering the pain _vedak._ They say, ' it looks like my headache is a little less now.' He is the knower of the pain, but not the knower of the sufferer. He will also say, 'now the head is really hurting.' For You, You have to say, 'Chnadubhai's head is hurting.' You are the knower and the sufferer suffers within. The one who has the head has to suffer. We have no give or take, no concern, we do not eat or drink, then why should 'our' head hurt?

So see, He knows the pain signals _vedana_. He knows the pain and knows, yes, now the pain has increased-decreased. He knows everything. How can He become the _vedak_ sufferer? He is the _gnayak_ knower of the _vedak_ sufferer. The tooth is hurting. Who is hurting? The sufferer is hurting. And what is hurting the sufferer, what is happening to the sufferer, is known by the knower. When this much vision of separation is there then the suffering will not reach the knower. When one sets a counter pulley in the middle, the pain _vedana_ will not reach the _gnayak_ knower. Do not people use counter pulleys? One puts one pulley this way and another pulley that way and does the weight not decrease by half?

**Questioner:** It does.

**Dadashri:** In this way if we place one such pulley then only the sufferer _vedak_ suffers, and We know that now the sufferer has more pain. The primitive people in the uncivilized area tormented Lord Mahavir a lot and threw stones at Him, insulted Him, and the people saw this, and therefore they concluded that the Lord is suffering a lot. But they cannot 'see' who the sufferer _vedak_ is and who the _gnayak_ knower is. The Lord was the knower only.

**Questioner:** When the other person is hurt we do _pratikraman_. Now when one's body is hurting and there is pain and there one becomes _tanmayakar_ engrossed as the body mind complex, there, does _pratikraman_ have to be done? And if so, what kind?

**Dadashri:** You should just continue 'seeing' that _vedana_ pain signals. _Veda_ means to know and also means to suffer. The Gnanis are in all levels of this, from the suffering to the knowing.

**Questioner:** What if we become _tanmayakar_ engrossed in it?

**Dadashri:** Yes, it happens. When the molar tooth is hurting for me, even if I do not want to become engrossed, it happens.

**Questioner:** At that time _Shuddhatma_ pure Soul is forgotten.

**Dadashri:** Pure Soul is not forgotten. The fact that one does not want to become one with the body mind complex _tanmayakar,_ that Gnan, 'I am pure Soul' verily proves that.

**Questioner:** That comes in awareness later. Initially one becomes engrossed.

**Dadashri:** Yes, but it returns after a second, a minute, no?

**Questioner:** Yes.

**Dadashri:** that means Gnan is present with us. It does not matter that he dosed off, but You have to 'see' that the awareness has returned.

**Questioner:** So does that touch? Does not one need to do something for it?

**Dadashri:** Nothing touches. Such a state has never arisen. Such a state has not even arisen in the sciptures. How can one attain that state? This state that You have received is a phenomenally magnificent state. Therefore guard it very dearly, guard it very well. Because such a state has not arisen in the world at all!

# [ 9.2 ] Pudgal Pleasure versus Bliss of the Self

## Where does true pleasure lie?

Are you searching for _sukha_ pleasure-happiness? In which department did you experience happiness? Where all have you not experienced happiness?

**Questioner:** I do not see happiness anywhere outside at all. In the _pudgal_ non-Self complex of mind, words and body, only burning and pain is seen.

**Dadashri:** In weddings and everything else? You became a father of a little baby girl, is there pain and disturbance in it? Did you see such inner burning before?

**Questioner:** I have seen only pain and burning in the entire life. Is there any possibility for an end to this inner burning that is happening?

**Dadashri:** There is an end to it. The burning is in proportion to the pleasure derived and experienced previously in ignorance.

**Questioner:** That means a lot of pleasure has been derived in ignorance.

**Dadashri:** This here is of that only. It is not the same for everyone.

The pleasure was suffered in a very beautiful way, and that much is the contrary reaction to it! What was believed to be absolutely true turned out to be absolutely false! The suffering of the pleasure was very deep, and therefore its reaction will be very intense too.

**Questioner:** Now it feels as if I simply cannot afford and do with the worldly life.

**Dadashri:** How will you come to ease with it? Is there a way out without suffering the effect? But, if one 'sees' by remaining _gnata drashta_ 'knower' – 'seer' then it will do, and You have to say, 'Oh ho Chandubhai! You have done some really heavy duty karma, so now suffer them.' Then he would not disagree and negate You. Or otherwise when it arises if You say, 'not mine,' then too it will not touch You!

## The one who offends you is greatly beneficial to you

One man tells me, 'it literally feels as if I am being hit in the body, that is how offensive it is! Please do something and bring about a solution for me so that it will all heal. I replied, ' You will not find someone like this to offend and hurt you.' What is the offender saying? 'Go to _moksha_ Liberation. Why are you sleeping around here?' That is very good. Therefore if there is such an offender, be very grateful to him or her. Do not come here to heal that. Do not go to the pharmacist to get some medicine either. Where will you find someone who hurts and prods you? The hugely lucky one gets someone who offends him!

**Questioner:** He is called the one I should be very grateful to. He is my benefactor.

**Dadashri:** Yes. Otherwise such a lucky one will meet heart failure! Yes, but the offender is not generally encountered on a long term basis. The offender verily offends the one who is very near to coming to final Liberation _moksha._ The wife at home too prods, jabs and hurts!

Look! How many offensive hits the people give to this brother here. They have been hitting him _godo marvo_ for six to seven years. Now for the past three years, he has been saying, 'Now I want to go to _moksha_ only. I do not want to go anywhere else.' That has been decided now. This is because when he suffers the hits on a daily basis; will the _moha_ illusory attachment remain? Will _moha_ be there afterwards?

**Questioner:** Then it will not remain.

**Dadashri:** The hits will come from every direction. Now if we try some medicine to heal those hits, then the _moha_ illusory attachment will tend to linger on. There used to be a time when people were hired at great cost to hurt and hit us deliberately. But hired people will not offend us properly, would they? You too would have someone who offends you through subtle and overt hits, no? Everyone has someone that offends him at his home. _Godo_ an offensive or unpleasant hit, is it not a word worth understanding?

**Questioner:** Yes, it is a beautiful talk.

**Dadashri:** That which used to be painful-unpleasant _dukhadayi_ to Us has become the source of happiness _sukhadayi._ Oh ho ho! So wonderful like this! It was a mistake that we used to consider this source-cause of happiness _sukhadayi_ as _dukhadayi_ a reason or source of unhappiness. The one who breaks this mistake, his work is done! 'We—the Gnani Purush' have lived the entire life verily like that. We surely did not try to take any medicine to heal the hurts received from _goda_ offensive treatment from others. If someone or something is not being offensive, or throwing hits at us, we would encourage him or it! So now here this lady is saying, 'Dada why did you move aside the blanket that was shielding your body from the cold?' Then I replied, ' When I cover the body, then sleep comes. If there is an ongoing feeling of a discomfort from the cold air, then _jagruti_ awareness remains. Therefore a thrower of hits-discomfort is needed. So it will bother the whole night long and 'we' say, 'you are and I am.' Say that. In which life have you not slept off? For infinite life times, you have slept off have you not? What else used to be there?

**Questioner:** Those who take a lot of bodily care and comfort are the first ones to take a healing medicine.

**Dadashri:** You had applied a band aid and come here. I had asked you, 'what have you stuck here?'

**Questioner:** I told Dada that, 'This area had a wound and flies were coming a lot there. Therefore I have applied a covering. At that time You said, 'Oh you found a way out with a solution!'

**Dadashri:** People tell me, 'Dada, May I give you a medicine for the cough?' I reply, ' Ah! I am trying to incite the coughing and you are trying to suppress it? Are you trying to heal the coughing? When within, the coughing happens, the 'work' gets done. One knows that these unpleasant hits _goda_ are happening, no? So now if we take a medicine to heal it, then the one sending the hits will cease. Therefore in this _kaad_ era of the Time cycle- one needs a _goda maarnaar_ a deliverer of the unpleasant. I have given You _moksha_ in Your hand. Now if there is a _goda maarnaar_ then the _gaadoo_ oxcart of life will run well again. You too had a lot of _goda maarnaar_ visit you, did You not?

**Questioner:** When someone insults me, then more _jagruti_ awareness is there.

**Dadashri:** Then why do you not keep a _baadha—_ a self imposed inner conditional contract that until this happens, I will deny myself this item of food or drink etc.? If you keep someone's such a _baadha,_ then someone will come along to offend and insult you. You are having a hard time finding a doer, No? One man was saying, ' all night long it felt as if someone was hitting me with unpleasant stuff. Please do a _vidhi-_ special silent blessings- for that, Dada.' I repled, 'if it gives unpleasant hits its very good. Your merit karma _punyai_ has awakened mooah- special term used by Dadashri to awaken the listener. What does the one dishing out the unpleasant offensive stuff say? Go to Liberation _moksha._ So such an offender is good for you, no?

## The conviction that the body is pain generator

Does this body give unhappiness and pain or not? Has that conviction taken hold for You or not? This body is constantly _dukhadayi_ the source of pain and misery. Nonetheless has that conviction arisen?

**Questioner:** Yes the body is the source and cause of pain.

**Dadashri:** What pain _dukha_ does it give?

**Questioner:** The head would hurt!

**Dadashri:** When the head does not hurt it is _sukhadayi_ pleasure giving indeed, is it not? What is it in the body that gives pain? So now, in the middle of the summer in the afternoon if the air conditioner shuts off, then you will know, likewise, at such times You do not remain aware _jagrut_ and otherwise generally you are seeking pleasure. The conviction becomes established that it is indeed constantly the generator and source of pain _dukhadayi._ Tell 'him', 'why are trying to find pleasure in it over and over again?' This getting up every morning to go to the toilet, and the experience of bodily miseries all show that it generates pain. It can not be called _sukhdayi_ source of pleasure for sure. This entire _bhanjghad_ the trouble of destruction-creation has happned because of the fact that you take pleasure from it! You are seeking pleasure from it.

'We' admit that when there is a lot of cold in the nights of winter, we move away the warm covers over the body. Then 'we' do that which makes me feel cold all night. Therefore the conviction that the body is pain generating _dukhadayi_ remains continuously. That conviction has to become firmly established.

There is no pleasure in this body even for a _ghadi_ 24 minutes. The conviction that the mind brings pain has been established, the conviction that speech also brings pain has been established, but this body is the source of pain _dukhadayi,_ that conviction has not been established. One knows when the air onditioning quits suddenly or when it remains on in mid winter. Then one will say, 'please stop it, I am freezing.'

Really speaking it is the mental pain that is dominant and excessive all around. The body too is the source of pain continuously, and it is on the basis of merit karma effect _punyai,_ that one gets all this and the _gaadoo_ the oxcart of this life goes on. One eats _bhajias_ -fried delicacies, _jalebi_ crisp sweet sour fried golden rings in saffron laden syrup and thus the taste has increased! One gets to eat ice cream and that cools the stomach within!

**Questioner:** Dada, all that comes to the one seeking it, but awareness _jagruti_ decreases due to it all?

**Dadashri:** No. It will not let the conviction that this body is the source of pain _dukhadayi_ take hold, so what can happen? Therefore, what is written in his account of karma will come for sure.

## The comforts makes one a pleasure seeker

The matter has to be simply understood. In this any other interference will not be useful. We should try to decrease externally induced problems _upadhi_ by whatever means possible. These five Agnas of ours are such that no externally induced problem _upadhi_ can remain for sure. There is nothing in it that is problematic at all. I took upon me the investigation of experience regarding the fan, to find out what happens. Before, I did not use to have a fan in the home. Up to 1956 I had nurtured and nourished the quality called _titiksha_ to apply patience and suffer that which is unpleasant to the body. I used to sleep on a thin woven cloth mat on the floor as a daily sleep routine, and I did not keep-use a fan. Then the friends would come and say, 'you do not keep a fan because you are a _tapasvi_ hardship tolerating individual, but what about us? Then I said, go ahead and set up a fan. It was because the fan was set that this body has become _shatashilia_ comfort seeking.

A farmer who tills the land wears shoes daily, and the day he does not cover his feet, his feet will get burnt. Otherwise the body will become such that it will not burn. Therefore, now that one has become _shatashilia_ comfort seeking, one will have to become dependent. When the fan is not available, then one becomes dependent! And for Me it is problem to place _upayoga_ applied focused awareness of and as the Self—anywhere externally. So I am talking about Myself. So understand this point of talk. Do not stop the fan, but do believe that the fan is not beneficial for you.

Therefore, that experience is not beneficial for our _mahatmas._ We cannot say anything to the outside people. The outside people are seeking external _sukha_ pleasure and you are seeking internal _sukha,_ eternal bliss _sanatan sukha._ I am simply sharing my experience.

**Questioner:** Why only a fan? There are so many other things that are not good for us.

**Dadashri:** The other things are not to be seen, or watched out for. This fan is a little important. The other things do not touch you directly. The fan touches you directly. There is no problem of other things. Among the rest, the people in the home bring a refrigerator, where is the harm to you in that? They may say, drink this ice water. You can say no to that if you do not like to drink it. If the people in the home use a phone or a radio, what does it matter to you? If there is a clash, it happens to them, how does it affect you? This fan is the only thing that can 'touch' you.

The one who does not have any need for an external help and still does it, it is fine with us. Our path is the path without any objections. He on the other hand gets stuck on the spot where he believes and would insist, 'I cannot live without a fan.' So you have to say, that is right, that is how it is. If possible, bring a fan, that is what we say. Whoever has whatever need, such a one indeed has the necessity for it.

**Questioner:** Did you say that one should not become a _shatashilia_ comfort and pleasure seeking?

**Dadashri:** One becomes a _shatashilia_ due to external comforts and conveniences available. And when these are not available then he creates problems. This body _sharira_ is ready to remain however you keep it.

There is no necessity; one had deliberately formed this habit. The wrong habit of the fan has been formed. And I got completely chilled (awakened) after my experiment. Is this (being used to comforts) called a method of progress? And when 'we' go to Ahmedabad, they air condition the place., saying, 'Dadaji is going to stay at my home. He does not know that I have no need for air conditioning. I need the kind of air conditioning that prevails even after I leave your home and step out into the hot air on the way to another _satsang_ (bliss of the Self). This here is such that the momemt you step out there is the hot furnace like heat...what will happen if you come out from the cool air of the air-conditioned home? It would feel like hot coals. That is why the Lord said, that do not become _shatashilia_ used to bodily comforts. This is what is called _shatashilia._

This body has to be trained somewhat no? The Lord has said to tolerate 22 types of _parishaha_ pain suffering situations. In that I am saying no, I am not even mentioning those to you. If I do, you will all get apprehensive, so it is better that I do not say it.

**Questioner:** But Dada, this body is seeking external pleasure _sukha,_ no?

**Dadashri:** But, You do do not have to seek pleasure. You have received inner bliss. The one who has not received this will seek external pleasure. The One who has received inner bliss will be fine if he does not get the external pleasure, will he not? These words are not for the one who has not received inner bliss. What can such a person do? But here, the person is seeking outside only. Some even wait saying, Yes, finally the cool wind has come, ah it has come.' Enjoy it if it is not going to go away, but then he will say, 'ah, it's gone.'

This is the kind of dependence that remains in man. See, the Lord has said to tolerate 22 types of _parishaha_ pain bearing situations. Is it not written in the book?

**Questioner:** Yes, it is written that the difficulties have to be tolerated.

**Dadashri:** Yes. That is not what I am telling you at all. All I am saying is that if it is like this for a bit, Your _upayoga_ awakened awareness will remain within. Otherwise the _upayoga_ applied awareness will keep buzzing on the external only. The slightest discomfort from heat and your attention will remain on the outside only. Nonetheless, if the fan is running on its own, do not stop it. If it is running, settle with equanimity, but do not believe that there is _sukha_ happiness-pleasure in it. It is because you have believed that there is pleasure in it that you believe that there is pain in that other. Hence the _upayoga_ runs in the other place.

What would be the condition of the person who has come outside of an air conditioned room? Tell me that. Who discovered these fans etc.? They are the people from foreign countries. By which method? That which was discovered for them have taken hold here. Otherwise, for us, only the kings had fans. At other places there would be some ordinary fans, and that only if he is a big businessman. Otherwise, for the one who is working all day, what kind of fan does he need? Nature is indeed trying to help you in every way. When breeze is needed a mild breeze does flow. It helps you in everyway, and allows whatever amount of perspiration that has to happen, arise. Thereafter, if we live a life not in conformity with nature, then what is its meaning? This is not a talk that concerns our religion. This is just to know.

If you have a fan, stop it for fifteen minutes to half an hour, 'see' and remain in _upayoga,_ then You will not need the fan. The one who lives in _upayoga_ will not have a need for the fan at all. This fan is needed as long as the _upayoga_ is external only. Even then, we are not denying it. And even if Yours is in the external, if within that Your awareness is, 'I am the Self,' then it is more than enough. There is no problem. Even then what is wrong with proceeding further a little more? Is there a problem?

**Questioner:** Whatever things there are in the home, if any of them get damaged, then the entire 'soul' goes in it. I can tell you my story that I had not known about a refrigerator for seventy years, and one day when it did not work, I turned the whole home upside down.

**Dadashri:** Yes, that is how it is, for sure. All of this is an _aafat_ only. _Upadhi_ is a different thing and _aafat_ is a different thing. _Upadhi_ is an external problem that arises and _aafat_ an external problem that is created and invited. What happens to you is natural. All this is _aafat._

When I did not have Gnan, Hiraba (Dadashri's wife) would say, 'that faucet has gone bad.' And _upadhi_ arises for me. Then I have to go, and bring him (plumber) that is _upadhi._ That is a necessary thing, no? But these others are unnecessary _aafats._ People bring television and other things, do they bring just a few things home? The eyes 'go-get strained' and that too an _aafat._

**Questioner:** The television once stopped working at a very important time so people all around started saying, ' tv is not working?' Because the tv is not working the entire _atma_ is in it.

**Dadashri:** Yes everything goes in it. Een then, we should not have any scorn for it, no? This is because the other person will do what is convenient for him. Our own son at home may be doing what pleases him, can we say no? If you say no, _dwesh_ aversion will arise.

And when one is in _upayoga_ awakened awareness as the Self—nothing remains. In _upayoga_ there is no awareness whether there is heat or cold, nothing of the sort. If the young boy is giving his final examinations and writing a paper; and if the fans have quit, he would have no knowledge of it. If the lawyers are pleading intensely in front of a judge who is listening carefully, if the fans quit, they would not even know it. It is when one becomes free from work that he realizes it. That is the external _upayoga._ It keeps wandering incessantly. Even then I say, there is no problem. Do even this much, even if its little. Does he remain in the five Agnas? Let the fans turn but remain in the five Agnas. But know for sure and keep that knowledge that this thing is laden with mistake. It is not as if I do not use a fan. Even I use a fan. Now deducting a little by little from that one approaches the original location—the Self.

Now we walk around with these shoes and on some day some robber takes away our shoes, and we have to walk out in mid day sun, and then what will be our state when we walk on that sand and that tarmac road? Now the feet of the farmer are such that they adjust simply. Nothing happens to him, nor does he have any necessity. It is the law of nature that however much one needs, that need is simply taken care of, for sure. So then, why should we not take advantage of that law? That verily is the law of nature. This is so, because You are independent. Nature is subservient to You. You spoil that which is correct by nature.

I have 'seen' my absolute independence; I have experienced it. Thereafter Gnan has happened to Me.

## Watch out! You will have to repay them!

Our _sukha_ pleasure enters it. Then we get it, back from it. Now we establish a belief that the pleasure _sukha_ lies in that _pudgal_ non-Self complex- living or non-living. But, when that very _pudgal_ non-Self complex gives _dukha_ pain, then the mind says, why is he or she doing this in this manner? Then one will not like the very _jalebi_ sweet thing; that used to be pleasant and pleasure giving. Therefore, one has to repay it back. There is no _sukha_ pleasure in it, and to take pleasure from it necessarily calls for repaying it back, for sure. To keep it back where it used to be, only when we do this, we will be become clean, otherwise it will not happen, will it? All these are your imaginations only. As many turns you wind around it here, exactly that unwinding turns of repayment you will have to make over there. The established arrangement _gothavani_ is yours. None amongst all that, is anything new that is arising.

**Questioner:** Whatever _sukha_ pleasure has been taken from the _pudgal_ non-Self complex (living, one's own, or someone else's, or a non-living object); will it have to be repaid without fail?

**Dadashri:** They will have to be repaid by some method or another. That bank does not belong to our father. 'We-Dadashri' do not take anything and therefore we do not have to repay anything.

**Questioner:** This one thing is clear for our _mahatmas._ The pleasure _sukha_ does not arise from the mind, speech or body.

**Dadashri:** They are merely repaying it, in this manner; not doing anything else. They have to do it even if they do not want to. They have to do it even if they do not like it, no? That is all called the 'repayment.'

**Questioner:** So there is no further repayment for it, is there?

**Dadashri:** This verily is the repayment.

**Questioner:** So then, the pleasure that happens to get tasted through the mind, the pleasure that happens to get tasted through words, and the pleasure _sukha_ that happens to get tasted through the body; 'I' am simply to 'know' it. If 'I' 'know' it then it will not stick, will it?

**Dadashri:** Nothing touches the 'knower' _jaannaar._ Everything touches the sufferer _bhogavnaar._ Which external pleasure that is taken by us does not have to be repaid? If it is given to me without my asking for it in the least, without any desire, and I drink it, then I do not have to repay it. Every other pleasure has to be repaid.

## Thus are the pains of mind and speech

**Questioner:** Please give an example of taking pleasure through the mind.

**Dadashri:** All of this is through the mind only, no? When it is very hot and a breeze comes along, then pleasure is experienced. Where did that pleasure come from?

**Questioner:** Through the mind.

**Dadashri:** Yes. When one is burnt, and a cool lotion is applied, then? Ah nice! He may even fall sleep! That is because the _sukha_ pleasure arose.

**Questioner:** What are the pleasures of the speech like?

**Dadashri:** After scolding you angrily, when the husband apologises saying, please forgive me, my mind is the weird and crazy one,' you will experience pleasure. When the previous pain is wiped out, the pleasure _sukha_ of speech is experienced. The husband will say, ' my mind is spoiled, I hurt you a lot.' She will reply, 'No there is nothing of the sort. There is no problem.' She will forget all the taunts he has made. One needs to know how to use such keys.

## The understanding nurtures the power of the 'bearing'

Sleep takes over when the breeze from the fan comes; so then what is the difference is left between an animal and us? That much time of ours goes to waste. How can one derive pleasure from that? It is called pleasure of the non-Self _para nu sukha._ When one suffers the pleasure of that which is of the non-Self, then the bliss of the Self _swa sukha_ stops coming.

**Questioner:** Dada, does that really mean, that there is no problem in (enjoying) suffering _bhogaviye_ pleasure, but one is not to become dependent on it or become very captivated and engrossed in it?

**Dadashri:** Spend and use if your energy to tolerate (pain) does not decrease. It does decrease thus. Man has all the 'bearing' (tolerance) power. Those bearings then get worn out. They get worn out in this, just as the bearings get worn out in the machines. Otherwise the bearing power is there for sure.

**Questioner:** So then what should be done to nurture and increase that 'bearing' power, Dada?

**Dadashri:** What is there to be done? Simply understand. And decide firmly that 'it' is there and 'I' am here. Then say, ' go on, come on.'

## To sleep is to lock the Self in a sack

**Questioner:** Dada, what would You say about sleep of six hours? Or should it be decreased to three to four hours or even less?

**Dadashri:** There is no necessity to go to sleep at all. Sleep will come on its own for sure. One can have the benefit of four hours of sleep in just a quarter of an hour. There may be a dozing nod head drop this way! Even then go ahead and go to sleep. But keep the state within _jagrut_ awakened awareness state. Set everything within and then go to sleep.

**Questioner:** How should one keep the awareness _jagruti_ within?

**Dadashri:** If You set it, it will remain. Let 'Dada' sit within first, then keep 'doing' 'I am pure Soul.' Do the _niddidhyasan_ (envisioning process through purified _chit_ ranging from overt visual contemplation of 'Dadashri' to the subtlest levels of the Self and the non-Self) of 'Dada' every night until sleep comes. Then fall asleep _oonghee javoo._ If the sleep does not come, remain in _upayoga—_ awakened awareness applied to the Self and the non-Self. This _upayoga_ is maintained by remaining in the _niddidhyasan_ of _Dada,_ the envisioning of the entire encounter with the Gnani Purush. As that remains, if sleep comes, then fall asleep again. When you are awake again, return to _upayoga_ again. Maintaining _upayoga_ is necessary for _moksha._ The _sukha_ pleasure that arises in sleep is pleasure on external dependence _paradhin._ It is not Your pleasure. It is externally dependent and is dependent on the sense organs _indriya_ and the body. There are quite a number of people who pinch themselves in sleep to remain in _upayoga._ And for You, it is possible to remain in _upayoga_ without resorting to any unnatural ways _sahajasahaj,_ so then keep that level of _upayoga._ Otherwise the pleasure of sleep is called _pudgal sukha_ pleasure of the non-Self complex. It will not let You go to _moksha._

One needs an 'awakener'. Otherwise cover your self and continue sleeping. One should not lock up this 'Self _Atman'_ in a sack and keep it that way. Yet, behold, human beings do exactly that, lock it up in a sack and go to sleep! How can one waste that time thus, after one has met Dada, met Gnani ! One wraps it all up in a bundle and then goes to sleep in ease, like tying a sack!

**Questioner:** That is true Dada, one simply does not have such awareness at all, one is involved in pampering and protecting the self only. One is fond of suffering the pleasure only.

**Dadashri:** What is this to be suffered _bhogavavoo_ ? That conviction _shraddha_ faith will not break. Your conviction that there is pleasure in sleep must break. Sleep is the pleasure of _pudgal_ non-Self complex, it is not Yours! It is that _shraddha_ conviction of yours that lingers on the _pudgal_ even now. That _pudgal_ (non-Self complex under the constant changing influence of SCE) can never be the source of pleasure _sukhadayi_ at any location, at all. One is sleep, and the other is sex, these two are the two major tormentors. The deceivers are these two.

**Questioner:** But Dada sleep must have been intended as a natural gift, no?

**Dadashri:** That is for the one who wants to wander life after life. When a warm covering comes to me in a cold night, I move it away slightly from the body. When the cold air is felt, it remains awake, and thus 'we' remain awake all night. And if that is not the case, then when the coughing bout begins, it keeps me awake. Then 'we' remain in _upayoga._

I used to cover the body with only one _shawl_ instead of two! Deliberately, otherwise if cold is not felt, then 'it' will sleep the whole night, and therefore some spark is needed for the body. Yes, otherwise, everything will go in sleep. If good food has come on the plate, he overeats it and then snores away in deep sleep. It should not be like that, a little low grade spark of awareness is necessary for sure. The world will give very beautiful things to cover the body at bedtime, who would not? The people of the world fall into sleep after covering themselves with comfortable covers, and they will also try to do the same for you, and if you do that, you will lose out. You will sustain a loss. It can only happen if you use the cover.

For a very long time now, even if the health has taken a turn for the worse, whatever may have happened in the night, we wake up at exactly six thirty in the morning. When we wake up the time shows that it is six thirty for sure. But really 'we' have not slept in the night. For two and a half hours, 'our' internal _vidhis_ are going on. The _satsang_ ends everynight at eleven thirty. At midnight 'we' go to bed. 'We' do not take these wordly pleasures like pleasure of sleep. When this person has had a good sleep, he says in the mind, 'today very good sleep came.' But he does not know where the pleasure came from. This has come from _pudgal_ non-Self complex, it has not come from the Self. When you taste the pleasure from the _pudgal_ then the bliss of the Self _atmasukha_ will stop coming, cease to express. This is because, there is still the tenacious companionship _sobat_ of sleep, is there not? Do people derive pleasure from sleep or not? The habit of delving into material pleasures _bhoutik sukha_ has not gone yet, has it? Should this habit not leave? Sleep is heavier than sex. The woman may even scold you, but here one just curls up in a fetal position and goes to sleep. Have you ever curled up in a fetal position and gone to sleep?

**Questioner:** I used to go to sleep covering myself with two comforting blankets. After hearing this from Dada, I gave up one.

**Dadashri:** You did a good thing. You do not have to do anything. It is this Gnan—heightened awareness and experience of the Self—verily will do the work. This Gnan verily will present and bug You from within. And 'we' move the covering away from the feet, when the time comes to cover and sleep, so that there is no need to prod from within. That is why 'we' say that 'we' do not sleep. The Lord—Bhagwan has not slept for a second even. This is because there is constant state of _jagruti_ awareness. What kind of state? The eyes may be closed. The body may sleep, but the inner one is awake _jagrut._ This means it is not _ghasghasaat_ snoring away in deep slumber. Have you seen the _ghasghasaat_ of people? He will awaken in the morning and say, 'today very good sleep came!'(Please note: That is how they say it in Gujarati or Hindi. They do not say, 'I slept off very well') . That means greater pleasure _sukha_ came. Hey Mooah—the dying one! Was sleep a _bibi_ wife that you-mooah slept with the wife? People go on sleeping with sleep. The scriptures have not scared you thus; know that!

## Absolute enlightenment is obstructed by the taste of pudgal

**Questioner:** The expression of absolute Self, _keval Gnan_ comes to a halt if one takes pleasure from _pudgal_ the non-Self complex.

**Dadashri:** Why even bring absolute knowledge _keval Gnan_ here? All this current Gnan has halted here due to that. This other is the following of the Agnas, what else? Gnan from here onwards means whatever _anubhav_ experiences ( _as the Self)_ happen; that much is correct. That _darshan_ vision as the Self, has happened already and completely so. Where or what else Gnan is there at all? When is the _rus_ the taste of pleasure and the deriving of pleasure- going to cease? What is the meaning of asking about that which does not come to a conclusion, end, or cease?

**Questioner:** I have made the firm discision _nischaya_ that I do not want to taste any _rus_ pleasure from _pudgal_ non-Self complex.

**Dadashri:** You are verily tasting this _rus_ pleasure. You would not know it . You will procced in that awareness slowly. Take the next step, after one task is complete, do what is needed today to decrease this. Take into your awareness, what you are doing today. Are you deriving any pleasure from sleep now? Did good sleep come? Do you enjoy it?

**Questioner:** When sleep comes thus, pleasure comes to the mind _maja_ , but in that, now I decide that I should wake up at five or four in the morning.

**Dadashri:** None of that, all that is done by the _agnani_ the one who is not Self realized, too. This is _pudgal sukha_ pleasure from the non-Self complex; that is all; know it as separate from You! _Mahatmas_ have no inkling of this at all! If You have understood that it is wrong to taste this pleasure, then decrease it in whichever way you can.

## Initially absolute conviction is needed

Is this matter about going to _moksha_ decided for You or is it going to change a little?

**Questioner:** No, no. That can never change _._ The decision has been made resolute. How should it be from one's own perspective to ensure that the decision does not change?

**Dadashri:** One should have the _pratiti_ conviction that except for the Self, bliss _sukha_ does not exist anywhere else.

**Questioner:** What is the foundation-basis on which such a conviction _pratiti_ can rest?

**Dadashri:** When one receives true knowledge; the conviction will always set on that which is true. If someone serves you a boiling cup of tea, you would not start sipping it immediately, would you? No, because the conviction _pratiti_ has set for you that it will burn your tongue. _Pratiti_ unflinching conviction, does not let you forget anything. The knowledge that comes from _pratiti_ will not let you forget. Even a mad person will not forget if _pratiti_ sets in.

**Questioner:** The matter of the tea is one thing, but in matters of the path of _moksha_ , what all can be there?

**Dadashri:** All this that is there, it is all the _pratiti_ the unflinching conviction that has taken hold.

**Questioner:** So he has to remain in the conviction of the bliss of the Self _Atma sukha_ in all matters and circumstances?

**Dadashri:** It has to be so. It can only work if there is conviction that does not waver _pratiti._

**Questioner:** One has to walk on the path of _moksha_ with the conviction that except for the Self there is no happiness-pleasure _sukha_ anywhere, so if interest arises elsewhere, what is one to do?

**Dadashri:** It scatters away when one does not want anything. This happens to the One who has the ongoing conviction that there is no pleasure outside the Self. Those pleasures fall away.

Now if the conviction _pratiti_ has set that coughing bouts start after eating _chevdo-_ spicy Indian snack mixture, then the moment he sees _chevdo_ he will know from within that here comes a problem. That is the definition of _pratiti._ He will not forget it even if he is not in his full senses. He will not forget it even if he is drunk. Conviction means conviction exists. Either there is no conviction or else the conviction is weak, it is not strong.

**Questioner:** So then if another interest arises, it means that this conviction is not there; does it not imply that?

**Dadashri:** No. That _pratiti_ conviction ( I am pure Soul) and interest are different from each other. The interest can arise in the presence of the existent _pratiti._ Both may be together.

**Questioner:** How is that?

**Dadashri:** Where there is conviction, there is no interest and where there is interest, there is no conviction. People are caught up and entangled in this confusion. Both are there, the interest and the conviction. The One with conviction _pratiti_ is different (the Self), and the one with interest (the non-Self) is different too.

**Questioner:** Who are they exactly?

**Dadashri:** You have to recognize them promptly. Check who has the interest and who has the conviction.

**Questioner:** When the interest arises, by what method should it be cut off?

**Dadashri:** There is no method for it. Just become disinterested.

## Lack of reaction to pain happens after Gnan Vidhi

**Questioner:** I 'see' anything that happens to Chandubhai (the self) but then why does bliss not arise?

**Dadashri:** Bliss _anand_ does happen. If bliss does not happen then what happens? Tell me. Do worries happen? You are seeking a separate bliss. There are two types of _anand_ bliss. First, there is the lack of reaction _abhaav_ to worldly pain, and there is no higher bliss than that (in the relative world). And secondly, there is the experience _sadbhaav_ of the bliss as the Self _swabhavik sukha_. This exists 'there, it will not be received here, where the body is. The exact experience of the bliss of the Self as the Self is there. Whereas, here, despite living in the world, the lack of reaction _abhaav_ to pain _dukha_ has been called the highest _anand_ bliss. What kind of bliss _anand_ are you seeking? That which tickles? Then it will not do. All that exists outside, does it not? Why don't you go out there and get tickled? Otherwise bliss means Wow...neither _akudata_ disturbance nor _vyakudata_ turmoil and external disturbance but _nirakudata_ beyond disturbance and turmoil. _Nirakudata_ the unaffected bliss state is a quality of the _Siddha_ the absolutely enlightened Soul without a body, and it is that _anand_ bliss. It is called _nirakudata._ Will bliss of the Self prevail? Are you still seeking the temporary pleasure that tickles?

**Questioner:** The talk had arisen that first begins the insulation-lack of reaction to worldly pains _dukha no abhaav_ and then one 'feels' the bliss of the Self _sukha no sadbhaav._ So then until the external activity of lack of reaction to worldly pains ceases, will the exact experience of the bliss of the Self not come?

**Dadashri:** Bliss in the world is defined as the lack of reaction to worldly pains, for sure. This is because there is no other bliss, is there? That other is the expression of _param anand_ absolute bliss, and it is natural as the Self _swabhavik._

**Questioner:** But is it not different from this? Is the bliss that is from the absolute bliss as the Self not altogether different from the bliss that is felt because of the lack of reaction to worldy pains _dukha_?

**Dadashri:** That is not _sukha_ pleasure at all. That is the naturally expressing bliss _swabhavik anand._ Bliss of all types remains continuously there.

**Questioner:** That _sukha_ bliss that is experienced currently due to lack of reaction to worldly pains is the reason why the process of understanding that other absolute bliss does not arise?

**Dadashri:** It is like this. Even though the gold has been absolutely purified, it may still be lying in the furnace. Even then nothing happens, no effect is there to the gold that has become _shuddha_ pure, despite being in the very hot furnace. Later when it comes out as an ingot of gold, what is it like? Is the furnace not gone? Likewise, this is a furnace for sure. There is no pain _dukha_ of the furnace. The body is there, but there is no pain of the body.

The entire world is seeking insulation from pain. And when it happens, they call this insulation from pain- lack of reaction to pain, _sukha_ pleasure. That is not the right method of attaining bliss. The space-time interval- between two pains _dukha_ is called pleasure _sukha_ by the people of the world. One type of pain has arisen and has gone away and a new pain has not arisen, and until then one feels pleasure. Really it is not pleasure _sukha._ It is the lack of _dukha,_ the non-feeling _abhaav_ of pain that is identified as _sukha_ pleasure for sure. People are searching for such pleasure. And the Self is by its very nature _sukhio_ blissful. However, the only difference is that there is the Self in the furnace and the Self that has come out of the furnace. That much difference is there in this. In the furnace the absolute bliss experience _sukha no sadbhaav_ , is not experienced.

**Questioner:** That which arises after having come off the furnace is the absolute bliss of the Self, Dada?

**Dadashri:** That verily remains (continuously) as the _anand_ bliss. And its beginning is in the furnace. But, the total-absolute bliss comes when one becomes free from the furnace.

The deeper one slips into _sansaar—_ worldly interactions through _pudgal_ experience—that much pain increases for him. If He does not enter there, there is no pain. When there was no Gnan, this verily was the business. 'This is who I am and this is my knowledge.' Having taken Gnan, 'I am not this, and this is not mine.'

**Questioner:** Therefore the bliss started prevailing because He (the awakened One) ceased going deeper in _sansaar_ worldly life interactions.

**Dadashri:** That verily is the beginning of the prevalence-experience _vartey_ of bliss _sukha._ And 'we—the Gnani and the fully enelightened One within' have burnt the sins to ashes! We have burnt the sins to ashes. That is why everything appears lightened (light as less weight load) and awareness _jagruti_ remains, otherwise there is no awareness! The entire world is sleeping, that is what the scripture writers have said. In that _kramik_ path, the pain remains until the very end, until the last life, and for us all here, the insulation, the lack of any suffering from pain _dukha no abhaav_ , happens for sure. This is so because the entire Self has been attained. In that other _kramik_ path, there is a step-by-step attainment of the Self and there is pain associated with the part that is not yet attained. Here it is Akram, so one attains the entire Self.

**Questioner:** The lack of any suffering from the pain through _pudgal_ non-Self mediated experience—happens after Gnan Vidhi comes to experience after taking the Gnan, and that happens immediately for sure.

**Dadashri:** It happens.

**Questioner:** Yes, and thereafter, the absolute bliss of the Self that should happen, would happen, I remain more in the Agnas within Gnan...

**Dadashri:** The stock that you have brought forth from past life, as it gets used up, by that much the exact experience as the Self _swa sukha sad bhaav_ happens, that _sukha_ bliss continues to open.

**Questioner:** Now that _sukha_ pleasure and this _sukha_ bliss; that one has a relative insulation-absence of-suffering _abhaav_ from pain of the world, and this _sad bhaav_ right view-experience bliss, is there a difference between the two, Dada?

**Dadashri:** There is a difference. This insulation that has happened from suffering of pain feels like a great ease _nirant_. And for that other _sukha no sadbhaav_ bliss as the Self to happen, is a different matter altogether. Such a One has entered the natural blissful state. To be insulated from, to be indifferent to, to be in relative absence of pain (worldly or personal, physical or mental) is not the naturally expressing-spontaneously experiencing- _swabhavik_ bliss of the Self.

**Questioner:** That arising and happening of the absolute bliss as the Self _sukha no sad bhav_ is dependent on His _purushartha—_ highest inner efforts after enlightenment and separation as the Self—no?

**Dadashri:** Only if the stock within finishes.

**Questioner:** If one can get the company of the Gnani Purush, then that stock will automatically finish for sure.

**Dadashri:** Then it will empty, that verily is the way. There is no other way. If one gets His companionship then it is more than enough.

## The first stage of moksha

What is this Gnan? There is liberation in worldly interacting life _sansaar._ This liberated state is there for you as a worldly being. Even as a worldly being, there is _moksha_ liberated state, _vitaragata_ absolute detachment, and _raag-dwesh_ attachment-abhorrence will not happen from here on. Now, let me explain to you, what is meant by _moksha_ in worldly life interaction. What You are seeking, do not seek that now. That will come for You on its own, automatically. To become liberated as a worldly being, to have _moksha_ in _sansaar_ means freedom from the pain of the world!

This world is suffering from pain only and what does it ask and beg for? 'Oh God, free me from this pain.' This is the _vitarag_ absolutely detached path that liberates one from all pains; all those pains have been destroyed now. But production of that other—absolute bliss—has not begun yet. Why is that? You have made overdrafts in the past life and that is what you have to pay in the bank of this life, daily. These will finish in five to ten years, someone may have brought forward more overdrafts, but that too will finish within ten to fifteen years. These are the overdrafts (unsettled accounts) that you have carried forward in this life. So freedom from these pains is called the first stage of _moksha._ And freedom from the gross body is the last _moksha._ So do not seek it. It will come on its own. Once we have finished paying off our overdrafts, it will be there!

## Experience the bliss of the Self

The _anand_ (happiness here) that was there before Gnan was temporary _anand_. After Gnan true _anand_ bliss arises. Initially the _anand_ that happens through our _satsang_ and talks but it will not last forever. Now one's own natural Self bliss _swabhavik anand_ will arise.

**Questioner:** Is _anand_ not called _sukha_ pleasure?

**Dadashri:** No. There is a lot of difference between _anand_ bliss and _sukha_ pleasure. No one has even seen-felt that bliss of the Self _swa sukha_ , not even its shadow. This other _sukha_ pleasure here is a _vedana_ reception of signals. What our people call pleasure _sukha_ is called _vedana._ There is the _vedana_ of pleasure-sweet and the _vedana_ of pain-bitter.

**Questioner:** This _anand_ bliss that comes, where does it come from?

**Dadashri:** The very nature of the Self is bliss. Therefore, it is not to be brought from outside. If one remains the Self _Atmarupa_ then bliss only will remain continuously. It does not have to be acquired from outside, whereas _shanti_ peace has to be brought from outside. He feels peace when he eats a cheesecake or _jalebi._

**Questioner:** And then why does that _anand_ leave?

**Dadashri:** It will leave, will it not? It leaves because it has not been exactly completed. One should Become such that He remains as the Self continuously, that is the work left to be done. Once that is done in exactness, then when full, it will remain continuously. One should remain continuously in-as verily the Self. The play _ramanata_ should be as the Self only.

**Questioner:** Then there will be confusion in _vyavahar_ worldly interaction, no?

**Dadashri:** Only when he has really no need for worldly interaction _vyavahar_ at all, is He able to remain as the Self! One will have to complete the _vyavahar_ , will he not? That verily is the reason for the lesser bliss happening. And then, in this manner, as the worldly interaction comes to completion, then bliss will come. One will need constant play in-as the Self.

# [10] Understanding of the Goal

## Subtle difference between aim and goal

All these worldly people are doing aimless actions. They do not have any definite aim ( _heytu_ ).

**Questioner:** Can we say that a 'goal' ( _dhyeya_ ) and an 'aim' ( _heytu_ ) are same?

**Dadashri:** A goal and an aim; both are different.

**Questioner:** That means all these actions are without a goal ( _dhyeya_ ), no?

**Dadashri:** We cannot say that it is without a goal, but we can say that it is aimless. The one having an aim ( _heytu_ ) may or may not have a goal ( _dhyeya_ ).

**Questioner:** What is the difference between an aim ( _heytu_ ) and a goal ( _dheya_ )?

**Dadashri:** The one having an aim may or may not have a goal. So goal is the ultimate thing. It is not called as goal when someone has an aim to achieve happiness from material things. Goal means it will take you to the last station (ultimate liberation); that is called a goal ( _dhyeya_ ).

**Questioner:** That means in the material, relative world there is no such thing as a goal, right?

**Dadashri:** One uses the word goal and one is wrong by that much. It cannot be called as goal; it is called an aim. One utters the word goal, but it does not fit there and is inappropriate.

An aim means that which distinguishes and preserves one's notion. What is _sadvivek_ , right discretion? It is that which, because of one's own desire for happiness, he will maintain his aim, intentionally keep discretion ( _vivek_ ) about not hurting any living being. Because every living being lives with a desire for happiness, looking for only happiness; they do not like unhappiness.

## To attain the Self is verily the goal

One needs to have a goal ( _dhyeya_ ), no? No work can be done without making a goal. What is your goal?

**Questioner:** I want to become like Dada.

**Dadashri:** Why did you get this thing in your mind? What do you want to gain in becoming like Dada? Have intention of becoming pure, _shuddha_! Let us talk about attaining _moksha_ , liberation. I want to become like Dada, I want to be like this; you are not to make such a _bhaav_ , deep inner intent. Know that such intent will lead you nowhere; it will leave you dead and hanging, neither here nor there. We have _shuddha_ _upayog_ , application of the awareness as the Self, other means and resources; and becoming pure, ( _shuddh_ a) means getting ahead of Dada. Not like Dada, but higher then Dada. You want to become like this and that, for what? You are not to make such aim, _heytu_. Remain _shuddha_ (pure) only.

**Questioner:** And then, let what may happen, happen.

**Dadashri:** Whatever its fruit yields. Other then that, wanting to become thus; such _bhaav_ , intent will bind you.

**Questioner:** If I have made a certain goal then I would keep moving little faster accordingly.

**Dadashri:** The only goal to decide is that of _shuddha_ _upayoga_ , remain as the pure Knower-Seer only, the Self. And 'we' are _shuddha_ , pure, for sure. Otherwise that _potapanu_ , 'I-ness', will remain. For You, _shuddha upayoga_ is said to be without the 'I-ness'.

## Absolute Self verily is the goal after, 'I am pure Soul'

**Questioner:** So how is it possible to remain focused on the goal ( _dhyeya_ ) and settle with this _prakruti_ , the non-Self complex?

**Dadashri:** 'You' are to remain in Agna. Agna is such a thing that it can bring everything of yours to an end. In addition have I ever put any restriction of eating any food? When _rus_ (mango pulp) _rotli_ (thin wheat bread) come in your plate, then settle it with equanimity. What is the problem with that file?

**Questioner** : No problem.

**Dadashri:** Good. You have two sons and a daughter; get them married. Am I saying no to this? But settle with equanimity, not by spending a million rupees; just do according to the customs and traditions of the average people.

**Questioner:** Is it considered a goal ( _dhyeya_ ) for _mahatmas_ to follow the Agnas?

**Dadashri:** No, to follow the Agnas is not a goal. The goal ( _dhyeya_ ) is to remain as the Self, but You have to follow the Agnas to attain the goal (absolute Self), otherwise you will not achieve the goal.

**Questioner:** _Mahatmas_ attained this awareness of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ', so can it be said that the goal has been attained?

**Dadashri:** But the completion ( _purnahuti_ ) of the goal should happen, no? Completion of the goal (absolute Self state). Therefore, 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' is now the follower ( _dhyata_ ) of the goal, and the goal is the absolute Self ( _dhyeya, keval Gnan_ ). So now You walk exactly to the path of the goal of the absolute Self.

## When terrible adversity arises, then enter the Self

When it is freezing cold one does not remember the blanket and only the Self comes in memory.

**Questioner:** Is that considered according to the goal ( _dhyeyapurvak_ )?

**Dadashri:** That is the goal—dhyeya.

**Questioner:** Now in that situation; how would it be for the one who is following the Agnas? The one who remains in Agna, what kind of adjustment he would have at the time of extreme cold weather?

**Dadashri:** He who is following the Agna ( _agnapoorvak_ ), will settle the file with equanimity, he will not have any problem. But the one truly after the goal ( _dhyeyapoorvak_ ) is the one who at the time of the extreme cold, will not be looking for a blanket to cover himself but will remain as the Self. Nonetheless, the greatest benefit you got is that the clashes are gone after attaining the Self, no more arguments and clashes!

**Questioner:** But you said that if it is not fulfilling the goal ( _dhyeyapoorvak_ ) then it could slip him from that state?

**Dadashri:** One can end up living some more lives.

**Questioner:** Some means how many?

**Dadashri:** But at least he has arrived in the limit of countable more life times ( _agnapoorvak_ ). If one lives only one life without conflict then also he has reached the limit of life times to be lived.

**Questioner:** If a person is not looking for blankets or covers in freezing cold weather and remains as the Self...

**Dadashri:** The warm cover would not even come to his memory.

**Questioner:** Hmm.. So then how does he enter the Self?

**Dadashri:** He is the Self at that time, no?

**Questioner:** That is called the awareness of the goal ( _dhyeya ni jagruti_ ).

**Dadashri:** He is the Self, but he comes out because there is a blanket to cover.

**Questioner:** So he becomes the Self if the weather turns even colder.

**Dadashri:** He enters the _mooda_ _swaroop_ , the original Self.

**Questioner:** He will become separate from the body ( _deha_ ) at that time.

**Dadashri:** 'You' is separate for sure. I have made the separation. 'You' are separate. Now, when there is the blanket, he comes out with energetic pleasure, ( _rof_ ) and relishes that taste, the pleasures of the five senses. At that time, that other taste, the bliss of the Self ceases. If one tastes any kind of _vishaya_ , sense pleasures from the non-Self, the taste of the Self (bliss) ceases. That is why 'we' have said to all these _brahmacharis_ (those who have vowed to be and remain celibate), that the bliss of _brahmacharya_ (freedom from all sexual impulses through thoughts, speech and acts) is totally distinct.

**Questioner:** The one who follows the _kramik_ path (step-by-step path of Self-realization), would he have a goal to attain the Self? How would be his awareness?

**Dadashri:** It would be very good. Very rare people would be there who have the goal of attaining the Self, because most of them have succumbed to the temptation of enjoying worldly physical and material comforts only. As one reaches higher, the greater is the _lalacha_ , temptation-laden greed. This temptation-laden greed remains till the end.

**Questioner:** In this _kramik_ path, to attain the Self, the seekers practice penance. They go in the jungle and suffer the fear of staying alone and suffer torment and hardship, so is it supporting the goal?

**Dadashri:** Can we not know what the intent is there? That of Krupaludev Srimad Rajchandra is of the Self. Apart from that there is nothing else that is meaningful.

**Questioner:** So He (Srimad Rajchandra) had developed such _jagruti_ , awareness to remain as the Self, during such tough circumstances of adversity ( _upsarga_ ) and turmoil ( _parishaha_ ), no?

**Dadashri** : Yes.

**Questioner:** There is no telling about other people in this matter? If other people were to practice such penance, is there no value to it?

**Dadashri:** It will be of no use. An elephant would bathe, but then dusts his body with mud. We say, ' _Mohaniya anek prakarni hovathi teni saame hoo anant sukhanu dhaam choo,_ Because illusory attractions are of countless kinds, in front of them, I am the abode of infinite bliss.' _Mohaniya_ , that which deludes, is of many different kinds. Which different kinds? That which was renounced, is the illusion _mohaniya_ ; that which one wears (ochre robes) is _mohaniya_ ; doing all this is the illusion _, mohaniya_.

**Questioner:** When it is cold and one thinks of blankets, is that _mohaniya_ also?

**Dadashri:** It is _mohaniya_.

**Questioner:** That means anything that makes one forget the Self..

**Dadashri:** That is the illusion, _mohaniya_. Many kinds of _mohaniya_ exist. That which people have headed to renounce, _moha_ , the illusory attachment, that is also one kind of _mohaniya_. One proceeds to get rid of _mohaniya_ and where is the need to get rid of anything? You simply go to Your place, no?

**Questioner:** So the one who has a goal ( _dhyeya_ ), he will not try to remove the illusory attachment, _mohaniya_ ; he will become what he is—the Self.

**Dadashri:** Many kinds of _mohaniya_ are there.

**Questioner:** But this _prakruti_ can be called with _mohaniya_ for sure, no?

**Dadashri:** All ( _prakrutis_ ) are _mohaniya_ only.

**Questioner:** One goes in the jungle and does not lose his stillness even in front of the tiger and the lion.

**Dadashri:** All that is called _moha_ —illusion.

**Questioner:** That too is _moha_?

**Dadashri:** If he asks the Lord, 'Sir, the thing that I have been doing, what is it called?' Then the Lord will say, 'this is _moha_.' But this _moha_ is helping towards the goal.

**Questioner:** One is trying to get rid of _moha_ , trying to renounce, can we not call that goal ( _dhyeya_ )?

**Dadashri:** How can it be called a goal? What is it? He removes one thing and accumulates the other thing.

Although I am Gnani Purush, whatever traveling I do, all that is also called _moha_.

**Questioner:** Now Yours is towards the goal ( _dhyeyapurvak_ ) only.

**Dadashri:** Not towards the goal, I have attained the goal—the absolute Self ( _dhyeya swaroop_ ); even then, these actions ( _kriya_ ) which are seen externally are of the illusion ( _moha_ ) only.

**Questioner:** So how is it possible to be established as the Self ( _dhyeyaswaroop_ ), while this illusion filled activity ( _mohaniya_ ) is going on?

**Dadashri:** It has happened, has it not?

**Questioner:** What kind of awareness is there?

**Dadashri:** This action is discharge. So it keeps happening by itself. 'You' don't have to do it. When one has to do it, that is the illusion ( _moha_ ). That is not according to the goal ( _dhyeyapoorvak_ )

When one becomes established as the Self ( _dhyeya_ _swaroop_ ), then nothing is involved at all. The _pudgal_ , the non-Self complex of thoughts, speech and acts, is _mohi_ , subject to illusion indeed; and that is the nature of the _pudgal_. _Pudgal_ remains in its nature and the Self verily remains as the Self within. Both are separate.

## Dhyeya, Nischaya and Niyanu

_Dhyeya_ : The goal.

_Nischaya_ : Unfaltering decision to remain the Self after Atmagnan in Akram. _Niyanu_ : a phenomenon where one's _bhaav_ to attain something is so strong that all his punyais are expended towards acquiring only that.

**Questioner:** Is there any relation between the goal ( _dhyeya_ ) and the decision ( _nischaya_ )?

**Dadashri:** Unflinching decision ( _nischaya_ ) is a little thing compared to _dhyeya_ (goal). The goal is a different matter. One has to make different decisions for different things. The goal is only one, to attain only the Atma, the Self; to attain _moksha_ , liberation, whatever you say; the only word is, the Goal. Decisions are for a variety of things. **Questioner:** The decisions that are made, would that be related to _vyavahar_ , worldly interactions also?

**Dadashri:** Decisions come under that which can be counted.

**Questioner:** Then there is this _niyanu_ , ' _niyanu_ of _moksha'_.

**Dadashri:** _Niyanu_ means whatever is done until now, for the Self like, _tapa_ -penance, _japa_ -chanting or reciting names of the Lord; one did all this, so he has this in his balance of merit karma effect, and he is allowed to spend it wherever he wants to. So then, if a person were to make such _niyanu_ that a country must be destroyed, then all his balance of merit karma effect ( _punyai_ ) will be used up there.

**Questioner:** So the _niyanu_ will be used up for the purpose of worldly needs and desires?

**Dadashri:** Yes, when one does ego, it gets used up. Ego of 'I will do it this way' – it gets used up in this.

**Questioner** : What is the relation between these three words: _niyanu_ for _moksha_ – liberation; _nischaya_ of _Shuddhatma_ (for the state of pure Self), and the _kalyani bhavana,_ deep inner intent for the world's salvation?

**Dadashri:** One must make _niyanu_ for _moksha_ ; otherwise he will get into competition and contention with someone. 'Except for _moksha_ , I do not want anything', if one makes such a _niyanu_ then all his earnings ( _punyai_ ) will be spent there only.

'I am pure Soul', that _nischaya_ \- decision, must not falter. That decision, which has been made, must not change.

**Questioner:** And _bhavna_ \- deep inner intent, for _jagat_ _kalyan,_ salvation of the world, that's it.

**Dadashri:** That's it, may people attain this bliss of _moksha_ that we have attained.

**Questioner:** These _mahatmas_ have attained the goal of _Shuddhatma_ , the goal of _moksha_ , so how is it possible to become firmly established in that goal again, if one falters and slips from that goal?

**Dadashri:** If one becomes derailed from it, then it is not called a goal. Goal means, it is my all; it is my 'everything'.

**Questioner:** So the first thing necessary is to strengthen the goal. So how can it become stronger?

**Dadashri:** The _dhyata_ meditates on the _dhyeya_ to become that. This means the meditator, the pure Self (here the awakened one), meditates on the absolute Self and becomes that. The Self meditates as the Self to become the Self.

**Questioner:** Who is the meditator in this?

**Dadashri** : The Self.

**Questioner:** And what is the goal?

**Dadashri:** The real Self – _Atmaswaroop_ – the absolute, fully enlightened Self.

**Questioner:** How can the Self meditate to attain the Self as the goal?

**Dadashri:** This Agna which has been given to You, that 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ', should be Your meditation.

# [11] Importance of _Satsang_

## What if the water is not sprinkled after sowing the seeds?

**Questioner:** Even after taking Gnan, to bring forth and hold the idea of 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' appears a little difficult.

**Dadashri:** No, You do not have to recall and hold it; it will come by itself. So what do you have to do for that? You have to keep coming to Me (the Gnani). The water of _satsang_ that is necessary is not getting sprinkled. That is why all this becomes difficult. What can happen to your business if you do not pay attention it?

**Questioner:** It will go down.

**Dadashri:** Yes, this too, is like that. You took Gnan so now You have to nurture the seeding that has grown with the 'water of _satsang_ ', and then the plant will grow. If a planted sapling is small, then You have to water it. So You should water it a little in a month or two months.

**Questioner:** I do spray water at home on my own.

**Dadashri:** No, if you water it at home then it will not work that way. Will it work? The Gnani has arrived in your vicinity and you have no value at all! Did you go to school or not? How many years had you gone to school?

**Questioner:** Ten years.

**Dadashri:** Then what did you learn in the school? Language! You spent ten years to learn this English language and I am asking you to spend only six months with Me. If You keep in close touch with Me for six months You can accomplish Your work.

## If the nischaya is strong then obstacles will break

**Questioner:** I have difficulty in coming to _satsang_ because previously many commitments elsewhere.

**Dadashri** : For that if your _bhaav_ (intent) to come to _satsang_ is strong then all other obstacles will break down. You just have to check to see whether your _bhaav_ within is strong or not. You have to remain Knower-Seer of that.

## You will never sustain a loss in business while in satsang

All businessmen that come to 'us' are very prominent and successful. When they go late to their shop by an hour, they lose business worth close to five hundred thousand rupees. So I told them, when you come here, for as long as you are here; you will not incur a loss. But if you stop at some shop in the middle for half an hour or so, you will incur a loss. If you come here, then the responsibility is Mine. I do not have anything to give or take in this. Therefore you have come here for only Your Atma-Self. That is why I tell everyone that if they come here, they will not incur a loss in anyway.

**Questioner** : It is pretty good if _buddhishadi_ , people with a lot of intellect, are able to renounce ( _tyaga_ ) their intellect.

**Dadashri** : The intellect harress them too; it deceives them. It will do this and it will do that. But even then, they do not leave 'us' (the Gnani and the Lord within), for sure.

It is like this, no one is likely to give up this state of _Shuddhatma_. Here even if you are pinched and poked everyday, You should still not leave this state of _Shuddhatma_.

## The amazing wonder of the company of Dada and His Satsang

If the effects of _udaya_ , unfolding of karma, come very heavy then you should understand that this _udaya_ (unfolding) is difficult, therefore remain in peace and calm. When the _udaya_ is very difficult and heavy, then try to cool him-the ego down by remaining in only _satsang_. Such things go on. There is no telling what kind of karma will unfold.

When You sit here then even if You do not do anything the changes will continue to happen within, because this is _satsang_. _Sat_ means eternal- the Self, and _sang_ means company. 'This-the Gnani Purush' is the manifest _Sat_ , so if You sit in the company of this _Sat,_ then it is considered the ultimate _satsang_. All other _satsangs_ are there but they are not ultimate. This is Bombay Central (the final station); after this, the train will not go any further!

**Questioner:** What is the way to increase extra _jagruti,_ awakened awareness of the Self?

**Dadashri:** It is just that You have to remain in _satsang_.

**Questioner:** When someone sits with You for six months then _sthool,_ -overt changes happen within him, then _sookshma-_ subtle, changes happen; is that what You are saying?

**Dadashri:** Yes, changes will continue to happen just by sitting here.

**Questioner:** What do _sthool-_ overt, changes mean?

**Dadashri:** Overt changes mean his problems in the external world part are gone, only the internal problems ( _kashaya_ ) remain! Thereafter, if _satsang_ happens again then the internal trouble part would also go away. If both are finished then He becomes complete. Therefore one should have this _parichaya,_ familiarity, with the Gnani. Two hours, three hours, five hours. You get the benefit of as many hours You credit in _satsang_. Some _mahatmas_ have the understanding that after attaining Gnan, they do not have any work left to do. But change has not happened at all.

**Questioner:** What intense desire should _mahatmas_ keep for attaining the absolute state?

**Dadashri:** As much as possible one should spend his life with Dada that is the only intense desire. Anywhere, day or night but one needs to stay near Dada only. One should stay in the vicinity of Dada.

**Questioner:** The _satsang_ , which we are doing, does it go in the section of merit karma ( _punyai_ ) or in the section of pure, _shuddha,_ karma?

**Dadashri:** Those who have become _shuddha,_ pure, have become absolutely free ( _vimukta_ ) from ego, for them it will go in the section of the only the _shuddha,_ pure. And for the one who has the ego that, 'I am this', and as long as that exists, and wants the fruit of this, then only the merit karma effect ( _punyai_ ) will be there. And if one behaves according to this then he can even attain liberation. However, when desiring a fruit, an effect, in this matter, one binds a very high order of merit karma ( _punyai_ ). Is it an ordinary thing to listen about the true Self and establish a little or more faith in it?

When 'we' do _satsang_ here and conversations that happen here, at that time _devos,_ divine celestial beings, come to listen! Such talk has never happened in this world whatsoever. What is this talk going on about? Here there is no talk about the worldly life in the slightest extent at all, there is no part of the worldly life in this talk at all, not even a cent percent.

## Even insults in satsang are beneficial

Does Dada stay on your mind?

**Questioner** : Ten percent of the time I do my job and other worldly activities but ninety percent of the time, Dada's _niddhidhyasan,_ inner visualization, prevails.

**Dadashri** : Very well. So ninety percent it remains here and ten percent or so is in your occupation! Then it is good. You have gotten your work done!

**Questioner:** Now I have become separate from Chandubhai for sure. Now I see everything as separate.

**Dadashri** : Yes, but there is still the fear of this world; incase you encounter _koosang-_ negative company and influence that leads one astray from _satsang_. There is nothing but an environment of _koosang_. So if ever there is a little drenching from it, then you will take a little beating.

**Questioner** : But now I don't want it; I just don't want any _koosang._

**Dadashri** : You may well not want it but here some people get pulled into excitement and they fall down, so stay away from _koosang_ ; that is the intent of what 'we' are telling you. But otherwise this world is such that no one can touch you. But for the time being whatever arrangements you make, just be careful about _koosang_. Everything else is under the control of _vyavasthit_ , where worries have no place.

If sometimes _koosang_ happens, then it will cause problems. But that too, if more time is devoted towards _satsang_ then all that other influence may even vanish. So sometimes there is a danger. There will always be an exception. So stay away from _koosang_.

**Questioner** : I don't want any _koosang_ now for sure.

**Dadashri** : But even then, as much as possible, remain in the company of _satsang_ with _mahatmas_. Even if they insult you, it is still better to be with them. Even if they insult you, there is no problem as far as the _mahatmas_ are concerned.

## You cannot trust a venomous snake

**Questioner:** But if _koosang_ (company that takes one away from the Self) does not have the effect of _koosang_ , then it is not called _koosang_ , is it?

**Dadashri** : But even then you cannot trust it. If there is snake just sitting there, you cannot trust it. There is no telling when it will come into its nature and bite you. Our _satsang_ is good, no matter how inpalatable it may be. There is no problem if you have to end up spending time with this satsang of Gnani and _mahatmas_ , because this is _satsang_ , no? There is no telling when _koosang_ will bite you. If one wrong thought happens to seep within, it will not leave even after twenty years. If it starts to grow within, it will grow into a big tree. All talks about _koosang_ are sweet, and they will creep in easily.

You should go to the Oberoi Towers Hotel and drink tea there just once. Just see how much and how bad an effect it leaves on the mind. It is not the people that gather there but the effect of the _parmanus_ will remain.

**Questioner** : When just a cup of tea can have so much effect, then...

**Dadashri** : It is not just the effect of tea, when you go there, the effect starts from the time you start climbing the stairs. If you put just a small clove of garlic in ghee (clarified butter), what will happen outside?

## Punyai pulls one away from koosang into satsang

**Questioner:** Is it the _purushaarth_ inner spiritual effort of _pragnya_ , the liberating energy of the Self, to pull one out of _koosang_ and into _satsang_?

**Dadashri** : No, _pragnya_ does not come there at all. There, some _punyai_ \- merit karma effect, one had done in the past, comes into force and takes over.

But otherwise the original Self does not join in any kind of company ( _sanga_ ). It is _asanga,_ free from any association; its very nature is _asanga_. And yet people run around to make it _asanga_. In worldly interactions, there should be _satsang_. Because, of the two _bhaav-_ intentions that are there, of _satsang_ and _koosang_ , if a person remains in _satsang_ , then some day he will make progress but not the one who is involved in _koosang_.

## Live in the group of mahatmas

**Questioner** : So Dada, the _mahatmas_ will have to address this question. How should we keep our worldly interactions? And for those who are going to live long, what should they do inorder to safeguard their remaining life and maintain the _upyoga_ , applied awareness, of _Shuddhatma_?

**Dadashri** : The remaining life should be spent where other _mahatmas_ live. It should be spent in the company of _mahatmas_ and in _satsang_. So to remain away from _koosang_ is called _satsang_.

**Questioner** : But can one last there?

**Dadashri** : Of course one can last there. You will not incur any losses and You will continue to profit.

**Questioner** : Dada there are two things I fear. One is that all the files which have been left behind, will pull me away. If the files have not been settled with properly and if our own financial situation has not been established well, then the files will pull us away from here.

**Dadashri** : That will happen. They will come and go, and he will resolve them. Whatever efforts one makes to become free; all those efforts will bear fruits.

**Questioner** : He will come across the right circumstances.

**Dadashri** : The one who wants to be bound, the one who has doubts; will be bound by all this. But otherwise nothing on the inside is binding. No matter what one does, nothing binds.

**Questioner** : There is no bondage of karma in Akram, is there?

**Dadashri** : The one who follows the five Agnas in Akram will never become bound.

**Questioner** : What if he is not able to follow them completely but it is his intent to do so?

**Dadashri** : Even if one follows them by seventy percent; that is acceptable.

**Questioner** : But Dada in one sense, You made the separation for 'Us' through 'I am _Shuddhatma_ ' and this part is the non-Self ( _anatma_ ); from that point onwards, the charging of new karma has stopped. The _bhaav_ karma (cause karma) has been destroyed.

**Dadashri** : No, but even then on the outside the _koosang_ is still there no? Starting from the kitchen to the office, in the home, on the road, outside, in the car, in the train – everywhere there is nothing but _koosang_. This Gnan that has been given to You in two hours can be devoured by _koosang_ which exists everywhere. So for that, the protective fence of the five Agnas has been given to You and so if You remain within the protection, not even an iota of change will take place in the state of the Self within. That Gnan will remain the same as when it was given to You. And so these Agnas have been given to You to follow. That much part has been kept as Your responsibility. If you stay by yourself, the protection will not remain everytime, no? That crowd, if the entire town is of satsang ( _mahatmas_ ), then the protection can remain.

# [12] Fearlessness, in the state of Gnan

## All kinds of fear leave in the company of the Gnani

**Questioner:** Dada, how can one dissolve the tuber, the inner state, of fear ( _bhaya_ )?

**Dadashri:** All fears decrease after receiving Gnan- Self-realization.

**Questioner:** Fear may still remain in the imagination of some, no?

**Dadashri:** No. Fears, which used to terrify you, are gone after Gnan, Self-realization.

**Questioner:** But how can one become absolutely fearless ( _nirbhaya_ )?

**Dadashri:** Fearless? For that one has to live with a Gnani Purush at least two to four months. Once a person lives in the vicinity and nearness of the Gnani Purush, all fears leave. Fear is not a real thing; it is only a misunderstanding. By staying with a Gnani one can know that this misunderstanding has cleared, whereas away from the Gnani, the misunderstanding gets more entangled.

**Questioner:** Whatever this filled stock is (charged karma from past life, discharging in this life), when this comes out.....

**Dadashri:** This is not new material; it is the old stock. No new karma is being charged, and the old stock that was filled will empty for sure. Our path is verily such that everything will continue to leave. One by one it will continue to leave.

'I' have given this absolute state of fearlessness ( _nirbhayata_ ). This path is beautiful and it is the independent path. I have given You this _vyavasthit_ , the knowledge of the energy that runs this universe, inorder to be rid of so many fears. How many fears have been removed! There is no reason to harbor any fear.

**Questioner:** You gave _vyavasthit_ to get rid of many fears, but _vyavasthit_ is given to remove all fears, isn't it?

**Dadashri:** Yes. Fears begin to leave as much One begins to understand ( _darshan,_ vision of awakened awareness) _vyavasthit_ and when the understanding of _vyavasthit_ becomes absolute, One becomes the absolute Self, _keval_ Gnan.

**Questioner:** Yes. That means if one understands _vyavasthit_ completely, all kinds of fear will leave, no?

**Dadashri:** All kinds of fear must leave. One should know _vyavasthit_ as it is, then all fears will leave. 'You' have discovered this much at least. Now You will start to know more by sitting near me. 'You' can 'know' a lot if you get the opportunity to stay with me for fifteen days. It is possible to stay fifteen days with me if you have planned in advance. You can get the opportunity to sit together, eat together, drink together, sleep together and talk with me in one home.

Just as birds quiver, there is quivering and fear inside. Now much of your fear is gone, no? With this Gnan, have they vanished?

**Questioner** : Yes, it is all gone.

## There is always protection along with fear

**Dadashri** : Now is Gnan increasing or not? Tell me all about it. Tell me about this increasing state, why don't you?

**Questioner** : The Gnan is increasing for sure but by as much as the awareness increases, the fear ( _bhaya_ ) also increases due to it, no?

**Dadashri** : But as many fears are 'seen', You also get protection for that. It is like this; as much awareness ( _jagruti_ ) there is; there is that much fear, but You get protection for it. This experience ( _bhaan_ ) arises automatically. So as much awareness there is; that much fear is 'shown' and verily that much place of fearlessness ( _nirbhayata,_ the state of the Self) is shown. If a person sees a snake coming inside the house, he will not be able to sleep. He will be able to sleep when he sees the snake leaving.

## Eternal freedom from fear in the abode of the Self

People have to travel by airplanes. After they sit in the plane, they will start smoking. Our _mahatmas_ will get thoughts of, 'who knows when this plane will break down!' So let us remain as the Self – the Atma. Do you feel scared in a plane? Is there any enjoyment in fear?

**Questioner** : There is joy in that at all!

**Dadashri** : So in what do you find joy? Tell me in which places there is no fear. Look for a place that is free from all fears.

If you are walking along the side of the road and some driver ends up driving on the wrong side and runs over you, where is there a safe-side for you? It is "only in 'I' where there is 'all right', a safe-side and 'my' (my-ness) is unsafe". So is there any joy in that?

There is no telling when your factory will burn down. Today the boss is having fun and tomorrow he is dead. Does that happen or not? How can you attain closure at such times?

Do you have to go home at night or do you end up remain sitting wherever you find joy? When it is half past midnight, and you are having a good time, even then you have to leave that place and go home or will it do if you don't go home?

**Questioner** : If it is for a day it would be fine but not everday.

**Dadashri** : In the same way you have to go to Your home (in the state of Self; _moksha_ ) don't you? This worldly life ( _sansaar_ ) is not Your home. Have a good time here, it is fine for a day or so, but to do it everyday? So You have to go to Your home. When You go to Your own home, then there will be a safe-side. That is what I am telling people, 'go home...go home. This home is not Yours, You cannot take a breather here (in the relative self)'. You can have a great time here. I too used to have a great time, but what to do! When I sit in the plane, people smoke cigarettes. I know what they preoccupied with. 'We' too feel in our mind 'who knows when the plane will breakdown?' So a person has to sit in fear. Even when sitting in a car, 'we' feel 'when will it crash? When will there be an accident?' So wherever 'we' look, 'we' see nothing but hazard, hazard and hazard.

In Your Self-state, no one can touch You. The Self is such a One, that fear cannot touch it; the Self is _vitarag_ and fearfree ( _nirbhaya_ )! Bhagwan Krishna has said something very beautiful in the Gita, that the Atma-the Self is _vitarag_. Absolutely free from all attachment and abhorrence, and _nirbhaya_ , free from all fears!

## A Gnani is absolutely fearless

One will accomplish his work when the final fear leaves. People cannot get rid of fear. There is no way by which fear will leave. Constantly there is anxiety and fear, which persists.

Say for instance, if you need to go somewhere and someone says, 'there is a possibility that a robber will mug you on the way.' Now, there is no choice because you have to take that road. So then how will you feel inside? You will feel anxious and stressed once you hear about this. Where in the world did this stress come from? This is our world, we are the owners and why do we have to struggle and feel so stressed? The reason is that one wants to control the world of the non-Self ( _paarku_ ). Otherwise would there be any stress or conflict? Many thieves and robbers may come on the way; that is their business. Why do You need to worry? Is it not their business? It is a business and if you are a good customer, then he will give you his product (rob you), otherwise he may not give you the product. He will say, 'what the heck, why should I give this guy anything? It's a waste.' One should not harbor any kind of fear. You have not achieved anything as long as fear exists. Now, after Self-realization if any fear does arise then You should apply this knowledge (Gnan) and fear will disappear. Where is the fear to the Self, the pure Soul? The Self is not a thing that one can steal or rob. No one can shoot the Self. No one can do anything to the Self. How can there be any fear to the Self? Then the awareness arises which says, 'Chandubhai, the owner of the pocketful of money, has the fear of being robbed.' And you have become the owner, is that not so? And you think that if you worry or keep tension then he (robber) will not rob you, is that right? _Mooah_! (special exclamation used by Dadashri to shake up the listener, literal meaning, mortal one), he will rob you first by seeing tension on your face. He will beat you up as an extra item too.

The head police officer told me he would lock me up in a cell, so I told him, 'why don't you take me, I am alone at home and I have to lock the door myself. Here the police security will lock the door everyday'and this was the state within, when these words came out. So the officer was taken aback by this comment. When I said a few words like this, he became stunned and so he told another police officer that I must be someone related to the Prime Minister. He felt, 'How can anyone say such things? No king in the world would have said such a thing. This man here surpasses the president also.' I am telling you this fact. Forget about fear, he offered some tea once he found out that I was a contractor. He had expectation of 'maybe I'll get ten rupees or so from him'. That amount of the potential bribe that he lost was part of the account! _Mooah_! You had such expectations from 'Us'? You have such expectation from the one who is so pure? Where even God has stood at a distance. God too has to observe humility and distance; one has to stand very far away!

## No one can shake the one who is strong

If You remain still and unmoved (from the state of the Self), then there is no power-energy ( _shakti_ ) that can hurt you in this world. Once You move, then all other energies (non-Self) will eat you up. 'You' do not need to move an iota. If you feel fear within then say, 'Dada is my protector, nothing is going to happen to me' and remain that way. If You, the Self, remain unmoved, then no force in this universe can touch you. What does the _shakti_ (relative energy) see? Did he move or not? It looks for the slightest movement only. There is no need to move an iota. If You move, then Chandulal is done for. If You remain unmoved then what can happen?

**Questioner:** Then nothing will happen.

**Dadashri:** Circumstances of instability ( _hali javoo_ ) are all around for sure and that is the nature of the worldly life ( _sansar_ ). It is in the nature of worldly life to shake-upset a human being here and there. Let the mover (the non-Self) move. 'You' must remain in Your place. It is possible to maintain such steadiness ( _sthirata_ ), is it not?

**Questioner** : Yes.

**Dadashri:** You do not feel fear of any kind, do You? All these people here ( _mahatmas_ ) are free from fear and is that not a wonder? They are fearless because they have become still and steady ( _sthirata_ ).

**Questioner:** We should employ some policemen to periodically come and test our _mahatmas_.

**Dadashri:** Some of our _mahatmas_ have been tested. They are ready now. They will not be afraid of any thing. They have been made ready by having to face constant challenges that push and thrust.

**Questioner:** You kept them testing, no?

**Dadashri:** Yes. So I am convinced that these people are ready. No matter what happens. They have become prepared like a person who is ready to face death.

What if someone comes to arrest you with handcuffs and inquires, 'Is Chandubhai here?'

**Questioner:** Then I will say, 'take me'.

**Dadashri:** Is that right? You will not worry about what the world will think about you, right? I had told the police sub-inspector, 'no problem, you should have brought a rope with you.' Here people would say Ambalalbhai is such a person.' So let these poor people have some fun, no!' So then police sub-inspector got scared. So be ready for all kind of situations. Any circumstance can arise. It is _vyavasthit_ , isn't it? Nothing is beyond _vyavasthit_ , no? Now, You must settle with equanimity, no? So what can we say to him (to a police sub-inspector) as he shows up with warrant? Has he come to arrest on his own? No, he is also following someone's orders.

**Questioner:** It is not in his hand also.

**Dadashri:** He is also following orders and it is not even under the control of the boss who has given the order. Everything is happening on the basis of our own karma.

**Questioner:** In this situation, there should not be any effect on a single _parmanoo,_ indivisible subatomic particle, within.

**Dadashri:** Not even single _parmanoo_ should move-react. That should be the only thing. People will sweat from the fright even when it is not hot. One will get sweats in the day of winter! I am making them strong. They all had stayed with me. I would strike them from this way to this way. Why harbor any fear at all?

## Become such that no living being will experience fear from you

I have seen the world _nirdosh_ \- flawless; there is no _doshit_ -faulty one, whatsoever. That I have 'seen'. There is no one _doshit_ -at fault in this world; this constantly remains in My vision. Whatever _dosh-_ fault there is; is the result of my own karma.

There is no living being that can undo and braek the design-blueprint that you have painted (in the past life). Whatever there is, it is all verily your own design. There is no interference from anyone in it. This world is such that you can wear millions of rupees worth jewellery and walk amidst a crowd of robbers but even then no one will touch you. There is no need for you to be afraid of anything. Where One has become such that no one experiences any fear due to him, then he does not need to be afraid of anything in this world. No one should experience any fear due to you. Whereas here, even a sparrow will fly away before you reach there. Hey _mooah_ , what kind of a person are you that even a sparrow flies away? One's unsteadiness ( _chanchadata_ ) is a different thing. Even a sparrow should trust you a little or even animals should trust you, should not they? At this time if hundred thousand snakes were to come here, what will they look for? They look at how poisoinous a man is, by looking at the eyes. The snake knows for sure that the snake itself is poisonous, but if the man is 'poisonous' then it will say, 'I will sting you'. And if it does not notice anything then it will crawl away without doing anything. **Questioner:** What can we say about a person who scares others? What kind of consequences will he have to face?

**Dadashri:** We do not need to be afraid of him. One should not think about scaring others. Our life should be such that no one should feel fear because of us. Make such a life here. What are you going to gain scaring someone for nothing?

## A reaction of being startled due to reflex is not fear

Now we have achieved the state of _Shuddhatma_. Now where is the loss? There are no remaining losses.

**Questioner:** I don't see any loss. But a little bit of fear does remain.

**Dadashri:** That is not fear. The one who has not attained this Gnan (knowledge of the Self) will feel fear. The entire world is caught in fear. After attaining this Gnan our _mahatmas_ do not feel fear but would have reflex reactions to fear. Fear exists due to ignorance. A reaction of startled response ( _bhadkaat_ ) is the nature of the physical body.

**Questioner:** What is the meaning of startle reaction?

**Dadashri:** It is the nature of a physical body; it is like a toy that will move in response to a key that is wound. It is not its intrinsic property. Similarly this startle reaction has been woven in the physical body. That is why it happens even if you do not want to do it. If there was a sudden loud noise, it will make your eyes blink even if you don't want them to; that is what _bhadkat-_ startle reaction, is. After this Gnan startle reaction persists and if ignorance ( _agnan_ ) exists then fear exists. Fear exists due to ignorance.

The fear that the world feels is the fear of ignorance. Once the fear of ignorance is gone, only the reflex startle reactions remain.

Right now, if a sudden new kind of noise were to happen, even my body will react with a tremble. Now someone might say, 'That really frightened Dada to a tremble.' The fact is, 'No, Dada is not such a person that he would care! But this startle reaction is called a _sangi chetna_ \- reflex reaction. It has resulted with the association of the charged life energy ( _chetan bhaav_ ).

## Fear leaves once the ignorance leaves

One may not get scared by four outlaws, but when he trembles upon hearing the angry noises of a gang of fifteen to twenty robbers, then it is all over, and done, no? The One who did not get scared by four will subsequently not be scared by forty and the one who does not get scared by forty then he will not be affected by four thousand, and the one who does not get scared by four thousand will not be scared by four lakhs, from hundred thousand and finally this one will not have any fear from forty million and this then will come to an end. There are no more then four billion people. The One, who does not get scared by anybody, will attain total fearlessness ( _nirbhayata_ ). The one who is fearless, to him, what difference will four make? Then what difference will four hundred thousand or four billion such people make? That is the only thing that Dada is saying, 'brother, all fear will leave as soon as the fear arising from ignorance is gone. Fear arises from ignorance. There is no other fear at all. Why do you need to be afraid of people? These poor fellows are only tops (spinning toys), they are spinning on their own. Some might get hurt too, at some time. But it is not under their control. Fear exists as long as the belief, 'I am Chandubhai' exists. With the Gnan,'I am _Shuddhatma_ , pure Soul', You are fearless. You, the Self are _Shuddhatma_ and the remaining part; that of Chandubhai, is the neighbor. So when someone comes to fight with the neighbor, it is within the parameters of justice.

## When sorrow does not move, one will move away himself

This one is very tender like a flower, mind you! But he has learnt from me that when a lot of fear arises, He instantly becomes _nirbhaya,_ fearless. Whereas even when there was just a little bit of fear, if there were a couple of mosquitoes in the room, he would spend the entire night focused on them. And now, even if there are a hundred mosquitoes, he goes to sleep.

**Questioner** : Dada please explain that to us. Why do we end up getting into the _pudgal_ , becoming the self? Why is the entire night spent worrying about mosquitoes when there are only two or three mosquitoes?

**Dadashri** : He wants to move the suffering of pain away, so he resorts to countless attempts and in a situation where He does not want to move it at all, He moves away from it (by enetering the Self).

**Questioner** : First he tries to move the pain away, but then He only moves away from it.

**Dadashri** : You said the right thing. If the pain does not move away, One moves away Himself. And the law with all of 'Us' who have attained the Self is that whenever a lot of suffering falls upon us, 'We' move into our 'cave'- the Self. If the pain on the outside is unbearable, then He retracts in His cave. And when our _mahatmas_ do not have any difficulties and adversities, they come out and feed on this fodder of worldly pleasures. That They withdraw inside during difficulties. When the difficulties are not there, there is this misuse of the situation.

**Questioner** : So when there are no adversities, that is when we have to very cautious, right?

**Dadashri** : Yes. Then You have to have to even more cautiousness but alas it does not remain. Nevertheless everything will be resolved in this manner, because the path is straightforward, no? This is a scientific path.

If someone were to tell you right now that the five hundred thousand rupees you had loaned him, are all gone. So you get a shock and so You will go into Your _Shuddhatma_ state. You would not be able to bear it, would you? This attribute of the Self is very good indeed.

**Questioner** : What is better than coming into the cave of the _Shuddhatma_? Otherwise if one did not have Gnan, something or other will happen, who knows!

**Dadashri** : Yes.

## When bombs fall, one becomes like the absolute Self

You have been given a magnificent and extraordinary Gnan. Whenever you wake up at night, the awareness ( _jagruti_ ) will be present that 'I am _Shuddhatma_ '. It will be present wherever You want it to. And if you are faced with a lot of adversities, then there will be a constant awareness. If a difficult situation were to arise for you, then another more difficult one, even more difficult than the previous ones, and then if bombs start falling around you, then the Self will withdraw into the cave. Your state will become like that of a _keval_ Gnani, the absolute Self This Gnan that You have been given is such that Your state will become like that of a _keval_ Gnani, but the bombs have to fall outside first.

Even then we are saying, 'it would be good if the bombs were to fall!', but others will say, 'no, do not let them fall sir, don't let the bombs fall'. 'Hey You! You can attain a state like a _keval_ Gnani so why not let them fall?' But here people will stay awake all night even when there are two mosquitoes inside the mosquito net! 'Hey you! Why did you get up again?' he will say, 'when I turned on the light, the mosquitos got inside the net!' 'You foolish man! The mosquitos don't let you stay in the cave of _Shuddhatma_ and the bombs do, so which of the two is better? The bombs! So let them fall!' It will bring about a quick resolution. In taking small beatings, it will ruin your mind; instead get it all over with, with just one stroke. With the small beatings your mind will get damaged, it will start to rot, instead bring about a resolution for once and for all. But then he will say, 'no, don't let the boms fall. Dear God, don't let the bombs fall for the time being!' You fool! Let them fall; get ready!

Even if one asks for them to fall, they will not. Who would drop such expensive bombs? The bombs are expensive; when they fall, our _mahatmas_ call it a very auspicious day and they go inside their caves. They can attain _keval_ Gnan. _Keval_ Gnan is not likely to happen, but they will get inside their caves.

If the bomb falls, the Self will not be shattered but all other desires will shatter. The one who does not have Gnan, that unfortunate one will say, 'I have to get my son married. I wanted to build a bungalow. All my desires remain unfulfilled.' Then he dies with unfulfilled desires and goes into the animal kingdom. If the bomb falls, the unfortunate one will become an animal and the other one's ( _mahatma_ ) condition will be like _moksha_ because all his desires will be fractured. He is not likely to fracture them on his own.

## Fear or fearlessness, at the time of death?

The Self that has been given to You will withdraw inwards when circumstances of fear arise. If there is no fear, then he will go out for this and for that. But the moment the bombs starts to fall, he will immediately withdraw inwards. He will look for a place that is free from fear and so he will come in. So amidst circumstances of fear, this Gnan will prevail beautifully. It will be beautiful at the time of death or else when there is fear of dying, even then it will remain beautiful.

**Questioner** : If fear arises, he will go inside the Atma-the Self?

**Dadashri** : All his external intentions ( _bhaav_ ) will come in the Self and He becomes 'I am _Shuddhatma_ '. Then he will let go of everything on the outside. He will stop having any dealings on the outside but as long as the 'bombs' do not fall, he will say, 'I'll go get some _jalebi,_ I'll go get some snacks'. And the moment any fearful situation arises, He will come home. And when the time of death comes, he is to be found inside the Home – the Self.

**Questioner** : So in situations of fear, awareness ( _jagruti_ ) will increase a thousand fold?

**Dadashri** : It will increase for sure, the awareness will increase but _bhaav_ of _Gnata-Drashta_ (Knower-Seer) will be constant and will prevail then. But it is only when there is a huge calamity on the outside that He withdraws in the Self. And on the inside, there is always absolute bliss ( _anand_ ). There is no pain at all!

After attaining this Gnan, there is no fear that can trouble Him. He can remain fearless forever. Can that happen or not? Have you seen anyone who is _nirbhaya_ , free from all fear?

**Questioner** : _Nirbhaya_ – in the sense that You are talking about, no I have not seen anyone like that.

**Dadashri** : No one can be _nirbhaya_ (fearless). Lord Krishna was such a One; Lord Mahavir was such a One. Otherwise no one can be so. What capacity does man have to become fearless like Them? So only when One has _vitaragata_ -absolutely withouth attachment or abhorrence, can He become fearless, _nirbhaya_. When there is no _raag_ - _dwesh_ , then the state of fearlessness can be attained.

## That is when the Science becomes Complete

When there is no circumstance, which can incite fear; no matter what the circumstance, even if atom bombs are being dropped, no fear will be experienced. When not even a slight stir in your stomach will be experienced – then know that the science ( _vignan_ ) has been completed. Otherwise, the One who has the understanding that 'no matter what the circumstances, 'I' should not feel any fear' – if He walks with this awareness, then the science is about to become complete for Him.

Fear must not be experienced. No matter what, fear must not be felt. Because when You are the Owner ( _malik,_ God), then whom do You have to fear? You are the Owner, You have the papers, You have the title – You have all this but you do not know this yet, so what can anyone do?

This Akram Vignan- science is so powerful that even if the atom bomb were to fall, the one who drops it will have fear, but not the One on whom it will fall!

# [13] Uchit _vyavahar_ – Shuddha _vyavahar_

**Questioner** : Dada, in Akram, You call all our worldly interaction _nikali-_ that which is to be settled only, do You not?

**Dadashri** : Our- _mahatmas_ worldly interaction? Let it _nikali_ –that which is to be let go, renounced or _grahaniya-_ that which is to be acquired, that is not a question for You, but it is our (all in Akram) worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ). It is _uchit_ _vyavahar_. Starting from _uchit vyavahar_ to pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ), that is our woldly interaction.

**Questioner** : Can you please clarify the two: ' _uchit'_ and ' _shuddha'_?

**Dadashri** : It starts with _uchit_. _Uchit_ means it does not warrant any criticism. Even when the _mahatmas_ are swearing at each other, it is still _uchit_. Beyond that is the pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ).

**Questioner** : How is that? You defined _uchit_ that 'No one will criticize it', and on the other hand you say that, 'even when the _mahatmas_ are swearing at each other, it is still _uchit_ '?

**Dadashri** : If you have become irritated with anyone here amongst _mahatmas_ , they will all know that, 'He must be settling the account, with some equanimity.' Will they not say that? They will not make a note of it, will they? Did you make such a note of anyone?

**Questioner** : No, one cannot make a note of that.

**Dadashri** : Why is that? Is it _uchit vyavahar_? Yes. It is without any attachment-abhorrence ( _raag-dwesh_ ). Interaction without any _raag_ - _dwesh_ means that, no matter how much they are hurting each other, it is considered _uchit vyavahar_. There is no _tiraskar_ \- contempt involved in it at all. Does that happen or not?

**Questioner** : So Dada, this is the thing for us _mahatmas_ , that having attaind the Self from You, our interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) should become pure ( _shuddha_ ), should it not?

**Dadashri** : It has happened already! It has happened from _uchit_ interaction to pure ( _shuddha_ ) interaction.

**Questioner** : Now, to keep that _uchit_ (high level) interaction to _shuddha_ pure interaction, is there a difference.

**Dadashri** : Yes. Pure interaction remains pure. But as long as that interaction is not visible as pure _shuddha_ , there is a difference, starting from _uchit_ (high level) interaction to _shuddha_ , pure interaction. It is actually pure, but there is a difference starting from _uchit_ - _shuddha_ to _shuddha_ - _shuddha_ , pure-pure.

It is like this, ours (in Akram) is considered _shuddha_ , pure, worldly interaction. But as long as it is not seen as pure, it is called _uchit_ (high level) interaction. And when it becomes visible as pure, it is considered pure – _shuddha-_ _shuddha_. Other those who have not attained this Gnan, they do not have _uchit_ interaction. They get upset when they have to be upset, cry when they have to cry and laugh when they have to laugh.

Hence, our _vyavahar_ interaction begins with _uchit_ interaction ( _uchit vyavahar_ ) and it eventually ends with pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ). _Shuddha nischaya,_ pure Self and _shuddha vyavahar,_ pure interaction. Now, however much your interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) becomes pure ( _shuddha_ ), that much of the pure Self, ( _shuddha_ _nischaya,_ the Self) will manifest. When it becomes completely pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ), that is _shuddha_ _nischaya_. It means the absolute Self!

Now, ours is _uchit vyavahar_ , but how can others see it as that? Ours is _uchit_ interaction for _moksha_ , but others see it as _unuchit_ not right.

Now, what is _shuddha vyavahar_ (pure interaction)? This man who is insulting me, his interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) is _ashuddha_ , impure. But I have to see him as a _Shuddhatma_ , and I have to maintain pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar)_ with him. I should not allow my _vyavahar_ to be spoilt. That is because it is not he who is insulting me; it is my own karma unfolding through him. Therefore, he is not responsible at all. Did you understand all that? Whether he is in his _Shuddhatma_ or not, but we should see him as a _Shuddhatma_ , and that he is _nirdosh,_ not at fault. That is called a _shuddha vyavahar_. You learnt to 'see' even the _doshit_ , one at fault, as _nirdosh,_ not at fault. The one, who the whole world calls as _doshit,_ at fault; we see him as _nirdosh,_ not at fault. Similarly, if one's vision ( _drashti_ ) is that, then one is _shuddha,_ pure, and so is the other man. That is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_.

Following the five Agnas is really pure interaction, _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. The five Agnas are just for that. It is for the _uchit_ _vyavahar_ tomove on to absolute purity ( _shuddhata_ ). That is what it is for. And the inability to follow the five Agnas, goes into _uchit vyavahar_ (high level interaction).

**Questioner** : We do that here, do we not? You told us about the base for _uchit_ interaction, so what about the _shuddha,_ pure, that You also mentioned in it?

**Dadashri** : then, 'Our-Gnani Purush's' interaction is very close to _shuddha_ , pure; you can actually call it _shuddha_. But it is very close to the _shuddha_ ; it is spontaneous and natural.

**Questioner** : So then what is the perfectly pure ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ) like? Please tell me that first.

**Dadashri** : Not in the slightest, not even by a single word, should any harm come to anyone, not through the mind. You too, do not hurt anyone through the mind, but not hurting anyone through the words or the body; that is completely pure interaction \- _shuddha_.

**Questioner** : You say that Your interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) is close to perfect; then what is the difference between that and the perfect pure interaction( _shuddha vyavahar_ )?

**Dadashri** : We do say sometimes that 'we' lack by four degrees, do we not? And that makes a difference.

## Discharging karmic stock is not _vyavahar_

This old remaining stock that comes out; that is what one calls as _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) then that old stock will stink. Therefore, filled stock ( _bharelo maal_ ) is not _vyavahar_. What is _vyavahar_? It is that which one is in ( _dhyan_ ), right now; that is _vyavahar_. Right now, if this man is scolding someone, I would not tell him off. I would know that He-the awakened Self is not involved in the scolding, because he regrets doing that. He feels, 'This was wrong, this should not have happened.'

The worldly people cannot understand this deeply, can they? How deep this matter is, is something which people do not understand. This is how they see it, so they view it superficially, do they not? So this deapth means that even if he is cursing them, I would know that He-the Self is not in that. 'He' is not the one doing the cursing right now. He is regretting it therefore his _vyavahar_ is high level ( _uchit vyavahar_ ). It is the old stock that is coming out. It will have to come out, no?

**Questioner** : You had given a good example about Tansa's water supply; even if one shuts off the valve from there, the water that that is still inside the pipe comes out.

**Dadashri** : For these people, the valve that allowed the incoming water, the inflow has been shut off, but the outflow continues. Now if there is some tar in the water that is coming out, then tar will come out together with the water. Do you have to scold him at that time? That is what was filled in the past life, and so that is what has to come out now. Why do you get upset with him? It will have to empty, will it not?

Therefore, the _mahatmas'_ interaction s all an _uchit vyavahar_ , high level interaction, because what happens within, the moment you get angry? The answer is 'this should not happen?' On the one hand one becomes angry and on the other hand, there is the remorse that 'this should not happen.' The changed opinion is Your _vyavahar._ 'This should not happen' - that is Your _uchit_ _vyavahar_ (high level interaction), whereas people look at one's visible interaction. So they tell me, 'Your _mahatmas'_ external conduct does not change much. So I tell them, ''We' do not have to change that.' So they tell me, 'How can that be acceptable?' I tell them, 'It is all acceptable to 'us''. Because if I try to make them understand this; I will waste four hours of my time, and they will still not understand.

## The internal intent is verily vyavahar

**Questioner:** Now, there is our (Akram) worldly interaction and there is the worldly interaction called _parmartha_ _muda vyavahar,_ the original worldly interaction for attaining the Self, described in scriptures. What is the difference between the two?

**Dadashri:** No, not like that. Our worldly interaction pure- _shuddha_. Therefore, there is no question of original worldly interaction for the Self. What is that original worldly interaction? It is called _sadavyavahar,_ good interaction. So, one can go up the ladder of spirituality through good interaction. For us there is no _sada_ _vyavahar_ , good interaction. We have _shuddha_ , pure worldly interaction. It may slip somewhat to the level of _sada_ _vyavahar_ , good interaction, but it never slips below that level. Over here, we have pure _nischaya_ , the Self and pure _vyavahar,_ worldly interaction. The five Agnas given to all constitute pure worldly interaction.

The other person may insult you, but You are to 'do' _sambhave nikal_ , settle with equanimity. Now if the other person is saying something grossly hurtful, even then You have decided to settle with equanimity. This decision is the only thing that is counted in _vyavahar_ worldly interaction. This talking, quarrelling and cursing is not counted in the interaction, but the decision that, 'I don't want to fight, I want to settle with equanimity,' is counted in the _vyavahar_ interaction.

**Questioner:** What You just said; how many people can really grasp that meaning?

**Dadashri:** Few can grasp this in exactness. However, something will grow and come out of this, amidst where there used to be complete desert.

**Questioner:** The _vyavahar_ , worldly interaction is in the form of discharge. So why is there talk of purifying it or it becoming purified?

**Dadashri:** It is in the form of discharge, but it is so only for those to whom I have given Gnan. Yet, our (in Akram) inner interaction is _aadarsha_ (ideal, _uchit,_ high level). The outer interaction is in the form of discharge. The inner interaction is _shuddha_ pure.

**Questioner:** Please clarify this matter about the inner interaction. I do quite not understand it.

**Dadashri:** The inner, 'it should not be like this,' that is verily the _vyavahar_ interaction. While on the outside he is angry, simultaneously on the inside, 'it should not be like this' is there. That is the _vyavahar_ interaction, and that is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction. The Atma, the Self is the Knower and 'it should not be like this,' is in the middle.

**Questioner:** Who is saying, 'it should not be like this?'

**Dadashri:** All that is from _pragnya,_ the liberating energy of the Self. It is a kind of a pure interaction _shuddha vyavahar_. Even when some one is swearing at you, Your inner interaction towards that person is of a very high level. That inner interaction is such that the mind is not affected at all.

## Only the Gnani helps one attain shuddha vyavahar

Pure worldly interaction _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ is the direct cause for _moksha_. When You follow 'our' Agna, then the worldly interaction verily is pure.

**Questioner** : If someone wants to bring about pure worldly interaction ( _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ ), he needs the live presence of a Gnani Purush, does he not?

**Dadashri** : How can this happen without live presence, without meeting a Gnani Purush? One cannot attain the Self, without a Gnani Purush, can he? Then why discuss any further? But You all ( _mahatmas_ ) will attain the _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction. Some will do so in five years, some in ten years and some in fifteen years. But the more one follows the Agnas, theworldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) will continue to become pure. _Shuddha_ _vyavahar_ means that it does not harass anyone, it does not cause anyone any difficulty whatsoever. Hence, without a Gnani Purush, there cannot be _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , can it? Even _sada_ _vyavahar_ good worldly interaction is rare, without a Gnani Purush, in the current era of the time cycle.

**Questioner** : Will _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ (pure worldly interaction) cease, if there is no Gnani Purush around, after twenty five years?

**Dadashri** : For all these people ( _mahatmas_ ), it will continue even after I am not around. They have Gnan, and there is the energy and guidance of the awakened Self behind it. And for the one who has a relation with the Gnani Purush; the Gnani Purush will be with him every step of his life for sure. So he does not even have to think about it at all. For the one form no relationship has happened or who does not even know of Him, for such human beings other ways will come about.

**Questioner** : Will the _shuddha vyavahar_ come to an end?

**Dadashri** : No, _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ will continue even if the Gnanis of the _kramik_ path are around. Whem Tirthankaras are around hundreds of thousands human beings have _shuddha vyavahar_. Lord Mahavir had _shuddha vyavahar_ , and all his followers who went to _moksha_ , they departed with _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. One cannot go to _moksha_ without having _shuddha vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction, can he?

## The Self Knows and the worldly interaction continues

Worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) is _kalpit_ _vyavahar_ , imagined interaction - interaction that takes place with the false belief of 'I am Chandulal'. Ours, here (Akram) is pure worldly interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ). Hence, any interaction ( _vyavahar_ ), where anger-pride-deceit-greed do not happen is called _shuddha vyavahar_. We, here, do not have anger-pride-deceit-pride at all. And 'we' proved that the _krodha_ (anger with violent intent) is not _gusso_ (anger without violent intent), and therefore 'our' interaction is a pure interaction ( _shuddha vyavahar_ ).

When you refer to your wife as 'wife' from the relative view point, but internally You know she is 'file number two'. And You refer the child as 'file number three'. You refer to this body as 'file number one'. So, from the moment You say 'file', the Self and the body complex remain separate. Everyone ( _mahatmas_ ) is aware of that. This is as clear as daylight. So this is a wonderful thing. The _samadhi_ (the state of equanimity as the Self) remains constantly, does it not? It does not waver, does it?

Even when you eat and drink, is it a _shuddha,_ pure or _ashuddha,_ impure, _vyavahar_? It is _shuddha_. It is because You do not eat, do You? What does our _vyavahar_ say? It says, 'the eater, eats ( _ahari_ _ahar karey_ _chey_ )' So ours is a wonderful science, is it not? Otherwise, how can one maintain _samadhi_ even for an hour? No one can attain _moksha_ without attaining Gnan. The interaction of the people of the world is good and bad _shubha_ and _ashubha_. It is not considered Gnan.

_Shuddha vyavahar_ (pure interaction) means that there is no intereference from the Self (the awakened One) at all. The Self continues to Know, and _vyavahar_ continues, that is called _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. Then it can be anything, You do not have to see anything else, it does not matter whether you are running a medical practice, running a farm or running a business. All You have to 'see' is where the self is functioning. Really speaking, there is no _himsa_ violence. The Self never takes birth nor does the Self ever die. These are just the _pudgals_ (non-Self complexes) that arise and hurt each other. The vibrations hurt, and therefore in reaction, 'he'-the non-Self complex' hurts back. In all this one has the illusion, 'I am this', and that is why he incurs the liability of karma.

_Shuddha vyavahar_ is that in which ther is no _mamata-_ myness. Then it may be anything, 'we' do not have any concern with that. If there is _mamata_ in the _vyavahar_ , there will be _kashaya,_ anger-pride-deceit-greed, and so that cannot be considered as _shuddha vyavahar._

## No shuddha vyavahar without Self-realization

**Questioner** : If conviction ( _pratiti_ ) of the Self is established, then only can _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ happen, no?

**Dadashri** : Yes, otherwise _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) cannot become _shuddha_ (pure). Should I tell you when it is considered as _shuddha_ _vyavahar_? When You see the Self in a donkey, in a dog, in a cat, in a tree, when You see everyone as the Self; that is when it is considered as _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ – pure worldly interaction.

## Sadavyavahar is ego dependant: Shuddha vyavahar is egoless

**Questioner** : In worldly interaction, when they talk about good thoughts ( _sadachar_ ) and good worldly conduct ( _sadachar_ ), that will constantly happen when one follows the five Agnas, will it not?

**Dadashri** : When one is constantly following the five Agnas, He may not necessarily be in good worldly conduct ( _sadachar_ ), he may not be in good worldly interaction ( _sadavyavahar_ ), but nonetheless He is in pure worldly interaction, _shuddha vyavahar_. When one follows the five Agnas, his _vyavahar_ verily is pure ( _shuddha_ ). _Sadachar_ is good worldly conduct. _Sadachar_ and _sadavyavahar_ , they are both dependent on the ego ( _ahamkar_ ), and _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ is dependent on the egoless ( _nirahamkar_ ) one. In the _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , whatever happens, say if Chandulal scolds the son, but from within You say, 'What are you doing, Chandulal?' then that is Your _shuddha_ _vyavahar_.

**Questioner** : So, what has to be done in _shuddha vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : There is nothing to be done. Doership is a grave illusion. And for those who are doers, doing good is _sadavyavahar_ and doing bad is _asadvyavahar_. And You are not the doer of anything; that is Your _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. You are aware that You are not the doer of any karma, are You not? When that awareness prevails, it is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. When _vyavahar_ becomes _shuddha_ , _nischaya_ becomes _shuddha_.

So following the five Agnas is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , completely _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. _Sadavyavahar_ is the lower state, a lot lower state. The world has not seen _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ at all. The world has come only as far as _sadavyavahar_ , good worldly interaction.

## Deeper understanding of sadavyavahar

**Questioner** : What is the definition of _sadavyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : It is the interaction in which the other person is not hurt, where, your _kashayas_ hurt only you, and no one else. That is a _sadavyavahar._ And _kashayas_ that hurt others is _shubha-ashubha vyavahar_ (helpful and hurtful interaction) Where _kashayas_ will benefit others and at times they will hurt others, that is _shubha-ahshubha vyavahar_. This _shubha-ahshubha vyavahar_ is not even considered a _vyavahar_ worldly interaction. There needs to be _sadavyavahar_. _Shuddha vyavahar_ arises from following the five Agnas of the Gnani Purush, but _sadavyavahar_ is needed in the worldly life. Now, _sadavyavahar_ is that in which one accepts the hurt others give him and he maintains the intent of not wanting to hurt anyone. One may unknowingly hurt someone, but in the mind the intent is, ' I definitely do not want to hurt anyone.' If hurt happens to anyone, then that is dependent on the unfolding karma of past life. From this point, it is considered as _sadavyavahar_ ; _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ is that which is without _kashaya_.

_Sadavyavahar_ is to have the interaction according to the scriptures, according to what the great ( _mahan_ ) people have said. It is the one that involves the path to _moksha_ , involvement in the tools that help attain _moksha_ ; all such worldly interaction is _sadavyavahar_. Worldly _sadavyavahar_ is in fact _shubha vyavahar_ auspicious-helpful interaction. Both are intent dependent. One has intent for liberation _moksha,_ the other has intent for worldly interaction

**Questioner** : Please say one more time about _sadavyavahar._

**Dadashri** : All the tools, that lead to _moksha_ are there in the worldly interaction, then it is _sadavyavahar_ and when tools that promote material and worldly life are there in worldly interaction, it is _shubha_ _vyavahar_. _Sadavyavahar_ does not exist in worldly life ( _sansar_ ). _Sadavyavahar_ means, compassion, peace, equanimity, forgiveness, truth, renunciation, dispassion; that is all considered _sadavyavahar_. Whether the other person interacts with these qualities or not, but if one has and interacts with these qualities, that is _sadavyavahar_.

## Shuddha vyavahar is without ego

What is called a real exact _vyavahar_ , interaction? It is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction. After attaining _nischaya_ , the Self, whatever remains is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. It is the worldly interaction without ego ( _nirahmakari_ ), where there is not an iota of ego; that is _shuddha vyavahar_ (pure worldly interaction). There is a difference between _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ and _sadavyavahar_. _Sadavyavahar_ is associated with ego ( _ahamakar_ ), and _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ is without the ego ( _nirahamkar_ ). Ours (Akram _mahatmas_ ) is considered as egoless worldly interaction. Even if it appears bad, with all the external imperfections; it is egoless. That is why ours is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ (pure interaction), not _sadavyavahar_.

_Shuddha_ _vyavahar_ means constant internal _saiyam_ (absence of _kashaya_ ) prevails. External _saiyam_ may or may not be there. People in the world outside have external _saiyam_ (control over the five senses); _tyagis-_ the renunciates have it. _Moksha_ can be attained only if one has internal _saiyam_ , then even if one does not have external _saiyam_ , it will do. One is blessed, when interanl _saiyam_ arises.

## The difference between shubha and shuddha vyavahar

**Questioner:** What is the difference between _shubha_ _vyavahar_ and _shuddha_ _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri:** The Gnani, the one who has realized the Self and the _agnani_ , one with no awareness of the Self; both can do _shubha_ _vyavahar_ , good-helpful worldly interaction. The Gnani does not have to do _shubha_ _vyavahar_ , it happens by itself and the _agnani_ has to do it. There is ego therefore he has to do _shubha_ —good worldly interaction. That means if you tell him, 'I do not want to work with you because you are creating a loss.' Then what will that person tell you? He will say, 'Please forget the loss that is incurred but now let us do it well from the beginning.' You 'did' something hurtful _ashubha,_ and does the helpful _shubha._ Where you become irritated he does not get irritated, and in fact corrects it and makes you come to the good-helpful, _shubha_. He carries forward as if nothing hurtful has happened and makes you forget the hurt; does he not? Then the train will move further, otherwise the train will become derailed. Have you seen all those who have been derailed? Thus both the Gnani and _agnani_ can carry out _shubha_ _vyavahar_ , good worldly interaction. It happens naturally for the Gnani but the _agnani_ has to do it.

When the _vyavahar,_ worldly interaction, is carried out with _jagruti_ , awareness then it is called _upayoga_ of the Self. When _shubha_ , helpful and _ashubha_ , hurtful worldly interaction is associated with _jagruti_ then also it is _upayoga,_ applied awareness of the Self. _Shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction, is the interaction with the experience of the Self and _shubha_ _vyavahar_ , helpful worldly interaction is the interaction without the experience of the Self. But since the Soul is accepted, the awareness follows.

## Shubha, ashubha and ashuddha interaction

**Questioner** : Dada what is _ashubha_ _vyavahar,_ hurtful interaction? Is _ashubha_ the opposite of _shubha,_ good?

**Dadashri** : _Ashubha_ _vyavahar_ is all going on all around, is it not? Pockets are being picked, people hurt others, curse others, etc. One gets tired of the _ashubha_ _vyavahar_ (hurtful interaction). When one gets tired, know that _shubha_ interaction has left. That is why one has to hire lawyers.

**Questioner** : Does _ashuddha_ impure interaction include both; _shubha,_ helpful and _ashubha_ hurtful interaction?

**Dadashri** : No, _ashhddha_ impure interaction is very rare. A very rare person does that. A useless person, someone who is likely to go to the seventh hell, has _ashuddha vyavahar_. This is _shubhha_ and _ashubha_ , helpful and hurtful, respectively. Even _ashubhha_ is better than _ashuddha_. _Ashubha_ interaction means _paap_ , hurtful interaction and _shubha_ interaction means _punyai_ helpful. The one commiting _paap_ hurtful interactions may someday do _punyai_ helpful deeds. But the one with _ashuddha_ impure interaction; there is nothing saving him.

## All interaction except the shuddha interaction is with ego

**Questioner:** Dada, we talked about 'wordly interaction _vyavahar_ original worldly interaction' and ' _paramartha_ (that which leads to the Self) original ( _mooda_ ) worldly interaction.' Now, is that synonymous with helpful-hurtful ( _shubha ashubha vyavahar_ ) worldly interaction?

**Dadashri:** Yes. Worldly original worldly interaction is the helpful-good and hurtful-bad worldly interaction ( _shubha ashubha vyavahar_ ) and is associated with ego. Where there is ego, the interaction becomes poisonous. In the traditional _kramik_ path even the interaction intended for the ultimate- the Self ( _paramartha_ ) is tainted with the poison of ego.

**Questioner:** That means without the attainment of the Self all interaction is with ego?

**Dadashri:** It is with ego only. What else can it be called? All this helpful-hurtful _shubha-ashubha_ interaction is with ego only.

**Questioner:** So, in _sada vyavahar_ interaction that leads to the Self, is there ego involvement?

**Dadashri:** Yes. There is ego in _sada vyavahar_. And when the ego is absent, it is with natural intent. ( _sahaj bhaav_ ). This is _shuddha vyavahar._

**Questioner:** In _sada vichar_ (helpful thoughts) and _sada vyavahar_ (helpful that leads to the Self) interaction, is it better if there is no ego?

**Dadashri:** There is nothing better than the egoless interaction. Ego is the poison.

**Questioner:** As long as there is ego in _sada vyavahar_ , it is a deficiency and weakness?

**Dadashri:** Defect and weakness? Yes. And what a deficiency it is. It is like eating uncooked potatoes.

**Questioner:** Dada, the ego exists for sure in _sada vyavahar_ , because Gnan has not happened yet, no?

**Dadashri:** Yes, ego will be there surely. And for 'us', the interaction is _sahaj-_ natural, without any ego. All our interaction that now remains to be settled ( _nikali_ ) is natural, without ego.

## Shuddha vyavahar happens after kashayas end

**Questioner** : This _shubha_ _vyavahar_ and this _ashubha_ _vyavahar_ , but the word _vyavahar_ is used there, is it not?

**Dadashri** : Where is the _vyavahar_ there? It cannot be called _vyavahar_. One says that, that is all; it is just a term that has been given to it. Otherwise, _shubha ashubha vyavahar_ is interaction with ego only.

**Questioner** : Now, in the _kramic_ path, many lifetimes go by in doing all this. And what do You do here? First the separation is made, then one is told to maintain _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , maintain _shubha vyavahar_ , maintain _sada_ _vyavahar_...

**Dadashri** : In this Akram path, You will learn all that now. _Shubha_ _vyavahar_ and _sada vyavahar_ will arise naturally and spontaneously, and _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction, will arise from Your _purushartha-_ following and being in the five Agnas.

It is considered a _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ when one's life is becomes in accordance with Agna ( _Agnapurvak_ ) and when _kashayas_ do not have any effect, and where _kashayas_ have calmed down. Then know that there is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ there.

_Nischaya_ , the real Self is _shuddha_ , pure. What is considered as _vyavahar_ - _shuddhi,_ purity of worldly interaction? _Kashaya_ -less worldly interaction is considered as _vyavahar_ - _shuddhi_. Then You do not have to see if one is fat or thin, tall or short, white or black. Just 'see 'if he is without _kashaya_? If yes, then that is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_.

Once we had to go to Bhadran, but the car broke down. It was five to six hours late, but that did not bother anyone. Yes, that man from the other institution was telling the _mahatmas_ that they would get upset if someone were to come late by half an hour, but here it does not affect anyone in the slightest, even when the car is five hours late. That is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ (pure interaction).

If someone comes here and his behavior ( _aachar_ ) is not right; if he pushes someone aside and does the _vidhi_ (special energizing blessings and connection with the Self at the feet of the Gnani Purush), his behavior may not be appropriate, but still there is no _kashaya_ in it. To push someone aside here is it not considered wrong? 'We—the Gnani Purush' understand everything, sitting here 'we' know what each one is doing, but 'we' know ( _jaaniye_ ) that your behavior may not be appropriate, but there is no _kashaya_ in it. Inappropriate behavior is _prakruti_ , the non-Self complex; it is the attribute of the _prakruti_. At the time of the wrong conduct happening; 'it-the _prakruti_ ' will not refrain from hurting; even if there is no instigation at all. So he will push two people aside and then sit down to do the _vidhi_.

'We' come across many _prasang_ (situation, situation that makes the Gnani come out of the Self) , do 'we' not? Even when I am shaving, if I put my leg down, people start doing the _vidhi_ right there. They don't even think what will happen if there is movement. Oh, even at the time of having a meal, they will do the _vidhi._ Nevertheless, it is _shuddha_ _vyavahar_. 'We' know that this is a _kashaya_ -less result. If 'we' were to tell him without us spoiling the mind that he cannot do _vidhi_ now, and that he is to go away, even then he will not mind.

Now where do _kashayas_ arise? They happen where there are rules and laws. 'Hey you cannot go in when He is eating, do not be disorderly there.' The mind will retaliate; then _kashayas_ will protect the worng vision. And here there are no _kashayas_ at all, are there? Anyone can come again whenever he wants to. And if when a fault has happened, all are immediately doing _pratikraman_. Do they do _pratikraman_ immediately or not? And _pratikraman_ happens naturally.

## Examples of various types of vyavahar

**Questioner** : Dada please explain _ashuddha vyavahar_ , impure worldly interaction, _ashubha vyavahar,_ hurtful worldly interaction, _shubha vyavahar_ helpful worldly interaction and _shuddha vyavahar,_ pure worldly interaction, with examples.

**Dadashri** : What is _ashuddha vyavahar_? It is when one continues to do _himsa_ (violence) all daylong. Being a human being, he is involved in _himsa_ the whole day. This is worthless interaction of the ultimate level. Even the worthlessness is of the lowest level. When a person kills someone and eats human flesh, then we have to say that his worldly interaction is _ashuddha_.

When one kills a living being like deer etc., for pleasure, that interaction is _ashuddha_. But who does all that apply to? To the one who is not understanding, who is being unnecessarily foolish, that is where this _ashuddha_ worldly interaction happens.

Now if one kills a deer to feed his children; that is _ashubha vyavahar_. At the time of killing, he is aware that what he is doing is not right.

Now another person kills a deer to feed his children, but then he regrets it tremendously, 'Why did it fall on me to do this?' That remorse gets subtracted from his _ashubha_ worldly interaction. So that it is a mixture of _shubha_ - _ashubha_. Look, how much work _bhaav_ (inner intent) does!

Then _shubha_ _vyavahar_ means, one will not do _himsa_ violence towards someone even when that person is doing _himsa_ violence against him. Then finally there is the _shuddha vyavahar_ pure worldly interaction. There is also a _sada vyavahar_ of the ascetics ( _sadhus_ who are trying to attain the Self) in between these two types. The interaction of the _sadhus_ is higher than _shubha vyavahar_.

And _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ is 'our' _vyavahar_ ; it is indeed _shuddha vyavahar_. The pure _nischaya_ is one hundred percent there; _Shuddhatma_ , the pure Self, and therefore _vyavahar_ worldly interaction is also _shuddha_ , pure. _Shuddha_ _vyavahar_ is when 'Chnadubhai' is cursing someone and You- the Self 'see' 'Chandubhai' as a third person who is so miserably weak, then that is _shuddha vyavahar,_ pure worldly interaction. 'One' is not always going to be able to 'see' in this way when the 'self-Chandubhai' is cursing someone, but One can 'see' it up to certain level of worldly interaction. To 'see' the worldly interaction of the 'self' is _shuddha,_ pure worldly interaction. There are our _mahatmas_ with such a desire. They try to do that as much as they can, otherwise als,o they do know that this interaction _vyavahar_ that is taking place is not 'me'. That is where _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction begins.

## Shuddha nischaya rests on the foundation of shuddha vyavahar

_Shuddha_ _nischaya_ is based on _shuddha vyavahar_ pure worldly interaction. So, one's worldly interaction _vyavahar_ should be pure _shuddha_ and above that rests _shuddha_ _nischaya_ the Self. There is no _nischaya_ , where there is no (pure) _vyavahar_.

**Questioner** : So Dada first comes the _nischaya_ (the Self) in this and then begins the _vyavahar,_ no?

**Dadashri** : No, they are both together. They never become separate.

**Questioner** : But _nischaya_ (the Self) is attained first, then comes _vyavahar_ , does it not?

**Dadashri** : One verily attains the _nischaya_ in the presence of the worldly interaction _vyavahar_. To attain _nischaya_ (the Self) means to attain the experience of the Self ( _Atmanubhav_ ). If one does not attain the experience, then he has not attained the _nischaya_.

**Questioner** : What we refer to as _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ pure worldly interaction, it comes only after one has attained the experience of the Self, no?

**Dadashri** : _Shuddha vyavahar_ comes after the experience only.

**Questioner** : So if one does not have the knowledge of _nischaya –_ the Self, how can his worldly interaction ever be considered _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : Because the _nischaya_ is pure _shuddha_ (the self has become pure as the pure Self), _vyavahar_ has become pure. So the basement only begins, when the self (worldly) becomes the Self ( _shuddha nischaya_ ), only then the _vyavahar_ becomes _shuddha._ Hence whatever _vyavahar_ it was, it became pure _shuddha_ after one come into _nischaya_ ( the Self) and now the basement is of _shuddha_ _vyavahar_.

If there is no basement, then to people who refer to _shuddha_ _nischaya_ claiming, 'I have attained the Self;' I ask them, what is your Self sitting on? They may reply, 'What do we need worldly interaction _vyavahar_ for?' The answer is, 'the Self is gone because there is no Self ( _Atma_ ) where there is no _vyavahar_.' Therefore such people have carried on without giving any importance to _vyavahar_. Such people even say, Only _upadaan,_ spiritual readiness and worthiness is needed. There is no need for a _nimit_ (the Gnani).

**Questioner** : Now, the whole _vyavahar_ is said to be a discharge, then how can it be possible for _nischaya_ to stand on the basement of _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : But what is the problem there? It will sit on it as long as _vyavahar_ is there, will it not? When the _vyavahar_ is not there, there is no need for it, is there? The Self will continue 'seeing the film', as long as there are discharge karma. Then it has to 'see' the film of the whole world. But when will these karma discharge? Only when the _vyavahar_ remains with the vision of Self ( _shuddha_ state).

_Vyavahar_ will have to be exact. One will shout, 'Sir, what do I need _vyavahar_ for, when I have become the Self?'

**Questioner** : This talk is about the outside people (non- _mahatmas_ ).

**Dadashri** : It is of the people ( _mahatmas_ ) here. What problem do those on the outside have? Where there is no _nischaya_ at all, people on the outside have only the _vyavahar_ , do they not? I am saying this for those who have the _nischaya_ (the Self). There should be _nischaya_ along with the _vyavahar_. _Nischaya_ should be on the basement of _vyavahar_. Where there is _nischaya_ , but no _vyavahar_ , there is no _nischaya_ either. So this is our Akram path, _nischaya_ is standing on the basement of _vyavahar_. Therefore, there is _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ and there is _shuddha_ - _nischaya_. There is talk of Atma at other places, but _vyavahar_ is not there. When _vyavahar_ is not there, that is not the absolute state of the Self.

To keep _nischaya_ in _nischaya_ , and _vyavahar_ in _vyavahar_ , that called _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. Still _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ do not have anything to do with each other.

## Complete vyavahar dharma in the five Agnas

Where there is no _shuddha vyavahar,_ pure worldly interaction, there is no foundation of _vyavahar_ at all, there is no _nischaya,_ the Self. And without purity in worldly interaction- _nischaya,_ talks about the Self ( _Atma_ ) will never work.

On the basement of this _shuddha vyavahar_ pure worldly interaction, stands the _shuddha nischaya,_ the pure Self. To the extent that your worldly interaction foundation is weak, lacks purity, you will not attain the pure Self, _shuddha nischaya_ by that much. This is because the law of attaining the Self is that the Self can be only attained, if the worldly interactions become pure _shuddha_. And here in our Akram path our religion ( _dharma_ ) exists along with complete _vyavahar._ Complete _nischaya_ and complete _vyavahar_. The five Agnas which 'we' have given, that is the complete _vyavahar dharma,_ complete religion of interaction.

'We' are saying that this is such a path of pure interaction, _shuddha vyavahar_ and pure awareness as the Self _shuddha nischaya_. This is Akram Vignan. Your pure interaction is dependent on these Agnas which 'we' have given to You. Now if one does not follow them or follows them to a lesser extent, it is a different thing. But the _vyavahar,_ worldly interaction which is carried out through five Agnas, is pure interaction - _shuddha vyavahar._

## Shuddha vyavahar is like a drama

What I am saying is that one is considered as having attained the Self completely, when he has the _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. _Vyvahar_ (interaction) should be 'dramatic' (like acting in a play). If someone tells you, 'You will have to drink tea', and the inner one-the ego says, 'no I do not want to', then the tow come to clash. He will say, 'You will have to drink', and the inner one will tell him, 'No I will not'. So then they drop the cup and the saucer and break both. Should _vyavahar_ be like that? I would say, 'Bring it, how much would you like me to drink?' he would say, 'One saucer full.' So then I would go ahead and drink it. I would drink it even I do not have a habit of drinking it. How wonderful this drama will look!

And our _vyavahar_ is true _vyavahar_ , it is _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. On that _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ is the _shuddha_ _nischaya_. _Shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ means that when visitors come to visit you at your home, they do not have Gnan, and you tell them, 'Have some tea before you leave'. Hey why do you need that, now that you have become a Gnani?'. Tell him, 'No it is customary, is it not?' People on the outside should not complain that, 'Chandubhai is in 'Dada', so he is not taking care of his _vyavahar_ anymore.' It should not be so. _Vyavahar_ should be dramatic, in everything. Get your children married, and do it dressed up nicely. Wear all the fancy appropriate clothing in the wedding.

## The wagon to moksha can no longer get stuck

You should be immersed in worldly interaction but You should not let go of _nischaya_ , the Self, either. You should be aware of ( _dhyan_ ) the Self _nischaya_ , while being involved in the worldly interaction.

You should not forget that you are Chandubhai and you are from Dakor. And when you go to work in Navsari, you can say that you are from Navsari, but you should not forget where your roots are. Whatever 'hat' (role) you have to wear, you have to wear it, do you not? You can say that you do not have a choice in that. Infact, you are the one who creates those 'hats'. It is good that You now have Gnan. Those roles will end, otherwise they would continue. And in this manner, our wagon will proceed to _moksha_. You have two 'bulls' that are pulling it, no? What two 'bulls' are they? They are the bull of _vyavahar_ and the bull of _nischaya_. Whoever has employed these two 'bulls', will not get stuck.

## Akram Vignan sails through the worldly life

In this science of the Vitarag, this Akram Vignan of ours; is a complete path of _vyavahar_ - _nischaya_ because the worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) happens completely with with _saiyam_. What is this _saiyam_? It is one where, when the one cursing someone is 'Chandubhai' (the self) and You, the Self, are saying 'no' to that. You, the Self say, 'It should be like that'. That is Your _saiyam_. And the value is of Your _saiyam_ , and not the _saiyam_ of 'Chandubhai'. So this worldly interaction is with _saiyam_. Hence, this _vyavahar_ is of _saiyam_ , and that is why 'we' call it _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ , pure worldly interaction and on the basement of this _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ , completely stands the _shuddha_ - _nischaya_ , the pure Self. Where there is _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ , there is the Self. Where there is no _saiyam_ in _vyavahar_ ,the worldly interaction, one should not believe that he can attain the Self there. _Vyavahar_ should be with _saiyam_.

**Questioner** : _Mahatmas_ have a problem in understanding this.

**Dadashri** : No. After giving you the Gnan, Yours verily is _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ , but he (the discharging ego) believes it otherwise. _Kriya_ (activity of mind, speech and body) appear _himsak_ hurtful, but the _vyavahar_ is definitely _shuddha,_ pure.

**Questioner** : After attaining Dada's Gnan, _saiyam_ _parinam_ , a naturally arising state without _kashaya_ , arises internally.

**Dadashri** : It is _saiyam_ for sure. The Self is separate indeed. And due to the internal _kashayafree_ state ( _saiyam_ _parinam_ ), it is considered as _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. In having this result, it is considered truly pure, _shuddha_. This is _alaukik vignan_ , science beyond the world! One ( _mahatma_ ) should sail right through the worldly life without any difficulty at all. Our Gnan is such that it can take you right through the worldly life, on the other side ( _moksha_ ). It is _alaukik_ (beyond world) science, if this science comes to be known, the whole world would be blessed.

## Seeing the Self in the person cursing you

What is 'our' _vyavahar_ like?

**Questioner** : Top; the highest of all.

**Dadashri** : So that is what is needed. One has understood that in this life. Nonentheless his _vyavahar_ is of a high order ( _uchit shuddha_ ), it is something that has 'fit' him; and so he will become that in his next life.

And whatever account (effect) others give us, it is our own. If someone comes to shower you with flowers; that is your own karmic account unfolding and then if someone hits you; that too is your account of _karma_. When someone is swearing at you, at that time, You should be seeing only the _Shuddhatma_ in him. That worldly interaction is not seen. That _vyavahar_ is account of your _karma_. Whatever account you were to suffer, is now finishing. That is why he his doing his _vyavahar_ , but He is is _shuddha_ , pure. Therefore, if the vision of purity remains towards him, then that is called _shuddha_ - _nischaya_. You are pure and so is the world. Whatever the amount of pure awakened awareness ( _shuddha upyoga_ ), that much is called _shuddha_ - _nischaya_ , that verily is the pure dwelling in the Self ( _shuddha atmaramanta_ ), and then only will there be _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. However much _shuddha_ _nischaya_ , pure Self, there is, there is that much _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ , pure interaction. When _nischaya_ becomes weak, weakness in remaining as the Self, it becomes impure and there is that much impurity in _vyavahar_ , interaction.

## Shuddha-vyavahar only after attaining the Self

**Questioner** : Has it also not been said that after attaining _nischaya_ (Self), what remains is the _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ ; is that called as _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : Yes, after attaining the Self - _nischaya_. But until it is attained, the entire _vyavahar_ is stuck. Until then _vyavahar_ is not considered as _vyavahar_.

**Questioner** : I did not understand. It is said that, 'Without attaining _nischaya_ , _vyavahar_ cannot be called as _vyavahar_ ', so then they say, 'first comes _vyavahar_ and then he attains _nischaya_ ' right?

**Dadashri** : _Vyavahar_ never comes first. When worldly people talk about _vyavahar_ , they do so without understanding. _Vyavahar_ means it should be _adharit_ , should have a support. Why is this _vyavahar_ truly not _vyavahar_? The answer is, 'This _vyavahar_ that is there, it has a support, _adharit'_. So if one has attained _nischaya,_ the Self - 'If I have become the Self, then what else remains?' What remains is the _vyavahar_. If one were to ask him, 'Just because you have attained the Self; does that mean you will go to _moksha_ right away? He will say, 'No! The _vyavahar_ still remains.' So that is where _vyavahar_ begins. When the Self has been removed (separated) from it; what remains is the _vyavahar_.

This _vyavahar_ is what you created yourself. You are responsible. Therefore resolve it and bring a settlement to it.

**Questioner** : And after attaining _nischaya_ , it is considered _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_ , is it not?

**Dadashri** : Yes, thereafter it is considered _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. There cannot be any path to _moksha_ without _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_. The _vitarags_ went to _moksha_ with both the wings; _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_.

## No insistence in vyavahar

_Vyavahar_ , the worldly life, is wasted if _nischaya_ , the Self, is not attained. _Vyavahar_ is to bring about _nischaya_ , and if _nischaya_ does not come, then it goes to waste. And after attaining _nischaya_ , there should not be any insistence on _vyavahar_. For example, if you go to a certain place every year; then there should not be any insistence to go there again. If circumstances arise, then you go. If circumstances to go to some other place arise, then you can go to that other place too. There is no problem with that, but there should not be any insistence on that _vyavahar_.

If _nischaya_ is not in Your hand, then there is no value to the _vyavahar_. Value of _vyavahar_ is after attaining _nischaya_. Documents without the Governor's signature are worthless.

You may take a party of five hundred to a wedding, but if the groom gets lost, then whose house will you go to? If you go to the home of the bride, they will say, 'Why did you come without the groom? Go back and bring the groom with you.' So all this _vyavahar_ (without the Self) is like a wedding party without a groom. When is _vyavahar_ taken care of? It is when you go to the wedding with the groom (the Self). Is the value of the wedding party or of the groom?

**Questioner** : The groom, of course!

**Dadashri** : Even if the groom is limping, he will do, and even if the wedding party is good looking, it will not do.

**Questioner** : So _vyavahar_ is necessary first.

**Dadashri** : Yes, so _vyavahar_ is necessary, still one is not to hang on to it. You are to hang on to _nischaya_ , but necessary is this ( _vyavahar_ ). _Nischaya_ without _vyavahar_ is lame. What good is a bed without four legs? 'The Atma (the Self) is like this...the Atma is like that'; nothing is gained by just saying those words. Show us your _vyavahar_. _Nischaya_ will shine, only if it has the basement of _vyavahar_. Our _vyavahar_ should be ideal.

## _Vyavahar_ remain right till the end

_Nischaya_ without _vyavahar_ is wrong _nischaya_. 'Our' science stands on the basement of settling with equanimity. If one's _vyavahar_ is _shuddha_ , pure, then consider him as definitely having come into _nischaya_. No weakness should remain in _nischaya_. _Nischaya_ is _nischaya_. There should not leave any weakness in it. But it is wrong to have weakness even in _vyavahar_. _Vyavahar_ should be clean, it should be pure. It should be _vitarag_ ; without any _raag_ or _dwesh_. It should be such that no one is hurt even in the slightest. Weakness in _vyavahar_ will lead to weakness in _nischaya_ too. _Vyavahar_ without _kashaya_ is true _vyavahar_ ; interaction free of inner weakness of anger-pride-deceit-greed, is true interaction. Awareness of one's own Self is _nischaya_ and _moksha_ is attained with that. Now people leave _vyavahar_ behind and run away. They are like the ones who run to the Himalayas leaving a wife at home.

When is one asked to leave _vyavahar_? The Lord has not said such a thing; I am saying that leave the _vyavahar_ when your intake of food stops. If _vyavahar_ is not present, then _nischaya_ is not there for sure. _Nischaya_ is there if there is _vyavahar_ , otherwise if you push _vyavahar_ away, then _nischaya_ is not there. The five sentences (five Agnas) we have, that is complete _vyavahar_ , and that is _shuddha_ - _vyavahar_. Even then we give you the freedom to eat desserts and savory dishes.

**Questioner** : But today in _vyavahar_ , Dada goes to someone's wedding, or some thing or other. But after taking _diksha_ , vow of renunciation of the worldly life in the _kramik_ path, and having renouncing everything, then they must not be going to weddings, right? They don't go anywhere in the worldly life, do they? So there is this much difference between us and them, right?

**Dadashri** : That (renunciation) is only _vyavahar_ , is it not? They have not come into _nischaya_. So people feel that they have renounced everything, but all that renunciation is the result of unfolding of their karma.

For me all this has gone away due to unfolding karma. But is this not _vyavahar_? Now I go to other homes, do I not? As long as I am in this body, there is _vyavahar_.

**Questioner** : But I am asking if Lord Mahavir's _vyavahar_ was like Dada's _vyavahar_.

**Dadashri** : His _vyavahar_ was slightly higher. He was Lord Tirthankara, from the start; from the time he was born, his _vyavahar_ was high. He held three kinds of knowledge. Therefore, we cannot even compare him with anyone. Very beautiful; we cannot compare him with anyone.

## There is no relationship between vyvahar and nischaya

**Questioner** : Who is the knower of _satgnan_ , eternal knowledge?

**Dadashri** : The one who holds the desire to know is the knower. The Self does not have such desire. _Vyavahar-atma_ , the worldly interacting self, has that desire to know. So it is its desire.

**Questioner** : Are they the same or separate?

**Dadashri** : By _vyavahar_ they are separate; by _nischaya_ , they are one. After attaining Gnan You have become one. When you went there (out of the Self), you could see two as separate, but when you came back (to the Self) and sat down here, it all became one again.

_Vyavahar_ is separate, for sure. You are sitting separate from this gentleman here; can two people not be in one place at the same time? That is how _vyavahar_ is separate. And _nischaya_ is only one. Atma (Self) is of one nature; it is the same in all.

_Nischaya_ without _vyavahar_ is usless, it is considered lame. _Vyavahar_ should be good, it is a different matter if it does not remain that way, but you should maintain good _vyavahar_. If it does not remain so, it is under the control of _vyavasthit_.

**Questioner** : It feels that _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ are not separate, they are one, so then what is the point in talking about _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : It is on the basis of _vyavahar_ that we live. Is the _vyavahar_ of eating and drinking still not there?

**Questioner** : So then where did this _vyavahar_ come from? What is the basis of it?

**Dadashri** : All these are our own karma, karma that still need to be settled. On the way to _moksha_ , whatever account of karma that remains to be settled is _vyavahar_.

**Questioner** : But on what basis does _vyavahar_ exist, is it not on the basis of _nischaya_?

**Dadashri** : _Nischaya_ is a different thing alltogether, but _nischaya_ cannot be called the basis for _vyavahar_. _Vyavahar_ is all an effect. So _vyavahar_ is based on the causes, and this is an effect, you have no choice but to suffer them. You do not have a choice there, do you? That is why 'we' told you to settle all files with equanimity; You, the Self are the Knower and the Seer, _gnata_ - _drashta_.

**Questioner** : But good _vyavahar_ is born out of _nischaya_ , is it not?

**Dadashri** : No. If it were born out of _nischaya_ , then _nischaya_ would be considered its mother. _Nischaya_ is not even its relative. _Nischaya_ does not become a mother or father of anyone.

Just as the Self and the body are together, that is how _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ must remain together. Atma is _nischaya_ and the body is _vyavahar_ , work of both should come to completion. The part the body complex carries out is _vyavahar_. So, when _nischaya_ becomes absolute, then it does not have any need for _vyavahar_. But as long as one has a body complex, there is need for _vyavahar_. When one is close to final liberation, there is less _vyavahar_. If he is far from liberation, then there will be a lot of _vyavahar_. But there has to be _vyavahar_. One cannot do without a _vyavahar_.

**Questioner** : There is a need for _vyavahar_ , as long as one has a body, is there not?

**Dadashri** : _Vyavahar_ will remain as long as there is a body, even if you do not wish to. When Lord Mahavir was giving _updesha,_ spiritual instructions, even then that _vyavahar_ was there because of the presence of the body, but if you tell him to give _updesha_ now, how can he do that?

**Questioner** : Is the body not there since time immemorial? Where did it come from?

**Dadashri** : When something exists since time immemorial, if we ask 'where did it come from?', then it can be said that it had a beginning.

**Questioner** : Has the body been here since time immemorial or not?

**Dadashri** : It has been there since time immemorial; for time immemorial this mind-speech-and body has been there. This body complex means an unrelenting attachment _vadgan_. One is possessed by the mind-speech-body. Trees do not have a mind, they just have the body and some have a very tiny mind. They do not know when someone cuts them down. There are certain trees like the _asopalav_ (jonesia asoka) tree which blossoms from within at the touch of a woman and the _lajamani_ (mimosa pudica) plant which will retract with the touch.

**Questioner** : And then is the body going to remain for time immemorial?

**Dadashri** : The body exists because of ignorance of the Self ( _agnan_ ). When ignorance goes away, one becomes free of the body and this _vyavahar_. _Vyavahar_ exists because of the ignorance of one's own Self.

**Questioner** : Then I will have to maintain awareness in both, _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ , will I not?

**Dadashri** : No, You do not have to do anything in _nischaya_. I have to see to the _nischaya_ ; You have to take care of only the _vyavahar_ ( Be in the five Agnas). You do not have to look at the _nischaya_.

If _vitaragata_ absence of _raag and dwesh_ , does not come in the _vyavahar_ , then _nischaya_ has not been attained. _Nischaya_ verily is _shuddha_ (pure), but you will not derive its benefit. However much you purify the _vyavahar_ , that much benefit of _nischaya_ will manifest within You..

**Questioner** : And _vyavahar_ does not come without attaining _nischaya_.

**Dadashri** : There is no value of that _vyavahar_. Until the stamp of _nischaya_ has been placed, there is no value of _vyavahar_.

## Vyavahar cannot be negated or ignored

**Questioner** : So blowing off the _vyavahar_ will not work at all, right?

**Dadashri** : How can there be _nischaya_ without _vyavahar_? What is _nischaya_? There has to be something of _anischaya_ non-Self , then there is _nischaya_ the Self. Can there be _nischaya_ alone? There is _nischaya_ if there is something of _anischaya_. If there is a temporary thing, then there is something that is permanent, an eternal thing.

**Questioner** : Where there are cultured pearls, there are real pearls.

**Dadashri** : Today if there are cultured pearls, then you can know that there must have been real ones at sometime, otherwise they would not be able to make the cultured ones. From that, you have to understand. So what do pro- _vyavahar_ people say? They say there is not need for _nischaya_. Pro- _nischaya_ people say there is no need for _vyavahar_. So they both have become lost. In India, both of them have been wandering around, lost. They talk about the Atma, but they have to wander from one life to another, they will not become free for infinite lives. _Moksha_ , liberation, is only where _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ are considered equally.

Even if one becomes insistent on _vyavahar_ , then a major mistake happens and one ends up wandering life after life. And you will be blessed if _nischaya_ becomes the _nischaya_. Those who insist on _vyavahar_ only, end up taking a beating of endless wandering.

**Questioner** : That is because _vyavahar_ is not in his hands; it is _parsatta,_ under the control of some other entity.

**Dadashri** : Yes, it is under the control of something else ( _parsatta_ ). Karma (ignorance) make one believe that everything is under his control, this is for the one who has never come into the realm of the Self. That is what is called _swacchand_.

**Questioner** : Dada, what is _nischaya_ of _nischaya_?

**Dadashri** : _Nischaya_ is this ultimate essence. _Vyavahar_ means superficial, and _nischaya_ means the Atma, the Self. Pure element ( _shuddha tattva_ ) is called _nischaya_ ; a _tattva,_ elemental thing can be called _nischaya_ and situations ( _avastha_ ) are considered _vyavahar_. That which is permanent is called _nischaya_. If one becomes established in the _nischaya_ of the Self, then his work is done. The whole world has the _nischaya_ of _vyavahar_ ; that is where their wandering is. I have become the Self, one will claim. He believes the _pudgal_ (non-Self complex) to be his Self. Some become _kriyajada_. What is _kriyajada_? It is where one believes _kriya_ (activity through mind, speech and body), to be the Self, the Atma. To believe _dehadhyas_ , the belief of 'I am this body', as the Self, means aimless wandering from life after life. Now, only if _dehadhyas_ departs, can _nischaya_ the Self be attained. When _nischaya_ is established, then the work is done. You have attained a _nischaya_ which is unshakable.

## Pudgal is vyavahar and Chetan is nischaya

Those who attempt to emphasise _nischaya_ become weak in _vyavahar_. They will not attain _moksha_. Those who attempt to emphasise _vyavahar_ become weak in _nischaya_. They will not attain _moksha_ either. Those who are _udaseen,_ indifferent, in both, _nischaya_ and _vyavahar_ , they will attain _moksha_.

One should not be biased towards just one side only. In the body, there is both _nischaya_ and _vyavahar_. They both exist in one place. _Pudgal_ the non-Self complex, is _vyavahar_ ; _chetan_ , the Self, is _nischaya_. No one has more or less of either at all. This _pudgal_ is _gneya_ , that which is to be known, and _drashya_ , that which is to be 'seen', and _chetan_ , the Self is the _gnata_ , the Knower and _drashta_ , the Seer. There is no other difference. Not knowing this fact has given rise to the illusion, _bhranti_. So, the _pudgal_ itself became the knower, believing, 'I am the one seeing it.' Hey! Then who is the doer? He will say, 'I am doer too!' The 'doing' and the 'knowing' becoming mixed is known as the coming together of the two separate flows. Two lines, the Self and the non-Self, run together, and that is known as _bhranti_ , illusion. When both the lines remain separate in their own states, that is called Gnan. Both remain verily in their own nature. The line-flow of seeing keeps seeing, that is the seeing part ( _jonaar_ ). And that which is seen _drashya_ , does not depart from its nature _drashyabhaav_.

## Swabhavik is nischaya and vibhavik is vyavahar

What is _vyavahar_ , worldly life interaction? If one were to understand only this much, he would attain _moksha_. This _vyavahar_ , worldly life interaction is relative and "all these relatives are temporary adjustments and the real is the permanent". The Self is the only entity that is not involved in this worldly life. All other things are in the worldly life. Whatever real things there are; they are all permanent and whatever relative things there are – they are all temporary adjustments. So the relative is the entire worldly life interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) and all that is worldly is prone to destruction. To believe 'that this is I' in that which is prone to be destroyed is the wrong belief. 'I am Chandubhai, I am this woman's husband,' to believe this to be real, are all wrong beliefs.

**Questioner** :What is _nischaya_?

**Dadashri** : _Nischaya_ is that which is ' _svabhaavik_ changeable', changeable intrinsic nature. Everything changes continually. It means its phases ( _paryaya_ ) keep changing. But when this change is _swabhavik_ (intrinsic) then it is _nischaya_ and when the change is _vibhavik_ (not an intrinsic original state) then it is _vyavahar_. This _pudgal_ is in a _vibhavik_ state. That is why it has come into _vyavahar_ (the worldly life interaction) and the Self is _swabhavik_ and that is called _nischaya_. So when it naturally comes into _swabhavik_ its _dravya-guna-paryaya_ matter-property-phases; then it is called _nischaya_.

**Questioner** : The non-destructible ( _avinashi_ ) part is called as _nischaya_.

**Dadashri** : Yes. And the destructible ( _vinashi_ ) is called _vyavahar_. The eternal ( _avinashi_ ) does not do anything in the worldly life interaction, and the worldly life interaction does not do anything to the eternal. Both are completely separate.

## The doer of the vyavahar is with the vyavahar

**Questioner:** I am confused between _nischaya_ and _vyavahar._

**Dadashri** : Very well; in what context? Why are you confused? _Nischaya_ , the Self, is _nischaya_ and the worldly life interaction, _vyavahar_ , is the worldly life interaction. The worldly life interaction is that which is to be seen ( _drashya_ ) and known ( _gneya_ ) and _nischaya_ is the Seer ( _drashta_ ) and the Knower ( _gnata)_. Both are completely separate so where is the need for confusion?

**Questioner** : When I go to do _vyavahar_ the Self _nischaya_ is missed.

**Dadashri** : No, the Self can not be missed. Because the worldly life interaction _vyavahar_ is there along with its Knower. If the Knower were not there, then the worldly life interaction would not be there either. If the worldly life interaction is there, then its Knower is there for sure and because _nischaya_ is there, then one does not have to make the effort to Know. The _nischaya_ , is the Knower there for sure. Why should we have to go to learn to Know? We are the Knower of the worldly life interaction.

**Questioner** : But if the worldly life interaction decreases, then the concentration on the _nischaya_ will come.

**Dadashri** : It is not like that. What does _nischaya_ say? "There is no condition in _nischaya._ " There is not even a single condition in it; because there are no conditions in it; that is when it can remain as _nischaya_ – as the Self. There are no conditions of any kind.

All these _mahatmas_ were engrossed in doing worldly interaction work and yet they remained in _nischaya_ (as the Self); did you see that or not?

Now if _nischaya_ is the Knower ( _jaankar_ ) and _vyavahar_ is the doer ( _karnar_ ), then the worldly life interaction is there with its doer. Only if there is the doer of _vyavahar_ , will that _vyavahar_ be there, otherwise how else can _vyavahar_ be there? You do not know who that 'doer' is and that is why you claim, 'I am the doer'. But there is always the doer of _vyavahar_.

Therefore the _vyavahar_ will always be there along with the doer of _vyavahar._ Just as when we want to eat, the fingers will automatically do the work on their own. You (the Self) remain in _nischaya_ ; 'it' (the doer of _vyavahar_ ) will do all the work. But if You, the Self, enter in it, then mistakes will happen. Let the worldly life interaction _vyavahar_ remain as _vyavahar_ , it will do it very beautifully. Because it is mechanical. Mistakes cannot happen in that which is mechanical. But one tries to turn the handle himself in a process which is mechanical. Oh you foolish one! Don't do that. It is running for sure. But he interferes ( _dakho_ )!

This entire world does nothing but interfere only. The worldly life interaction keeps running continuously. And they keep interfering with it. The doer of _vyavahar_ is always there. The _vyavahar_ itself says, 'we want to go eat now'. Then 'We', the Self, should say, 'let us go'. But the eating is done by the _vyavahar_. It will even give information. 'We are hungry', it will inform You. If it is thirsty, it will even give that information. _Vyavahar_ itself is giving the information. You have to 'see' that _vyavahar_. Hunger has arisen. What is he eating? What does he not eat? Does he eat with one hand or two hands? If he is in a hurry, he will say, let me use two hands!

When fatigue arises, does that mean You, the Self, have to go to sleep? Does fatigue happen? It informs that 'I am going to sleep'. So then You have to say, 'go to sleep. There is only one pillow in the bed, take two and sleep nicely. Hmmm – sleep leisurely. Change the bed sheets if you want to'. This _vyavhar_ is there on its own with the doer of _vyavahar_ along with it. Otherwise, how can the _vyavahar_ be? It cannot be.

**Questioner** : So Dada, a complete change has come about as to 'I am not the doer in this worldly life interaction'. And before this Gnan, I used to move along saying, 'I am doing it'.

**Dadashri** : No. But it is not a question of 'I am the doer'. It is not even the question of 'I am not the doer and he too is not the doer'. It is that there will always be a doer of _vyavahar_ and You, the Self, have to continue to 'see' that. Who is doing all this?

Our Gnan is such that it will show the doer of _vyavahar_ , 'look, this is what happened!' This statement is very profund; it is worth understanding. This sentence came out only today, 'We' too entered into thoughts about it! It was in our awareness ( _khyal_ ) but it was not there in the form of words. For that someone has to ask about it. It would not come out if no one asks questions. You have to receive it after asking the question. This is not a radio!

The worldly life interaction is always there along with the doer of the worldly life interaction _vyavahar._ And therefore it calls for no interference and You have come to know that 'Oh there is a doer of the _vyavahar._ ' So then why do You have to interfere? 'You' just have to keep seeing and the doer of _vyavahar_ keeps on doing. But you used to go and interfere in the middle; before the arrival of the doer of _vyavahar_. You used to jump the line, get in ahead of your self. And so the poor doer of the _vyavahar_ would stand outside.

This sentence is very good. Once in a while such sentences will come out. This Gnan is in 'our' awareness ( _laksha_ ) but it has not come in words. _Vyavahar_ , is always there along with the doer of _vyavahar_. So You, the Self must not interfere in it at all. There is no need to enter into _vyavahar_ , at all. When there is _nischaya_ _vyavahar_ , there the _vyavahar_ always becomes separate for sure.

**Questioner** : Then one should not say later that 'I am not the doer of it'.

**Dadashri** : No, if we were to say that, then there would be a problem. When I say that the doer of _vyavahar_ is always there with _vyavahar_ , then You have to understand from that exactly. What happens in saying, 'I am not the doer' is that all those worldly people become upset! 'I-the Gnani' will never ever say that 'I am not the doer of all this'. Then all those others within will not do anything either. In any case, when has it ever been 'our' ability to say, 'I am not the doer or I am the doer'? How can 'We', who are the Knower-Seer have words such as these? After becoming _gnata-drashta_ , 'our' language must change for sure. The sentence, 'the _vyavahar_ is always there with the doer of _vyavahar_ ', is a very powerful sentence. It makes one free from all burden of doership. _Vyavahar_ has become burden free ( _nirboj_ ).

**Questioner** : But Dada, what I have understood is that the doer is _vyavasthit_ , no?

**Dadashri** : _Vyavasthit_ is there, but it- _vyavahar_ is there with its doer.

**Questioner** : Yes, that is correct Dadaji, but who is the doer of _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : It is there with the doer for sure. So the hurt you feel in the mind that 'I became engrossed ( _tanmayakar_ ) in it'; is wrong. It is the doer of _vyavahar_ who becomes engrossed. 'You' are not the doer so how can You become engrossed?

**Questioner** : The one whose _vyavahar_ is not _vyavahar_ , his _nischaya_ is not _nischaya_.

**Dadashri** : That is the very thing that is applicable to this talk. ' _Vyavahar_ is not _vyavahar_ ', means to believe 'I am the doer in _vyavahar_ '; such _vyavahar_ is not _vyavahar_. _Vyavahar_ is always with _vyavahar_. That means that the doer of _vyavahar_ is always with it. And only then can One be in _nischaya_. Otherwise everything becomes messy. Things on this side end up over there and vice versa.

**Questioner** : The one who has not let _vyavahar_ remain as _vyavahar..._

**Dadashri** : For him, _nischaya_ will not remain, will it?

## Vyavahar cannot be renounced prematurely

**Questioner:** But after Lord Mahavir renounced the worldly life ( _sansar_ ), was he ever in _vyavahar_ worldly life interaction or was he not?

**Dadashri** : He never left the worldly life interaction at all. That ( renunciation of family life) is due of the effect of unfolding karma. Starting from the Gnani all the way to the Tirthankaras, all interact according to the unfolding karma. They have no 'I-ness' ( _potapanu_ ). Therefore their worldly interactions are according to unfolding karma only. They do not have the approach that 'I want to do it this way only'. Therefore till age thirty-one, Lord Mahavir lived the worldly life as a family man, very well, he even had in-laws. He even had a daughter; is one likely to have a daughter if he did not do _vyavahar_? Your _vyavahar_ is not the obstacle, the running away from that _vyavahar_ is the obstacle. You have the tendency of wanting to run away, 'how can I escape the pains of the worldly life?' Just look at 'me'; 'we' live in a home, do 'we' have any intention of running away? Do 'we' have the tendency of 'let me run away from here'?

This man here tells me, 'I will leave my work as a lawyer'. So when he gets ready to abandon the _vyavahar_ worldly life interaction, we can know that his _nischaya_ is not proper. It means that tomorrow he may even leave _nischaya_. As long as the body is there, the _vyavahar_ will be there and till then the basement of _vyavahar_ should be there. It is a different matter if one leaves it when he does not have a body. But what will you leave? You may cut your nails that have grown and ready to be cut but will you be able to cut the other inner nails? Your hair which has still not come out, will you be able to cut them? Cut whatever has grown. But can you cut those that are still inside? So what will you renounce or abandon? Whatever is renounced, will come back over and over again. So understand this talk.

**Questioner** : Dada, as such it would be good to be free from the deceit and illusion of , 'I am Chandubhai'; and to have such intention, but not the intention that I am going to renounce this tomorrow. This subtle difference needs to be understood.

**Dadashri** : One has no independent energy to evacuate his bowels and yet he goes around saying 'I will do this...I will do that...' So You will have to understand this. Where there is no energy, why do you project and believe it to be there? Where there is infinite energy, there, why don't You say, 'I am full of infinite energy'? What benefit is there in projecting and believing energy, where there is none?

## Vyavahar is settling

**Questioner:** After giving us Gnan, You have shown us that this worldly life interaction _vyavahar_ is all being settled ( _nikali_ ).

**Dadashri** : Yes, it is all being settled. That is why through the power of Akram Vignan one can go to _moksha_. Otherwise how can one to go to _moksha_? Where the worldly life interaction is not being settled ( _nikali_ ) , how can one go to _moskha_? And this Vignan is such that it makes one free from attachment-abhorrence ( _raag_ - _dwesh_ ). One can actually be without _raag_ - _dwesh_. Even if someone were to take away your plate of food from in front of you, you would not have any _dwesh_ (abhorrence) towards him; so then _raag_ cannot be there at all, can it? _Dwesh_ goes away from the moment I give Gnan.

The inner _saiyam_ , that You have within; that is _vyavahar_ for You and it is pure _shuddha vyavahar_. And the external _vyavahar_ is all settling. For that, the only thing worth doing is to settle with equanimity ( _sambhavey_ _nikaal_ ); nothing else is worth doing.

The worldly life interaction _vyavahar_ is a matter to be settled and _nischaya_ (the Self) is the acquisition. That, which is worthy of acquisition, is _nischaya_ and the other is to be settled. Whether it is sticky, bland, thin or thick; it is not worth holding on to.

## Centering is vyavahar and the slab is nischaya

The slab of concrete (foundation) is our _nischaya_ and the 'centering' (the supporting structure to build) is the _vyavahar_. Now we have to do the centering, but ultimately it has to be got rid of – this much You should know. Then the slab has to be left alone. So in this way, you can understand that this centering is to be done away with, settled with. We cannot say that it has to be forsaken or unnecessary. It has to be settled. Whatever money comes your way when you get rid of the supporting wood is fine and if it does not, then there is no problem. We just wanted to put the slab in, no?

This much must be understood. 'You' will have to understand the distinction between the worldly life interaction _vyavahar_ and the Self _nischaya_. At the moment there is partiality only towards the worldly life interaction, no? People say only if the _vyavahar_ is 'done' will _nischaya_ arise. So people do the 'centering' and then walk around it leisurely. This will do, they say. They do not know about the slab (the Self)

**Questioner** : That is correct Dada. After coming to Dada, I can understand everything more through the example that Dada gives me.

**Dadashri** : From the example that I give you, you will be able to grasp as to what had possessed you and what had not.

Look, does our Gnan not show you a relationship with the 'centering'? The example was given so that people can understand it and grasp it. You may not have come across this example elsewhere.

All of 'our' _vyavahar_ is _nikali_ – is being settled. Our love cannot be for anything that has to be settled. Our love would be for that which needs to remain. Despite this even when the settlement is being done, you need to paint it. One has no choice but to paint it completely. If someone were to see it, it would look bad, no? Would you not have to paint it?

If You have _nischaya_ (the Self) in Your hand; then do not make any worldly interaction sticky, be it right or wrong. By holding it as right or wrong it becomes sticky, and _nischaya_ the Self will be missed. So one only done the centering; he has made it very strong. He painted it and did everything else and then claims, 'how nice a centering I did!'

Have you seen a centering? They put supports called centering; they put planks and boards. What is that decoration for? Why do they do it? They put supports and then they put boards on top. But what is it that they support? Who are you going to put up there? People?

No, it is to fill the slab (of concrete). Then you have to remove it (centering support). When a slab has to be poured, they put supports and put planks on top to get it ready. So we begin to wonder that they are doing something new. But no, they are filling the slab; they are using it as a support. But then they take it out. After a few days, they take it out. This is the description of _vyavahar_. What I have said is that _nischaya_ is standing on the basement of _vyavahar_. And so the _vyavahar_ will have to be clean. But despite this, we will not insist on _vyavahar_ but insist on _nischaya_. _Vyavahar_ is settling.

At the moment people have become stuck in _vyavahar_. And many people say that there should be an equal balance between _vyavahar_ and _nischaya_ and that one should not insist on _vyavahar_ alone and be stuck in it. But You have to lean persistently towards _nischaya_ but the settlement of _vyavahar_ is also necessary.

Thus I am giving the example of 'centering' as the _vyavahar_ , so that You can get Your work done. What work has to be done? The answer is that the slab has to be done. In this method, in order to attain the Self, one has to do the 'centering'of _vyavahar_ and then later take it out. Then it just has to be settled.

People of the world do not understand these subtle facts, thus the whole world is stuck in the worldly life interactions – _vyavahar_. And when the _vyavahar_ is persistently held on to, they will altogether miss out on the main thing, the Self That is why 'we' have said, 'the worldly life interactions is to be settled and _nischaya_ (Self) is to be acquired.

Then someone else will come along and ask, 'why are these supports not of teak wood?' Hey you – just let go! This support is for the slab. Are they to be kept in place forever? Therefore _vyavahar_ is _nikaali._ So what kind of teak wood people use? They bring very good quality teak wood and made the support. Then later if the slab has to be poured, we will do that, but lets do this for the time being. And so people have started to use ornamental wood and they have started to paint it, even polish it. They think that is the only thing that has to be made and that no other work needs to be done. Whereas what 'we' know is that 'we' want to pour the slab, what will we do hanging on to the supports for? If _vyavahar_ is not there, then the work cannot be done. Because as long as the body is there, the _vyavahar_ is there. So this talk needs to be understood. If we understand the main path, then we will not go astray.

This _vyavahar_ may be ideal ( _adarsha_ ) or it may not be. Whatever the kind of stock of karma that was filled is what will come out. If one had filled tar and then he complains that _ghee_ (clarified butter) is not coming out, only tar is coming out – so whatever happens is correct. Therefore all this calls for compassion. Some people's stock comes out good, it is not that they are doing good _vyavahar_ ; it is because of such stock was filled. Ultimately all that stock has to be settled with equanimity.

## Where vyavahar is ideal there is completion

Now after attaining Gnan, the _vyavahar_ will start to become ideal ( _adarsha_ ) day by day. It is not ideal at the moment and that part will bother you from within. What part bothers you? The part of the _vyavahar_ that is not ideal is what bothers you. So that part will leave and it will remain ideal.

The one whose _vyavahar_ becomes ideal; he becomes complete _Shuddhatma_ – complete pure Soul. Then there are no Agnas to follow; the role of the Agnas is finished. 'You' have to go to this level. Vyavahar must become ideal. In the _kramic_ path, they have completely uprooted _vyavahar_ and thrown it away. It is not necessary there. It is true for them also. The _kramic_ path is exactly like that. If the _chit_ were to go in _vyavahar_ , then he would miss out on the other side (the Self). Because what is that path like? There, the relation of _Gnata-gneya_ ( the Knower-the known) does not exist. We in Akram Vignan have a _Gnata-gneya_ relationship and so _vyavahar_ needs to be ideal, whereas there (in the _kramic_ path), they do not get involved in the _vyavahar_ at all. They will not discuss anything about it. I will talk about Gnan and if the topic of marriage comes up, I will talk about that too. So when a personwho has experience of the _kramic_ path or experience of Gnanis of the _kramik_ path comes here, he will say 'he (Dada) is not a Gnani!' Because amongst the 'diamonds' he has seen, he has not seen a 'diamond' like this.

**Questioner** : That does happen.

**Dadashri** : Anyone entangled in excessive intellect will have this kind of problems. Because a Gnani of the _kramik_ path cannot get involved in _vyavahar_ whereas 'we' get involved in everything!

## Ideal vyavahar is like this

Our worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ ) must be ideal. Ideal in such a way that no Jain's or ascetic's worldly interaction can be like it. Our _vyavahar_ is like that of the Tirthankaras, ideal ( _adarsha_ )! When the _vyavahar_ itself is not proper, then of what use is it? What should _vyavahar_ be like? It should be such that it pleases people. Should it not be like that? Has your _vyavahar_ not turned around since you have come here?

**Questioner** : It has turned Dada, it has turned a great deal.

**Dadashri** : It will turn. If someone were to get agitated and angry with you now, you would call him with love. Otherwise what is the world's _vyavahar_ like? If he gets angry, we too should get angry, if he laughs, we too should laugh. So you fools, if you keep the _vyavahar_ in this way, when will it ever come to an end? One needs to make the decision that 'if the other person is getting angry, I should not get angry', then it will come to an end. If he gets angry and you get angry in return, then it will start anew, won't it? It has always been that way, no? That other person comes and he is angry, the moment you see his eyes, you are ready! Now what does our science say? If he comes to you angry, we should remain calm. Our worldly interactions ( _vyavahar_ ) should be ideal. Do you feel that the _vyavahar_ is ideal?

**Questioner** : Yes, the entire ideal _vyavahar_ is included in the first two Agnas. On the one side, the _Shuddhatma_ is seen and on the other the unfolding karma is seen.

**Dadashri** : Yes. Ideal worldly interactions will come. Only if the _vyavahar_ is pure _shuddha_ , there is pure _shuddha_ _nischaya_ (the Self); otherwise we can take it for granted that there is no _niscahya_. If a person is not settling with equanimity and then he claims, 'I have attained the Self _nischaya_ ', that is unacceptable.The basement of pure _vyavahar_ will be needed. How is it acceptable when people around him complain and he claims 'I have become _Shuddhatma_?'If you were to ask those who live with me, 'Does Dada give you a hard time?' they will say 'no'.

What else remains when one does not clash with anyone in situation of conflict? So you have to check whether one gets into clashes in situations of conflict; if not then it is true _vyavahar_. And if a clash does happen, they will ask for forgiveness from each other. If you ask for forgiveness from the other person, even if that person is far away and not aware of the apology, it will still reach him. If you ask for his forgiveness even in his absence, it will reach him; that is how beautiful our _vyavahar_ is; it is pure _vyavahar_.

Ideal _vyavahar_ means if you were to ask the neighbours, ask the family members, ask anywhere for that matter; and if they all agree that it is; then your _vyavahar_ is ideal. The _vyavahar_ should be such that it does not hurt anyone at home, the wife, the relatives or anyone else; such should be the _vyavahar_ otherwise how can we say that he has attained the Self? Vyavahar has to be ideal. And if it is not, then one's goal must be ideal. As one's _vyavahar_ becomes ideal, that much of the Self ( _nischaya_ ) will manifest.

Once I went to visit a Chief Minister. I asked his mother about him and she said, 'oh don't even talk about him. All day long he abuses me verbally!' Now, how can you call such a man a Chief Minister? How bad is his worldly interaction ( _vyavahar_ )? Of what use is it when he talks big outside but at home his interactions are not proper? Our _vyavahar_ should be such that we do not give the slightest trouble to anyone and the life at home remains beautiful. First everything at home should be cleared. Just as we have the saying, "Charity begins from home", ideal _vyavahar_ "begins from home" too.

'Our' _vyavahar_ is beautiful. All day long I remain in ideal _vyavahar_. If you ask anyone around us, they will tell you that I have not quarreled with any of them. Never have I raised my voice. Never have I become angry with anyone. If that is what everyone says, is that not considered as ideal? If you ask my wife, she will say, 'he is like a God'. She even does 'our' _darshan_. She will touch her head at 'our' feet and do _darshan._ If the _vyavahar_ is ideal and pure, then what other problems can be there?

Even then, one time someone saw a mistake in my _vyavahar_. He said to me, 'You should have done it this way, you made a mistake', so I told him, 'Dear man, you just found out today but I know from my childhood that he (A.M. Patel) is with mistakes!' So he said, 'no, you were not like that in your childhood, you have become like that now'. So all this is as per one's own understanding. So we say it right from the start that we are weak. So there would be no conflicts, even the other person does not have to waste time! And neither will he feel hurt.

## Vyavahar of devotees

Those who do _nischaya_ (seek the Self) without a basement of _vyavahar_ are called _bhagats_ (devotees). Devotees in their _vyavahar_ are goofy. There is no compliance with meal times. Even at three in the afternoon, they would not have eaten. One devotee's wife told him to take a hundred rupees and buy some sugar. He was to buy ten rupees worth of sugar and bring back ninety rupees because they have to pay their child's school fees. 'I will be right back with the sugar', he tells her. Now she needed the sugar to make tea so she tells him, 'hurry up and bring sugar so that we can make tea'. The devotee goes out, before he gets to the grocery shop, he meets another devotee. 'Jai Hari (hail the Lord)...Jai Hari Narayan!' he tells him. The poor devotee forgot about the sugar. 'Where is the _bhajan_ (group hymn singing) ?' he asked the other devotee. 'Is it over there?' and so quickly joined the _bhajan_ in session. At home the wife is waiting for the sugar so she can make tea and also she needed to pay the school fees. But she would be able to pay when the ninety rupees came back. The child missed his school because it was past ten o'clock. How could he go without taking the fees? The teacher had told him, 'come back tomorrow with your fees'. It turned ten o'clock, then eleven o'clock, then twelve noon, but still no sign of the _bhagat_. He came home at 2:30 PM when the _bhajan_ ended. He came without sugar and they went without tea. So all the devotees are like this. The _vyavahar_ of the devotees is crazy. And those whose vyavhaar is crazy, they can never go to _moksha_.

Vyavahar has to be ideal. In this world, people's vyavavhaar is not ideal. In fact how is it even _vyavahar_? Is that possible or not? These devotees are called goofy. And this of ours is the basement! It keeps the _vyavahar_ absolutely correct. If the _vyavahar_ spoils then _nischaya_ spoils. And it is on the foundation of _vyavahar_ that this path of ours rests and it is completely ideal _vyavahar_. My _vyavahar_ is considered ideal because I never get angry. Even if someone says something negative, I do not get angry.

## The worldly life interaction decorated through ego

**Questioner:** The _vyavahar_ of those who have the right vision ( _samyak drashti_ ) vision of the Self and those who have illusory vision ( _mithya drashti_ ), for the one who evaluates the two, it would not tally. Now what kind of awareness should the one with vision of the Self maintain when interacting with the worldly life? Should he retract from that _vyavahar_ or should he continue doing it on the basis that ' _vyavahar_ is a discharge'?

**Dadashri** :No, no. They don't need to retract or there is no other hassle. It is like this: both, the ones with the right vision and the one with the wrong vision, has _vyavahar_. And _vyavahar_ is dependent upon unfolding karma effects. Is there any need to ask as to how and when and what you should do, for that which is not dependent upon You-the Self? The _vyavahar_ of the one who is a _mithyatvi_ , (the one with the wrong vision), appears somewhat nice. The reason being that he "decorates" it through his ego and takes on the responsibility of another life whereas 'we' do not decorate it. But ultimately 'ours' will go higher. In the end, he himself will say 'I am very comfortable with you'. The other person's is with decoration so his looks better. But for that he takes on the liability for the coming life. We do not have such liability. We do not have the materials for the decoration so how can we decorate it? The other person will be sitting having done all the decoration. Now if I were to decorate it, when would everything be resolved? There is no material there, for the decoration, is there? And these people will decorate, no? What will the ego not do? They will even say, 'I will give you my life'! So all these things appeal to them whereas we cannot say anything here. They will even use flattery and all such things. Then at night they will even quarrel. Here with us, one will not see any quarrelling. So in the end they will say, ' this man is very good'.

What is considered as _Atmagnan_? It is that those who have Knowledge of the Self, their _vyavahar_ is higher than all the people of the world. _Atmagnan_ \- Knowledge (experience) of the Self has to be with _vyavahar_ , and that _vyavahar_ must be beautiful. Do we need the _vyavahar_ that people will praise or the one that people will criticise? What do you think? If the _vyavahar_ is ideal and superior, then know that there is _Atmagnan_ , otherwise it cannot be called _Atmagnan_.

## Guidance for the vyavahar of mahatmas

**Questioner:** So Dada give us _mahatmas_ some guidance in this matter so that others will benefit, because people usually look at the _vyavahar_ only.

**Dadashri** : They look at the _vyavahar_ but with 'us' it is like this; the guidance is that regardless of what kind of _vyavahar_ worldly interaction one is in, _saiyam_ (the non-reactive state of being free from anger-pride-deceit-greed) should be there. One will have to arrive to this level of _saiyam_ , no? _Purusharth_ (being the Self through the five Agnas) towards _saiyam_ must be there. _Saiyam_ is in one's hand. Vyavahar means conduct and speech, and all that is under the control of other entity but _saiyam_ is in one's own hands. If there is _saiyam_ , people become very pleased. If a hundred of those people become very angry but You do not, and remain calm, then will the people not be pleased? Will you not make an impression of 'there is something here!'? So slowly these energies will arise in our _mahatmas_. These inner energies have arisen in them. But as the external happiness and external energies manifest outside, people will begin to accept. How are they to accept, otherwise? If the energies do not manifest openly, then how can they accept?

## The vitarag are more beneficial to the world

When I attend a wedding, does that mean the wedding sticks to me? When 'we' go to weddings, we remain completely _vitarag_ – absolutely free from attachment and abhorrence. When we go to ' _moha_ bazzar' (anything which creates illusory attachment), we become completely _vitarag_ and when 'we' go to 'bhakti bazzar' (devotional gatherings of _mahatmas_ ), our _vitaragata_ (state of being _vitarag_ ) decreases.

**Questioner:** So of benefit is the other state where amidst _moha_ bazzar, we get to do _darshan_ of the _vitarag_!

**Dadashri** : When you see 'us' in someone's weddings, you will see complete _vitaragata._ There is no hassle or problem of any kind! One can do _darshan_ if there is _vitaragata_ but not otherwise.

I have shown people something new, no? Despite going to weddings, one can go to _moksha_. Vyavahar is where there is no attachment-abhorrence. There is no problem with _vyavahar_ such as that. In the _kramic_ path if one goes to see a movie, there is attachment-abhorrence towards the cinema and we say that the _vyavahar_ of Akram is being settled. We say that he has gone to settle it. The other person goes to acquire ( _grahan_ ), whereas this one goes to settle ( _nikal_ ).

You have to finish off-settle circumstances of weddings and other _vyavahar_. I too am finishing off-settling with that _vyavahar_ and so are you, but you finish it by becoming engrossed in it whereas I finish it off by remaining separate from it. So You just need to change Your location; You don't need to change anything else. Lord Mahavir too, was in the _vyavahar_ for a short while. He was a Gnani from the time he was born, despite this he was in _vyavahar_ with his brother and his parents. He even lived with his wife and he even had a daughter. Despite being in _vyavahar_ he completed the life and role of a Tirthankara. You too have that much energy but that energy has not become free from the veils that shroud it. It remains veiled.

Therefore go to wedding etc. but they- the interacting world- do not say that you become engrossed in them. Your _moha_ (illusory attachment) is what makes you become engrossed. Otherwise you would not remain engrossed; that is why no one will complain about you for not becoming engrossed in it. 'We' too go to weddings. But no one complains. The people at the wedding say, 'You have given me salvation'. If you remain engrossed in it, you may make a mistake, then people will have problems with you.

So who is more beneficial? Those who do not become engrossed in the worldly life interaction are more beneficial to the world. Such beings are beneficial to themselves as well as beneficial to all others. They are beneficial in every way. Even for You, 'we' have paved such a way, that you will not become engrossed either. Our Gnan is such that You will be able to remain in Your own place and not wander off to an alien (non-Self) place. The alien place is Chandubhai.

## The vyavahar of mahatmas is being settled

**Questioner:** The _vyavahar_ of the _mahatmas_ is _nikali_ – is being settled. So the _vyavahar_ is _nikaali_ and so for _mahatmas_ the Self is- _grahaniya_ – that to be acquired. So in this state, how much care and attention should I take in worldly interaction? For how long should I look after it?

**Dadashri** : If the worldly life interaction is not there then what would You be seeing? No attachment towards good _vyavahar_ and no abhorrence towards bad _vyavahar_. Whether it is good or bad, _vyavahar_ has to be. If _gneya_ were not there, what would the _Gnata_ see i.e. if there were nothing to know, what would the Knower know? Vyavahar is gneya (that which is to be known) and _nischaya_ the Self is the Gnata, the Knower.

How much _vyavahar_ should be looked after and taken care of? If you go to look after _vyavahar_ , you will miss out on the _nischaya_. In _vyavahar_ You just have to see what is going on. You have to make sure that there is no _raag_ or _dwesh_ ; you don't have to look after anything else. If the son does something wrong and you end up giving him a slap; that is _vyavahar_ ; You have to 'see' that the boy was slapped. Even then there is no _dwesh_ at the one who slaps and no _raag_ for the child. Tell Chandubhai to do _pratikraman_. Then everything will be quickly resolved. Then people in the family will talk justice, 'it's very bad. You have no sense'. So at that time You have to tell him, 'Chandubhai, you never had sense from the start, did you? I have known you from the start. It is a good thing that everyone today is saying so.' You have to talk it out thus within. Otherwise people outside will catch on and bother you repeatedly.

Will you not accommodate your brother? Just bring about a solution everywhere, if for one life you are bound by people, so should you not take care of that bondage? So keep 'seeing' what kind of _vyavahar_ is going on. There should be no _raag_ - _dwesh_ in that.

The Gnani's understanding of _vyavahar_ is that if the daughter gets married, it is _vyavahar_ and if the poor daughter becomes a widow; that too is _vyavahar_. It is not 'real'. Both situations are _vyavahar_ ; they are relative and on top of that, no one can change them. Therefore keep seeing it. Now what do people say? 'The son-in-law has died' and they grieve and bang their heads. So, on top of that, they have to call for a doctor! So they are dependent upon attachment and abhorrence ( _raag_ - _dwesh_ ). This is because they have not understood _vyavahar_ as _vyavahar_.

Here it does not matter what _vyavahar_ you do, no one should have any complaints; then it is considered exact _vyavahar_. But when can you call it exact? When it is according to what the Lord has said; when it is according to the _Agna_ of the Lord. There is no anger-pride-deceit-greed in it. There the _vyavahar_ is good and clean. Otherwise wherever there is _saiyam_ (lack of reaction within) to anger-pride-deceit-greed, then the Lord has accepted it.

## In Akram, the vyavahar is like ice

**Questioner:** Today we are working in our _vyavahar_ and if a person is doing something wrong, then according to the _vyavahar_ we have to maintain whether he is right or wrong, do we not?

**Dadashri** : In _vyavahar_ it is like this; as long as you like something, you will do that _vyavahar_. But when that _vyavahar_ of yours goes away, then you will not like that thing at all.

What is the nature of _vyavahar_? What is the _vyavahar_ of this Akram path like? The _vyavahar_ of Akram path is like ice. So having brought a ton of ice, one will say, 'I will preserve it with saw dust', so 'we' tell him, 'if you are able to, then do so but in the end it is going to melt away'. So no matter what you do to protect it, one day it will melt and come to an end.

The _vyavahar_ must become clean in one life time. In the life of final liberation, the _vyavahar_ must be clean for sure. No laxity or insincerity will work there. At the moment you will get away with insincerity ( _pol_ ). However, this is _ekavatari_ Gnan (knowledge which grants _moksha_ in one life time). If one is very greedy, he will have three more life times or five more life times

There is no problem with _vyavahar_ ; the problem is with becoming engrossed ( _ekroop_ ) in _vyavahar_. You should become one with the Self and _vyavahar_ is superficial; it is superfluous.

## Conduct needs to be settled only in Akram Vignan

The Lord says that our _vyavahar_ should be such that it should not hurt anyone. People have believed _vyavahar_ to be real but even then they do not know how to be in worldly interaction. One has become very partial towards _vyavahar_ but even then _vyavahar_ has not become completely clean. What should _vyavahar_ be like? It should be ideal _adarsha_ – ideal. People feel impressed by seeing it. But here, in every household there are interferences ( _dakho_ ). If there are interferences, how can you call it _vyavahar_? What is the meaning of _vyavahar_? Give and then take, otherwise take and then give; it is very precise. That is called _vyavahar_. Vyavahar is the _vyavahar_ of give and take. I do not give to anyone and nor do I take from anyone. No one gives me anything and I remain in the Self.

**Questioner** : I have taken refuge at Your divine feet ( _charan_ ); in the end that is the ultimate solution.

**Dadashri** : That is it. Our adjustment should be such that we have constant protection in every way, in both _vyavahar_ and in _nischaya_. There is no more taint of impurity in _vyavahar_ as well as in _nischaya_ and we become light as a flower! We experience liberation right here. As many corners as have been broken, as many bondages as have become untied; we have become that much free. Many bondages that pull and bind have become untied – tens of millions of lives are pulling us with a rope. And as many ropes as have been severed, we have become that much free, no? However many are left, will set us free eventually. This is the way; everything will become free with this.

It is like this, our path is simple and straightforward. It is possible to get Your work done whilst managing your business and without hurting anyone at home. Give closure to everyone and satisfy them and then we have to go to _moksha_. It is not possible that anyone's claim remains and we go to _moksha_!

Here, our _vyavahar_ is considered _shuddha_ _vyavahar_ – pure worldly interaction. People will say, 'your _vyavahar_ is not proper' but ours is pure _vyavahar_. People place a great emphasis on worldly interaction. One thing that the whole world places an emphasis on the conduct of mind speech and body-worldly conduct. Because worldly conduct of mind speech and body is verily their 'seed' – cause. Whereas for 'us' ( _mahatmas_ ), we have discarded it as an effect and 'we' do not consider it as a cause. So we have to settle it whereas conduct improvement is their main thing. And so they just say that good worldly conduct ( _achaar_ ) is necessary for sure' but for us it is completely different; so how can it 'fit' them? It will not! By the time it fits them, all your conduct will have become empty like mine. Then they will say, 'no, they are saying the right thing'. These conducts will come to an end.

**Questioner** : Here the worldly conduct ( _achaar_ ) comes to an end by becoming free from any sense of doer ship ( _kartabhaav_ ).

**Dadashri** : Yes. That is exactly what I am saying! In getting rid of doership, worldly conduct comes to an end. Then people will say, 'what are you talking about! It is so beautiful!' Everyone tells me, 'Dada, we cannot believe in your devotees but when we look at You, we believe it.' This is because mine is all finished. But even my belief is that it has to be settled. This is Akram Vignan – the easy path to liberation!

## Respect to even those that insult – that is pure vyavahar

Just look, 'we' too were sitting on the stage. 'We' do not have _dwesh_ (abhorrence). On the most part, 'we' do not have to come into such a _vyavahar_ but when we do, we will not have the slightest contempt towards it. 'We' will do all the drama there, i.e. 'we' will play our part in that 'play'. 'We' do not have 'I want to do this or do that'. We should not have contempt towards _vyavahar_. Whatever _vyavahar_ happens, in that 'Ambalal Mudjibhai (Dadashri's worldly name)'; is under the realm of that _vyavahar_. 'We' are under the realm of the Self _nischaya_. 'We' are always in the realm of _nischaya_ ; 'we' remain in the realm of 'our' Self state. That is why the _vyavahar_ must never feel the slightest contempt from you.

Vyavahar is dependent upon the effect of the unfolding karma ( _udayakarma_ ), but 'we' will not accept the realm of _vyavahar_ if it is not ideal. Therefore _vyavahar_ should not be instigated even in the slightest. The 'ultimate Light' is that which does not hurt a single living being to the slightest extent. Even the opponent will feel peace. Even the opponent will say, 'sir, this person and I have difference of opinions but I have respect for him; I feel for him!' This is what he will say in the end.

This 'Science' does not instigate or provoke _vyavahar_. Every other 'knowledge' _-gnan_ scorns _vyavahar_. This science does not reject or scorn _vyavahar_ in the least. One completely remains in one's own reality and does not reject _vyavahar_. That which does not scorn _vyavahar_ is verily the controvertible principle ( _siddhantik_ ) that attains the ultimate. We can only call it _siddhantik_ when it never goes against this principle; there is no controversy. It will never result in going against the absolute principle in any place; there is not such place where it will do so. Therefore this is a "real Science", a "complete Science". It will not make you contempt _vyavahar_ in the slightest. The knowledge that is contemptuous towards _vyavahar_ , that knowledge will never attain _nischaya_ – the Self.

**Questioner** : That is a straightforward fact.

**Dadashri** : Therefore 'our' _vyavahar_ (worldly interaction) is always ideal. Our _vyavahar_ is one that the world has never seen. Our _vyavahar_ is _manohar_ – it wins people's minds. 'We' are one whose worldly interaction is _manohar_ (wins over minds), even the humility wins minds. No one has attained the Self by shoving aside _vyavahar_. And all talk about attaining it, negating and neglecting _vyavahar_ is all infertile knowledge – _shushka gnan_. Where is _vyavahar_ , the moment there is contempt? Where is the _nischaya_ there?

**Questioner** : In scorning _vyavahar_ , there is scorn against _nischaya_ as well.

**Dadashri** : _Nischaya_ will never arise at all if _vyavahar_ is scorned. Vyavahar means it is a 'basement', therefore if the basement is weak, then _nischaya_ cannot remain upright.

## Even the Gnani accepts the realm of vyavahar

'We' accept the realm of _vyavahar_. 'We' are observing ( _nihadavoo_ ) _vyavahar_ with equanimity. What does it mean to respect the realm of _vyavahar_ ( _vyavahar satta_ ) ? There is a prominent businessman who spends a lot of money for charity. So when he comes here, 'we' would say 'come, welcome' and give him a seat that represents his importance. All that is regarded as respecting _vyavahar satta._ But at that time, in 'our' vision there is equanimity ( _sambhaav_ ). Then whether it is a prominent businessman or his driver; there is no difference in 'our' vision, which has equanimity. The Lord has said for us to accept _vyavahar satta._ Even Lord Mahavir used to address King Shrenik as 'King Shrenik'. Because that was his social status. Such _punyai_ (merit karma) is there, no? But the vision was one of equanimity!

Vyavahar _satta_ will have to be accepted for sure. The one who is helping religious and charitable causes has to be accepted. The one who is doing service for the body (of the Gnani) has to be accepted. All those who have a large share of service ( _seva_ ), will have to be accepted, no? But equanimity prevails in the vision ( _drashti_ ). 'We' have to ask after everyone's health. If someone's mind has gone mad, we have ask about that person too, because the mind has gone mad, not the Self \- the Atma! The mind will last for only one life time or for a certain period of time whereas the Self is permanent.

## Vyavahar of the Gnani is rasadavo

What does Akram Vignan say? It says that every one keeps _vyavahar_ , but keep your worldly interaction _vyavahar_ _rasaadavo_.

What is the _vyavahar_ like in the home? _Rasaadavo vyavahar_! So my nature is such that I would constantly keep the _vyavahar rasaadavo_. If someone is sitting next to me, even with him it would _rasadavo_. No one has ever incurred a loss of any kind. In _rasaadavo vyavahar_ , I have not incurred a loss either. When I go to a businessman, even with him my _vyavahar_ is _rasaadavo_. His _vyavahar_ maybe polished, but mine is good. I also understand his polished _vyavahar_ and I understand even the _vyavahar_ that is _rasaadavo_. If I meet someone _rasaadavo_ like me, I would know him too. I have the nature of knowing.

**Questioner** : What kind of _vyavahar_ is _rasaadavo_? Please explain it in more detail.

**Dadashri:** The interaction will not deceive 'me'. Do you use the word ' _gapot'_ (deceive or trick) or not? It is a very old fashioned word. _Gapot_ means, if you have to recite ten lines and you forget to recite four of them, then the other children will say 'he did _gapoti_ of four lines'. So he did this much _gapoti_. He did gapot ( deceptiion or coverup) of this much in what needed to be recited.

So our _vyavahar_ has to be _rasaadavo_ – that is what I am saying. I can understand the kind of _vyavahar_ the other person keeps, I can tell that he has done this much cover up ( _gapot_ ). But we have to keep ours _rasaadavo_ ; that is the main point. In this home, the _vyavahar_ is _rasaadavo_ for sure. Is it not? Many rules are not observed here. What is rasadavo? It is without deceit ( _kapat_ ); it is pure ( _shuddha_ ). So our _vyavahar_ has to be _rasaadavo_. The attribute ( _guna)_ of _rasaadavo_ arises in doing _sambhavey nikaal_ settling with equanimity. For that matter, our mahatma's _vyavahar_ is _rasaadavo_ for sure. Even if someone stomps on his foot, he will not say anything negative about him. They settle with equaimity _sambhavey nikaal_ everyday. There are so many people here but no one has had any conflicts.

**Questioner** : Rasaadvo _vyavahar_ means sincere _vyavahar_?

**Dadashri** : All these clerks write 'yours sincerely', don't they? But that is considered insipid ( _lukkho_ ) _vyavahar_. And sincerity is included in rasadavo but rasadavo is not included in sincerity. The pail of sincerity will fit in the pail of _rasaadavo_ , but the pail of pail of _rasaadavo_ will not fit in the pail of sincerity.

If one can remember the word ' _rasaadavo_ ', then his 'work' will get done. _Rasaadavo_ – even if you remember this much, it is more than enough.

Ours is _rasaadavo_ _vyavahar_. That is why you feel that this person (Dadashri) is an _aptajan_ one who can be absolutely trusted. You do not feel this way when others talk. When I scold this person, even then my _vyavahar_ is _rasaadavo_. The scolding part comes because the stock of karma within is discharging, and what can be done if it is due to the account of the other person? It is not my wish to do so at all!

## Keval Gnan is when the vyavahar does not touch You at all

That amount of _vyavahar_ worldly interaction, which does not touch ( _sparsha_ ) a person, that much _vyavahar_ is considered _vyavahar_. In this manner, when the entire _vyavahar_ ceases to 'touch', then it is considered _keval_ Gnan absolute knowledge of the Self. Whatever _vyavahar_ that does not 'touch', that _vyavahar_ only is considered _vyavahar_. How can we call it a _vyavahar_ when it 'touches'? (Touch- _sparsha_ is higher than an effect - _asar_ ). Vyavahar means that which does not 'touch'. People will feeland claim, 'he did that.' And You feel, 'Chandubhai did it, not I'. Vyavahar means people will see, and even say 'this person did this', they see that, and so they are bound to say just that, no?

This is simply the _vyavahar_ that has arisen in the _samsaran marg_ – naturally evolving life forms in the world. Take the example of how the _vyavahar_ arises in front of a mirror; is that not an exact _vyavahar_? If you raise a finger, then the image in the mirror, will also raise a finger. If you raise two fingers, it will raise two also; is that not an exact _vyavahar_? This _vyavahar_ , people have churned and have 'drunk' it. This _vyavahar_ (current worldly interaction) is exactly like that one, there is nothing else here. As much _raag_ - _dwesh_ has gone, that much _shuddha_ pure _vyavahar_ has arisen. When _raag_ - _dwesh_ have completely gone, then all the _vyavahar_ remains as _vyavahar_. It is considered _vyavahar_ without interferences ( _dakhal_ ). For _mahatmas raag_ - _dwesh_ are gradually decreasing in certain matters, and in some other matters they are becoming completely free. Certain matters means as much _raag_ - _dwesh_ goes, only the corresponding amount of _vyavahar_ can become free. It does not become free all of a sudden. It unwinds slowly and gradually. When it becomes completely unwound, that is when _keval_ Gnan happens!

JAI SAT CHIT ANAND

# I really appreciate you reading this book! Here are my social media coordinates:

Friend me on Facebook:

<http://facebook.com/shuddha.dadashri>

Follow me on Twitter:

<http://twitter.com/shuddha>

Favorite my Smashwords author page:

<https://www.smashwords.com/profile/view/shuddha>

Follow some live translations of the Books of Gnani Purush Dadashri on

You Tube:

<https://www.youtube.com/user/VISHUDDHATMA>

Visit my website:

http://www.dadashri.org

