So now I have the pleasure of introducing Carol Stevens, Executive Director for Media Relations and Strategic Communications at the American Bar Association before joining the BA, Carol spent more than 30 years as a journalist including 30 years as managing editor for news at USA Today
She also served as a reporter for Detroit News, Washington Bureau, and Washingtonian Magazine. We are very excited to welcome her today. I would like to welcome her and the panelists she will introduce to the stage.Thank you all.
(applause)
Good afternoon. In my career, I've done a lot of interviews and I can't think of a more inspiring assignment than the one I have today
To talk with these three accomplished women about the role women play in defending human rights and democracy
Each member of this group is a leader, and each is committed to advancing and defending human rights
Because we want to hear from them, I'm not going to spend a lot of time on my introductions but I invite each of you to review their bios in your printed program, I think you will find them instructive and inspiring.
Our first honored guest today is Chief Justice Meaza Ashenafi, the first female president of the Federal Supreme Court of Ethiopia.
The Chief Justice (applause) with fellow women lawyers reformed the Ethiopian justice system treatment of sexual harassment cases. How is that for a legacy? Welcome Chief Justice
Next I'd like to introduce to you Judge Susan G. Braden. Judge Braden recently retired from the United States Court of Federal Claims where she has served as Chief Judge since 2017.
The U.S. Court of Federal Claims has exclusive jurisdiction over cases against the federal government arising from issues such as breach of contract, patents, copyright infringement, and federal tax refund disputes
We look forward to hearing Judge Braden's insights into the U.S. judiciary. Welcome. (applause)
I'm also happy to introduce Dean Rosa Celorio. Dean Celorio is a giant in the field of human rights and human rights in the Americas.
She is the Associate Dean for International and Comparative Legal Studies at George Washington Law School and she is also the Burnett Family professorial lecturer in International Comparative Law and Policy where she focuses on legal education and the impact of defending human rights. Please welcome Dean Celorio
We're going to have the chance to hear from each of these women and I'm going to start with a few questions for the Chief Justice
You have a fascinating personal narrative. Can you talk to us about critical events in your life that inspired you to join the judiciary?
Thank you very much, I would like to take this opportunity to thank the State Department for sponsoring my trip and of course the opportunity to participate in this great panel
In terms of my role in the judiciary, at some points in my career I have served as the high court judge, but then I left the judiciary and I was engaged in other professional careers.
Last year I was appointed as the President of the Supreme Court in my country and my appointment is related to the democratic transition that is ongoing in our country right now
When the proposal came, it was not an instant yes because I had a very comfortable job at the United Nations, I also had family responsibility, and I took the opportunity because I thought this is a lifetime opportunity
Being appointed as the first female Chief Justice is very important and honorable thing to do so I decided to accept the position. With the position, I inherited a very weak infrastructure,  with very limited control and public trust.
But I have created a big reform program, a big reform agenda, and also with the help of different appointed partners we are embarking on a big reform agenda and I am very positive about it
Can you tell us about the role of women in promoting justice and human rights in Ethiopia?
Sure, before my work with the United Nations, I was an activist. I was involved in women's rights which is why I really like nonprofit organizations.
I feel the warmth in this room because many of you are working with the community and I have been there- I like you
So I was the director of the Ethiopian Women Lawyer's Association for 8 years so that group of women started that organization and we have done very important advocacy work, we have managed to lobby for the reform of laws in Ethiopia
We've presented thousands of women who cannot afford professional services, we have paralegals, not only in the capital city, but across the country, and in a nutshell we have put in to the center women's rights issues and gender equality issues
So yes, but it's not only in Ethiopia, but in Africa in general, women's rights organizations, especially women lawyer organizations are very active in pushing justice and human rights particularly related to gender issues.
Judge Braden, please tell us about the critical events in your professional and personal experience that set the stage for you joining the judiciary
Thank you Carol, as a matter of personal privilege, since I used to be the Chief, I wanted to see if Ambassador from Nigeria is out there. He's my neighbor from across the street and I have learned so much.They have made a major impact on the fight against terror and have been a tremendous ally as other countries have been in Northern Africa
I also wanted to recognize John Jasik from the State Department who is here. John is the person that is responsible for bringing judges from other nations or having our judges go to other nations and this has been a labor of love for him and I haven't had the chance to say hi, and he's sitting next to my husband, the most handsome man in the world
And in charge for international matters for the American Bar Association. Now, your question was why I become a judge?
Well, what in your background led you to become a judge?
I love being being a lawyer! I love it and I love my judges. I always consider my judges as the most important thing.You have to to convey to the judge right away one thing- that you have the white hat on
And that has to happen early in the case. Judges are so used to hearing that blah blah blah the point is to say look- there are two people in this room and one of them is not a good person, and it's not me
What do you see as the biggest problem facing women in the judiciary?
I don't know the answer to that really. I mean I did want to say I wrote something down because you were supposed to ask me a different question (laughter)
She was supposed to ask me about being a woman  judge, and as Carol and other people know, we were very fortunate. My husband and I went before the justice system and the Supreme Court to their first formal visit to Europe at the end of the 90s
Justice O'Conner led that delegation, and she alone probably of all the justices in the last 50 years has been the most involved with understanding the importance of creating personal relationships internationally with all judges, particularly women judges
And I'll never forget, we went to Germany and you would've thought she was a rock star.They all knew her personally. She had corresponded with them, and she had taken the time and effort to do that.
When she went on the bench, she was asked about what was the importance of her being on the Supreme Court, and she said "the importance of my appointment is not that I will decide cases as a woman,  but that I will be a woman deciding cases."
Are there challenges for women? Yes. There are challenges for men, there are challenges for everybody. My own view is that we need to get beyond the gender issues and go to what's really important which is providing justice
(applause)
Dean Celorio, what in your personal history and background inspired you to do the important work you do today?
That's a wonderful question, and first of all I just want to say what an honor it is to be here and what an honor it is to be seated with these wonderful women that have accomplished so much because this is precisely what we're working for, to see women in leadership positions.
In my particular case, I had a sense of what unjust very early on in my life. I actually grew up in Puerto Rico. I saw a lot of things when I was growing up, and one thing that really shaped me is my parents once took me to a battered women's shelter
I started working there as a volunteer, and I have to say that was probably one of the most formative experiences I had when I was growing up. I was able to interact with a lot of women that had suffered so many  human rights violations and were in very dire circumstances
And after that, that really led me to a lot of gender work in my career. And also I'm the daughter of a Cuban immigrant and I think that shaped me. That shaped me, that made me interested in international affairs, it made me interested in social issues
But I always tell my students that in my particular case I kind of discovered a passion. I think that's very important in life. I started working in international law basically right after law school, I encountered human rights and completely fell in love with it and thought that it was the right thing to do
And I've been very fortunate to be able to have a career where I've always been connected to it and to the world in many ways. I think that's so important, I echo everything the panelists have already said
about the importance of this kind of program, about the importance of us being able to have more forums to have discussions about this in particular. Thank you.
(applause)
Turning now to your role as a dean, as the number of women in higher education has increased, how has that effected universities, and has it effected their ability to address issues like human rights?
Thank you, I actually think that's a wonderful question. Every day we have more women in higher education. At our law school, it's actually the majority of students are women which is absolutely wonderful
And I think it has added a layer of diversity, a participatory approach, and an inclusive approach to the discussions. We notice that in classrooms. And I think also we are training lawyers that represent more of what our society looks like
I mean, the legal profession has to reflect the cultures, the viewpoints, the differences and I think women bring that to the table
One thing though that we're working to do in a very persistent way that's very needed is that I do see a lot of women graduating from law school, which is wonderful and I love being a part of that, but I do also want to see them in leadership positions
and in decision making positions, and I want them to have a voice and to be able to actually set the pace and to have more influence in society in general
and I think that's where women, we still have a lot of work to do, and society as a whole has a lot of work to do on this, and I think also socially we have a responsibility to build societies where we have better conditions for women to succeed
that they have access to the education they need, that they can access the contacts, the networking, the resources, and also the different kinds of support that you need to be able to have a successful career and be able to balance a lot of other things in your life
and I think we're very long and far away from that. We're still working on building societies that are more favorable for women to attain leadership positions in my personal field
Chief Justice, you're an alumnus of the International Visitor Leadership Program so what about this program and your travels from Washington DC to Portland, OR, Cincinnati, Boston, Detroit, what in this program prepared you to be on the path you're on today?
Thank you, thank you very much for that question. My visit as an international visitor was very trusting, but it happened many years ago. It happened in 1997.
I remember it was 19 young African leaders and 6 of them were women and as you said we visited important cities. So, I don't remember every detail but what I remember is I look a lot of lessons, especially in institution building
and how institution building is taken very seriously in America. How organizations are run because we visited universities, nonprofit organizations, and the private sector and so on.
I was also struck by the hospitality and the kindness of people. We went to private homes for dinner or lunch and people always went out of their way to accommodate us and I have a very positive memory about that
I'm not in touch with the other Africans on the trip but I'm sure they are doing something very important in their communities. And at least I know that the Minister of Justice for Rwanda was one of the participants in the program
Especially earlier in your career, having exposure to this kind of very systematic learning is quite useful and it has effected me a great deal
Judge Braden, your bio shows that you have legal expertise in many technical fields that until recently you weren't really associated with attracting a lot of women. How have you ensured your voice has been heard?
I got involved with whether copyright law should apply to computer software and changed the law in this country and the EU in the late 90s, early 2000s was the last decision we had
and from that, I became involved in a lot of other areas in technology. I'm actually now on the board of two private  that are involved in artificial intelligence which is a very important and growing area of technology
It is interesting you should ask this because just yesterday I wrote a letter to nominate a friend of mine from the intellectual property section of the American Bar Association for the Margaret Brent Award
and I said I know for all the people that have won that award they've never appointed someone in that field. But this women was an electrical engineer and a computer engineer before she went into law
I'm very active in another group called chicks "chicks in international property law" and that group was formed 10 years ago. We now have 30,000 women lawyers involved in that group around the world  who are involved in technology
Now we all know that's where the jobs are, where the opportunity is, and where the money is so my view is that is one of the most important areas for women to be involved in because  you go where the money is right? and that is what is going to drive the economy for all of the world's countries
Smaller countries such as yours have such a wonderful opportunity to begin to grow young lawyers in this field and I think human rights is important but the technology that is going to enable people to understand and see where their violations are
When people understand things you get an international consensus about here's a problem, we now need to work through that and how do they learn that? Through technology. So, that's where it is.
And, I was going to say that I'm proud to announce the president appointed me to the Fulbright board before the holidays so if you have any friends who want to be a Fulbright scholar, particularly focused on intellectual property, please get their applications in
Dean, what specific roles do law schools have in promoting human rights?
I think it's a very important role. We're training the future and in many ways we're training the present too. I've never seen so much student realization as I've seen in the past 8 years, especially in our law school
And I think we also have a responsibility in terms of the values that students carry with them after they graduate from law school.
We teach a lot of theory of course. We teach a lot of practice. We make sure they are exposed to  contacts, we make sure they are exposed to networks. But I think those values, for us that's key.
So, for example, I always tell my students it doesn't matter where you're working, it doesn't matter if you're a law firm partner or if you're a judge or if you're in a nonprofit or if you're in the federal government.
At the end of the day, you can take values like diversity and gender equality and human rights and will of law and access to justice and a worldview that accommodates for different thinkings and pluralism and you can take that everywhere
You don't necessarily need to be in the public sector to have to do that and I think probably that's where our most important role is because the reality of that.We are going to give them a lot of knowledge in law school, but at the end of the day they do have to be in practice
to learn how to do their craft in many ways. But those values stay. And I think another thing that is important when you are in an education role is that a lot of our students are very young.
They're developing their sense of the law, of the world, you know, the social contributions that they can make. I see it as an opportunity to work with them, maybe a few years, maybe one year, to help them in that development
Because at the end of the day many of them are going to be leaders like you. Many of them are going to be in influential positions and for me it is very important to see more leaders with those values.
That I mentioned. So I think for us that's probably the most important part of the education that we give.
Where do female lawyers and female law professors fit in this equation?
I actually think the legal profession is one of those professions where you're seeing some gradual changes.
Where you are seeing more women professors which is absolutely fantastic. Where you're seeing more women deans.Right now about 10 law schools this year appointed new deans and most of them were actually women which is fantastic and refreshing.
But I think we have a long way to go. The reality is that I think for a lot of women to reach career goals as high as being a distinguished law professor in the United States or being a dean or having any sort of academic leadership position you also have to encourage this when they're young
I think a lot of women don't necessarily grow up thinking I'm going to be the dean of a law school when I grow up.You basically have to encourage girls to  dream and to dream high.And to dream also in terms of diversity. What kind of sectors can I work in? What kind of education do i need?
How do I build an academic profile or a professional profile to be able to later be able to sit, to be a dean of a law school?Our law school is actually going through a dean selection process and it has been fascinating for all of us to watch because there has been a very heavy encouragement for women to come and interview
But we're always saying, especially the women deans, you have to help get women from point A to point B. If you want to have women to have the extraordinary credentials to be the dean of a law school, you have to work with them when they are young.
I was lucky. I had so many mentors. I was surrounded by people that were advising me, that helped guide me through my career. And I'm so grateful for them today and I think that is so important for women in general.
And I also grew up in a place and with a family that encouraged me to dream very high. And I'm still like that. I still dream very large and I think that's absolutely fantastic.The moment that you stop dreaming we don't have any hope anymore. (Applause)
But that has to start young.And I think with that I try, at least in the stage that the attorneys come in, the future attorneys, to try to give them that.Give them that hope, give them that energy,  and hopefully that carries them through their careers.
And I hope to see more women leaders in the future,  I think there's a lot happening around us that is very interesting but we do have a lot of work in terms of creating those conditions in my view
Chief Justice, what are some of the opportunities and some of the challenges for women who are in leadership positions?
For women in leadership positions there are many opportunities because they can make decisions, they can contribute to development, they can contribute to world peace
Just yesterday I was reading a piece that talks about Angela Merkle's proposal to organize a Europe Africa conference  and the theme of that conference is "let's listen to one another" She did not say listen to me, she said let's listen to one another
So, there are global leaders who can make a big impact but women at every level now are meeting in the private sector or the public sector or in their community organization and they have a very important role and they can make decisions and they can make a difference
The challenges, of course the stereotypes, there are you know members of our society who still believe that women are not competent. Our Prime Minister was talking informally about the appointment of women in Ethiopia, the government appointed 50% of the cabinet to be women
The President of the country is now a woman, the President of the Supreme Court, I am here, so sometimes people say "are you sure these women are really going to be effective?" and he said nobody asked me about men.
There are many lousy men out there who do not deserve that. So that mentality is still there, but as long as you're smart, as long as you're organized, as long as you're a team builder, they will accept it sooner or later
To also tweak the situation, for me my previous role and my current role. I was an activist, I was on the other side of the fence. Now, I'm heading the judiciary. So, sometimes when something terrible happens to women they tag me on social media to say why is she not speaking, why is she not taking a position on this
But it takes a little bit of communication. I hope I will not end up in crisis,  but that is a transition that we need to make. We have to make sure wherever we are to empower women but at the same time we need to communicate with society  to help women and create better mandates.
Judge Braden, you invited us to go beyond gender so would you give us leadership advice both for the men and women in this room?
Leadership advice, I mean you talk to any Fortune 500 company CEO and they will tell you they have failed in the past. They may have failed more than once at something in the past. You can't lead unless you learn to take a risk
In any number of different things, you've got to suck it up and take that risk and be prepared that you may fail. But you want to give it your all. And then if you fail you want to go back and recharge and do it again. There's probably no one in the room that has not failed at something, men or women in your profession
That's just the way life is. No one talks about it very much but being a risk taker, being, having the self esteem to take responsibility for that and your own actions and to do so with good intentions. Not for bad reasons, but basically because you really feel this is the way to go about something.
Somebody may not like that, and guess what, they may be right. You may be right. But if you sit still in your box you're never going to get anything done.That's a nice, safe, cozy place. So, take a risk, speak up, say something, do something.
Dean, you've talked to us about making our voices heard as women and as human rights advocates. How do we do that?
We have to speak. And I know it sounds really basic,  but the reality is that women are not encouraged socially to voice what they think. And sometimes they are not encouraged to be who they are
And the reality is that if we have learned something from the Me Too movement, from the Time's Up movement, from everything that has happened in many countries in the past 20 years, the reality is that we  should be at the table as well.
We should be shaping policy, shaping legislation, shaping programs, being elected judges. Really, at the end of the day being the wheels that move society. The reality is that women are not necessarily taught to do that.
You would be shocked at the amount of law students, and I work with law students, and usually lawyers, we love speaking it's part of who we are; the amount of women law students who have had conversations where they say "I think I sound too aggressive, I think I sound too assertive"
"Maybe I should try to be a little more restrained." and the reality is that we were all brought up that way. But at the end of the day, I think that real leadership is about speaking up and voicing what you think and being creative  and pushing that boundary, and being groundbreaking and dealing with the challenges
And you don't necessarily do that staying quiet. But this is, especially in the human rights field, we call this a stereotype. A stereotype or a notion of how women should be. But at the end of the day, I think it's time to break that stereotype. We need women to speak up. (Applause)
And the reality that I think is complicated is that women are also subjected to a double standard. The reality is that is that women are judged in a much stricter way socially and this applies to leadership positions as well.
And I think we need to really identify those stereotypes, eradicate those stereotypes. I think that is all very important for women to be able to sit at the table. And I think women are not only the ones that have to speak up, but I also think we have to build social conditions and this also includes men.
to be able to give women spaces to be able to do this as well. I think this is a social responsibility that we all have but it is something that we really need to do. In my view I think its is a priority.
I know there are some members of the audience that may have some questions. There are microphones on each side of the room so while you're going to those microphones I have one question for each of you it's the same question
As we seek to empower human rights advocates, leaders, and women, what advice would you give today to your 20 year old self? I'll start with you, Chief Justice
I think in my case, I believe I have done okay. Until I was the age of 17, I didn't have access to a television set. I traveled to the city to join law school from very far away. I grew up in a very small community, you could call it a remote community, it was several kilometers outside the center
But I believe I made use of every opportunity that came across my way so I don't know if I would do anything differently. My bio has summarized in one paragraph, but it's years invested in working very hard so I don't want to be harsh on myself.I think I want to congratulate myself.
Having said that, I still have a message and advice to my 20 year old daughter and to African women. Some of it has already been mentioned,   they need to focus on what they're doing, they have to focus on the prize.
Mentorship is very important. It could be their mothers, their aunties, their teachers, their supervisors, but I believe in it a lot. Also, I think it is important who you associate with. Your friendships, your partners, they are important because you need to be around people who nurture you and you should be able to control that as well
And they have to be assertive.They don't need to be aggressive, but they have to know their rights and stand up for their fight. Talking about risk taking, that is also very important.
You know, challenge comes along always, we don't have time, but I could talk about a lot of challenges that I faced as a community leader and when I was establishing a bank focusing on women.  It's a lot of hard work, there are challenges but never give up.So I give that kind of advice
Thank you, Judge Braden?
Don't worry so much. (applause)
The second thing is it's okay that you don't know everything or aren't so sophisticated or whatever. I got into the job of being a lawyer by mistake. Long story short, I worked in Atlanta Legal Aid Society the summer before I decided to go to law school
I got the job because I wrote a letter to the director because they were bringing cases into the Supreme Court and I thought it would be fun to go be involved in this. Of course I wasn't a lawyer yet. I didn't realize he wrote me a rejection letter.
He wrote me a letter saying Dear Ms.Braden, what a fine resume you have,  if you're ever in Atlanta please give us... And I thought it meant yes.
So I wrote letters back saying I'm coming on this day. I didn't realize they were so busy. I was in the Atlanta airport and called and said I'm here and he said well come on down. That was my first job.
I didn't know any better. Wait a minute, it gets worse. So the first thing I actually worked on was a case that went to the supreme court. I didn't do any of the brief but I came to Washington to watch the argument. Based on that, I thought I can do this
I've done Supreme Court work, I'm going to law school. I didn't know what I was doing. But sometimes that's just as well.Take a risk, you never know what's going to happen. I also want to say something with the Chief Justice before you end the program after audience questions.
Okay, Dean Celorio, what's your advice and we only have a minute and a half so I'm afraid we'll have to hurry.
A minute and a half. I will tell you what I tell my students. I do advise a lot of 20-something year olds as part of being a dean. I think it's being creative. Never loose that. Be persistent.
There's a lot of lives that can be challenging.Especially in careers and especially in that road to leadership it is important to be persistent but it is important also to be prepared. Education is key. Nobody can take that away from you
And I always tell that to my students.But I think dreaming big is very very important as well.Have goals, have dreams. Never loose them. Don't get discouraged, and as our wonderful and wise panelists said earlier, it's okay to have failures sometimes.
And it's okay also to not have a plan. The reality is that most of our careers haven't been planned. Fate also guides you in your career and it is important to have a certain kind of flexibility. If you're prepared, persistent, creative, and you have goals, eventually  you will get to a place that you're happy
But you don't necessarily need a plan.
I'm sorry to those of you that have questions but our time is up but  yes Judge Braden says you can come up afterwords and they'd be happy to talk to you about your questions so please join me in thanking this fabulous panel for their wisdom.
