Brian Smith here and welcome to the
dream path podcast where I try to get
inside the heads of talented creatives
from all over the world my goal is to
demystify and humanize the creative
process and make it accessible to
everyone now let's jump in Jason Moore
welcome back to the duo cast oh I'm so
glad to be back it's been crazy it's
been crazy and it's been quite some time
since we've actually sat down together
and and here we're not even sitting down
together we are respecting the social
distancing guidelines and being safe
with the the pandemic situation yep
I'm sitting in my studio you're sitting
in yours yeah and I assume you're fully
clothed hopefully I am today
yeah unlike our face-to-face duo cast
that were you're pretty much buck naked
pretty much I like to keep my underwear
on just because I don't like I don't
like sticking to the leather seats that
you have
well Jason it's it's really good to
reconnect with you in this format after
all of this time since we started the
Sundance episodes yes I it's it's good
to sit down and actually finally get to
talk to you about this it's been about
what two months it's it's been a while I
mean I I think it was really before I
went to Park City that I think that was
the time frame that we sat down and did
a duo cast just like right before I went
to Park City mm-hm yeah so how are you
holding up over there with all of the
isolation and social distancing and
toilet paper shortages and and the
craziness that's happening right now
we're actually holding up really good
the social distancing thing doesn't
really it doesn't really affect me too
bad I spent a lot of time indoors anyway
I'm not a big social person but you know
it is kind of a pain in the neck to you
know not really get to go out and do the
things like go into restaurants and
things like we used to do go to the bars
and stuff like we used to and everybody
now but the six foot rule is really
really kind of
touchy on how close you can be to them
how close you can be to them when you
talk to them and just the way they're
acting and I think that that's actually
kind of good people want to keep their
distance and I think that the sooner we
keep our distance and stay inside and
let this thing kind of take its course I
think the better will be because this
needs to stop we need to we need to be
able to get back to normal at some point
yeah I I'm with you on that Jason I
think we need to do what's difficult now
and hunker down as they say and endure
the the isolation and the the lack of
social contact and and also you know it
is it is tough it's really tough to you
know respect those those six-foot
boundaries because it's awkward and we
don't want to be viewed by other people
as alarmist or overreacting and so I
think there's sort of a natural tendency
to to try to downplay a little bit but I
think it's important that we all really
just dive into the what the medical
advice is and the advice from scientists
which is keep your distance and ride
this thing out and let's get back to
normal
I agree how's your toilet paper supply
doing we're doing fine but it's it's
always a touch-and-go situation you you
got a time your grocery store trips
early-morning adventures to the grocery
store and and really be strategic about
you know your shopping so that you can
get the supplies you need but yeah it's
it's a little distressing to to go from
the the opulence of the Park City
experience where sort of the world was
my oyster and you know it was a lot of
hard work but at the same time it felt
like kind of living in the lap of luxury
a little bit like you're rubbing elbows
with the Stars and you're going to these
premieres and nobody is thinking about
even though it was happening at the time
nobody's really thinking about this
global pandemic that's about to hit the
United States and and change really just
completely change our culture and our
economy for who knows how long
this could be a permanent change in the
way that we go about traveling and the
way that we go to restaurants and who
knows what's gonna unfold from this but
it's a really jarring bizarre couple of
months I can tell you it's I'm still
trying to wrap my brain around it yeah
me too
I was lucky enough that when it all
started happening I went out and I feel
like a soldier I went out there on a
mission for days and found supplies and
found stuff that I need I didn't hoard I
don't have a garage full of toilet paper
but I found what I needed and I still
have some of it and I feel like I did a
pretty good job doing that without
hogging it for everybody else I think
that that's a problem too is that people
tend to kind of panic and think oh we
better get everything that we can and
just pack our garage full and who cares
about everybody else you know that's
kind of the attitude I think sir I hate
we'll have you know right no we're doing
good we're doing really good we're I get
to spend more time with with my wife
which is great we have a good old time
would we just make each other laugh all
day so it's fun so what are you doing to
stay sane in the house and you know in
terms of you know movies or music or
television what are you doing drinking
no actually actually you know I just as
you know I've just been working and
we've been hammering out these episodes
we had eight of them from Sundance and
that actually has been keeping me pretty
darn busy just trying to stay busy doing
things around the house like I said
spending time with the wife listening to
music playing music learning new songs
writing new songs I got back into Frank
Zappa I haven't listened to a lot of
Zappa and years got into his whole
catalogue and was kind of geeking out on
some of his videos on YouTube some of
that stuff he's a very underrated
musician I think a lot of people think
that he was just weird and I think of
him as super intelligent highly skilled
instead of musician musical brain Frank
Zappa was I've also been watching a lot
of videos on YouTube
anyone that'll sort of present itself
with unfinished studio work from
different bands like the Beatles
I found a bunch of early demos from Van
Halen that I'd never heard from the
mid-70s you know I keep myself busy with
and entertain myself
largely just internet as long as I have
internet I think I'm good yeah
yeah I think we've all got we've all got
plenty of content out there to consume
for sure and it sounds like though that
you're you're kind of diving into some
some esoteric areas like Zappa I it's
interesting I was just looking at a
video the other day of a reconstruction
of a guitar it's a Gibson it looks like
an SG guitar that Dweezil Zappa hmm had
taken on an airplane and some airline
had damaged the guitar so badly the
entire neck just broke in half at the
top oh man and and so I watched this
this video of the process of fixing this
guitar and and when you look at the
broken guitar it almost makes you want
to cry
and but it's interesting that you are
you're you're diving into Zappa Frank
Zappa and then I I see this video on
Dweezil Zappa who really kind of takes
after his dad I think there's a lot of
influence there and there's a lot of
Dean shared DNA that you kind of hear in
do easels music but I'm with you on the
musical genius part because Frank Zappa
it's not it's definitely not easy
listening I would say you know it's um
it's probably like it's probably even
more inaccessible and challenging than
the most hardcore jazz that you'll ever
listen to oh for sure and that's why
he's kind of a he's kind of a musician's
musician and it's one of the reasons why
I really haven't fully appreciated Frank
or Dweezil Zappa because it's it's so
diff
called in challenging material you know
to appreciate mm-hmm yeah I've been I
don't know man I've been busy with the
podcast and work and I watched some
streaming shows on Netflix I of course
watched Tiger King which was disturbing
extremely disturbing to say the least
I've read a few books reading some
Malcolm Malcolm Gladwell books and you
know read blink and now I'm into talking
with strangers I think it's called
and I'm you know talking to strangers by
Malcolm Gladwell that Malcolm is one of
those those authors that I can I can
always I can reread his books too and
get kind of more out of it the second
time the night I did the first time I
don't know I think everybody's trying to
find what their equilibrium is in this
environment of very extreme limitations
being put on our ability to travel and
kind of do the things that we like to do
on the weekends and after work and right
here we can't even work really I mean
unless you're an essential worker you
know you're stuck at home that's true
but it's it's also interesting too it's
it's interesting to see how we interact
with our families when I when we are
hunkered down with them for such an
extended period of time
you know I think we we get to know each
other in a different way and I think
that's that can be healthy so I'm trying
to lean into it and play cards more with
my family you know board games right
yeah and just be with them you know just
the act of just being with your family
for for that long it's it's challenging
because we're not we're not used to it
and then we also have to be conscious of
how much time we spend on social media
which can be a rabbit hole that oh yeah
you know really pulls you away from from
pulls you away from what's important and
sends you into a tailspin of existential
dilemma and so that those are my
rambling thoughts on on the last couple
of months man it's been
it's been quite a ride and really
bizarre that's the tire would describe
it just bizarre and and in an almost
surreal I agree that's exact it's the
exact way I feel about it too and I I
feel like you you got pretty lucky the
timing on the Sundance thing was was
great because had it happened even maybe
even two weeks to three weeks earlier
you the Sundance probably wouldn't have
happened oh yeah they would have shut
down Sundance for sure yeah you know we
did good he came and came back with
eight great interviews and what I got a
question for you what one was your
favorite one with what interview did you
what resonated more with you out of all
of the eight episodes which one was your
favorite that's a great question I I
think that the Bryan nappin burger
episode which is episode 41 mm-hm that
one resonated with me because of the the
work that I do and you know that I'm a
trial lawyer by day as you know and I a
big part of my practice is representing
survivors of childhood sexual abuse
against institutions like the Catholic
Church or the Mormon Church or the Boy
Scouts and it just so happened
coincidentally that Bryan nappin burger
it was a documentary film director had a
documentary called Church in the Fourth
Estate that was premiering at Sundance
and so I asked his publicist if he'd be
interested in an interview and and all
kind of lined up and I got to talk to
him there with the subject of that film
Adam steed who is a survivor of
childhood sexual abuse
and was kind of a whistleblower against
the Boy Scouts in the Mormon Church and
really compelling story I mean I
connected with all of the guests and I
appreciate all of the interviews in
their own you know unique ways and the
way that they contributed to kind of
this body of work that I brought back
from Park City but because of the work
that I do and then I've done for the
last 20 years
the Brian knappenberg episode really
really hit me and and resonated with me
and and then you pointed out that during
the interview he disclosed that Brian
did that he had a Netflix project a
Netflix documentary that was going to be
coming out soon and he couldn't say the
name of it during our interview and you
looked it up and actually watched it and
it's the the trials of Gabriele
Fernandez yeah
and so I I watched that I died it's
still shaking me up I'm thinking about
that documentary because I have cases
like that and it's so disturbing to to
watch something unfold in a documentary
format in multiple episodes which is
just kind of a fucking train wreck of a
situation where a child is abused and
not only abused but you know social
workers know about it and they don't do
anything about it and I won't spoil it
for anybody if they want to watch it but
it is an extremely powerful hard-hitting
documentary that is now out on on
Netflix it's it's it's gut-wrenching
yeah yeah it's um you know I just can't
shake it I mean I can't stop thinking
about it but yeah that's that's the one
that was the most most compelling for me
I I think I enjoyed all of them I really
did but the couple there's a couple that
really resonated with me episode 35 with
Jeff Orlowski where he's talking about
his films chasing ice and the social
dilemma I think that those were very
interesting those are very interesting
films and I thought I really liked his
work and how he how they did those films
another one that I liked was episode 37
with Nick basta I've seen Nick and in
various shows I've seen him on Law &
Order SVU so I'm familiar with his face
and I was very interested in what he
said that he wanted to do a documentary
about
Yogi Berra and you know I've been a
baseball fan throughout throughout the
years and Yogi Berra is one of those
figures in the 20th century that I mean
if you don't know who Yogi Berra is I
don't know if you've been living under a
rock or whatever but I thought that he
taking on that documentary one that take
on that project was was really cool and
I hope he gets to do that and of course
I really liked Anthony Willis episode 38
I think it was he there's a films and
jazz film scoring I don't know how they
do it I'd love to sit and watch somebody
do it it looks like a lot of work but it
looks fun yeah you've identified some
some interviews that were memorable for
me for sure and it's hard to pick out
one I mean I just I bring up the nappin
burger interview because of the the
connection that I have to the subject
matter of his documentary that was at
Sundance but you know personally I would
say Nick basta is the one that I feel
like is you know someone I can call a
friend at this point I mean he's just
we connected instantly in the way that
we met at the movie theater and the way
that I found out you know that he was in
one of the the films which was the
Gloria's with Julianne Moore you know
had Sundance and then agreed to an
interview when we were there the way it
kind of unfolded organically like that
and just what how real and authentic he
was and not pretentious in any way I
mean just a true hard-working actor who
doesn't have any pretense about you know
being in Hollywood or being in the movie
business or a film business really I
mean none of my interviews had had that
type of pretense but Nick really came
across to me as someone that I could
have a beer with or you know hang out
with and no yeah totally and and I just
connected with him that way and Audrey
was another one of those those
interviews that it's kind of had an
immediate rapport with her
and after the interview I had a new
respect for the behind-the-scenes folks
who make these movies really happen in
term vision Lee you know she's a
production designer she was on this film
called the last shift with Richard
Jenkins and you know the the way that
she described how it came together
visually really opened my eyes to how
much work goes into making a film before
you even turn on the cameras and all of
the planning and set construction and
you know the thought process that goes
into that before you start recording is
it's pretty eye-opening and you know
Florentine was another one that I really
enjoyed Florentine to sit down with
someone who you know English is not her
first language and so we had someone
helping with translation a little bit
and it was one of her production
managers magalie and and I learned about
animation and that very specific type of
animation that she does out of Paris
yeah and how long it takes you know one
minute per month to to put that together
that was pretty cool crazy Christian
Zuniga Christians Inigo was was another
one that I kind of connected with almost
like like he's one of my peers you know
just somebody who is who doesn't have
any pretense about being in the industry
you know when I asked him about wanting
to do to be a producer or director and
he just immediately said no no no I mean
I think this is what I want to do
cinematography I want to have to deal
with everything that directors and
producers have to deal with and he knows
what his role is in the film industry
and what he likes to do very decisive
that way yeah exactly and I I think
there's a there's something admirable
about folks who understand what their
passion is
within a certain industry it's not like
he's bouncing around like a pinball in a
pinball machine you know looking for the
next best thing he knows exactly what
his talent is and what his highest and
best use is and that's he has an eye for
you know seen through the lens and
capturing the director's vision through
camera work and that's what
cinematography is and so I learned a lot
about cinematography just talking to
Christian mm-hm and and also how the
industry works in terms of living in
Atlanta versus Los Angeles I don't know
there's just it was looking back on the
Sundance episodes for me probably one of
the most fulfilling journeys I have been
on in this podcast situation going to
Park City being on location being able
to talk to people face to face about
something that they're deeply passionate
about that they should be proud of
because because they've been invited
into this elite festival right probably
the most preeminent festival in the
entire world when it comes to other than
maybe kin when it comes to recognition
of that type of work that's a long
rambling way of saying what a really
fucking cool journey this has been
and I appreciate you doing such great
work making them sound pristine from an
audio standpoint and cutting them to you
know really portray the guests in in the
best light possible and make them sound
great and make me sound great and I just
appreciate you as my co-pilot man thank
you well thank you I appreciate that
very much Brian but really what it comes
down to is that sweet chocolaty voice of
yours yeah well you should have been
doing Radio 4 you should have been on
radio from the get-go yeah why it didn't
even cross my mind man and until I
I burned out a little bit on the law and
and looked for you know something
creative to do and then found found
podcasting of all things too
kind of take me in the in that creative
direction but so you know the next thing
we have to decide Jason is what are we
gonna do now that we don't have anymore
Sundance content we we went from two
episodes per month so one every two
weeks to one episode per week after I
came back from Park City and the reason
we went with the reason we went to one
episode per week was to make sure that
the guests that I interviewed did not
have to wait four months to hear their
interview and share it with their their
colleagues and friends and family and I
think it worked out pretty well it was
nice to to have that content just know
you know on a regular basis once a week
every Wednesday and here we are now
facing a decision we have it we have you
know we're at a crossroads and the
crossroads decision we have to make is
what are we going to do with the
frequency of our episodes you know one
of the challenges we're gonna face is
that if I can't go get these interviews
done in person for the foreseeable
future I'm gonna have to do this
remotely through the internet like you
and I are doing right now
and I I don't like doing that I it's
it's uh it's it's it's a tough decision
for me because you know part of me wants
to dial it back and go back to once
every two weeks just so we can you know
kind of ride out this storm and then
once I'm able to travel and to do this
face to face more often made me move to
a once per week frequency but what are
your thoughts on that Jason well I I've
been thinking about that actually and I
think for now while this kovat 19 steps
going on definitely gonna have to do it
remotely which I know is terrible I know
it it's not ideal it doesn't it doesn't
have the same sound quality in the same
quality altogether as you would
face-to-face but it's it's
people can still listen I'm okay with
doing a duo cast or a recap every other
week like we were doing before just to
kind of stretch it out a little bit and
maybe maybe that's not the right term I
don't know but just to kind of like you
said right out the storm because I think
we're gonna need to do that for at least
gosh I think probably another month if
not two yeah I think I think we're gonna
be looking at the summer before anybody
is talking about traveling anywhere
safely but you know think about it this
way maybe I should be looking at it like
well with internet interviews via zoom
or you know whatever the platform is on
the internet to record these interviews
if I'm not traveling to these folks to
interview them maybe I can crank out
even more interviews than I normally
would yeah and I can get those up you
know what what I would hate to do is
have a guest that I would much prefer to
talk to in person and then kind of waste
that interview with a lesser quality
audio experience by doing it over the
Internet that's what my main concern is
so we'll talk about that I don't know
that will make any final decisions but
we do have some pretty exciting guests
coming up and you know what what is the
next interview that we have
that'll be launched after well after
this duo cast next week is David Fran
gionee he's a drummer and producer
recording engineer and I think he works
with Aerosmith yeah yeah well David Fran
gionee was was a fun interview and I
talked to him from his home in Florida
and it's probably going to be the new
norm that I'm just talking to folks over
the internet via you know zoom or
whatever the the format is but david has
a really interesting rich career to talk
about in terms of his knowledge about
audio recording and how he got involved
with Aerosmith and recording those
albums and also his work as the
publisher of Modern Drummer magazine hmm
but he's his uh his resume is really
fascinating such an eclectic guy he's
written books two of which are on the
subject of Clint Eastwood movies he's a
big Clint Eastwood fan he donates all
the proceeds from the sales of his books
to charity and he's just a really
interesting guy so I hope folks are able
to listen to that episode and that this
new approach to interviews via the
internet will actually work in our favor
to be able to put out more content out
there because we don't have to take the
time and resources to actually travel to
them during this pandemic situation yeah
it's gonna be interesting to see how
this plays out I honestly didn't think
you know when all this started I
honestly didn't think that it would
affect us at all as time went by I'm
like oh yeah it's going to it's gonna
affect everybody yeah yeah I think
everybody's trying to get a sense of
what it means to them and their with
their work life and their personal life
and their future I mean it's it's really
hitting a lot of people pretty hard you
know and changing our world around us
whether we like it or not and so we just
have to figure out what that means for
each of us and then figure out a way to
get through it together
right on well said Brian yeah well Jason
it's been really good to talk to you
and get back into this duo cast groove
again and let's let's do this more often
I'm with you on that but I am also
looking forward to seeing you at face to
face at some point again and and we can
sit in their underwear and do them from
your house sounds good looking forward
to it Jason
just so people know we're not really in
our underwear when we when we do these
interviews Brian's really shy well yeah
you're not alright Jason I'm signing off
alright thank you Brian hey thank you
for listening and I hope you enjoyed
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