raw underground the first rule of raw
underground is that you don't talk
about raw underground if you don't
understand that reference i'm making a
fight club reference raw have done
well the wwe have done their version of
fight club on monday night raw now this
is um
this is going to be interesting as we
get into this so it all started off
yesterday yesterday afternoon evening in
that it had been announced that shane
mcmahon was returning to monday night
raw uh shane mann hadn't been seen on
wwe television
since the smackdown 20th anniversary
edition
uh on fox the first fox debut show
he faced off on that show against kevin
owens in a ladder match loser was
quote fired from the wwe and that was
shane mcmahon's removal from wwe
television because they wanted to
go away the wwe did from or move away
from having an authority figure on wwe
television they wanted to remove all of
that removed the mcmahons from
television and look how long it lasted
10 months
uh before shea but man is back
apparently he's fired no more he is now
back on monday night raw as the host
creator brain child whatever
behind raw underground now so we heard
that
show man was going to be returning and
then reports start to come out that
he was going to be unveiling a concept
that had quote
raised some eyebrows backstage so it
peaked a lot of people's interest and a
lot of people were interested to see
okay what's
what's she mcmahon going to be doing in
wwe uh
or specifically on raw going forward uh
so throughout the show
we saw uh this sort of dimly lit
room from the outside uh you would see
they had a couple of shots where they
had this this guy who was
the tall ninja remember akira tazawa had
those ninjas or he still has those
ninjas but a few weeks gone raw he had
the giant ninjas like over seven foot
tall like seven foot four
basically you had this guy he was
standing outside of a door
in a dimly lit part of the wwe
performance center uh and the
commentators tom phillips byron saxon
samoa joe
said that uh shaving man was going to be
returning to raw and he'd had a
unique brain child um and was going to
be
unveiling something important or
interesting
uh on raw tonight so we had this guy
um guarding this jaw at one point you
had a guy this was really confusing you
had a guy come up to this
this bodyguard with a tray of drinks
i don't know what they were tray of
coffee tray of soup the guy just sort of
turned stared at him and he ran off
i don't i don't know what that was for
but you know apparently one of the rules
of raw underground is that drinks aren't
allowed so you know it's very important
stay hydrated
guys so eventually we found out we found
out that the son of the wwe chairman
vincent mann shane mcmahon
was debuting a brand new concept in wwe
called raw underground
uh it seems to be a recurring segment
throughout the show
and it incorporates mma elements
interesting it's essentially
um worked
mma style they've been doing this for a
long time in the likes of japan the
whole
um worked work shoot style of mma
whereby it looks like an mma fight it's
a simulated mma fight
uh but in reality it's work the outcome
is predetermined it's still pro
wrestling but it's mma style
it's essentially that um it's a darkened
room where there's a ring
set up with no ropes just ring posts
there are women
dancing on like podiums in the backdrop
because we're back into the 1990s and
1980s
and you have mixed martial arts style
fights taking place on the map with
shane mcmahon standing at ringside doing
his own version of
commentary hyping up the competitors in
this fight to knock on
matches in fights um and it was just a
different presentation of that
we saw dolph ziggler eric of the viking
raiders and the hurt business mvp
sheldon benjamin and bobby lashley
uh involved in some of these fights now
uh it's been reported by alex mccarthy
over at talksport that
this raw underground is legitimately a
brainchild of shay mcmahon
and something that was put together the
day of the taping so
it makes me laugh because uh by all
accounts shame of man shows up at the
tapings
and he goes let's do raw underground
simulated bare knuckle fighting
and they go okay let's do it which makes
you wonder
what is going on in terms of the
creative direction of
monday night raw and the wwe right now
that someone can show up at the day of
the tapings and then just completely go
we're gonna do something completely
different for the third hour and then
wwe go yeah
okay fine so okay okay
okay that's what they're going to do now
this is obviously an attempt by wwe in a
bid to combat the declining ratings
um raw underground as i said it is
completely scripted
it's not a shoot style kind of
environment
it's not shoot mma fights not like the
brawl for all that was in 1998.
um some people said oh it's gonna be
it's the brawl for all kind of thing
it's not because obviously it's uh
it's a work to shoot and it's still pro
wrestling
uh fightful were reporting that wwe was
still filming content for raw
underground
for next week's show until midnight
eastern time last night
um some of the uh unknown hosts
have it also been suggested uh by all
accounts as well
underground the underground name has
been that has been thrown around by wwe
for a lot of other projects for the last
few years
uh so it appears that raw underground is
finally a thing and
wwe finally found the project which they
want to name as underground and it
debuted
on raw last night now this is
uh raw underground the raw underground
segments are going to be happening
throughout the third
hour of monday night raw and this is
just wwe's latest attempt
at uh trying to fix that third hour of
raw
um the third hour of monday night raw
well
historically but especially in recent uh
weeks and months has been doing
horrific in the ratings recently
horrendously bad
um just i think even awb
um or rather nxt and aws
uh combined viewership beat raw's third
hour last week which just shows how bad
monday night raw's third hour
uh has been doing recently it's just the
wwe's latest attempt to get people to
watch the third hour this time instead
of
the electric chair or whatever the 24 7
championship this time it's fight club
they're trying to do fight club on the
third hour of monday night rauter
somehow get people to watch and uh i
have to praise their creativity
maybe that's where the praise will end
for this but i have to praise their
creativity at least they're trying
something
um it it has to go without saying as
well
and i will touch on this a little bit
more in a second but uh it's bloodsport
it is wwe has obviously seen
josh barnett's version of bloodsport if
you've never seen josh barnett's
bloodsport um promotion
it's it's exactly the same thing it's
not even like oh it's their take on it
blah blah blah it's exactly the same
thing
no blood sport basically is the same
thing it's a ring set up with just
um ring posts no ring ropes um
obviously josh barnett has his mma
background and you have two guys face
off
sometimes in mma gloves sometimes
they're not but essentially they just
beat the hell out of each other but it's
it's a work shoe it's still pro-resting
and the outcome is pre-determined
it's exactly the same as that that's
exactly what raw underground is
so um all the best ideas are always
stolen and uh ripped off aren't they and
uh it looks like wwe has done
uh the exact same when it comes to josh
barnett's blood sport when it comes to
raw underground
now before i completely poo poo over at
all
i will say that there there are
potential ways that this can work
um it it depends on certain
people that are used and presented
during this
raw underground concept for example
everyone wants to see this
match maybe apart from one of the people
in the match
themselves but a lot of people want to
see matt riddle versus brock lesnar
right everyone
just wants to see obviously two former
ufc fighters
mma guys there's real-life animosity
there brock lesnar hates matt riddle for
a shoot that's because matt riddle has
been
open for years and years on social media
saying i want to be the guy that retires
brock lesnar i want to have a match
against brock lesnar at wrestlemania i
want to be the guy
that retires brock lesnar uh so much so
that when matt riddle
was uh in the royal rumble at the start
of this year he actually had
a brief run in with brock lesnar
backstage uh where essentially brock
lesnar
confronts them said keep my name out of
your mouth we're never going to work
together ever you know it's never going
to happen get over it
i don't like you um now business is
business at the end of the day and brock
lesnar is a businessman
and uh look if he thinks that he can
make money in a match against matt
riddle if the wwe thinks that they can
make money
in a match between matt rodol and brock
lesnar at some point down the line
they will do it brock lesnar will do it
and the wwe will do it
i don't know about you but what would i
be more interested in would i be
interested in seeing brock lesnar versus
matt riddle in a normal match in the wwe
wwe ring sure
but brock lesnar versus matt riddle in a
raw underground style kind of
environment where it's
mma style work shoot no ring ropes
physicality
that that would interest me that that
would interest me and that would be um
an interesting presentation and
something unique and something that i
would be interested in do i think it
will happen
i mean you can never say never but not
for a long long long time
uh i'd be fascinated to see someone like
brock lesnar presented during raw
underground i think that would
definitely shoot the uh this segment uh
give it the segment a shot on the arm
which it would need
um because a lot of people myself
included still aren't sold on it
um but that's a unique way that they
could utilize that segment
uh something interesting as well that i
want to comment on as well was the
dancing females they essentially had you
remember
the tna pay-per-views back in the day
the original ones and you had the woman
in dancing in cages and
i know people say well what about the
nitro girls in the 90s that was the
1990s
they had um females dancing on po on
podiums
essentially or on a platform last night
during these raw underground segments
and to me i know some people people will
say are you just being politically
correct you're just you just
you're just being politically correct
this is a problem with 2020 just being
to pc
at the wwe pc um the whole females
dancing on the platform
to me just came off as very very tone
deaf at one point they were dancing and
then they got mad at each other and
started up a little bit of a cat fight
that shay mcmahon broke up
um and again it just came across very
very tone deaf that element of it i
would get rid of that
because this is a company one they're a
publicly traded billion dollar company
their days of i i was under the
assumption there days of bikini contests
swimsuit contests pillow fights briar
and panties matches whatever
i thought they were firmly in the past
and they've been so big on
the way we're presenting uh female
superstars in wwe has changed they're no
longer divas they're superstars
it's the woman's evolution give divas a
chance uh their main event and pay fews
they've main invented wrestlemania blah
blah blah
and they want to talk about that this is
only a couple of weeks after they were
celebrating the uh
five year anniversary of the beginning
of the women's evolution in wwe
and you've got females dancing on
podiums and getting into cat fights
it's just again i don't have necessarily
have a huge problem with it i just comes
across as very tone deaf to me
and just something that i don't think
wwe needs to do and i don't think the
segment needs it it plays up to
uh quite a few stereotypes of females
that i don't necessarily sure have a
place in wwe in 2020
you know we can't get we can't get wwe
evolution two right we can't get the
second installment of the all-female
pay-per-view wwe evolution after we had
the first one in 2018
uh and the company still goes on about
the women's evolution but we've got
dancing girls
on a platform during raw underground in
that third hour
i'm all for changing the third hour and
trying to do something different
personally i'd rather get rid of it
altogether and we'll touch on that in a
second
um but is dancing females on the
platform really the way to bring the
viewers in i just don't think so it's a
pg show as well you can't
if you're going to go full tv 14 then go
with it but you can't be half pregnant
you know you can't be pg but then have
females on a platform dancing you can't
say oh we respect women and we have
women's evolution they're treated as
proper superstars and they're in the
main event of shows and yet they're
dancing and getting into cat fights
during the third hour of raw it just
again it just came across as very tone
deaf that element
of it and that would certainly be
something that i would get rid of if i
was wwe
uh so we saw a few people compete we had
dabba kato
make his raw debut if you don't um
recognize that name
he previously went by the name of
babatunde in nxt
and um had a few appearances in nxt
mostly live events but he won the first
fight i guess they're calling it contest
it's not a match we won the first fight
shane mcmahon had a look of awe as he
was staring at um
dabba cato because he's like
legitimately over seven feet tall and
just
looked like a monster if if that's a way
of introducing new talent then sure
sure i'm i'd be open to that it's a
different way of presenting them rather
than just vignettes show up on
uh on raw or smackdown i would be i i
think i don't think that's necessarily a
completely
bad idea when i was watching it i was
just like because it was the first
fight that they'd had in this whole raw
underground
arena room segment whatever i was just
watching it going
what the hell is going on that was what
i was that was my initial reaction to
it's like am i
am i losing my mind am i in some form of
alternate reality what is going on
because it was just like
it was just strange it was so strange
but if that's a way of introducing new
talent that's cool
i don't know how that translates over to
the main narrative of raw inside the
arena
inside the wwe performance center inside
an actual ring so that's something
they'll have to
have to look at um but when i was
watching it my initial reactions were
that and i don't want to i don't want to
seem pessimistic i really don't seem
pessimistic and i don't want to seem
that person that's just oh wwe they
don't know what they're doing i'm going
to bury wwe they're
terrible blah blah blah because i i'm
really i don't i try not to be that
person when i
look at professional wrestling i try and
give everything a chance and i try and
be as objective as possible before i
give my opinions on things
um but the first thing that i thought of
was the electric chair uh do you
remember the electric chair it was
uh around this time last year in 2019
actually i say around this time it was
around may time of 2019
and wwe attempted then to do the exact
same thing that they're trying to do now
they tried to change the third hour of
monday night raw they tried to make it
gritty
and dark and dingy they tried to bring
back the attitude era
during the third hour of monday night
raw and it failed
miserably and i say miserably i mean
maybe i'm understating it it was
awful you had the electric chair segment
with sami zayn that was horrific
uh essentially what they did to make raw
the third hour gritty and dark and you
got to see monday night raw the third
hour
they just turned the lights off so
instead of on the titantron
having all these fancy led um boards and
graphics and all that they just turned
it off and it was just a black logo with
roar in the front of it and that was
that was
that was the third hour of raw that was
the attitude era raw coming back
and uh it just didn't work it was done
after a couple of weeks
and they went back to their usual format
um and the reason why it failed so
miserably isn't necessarily because the
concept was bad
uh it's because you can dress up a turd
but it's still a piece of crap
and that's essentially what it is no
gimmick
and uh maybe maybe i might be wrong here
but i i i still believe this
no gimmick will cure this third hour
monday night raw shouldn't ever be a
three-hour show
end of discussion you can do all the
fancy gimmicks you can
change the name of the final of the
third hour you can change the graphics
you can have shane mcmahon out there you
can have the electric chair out there
you can do whatever you want to do you
can have females dancing on podiums you
can have guys bare knuckle fighting in a
weird room
that's dimly lit uh and looks like it's
really hot and stinks
for the third hour uh but it's not gonna
dress up what shouldn't be a three-hour
show
no gimmick no gimmick will cure this
third hour it's just wwe's latest
attempt at finding something to get
people watching
during that third hour because by the
time the third hour of raw comes around
people switch off because it's too long
whatever they've seen even if they've
seen a great show for two hours
they don't care all they care about is
ah really another hour i've been
watching this for two hours already
i'm tired it's 10 o'clock now i want to
go to bed
switch off done that's what the third
hour does
and again i credit wwe for trying i
completely credit wwe for trying
something different trying something
unique and trying to break the format
because
you know it's called a creative team for
a reason so they've got to do something
creative even though if this was an
actual
um an actual brainchild of shame of man
i credit them for trying something
different and
i don't want to completely say oh it's
not going to be successful because it's
going to be difficult to judge after one
week
um but i just don't see any gimmick
curing this third hour the only thing
that will cure people switching off
in that third hour is getting rid of
that third hour
that is it that is it but that isn't
going to happen that is never going to
happen
until the usa network or wwe decides
that enough is enough
because as i mentioned so many times on
this channel the usa network pays the
wwe
handsomely for that third hour of monday
night raw
even though the ratings suck and less
people watch that third hour every
single week
it is more viewers than they would
usually get during that time slot on the
usa network
so usa network c sees that they see like
last week 1.4 million viewers which is
terrible for monday night raw by the way
that's an all-time low
during that third hour but they see that
1.4 million viewers and usa now it goes
you know what
we wouldn't be getting any more viewers
if we just had a different show at this
time
if we had a usa network original content
program whatever during that third hour
we would not be getting 1.4 million
viewers so the usa network to ensure
that they get the most people possible
that they can
in that time slot they pay wwe a lot of
money
to keep that third hour and on the wwe
side of it
yes it looks bad on them that they're
losing viewers every single week during
that third hour
but they're still getting that money and
that's all vincent man ultimately cares
about and the wwe ultimately cares about
they get that television money they
don't care
they don't care so this is just an
attempt to try and freshen up that third
hour try and do something different
but as i mentioned with the electric
chair and turning the lights out
and the graphics on monday night raw
like they did last year almost at the
exact same time just a couple months
later
last year a couple months earlier last
year rather i i just think it's going to
same work the same way as that
and um as i mentioned earlier raw
underground
it doesn't look an awful lot like blood
spore it is blood support
if i'm josh barnett i'm getting on the
phone to my lawyer going
can we do anything here because and i
don't know if he necessarily can but
it's very very obvious as to what
they've seen they've obviously
whoever's if it was shame a man that
came up with this idea they've obviously
seen
something like blood sport and gone you
know what we should try and do something
like that
shay mcmahon is well documented he's a
massive fan of mma he actually
wanted wwe to purchase ufc back in the
day before
ufc exploded and became the ufc that we
know today with dana white he wanted
wwe to purchase it and run the ufc so
he's always wanted to do this kind of
combat sport mixed martial art element
to wwe
he was if anything very ahead of his
time when it came to that um
and like like i mentioned i'm not i'm
not totally against it
but i just i just don't know how long it
will last um it was interesting as well
to see eric of the viking raiders
uh during one of these raw underground
fights because
you think of the contrast on where this
tag team has gone
over the last like six weeks the viking
raiders have gone from bowling and mini
golf
and eating turkey legs to shoot fighting
in the space of a few weeks
and it says all says everything that you
wanna that you wouldn't already know
about wwe's interest in tag team
wrestling and tag teams that they'll
just throw them
into anything they will throw them into
anything so i found that quite humorous
i thought eric looked good in it and it
probably is the most devastating
and serious the viking raiders have
looked like a long for a long time
but as i mentioned earlier there are
elements of it that i that i think can
work
and i think were could be interesting
now we saw the hurt business at the end
of the show
hijack raw underground and kind of get
involved and make it their own
and i think bobby lashley specifically i
think he's tailor-made for
our underground we know his history in
mma he's competed in the likes of
bellator he's had several mma fights
having bobby lashley as a regular figure
during these raw
underground segments i think would be
really interesting it would certainly
make
bobby lashley look like the dominant
kick-ass monster that he should have
always been
booked as in wwe you know forget this
bobby lashley flexing his glutes having
leah rush out lashley lashley lashley 10
million times
uh wearing ray-ban sunglasses and a
headband and all of this crap
book bobby lashley how he should be
booked and that is as a monster as a
shoot
fighting monster having on raw
underground every single week just
kicking the hell out of guys anyone that
shows up he beats the hell out of
that would be worth watching that would
be worth watching because then suddenly
you've got someone like bobby lashley
who feels legitimate he feels unique
and he looks like money and uh
perception is reality when it comes to
professional wrestling
if you perceived and the fans perceived
bobby lashley to be this kick-ass
monster that nobody could defeat in a
shoot fight then that guy's
that guy's money and you can do
something with that guy so i think bobby
lashley should be
absolutely a regular figure uh of uh raw
underground going forward
i must say as well that as the show went
forward and as these
uh raw underground segments continued i
do think they continuously got better as
the night went on
i will say that my my favorite point of
it was having the hurt business
uh at the end of this show invade raw
underground they were leaving
the arena and mvp was po'd about losing
the united states championship match
against apollo early on in the show
he's got a rematch at summerslam but he
hears about this
raw underground deal and he says look
we'll have a look
bobby lashley's ears pick up when he
hears the word
shoot fighting so obviously because of
his mma background they show up bobby
lashley just kicks the hell out of
people
mvp gets in there he's talking trash on
the mic shouting benjamin who is a
a legitimate athlete as well a
legitimate wrestler gets involved there
and they kicked us they were the one
standing tall at the end of raw
and having the hurt business control
that environment having mvp on the
microphone
uh as bobby lashley and shout out and
benjamin are kicking ass
in that raw underground setting makes a
lot more sense and the segment
immediately became a lot better
a lot lot better um and i was
immediately more invested and interested
in those segments having the hurt
business involved and have an mvp on the
mic
i can get behind that you know i don't
want to be like i'll get rid of shane
mcmahon he's old all this sort of stuff
but i just don't think shay mcmahon
suits that environment
if he's the guy to facilitate starting
it off that's fine
but i would have mvp be the regular host
for a better whatever word of uh
of that segment and having the hurt
business have it as a shoot fighting
club
it fits the stable it fits the the fits
the characters it makes a lot more sense
uh i could get behind that uh something
i will say
a criticism of these raw underground
segments is the camera cuts during these
fights were brutal wwe is bad enough
and i don't know if this is a kevin dunn
thing wwe is bad enough for a million
different camera cuts during a match
anyway sometimes during a match it's
like every punch every kick every move
is camera cut camera cut camera cut
and during these raw underground
segments my every punch every five
seconds even
probably less than that it was camera
cut camera cut you don't need to do
a million camera cuts for something to
feel gritty and something to feel
dirty and dark or anything like that
instead why don't you go the opposite
way why don't you have no camera cuts
while you have single camera shot
just zoom in on the guy's face as he's
getting punched in the face
right that's gritty you don't need a
million camera cuts i nearly had a
seizure about 10 times during it it was
it was
horrendous my question is though
ultimately coming out of this raw
underground segment i mean we'll see
them for the next few weeks because
wwe's filming content for it
is can it last does this does this
segment have legs and i just don't think
it i just don't think it does
i don't see in a year's time wwe still
doing this i don't
i just don't see it having the legs to
do to do this for a year i
i'm not going to completely write off as
i mentioned the segments got better as
the show went on
i praised wwe for trying to do something
for that third hour i'd rather them just
scrap
it um and i don't think anything can
change people switching off that third
hour
i don't think anyone's ever going to
watch monday night raw game oh
i'm really looking forward to that third
hour i want to watch raw underground
because also this wasn't they were
mentioned though raw underground starts
at 10.
this wasn't as if the whole third hour
was raw underground
it seems just raw underground segment
spliced into the third hour
i could get behind the hurt business
running it i could get behind if that
entire third hour was raw underground
because suddenly then it's a different
show
suddenly monday night raw becomes a
two-hour show and then the third hour is
something completely different raw
underground
if you want to watch it you can watch it
if you don't you don't
and you can just focus on the ratings of
raw and you can focus on the ratings of
raw underground that's what i would do
i have just something completely unique
for that third hour and then maybe
people will want to watch it but when
you're just splicing it into monday
night raw
you still feel like you're watching a
three-hour episode of raw
whereas if you have a two episode two
hour episode of raw followed by a
one-hour episode of raw underground
that to me makes a little bit more sense
it makes both shows a lot more
digestible and a lot more
easier to watch um but it's such a
strange
idea it's such a strange idea it's come
completely out of left field
as i mentioned i'll give them credit for
being unique but the son of a
billionaire comes back and then rents
out a tiny room that's dimly lit and has
people fight it was it was just odd
it was really odd um but i think it can
work i do think it can work
um depending on the guys that you have
featured in it
if you have guys like matt riddle
timothy thatcher from nxt
brock lesnar bobby lashley dolph ziggler
as regular guys
on this raw underground uh raw
underground segment guys that are
legitimate they've got mma wrestling
shoot fighting backgrounds whatever then
i would be open to that i would be open
to having
a two-hour raw a one-hour raw
underground the main guys on the on the
raw underground other likes of
lesnar riddle thatcher lashley ziegler
that's interesting and the hurt business
of course that's interesting because
that's completely different that's
completely unique so i won't write it
off completely
um but i think they just they need to
completely go over it or not go with it
um if they change that entire third hour
of the show then that would that would
be something and something to
worth considering discussing and hey
look maybe it would be something that
people would be willing to wait to watch
you watch the two-hour raw and then you
go okay we're going to see something
completely different for this entire
third hour it feels like a completely
different
show you've got legitimate guys
competing on it
and at that point it almost doesn't even
feel like wwe anymore it feels like
something completely different so
i would be open to that we'll just have
to wait and see what they do next week
as i mentioned there are
a lot that i would change about it i
don't know how long it can truly last
how long it truly has legs for again
we'll have to wait and see
i would be very very surprised though
that if in 12 months time we're still
watching raw
underground for that third hour of
course i could be wrong though we'll
have to wait and see
but of course as always this is just one
man's opinion what are your thoughts on
raw underground did you enjoy it did you
not like it
uh what did you like what would you
change what do you think they should do
with raw underground going forward
let me know your thoughts in the
comments section below i'll be sure to
respond and reply to all of your
comments i really enjoy
interacting and speaking with you guys
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